Star Trek: 10 Things You Didn’t Know About Kai Winn

[@GuyNamedSean]

I think the biggest shock was that Winn was only present in fourteen episodes. Her character was so massively important that you're constantly aware of and thinking of her through the whole series.

[@ajlong404]

💯

[@darquequeen]

And that speaks to how her character was written by the writers and portrayed by the late Louise Fletcher. 👍🏼

[@joncarter3761]

That's just over half a season! I loved her actress so much, her, Way'un and Gul'Dakott were the best villains for me. So well written, such interesting personalities and so detestable, it made them perfect antagonists!

[@kailahmann1823]

That's something DS9 did very well overall: Because the series had a giant set of recurring characters and kept swapping between them, if felt like they were around all the time.

[@sheilarough236]

I was so surprised that she was only in 14 episodes

[@davidlape7936]

Great character. Phenomenal actress. Rest in peace Louise Fletcher.🖖🏼❤️

[@raven4k998]

imagine meeting Kai Winn and saying ok Karen to her🤣

[@NomenLuni1975]

Louise Fletcher was such a magnificent actress. She played the villain so well, both in DS9 and One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest, that it's such a surprise that she's the complete opposite in real life and one of the nicest people you could ever meet. Her Oscar speech in 1976 was so amazing. She will never be forgotten.

[@nickhaines1079]

If you love the blood-boiling feeling that this absolute master of hated characters gives you then I'd also recommend Flowers in the Attic. The movie itself is ...OK. It's not great, it's not terrible, but Fletcher gives another one of her absolutely brilliant performances as the grandmother. Somehow my top 3 most hated characters that make me rage with the fury of a thousand suns were all portrayed by one person. She was in a class of her own.

[@ferninthehouse]

@@nickhaines1079 i know the plot of the book. i didn't realize there was a movie but it seems very fitting that she should play the grandmother

[@NomenLuni1975]

@@nickhaines1079 I will check it out. Thanks.

[@auldthymer]

I was able to watch Neill Simon's "The Cheap Detective." Louise Fletcher plays a character that parodies Ilsa from "Casablanca;" she gives stirring speech after stirring speech that go on much too long and devolve into idiotic blather. She is absolutely funny, but the character is intensely serious. She was a delight. (And she was as pretty as Ingrid Bergman, which I always forget because of her villainous roles.)

[@JJMHigner]

I could not say it better!

[@SeattleSandro]

Adami Winn and Gul Dukat were the first villains in Star Trek that always elevated the episodes they were in. They were so well-written and well-acted. While I never rooted for them, I was always interested in learning more about them. Winn's arrogance, resentment, and contempt for Sisko made her relatable, because she didn't intend to be evil, she was just blinded by her monstrous ambition. I think many of us know people like that.

[@memento81]

"communal narcissist" is the search term for her personality style.

[@cryofpaine]

You're far more likely to run across someone like her in real life than someone like Dukat. That's what makes her such a great villain - because she is absolutely real. "Space Karen" is the perfect description.

[@SeattleSandro]

@@cryofpaine I think Dukat might be a vulnerable narcissist. He's always the victim ("the Bajorans never appreciated what I did for them"), full of grievances, grandiose, the hero of the story that nobody gives enough credit to, willing to screw over his own people by joining the Dominion , with a fragile ego, who's happy to be an authoritarian to get what he needs. He's always reminded me of a certain twice-impeached, once-indicted, disgraced, one-term, ex-president.

[@SeattleSandro]

@@cryofpaine Not disagreeing with you though. She's a total can-I-speak-to-your-manager space Karen.

[@cryofpaine]

@@SeattleSandro Absolutely, they're both raging narcissists. I think the reason why Winn or Umbridge are more viscerally hated than Dukat or Voldemort are because their level of evil is unusual to see in the real world. (Temper TanTrump to the contrary.) But we deal with Karens all the time. So it becomes more personal. We don't just hate them because they're evil. We hate them because they're evil AND they remind us of that person we had to deal with last week.

[@StephenLeGresley]

Louise Fletcher was a treasure for many reasons: 1) Complete control over her performance, From her delivery of dialogue to her physical movements to her facial expressions. Every aspect of her acting was masterful and demonstrated her complete control over who she delivered her performances. This kind of skill and talent is so very very rare. 2) Sometimes she made you agree with her. It's been said that one of the signs of a truly great villain is that you kind of see their point of view and in the case of Kai Winn I have to admit there was more then one time where I had a hard time disagreeing with her. That takes not only good writing but great acting to pull off. 3) While I sadly never got the chance to meet her in person, I know a couple of people who did and between that in interviews with cast and crew, not a single person has anything but wonderful things to say about her. She was kind, considerate and loving of others. People have told me she had a natural empathy and sweetness to her that made her a joy to be around. Rest in Peace and Love Louise, you will always be our Kai. 🥰♥

[@GSBarlev]

Regarding (2) -- Let's not forget that she saved either Jake's life or Kira's, if not both. Also I always got the sense that what she did she did for (what she believed to be) the good of Bajor. You can see this in her final conversation with Kira, when Kira suggests she step down, and Winn goes, "No, Bajor definitely needs me to lead it." Her "evil" was deep-seated narcissism, which was what made her and Dukat such a phenomenal pair.

[@JJMHigner]

Wonderful breakdown. Very much appreciated!

[@DavidEdwards9801]

I've heard before that the actors that play the "bad guys" are often the nicest people in real life =)

[@StephenLeGresley]

@@DavidEdwards9801 In her case, it's absolutely true.

[@KabukeeJo]

Louise Fletcher was amazing as Kai Winn! Her death was a great loss. RIP Louise Fletcher.

[@xandersnyder7214]

I absolutely loved to hate Kai Winn, and Louise Fletcher did such an amazing job playing her. I always viewed her as having a politicians smile and she had the air of this quote from "The Hunt for Red October" "Look Jack, I'm a politician, which means when I'm not kissing babies I'm stealing their lollypops" I always felt that the writers for DS9 did a great job of writing complex characters. And lastly, I had NO CLUE that the rogue telepath Lyta Alexander (Patricia Tallman) was her stunt double!

[@gateauxq4604]

I knew Patricia Tallman was a stunt woman but didn’t know she was Louise Fletcher’s. Very cool

[@michaeljames9892]

Patricia Tallman was also stuntwoman for both Nana Visitor and Gates McFadden.

[@TomBelknapRoc]

Thanks for this! Louise Fletcher definitely has not gotten the credit she deserved for playing such a compelling character. That she was only in 17 episodes is astonishing, because her appearances are all so critical, it's hard to imagine there weren't more.

[@gwenever7286]

A long over due tribute to one of Star Treks greatest actresses, I cannot think of a poor story or performance she was a part of, something that few other Star Trek characters can be credited with. Louise Fletcher RIP

[@Mrs_Banjo]

Louise Fletcher was just so great. She gave the character depth beyond the script which is so important.

[@Youngstown529]

You know STAR TREK is good stuff when you get an Academy Award winner in a relatively small role. She was outstanding and elevated this show to stratospheric levels!!!

[@darquequeen]

The character always got under my skin, and I mean that as a great compliment. When she met her end, I was like, girl, bye! Great acting and writing! ❤🖖🏼

[@Buddy74656]

Only fourteen episodes but she had such a presence that it felt like much more.

[@orionwesley]

I didn't care much for DS9 honestly, but Louise Fletcher's episodes and story arch were far too entertaining to miss. Great video. 💖

[@sheilarough236]

Louise Fletcher was so wonderfully good at playing evil characters that believed themselves to be good. Yet she was kind & humble as an actress. See her Oscar acceptance speech for Nurse Rachett Interesting fact about her: as a hearing child of deaf parents, her first language was American Sign Language. Her hearing aunt taught to speak when she was 3 or 4

[@larryiscreating]

RIP to a truly magnificent actress. "Loved to hated" shows how great a job she did 🙏🏾

[@bazblackadder]

My former supervisor looked like Winn. Had she ever called me "my child" I'd have probably screamed and run for the Fire Exit... 🤣🤣🤣

[@billdelaney2817]

Perfect tribute to a wonderful woman

[@Sir_Jimmothy]

I lost it at the "sex candle" aside there - bless you, voiceover man!

[@flotowncomputerguy6243]

Winn is the product of Louise Fletcher's childhood in the south. She captured something of the small town churches with Winn's attitude, the holier-than-thou elder churchlady who is also unendingly jealous of the faith of others. You hear it in the remarks that may sound pleasant at face value, but are full of that seething unhappiness just below the surface. She put a depth and complexity in the character that made her timeless

[@johnnysizemore5797]

Kai Winn is a great example of just how far an originally good person can be corrupted by their own hubris...

[@theonlymatthew.l]

What evidence do you have that she was ever originally a good person? One or two good acts doesn't define a person as 'good'

[@apok1980]

@@theonlymatthew.l lol, I was thinking the same thing. I always remember watching her with that sinister smile calling everyone “My child”. I always found it interesting with Kira one minute being obedient and behaving to Kai Winn, the next minute wanting to strangle her.

[@akl2k7]

​@@theonlymatthew.l Heck, she could have been lying about those things if all we have is her word, particularly the prying out gemstones to negotiate for prisoners.

[@tetravega567]

@@akl2k7 Would've been neat if the Cardassian she bribed was Elim Garak...

[@jcoremax1563]

She lied about hearing the prophets so you can’t believe anything she has said about her “good” deeds

[@XanBos]

There probably isn’t another singular Star Trek character that did so much to evoke the hatred among fans. The actor did her job with excellence. Every time Kai Winn showed up, I felt the rage against her. I think the writers did a fantastic job creating the character, and ultimately she got what was coming to her. Well done everyone!

[@lesm6389]

"Sex candle" 😆 (Also, hadn't realized Pat Tallman was also her stunt double!)

[@--Animal--]

"Excuse me! I'd like to speak to your Prophets right now!" -Kai Winn

[@krumpetwithhoney8567]

Thank you Sean. Nothing else... Just thank you.

[@krafka]

DS9 scored by landing Louise Fletcher. We wouldn't love to hate Kai Winn nearly as much without Fletcher's brilliant performance. RIP Louise Fletcher.

[@vampitwine]

Louise Fletcher was fantastic as Kai Winn. always a good episode when she was in it :)

[@FattyMcFox]

Winn was a complicated and compelling villain. Even when she bared her soul about her suffering during the occupation, you always asked " is this true or is she playing the other person in the scene?" and that subtle nuance was portrayed masterfully by Louise Fletcher. We only ever hated the character so much because Louise Fletcher was bringing her A-game to every moment of screen time.

[@frankharr9466]

I think making Winn Kai was brillient. It gave her a really good reason to stay in the story. Also, I wonder when they decided the Winn had never had a vision and desperately wanted one. Anything so she knew the Prophets didn't hate her. And they never gave her one, I assume so that she would do what she did in the last episode.

[@Chaosfox04]

My mom loves the character of Winn Adami and Louise Fletcher's portrayal. She says Nurse Ratched whenever Winn's in the episode.

[@peabody1976]

Wait, what? Patricia Tallman...??? Lyta Alexander on B5??? She was Louise Fletcher's stunt double? Oh, I did learn something today. And boy, was Louise Fletcher such a great actor and did Winn very well. She will be missed.

[@NomenLuni1975]

She was a regular stunt double in Star Trek, and she even had an acting part in 'Starship Mine' (TNG), where she played one of the terrorists,

[@maryellencook9528]

Space Karen = Kai Winn. LOVE IT ! ❤️ 😍 💖

[@OverworkedITGuy]

The one missed opportunity I am sad for in DS9 was that we never got Winn, Dukat and Weyoun in the same room at the same time.

[@JJMHigner]

Absolutely agreed!

[@paulhunter6742]

Weyoun just Clone mouth piece for the Founders. Apparently, Weyoun species was disposable since got up to Weyoun #7.

[@redphoenix9226]

This maybe a bit controversial but DS9 had some of the greatest villains of Star Trek history

[@_Omega_Weapon]

Not at all. Definitely some of it not the best

[@GSBarlev]

Do you consider Gowron a TNG villain or a DS9 villian?

[@ZakhadWOW]

@@GSBarlev on technicality, a DS9 one. He was never truly a villain in TNG

[@gamerofthesith5275]

My wife and I always called her Sydney Opera House, because of the hat she wore during her first appearance.

[@matthewhostetter8974]

Space Karen is the best name for Kai Winn, she was really a fantastic secondary antagonist for the entire series if not the franchise and it's shocking she was only in 14 episodes.

[@Bluestar1079]

I used to love to see the reactions sisko gave when he would be told winn was on the way to see him. I know it well from my own job

[@thebullet7874]

Well done! Great list.

[@tangerinealarm]

I didn’t realise she was only in 14 episodes. She casts a shadow over so much of DS9 / Bajor it feels like she’s in more of it. Did she do many conventions / did she know how loved her performance of the character was?

[@DawnieAngel11]

Thanks Sean! So happy you are adding lots of videos while waiting for SNW next month. Thought we might have to wait, so glad you are continuing your awesome commentaries in the meantime!

[@sunnysummer342]

And that is why Star Trek Deep Space Nine hands down is the best Star Trek. All the characters are well written and the actors they hired are perfect vessels to act them out. Louise Fletch is an excellent actor; she's perfect to play Kai Winn. She played that hateful Nurse Hatcher in One Flies Over the Cuckoo's nest and the Grandmother in Flower's in the Attic. You just loves to hate her and that is what makes her performance perfection. Thank you so much for doing this video. Fantastic job fleshing her character out. It's scary how evil she was in the series.

[@XL-5117]

I couldn’t agree more. DS9 is far and above the best modern Star Trek and Kai Winn one of the best multi dimensional characters that makes the series so great.

[@PitargoNats]

DS9 allowed for some of the best character development in Trek. The long-running story arcs helped instead of the episodic format of other Trek.

[@jtreedy116]

Love to hate indeed. When I introduced my wife to DS9 - I told her (of then Vedek Winn) - you don't know it yet, but you HATE her. And you will LOVE that you hate her. Kai Winn was one of the best antagonists in all of Trek.

[@intoxicatedmasculinity]

Fletcher is just amazing in that role. Nurse Rachet will, maybe rightly, be the role she's remembered for, but Winn should be in that conversation. She's just doing so much and doing it so subtly.

[@Metonymy1979]

I always thought she was one of the best villains ever created.

[@dlrglaze]

You did a fantastic job describing Kai Winn. Thank you!

[@Rocketsong]

I knew Pat was the stunt double for Nana, and for Gates, didn't know she was stunt double for Fletcher as well. You need to do a 10 times Pat Tallman was the stunt double and you didn't know it.

[@Bleepurchin]

Great video guys. Really insightful.

[@DarthLee8472]

Kai Winn is one of the best characters that you love to hate on Star Trek: Deep Space Nine. R.I.P. Louise Fletcher 1934 - 2022.

[@JJMHigner]

Wonderfully Sinister and complicated character in the cool and calculated format that we rarely get to see even outside of sci-fi. Louise Fletcher was wonderful in this. Really great addition to a very complicated people.

[@Carstuff111]

Such a lovely woman that played some truly bonkers characters in her time, and this is one of my favorite of them!

[@beast1624]

Kai Winn was only in 14 episodes?!?!?!?!? What in the world! Seems like way more. Just a testament to how well Louise Fletcher played the character. She was amazing!!!

[@thebagfather4633]

louise fletcher a legend and no one could play winn like her r i p Louise

[@alm2187]

Always thought reciting her resume to Kira after saying "And you think I lack courage" made for quite the redemptive moment.

[@petrossteadilious]

She sounded so patronising to Kira when she called her child

[@alm2187]

What if that's in the official vocab guidelines for your role,@@petrossteadilious? Could you manage calling people out with no hint of condescension?

[@imarxb]

Such a wonderful actress. She came in and did her job superbly.

[@duckieforever]

Louise Fletcher was typecast for a reason. And she was goddamn brilliant at that reason. I wish she were here to have seen this video. LLAP

[@marylousherman5471]

She was the 'Church Lady' from hell.... loved the hats she wore!

[@andrewstephen2359]

She was such a fascinating character. Determined and hungry she nevertheless had hints of compassion. Usually buried you could however see that if she had only the courage to confront her own failings she could have been a better person for it. I always felt that despite their differences, Kira on some level genuinly wanted a better relationsip with her. Its interesting how Kiras suffering brought forth an unrealised compassion whereas Winns left her with a need fo power for its own sake. Perhaps the difference was that as a resistance member Kira would have had an agency that Winn as a pacifist preist would have lacked.

[@Maximum_Warp]

I'm literally watching the DS9 episode 'Shakaar' that has Winn as a prominent character and I get a notification for this video. Crazy!! Haha. Love DS9.

[@GLTLegislator]

I've always liked Siskos face whenever it got mentioned that Kai Winn is about to visit the station XD

[@arashimifune2853]

"My child"... ARGH xd Only 14 episodes?? That's even less than Weyoun (just Weyoun, not Jeffrey Combs in general xd). Casting Louise Fletcher as Winn is one of the biggest wins (he he) Star Trek has ever done.

[@kroome111]

So shocked only 14 episodes out of 173 that Winn made an appearance but that shows the character strength, appearing every other episode may have been detrimental. Still 14...

[@jimmyyu2184]

Apologies in advance for the multiple posts, but L. Fletcher have always been my favourite "Vileness". She's always been the one I "love" to hate, and the one I that "hate" to love. Peace. Out. 🖖

[@kirkmorrison6131]

She was a great actress, and her passing is to be mourned

[@anonagain]

Wait...Patricia Tallman was Louise Fletcher's stunt double? You mean the Patricia Tallman who played Lyta Alexander on Babylon 5??? OK - I looked it up - had no idea she did stunt work too, including doubling for Laura Dern throughout Steven Spielberg's Jurassic Park.

[@aeonjoey3d]

RIP Louise ❤

[@QBCPerdition]

I find it very difficult to name my favorite series from Star Trek. TOS is the original, and there is something to say for that. TNG was the one that brought it to the masses, and it was the first series i really sat down to watch with my dad. Voyager was the series I watched on my own after my parents' divorce, its MY Star Trek. DS9 was a series I didn't watch at first, but I have to say it is the most adult series. Its setting allows recurring characters much more easily than the other series, and that leads to some of the best villains, the ones you get to know through repeated visits. Kai Winn was one of those villains. Her, Dukat and Weyoun (yes, and Brunt) are what give DS9 its true shot at being described as the best Star Trek series.

[@Parker-Green]

It’s crazy that it was only 14 episodes she appeared in!! She always felt like such a big presence within the show!

[@donall]

They missed a trick by not having her as a nurse or something in the Benny Russel story

[@MishraArtificer]

That one might have flown over most people's cuckoo's nests...

[@Donnagata1409]

OOOOOOOOH, that would have been awesome!

[@Herowebcomics]

The lady who played her was amazing! She was in a PG-13 comedy movie and was a totally different kind of bad guy!

[@NathanTarantlawriter]

OH Space Karen is the perfect moniker for that character!

[@uvp5000]

Louise Fletcher was one of several Marquis actors in the series. I still binge Deep Space Nine after having watched it in its original run.

[@caseyontiveros2776]

What she did as a character was amazing. To hate a character where you start to see their character in that actor is a true testament of their performance.

[@jasonsumma1530]

I didn't realize this character was only in 14 episodes. She was a thorn to Sisko and Kira while trying to play the good guy. Did Winn ever interact with the Founders?

[@SpaceEngineerErich]

Stares at you in 'my child'

[@jamesburge1983]

The thing that always bothered me was that Kai Opaka was still alive during all of this, just trapped on a planet in the Gamma Quadrant.

[@knitcrochettiger361]

i will NEVER stop praising Louise Fletcher's performance as Kai Winn....her job was to make us HATE Kai Winn and Fletcher did that beautifully....she was a master!.....i cannot imagine anyone else doing such a wonderful job playing the character

[@alm2187]

Well, at 8:18, what goes into a stunt like that? Is it about heading the cavern wall as hard as it looks, or is it more about making it look hard?

[@HammerJammer81]

That Thumbnail absolutely nails it. Any Episode she is in gets fast forwarded.

[@censorshipsucks9493]

You know you're a great actress when every time you appear people are just beaming hate at you to your character.

[@sicily7220]

Louise Fletcher played Kia Winn so well; mean she made Kia Winn such villain. You loved to hate the character.

[@DMSProduktions]

I SEE she was a FAN of the Opera House in Sydney!

[@y_fam_goeglyd]

She was such a brilliant actress that I genuinely hated her character. I'm sure I'd have loved her if I met her in person, but definitely not as Wynn! Such awesome talent.

[@AvesPasseri-Jinysvet]

I remember forman's word when he chose her to play the nurse in one flew over the nest - her portrayal of the nurse had that menacing calmness about her, she looks innocent, but... That's exactly what he was searching for, not the typical villain. He persuaded the producers that she is the one. And showed her the way to the oscar and fame. (I simply like him, I'm also Czech.🙂) The moment i recognised her in the series after so many years, i saw that nurse again. That calmness that screamed to me : "be careful about her, she is bad...".

[@erictaylor5462]

I think the main reason Kai Winn is such a popular villain is because she was so well played by the actor. Also why Nurse Ratchet was such a great villain.

[@InThisEssayIWill...]

Dolores umbridge and kai winn ought to start a club..

[@DaellusKnights]

For me one of the things that made Mrs Fletcher's portrayal of Kai Winn so compelling was that she was so HUMAN, so REAL. As stated she wasn't the stereotypical mustache-twirling villain-of-the-week... She was charasmatic, even likeable at times (when you didn't think about how debased she really was), and was damnably believable as someone we could very well meet on the street in real life.

[@Amazonianarya]

Kai would like a word with the editors, she prefers Pope Karen, thank you very much. Seriously, the mention of Pope Karen, and finding out it was her, was what got me into watching all of DS9. And did she make good on that; evil not like genocidal maniac (we already had Dukat), but that holier than thou type who only uses their piety to make you feel bad, and make themselves look good. Winn even admits at the point in the 7th season, the prophets have never spoken to her, and she was tired of not being rewarded by them and switches to the Pah-Wraiths

[@paulhunter6742]

Isn't that true of some religious people even today. Church leaders and members who use their piety make themselves look and feel important. Image more important the Substance in their faith.

[@mattf9096]

I always say that Winn and Dukat are big reasons that DS9 is my favorite trek series. They are inherently one in the same with their goals and tactics, but because of Dukat's race being deemed as "bad" he doesn't have the same leeway as Winn.

[@arvurebantra7639]

I have always believed that Winn is one of the best Star Trek villains ever. She's absolutely one of the most dangerous, not because of her skills, but because of her faith.

[@michaelbayer5094]

The term, Banality of Evil, was first coined by the eminent historian and philosopher Hannah Arendt to describe the Nazi Adolf Eichmann at his 1961 Jerusalem trial for Crimes Against Humanity. Arendt stated that Eichmann, an ordinary bureaucrat, conceived of and implemented evil acts (The Final Solultion) while not being an evil person per se. Her account helps us understand how evil is propagated and accepted by otherwise good people. The lesson is that when society permits evil in its midst, evil becomes ordinary and everyday (banal). Then, reprehensible conduct and its perpetrators become acceptable. Fletcher's Winn ably demonstrates the Banality of Evil.

[@damouze]

8:17 We should have known that somewhere in the Star Trek Universe there existed a telepath modified by the Vorlons.

[@GSBarlev]

As pointed out by others, this isn't even her only appearance. She's appeared in Trek an outrageously large number of times, and weirdly most of those were uncredited.

[@damouze]

@@GSBarlev I know. My failed attempty at humour. Sorry.

[@GSBarlev]

@@damouzeI'm sorry! I didn't mean it as a critique! I'm in the same boat as you.

[@damouze]

@@GSBarlev No worries then!

[@user1008]

Definitely my most hated character😂 RIP to the incredible Louise Fletcher!

[@RyanK-100]

I think Fletcher was one of the top 10 actors in the franchise. I find most "evil characters" banal, but not Winn. Most actors can't pull off the believable evil the writers hope for, but Fletcher did. I caught myself truly hating her during one episode, and smiled to myself because that so rarely happens to me.

[@My2CentsYall]

She played that role with excellence it helped the series!

[@starclone4]

She was played to excellence, by miss Fletcher !!!!❤

[@williamwelch7]

Thanks

[@ajlong404]

5:53 "sex candle" 🤭😆🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@vic5015]

"Space Karen" sums her up quite well, imo.

[@Voodoomaria]

Saw another video that dubbed Winn as "Space Karen" That made me spit my tea laughing.