The Awful Absurdity of Destiny 2's Ending

[@Th3Jez]

Spent hundreds of hours and thousands of dollars on this one, hope you like it. Corepunk is an isometric MMO with a blend of MOBA, and ARPG. Get into the Early Access now 👉 cw9m.short.gy/th3jez

[@peterhodges3106]

*some hours, no dollars.

[@ryanfleshbourne3547]

i am sorry bro but time to pivot this is not it. story analysis without ever interacting with the story is WILD.

[@belamerda145]

@@Th3Jez worst attempt at rage bait slop

[@kingechatronii7379]

I just finished the video, and the outro made me kindof emotional...I always come back to your shenanigans with your friends on Destiny 2. Will you still make content with your friends? Don't mind if it's you and your friends exploring other games, either as one-offs, sponsors or playthroughs. Just need you and your friends' energy.

[@MrJake-hy2rf]

OMG you effing nailed it. Gen X here crawling out to tell you. Your opinions are always valid and valued. You are the son I never acknowledged.

[@tiptoptom3710]

23:23 - the reason why the Iron Lord axe is in Crow's room is that he's the reason why Saladin had to join Caiatl's War Council. Saladin left him the axe as a symbol of his forgiveness, however Crow still feels guilt over having indirectly sent him to work for the Cabal.

[@RobertoArboleda]

Jez barely plays seasonal content, and when he does, he pays zero attention to the story because he's making jokes with Trvl Danielle and/or Datto for the audience. If he reads this, I'm 100% sure it will be the first time he's learning about it.

[@ajeenius7437]

@@RobertoArboleda Fair, but stories you can't experience after the season disappears should not have an impact on future expansions... I know Bungie are incapable of a new player experience, but jesus fucking christ.

[@RobertoArboleda]

@@ajeenius7437 The axe is essentially an Easter egg for those who played the seasons, I guess. But yeah I agree that the new player experience sucks ass, and there should at least be a mega movie or something easily accessible in game explaining previous events, for new or returning players. And no, those super short inkblot style videos they're now doing are not nearly enough.

[@doom_slayer_5.048]

Crow is cringe never liked him

[@Dlo2018]

and it's by far the laziest way to write saladin out of the fucking game and put into a role as another vendor with a splash of cabal paint. a fucking waste it was.

[@aerow6192]

My biggest problem with the campaign is Elsie Bray needed to be a part of this story. From the moment she showed up in Destiny 1; her goal was to change the future. To avoid a certain future. Where was she to help???

[@ohWAFE]

I thought this was covered in season of the seraph? Dark future avoided

[@ohWAFE]

Rasputin doesn’t destroy the traveler in our timeline

[@santiavellaneda1]

That is a valid point, but I think it could be argued that the future was changed in Beyond Light. In her timeline, every guardian who learned Stasis fell to the influence of Darkness (The Witness), including our own. Her Dark Future Timeline begins with the discovery of Stasis; since we learn how to use Stasis without becoming corrupted, her timeline is avoided.

[@cykeok3525]

That's cold lol She didn't have time to explain why she didn't have time to explain... and Bungie didn't have time to care.

[@MLM614]

I'm very disappointed in this as well. 😤

[@ademonslayer7130]

I mean, the real issue is that half of the relevant plot points that make this campaign make complete sense are from seasonal stories that aren't in the game anymore. For instance with the first mission, the doorway into the Traveler was impassable under normal circumstances, which is why after Lightfall we scrambled to find a way inside. Eventually we settled on a plan to get inside, using the Ahamkara, we sent Crow in ahead so he and Mara could establish a link and Mara could use that link to open up the doorway so we could pass through and onto the other side. At the beginning of The Final Shape, Mara begins her part of the plan allowing us to pursue the Witness into the Traveler. When we landed in that first area, we were still traversing the doorway into the Traveler which Mara was keeping open to allow us safe passage, which is why she was in pain, because the Witness was trying to stop her from keeping it open, and prevent us from getting any closer. Because the Witness knew we were a threat.

[@gabrielpineirogarcia2078]

That makes me wonder, after we go inside and the Witness "closes" the door, what changes right before the final mission that suddenly lets Mara come into the coms and say shes bringing the Helm in? At this point we havent damaged the Witness so that cant be the reason why the portal reopened.

[@aceofsharks9837]

@@gabrielpineirogarcia2078 A division of it's attention/power. For the entire expansion The Traveler is actively resisting The Witness's attempts to take control of The Light. So between struggling for control and trying to stop/sway us, It can't effectively stop Mara from opening the doorway like it did before. And each building up mission we did further loosened it's hold on The Pale Heart.

[@thegloriouskingkronk8422]

@@aceofsharks9837 They also outright say this

[@Shadoefeenicks]

right, but this campaign was for established players, who most likely played those seasons.

[@ademonslayer7130]

@@Shadoefeenicks Sure, I don't disagree. But to be fair, I didn't play half the seasons cause I personally found they were too repetitive and formulaic. So I can't really blame people for skipping them entirely.

[@gloomygloomstalker3878]

Nathan Fillian’s return as Cayde was perfect, this was the Cayde we needed in Forsaken, Nolan North did a fine job filling in but Fillian just has a way of weaving in layers to the lines in his good appearances

[@Katpitz7]

yes, he did say that.

[@Kharnjar]

*Uploads 25,646 word long rant* Point number one: "The story just uses too many words IMO!"

[@swagasaurus8568]

29 words to say "shoot ball" vs 25k words to say "me no likey". Is he the true final shape?

[@doom_slayer_5.048]

Yea it’s called cringe exposition half the times when these characters talk is fucking stupid

[@crazygrim4895]

Underrated comment. SOMEONE GIVE THIS GUARDIAN HIS LIKES!!!!!!!!

[@Thomas_Cool]

It's not that the "story uses too many words", it's that the story dresses up simple game mechanics or random story beats with needless jargon from the characters that doesn't actually mean anything. Here's a real quote from the game. "This is not like charting a course through the currents of sea or the depth of space. This is an architecture defined by how we imagine it. Not dissimilar from the ascendant plane, but if more like it's opposite. The ascendant plane mirrors aspects of our world, aspects of our will and import to those who traverse it. Those aspects are decided upon through our actions. The Veil, conversely, weaves not with our will, not our decisions, but with intent, unfiltered by logic. What we feel, not what we decide. Mapping such a thing would be like... rebuilding a creature from the calcified remains we found aboard the pyramid ships. They are an image of a dissection. A deadened echo of existence. But look at them as they are, to see their disparate parts... Even understanding their anatomy does not give us the knowledge to make them as they were. I will continue to seek the path the Witness forged into the traveler, but I am... no longer confident that it could ever be walked again. All this to say "Guardian I am probably the smartest person in the world and I have no idea how the Witness got into the traveler". What makes this so frustrating is that stuff like this plagues almost all of the dialogue in the game, especially mission dialogue.

[@RedShadowOfSaturn]

Yet somehow, our favorite memer has a tighter, more on-target script than Bungie's needless exposition dumps that last 5-=10 minutes every time you kill 100 Fallen for a quest step. 25k words is just right tbh imo lmao.

[@Wulfspyder]

My fire team had a very mixed reaction to Ghost dying and being revived. Me: "Can't lose our little buddy." Titan1 (who works in the animation industry): "This was telegraphed like 2 hours ago, meh." Titan2: "Fucking weak. Shoulda stayed dead, little shit."

[@Yubl10]

Should have stayed dead is how I felt about corona after Halo 4. They shouldn't have brought her back evil after Halo 4. Just my opinion. 🤷 She had a great heart felt goodbye with master chief at the end of Halo 4, which made you care and then messed that up with Halo 5. I think that Halo 4 has a great ending, even if I don't think that the rest of the games story is all that good.

[@inoob26]

Jez in streams: no music, no dialogue Jez the monotone guy: *WHERE IS MY EFFING HIDE HUD BUTTON I WANNA SAVOR THIS MOMENT*

[@arsarma1808]

Something to note about Zavala's little vision quest, is that I think it went so poorly because he's been rejecting darkness. The Guardian has a huge advantage with the years of experience with Deepsight, Stasis, and Strand. Without it, we probably wouldn't have been able to carve it apart from the inside. Heck, having prismatic technically gives us the ability to warp reality. The Witness was right that everyone else was super weak at this point. But it was also wrong to think we could be tempted by anything less than a cool gun. Shiny harp gun go twong. Also, doing Wild Card as a hunter is super funny. It gives the impression that Cayde foisted the Vanguard role on Crow because he likes you better.

[@harboro4171]

Isn’t crow and mara being twins linked through space the entire reason we sent crow into the traveler first in season of the wish? Like come on Jeb I haven’t had destiny installed since before lightfall

[@Lady_Amelia-Eloise]

Precisely

[@mansfaye1084]

It's tough to discuss story when you've been ignoring it every time you could

[@RobertoArboleda]

That was mostly explored in seasonal content. If you watch this channel regularly, you know this guy barely plays seasonal content, and when he does he's all the time joking around with Travel Danielle and/or Datto and paying zero attention to the story.

[@ryanfleshbourne3547]

@@RobertoArboleda and when you make a 2 hour long, 25 thousand word story video with references and cross-examination from lore creatoors, the least you can do is watch a 20 minute seasonal recap. the excuse is not valid.

[@TheGamingSpartanA113]

Blame seasonal content removing crucial story information every year.

[@Foobymaster1]

Destiny has always had their best story telling in off screen dialogue and lore.

[@marcosdheleno]

that's not a compliment...

[@Foobymaster1]

@marcosdheleno it wasn't really supposed to be

[@rileychesters16]

TLDR; jez hates words and can't read

[@matthewboan616]

I don't think the video has been out long enough for you to have even finished watching it.

[@belamerda145]

@@matthewboan616 I think you're dumb

[@brettadiah10]

Refuses to read/listen to the story is probably more accurate lol.

[@lexiplays1252]

Yes

[@avocadonation6456]

conveniently. he also left out of this video the fact he hasnt paid attention to destiny 2 story or even the game in like a year

[@Bio_UK]

I remember i was on the brink of tears when cayde sacrificed himself for our ghost. That final line pushed me over the edge. I played this game franchise since i was 10 and now being an adult it was hard to say goodbye to the main story but in my opinion the final shape was the goodbye that was needed to the Light and dark saga

[@blackwingz7618]

I legitimately cried, I’ve played since the start of D1 and man it was a well needed ending, yes some hills and pitfalls along the way but all in all I’m happy the light and dark saga ended

[@Weebfox]

Im gonna watch this and take a shot every time Jez bashes the ghost wish me luck Edit: Crying over having to witness losing Cayde once more AND I have alcohol poisoning now and am throwing up uncontrollably 10/10 experience thank you Jeb for everything you've done to the community and being one of the pillars who has kept me invested in D2 all these years o7

[@eduardoceron4636]

You still alive???

[@Weebfox]

@eduardoceron4636 This might have been the worst idea I have ever had

[@devilwolf3202]

lmaoooooo

[@TheInfii]

​@@Weebfox gotta be up there with the Lightfall drinking game. Drink everytime they mention the Veil. 😂

[@vexmythoclast9476]

95% of viewers’ comments: “Lmao Jez can’t read” The 5% of viewers who actually finished this video: *“Holy shit Jez is quitting Destiny.”*

[@vexmythoclast9476]

@@hithere5553 I mean I like watching Jez, TravelDanielle and Datto doing Destiny content. Kinda sad if that’s coming to an end.

[@ryanfleshbourne3547]

Yeah, we all did with TFS. Who cares if one more person does

[@Zevox144]

@@ryanfleshbourne3547 Nah I'll be here til Disney lets Hugh Jackman stop playing Wolverine. Maybe less intensely, but still here.

[@Natefilenotfound]

Quit Destiny and stop farming sympathy viewership because you can’t grasp base game foundations, or just the layout of what makes DESTINY the game type that it is and has become. It’s not that hard.

[@horrorfan117]

Me: Thank fucking god

[@GreenSquad91]

When I saw cayde about to give up his light for our ghost, I was really hoping he would become our ghost. So he would basically be our narritor moving forward. I thought that would have been pretty neat.

[@marcosdheleno]

it would be hilarious if he revived the ghost and it was peter dinklage again...

[@Mental_Warlock]

Fun Fact: The Witness has the most music tracks in Destiny History during his boss fights Campaign: "Ritual Site" and "Cut Away" Raid: "Unmade" Excision: "Stronger, Together", "Cusp of Finality" and "Make Your Own Fate"

[@RosaNagashi]

This is kind of incorrect. Ritual site and cut away were just made as pale heart tracks and happened to be selected for Iconoclasm. Stronger Together/Cusp of Finality/Salvation’s Ruin/Make Your Own Fate is a single music system, they just split it up into 4 tracks on the soundtrack. Same goes for First Knife/Unmade. The witness has 2 music systems made specifically for it, which is just as much as, for example, Oryx had with Regicide/Last Stand. Calus at this point also has 2 massive music systems dedicated to him, although the Discipline/Desperate Measures/Tyrant Overthrown group isn’t wholly unique and only has individual portions that were made specifically for the campaign Calus fight.

[@Mental_Warlock]

​@@RosaNagashiMy intention was to focus on the boss fights themselves not the individual tracks that played right before the encounters

[@Aurich88]

I actually like what they did with Targe, partly because of who they cast. Probably better known as a contender for the worst father in all fiction (Dr. Venture), Urbaniak plays Targe like an stern but impotent dad. He does all that fussing when Zavala runs off because he doesn't know how to handle the anxiety of losing his boy. And when he catches up with him, he immediately jumps into the Witness' face and starts talking shit, picking a fight he is obviously going to lose. Exactly like a dad. It's sadly sweet. Also, spending your last moments telling the Witness it's afraid is objectively stupidly brave, which is very Titan of him.

[@Xenmaru00]

still died a more fitting and worthy death than Clark's father in Man of Steel. dumbass decided to die rather than let his kid save his life at no risk at all, for what, a secret? that the whole town already knew since Clark singlehandedly pushed his school bus out of a damn river? Targe went out like a Dad, Johnathan Kent went out like a bitch.

[@edwardrichard8093]

Who is targe?

[@Shinybook51]

Targe was a brilliant character in the campaign. I'm very pleased that they were able to make me feel invested in someone we haven't really had in the story before in such a short time (especially given how last expansion's characters were).

[@84m30]

VENTURE BROS MENTIONED

[@stalkholm5227]

Word nerd, here! (You'll call me a logophile and you'll *like it.*) I liked the way the Witness spoke, I felt like they spoke precisely and with intention, I understand someone seeing the Witness as pedantic, but the characterization worked for me.

[@WitchofHeart13]

Now this is a great comment here, it’s hard to find peeps that can talk about liking the narrative without trashing Jez for one reason or another. We all got our experiences here.

[@nttreaper4875]

​@@WitchofHeart13 no one would be trashing him if half of his argument wasn't "me no like words or read them"

[@kenyizsu]

As a certified lore junkie for a handful of franchises, I STILL very much agree with Jez that the STORY should be complete and easy to follow without knowing all the side fluff. The story should be the one to make you want to read up on the side fluff. Having actual story-moving plot points in the side fluff is starting to feel like a cardinal sin to me, genuinely.

[@blah90292]

Legit tho "how many times did your revive me?" "Crow... I respect you too much to say" would've been top tier dialogue

[@N008Nightmare]

24 minutes in and heres the points i have: yes we knew crow and mara were twins, that was a big part of season of the lost, and more specifically the exotic mission for Ager's Scepter. The Iron Lord room in crow's mission is in reference to season of the risen where crow, being mentored by saladin, killed one of caiatl's advisors and Saladin stepped up to face the consequences on his behalf. Its the whole reason Saladin is on Caiatl's war council. Crow feels guilty for saladin having to pay the price for his mistakes. Jez, I love you buddy, but you dont really have room to complain about not understanding the story when you've spent literal years avoiding learning any of the story. 😂😂

[@ajeenius7437]

Eh, all of that is a part of seasonal content that no longer exists. While yes he did play it at the time it's still valid criticism to make since there are certainly players that DIDN'T play the game at that time that now just have to guess about the connections. And no, watching a recap on KZbin is not valid. That stuff should be in the game.

[@Freelancer837]

I agree partially, but any story that's only available in seasons is stupid. How will anyone right now go and play those stories? Not knowing Crow and Mara are twins is stupid though because that's always been a main story of Destiny thing. Multiple times. Since the very beginning of Destiny 1 year 1. He's still right about The Final Shape being terribel, but that's not something new/different. We knew it would be, and Destiny has been terrible for years with its expansions not being good since Forsaken at the least. But he sure is not the best person to talk about the story when he's missing basic general knowledge.

[@avaliantsoul5408]

and yet, everything we learned from seasons is gone, and no one can re-experience, which frankly gives him every right to complain, because anyone who joined after a season has missed 90% of the story up to that point.

[@isuccnewton2654]

to be completely fair, that shit is all part of seasonal content. ya know, the stuff thats been removed from the game.

[@N008Nightmare]

Seasonal content or not, he specifically asked if prior to the diorama in crows mission if it had ever been said they were twins. The answer is yes. Whether or not the specific content is still in the game doesnt change the fact that the information was previously provided. And the saladin bit is a bit more egregious given that it was literally the key scene from season of the chosen. While i agree that seasonal content being removed isnt conducive to ensuring that people understand the story, Jez is literally the least qualified to comment given his aggressive refusal to learn the story. He has literally spent years actively refusing to learn the story. The complaints about lack of context hold no weight coming from Jez specifically. You dont get to whine about your foot hurting, when youre the one who shot your foot. When your complaint is, 'there is no way (outside of lore) for me to have learned this information', and is just incorrect, it would be disingenuous to not point that out. I agree that final shape made some.... confusing choices, but those 2 points specifically were given context.

[@riloretro7821]

55:28 Bungie also conveniently left out Ikora's ghost, Ophiuchus, probably because they actually can't stand each other and they have a hostile coworker relationship.

[@EternalFount]

People say the Dread couldn't be made in a few months. I disagree. The Grim existed as a prototype for years. They just couldn't find a reason to finish them. The Weavers and the Stasis ones are just beefed up Psions. The Harbinger and the Stasis one(I can't remember Stasis names apparently) were already made. The Husk is probably 85% Fallen captain. Its not impossible they made these changes in months. I still don't care about the Witness, but I really did enjoyed the character side of the story.

[@KamikazePhil]

the dread outside of tormentors and subjugators were made in the delay, its been confirmed by paul tassi

[@cornholiotitycaca1042]

having grown up with you, It is wild to see your transformation from a young adult with childish content to a mature father figure who still plays a childish way but with a artistic twist it is wonderful to watch you grow up.

[@RosaNagashi]

TWO HOURS?? I’m going into this already disagreeing with you based on the title alone but oh my god this is gonna be a treat.

[@RosaNagashi]

Alright, finally got through all of it and I gotta say that, while I personally got a lot more enjoyment out of The Final Shape campaign that you seemingly did, I'm finding it hard to genuinely disagree with most of your points. I think it's important for me to understand that my perspective - that of someone who dives a lot deeper into destiny's lore and world building -is going to be vastly different from the average (and arguably more common) player that doesn't engage with that side content, and this video gave me that perspective. Brilliantly written and spoken throughout. I'll be here to see wherever you go next

[@Punky_Enjoyeroftrains]

The switchup is wild

[@mrsmi1ey]

i went in assuming i would disagree with most of the video, and ended up agreeing with almost the entire video. i'm honestly shocked at how well-rounded, well-researched, and well-written pretty much all of his arguments are. jez, i'm gonna be sad not having you around to joke through content with datto and danielle, but if we get one of these kinds of bangers each month, then i think we'll all be more than happy!

[@Punky_Enjoyeroftrains]

@@mrsmi1ey Same

[@MrTacticalToast]

I'm not fluent in yapanese, but I think Jez doesn't like writing done by committee

[@izzyxblades]

I also would say I don't care about Ghost, not that invested in him. But, after he died and my guardian was begging the traveler to revive him, that totally made me cry for some reason. Jez didn't mention that throughout the campaign, Ghost appeared progressively more cracked and fractured, so maybe that contributed to this feeling of not wanting to lose him.

[@aresgodofwar7401]

1:54:48 I have been saying that for so long now, Zavala love him but he should have been the one to give his life for his friends especially after finding redemption for his failures.

[@newtypeshot]

Your point about how we should have fought Zavala reminded me of one of the trailers leading up to TFS release where they showed part of the cutscene of the abomination boss you fight in the Wild Card mission and it was right after or shortly after Ikora’s line “Zavala please don’t do this” and I remember thinking it would be CRAZY if Zavala gave in to the Witness and was mutated into an abomination that we had to fight

[@korakatk318]

I can’t critique the story because I spent the whole campaign dicking around with friends instead of paying attention

[@YitbosSwede]

Jez really went from monotone-complainy-guy to 2-hour-dissertation guy in less than a decade. What a transformation.

[@parkerreed8565]

I miss monotone complainy guy so much! lol

[@derekkovach942]

This video probably won't make your destiny loving fanbase happy. But this is genuinely the best kind of content you make. You weave in your own brand of humor very well, and I'd love to see you really master it. Good shit, Jez.

[@Daylongs]

1:51:50 I actually really liked the fact that Cayde’s goodbye memento was through the radio. Reminded me very heavily of the Ace of Spades quest where you listen to different message logs Cayde recorded for people who could have killed him, and the final message was to the guardian. He ends the message with “Every story has an end. This is mine.” Nathan Fillion’s performance hard carried the expansion, I was worried when they announced Cayde was coming back because of his marvel humor in red war but I was very surprised and delighted by his character in final shape.

[@NathanHarrisStudio]

Datto would be so proud that Jez actually paid attention to dialogue after all

[@namenotfound2456]

To me it didnt feel much more than Lightfall, also, what they did to Zavala is fucking criminal, let alone reving ghost AFTER 2 SECONDS. I MEAN, FOR THE TRAVELER'S SAKE, THEY COULD LITERALLY DO ANYTHING ELSE, BESIDE THE SHITTY JOB THEY'VE DONE (an example: showing an entity or some kind of place where to infuse/mend Ghost, INSTEAD OF HAVING THAT CAYDE'S FAN SERVICE ASS SACRIFICE HIMSELF FOR BUNGIE'S LESS THAN POOR WRITING. (sorry for the rant, but as someone with 4k+ hrs in d2 alone, shit like this REALLY gets on my nerves)

[@Issac1222productions]

22 minutes in and I get the feeling Jez just hates not having things explicitly explained to him slowly in game and hates ghosts inexplicably. If your only point of complaint that you bring up over and over is "I don't understand because too many word". Like...I don't want the ghost to literally just say "shoot that ball", games and fictional media can dress up simple concepts in fancy words and jargon all the time. Play literally like any DnD campaign or a futuristic game like cyberpunk 2077 and they do this. It doesn't hit a specific nerve with me like it does with Jez for some reason. Also why the witness uses flowerly language might be because...he's made up of like 5000 people? I personally like the way the witness talks, it gives just the slightest tugging at the corner of the players mind that they might be seeing things on a "higher level" than us and that maybe they know something we don't.

[@tsunamie1015]

"Like...I don't want the ghost to literally just say "shoot that ball"" I mean, neither does he. He is simply pointing out how simple directives are explained in an overly convoluted and/or unnecessary manner. There's a difference between giving appropriate and concise directions that suit the tone, and long winded explanations that exist solely for the sake of explaining things. While the Witness using "flowery" language certainly could help it appear to be a higher being of sorts, in the end it's gonna have little effect if it leads to players not being able to comprehend what they're talking about. Situations that use language unknown to the player can certainly be used well, it's not an inherently bad thing. But that method relies on the game/scene to give the player different context clues. Using that method when the entire purpose of a scene is to explain something would be like me wanting to show you a beautiful scenery while also asking you to wear a blindfold.

[@thechunkmaster8794]

@tsunamie1015 None of the Witness’ language is actually convoluted, though. Its style of speech is actually very concise. You would have to very deliberately ignore what it’s saying in order to misunderstand it.

[@tsunamie1015]

@@thechunkmaster8794 That really depends. It's definitely possible to create eloquent characters without relying on the use of vocabulary that most won't know. Does it make the Witness any less eloquent? No. But it does take away from the moment, because a lot of players are, in that moment, thinking more about "what does that word mean?" than the actual thing he's saying.

[@thechunkmaster8794]

​@@tsunamie1015 This is literally the only place where I have ever seen people complain about the Witness being supposedly hard to understand. I very much doubt that a lot of players are genuinely stumped about what it's saying when it's one of the most concise speakers in the game.

[@tsunamie1015]

@@thechunkmaster8794 Or it's simply not brought up much because the vast majority of players actually talking about it are the kind that would look up what words like "ambivalence" mean, or lore videos that talk about it. The people actually engaging with comments and forums are also the vast minority of a playerbase. Furthermore, a decent chunk of the playerbase probably doesn't have english as their native language. And even of those who do, how many know the definition of ambivalence off the top of their head? Besides, being concise and the negative effect of using not so common vocabulary are two entirely different things. I never said the Witness wasn't concise, just that using vocabulary that most of the players won't know diminishes the effect of an emotional moment.

[@phillipmudd]

I feel so much of what you’re saying. Especially in a world where everyone else telling me how much better this was than it is.

[@lukerance-jackson4346]

Nathan Fillion is a brilliant actor, it's such a joy to watch.

[@trashwizrd]

13:56 i just love hearing skyrim music playing in a destiny 2 video

[@Jaimeis]

I think part of the issue with ghost is that the guardian never talks to him. I don't hate ghost as much as you do. I'm more indifferent. But if bungie wanted to make Us care about ghost more, They should have our guardian Talk 2 ghost in the field instead of just ghost talking into the void. Like how in God of war and God of war Ragnarok there's the boat conversations.

[@RobertoArboleda]

The problem is that Bungie has always intended for us, the players, to fill in the blanks and reply to Ghost while we're playing. It's supposed to be a form of immersion. It's why the customizable guardian player is mostly mute and is always referred to as "them" in lore and dialogue. And honestly, it has never worked. I remember when people CHEERED in Forsaken when the guardian spoke a few lines because of Cayde's death after being mute for years. You'd think they would have taken the hint and turn the guardian into a more active protagonist. But no, they still to this day insist in making the guardian this awkward almost autistic character that is always peeping on private conversations and doesn't speak to their ghost.

[@mackncheese1683]

@@RobertoArboledaBro that last part just makes you sound like a fool. “I’m autistic because I don’t like to talk most times.” Like get over yourself.

[@RobertoArboleda]

@@mackncheese1683 Your comment makes no sense, but I don't care either way. I said what I said, and it's not my problem if you interpret my comment however the fuck you do. Have a good day.

[@jaipadv8282]

​@@mackncheese1683no no he has a point, the playable "Guardian" character really reeks of autism. I mean this as someone who knows many people on the spectrum. The way they choose to move about the universe and how they interact with these characters that they've been attached to for over a decade certainly has a strange tone to it. The game is set up in a way where your character essentially needlessly searches and rummages through every different method and destination in the universe, to hear the most of every conversation/dialogue between any two given characters, stores that information, and then never speaks to anyone about any of it at all. More so than a strong silent protagonist with intent, the way that the game is set up really gives off much more of a "this is my ADHD addiction for when I'm not shooting things" feel, especially when they CAN talk but choose not to, it really does start to feel like an ADHD/autism response of not knowing when to respond even when directly spoken to.

[@RobertoArboleda]

@@jaipadv8282 I salute you for putting into written words exactly how I feel about the character. Thank you.

[@RaulDiaz3d]

I never saw this channel I need to subscribe Great format Feel like pitch meeting but we the other guy

[@tysoncrosby3915]

Jez: lightfall wasn't good because we didn't get any explanation about what we were doing or why. Also Jez: Why final shape have so many words.

[@edwardrichard8093]

I can't tell if this is a meme or not. Just because they throw in a bunch of words to fill up their word count quota doesn't mean it explains anything.

[@peanutbutter3142]

@@edwardrichard8093 if you lack reading comprehension thats on you chief

[@Thomas_Cool]

That just wasn't the argument at all

[@mantra-hf6ej]

@@peanutbutter3142 A book can be 1000 chapter of thousands of words of incoherently strung together nonsense, and shocker its complete nonsense. You can also relay an idea articulately and appropriately without wasting an audiences time. Internet trends just have you aping a term like "reading comprehension" to mask your own insecurities about your intellect, no one thinks more of you because you lapped up bungie's slop for 8 years. Just downboat the comment and move on, you'll save more face.

[@djanthaz]

*”While you’re doing ayahuasca in a combat zone”* caught me so off guard 🤣🤣🤣

[@JasonColeman007]

Kay: We'll use pulsar level five, with a subsonic implosion factor. Jay: What? Kay: Just shoot the damn thing! Jez watching Men In Black: Yes, that is exactly what I'm talking about!

[@dragifire]

1:41:45 I think Nimbus does have a single speaking line, it's just rare. They can spawn in the little Neomuna airstrike beacon thingy and say something about it (I don't remember exactly what)

[@isaactheflaming12345]

You thought the story was absurd because you didn't pay attention I thought it was absurd because my game crashed every time I beat a level and it forcefully skipped several long, important cutscenes. We are not the same.

[@KenanHall]

This whole video is a narration for destiny as a whole. I'm truly impressed how you broke this down... excellent job bro 👏

[@victorvance13]

Ngl the parts that got me emotional during the campaign almost all involved Cayde, Nathan Fillion absolutely killed it in every single scene and line.

[@LiterallyMyst]

"Shoot ball" Almost made me spit out my cereal

[@JacobPrexta]

Whole bunch of great points but the witness dialogue makes sense, it believes it has knowledge of multiple worlds and is superior to all, the point of his dialogue and the grad student wording is that he is looking down on you in every way, believing he is so much better than you that even the words he uses are beyond you.

[@DravenothTheSecond]

I kinda wish that the witness succeeded in creating the final shape only for the universe to collapse and reform followed by the destiny 3 announcement

[@Dromniil]

I haven't watched much of it yet, but I wanted to address some comments I saw: Saying "but the story that gives you the context for *blank* happening isn't in the game anymore because the season was removed" doesn't mean the story was bad, it just means that the handling of content and story preservation mechanics are severely lacking and always have been. If you were willing, watching Byf's full history video before playing the final shape would fix that issue, but you shouldn't need to at all. Coming from someone who knows almost everything there is to know about the story, I loved it, but I totally understand that missing even a single mission or cutscene that was removed 2 years ago and therefore feeling completely lost is not cool.

[@Zevox144]

I agree, but Jez gets so much less credit for it when for the past two years he has made a point of making sure everybody knows he is going out of his way to get zero story engagement or even any dialogue whenever he plays the game, and that he was in fact there for these crucial story missions.

[@edwardrichard8093]

No. Lol literally the only person who 90% of the playerbase cares about is cayde.

[@Froggsroxx]

So to summarize: Bungie remains unable to write dialogue even to the level of fan-fics. Got it.

[@FaolanKitekaze]

No one show Jez any dialogue scene from a Hoyoverse game, he'll spontaneously combust from all the words

[@jamman499]

That was my immediate thought when he started complaining about draw out exposition. I can deal with it pretty well, but it grates on me sometimes too.

[@bootstrap925]

destiny dialogue all things considered is typically pretty concise. a single story quest from any hoyoverse game will make his brain melt

[@ExpressoPie]

😂

[@WitchofHeart13]

Goddess, y’all have been in this narrative too long. I’m sure you’ve played other games but this one seems to have normalized a certain kind of dialogue that people do in fact find bogged down. We can have different opinions yknow?

[@FaolanKitekaze]

@@WitchofHeart13 no one said you couldn't have a different opinion my guy. My joke was just about there being an even worse example of dialogue bloat out there in gaming

[@FloydThePig]

I feel like the difference between Haunted and the final shape was Zavala had been offered by the witness and a chance to go back. He was confronted with something even harder than the ghost of his past. It is definitely similar but he continued to feel like the traveler wasnt doing anything so even if he has forgiven himself/came to terms with the past already I feel it pretty reasonable that he would have to rethink it.

[@daimonclarke]

That's a lot of words used to complain about a lot of words

[@Raddahgon]

1:27:20 peak gameplay right there. Fantastic video. I was fed up with the story focusing on Crow and then retreading Zavala's family matters. Combine the pacing with the fact that cutscenes were bugging out and automatically skipping themselves. (The game never showed my character meeting Cayde or Zavala's cutscene when he's in his house) There were few good moments in the campaign for me. Best overall moment was sitting on the ship looking at the traveler after beating the Witness. Once I saw that, I did the mission again with a homie of mine and lo & behold both of us were chilling on the ship looking at the traveler. I grabbed five friends, most of whom had not done it, and beat the mission again only for the game to hang on a black screen for the next 30 minutes and crash. I saw streamers' games bug out when they beat the mission in a team of six. Seems like the ship has a weight capacity. A crew shot in that scenery would have been greatly appreciated but oh well.

[@jer103]

Pro tip I use when watching cut scenes in Destiny 2: have sit as an emote. You sit down, relax, and you can clearly see both people talking. Smart right?

[@chrisjackson7669]

Just wanted to say, really enjoyed this Vid, usually I watch your GM/Raid stuff with Mr and Mrs Trv and Co. but I could definitely feel the effort and passion put in, there were some really good points (that alt final missions vs Zavala idea for e.g would have been amazing to go through, I can barely remember which enemy a subjugator is most of the time -_-), I'm sad to hear the old style of vids may be leaving, but I will definitely be keeping an eye out for these greenscreen ones as the two I haev seen have both been excelllent (the other being the 33min "Bungie's worst story") Hope this new style of content works out for you

[@long_time_hiro8297]

I remember when jez used to not mindlessly hate everything

[@daiboy456]

Ikora said it herself in Forsaken. "I have only ever been a supporting character in your story".

[@TheLikkittysplitt]

Jez, skyrim is an rpg. Destiny is a shooter. No you can't put your gun down. That's like playing pokemon saying you could do without all the wacky critters

[@marcosdheleno]

4:13 to me, the issue is not that characters in destiny are like that, its that EVERY character in destiny is like that. if it were 1 or a specific group of people, it would be acceptable, but as is, it just ends up feeling dragged out for no reason.

[@kristawilson2895]

I care about ghost, but also have always played with voice on. I think if he’s never really had voice on and never really cared about the story of course he’s not going to be “emotionally” invested.

[@edwardrichard8093]

No no no. People who have an emotional connection to ghost are literally just desperate to praise bungie. I had a more emotional connection to crow because he actually interacts with your guardian. Your ghost is literally just your voice.

[@larsroom2136]

Incredible effort. I haven’t played destiny for 6+ years for personal reasons but this was fantastic.

[@Hiro35x]

@Jez Not liking something isnt toxic, thats just an opinion. Its how you go about not liking something that can stem into toxicity.

[@Conartistcriz]

Heya jez! Ngl this is my favorite green screen vid of yours, i was literally engaged for the whole 2 hours. You did good, i very much see the passion👍 thank you for this 💚 gl

[@DNrSquar3d]

I actually agree with the overarching points raised here. I think what made it worse for me is the fact that I had gone through the entirety of FF14's MSQ just 4 months prior to TFS, and I found myself almost begging Bungie to make the campaign make me feel something. It just fell so short of what a capstone to a saga should feel like.

[@jesster402]

The Destiny to FFXIV pipeline claims another lmao

[@UnreliablyGabe]

Bro I played baldurs gate 3 before this came out and this campaign's narrative felt like someone's last minute essay

[@KiddBuu_]

@@UnreliablyGabeI used to think I just wasn’t a fan of story games, which is why I didn’t care for Destiny’s story missions after TTK and RoI, but after playing Armored Core 6 3 times and Cyberpunk, I realized I like story games, Destiny’s in game story is just kinda garbage.

[@Venomx-nb1jr]

You know I played the final shape and I’m still not sure I understand wtf happened to cayde and the vanguard.

[@manuelvalerin8914]

Did anybody else imagine that Crow whipped out the Iron Lord axe like a Cartoon Character from Looney Tunes???

[@patricklarsson2372]

“We kill gods for a laugh and a new outfit.” Quick side note - everything The Witness was voiced by Brett Dalton. See particularly his Agents of Shield work to see how versatile he is as an actor, both on and off the screen. Really phenomenal work by Dalton for both Destiny and AoS.

[@onokenfudou3394]

As a Destiny 2 player myself, I have to admit, Destiny`s narrative peaked at Witch Queen for me personally, it was just too good, the writting was great, and the Throne World gave me some really good vibes too (I love that castle garden aesthetic thanks to Aden`s castle in Lineage II). I`m not saying that it was the best overall, but to me specifically I enjoyed it a lot. Sure, most might enjoy the previous expansions over the Witch Queen more, but that one expansion to me was just perfect, and the climax of the campaign was great. Coming from it to Lightfall was just meh, since Liightfall was just, yikes. And Final Shape afterwards was eeeeh, alright I guess, but nothing insane.

[@maskoblackfyre]

The biggest mistake of the entire Final Shape story is not having Zavala say "Were it so easy..." Prove me wrong

[@gelitesparton8533]

Unpopular opinion? I really enjoy ghosts humor. I think its tacky on purpose and i find it cute-

[@Xenmaru00]

Its like when Sagira pointed out our Ghost was one of the uppity ones. He has a personality. its largely straightlaced, but its *his* and he owns it.

[@gelitesparton8533]

@@Xenmaru00 Exactly, and its totally fair not to like that personality, but I definitely enjoy ghost. (Always think back to the time he tried to do drifters voice, it was so stupid but I loved it XD)

[@mdamonc]

Unpopular opinion in response? I think not only is ghost sometimes funny, but cayde-6 is sometimes not. I think the "i like crows hair cut" was short enough to be totally fine. Its not hilarious, but its not trying to be, its just a nice line tacked on. But Caydes "Oh noo crow, why did you kill the handsomest hunter in all of sol" was so fucking cringe, it breaks one of Jez' own tenants of "trying too hard". Cayde is overall still funnier than ghost imo, but i personally find ghost (and crow) more likeable than most people do, and i think while Cayde is very very likeable, he does have some unfunny moments that it feels like people are afraid to point out.

[@gelitesparton8533]

@@mdamonc Oh entirely, I love Crow and Ghost, and while cayde is one of my favorites of all time, just like everyone else he has unfunny moments. But- isnt that part of what it is to be a person? Youre not always gonna be the funniest person in the room. Sometimes you swing and you miss, hardcore, that moment where he does the line your talking about where he mocks crow for killing him, yeah it was pretty cringe and trying to hard, but I feel like it still fits in his character. (Also, I agree with ghost, I like crows haircut to XD)

[@DirtaDawg420]

Missed half these cutscenes first play through due to technical bugs, so yeah there was that too

[@alexA.7529]

Ok, I may not agree with you for some points but I do agree with "buffs our something by something percentage." It is absolutely insane that everything in this game that buffs regen or damage doesn't have a percentage and duration in paremthesis next to it, ans very annoying. Also I personally agree, I want abilities to suppliment gunplay, not be the gun

[@alexA.7529]

I guess I'll just talk about this while I watch, I too hated "I like Crow's haircut" from Ghost Everybody with the light can kinda feel like they're in the Traveller, that's why Cayde said that he knows, especially because he feels more like a Ghost does now I also agree, there is wayyyyy too much lore in this game that really should be told to us in some way Ok, Jez, if you listened to the seasons you play, then you would know they were twins. Also, media introducing you to new words that more concisely says a phrase in one word is not a bad thing A lot of the cringe comments by Ghost would be fixed if they just let our Guardian talk. He could have said something like "I think we need some better boots" or something like that. Then maybe something like Ghost asking how bad it is, and we say "barely a crack" but apprehensively, like we're sparing Ghost how bad it is Times like Zavala breaking in Witch Queen highlight how good Lance Reddick was, along with season of the Haunted. Lance was phenomenal for Zavala, and Keith David is so different that it doesn't feel like Zavala. I like Keith, but it'll never be the same Yes for the love of god Guardian speak, the campfire cutscene was so awkward I 100% agree, the section with all of us completely ignoring Zavala until at some point we just decide to investigate what he wanted is fucking insane, it's my least favorite part of this campaign Also again, Crow got the axe in a season from Saladin

[@Wulfspyder]

@@alexA.7529 It has always bothered me that Bungie seemingly wants RPG stuff without actually doing RPG stuff.

[@khaibreakbread4650]

This video made me realized something and I kinda mad I deep, but the Witness says the light creates life with the meaning but then what do you call ghost (pointy ball things made from light with THE SOLE PURPOSE OF FINDING GUARDIANS) just a lil food for thought

[@Dream146]

"communicating your views in a clear and concise manner is important." he says at the outset of a two hour monologue..."

[@Fibulator]

It's an 8+ hour campaign... I'd say 2 hours to critique it is generous

[@vexecutioner5907]

The best part of The Final Shape is the part where I get my life back. I'm fReeeeeeee!!!!!!!

[@jaybird21904]

A 2 hour video means jeb can go mia for like 3 months and get away with it

[@SPISheste]

The "I made a promise" literally made me stop up and just reflect on the game. Effing nice delivery from Nathan and writing, absolute cinema chills.

[@astonegargoyle4049]

On the point of the Guardian showing affection for the ghost, it is MY opinion that it is not. Back in the red war, when we lose our light and the ghost falls, our guardian pulls them closer in what is likely an attempt to protect them. And I don't remember it too well, but at the end of beyond light when the ghost is frozen by Eramis?

[@jackson2762]

I actually wonder, are players actually satisfied or were ever satisfied with the story over the last 10 years?

[@tsunamie1015]

Personally, i was never satisfied. Destiny 2 story had great potential, it had tons of lore and interesting ideas that they *could* delve into. But in the end they just create these steretypical stories that jump around between great emotional moments and absolutely baffling disconnected moments. It's a great example of a great setting/universe becoming bland because of the way it's presented.

[@irishbananamafia9728]

Jez: “Since we’re all gonna die I have one more thing I feel I have to share with you; I did not care for the Final Shape”

[@folawn]

Another outstanding video. Well done, Jez!

[@DrVivekPsyD]

2 hours? Jez guaranteed to spend 99% of this destroying the Ghost.

[@vrika4280]

The dialogue was cringy asf, the story was mid imo, I didn't like what they did to Zavala, Osiris and Saint suck, the Witness is a horrible antagonist, disconnected, boring and looks lame asf instead of intimidating, and when at some point ghost decided to say "I am yours, and you are mine", I wanted to fkn barf...

[@sombrashadow0013]

Im sorry, but I dont agree with most of this. Dont get me wrong, I dont think its the most perfect story they've ever done. But this was the only story that got an actual emotional reaction out of me. I feel like as a bookend, it works. My problem is, they should've just ended it there. Everything after Excision feels pointless.

[@Xenmaru00]

everything after TFS should be its own new game, honestly.

[@omensoffate]

This story was terrible 😂

[@Sam-h6u9d]

I like how people are saying that "Destiny 2 is dead" while the game has more players than helldivers 2

[@vargod_]

banger video jez! personally being invested for so long in Destiny, this ending made me feel so many emotions, mostly good. And i loved what they did. BUT i can still see and am not ignorant to the fact that you make some very good points. well done dude. also, you not being invested in the story like some of us makes sense why this vid is what it is. people need to lighten up🤣

[@THEOPDESTROYER777]

honestly, after seeing the cut ending where we used light & dark to rez our ghost, im sad THAT wasnt the ending we got! it felt so poorly paced and written to bring back cayde, just to kill him off AGAIN which held no emotional value to me because as soon as he came (🤨) on screen, i already knew he was gonna get killed off. If instead of him just suddenly knowing he could just rez something without ever really realising he even had any powers at all, The Guardian uses his mastery of light and dark, creation and consciousness, that he's acquired over the past 10 years of destiny, mastering different supers, abilities, refining its strength, and finally becoming transcendent through the coalition of light and dark within the traveller, allowing him to reach the apex of his power as a vessel for light and dark (god and void, sorry had to shove a hollow knight reference in here somehow), and because of this absolute zenith of power he has acquired, is now truly on a completely astronomical level compared to nearly everything in the destiny universe. So honestly, him being able to revive his own ghost would've made perfect narrative sense and not just a lame way to sort of shove cayde back into the DCV in time for echoes. After all, this is the ending after 10 YEARS of destiny, why is it focused on cayde? it should be focused on us, The Guardian, and the culmination of the time we have spent getting stronger and stronger over this past decade, ending in a display of our complete mastery over light and dark, and truly showcasing that these powers are neither good nor evil, that decision is up to YOU, Guardian.

[@zackl4833]

Lances voice will forever be Zavala, Keith sounds good but he isn’t him.

[@yasininn76]

I actually don't like him as Zavala. Absolutely love him in every other role of his, but this one just isn't it

[@Vaestus]

You talked about "please be more concise and stop with technobabble" but outright this game would be better as a silent film because this company cant write anything other than cringey, cliche, and shallow first year philosophy major garbage. Its heavy handed criticism but there isnt a single line of dialog in Destiny 2 that doesnt make me roll my eyes so far into the back of my head I can watch my brain losing its higher functions.

[@grompgames4409]

Everybody gangsta till Jez starts talking about story and dialogue.

[@jaipadv8282]

Looks that way now

[@chayarchy]

1:05:11 my personal theory is that early versions of the story had Zavala sacrificing himself but when we lost Lance they decided to change it but the narrative was too strong for them to drop it completely

[@JamiaKlanister]

2 horu long rant about story from a guy who barely understand or played story in D2. I guess rent due, thats why he released this video after month of 0 uploads D2 stuff

[@toptemidy]

1:07:13 Crow isn't deranged actually in this statement. Remember, they have been fighting and living together for hundreds of years, they're basically family at this point. Not with The Crow, but The Fireteam.

[@BungiiChan07]

My biggest gripe with the final shape campaign was that the witness spent so little time trying to recruit the guardian, y'know the literal godkiller (and even says this in the trailer with 0 elaboration in the campaign), and instead spends 100% of its time distracting our little buddies and then when we finally reach the final mission it starts swooning over us

[@Xenmaru00]

i feel like that was a case of him trying to slowly "win" us by depriving us of our seeming source of strength: our allies. Remember the analogies, "the safe space lined by spears". The Witness, to me at least, seemed like he was attempting to remove not so much the spears but what allowed those spears to be in place. If we were Humanity's Spear, and our strength was the many hands that held us, then by removing those hands, he could defeat/convert us. Because flat-out destroying us entirely in one go, was never his goal.

[@jackr.t.4459]

I mean, Rhulk tried too, even addressed us nicely as children of light instead of trashing us or whatever for like 3/4 of the raid And Stasis was The Witnes' first attempt at trying to recruit us, if one or most powerful assets was not enough to sway us, I dont think him just trying to talk more about it would of done anything more than what Rhulk accomplished

[@-HezSEs-]

The Witness has been trying to recruit us long before FS. Hell, Beyond Light's stasis and Europa's pyramid where supposed to be gifts for us to tempt us.

[@KiddBuu_]

@@-HezSEs-no no, the Darkness was trying to tempt us. The Witness was whipped together suddenly to give us a tangible evil that doesn’t require as much narrative effort to explain. For a lot of people, there’s a disconnect between everything before the reveal of the Witness and the Witness themselves, as it doesn’t really feel like the entity communicating with us before was ever intended to be the Witness and the Witness itself was whipped up as a afterthought so they could hurry up and put an end to the saga without having to do a ton of setup for what that entity and its forces were intended to be.

[@grunkbigrock5135]

So jez hates words, and I think it's funny that this man had the game muted until now. But frfr D2 characters don't shut up abt useless shit like why they yap so much and I still don't know wtf going on unless Lore Daddy tells me what's going on