The Biggest Problem With EV Adoption - DEBUNK

[@BenSullinsOfficial]

Seeing some confusion in the video today so wanted to help clarify. The reason I bring up Tesla over and over is because that is the majority use case in Los Angeles where the WSJ did their test. This is a common tactic by anti-EV media outlets. They pick the worst possible scenario and generalize that as justification why EVs "aren't ready" - you can see this all the way back in 2019 where the NYT used a similar tactic. I agree we definitely need better public charging, but the way they used this niche use-case to bash EVs is misleading in my opinion. Hope this helps! Here's that NYT video from 2019 btw - kzbin.info/www/bejne/amHOp5J8bq11pbc

[@ItsMe-nl8qnd]

This is how media “approach” everything.

[@patrick7228]

If you don't want a Tesla her video is completely valid. Not everyone wants the choice to be either Tesla or ICE. And as far as everyone getting access to Tesla, we don't know when that is going to happen and honestly given Elon's capriciousness, if it still will. She may have picked the worst-case scenario, but aren't you choosing the best with everyone will have access to Tesla and the experience will be great argument?

[@dadbain]

@@patrick7228 I'll defend Ben here. He drives a rivian and also owns Teslas and as such is his perspective in California, where he lives.

[@patrick7228]

@@dadbain Gotcha. Maybe then he should say my take today is only for people who live in California 🙄. Come on man, on a forum where he preaches facts to drown out the FUD (which I agree with and appreciate him for), I can't accept that explanation.

[@yediydeyah78]

@@patrick7228 I think he is and it's not a good look for a category (EVs) that should be as objective and evenly critical of (as well as praising of) EVs (inclusive of charging (public, home)). It's also not a good look if you're someone who drives an ICE (like me) and you're looking for objective and honest information regarding EVs (like me) and you find a resource that seems to provide the answer for EV-related issues as "....Tesla..."

[@brentsmith-d8h]

You ever notice that there are a million videos about how hard it is to charge your EV on the road, but not a single video about how hard it is to refuel your ICE at home?

[@clintwolf5737]

It can't be that hard to fuel up your ICE vehicle at home. Just get a drilling rig in the backyard and hope you hit oil, pump it out, refine it, and poof! a tank of gas. I would love to see a spoof video of this compared to charging and EV at home.

[@nathansuss]

Lmao

[@patrickchubey3127]

My old Dad had a barrel of gas in the shed and a hand cranked pump. That way there was always gas handy for the lawnmower, the tractor, the truck and the car, no muss no fuss and only an occasional trip to the local gas station.

[@bobbybishop5662]

Sure you can all you need is an overhead storage tank like farmers , ranchers and business have. It's a common practice.

[@hieyeque1]

I bought a Tesla specifically to avoid this situation.

[@amilcarcuevasjr313]

@@hieyeque1 and her Rivian can also use the Tesla SC network. I used it yesterday and it was so fast.

[@mdshovel]

I have the reverse issue .. Tesla charging places very rare in my part of the UK, but plenty of the others.

[@mannyman4103]

I just waited for Rivian to be able to charge at the Tesla SC and I bought one in February when they announced the system integration.

[@RickF-m2x]

So you traded charging ease for crappy quality and wonky controls and creature comfort? Sounds like you have the wrong values, my friend.

[@hieyeque1]

@@RickF-m2x I find it more discomforting to be stuck on the side of the road. Wife just took a 4000 mile road trip with the kids this summer - the Super Charger network was a great comfort. I do agree controls are not optimal. Quality for 2023 M3 is adequate (we've put 18,500) on the car. I really wish we could have waited for the 2024 model as the suspension and certain component upgrades are needed. The biggest complaint I have is the suspension (being to stiff).

[@ryansherman4556]

Tesla works so good because Tesla built the car ,the charger and the software

[@gaydybwad1321]

And the solar and the battery storage backup!

[@ryansherman4556]

@@gaydybwad1321 yep when your fully integrated it just works

[@RickF-m2x]

Exactly. CCS charger companies must deal with dozens of car manufacturers and their interpretation of how charging should work. An Electrify America charger must be compatible with the varied electric architecture of Hyundai, Kia, Ford, Chevy, Volkswagen. Mercedes, BMW, Rivian, Lucid, Lexus, Toyota, Nissan, Honda, etc, etc. That's a much more challenging environment than only one brand that the charger was built specifically for. If all the other brands had proprietary chargers for their cars, those would most likely be highly reliable, like Tesla. Complaining that all the other charging companies are horrible is only looking at the charging process through a very narrow filter.

[@GruffSillyGoat]

@@RickF-m2x - NACS uses the CCS charger protocol, it's in effect CCS in a different smaller connector form factor. The compact size was the key point Tesla put forward for it's adoption, plus the fact there were more Tesla's in the US than other makes and they were going to carry on using it regardless. With NACS or CCS there is only one 'brand' or rather standard, it's just the connectors that differ. Plus Tesla car's NACS implementation supports backward compatibility with their older non-CCS chargers (Supercharger prior to V3), that used a variant on the CHAdeMO CAN protocol. All CCS cars confirm to the same protocol, SAE J1772 / IEC 61851-23, this isn't the reason for the issues encountered; all cars supporting this protocol are talking the same thing (including those using NACS connectors). This isn't the same as cars using different incompatible standards - such as CHAdeMO, GB/T etc. The reason for the issue is more likely power availability, the car may ask the charger "can you support level 1 AC", the charger replies "sure thing", both start charging (initially with a test pulse) and the power grid fails to support the current level and the charging drops out. Less common are cable issues, where the pre-charge cable check sequence fails. Where protocol errors are reported normally this is due to a software bug or configuration corruption on the charger, which should be regularly maintained to mitigate such.

[@brentsmith-d8h]

I think in addition, Tesla LIVES or DIES on their chargers, all the other manufacturers are still coasting on ICE cars, and just don't consider charging a priority.

[@ARepublicIfYouCanKeepIt]

I own a 2022 Bolt EUV. I've used DC fast chargers from ChargePoint, Electrify America, EVgo and Rivian, both around town when necessary, and on road trips. Aside from the occasional outage, which is easily identified in real time via any number of apps, I've not encountered even a single problem. I've also never had to queue to charge. My best experience is with EVgo due to their partnership with GM. No apps. No cards. Just plug and charge.

[@rodbrindamour9505]

I think the WSJ video has a very valid point to make. For every EV owner not driving a Tesla, fast charging is the glaring fly in the ointment. The other charging networks are doing a huge disservice to EV adoption by providing such poor user experience. Those networks deserve a kick in the pants (or in the US, a law suit). While in Holland this past March I saw what the future for EV's looks like and it is chargers in street side parking spots, apartment complex parking with chargers, chargers everywhere. Even though I own a Tesla I don't want Tesla to be the only EV option. Networks get your act together!

[@RickF-m2x]

I have a Hyundai Ionic 5 and have been using the free 2 years of charging benefit at Electrify America that came with the car. I never have problems with EA chargers. And I consistently get 240+ kWh charging speeds. Yes, there have been times when one station at a location was offline. But I used to find the same issues with gas pumps offline with my previous ICE car. Just use one that works is the simple solution. Various apps and even the car's navigation screen can show me which chargers are out of service and I simply avoid driving up to that one. Easy.

[@hansj5846]

Owned an EV for little over one year and have never experienced any issues with charging. Maybe Europeans are just better at building infrastructure ❤

[@GruffSillyGoat]

This is more of an US thing at the moment, as it's further behind the charger rollout curve than Europe, which has less issues with slow/rapid AC and fast/ultrafast DC charging. Not saying issues don't occur in Europe but it's much less frequent impacting a few percent of chargers (AC tend to be more problematic as they tend to be older and more spread out so slower to fix); also a number of European governments are introducing legislation requiring 99% reliability.

[@RC-hn8sj]

The anti-EV FUD team is always pitching the worst case scenario. The questions I get are pretty dumb from people that don’t understand EVs. One prime example is: How long does it take to charge from 0% to 100% at home at 120VAC? Really, this is the best they got?

[@mdrudholm]

I just drove from Los Angeles to the Canadian border and back in a 3,250 mile loop in a Tesla and it was absolutely painless. In fact, I spent less time refueling than I would have in a gas car because I recharged everywhere I lodged (friends' homes, hotels, and a bed & breakfast). The five times I did need to use a Supercharger, it was anywhere from 9 to 20 minutes, which was less time than I needed to visit the restroom and grab food.

[@hadtopicausername]

Greetings from Norway. Last year, when it just became too expensive to have my old Golf pass our mandatory safety inspections (420 000 km and 23 years on roads that are salted to bits during winter), I made the switch to an ID.4 GTX. Tesla has opened their charging network to everyone here, and they're the only charging provider I've used so far. You won't find a single Tesla charger here without a CCS2 plug, so the entire experience is seamless. Also, payment by debit card is becoming a mandatory option here.

[@lifeaccordingtobri]

Usual hit piece from mass media. Yes there is problems with CCS network. Most people charge at home and don't need to fast charge (like a gas car) away from your home. The media is stuck in the mindset you HAVE to charge just like you fill up a gas car.

[@harriettanthony7352]

And that very good point was MISSED in this video

[@wj9494]

I agree, BEV’s are supremely good for local/commute driving, but I drive 50k miles a year for work, and require as much high speed charging as I can find.

[@xxwookey]

That's true but some of us _do_ need the away-from home network to work too. And at least some of that is DC fast charging. Understanding that many people will hardly ever do this is important, but equally it needs to work both for people who use it occasionally and those who use it quite a lot. For my usage nearly 1/3rd of our charging is DC fast charging away from home.

[@ScrappyDoodad]

EV Hating gets clicks and views and thus pays She created what she wanted

[@ARepublicIfYouCanKeepIt]

The _Hard Reset_ channel and podcast have it right. Rather than pointing to the environmental benefits of EVs, or even citing superior performance, lower TCO, etc., etc., why not ask a different question: Knowing what we do now, if we had to remake our world from scratch, how would we go about it? In the case of personal ground transportation, which is responsible for ~14% of greenhouse gas emissions, particulate pollution, energy insecurity and wars over oil, would we: A) Drill for decaying dinosaurs, flora and fauna, pump this toxic goo to the surface, process it and transport it, then put it in our cars and trucks to burn it once at ~30% efficiency, all while spewing particulate pollutants and planet-warming greenhouse gases? -- or -- B) Build powerful, long-lasting, recyclable batteries to power 95% efficient drivetrains with superior torque and emissions-free power, little to no maintenance and massively lower total cost of ownership? That answer is glaringly obvious. Unfortunately, the public's complacency with the status quo, and the power of corporations and special interests with vested interests in the fossil fuel-powered economies are formidable forces with which to contend.

[@Truckmech]

But where does the power come from to charge your batteries? What powers the mining equipment used to extract the battery materials? How do we repair the damage done by strip mining? Which is the most cost effective method of extracting the materials by the way. I’m not a EV hater, I think EV’s do have a place and are pretty cool to drive. But EV’s have hidden environmental issues of their own. In time, I think some of those issues can be overcome, but it will take time. There is no easy button, for the obstacles of replacing our current energy system. Oil will be necessary for the remainder of our lifetime and likely a little longer. I’m not an oil supporter or oil opponent, what ever we do has to work, good intentions don’t equal results, and some pretty bad consequences have come from good intentions. I’m for not making things worse even by accident.

[@ARepublicIfYouCanKeepIt]

@@Truckmech Oh, goody. Yet another retread of worn out disinformation. Here we go: 1. But where does the power come from to charge your batteries? A: You're not going to like my answers. Firstly, the electricity to charge the battery in *my* Bolt EUV comes from my solar array. Secondly, for those without their own solar generation capability, the electricity comes from the grid (as you're well aware). The inconvenient truth for you is that EV batteries charged on even the dirtiest grid are still far cleaner than the cleanest ICE vehicle. I would cite sources for you, however they're numerous and you'd no doubt take issue with any one that I'd cite in particular. Secondly, grids are getting cleaner with every passing year, widening the margin of environmental impact ever more. 2. What powers the mining equipment used to extract the battery materials? A: You might be surprised to learn that mining equipment has been powered by highly efficient diesel-electric plants for decades. More recently, even the largest mining equipment, equipment that's largely stationary, is tethered to electrical power. I happen to know this firsthand. You can learn all about it too. All you need do is Google it. 3. How do we repair the damage done by strip mining? A: I'd be interested to understand how you come to single out strip mining for materials supporting the energy transition while disregarding the 100+ years of ecological devastation wrought by mining for coal, drilling for oil and fracking for gas, as well as deforestation. Furthermore, you might also be surprised to learn that lithium chemistry batteries are ~98% recyclable. That is, after those batteries have powered vehicles for hundreds of thousands of miles, then spent 15 or 20 years providing clean, reliable, safe stationery storage, they'll be almost entirely broken down into discreet elements that are as good as virgin. As more and more batteries are recycled (as they can be over and over and over again), the need to extract virgin material decreases. 4. Which is the most cost effective method of extracting the materials by the way[?] A: Here's a hint. Assuming you're referring to lithium, it ain't evaporation ponds in Chile. Direct Lithium Extraction, or DLE, is far more efficient and affordable, while minimizing ecological harm and depleting aquifers. In fact, the water returned from DLE processes is significantly cleaner than it was when pumped from underground. If you're referring to human rights abuses associated with cobalt, every new battery chemistry contains little to no cobalt. So, problem solved. Oh, wait. Not quite. For, as you again might be surprised to learn, your smartphone contains cobalt. So do superalloys used to make parts for gas turbine engines, airbags in automobiles, catalysts for the petroleum and chemical industries, cemented carbides and diamond tools, corrosion- and wear-resistant alloys, drying agents for paints, varnishes, and inks, dyes and pigments, ground coats for porcelain enamels, high-speed steels, magnetic recording media, magnets, and steel-belted radial tires. Then there are alternative battery chemistries, such as sodium-ion, graphene, and others. These use no lithium. Additionally, there are flow batteries for long-duration storage that also don't use lithium, using safe, abundant, organic materials instead. Again, Google it and you'll learn a ton. 5. You mention "hidden environmental issues" of EVs. No, they're aren't. Full transparency of EV resource use is well-documented, as is the timeframe in which the entire carbon debt is paid. That's currently less than two years. ICE vehicles, on the other hand, continue to emit particulate pollution and greenhouse gases for as long as they're on the road; their carbon debt only increases over time. See also my answer to your first question. The Principle of the Path states: Direction, not intention, determines destination. Ground transport is responsible for ~14% of greenhouse gas emissions. EVs solve this issue. Period. So, the faster that we transition to EVs, the better. EVs are approaching price parity with ICEVs. As more and more EVs join the fleet, less and less ICEVs will remain on the road. As the EV/ICEV mix transitions to an ICEV minority, fuel prices will increase as demand decreases. The cold, hard truth is that everyone would buy and drive EVs if price weren't an issue. As the availability and reliability of public charging infrastructure, and solutions for "garage orphans" become available , the pace of EV adoption will increase. Norway is a prime example. There, 95% of new car sales are EVs and EVs will overtake ICEVs as a majority of the ground transport fleet this year!

[@Truckmech]

@@ARepublicIfYouCanKeepIt FYI, I’ve been in the automotive industry since before EV EUV was a “thing”. Almost 4 decades now. You are quoting articles. Not facts. 1) Solar panels don’t grow on trees. They are manufactured. Using petrochemicals. 2) The battery cells are enclosed in a plastic case. More petrochemicals. 3) Efficiency does not do away with friction. EV’s suffer the same as ICE vehicles on losses from friction, the tires still touch the same ground. 4) The grid on its best day, no matter the source, solar, wind, hydro, nuclear, loses 30% of its energy in transmission. Additional load only increases the loses. 5) Half of the people in the US live rural, a solar panel will not provide adequate power to maintain the battery charge for longer commutes. Cities cannot handle the burden of an addition 100 million people to cut the commute. 6) Solar is not effective without sun, so the grid is still necessary. Batteries do not absorb all the energy required to charge. There are loses in conversion of voltage from AC to DC and loses in the use of voltage transformers. What efficiency an EV has is lost in the grid. 7) Mining, more manufacturing, more mining, more fuel. Most mines use very large earth moving equipment, such as the CAT 797F. These are quite common in mining operations around the world. It is a 400 ton 4000 hp diesel powered dump truck. These trucks run around the clock using thousands of gallons of fuel per truck everyday. Each mine operates dozens of these trucks. FYI, 500 tons of earth is moved to generate one ton of lithium. How far could you drive a Corolla on 3000 gallons of fuel? About 90,000 miles. But we’re not done yet, we still have to refine the Lithium to be usable, more ENERGY from the grid. And we still have to mine other rare earth materials for the batteries. At the end of the day an EV causes just as much CO2 as an average ICE vehicle. Are EV’s going to stop oil, far from it, they actually cause even more demand. Not to mention the effects of the mining. What about vegetable oil? Well, we are actually paying farmers not to plant crops, so we can put up solar arrays, on the land where the crop would have been to make the vegetable oil. No, I’m not exaggerating, I live in farm country. Just because we convince ourselves that something is good does not mean that it is.

[@rugbygirlsdadg]

In the same way that the auto manufacturers bought the tram networks and ripped up the tracks...

[@yediydeyah78]

But can her experience be discounted due her not using a Tesla supercharger? Out of Spec Reviews has a similar video (related to Southern California charging) and they encounted some of the issues that she encountered. Just because it's not Tesla-related (i.e Tesla vehicle, Tesla Supercharger, Tesla Vertical integration) doesn't mean it's not an issue and should not be discounted. Resolving or addressing the issues related to EV charging shouldn't be - "well with Tesla..." or "get a Tesla" or "I don't have those issues with my Tesla", etc. As someone who is considering getting an EV (strongly leaning AWAY from a Tesla) - the real-world experiences reported by users that are not Tesla drivers is something to be addressed. Tesla cannot be the end-all, be-all when it comes to EVs, EV charging, etc. We cannot let that type of monopoly take place when it comes to EVs.

[@jacobcarlson4010]

Agreed, and the snobby attitude of most tesla enthusiasts is also a serious problem. My main reason for buying a Nissan LEAF was twofold: I’ve been seriously burned by the “reliability” of gas vehicles, even from highly reputable brands like Toyota and Honda; and I like the fact that the LEAF’s high-voltage battery is designed to be easy to disassemble (once you get past the main gasket/seal) and work on, as compared with those that use liquid cooling. Definitely do not recommend working on it if you don’t know exactly what you’re doing (~400v DC is not to be taken lightly), but the point is that it IS both possible, and comparatively easier.

[@restonthewind]

If you're stopping at CCS stations that aren't working, you aren't using an app like plugshare that tells you which stations are working. I've driven a Bolt on many road trips, and I've never had a problem finding charging stations. I know they're working before I stop because they're either networked and report their status or a plugshare user has reported using their status. I charge at home 90+% of the time, but charging on road trips is not a problem at all. There's a learning curve, but when you've learned the ropes, it's no more difficult than driving an ICEV.

[@LyleBialk]

I generally don't need an app to find a working gasoline station.

[@restonthewind]

@@LyleBialk True, but you also can't fuel your vehicle at home for a quarter of the cost of pumping gas as I'm doing at the moment.

[@ai4px]

I’ve had the hand shake issue with chademo as well. Before ccs was ubiquitous I bought a used chademo to Tesla adapter and we had to go to two charge stations to find one that worked.

[@ARepublicIfYouCanKeepIt]

Department of Transportation data shows that over half (55%) of public charger outages are attributable to connectivity issues for which there's a readily available, easy and affordable fix: eSim technology, which would dramatically increase charger reliability.

[@paulconnolly4483]

Even ESIM technology requires a reliable wireless network to connect with.

[@paulconnolly4483]

Using the app assumes you have network connection available in the location. Here in Australia that’s not always possible outside of the cities.

[@ARepublicIfYouCanKeepIt]

@@paulconnolly4483 eSIM makes multi-carrier connectivity much, much easier.

[@ARepublicIfYouCanKeepIt]

@@paulconnolly4483 eSIM makes multi-carrier connectivity much, much easier. It is a part of the solution set. But, hey, don't take my word for it. I only worked in wireless for 15 years. Do your research. Here's a hint, look into what the Department of Transportation's reports say about the matter.

[@jimsEVadventures]

The MSM always (and I mean ALWAYS) reports on the "exception," not the "rule!" Out of her 40% "problem" charges, I would say 50% were user error! But what do I know? Been driving EVs for five years and I have over 15,000 "on the road" miles on a Bolt! So...I call this type of reporting, "Spreading Fertilizer!"

[@ARepublicIfYouCanKeepIt]

"Spreading Fertilizer". I'm stealing that one for sure! To keep things clean, I typically refer to BS as "male bovine excrement."

[@jamesvandamme7786]

"Man bites dog" is news. "EV catches fire!" is news.

[@makarovaolabronislaw]

If you are not in the financial market space right now, you are making a huge mistake. I understand that it could be due to ignorance, but if you want to make your money work for you... prevent inflation

[@dakyneil9792]

Thanks for continuing updates I'd rather trade the crypto market as it's more profitable. I make a good amount of money per week even though I barely trade myself.

[@makarovaolabronislaw]

No I don't trade on my own anymore, I always required help and assistance

[@makarovaolabronislaw]

From my personal financial advisor ..

[@makarovaolabronislaw]

Sure what's Apk her directly, but KZbin's got a thing with posting number

[@makarovaolabronislaw]

+141

[@punditgi]

Keep up your fine work! 🎉😊

[@jacobandrews3738]

One other problem with 3rd party EV chargers is the government will give grants to install the chargers so companies focus on installing as many as possible to receive more grants instead of focusing on keeping the existing ones operational

[@JunitafluxcyfatriciaJunita]

Meanwhile in China they subsidize electricity costs . So the more it is used the more profitable it is for charger companies.

[@dennisengland9787]

I am a field engineer for EV charging stations in the middle of the US. A majority of my work is for Electrify America. In the year I've been doing this, the uptime for the chargers I routinely go to has more than doubled. It all comes down to the (EV charging) company actually having the maintenance done by qualified people. Something that wasn't done before. When all these other companies start plugging into a Tesla charger, their reliability will go down. For some of the reasons they mention in the video, but often, the software issues end up manifesting themselves as a physical issue. One thing I have noticed, EV drivers at the stations I work at are often very eager to chat and learn about each other's cars. And I get thanked a lot for maintaining the chargers. However, tesla drivers just plug in and walk away with barely an acknowledgment of anyone else there. Like they are ashamed they had to stoop to using a non-tesla charger. Teslas I have driven and used are just crappy. Might have nice tech, but I have to look away from the road to use it. Range isn't as good as advertised. Not to mention having to give money to a neo-fascist when you buy or use one. I'd never get a Tesla.

[@stever5359]

Good points, but be careful lest Elmo file a lawsuit against you for hurting his feelings.

[@sorinelpustiu5674]

Yeah having double the up time is still 4-5x worse than a supercharger. Maybe tesla owners walk away because they want to charge and they expect all chargers to work like with tesla chargers.... Perhaps non tesla chargers are very accustomed to their chargers not working and chatting with repair men. I'll enjoy driving a Tesla and not chatting with broken down charger repair men.

[@dennisengland9787]

@@sorinelpustiu5674 typical tesla elitist not knowing how math works. When the uptime of the chargers I work is over 90 percent, tesla supercharger stations can't be 4-5x better.

[@sorinelpustiu5674]

@dennisengland9787 yup,this video clearly shows 90% uptime 😂 How did you get 90% when in this video 40% of the chargers didnt work? Making up things dont make it real.​@@dennisengland9787

[@HanYou2]

me and most people don't want to buy a tesla, we want normal cars with indicators

[@theycallmeabe]

I moved from Seattle to Orlando in my Model Y, no problems whatsoever! Then I did it in my gas guzzler, definitely prefer Tesla!

[@muskrat3291]

I have traveled all around the Southwest in my Kona EV, mostly using Electrify America and encountered very few issues. It usual meant just moving over one stall to use a different connector, not a big deal. Only waited in one queue and that was for 7 minutes. I think the problem a lot of people encounter lies between the seat and the steering wheel.

[@tomz9692]

Correct as soon as everyone is on the NACS, the other charger networks will have to step up their product to compete with Tesla Super Charger Network.

[@BalintGulyas]

Thanks for your hard work mate! Education is the key and you are doing so well!! Good to see your videos!

[@mnhsty]

Not to mention prices are up 50-100% in the last four years.

[@alexmckenna1171]

Top Gear used to do the same thing..

[@ElMistroFeroz]

I've owned a Tesla for almsot a year and I have yet to figure out this obsession people have with overpaying for electricity.

[@xchopp]

We rented an MG4 EV for three weeks this past summer in the UK. Zero fast charging / CC contactless payment issues... except at a BP gas station, where neither of the two units worked for us (but at least one did... for the guy in the Ford Mach E). Otherwise, ZERO issues. Stop; plug into CCS port; present card; charging starts. Maybe there's a rule about DC charging accepting contactless payment? As an American, this made me feel like my country is falling behind: if the Brits can do it, what can't we?

[@xchopp]

Upshot: Pass a law that says that ALL charging stations *must* accept credit cards and/or contactless payment. No apps, RFID cards, or other paraphernalia needed. Sorted!

[@randomjasmicisrandom]

Thanks, I think! 😂😂😂 I was going to say the same thing, as a Brit I have had zero problems with my charging since I got my Skoda Enyaq in April. I’ve been to York, South Wales, South Coast and all around the midlands. Not a single failed charge session.

[@nettlesoup]

BP Pulse put out an X post a couple of days ago celebrating World EV Day... and then replied to their own post with another reminding everyone that it's not just about EVs: their forecourts deliver petrol and diesel to vehicles too. On World EV Day, ffs!! Tells you everything you need to know about their commitment to their EV charging infrastructure and the rapid transition to EVs in general.

[@GruffSillyGoat]

Small aside, *_"if the Brit's can do it, ..."_* well the Brit's (and Europe as a whole) has a history on it's side here, being an early adopter (sometime inventor) of financial technology systems.

[@GruffSillyGoat]

@@xchopp re contactless payments, regulations already exist in Europe (EU, EFTA and the UK) and other parts of the world.

[@sparklander]

I own a Nissan Ariya, and most of the charging stations are either broken or unavailable. I can charge at Tesla SuperChargers that have the Magic Dock connection. Gjeebs drove his Rivian from Arizona through New Mexico and further east, and his experience was abysmal. The story is not debunked. You are fine if you own a Tesla, but other automakers are not so fortunate. Tesla is not the only game in town. I agree with her.

[@steveschlackman4503]

When Hurricane Sandy, 2012, decided to sit over Far Rockaway NYC for a short time my old gas car got flooded above the motor. Geico, my car insurer, said a flooded motor is a write off. Whoopie. By the way my basement also had a wave of water go through it. Geico and other insurers towed flood gas cars out of Far Rockaway for two weeks. The answer is if you live by the water you are taking a risk.

[@robsengahay5614]

Teslas in Australia use CCS as they do in Europe yet the supercharger network is still almost flawless so the issue isn’t CCS. It must be product design.

[@wj9494]

US chargers come from Europe, I’ve no idea why they don’t work better

[@GruffSillyGoat]

CCS comes in two flavours - North America (and Japan) mainly uses CCS1 (SAE J1772) and the rest of the CCS world mainly uses CCS2 (IEC 62196T), both are available in AC only or Combo AC/DC socket types. The electrical characteristics differ, CCS1's AC charging supports single phase electricity whereas CCS2 supports both single and three-phase electric with a higher AC power ouput for more rapid AC charging. CCS2 has improved communications protocol that supports higher power charging and more advanced car/charger charging monitoring communications. Typically, CCS supporting countries that have a 110/120v electrical standard use CCS1 and those using 220/240v use CCS2. DC charging wise the two versions have little difference electrically. A lot of the difference is down to how reliable the local electricity supply is and the maintenance level of the chargers. Pay and Go at the charger, using debit/credit card, tends to work well in Europe and Europe mandates this being available, less hassle than having to use multiple apps or RFID cards. One key difference to the US is the use of contactless payment in Europe (and elsewhere) rather than physical swipe/pin car payment. The latter tends to breakdown more due to physical issues (contamination/physical damange to the card reader's chip/stripe reader). The US is moving over to Tesla's charger plug/socket format but with CCS signalling, that was made a new North American standard (NACS that Ben mentioned) a couple of years back; the American public prefer the smaller connector format (CCS1 plugs tend to be massive even compared to CC2). NACS is not backwardly compatible with older Tesla's and requires an adapter to charge. Other connector standards are available, of course, CHAdeMO in Japan and on certain Japanese cars and GB/T in China.

[@KaiPonte]

Good video. I own a '22 Ford Mach-e, currently with 35,000 trouble-free miles. Even though I only have L1 charging at home, I rarely use public charging. The issue with EA and EV Go is simply that they don't have a good business model. I regularly encountered issues with the EA chargers being out of service or unable to handshake. I do have plug and charge setup, but it wouldn't always work. Also, the CCS port is bulky and cumbersome. I've now charged a few times at Superchargers and it works wonderfully. I would drive a Tesla, but would miss out on Apple CarPlay.

[@Pegaroo_]

Ok yes the Tesla network works and works way better than the competition but arguing that this means charging is solved is arguing for a future monopoly

[@ewitte12]

I almost went with another EV and decided to keep my Tesla order open. This was one of my reasons. What I was looking at isn't rolled into the Tesla charging network yet I would rather not have to use an adapter either. When I change in 3 years I expect things to be drastically different.

[@smithy6611]

I just bought my first ev. An ev6. I got it in Seattle and did my first ev road trip back home to new Mexico and had zero problems. Took the long too. Down the PCH to San Fran then Barstow to Albuquerque

[@pi.actual]

I have watched a lot of youtube cross country EV road trip videos including the Cybertruck to Alaska one and it seems to me that they all consist of a series of white knuckled dashes from one charging station to another. No exploration, no turning off the track, just a calculated and compiled itinerary that frankly, don't look like much fun.

[@GeeDeeBird]

My guess is they used Plugshare to specifically locate and film at charger locations that were out of service. Of course, they could have just as easily located chargers that WERE in service. But what kind of news would that be? Boring! Also, I noticed that none of the chargers were run by Electrify America (97% uptime) or Chargepoint (98% uptime) which have the third largest and largest charger networks. (Tesla is number 2) The Wall Street Journal is a right wing news and opinion organization, so it's not really surprising that they would put out anti EV propaganda.

[@gunnarparment5050]

Thanks for putting some nuance on this story. In the opposite side of the world, all of this sounds ridiculous. Just the thing that you didn't standardize the charging plug until last year. 😂 The EU made your experience on charging cellphones better, but we couldn't help you with your cars.

[@johnd01]

I have 20,000 road-trip miles in 2024, visiting 30 states from Sacramento, California, USA. The Sunday after the 4th of July, my car informed me that there would be a > 20-minute wait to charge in Pocatello, Idaho. I slowed down a little to stretch my mileage to charge at Idaho Falls, about 60 miles farther, but still on my way. The only other charging problem I had was the Wells Nevada station went offline, so the car had me charge at West Wendover. I was the second car in line. West Wendover is an 8-stall Version 2 (150KW shared station.) West Wendover was taking some of the load from the more robust charger in Wells. I stopped at the Wells charger, and it looks like the service station is going out of business or being drastically remodeled. Other than that, I have not had any charging problems. Tesla Version 4 chargers will charge non-Tesla cars without an adaptor. I have seen non-Tesla cars charging at 2 different version 4 stations. In the past, we bought cell phones based on their network. We should still buy EVs based on where they can charge. Limited-range cars like the older BMW I3 should only charge at home. If you are careful, you can go farther, but what if the charger you are counting on is down?

[@solentbum]

A problem I often have (UK) is that the security feature in my contactless credit card will require a keypad entry (PIN) . Whilst the charger does not have a keypad. I carry two different cards. Nothing wrong with the charger, the car or even the overall charger experience, The problem is with card security. Yesterday I had the same problem with a Pay to Park machine. Currently one of the major charger providers is working on a vehicle ID system to mitigate the problem. Meanwhile I have been driving EV for over 10 years, 150k miles, with no major problems.

[@jacobheinz8236]

Thanks Ben for your efforts to challenge wild opinions with facts and real world data. With good data and facts comes knowledge and ultimately, wisdom. Far too many of us just wing it with noise and pay the price. Life is too fleeting and precious to be wasted on baseless opinions. We need facts and good quality researched data. Keep up the good fight!

[@513eis]

You are a hero of us EV owners.

[@DouginaBoxster]

Yes, with our Mach-E we have plug-n-charge with Electrify America and Tesla, and EVgo has "auto charge", which is essentially the same. With all we can just plug in and charge.

[@crwalter2003]

It's easy to duplicate her results... search for stations out of order, then navigate only to those sites. Now, you experience a high failure rate!

[@GruffSillyGoat]

And when at the site use the charger marked out of order, not the one next to it that's working.

[@michaelgoode9555]

Here in the UK CCS2 is and has been for some time the dominant charge port. As I understand it even new UK and European Teslas have CCS2 onboard and use the CCS2 plug. Teslas can use non-Tesla chargers and non-Teslas can increasingly use Tesla chargers. I have a VW ID3 which as a German built car comes as standard with CCS2. During our roadtrip this summer (only 1,300 miles so not in the grand scale of US roadtrips) we used both Tesla and non-Tesla chargers. The only fail was one in a very remote spot on the north east coast of Scotland where the unit was out of order because somebody had driven a vehicle into it and seriously damaged it. We were only going to plug in as we'd stopped for lunch and we had more than enough range to reach our destination without charging but the mentality of driving an EV is to plug in whilst the car is not in use if you can. Just makes sense. The real world range of 240 miles is way more than our own comfort break range which is around 2 to 3 hours. On Scottish roads and all UK rural roads in fact you would be really pushing it to do 50 miles an hour constantly so the range will never beat us and on a UK motorway the maximum speed is 70 mph so that comes in at 210 miles if you could maintain that speed for 3 hours uninterrupted. Anybody driving in the UK knows that this would be impossible. We have various rfid cards from manufacturers and energy suppliers which allow you to use many charger networks with just one card. Also, contactless payments are now a legal requirement for all chargers over 8kW.

[@mongo64071]

Registrations of non teslas last quarter in CA was higher than for teslas. People want other choices. Arguing that everyone should only buy one brand of car or charger doesn’t seem realistic or desirable. We don’t do that with gas stations. There should be charging standards for all chargers and cars. Maybe tie uptime to ability to qualify for public subsidies.

[@mr88cet]

12:04 - I think we need to come up with a “charging etiquette” convention along the lines of, “if your non-Tesla car’s charging port is on ‘the wrong side,’ please park on the far right side of the line of chargers, and if your port is on the ‘correct side,’ please park toward the left side of the line of chargers.” Point being that, if everybody adheres to such a consistent rule, conceptually, there could be no more than one unused charger because of this difference in EV design.

[@rtfark6414]

Thank you, again. The facts are so helpful. Please talk about the facts about Tesla used cars being rated so low on CR.

[@Smith_Tech_70]

Tesla handshake to a non-Tesla car, through CCS is seamless form what I've experienced.

[@WillOnParade]

I went to Pismo Beach from the Inland empire this weekend, in my Kona electric. It was a 3 and a half hour drive. Had to charge once to get there. Stopped at an EA station in Santa Barbara there was a line and one charger was down. Decided to leave and find one farther down the road. Did find one that was open eventually, but it was way off the freeway. Got to Pismo, needed to charge, went to an outlet mall, there were 4 EA chargers and like 12 Tesla Superchargers. I saw a bunch of Teslas come and go while I sat and waited for one to open. Moral of the story if you don't like to wait get a Tesla. Can't wait till my Kona can use the Supercharger network.

[@shaunpowelluk]

I'm not so sure about the NACS and CCS standards making a difference at point 5:35, as CCS is standard in Europe, even for Tesla, but the experience is the same. Tesla is the leader, and the others lagging somewhat. To add insult to injury, Tesla tends to be cheaper too, even for non-Tesla. Edit: Just realised the CCS standards are different between US and EU. We have type 2 CCS.

[@PJWey]

@@shaunpowelluk the situation here in the uk is not like this, personally this summer I did many longer trips in my MG4 using mostly Tesla Supercharger mainly due to being half the price and far more available. In one year of driving I have encountered only a few broken chargers, one of which was Tesla but it was no big issue at all. Chargers are everywhere and growing fast.

[@DyadintheForce]

These problems are kind of moot nowadays. I have a chevy bolt and i can access the aupercharger network. Im sure more car makers will join in and make it easier for everyone to charge

[@omgBenton]

I found myself shouting your same points at the WSJ video. While it's a fair representation of an extremely niche situation, most folks will view this as the persistent, everyday struggle of every EV owner.

[@conradfuller6697]

Thanks Ben, great logical and rational analysis!

[@xheksa]

I have KIA EV and living in Europe, not using Tesla Supercharger network. Only using 3rd party chargers here in EU. And everything is fine, everything is working. In 4 years i have and using EV everyday, i have issue with charger like 2 or 3 times.

[@ARepublicIfYouCanKeepIt]

The WSJ's reporting is way out of step with the consensus of myriad recent studies. These show an average reliability of approximately 75%. While that's admittedly horrible, the repeatedly cited 40% anecdotal experience is overstated by 60%. If one were off by more than half in any calculation, what would be the consequence? You'd fail the test, or worse!

[@gaydybwad1321]

WSJ journalism is unbalanced. Shame.

[@EuvCharging]

Keep doing this content, Ben. Very informative 😊

[@alasdairdougall7868]

On all the charger types I have used in Australia, all worked, bar the NRMA (NSW motor association) charger. We have CCS2 standard, and that, like the new NAC charger standard, reduce the differences between manufactures.

[@wydeedwardsjr1987]

Ben thank you for debunking this information. You are very correct about heading data versus an opinion. EVs are going to change the world for the better.

[@jimthain8777]

Strangely I never hear about this from channels in Europe, where CCS IS the standard. So I don't know what's going on here. I have heard of some problems with CCS here in Canada, but in the EV Facebook group I belong to these sorts of charging errors seem to be pretty rare. That "destination" as part of the charger is something that there needs to be more of. Being able to go somewhere dry, warm/cool, and get food or entertainment while you're charging out of town, is a great idea. It's also potentially more money for the charging companies. I just don't understand why we don't see much more of that.

[@aidanapword]

The chargers by other manuf have always more complex than Tesla because they have all this extra stuff on it. And also, the other manuf require 100% connection of everything (esp. WAN) before charge starts which just doesn't make sense.

[@arielspalter7425]

I usually enjoy watching your videos and agree with most points you make. Not this time… There are other brands of EV on the roads that need charging on the go, and Tesla’s charging network cannot accommodate the entire market needs (in some areas it cannot even reasonably keep up with the charging demand of just Tesla EVs itself so seeing a long line of Teslas waiting becomes more and more common). This is a serious concern and I think that downplaying the issue isn’t the right move.

[@Geckogold]

This is why Tesla opened up their Superchargers (well, most of it anyway, some won't work with non-Teslas such as the older V1/V2 that used a different communication protocol than the V3's which uses the same one as CCS1 does, and they may reserve some V3's exclusively for Teslas), as they foresaw that public charging was going to be a make or break moment for EV's in general. Sure, if you don't plan to drive long distances and can charge at home, an EV is great from just about any brand. But if you suddenly want to travel farther in one, most of the non-Tesla DC fast chargers aren't the best in terms of reliability, charging speed, number of stalls, or location. For instance, EVgo concentrates heavily in major cities, but doesn't have too many if any charging stations in say, the middle of the country. Even Electrify America doesn't have much presence in parts of the country, and there are many KZbin videos of EV road trips where EA chargers aren't working, or there's a lot of people who want to charge but only 2-3 working stalls out of 4. Tesla had amazing foresight on this, making sure there's often a decent number of stalls at almost every supercharger station, in addition to making sure they're up and running most of the time, with broken ones repaired within a few days, compared to weeks/months some other DC fast chargers have been broken for. Yes, we need significantly more public charging options available, and in more locations so that even someone who lives in an apartment could go to their local mall or grocery store and get a meaningful charge in the time it takes them to do their weekly shopping. Tesla also said they can't do it alone. They would need help from other companies to not just build EV's, but help with the charging infrastructure so that more people are willing to buy an EV as their next vehicle.

[@wrk8999]

Don't expect the WSJ to say anything positive about Tesla. Ever. They are much more interested in schilling for big oil.

[@segson4475]

You give clarity to the average person about EVs. Thank you for this. But please mention European standards in the future. In Europe, Tesla uses type 2 plugs which allows all makers to use their stations.

[@ReinholdDegenfellner]

I have a tesla too (in austria though), the reported issues are still a big issue. We don't want a tesla monopoly at the end. We have CCS over here it actually works fine for the most part, also on the teslas. I agree the SuC experience is far better than the others though, not so much because of charger uptime but because of comfort.

[@Geckogold]

I bought the CHAdeMO and CCS adapters (which weren't cheap either) for my Model Y, and for the most part it was kind of a waste of money. Aside from not having many places to charge, the few times I've used it, it mostly timed out, especially the CCS ones. I heard it has something to do with the communication connection being in a bad spot, where you have to almost lift the cord up a little to make the connection. They did work at times, but with so many more Superchargers built since I bought it back in 2020, there's hardly any reason to use CCS or CHAdeMO unless I'm going to a remote area where superchargers aren't available yet but they may have CCS/CHAdeMO. She's right though, in that they really need to build out more public charging, and more importantly, make sure they're reliable and up most of the time. That's why Superchargers are such a huge selling point for getting a Tesla over a non-Tesla EV, at least if you don't hate Elon Musk's guts.

[@Smith_Tech_70]

The open Tesla chargers in the UK support contactless payment (v4) and the Tesla app for any others. All work flawlessly. Tesla are starting to roll out their V4 chargers to other CPOs (charge point operators) too, so hopefully, the Tesla reliability will win through, and Tesla will run all EV charging, whether it be with a Tesla badge on the charger, or another CPO's badge. Win-win.

[@Aegisx5]

I've roadtripped literally thousands ans thousands of miles in a Rivian R1S. The Tesla network is the best, but Rivians out network is just as good where you can find it. I've had very few problems at EA stations either. EVGo sucks.

[@mckiwen]

European here, I own a Renault Megane E-TECH and around here it is mandatory that all new cars have CCS2 for DC and type 2 for AC. Even Tesla uses this standard (it's by law that all cars must use the same chargers, same goes for phones even Apple wanted to go its own way). Therefore, as a non-Tesla user, I do not have any of these issues as most networks work perfectly. Even more, I live in Spain, and around here the availability of chargers is not the best (we are way behing The Netherlands, France or Norway) and even under this case scenario it's pretty easy to charge any car. So at the end, USA, get a freaking standard to charge a car, you do not have this problem with petrol or diesel.

[@GruffSillyGoat]

They have a standard, the problem is it keeps changing.

[@dallasdrew2390]

I love your work Ben.

[@LCCB]

I appreciate them bringing attention to the "public" networks being terrible (they are), but she did need to counter that with "it can be done right, case in point, Tesla".

[@Enriquecido316]

My local Tesla Supercharger by the fox hills mall has stalls down all the time, for sure not 99% uptime lol. I did notice it get worse after the Supercharger layoffs. Definitely a regression

[@rugbygirlsdadg]

CCS in the UK and Europe is not an issue. Neither usually is contactless card payment which is mandatory for new chargers in the UK, including Tesla. Either a charger works or it doesn't. The chargers have contact telephone numbers to call for support. CCS is a standard, so there shouldn't be an integration issue. Plug and charge exists in the UK, but only one network that I'm aware of, supports it.

[@wj9494]

Supercharger sites are getting busier, the nearest one to me has a waiting line every weekend and it’s much worse on holiday weekends. Waiting to charge is frustrating.

[@raffiefoxmew3691]

Not an issue with CCS. That is the de-facto standard here in the UK and all Tesla charging stations use it. It is very reliable on Tesla's network. This is entirely down to poor software from badly designed charging dispensers.

[@LCCB]

Chat at 7:08 should combine all non-Teslas into a single line, as they ALL require the CCS network (until recently).

[@kjakobsen]

And in Europe, Tesla needs to adapt to the standard which is CCS.

[@robsquared2]

I think I'm with Alec from technology connections on this, payment should be as easy and complete as at a gas station, that means people who can accept money.

[@happygarage6310]

There should have been a standard from the beginning. There's still a lot of ground to cover, and a lot of education to be done.

[@mickrhodes4567]

Hi from the UK, this just sounds like the UK non Tesla network 2 or 3 years ago. It has massively improved here in the last couple of years, where most CCS chargers just work for most cars. I'm not saying there are never issues, but sounds like the charger manufacturers need to up their game in the US and do more car compatibility testing.

[@NoInfoFound]

These debunking videos are a really helpful thread for your channel.

[@clintwolf5737]

Good work Ben!

[@mr88cet]

5:08 - CCS is the ultimate in design by committee. A whole bunch of legacy automakers, power-systems experts, etc. all insisted that their particular favorite communication protocols be included in the CCS standard. The result is that there are often competing communication protocols for a single piece of the charge-session setup process. Therefore, all too often, the charger will not support a certain protocol alternative that the EV requests during the connection process (or the reverse). So they deadlock. NACS instead was created (essentially) by a single small team at Tesla, so there just aren’t nearly as many ways the handshake can “go off in the weeds,” so to speak.

[@GruffSillyGoat]

Oddly NACS standardised on using CCS signalling, as it was better. This means older Tesla cars cannot be charged using the new connector and need a protocol convering adapter to work.

[@SteveLomas-k6k]

A client of mine was late for a meeting because his Tesla didn't get the range it predicted, and he was stuck at a freezing charger for over an hour. Last time I want to the grocery another guy in his Tesla was still stuck in the baking heat 45 minutes later. I've no idea how common this is and I have no inclination to find out, I've never had these problems in a normal car. I think it's fair enough for the media to point out that this sort of thing happens- considering how gung ho they were on EVs for years- you can't complain that they have soured on them a little along with the public in general.

[@GeeDeeBird]

The non-Tesla charging companies have already announced they will be adding NACS cables to their existing stations - usually by replacing the ubiquitous, but obsolete (except for the Nissan Leaf. And who needs to fast charge those?) ChadMo ports with NACS. They are also working with Tesla and other auto makers to establish a universal standard for swipe and go charging. Tesla will not own the market any time soon.

[@unoriginalfly]

I get an email from Ford every month since they were announced, adapter shipping “soon”!!

[@ThisRandomUsername]

Currently it makes a lot of sense to run these charging stations. The markup is huge if you can get them reliable.

[@markwojtkowski1722]

Wait till it’s -20 degrees in Minnesota

[@3184Patrick]

i prefer credit card payment. otherwise you need like 5 different apps. although more and more Chargepoint locations are appearing and its the easiest.

[@loconius]

While my stomach majority, the fact that 580,000 drivers have to deal with this infrastructure problem because they’re not driving a Tesla is hard to swallow. Hopefully be adoption of NCS fixes this.

[@silveravnt]

Do most people not charge at home? I haven't used a public charger since the road trip to get my car home for the first time. People talk about how stopping to charge makes long trips take longer but I was just thinking yesterday about all the time I've saved by not having to stop at gas stations.

[@jeffmcentire3779]

Ben, These people!!!!! Yikes! I don't even own an EV yet and I know that these people who are "throwing shade" on EVs and EV charging are nuts. I personally have an EV GO account for my rental cars, I've had very few problems and very much enjoyed it. In a recent comment, I mention my business trip to Denver. My hotel had about 12 EV charge spots. So..... I never had to even go to a charger location. I just plugged in when I needed a charge and left between 5 and 7 am depending on the call time to be on site. So, Scottie and these other EV "poo poo-ers" can get with the program. EVs and EV charging network is getting better all of the time. 😊

[@AWildBard]

The lady may have been exaggerating. But definitely, the non-Tesla charging systems are not good. If you get a grade of 75%, that's rated poor. If you are on a road trip and you go to a charging station with two full and two non-working ports, it's really bad. From a pro-EV point of view, it does not help the cause of transitioning. Stations should be bigger, slow charging should be available to everyone who parks for a long time, and when you plug in, it should be easy to start charging. EV charging is improving, but it is not where it should be right now, and the systems have a long way to go.

[@ScrappyDoodad]

Also, the EV experience is less positive for the uninitiated, those who have not learned to navigate and operate the EV charging infrastructure Sometimes there is a trick to get the charge point to work

[@carrisr]

I also think she was "gaming" the system by using card swipe method rather than the chip reader or tap to pay that is clearly visible in the example she shows. Does anyone actually have a credit card that is swipe only at this point? Chip readers and tap to pay are FAR more reliable and safer than swipes. Card companies do not want people using swipe anymore. I recently went to a gas station that still only had swipe card readers and none of the cards I have worked on it. I had to go to another station.

[@91kitt]

Why is GM lagging in getting access to the supercharger network?

[@ARepublicIfYouCanKeepIt]

The number of EV charging locations and ports is steadily increasing. The reliability of these ports is increasing, as well. Three things that everyone must keep in mind about EV charging: 1. 80% of charging occurs at home and the majority of that happens during the overnight hours. The result? EV owners wake up to a fully charged battery each and every morning. When one purchases an EV, they also purchase the "filling station" as well. The same cannot be said about any ICEV. 2. The EV market is new and the public charging infrastructure is even newer. This is especially true for DC fast charging. The availability and reliability of our public fueling infrastructure has been developed over the past 100 years. Early motorized vehicle owners likewise had to deal with both scarcity and reliability in their day. 3. Under NEVI public EV chargers must meet or exceed 97% reliability. We're not there yet. But continual progress is being made. We will get there...sooner rather than later.

[@wj9494]

You mention installing more chargers, designed to make money, so they are nearly always in city centers, to maximize usage (eg: EVgo). That’s too slow IMHO, as there are around 2 million new EV’s a year, and I don’t think new chargers are keeping up, especially in rural areas. I also don’t think level 2 chargers are worth much except near homes.

[@BigCarKilla]

Check out when Australia’s @CarExpert when to the us to test a Rivian, and they had hell trying to charge their demo car.

[@aceroadholder2185]

Try the Ben Sullins drinking game. Every time Ben says 'Tesla" drink a shot of tequila.

[@rpsmith2990]

The last time I did that, there was a lot of explaining to do...