The CAV SPEAR TRAP! - Total War Tactics: Warhammer 3

Want to trap some cav and stab them with spears? This Total War Tactic will set you up a treat! Warhammer 3 strategy at its finest.
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[@_Meriwether]

This always works so well for Dwarfs, their spear and cavalry lineup is soooooo good

[@columbien10]

Especially their spear Hero "Morbius Grudbearer" who just morbs all enemy cavalerie away

[@faceoctopus4571]

Dwarfs do have slayers which are anti large and they are one of those units that don't pack tightly together, so if you are allowed to use units from another race (e.g. the allied thing in campaign) you can do this with slayers acting as the spears and the bait should have an easier time slipping through than most bait would have trying to get through a braced unit of spearmen.

[@grudgebearer1404]

Dwarfs have the "come into the range of our guns" trap that works very well against cavalry

[@_Meriwether]

@eqw alle That was the joke. They also don't have spears.

[@WarPigstheHun]

That's y u hire ogres! "Rampage dis whaay!!"

[@boricns]

I always thought riding through my own units was a “bad” tactic move

[@calebbarnhouse496]

It really should be, I think that cav running or monsters moving through infantry should be able to kill guys

[@BenGoblin]

@@calebbarnhouse496 they do if they're not your units (idk about Warhammer 3 but it does in other titles). Imagine how stupid it would be if your dumbass routing cavalry broke your flanks, or your dragon lands just a little too early and smashes up your front line?

[@calebbarnhouse496]

@@BenGoblin that sounds pretty reasoable to me, while the cav should not run into a block of infantry while routing, but yea a dragon coming down should be dangerous to both your men and there's, and it's not like there isn't counter play, just have the dragon come in from behind the unit, where they won't be landing atop soldiers, this would be a sizeable nerf to monsters, so they can be made better elsewhere, my preference is by giving them small arms fire resistance, which would just be non artillery shooting, but I can't look at cav running through a block of braced spears and not see an issue, just like it would be ridiculous to not have arrows deal damage to friendly soldiers

[@drgn2182]

@@BenGoblin dumbass routing cav disorganizing infantrylines and loosing a battle happened so often in history. I think it should be feature.

[@shadowblade5656]

@@drgn2182 What happened in history does not necessarily make for good gameplay. I feel like that's just gonna make people hate cavalry even more than they already do. Do you want a game with zero cav viability? Because that feels like how you make a game with zero cav viability.

[@filthyshoggoth]

"Little bit of damage" Not in the eyes of the one Cathayan cav that died instantly, it wasn't his day.

[@cataphracts123]

Another great way to use this tactic is to retreat the cavalry through the spears hidden by a forest. I was able to use this online once but with archers as bait.

[@WarPigstheHun]

I did that to some maul in Conquerer's blade hide my fortebrachio pokes in the forest. He couldn't see what killed him lol

[@WarPigstheHun]

@eqw alle thats how he beat Pompey's significantly larger, though less experienced, army.

[@shingshongshamalama]

Put an "open/close rank" function into the game and you've got a fantastic cavalry trap.

[@pianospeedrun]

You mean like they had in rome 15 years ago ?

[@GAMER123GAMING]

@@pianospeedrun aaaaaaaawkward

[@KeziaKez]

You can shift walk them into a loop and then hold it while hovering over the enemy to attack at the end of the pathing. This way you can in one click have them run through your troops loop round and into their backs without having to do anything

[@georgemorley1029]

Yeah and pin them in place

[@LunetoHa]

Beginners and experts all benefit from your videos! Excellent (especially these types, I love "gotcha" tactics)

[@thanoosudom6980]

I kinda wonder... Did you get this tactic from reading stuff like "Julius Caesar at the Battle of Pharsalus" and try implementing it in the game... Or It just comes up to you natually as a veteran player who tries to find the best way to utilize the units?

[@Raphley]

Why not both?

[@cseijifja]

Both , i saw a guy do this to me in attila tw , after i saw a video on pharsalus and it clicked .

[@simongloutnez589]

I mean zerk has being playing total war for so long, the old tw were actually explaining us to do this

[@iandestroyerofworlds576]

@@simongloutnez589 Yeah, older Total War games had better manuals / tutorials that taught us mixed unit tactics and what things actually did.

[@duckterdoland3881]

I don't Think ceasar told his men to ride through the lines of spears lel, further I think historically the spears were keept in the back of the roman army

[@GameTimeProductions]

With almost 4k hours in Total War games, I can say I've learned this to be a god tier tactic against AI

[@xutiantodd]

This is very stupid tactic only can rape AI

[@GameTimeProductions]

@@xutiantodd that’s why I stated “againstAI” if you can read English

[@jacksteel1539]

@@xutiantodd Unless a player doesn't look at their cav for 10 seconds that happens a lot

[@MathieuH96]

Always so good to watch these tips, keep it up you are insane !

[@ace7472]

I love using this tactic with the vampire counts because they struggle with enemy monsters and cav ( just overall large units). just an unit of spears and dire wolf and you are golden against a lot of enemy units. If the enemy is stronger use bloodknights instead of wolf or have them nearby for support.

[@alpacaofthemountain8760]

I always will love the matchup between large entities and anti-large infantry

[@PhilosophicallyAmerican]

Always fun to watch slayers chop though cavalry and monsters.

[@relaetsecyr]

A nice middle group for this tactic would be to have cav substantially slow down when moving through and removing the bracing of units it has to push through. You can catch cav from behind and it weakens infantry without destroying the viability of such a tactic. Honestly though, I think in the era of pike and shot having your own cav coming at you would be terrifying and would probably tank a units morale

[@Kesen2003]

Yes. Run through your own spear line while enemy cavalry is charging you down. Sounds effective.

[@scoutobrien3406]

I was looking your videos up because I just started playing Cathay and this was top suggestion after the roster. The ONLY battle I've played with them yet involving enemy cav I was looking at the awful Cathay Spearman speed vs the lightning peasant cav and decided to try anchoring the flank in the forest and drawing the enemy cav in with my single cav fleeing directly between the hidden spears. That was the first time I ever tried that tactic. 5 minutes later this video pops up. I guess what I'm saying is my KZbin is haunted

[@derekthehalfabee7942]

Wish this game had formations, would fit perfectly in this game. Being able to set a loose formation would be awesome.

[@KEKCMAH]

Zerkovich: uses tactics and tricks Waywatchers: enemy disintegrates

[@catdaddy1649]

I love this tactic with skaven. Use a lord as bait then pop a menance below followed by a warp bomb.

[@andrzejk1664]

I'm thinking, all of these maneuvers you present, rely on us having more units in a given area than the enemy. In the total war series, that's almost never the case (unless the oponent is running lots of artilery and we're not). I never seem to have enough of my guys, and when I try do any sort of layering I end up getting flanked. So some of my guys are getting the right match-ups, but at the cost of the army getting surrounded. Obviously, I'm missing something with this logic, can you tell me what's my mistake?

[@jacksteel1539]

This only relies on Enemy Cav to get a little greedy and have more units than them in a small area, they could even have 2-3 units of cav run after one of yours and pull them through the spears

[@andrzejk1664]

I get yoyr point, still with any sort of layering, I end up with a narrower formation than the oponent, so it's easier to flank me, right?

[@jacksteel1539]

@@andrzejk1664 It depends entirely on positioning, if you pull through your spears and he doesn't follow you're in a perfect position to protect your flank again with cav

[@andrzejk1664]

@@jacksteel1539 fair point! Thanks!!!

[@taserrr]

No that's always the case. You will never win 3/3 flanks, depending on your strategy generally speaking the goal is to win 2/3 flanks by outpushing 1 of the flanks that helps out the second one quickly enough to win that one too. And also multiplayer gold wise you can get spears and cheap cav/archers for the price of medium-good cav, so you wouldn't have less units this way.

[@Deltium5683]

good tip, thanks !

[@marcusc9931]

Now imagine being the guy whose job is to stop a charging juggernaut with a pointed stick.

[@davidjagt9627]

I do this all the time with LM in single player. I know Cold One Spear Riders aren't even close to good, but even with Skinks taking the charge, the Spear Riders do super well... As long as I don't get cornered

[@davidjagt9627]

It's good to see I'm doing something a little right!

[@handsomegod7912]

Nice tactic, thanks bro!!

[@Pickatimatrina]

I just love your guides ❤️

[@ronaldp7573]

Caesar wants his technique back.

[@canadianrocketman3475]

that was the greatest its a trap ive ever heard

[@sgg3586]

My favourite anti-cav technique is...many...many guns...all focus-firing on a single unit and watching as they dissolve.

[@PhilosophicallyAmerican]

I might need this. I downloaded an End Times mod and the Chaos Knights with Lances are killing my flanks.

[@charleslister8465]

Nice work

[@benb7883]

It’s funny that this is basically how Caesar beat Pompey at the Battle of Pharsalus

[@Britain1251]

This was so common in Shogun 2 multiplayer, you had to be really mindful of your cavalry.

[@ruuwb]

This tactic does seem to disrupt your spear formation quite a lot allowing the enemy cav to get through

[@jamoecw]

this works in Warhammer versions because unit formations are more of a buff and the units are rather porous. in earlier total war games you will need to 'shoot the gap' and slip between two spear units then have them close the gap right after. if it is Rome: Total War (not the games that start with Total War) then the formation is very important and charging them to close the gap will mean you don't get that buff. the reason you shoot the gap is that your own cav will 'break' the formation and they will not have any formation bonus, which means no reflecting charge and instead suffering the full charge value resulting in big losses to the spear unit until the charge buff wears off (only a couple of seconds, but that is pretty important as that means they will have to fight after suffering big losses and thus low morale). sometimes the AI won't fall for this and all the maneuvering will just tire out your units, though since the units are less porous you can use spears to block for archers and get the archers fairly close to the action safely.

[@blacklight4720]

Isn't that core battle mechanic for "Attilla"? Sending spears/infantry behind cavalry.

[@MysticalShadowDragon]

huh this could open up some hammer and anvil situations against enemy kav

[@0MVR_0]

The Swebian saddle-spear tactic possible to also charge cavalry with cavalry and a light spear reinforcement yet this is less impactful

[@AlanLamb11]

Is there a benefit from always going straight back with the retreating bait unit into your own infantry or does that only matter with charge reflection? I almost always automatically run off to the side and try to only clip the side of the enemy unit as that stops the charge and allows the bait unit to quickly turn and counter-charge. Getting the most models to touch for charge reflect would make sense but otherwise there is often extra 'hang' when trying to move a unit thru another unit which makes the timing extremely difficult to charge since enemy units all have different charges speeds so going off to the side to avoid the hand time is much safer.

[@jamesdurant8771]

This is similar to the tactics Rommel used against the British in the western desert during WW2. Just replace cavalry with tanks and spears with anti-tank guns

[@diomed4570]

How brace mechanic works with kislev units if they are firing? Will it work or they need to stop shoting to pull it off?

[@giuliozapelli6824]

I used to employ this tactic in rome total war!

[@StreitSandor]

Use a hero to bait in 2+ cav units, charge the hero into them just infront of your spear wall, enemy cav blobs up and stops, charge your spearmen into the blob. Easy win.

[@imanuelkanstler8269]

The Fun fact: Alexander The Great used pretty much the same tactics in Indian conquest he lured indian elephants on his light missle infantry creating the corridors of death without attacking them in melee, and Scipio Africanus used same thing in battle of zama in 202 BC against Hannibal.

[@BACKISBACK86]

Your camera working is so great....

[@AcertifiedBAMF]

I know lore wise disappearing bodies makes sense but honestly rather they stayed

[@JohannesLG12203]

It is a very clever tactic, but to me it feels like that cav should not be able to ride through allied spearmen without any damage. It feels wrong.

[@moosiemoose1337]

What feels most wrong is that your spearmen don't step out of the way and let the allied cav through

[@taylorpayne1993]

Amazing

[@tankjr84]

In the last clip, a couple enemy cav models get around the side and then come back to the engagement. When that happens, can individual models get a rear charge bonus or do they not since most of the unit is frontally engaged?

[@benton706]

They do, as per model engage in that combat. That's why the game is kinda broken at the moment, with cavs just throw models of infantry around, even when the infantry is braced and have charge deflect. It's not consistent in that either, as there are times when they just stop right at the frontline against non-deflect unit.

[@andrewseymore4506]

Sounds like Korg 😂

[@shanehahn7]

Good vid! Dang I really need blood dlc. I no more play wh3 without it :(

[@Azkaellon9001]

I didn't realise Korg had a youtube channel

[@truthhitshard]

so ther is no explizit formation for the spears where they stand and brace for impact right? i played a few hrs and i cant find any button for it and my spear guys god run over by cavalry. i thought the sense would be that they stick their spears out to counter the charge?

[@Crunkboy415]

It always works against Admiral Akbar!🤣

[@waleedkhalid7486]

Huh, I thought using your own units to go through another one of your own units removed the braced status and made it harder for them to defend against charges. I am learning that I have been giving the devs a bit too much credit and have been hamstringing myself tactically. Next I’m going to learn that my archers can’t friendly fire into my infantry.

[@raindrain1]

Yeah, I mean visually you can see your infantry aren't bracing anymore when your cav goes through them. They SHOULDN'T be getting that bonus.

[@volvodoto4053]

@Zerkovich how do you manage tactics with 40v40 matchups. So much mirco is overwhelming for me.

[@markuskekero8363]

Battle of Pharsalus

[@jackjacksonson2559]

thank you god sir

[@stevenlandbo6039]

The Greeks did this to the Persian but with light and heavy infantry

[@Neknesch]

Wait, so you don't have to change weapons on your for example ice guard if they get charged ?? I always try to change their weapons in the last second so they are "ready" for the incomming rush, is that a mistake ?

[@ferraniglesias7269]

Nice!!

[@nnaauujjddaa]

I thought this was bad because moving your cav through units damage the formation so they are not braced for the charge which means they eat the entire charge damage.

[@ErikLiberty]

Someone commented here that they eat none of the damage because the damage is only calculated against whoever the AI charged at, not the incidental contact that happens with anyone else. I haven't confirmed that.

[@petrovepryk3786]

I wonder, how it will work in the Mediaval II.

[@Dusty7460]

Can you please present those tactics on another total war title such as Attila ,Rome 2, so on. Thank you.

[@lief3414]

I haven't played tw:wh2 for a while but won't the ai usually charge the spears even without any manipulation? They are really aggresive with their cav.

[@jdmatics]

Imagine if it worked like in Med2

[@madzaisa]

The issue is that according to stuff i saw ead around and my own observation AI seems to get speed bonuses randomly. So he slowest Cav is somehow able catch your light one.

[@WarPigstheHun]

What if I counter charge with my spears

[@alexc6324]

i think anyone can win a battle with 5 units for you and 3 for the A.I But the problem is when the A.I has two fully stacked armies and you have one and the game puts you on the reverse of a steep hill with trees or rocks in awkward positions. this is my pain.

[@nicbahtin4774]

so just like Caesar at Pharsalus ?

[@thescppro9000]

Does it work in Shogun 2 😅

[@eaglesclaws8]

Galgimeah? Alexander vs Darius?

[@richbattaglia5350]

I hate traps because of their dishonor and insincerity. I do however dig a good defense.

[@Glitch_Online]

now i wanna see a trap.. for the trap!

[@andidollinger7062]

drop a bombardment spell well timed on the trap

[@justsomeguythatwantstocry4243]

I'm confused. why would their cavalry target yours in the first place? Wouldn't it be better to say: gunsmen empty their volley, then retreat behind spearmen while cavalry kind of do their thing?

[@modulusorbis5323]

omfg the spear-mans still dosent defend his position against cav???

[@hisokamorow6709]

This is a low impact high macro intensive move. Not bad, but if u have enough time to micro this much, then u may be fucking up somewhere in your macro.

[@sirwitold3538]

How he is able to draw? this is custom battle or mod ?

[@cyberdwarf-ng1gf]

there is this little paintbrush symbol on the top left. it is always there on the same spot, in battles and on the campaign map. the green line is meant for "defenses", der red one is an arrow to "attack" and the blue one i forgot. it is most useful using in multiplayer battles when you have a friend. but i guess there is always the option to draw dicks while you wait for the battle to finish :P

[@Invincible0203]

It's a replay, you can draw in the replay of battles which you saved replays for

[@smkie-hf9pz]

This is actually even more effective than it seems because the charge is focused on your bait unit. When the enemy touches your spear unit it shouldn't do any damage since its incidental contact, not the charge target.

[@barnacsikos7343]

With proper unit collision, this would never work

[@FDM55]

👍💪🔥

[@MrFatbard]

you know what i think total war needs to do? watch a western movie, cuz in those movies horses can change direction and take off really really fast

[@mathiashansen9108]

I don't like how the AI always pulls through units. Why couldn't they just have made it the same way as in warhammer 2...

[@vadandrumist1670]

So if I were them I suppose I would program the AI to disengage when the target cavalry makes contact with the enemy spearmen or what-have-you. Just another of the countless improvements the AI desperately needs.

[@TumpsBudGuy]

Now after you do this take the cav back around your infantry line for big flank bonus and no escape

[@brazilfootball]

Works better with phalanx units in loose formation, then tighten the ranks as the enemy closes in. If the enemy doesn’t fall for it and pulls back, hit them with arrows or slingers at close range. EZ PZ 👍

[@moritzwysotzki5401]

TW: WH3 is really awesome but it really pissed me off that you have sooooo less strategicall options for all the units themself. Like just look a Total War Three Kingdoms. Most units have three different formations. WH3 just got... one or am I wrong?

[@shadow_king12344]

There are options for some units like chosen

[@UCeagle79]

This doesn't work as well in Warhammer 3 with the unit move delay. And only works with units that move well through each other. I and if you ever try this vs a human they will just drop magic on you

[@partydean17]

This is in no way cheesy lol I think this is just proper to playing the game lol. Like you said you can try this on a player too

[@AU-cu4yf]

This is not a new tactic at all. Pretty sure I've seen competing channels with this idea over a year ago.

[@Zerkovich]

I mean I basically made this video about 6 years ago. This is just a refreshed version.

[@ammarhaziq919]

This tactic is used in real life battle, in battle of pharsalus, used by Caesar against Pompey, Caesar bait pompey cavalry with his outnumbered cavalry and then feign retreat to where his hidden 4th line infantry equipped with only pilla (roman javelin/spear), his spearmen completely routed Pompey's cavalry and Pompey lose that decesive battle because of that.

[@glens18account]

ai just charges cav into spears anyway so its NP, you can delete the video.

[@tomatoesofdoom]

the single player for these games is so crap. "here's a battle tactic you can use against the a.i because the a.i doesn't really think and just barrels forward every single time"

[@Tyber-]

regardless how good an A.I. is, it is an intrinsic development to counter/outplay certain aspects of it. In a finite-information strategy game this is even more applicable. And obviously this strat works for multiplayer as well since it creates the need to micromanage for your enemy which is less time your enemy can focus on other things. If both players have an equally good understanding of the games mechanis, units and principles this tactic will give you an edge if used efficiently.

[@Jixxor]

Yes, and that's also why, in my opinion, playing on harder difficulties is just a lame experience. The AI does not get better. The AI simply gets cheats. When I compare that to Age of Empires 2 DE, where the AI literally just plays better and starts executing actual meta strategies with higher difficulty, I can only shake my head that over 20 years into this franchise the best CA can come up with is giving higher difficulty AIs more cheats.

[@BenGoblin]

@@Jixxor Sir you are sadly mistaken if you think the AoE AI didn't cheat before DE which still took 20 years to come out, so it's no better than CA and Total War lol

[@Jixxor]

@@BenGoblin I didn't talk about AOE2 before DE. Also Age of Empires franchise doesn't get 10 new games every decade. And even in the old Age2, the AI also executed their strategies better with rising difficulty on top of the cheats back then.

[@PoorManatee6197]

Abusing the AI is a thing in every game ever except chess.

[@AlexTSilver]

If you are just going to cheese the AI you might as well corner camp in every battle. This is embarrassing tbh

[@Krispen_Wah]

Still shilling this scam lol

[@addie-yx2xv]

the ai in tw games is so pathetic. things have gone downhill since shogun 2

[@shadow_king12344]

The ai needs to manage more troop variation,spells ,lords, flying units, and many more so it can’t be as good as in previous titles

[@xutiantodd]

this is nothing smart at all actually pretty stupid it only works against the stupid AI

[@_greenrunner_]

it worked in real life on many occasions so it’s not THAT stupid

[@dyfrigshandy]

I hate this, it breaks the infantry formation, unwise