The Cult Next Door (Official Short Film)

Source: vimeo.com/205976732
Copyright 2017 Youngman Films
vimeo.com/youngmanfilms
The Cult Next Door is a short documentary film about Bill Gothard's Institute of Basic Life Principles. Gothard, who shunned things like rock music and short skirts, is now facing charges of sexual harassment and assault. Many individuals see the group as cult-like and also very damaging to the ones involved in it: this is their story.
Produced by-Jake Youngman, Dane Walker, Ana Theriault, Laura BultDirected by-Jake Youngman
Edited by-Jake Youngman
Music by-Dane Walker

[@blugreen123]

I never understood why people took childrearing and marriage advice from this man, who never married or had a family of his own.

[@lillylazer429]

Exactly. How would he know anything about marriage when he was never married. He is a huge creep. I read his IBLP. Everything is women blaming and shaming. Sex abuse runs rampant in this sect..

[@chrisrussell5690]

Catholics do this with Priests all the time.

[@suzannereilman4516]

...reminiscent of people listening to Catholic priests for the same sort of 'advice'...:)!

[@tabo5547]

Although the Catholic cult is established and huge so they are worlwide accepted. All religions are cult. Religions are our forefathers way of controlling us. I'm disgusted with the sexual abuse of children. My question is why some cults can just get shamed for it and the other get persecuted? Hmmmm it's people from the larger cults pointing the finger.

[@suzanneracine689]

Those are the ones who are gay and hate women

[@KB-tg7pf]

I was raised in this cult. I cried watching this. Finally someone put together something I can show people when they tell me ATI wasn't that bad.

[@sergeygreyse4171]

Kaytie Buckhalt, I live in central Europe and I heard seminars in russian. And I'm dreaming to be an a student in hothard's iblp or ati.

[@Ethericrose]

My healing love to you Kaytie. You are so strong to come here and watch this after living through it. You are an inspiration.

[@bunniewilder2515]

Kaytie Buckhalt I am glad you found your freedom. My heart goes out to you and your loved ones.

[@tansywoods8947]

Kaytie Buckhalt I grew up in a church, very similar to this.. I am free now but still have flashbacks.

[@eunhinged4764]

The World is beautifuly, amazingly, and epically awesome! Not to be afraid of, scorned or ran away from but embraced. My hope is for anyone stuck in a cult, oppressed or forced into isolation (for whatever reasons), can watch this documentary, and come join us. I promise you the only scary thing about the World is all the wonderful things it has to offer you......Good luck to you all : )

[@vertiian]

"I had friends who were still stuck in their homes in their late 20s." I thought of Jana Duggar

[@debbiebrown4420]

I've read that among those legalistic families there were single women in their 30s still totally dependent on their fathers and that some of them hadn't even been taught to drive, and of course, at that late age they still had no work experience at all. Those women had no more say-so over anything at all I don't guess than they had when they were 3 years old.

[@zachcochran343]

3 cults I’d love to see brought down: Scientology, jehovas witness, and Mormonism

[@dissonantpulse]

And Adventists...

[@amberfebruary]

All of the cults!

[@ThatsSoGayLIVEGayTV]

*All religions. All religions/deities are fake/cults/brainwashing entities. Here's how we know: *IF* any religion/God/ was true/real, then churches would have been the FIRST & ONLY establishments open during the covid virus, yet, were not; liquor stores were deemed more essential over any church. #TuneIn #HigherEducation

[@zachcochran343]

Sally Hall that has got to be the strangest thing I’ve seen on KZbin said in a long time 🤣

[@zachcochran343]

Sally Hall you realize people congregate in churches for an hour or two at a time rather close to one another and liquor stores are a place you go in buy something and leave lol

[@artdanks]

I sadly raised my kids on this guy's teachings! Really messed up our family, my kids and my wife! I meant well, but what harm it caused, for which I will always regret my whole life. I'm so grateful that they are all so very loving and forgiving!

[@natalieamberger2432]

How did you mess your family up?

[@jaclo3112]

@@natalieamberger2432 ATI demands patriarchal, male headship with zero qualifications which is designed to mess up families and harm children for the sole purpose of pandering to the male ego and fickle whims and emotions. You will not find a single culture or community that practises patriarchal male headship in the home and community that isn't riddled with messed up families. The one I grew up in was riddled with domestic violence, child abuse esp child SA and poverty along with severely damaged mental health of especially the women and children. It took over a decade of therapy from a trained psychiatrist who specialised in deprogramming for myself and my siblings, especially the girls, to just learn to interact in the real world. I'm not saying that was Art's experience, but it is the most common experience in these male headship cults regardless of the religion or country.

[@natalieamberger2432]

@@jaclo3112 i am so sorry to hear this, naturally I am speaking of true believers who are living the word and in this day and age that wld be very few indeed...Jesus is our example for sure above all else....we should never go against his commands regardless what parents or anyone tells us.

[@Mothafuckenzay]

Always question an search for your answers

[@jaclo3112]

@@natalieamberger2432 these people are true believers. which is why they follow the biblical command of patriarchal male headship. Jesus is most definitely their example which is why they use manipulation, threats and abuse to command conformity and obedience to the whims of the male head of the family. You do realise Jesus was pure evil.

[@kimmypayne2559]

I have tried to watch 19 kids and counting but can't get past the fake sincerity that mama duggar tries to politely whisper

[@hollyvanvleck3988]

i often woner if she is yelling at her kids when the cameras are off lol.

[@tired_buthappy]

Pretty sure her whispering is scarier than most moms’ yelling.

[@melissamorton1282]

Those kids are so screwed. They haven't been taught anything factual

[@SolaGratia.]

They called us "the Gothard Girls". We were teenagers, many of us from unhappy homes, and he painstakingly groomed us to accept his special attention as being something other than lecherous. I was 16 when it began and before long, I knew I was not the only one. But it was something we couldn't speak of.. Because no one would listen or believe us. I'm so proud of the women who finally stood up to him and participated in the lawsuit to expose him.

[@LaraCroftEyes1]

Sorry, what you had to go through no girl should have to be groomed for a sick ass pervert.

[@lillylazer429]

So sorry you had to deal with this creep. IBLP is a horrible thing

[@KiddyJones1218]

🖤

[@sdickerson1918]

I'm glad you all are free as well. This is sad😢

[@tayllor2900]

@Kevin McDonald Most cults would have called you demon possessed for having autism. Believe me, I know. Because I have epilepsy. People with epilepsy and autism are often told they are demon possessed by cults.

[@kittycoon9143]

I just stumbled upon this documentary and I’m so glad someone made this! I was raised in iblp and ATI. My family was in it for about 15 years probably, from the time I was probably a toddler until I was about 17 when we finally got out of it completely. We weren’t in too deep thank goodness, but my siblings and I went to several of his programs and our family attended a few of the conferences. I knew it was weird and I questioned things a lot so bill gothard told my parents I was “rebellious” and needed more guidance, so he invited me to live and work at the hq in Illinois. I lived there for a summer and I remember how creepy he was and how he treated us girls. He hugged us all the time and had one on one counseling and played footsie with us under the table at meals. I was pretty sheltered, so I didn’t know that much about sexual deviance or predators etc. I just thought it was weird. I thank the Lord that I had my own throughs and opinions, I did not allow him to bully me or take advantage of me. He knew I was too strong willed to be one of his favorite little play things. But I know some girls who were not so lucky😰 he liked the shy, sweet girls who were pure and chaste. All of this to say, what this man taught was not what God intended. He used the Bible to control and oppress people but this is not God’s heart. This is not Christianity, it was a perverse form of Christianity, but please do not put this on Christians as a whole. I believe the Bible and the God of the Bible, and I’m glad that I knew enough about the Bible to know that something was off. I’m glad I narrowly escaped this pervert. I hope he gets what he deserves for all the evil he’s done. I know he will answer to God for it one day, if not here on earth.

[@nottthereyet4872]

My own neice was at HQ for years. Even today as an adult, she is programmed to "follow the leader" without much thought of her own. She seems to hold no independent thought. So very happy for you! No one should ever follow man. Only God. Footsie really?? Ugh

[@southbug27]

So glad you didn't let him take God away from you. When people are abused religiously, then often turn completely from God & become bitter, hate-filled atheists. Although I wasn't in a cult, I was religiously abused & I wasted years running from God & being angry. I regret that I let their actions lead me to choose to walk away from God, the church, & living a Christian life for so many years.

[@jana731]

I'm glad that went out for you so well. You seemed to have learned from that, I hope the others will find some way to get out. But yeah sexual education is important I guess to look through such situations that even if one isn't as ownminded as you are one can still get out of such situations. Thats really dangerous

[@noname-by3qz]

I can't possibly excuse the Bible. It's got soo many contradictory directives it never ends. Jesus never said there would be a book, put together by worldly men of power, 3-400 years after him and everyone should worship it. That idea has ruined so many lives!!

[@juliecreaser878]

@@noname-by3qz interesting concept

[@victoriawelch1112]

It's easier to fool pple than convince them that they've been fooled.

[@contentangel2131]

you should run for president

[@mfrompa9641]

🙏 amen!!! Nobody wants to admit they are in a bad situation especially because they got into it with the best of intentions

[@miriameclipse7953]

Wow

[@laurap6534]

@kimberly montalvo including trump

[@knaptmenneskelig2611]

kimberly montalvo ...... WTF !!!!!...... A bit off the topic aren't you !!!!! I can tell you have an agenda and whether the topic has anything to do with it or not you will throw out your diatribe given any chance..... Quit spreading your hate around..... You are coming off as someone with a unstable personalities so maybe you should make an appointment and see about having your medication dosages adjusted, maybe it will help you with your fixation problem.....

[@Tina06019]

“If you rebel, God will make your car break down.....”. Hahahaha! I just cannot imagine that the Creator of the universe would choose to operate on such a micro-level.

[@TheNeeyang]

Tina lmaooo

[@SouthernBell86]

Tina Growing up in ATI I interpreted much smaller things than this as punishments for displeasing God. Can't find my keys? DVD player not working? Hitting all red lights? Better start thinking of what sins you can confess to make it stop so it doesn't escalate. Big things like a car breaking down usually lead to panic attacks because then God must be really angry.

[@saranatali4112]

SouthernBell86 I can 100% relate to this. I can’t finish watching this video. It triggers so many memories.

[@angeliquaserenity5009]

That was pretty much what Job's 'comforters' argued. Preachers like Bill Gothard don't read Job.

[@gillmacgillechiaran5651]

Tina - That supposed Creator is, it seems, capable of the most sordid evils and perversions.

[@sjow3952]

My question is how he was considered such an "expert" when he himself has never been married or had a family of his own. That in itself would have discredited his "system" in my eyes. What a creep.

[@gregcampbell4577]

That is a Very Good Point,' Definitely something Wrong with that Picture !

[@ArtCurator2020]

Dear Schlo: Gothard is definitely crazy, but I don't think that you need to be personally involved with something to be an "expert" about it. Male obstetricians never had a baby themselves yet they are indeed "experts" on the subject.

[@lillylazer429]

Exactly. Taking advice from this quack

[@OneWingedHoneybee]

@@sbeasley7585 Throw the whole bible away

[@knaptmenneskelig2611]

SBeasley ...... Just throw out the entire ridiculous book !!!!! That book ( what I call the sheep headers guide to the universe.... You call it the bible) has caused more pain and grief on this world then can be accounted for, given that, wouldn't that make your so called God a maniacal and aberrant tyrant..... OF COURSE IT WOULD.....

[@rhondagregory5253]

I had an experience in CA at a church I was introduced to. I went with a single girlfriend and I was married. They quickly whisked me off to be with the married people. My husband and I went back together. They assigned a couple to start hanging out with us and do bible study with us. The pastors wife met with me and my new "mentor" at her house. She took a look at my engagement ring and mentioned how she sold her engagement ring and gave it to the church. I ignored her. We went to one of their big services in downtown LA. When we took our daughter to their childcare we did not feel good about leaving our daughter. She was crying for us and the lady was very physical with her. We took our daughter to sit with us which was frowned upon. THe message was nothing more than giving to the church. They were telling women to give their diamonds, furs, anything they valued. They sent the offering buckets around for the 2nd time and at that time we left. I was later told that the single friend who introduced me to the church, that she and her boyfriend left the church because they were so controlling. No doubt in my mind they were a cult.

[@teamcougars]

So when the Duggar girls were asleep in their beds with blankets and jammies they tempted Josh by Gothards beliefs? Man alive did Jimmy Boob fail his daughters by not teaching Josh healthy boundaries 🤬

[@melissamorton1282]

Yes it's so sad, they were taught that if a male gets aroused it's always the female's fault 😢

[@juliemagouirk7687]

I was in this Cult, by my parents decision. I was around second or third grade when we entered this ATI/IBLP Cult. I didn't realize it was a Cult until...probably my mid teens. Which I believe was due to being extremely isolated from the real world due to my parents decision to home-school, being part of ATI/IBLP, churches that were led by the Cult Leaders persay, which REALLY isolated us. The Legalism that came from this Cult was overwhelming. It was used to control the wives/women, girls, and even the boys somewhat. The men were the hierarchy in the Cult. All the parents believed that they were keeping their kids safe from the world, when in reality it all did more damage then good. The ATI program used fear based religion to control everyone. I've had to go to Therapists over the years to help in my healing from it all. I found the courage to leave this Cult in my early twenties. I"m glad someone found the courage to finally make a small documentary of it. Kudos.

[@TheJayLordx]

Can I ask how you managed to escape this cult? Are your parents still in it or did they leave at the same time as you? Really glad you managed to see through this vile man and break the hold he had on you; to be human is to be free. Best wishes to you.

[@cerriberry6835]

Well done Julie ...all my love and best wishes to you. God certainly give us mountains to climb dosent he 🇬🇧🙏🏼✌🏻️

[@robertapascal6962]

The woman speaking at 22 minutes is speaking my truth. I was not raised in this, but my dad was a pastor and angry. His mom was mean to him. He in-turn raised us the same way. All the while preaching god’s love. It has taken me a long time to understand I have value. I wish I could befriend some of these people. At least they would understand my lack of social skills.

[@BhappyD]

There are many different support groups online for what you have experienced, even if you don't share the exact same religion/cult. Anyone growing up in an environment like that, regardless of its given title, will share the same or similar scars and trauma as the result of such an upbringing. It may be worth it to check some of those support groups out, as it is always nice to connect with others who know exactly what you're going through and make you realize that you aren't alone. I have not survived religious abuse, but I do know what it is like to have an abusive father. My "father" was/is a narcissist who was abusive, an alcoholic, controlling, and extremely manipulative. My mother and I were both his constant daily victims, and together we both faced his abuse and rages. It was not easy growing up in the environment he created, but I thank God for my amazing and beautiful mother, who did everything in her power to give me the best life possible despite our circumstances. My father always read the bible before he went to bed each night (always kept his bible under the bed on his side), and would project about God and His teachings etc. but he was always a walking contradiction, which was confusing as a child. I always had a genuine love for the Lord, but my faith was very distorted and limited due to the constant hypocritical ways of my father. I had a very warped view of the bible, and until my later teen/young adult years I was even a bit afraid to even read it, as I always associated the bible to my father and him reading his every night. I am thankful for God's patience though, as with time He has helped me overcome so much of the damage that my father caused, and I no longer look at the bible with resentment, but instead find it as a refuge and source of peace. It is so hard growing up with an abusive father, and people don't realize just how deeply it can affect all aspects of your life and your view of yourself and the world. I am so sorry that you know that same pain. I hope and pray that with time you will begin to find peace after what you have endured! Definitely consider seeking out some form of an online support group, whether it be for religious based abuse, or just for parental abuse in general, as it can be so healing to talk with others who truly understand. I also suggest that you seek professional help from a therapist, if you haven't already, as that is something that has helped me greatly as well. May God bless you! 💗🙏

[@dramatriangle]

I'm trying so hard not to pass these scars onto my kids.

[@dramatriangle]

famous brillance thanks for sharing that.

[@joandenisewannercrowley216]

How sad. Jesus's message is so simple. Your sins are forgiven. Stop focusing on you and start to do unto others as you would have others do unto you. Period.

[@Smooshes786]

@Roguish Miggz he abused her. She is responsible for her goodness and humor. Nobody else.

[@rhondac4459]

I came out of a church like that. You are terrified to leave because if you did you were out from the covering of God and a lighting rod for satans attacks. When I finely had to courage to leave I was so surprised to find God is so must kinder than I was taught. Grace and Mercy is an amazing thing.

[@suzanneracine689]

AMEN

[@knaptmenneskelig2611]

FredMonster ...... All Christian religions are based on fear ..... Your getting closer, but your still not there .....

[@forestdweller5581]

Until you can recognize all religions or Gods are merely fictitious you have a long way to go.

[@kimberlyhovis5864]

Amen

[@monetenglish68]

I left a Cogic church and was told satan would get a hold on me. Religious groups are not ok nor are they of God. Seek the lord not the church or religion. 🤗

[@harlotteoscara686]

If someone, anyone, tells you that they have “The Answer”, that the end of the world is right around the corner, that he or she speaks for God, and/or God wants you to allow bodily violation, RUN LIKE HELL. RUN. RUN. 🏃‍♀️ 🏃

[@BeautifulRealist]

Never stop questioning

[@debofranco2441]

Danielle M Yes! Test the spirits! No excuse if you k ow the Word Hosea 4:6 Proverbs 10:21

[@robertbishop5357]

@@debofranco2441 that's also in the New Testament. I think it's in 1 Peter.

[@KyokoEnoshima]

I find it funny there's religious responses to this

[@adamwoodie4029]

Yes! Even question whether or not you should never stop questioning!... Wait.. no don't question that. Crap, now I'm confused.. does that mean I just stopped questioning?? No it can't because I just asked another question! Sshhwoo that was close.... or was it???

[@knaptmenneskelig2611]

Debo Franco ..... Blah blah blah..... You are just another brain washed automaton spewing out the same old monotonous, mundane poppycock, you and your kind use sophism in your diatribes in an attempt to win over and control the vulnerable, ignorant and indigent...... Don't try to fool us, and don't fool yourself, you are no better then he is.......

[@mombythec]

I attended an Assemblies of God church school and the part about feeling like you’re years behind and not equal to peers HIT SO HARD. I even feel like younger people are socially and mentally above me all the time. I’m a lot better now than I was thankfully.

[@KB-tg7pf]

Something they left out was the teaching that since we all deserve hell, anything better than hell was a blessing. Another teaching that coincided with that was that we should surrender all our rights to God, and any feeling of unhappiness was a red flag that we still had some rights we hadn't surrendered yet. Now couple those two core beliefs with the authority structure set up, and you have the perfect scene for abuse. No matter what happened, we thought "if this makes me upset, I need to surrender my right to be happy. Thank you, God for this situation since it's so much better than hell. Please help me to surrender to your will even when it doesn't make sense to me." I consider myself very fortunate that my father genuinely loved me and was only in ATI because he was deceived and trying to do the best he could. So many of my friends weren't so lucky.

[@NeonBloodyMary94]

I know this feeling, it was a very scary experience. I remember I wasn't allowed to be upset. I had to give my right to be angry, no matter how justified to God.

[@JeremyFtw4]

Kaytie Buckhalt Ati does not teach abuse I personally disagree with several things Bill Gothars teaches, and I think if you asked Bill Gothard himself he would say its okay to disagree with him, if your family got legalstic with it and were abusing you then that is on that, maybe its for that very reason that God took Bill Gothard out of his position, people where treating his teachings too sacredly, but he never taught to do that....

[@bunniewilder2515]

Kaytie Buckhalt I...am at a loss for words. My father's side of the family are all prechers. Even my father has preached. My great grandma was my Sunday school teacher. She was a sunday school teacher for over 50 years. My mother when she first met my father had unknowingly wondered in to a "church" that was a cult. Jim Jones style. She kicked up as fuss in the "church" screaming, yelling, throwing things, calling the "church" out on their BS, and flat out called them a cult...she was kicked out. I think my mom's lack of ability to go along with what she was being told and voice that what they were doing was wrong not just from a Christain stand point but from a moral stand point. I think that saved her from a lot of danger. I am very sorry that you had to live though this. I am sorry that your friends had to suffer this. My heart goes out to you and your loved ones. My mom has a saying "cults are like an abusive relationship. You don't know you are in one until it's to late." I am glad you broke free.

[@stacynonyabizz4241]

Jeremy Ftw he was removed from the position because he is a sexual predator and keeping him in charge once that became public knowledge damaged the ability of the ati to make money from people the whole concept of the ati is abusive to anyone who is not the " authority". As a male you would be part of that privileged class. of course people will suport and d3fend a system that they benefit from. gothard teaches hitting infants, gothard teaches mindless obedience. gothard teaches helplessness. gothard teaches distrust of uoirand.own feelings. gothard teaches that men are helpless in the face of lust. gothard teaches victim blaming. gothard and the ati are the tools of satan sent to destroy men by allowing them an excuse to be weak and to destroy women by taking there independence away and to destroy children by keeping them from becoming adults in mind and spirit. gothard is evil

[@lv7118]

Kaytie Buckhalt ..hope you're happy now...for real.

[@naomihukes8283]

Child abusers don't just stop when there a teen, it continues into adult hood.

[@AttackHak]

Yep... and it is passed to the children

[@hollyro4665]

I mean it kind of depends. Pedophiles will lose interest in people as they turn to teens or adults cause it’s the kids they’re attracted to.

[@iliketowatch.]

I think the origin of Bill Gothard's need to control women comes from his insecurity regarding his small stature and high, woman-like voice.

[@jannadepue6037]

I grew up in this cult from birth. I worked for Bill and was in Oak Brook from the 80’s to 1994. Watching this made me cry 😢. I still have family following his most recent publications and this whole thing sickens me. I had to go through years of therapy to sift through all my life - it’s so confusing 😢

[@natalieamberger2432]

What do you mean what did he do to you?

[@bonniemoerdyk9809]

@@natalieamberger2432 ... you can Google his name and find out a lot.

[@jenniferhoffman2715]

​@@natalieamberger2432the iblp is based on fear Superstition manipulation and control

[@floridaprisonconsulting8791]

I was working at headquarters too

[@mariekatherine5238]

Ladies, if a strange man asks you if you’re a virgin, RUN!

[@mariekatherine5238]

Some colleagues from my Christian school signed up for one of these seminars. I joined them, but was rejected because I was age 27, unmarried, but living on my own, not under the "headship" of my father. Never mind the fact that I'd been on my own from age 18 or that I was not invited to live with my parents. I was considered unworthy and "in rebellion." Now, I thank God this cult rejected me. One of my colleagues got dragged into it with her entire family and it was eight years before they broke away having to suffer many negative consequences.

[@annmarie2964]

Praise God that you were rejected by such a group. Misery loves company of their own ilk.

[@mrscouts07]

The biggest problem here is that there are just enough positive things included in this cult that you can easily get sucked in, and not even realize it. There's nothing wrong with modesty, good character traits, and be the best you can be. But when it crosses over to legalism and a sole man (Gothard) as absolute authority, we're in cult territory. My parents actually met at a Gothard Conference back in the mid-70s and I'm so incredibly grateful that they didn't accept everything that Gothard said, but were able to think critically. I was homeschooled and had several friends in ATI but as kids we didn't talk much about details at the time-- I just knew that their parents were even more strict than mine (which was unbelievable!) and they were excluded from some activities. Now I have adult friends who went through ATI as kids and they're all either in counseling or in need of counseling. And parents don't always get into it to mess up and control their kids-- I believe that a lot of them just want to create a good, wholesome life for their family. So sad.

[@akbarshoed]

RealHousewifeRachel this movie is such garbage

[@akbarshoed]

RealHousewifeRachel this movie is such a pile of shit!!!! I know I KNOW each of these haters are drugged out losers now. Half are probably suicidal. It's a fucking CURRICULUM.

[@americannobody27]

RealHousewifeRachel No, you're in the word of God's territory!

[@marrionhues7296]

Yeah. I agree ironically maybe people who were excluded from the counter-culture were attracted to by fear & alienation it's just the degree of actions that should be taken into account.

[@priscellareid6314]

It is like being a Jehovah's witness.

[@WitchyWay...]

I grew up Mormon, but a ton of the things in this video were also taught in that church. That's scary...

[@thirtyonetwentyfive]

I hate victim blaming no one understands why someone stay in a cult, stay in an abusive relationship or continually keep quiet about being sexually abused over and over again...it doesn't start out that way...MASTER manipulators learn to hone their skills by trial and error and they learn how to pick their victims.

[@1ireneaustin]

i want to just confirm and affirm your theory here. I grew up in a house where there were 2 young girls, only one of them was molested, and that one was the more vulnerable one, the victim. i can honestly say that the perverts pick their victims carefully and know how to exploit them. Please don't blame the victims. They have suffered enough

[@growlinghands4696]

@18:50 - "Fire Alarms: When the fire alarm goes off, each person must descend the stairs *fully dressed* [my emphasis] whether day or night and go outside to the front of the building." Modesty is so much more important than mortality!

[@dvferyance]

Considering the fact Gothard never was married or had children how does he know anything about parenting?

[@chicagochrome666]

dvferyance He doesn’t. What he is doing is called “grooming”. He has an entire cult of parents breeding and grooming generations of children into submission for whatever he pleases. I think he’s proven what his wants are.

[@SilverWalker84]

as a parent if you have to send your child into a program to try to control or reprogram them you should take a long look at yourself because you are the issue. the majority of issues should be dealt with in the home and outsourcing the upbringing of your children is a disaster waiting to happen

[@DaniHahn100]

Michael McMullen I love this comment

[@brendakabanda2181]

Absolutely

[@suzanneracine689]

yes I agree

[@henryharris1636]

Yesterday I was driving on birchwood road with my friends and just messing around. We were in the cult parking lot, again just messing around. This road is a no outlet road by the way. When we left the cult building, a white van started following us and blocked off the road so we were trapped. We kept trying to turn and they would reverse and block us again. I had to go off the road to escape and even then the van kept following us. Who knows what would’ve happened if they had got us. I don’t expect people to believe this because it sounds crazy but I’m telling you what happened to me last night. If you see an old, white, smaller van that is slightly rusty and has tinted windows on the back doors and on the back of the sides, please beware. This is obviously a dangerous and active cult and I advise to stay far away. Especially if around the hinsdale area

[@catherineleary9462]

*absolute power corrupts absolutely*

[@BigGirlBeautiful]

Catherine Leary 👏👏👏💯💯💯💯

[@catherineleary9462]

BigGirlBeautiful 🌈thank you.

[@grainofsaltdashofinsanity9493]

Yes👍 and willful ignorance allows for invasion and corruption of ones own mind. Never could wrap my head around that 😵

[@piarossi4555]

soulbass81 I think Lord Acton. He went on to say that "great men are almost always bad men" or something like that.

[@akbarshoed]

Catherine Leary burn in hell! It's a fucking CURRICULUM, loser.

[@brendar9363]

I think it's important to notice how intelligent these people are. It's not idiots who get drawn into cults. It's people who, for whatever reason, are seeking. And a little bit weak.

[@EK-dt4cp]

Brenda R I have old coworkers who are Scientologists and I think the exact same thing. I’ll never understand how such seemingly intelligent people get sucked into cults.

[@inkyguy]

Brenda R, we're all weak.

[@MsAdventure531]

@@inkyguyno, not all.

[@jbw53191]

From the very first moment I watched the Duggars during season 1, I thought, "t This REALLY isn't going to end well."

[@LaraCroftEyes1]

Duggars are put of this cult

[@dogdoc3613]

What shocks me is that so many thousands of people followed this person that wasn't married and had no children but his word on marriage and child rearing was gospel. It's absolutely baffling.

[@ghostownaproach]

We attended the basic seminar in the 70s and I would sometimes go on my own years later. I had just gotten an eye opening experience around 1983 that got me to leave Gene Scott's teaching and I was then attending another Gothard seminar (still called Institute in Basic Youth Conflicts) back then. I asked God if following these teachings was what he wanted me to do and He said, "A lot of people are trying that..." I said, "I know, but is it what you want me to do?," He said, "Why don't you just do what I say in my word?" "I already give you 100% righteousness for free if you just trust me... You don't impress me by trying to be good... Be yourself and let me lead you every day and I will take care of everything else!" I've been doing that ever since and it works great. Btw, my wife watches that Duggar show sometimes and I can't stand it! It's fake as hell! Like being around Mormons. Equally fake as hell. But I didn't know the Duggars were associated with Gothard... Not surprised...

[@lindenmeadow]

I was first exposed to Bill Gothard's teachings in 1990 -- I was just a teenager at the time -- when I went with some friends to Gothard's 'basic' seminar in Atlanta. I went with the same friends to the 'advanced' seminar the following year. My parents had gone to one of his seminars in the 1970's, though thankfully they never got involved with his organization and never tried to build our lives around his teachings. I gradually came to recognize there were problems with a lot of what Gothard taught. For instance, he was notorious for taking Bible verses out of context and then using them as justification for his extreme positions. His heavy emphasis on absolute submission to authority concerned me as well. Additionally, it bothered me how many people that went to those Gothard seminars -- including the family I went with to the seminars in Atlanta -- practically idolized Bill Gothard and would uncritically accept anything he taught. The young daughter of that family, by the way, ended up going to work at IBLP (a.k.a. "the Institute") for a time. She got to know Bill Gothard personally and, by his request, kept working there longer than she had initially intended to. She definitely fit the profile of a "Gothard Girl" (pretty, slender, with long straight hair, etc.), but I dearly hope she didn't end up becoming one of Gothard's sexual abuse victims. :-(

[@mariec3527]

Once people start to limit your freedom you should know that's bad and that is a huge red flag . Don't ever let anyone tell you what to do . Nobody has that right . I Could literally see the pain and hurt in the guy with blonde hair that was wearing all black . His tone of voice and the way his eyes would move and how watery they looked you could tell

[@NJSMKMMS]

Trouble is these kids are all born into it, it's business as usual for them. The whole thing is founded on isolation and being taught what to think not how to think. It's massive if they get out and stay out and it's no easy road when they do. The three interviewed look seriously haunted by it.

[@cheesecake134]

I felt so bad for the woman who said she's always just a little behind, especially when it comes to socializing. This cult has such long-term, devastating effects even if you managed to escape the rampant physical and sexual abuse(often in your own damn FAMILY). Bill Gothard is such a monster.

[@primesspct2]

I was also under the influence of a "christian cult", just not this one. But I have found that taking our eyes off of Jesus Christ and what he did for us, and focusing on ourselves leads to nothing but insecurities, guilt complexes and never feeling good enough. This is spiritual abuse and these men are wolves in sheeps clothing. There is freedom in the true gospel of love and acceptance of Christ. I am so glad I have been healed from my spiritual abuse. I nearly walked away from christianity all together. My heart goes out to any of you struggling with your faith and your lives, God gave us all free will , He made us all different ,Jesus said to love our neighbors, not only the ones in our church. We are to love people period.

[@ESLhills]

I went to conferences before I was married. Practicing this ultimate submission ruined my life. I waited for my family and church to tell me whether I should marry my first husband. They didn't and I felt they were on board with it. I tried my best to submit, but honestly, there was nothing to submit to. I wasn't loved. I stayed in that for 20 years. Painful lonely years. I am still a Christian, but I've come to label Gothard's teachings as Christian mental illness. Now I believe in "mutual submission." More balanced.

[@itswhatyoumakeit6950]

My beautiful, beloved mother brought us into a home of freedom, and critical thinking. Self starter, respectful of elders and authority but definitely NOT worship or just eat what they give. No fear mongering. Matter of fact, I will text her right now and thank her once AGAIN!

[@MsAdventure531]

Yep Very similar to my experience coming of age. Hard to believe there are/were so many blind followers.

[@Windsweptzariel]

It would be interesting to put Warren Jeffs in the same room(cell) with Bill Gothard & see what would ensue

[@stacynonyabizz4241]

i can see a fucked up buddy sitcom ensueing

[@pguthrie222]

🤤

[@rosesandsongs21]

They would sexually abuse each other why?

[@stacynonyabizz4241]

i said fucked up not fucking each other. but yes actually i bet they would because gay prison sex is not just about sex its way more about power, and that jeffs has molested underage boys as well as underage girls, yeah i think someone is gonna rape the other.

[@rosesandsongs21]

. Yep, fucked up fuckers fucking each other for power! Oh dear, I don't talk like this usually, what is happening to me this is horrible... BUT, did they both abuse innocent victims? Yes. Do they deserve it? Of course. Still, I'm not used to such language... Seriously, how can anyone with half a brain knowingly damage young innocent minds for the rest of their lives, then turn around, look at the TV camera, smile and say: ''I can save you.'' Now THAT is a perfect case where I find our justice system unjust, these non-humans should also suffer physically AND morally for as long as they live, an eye for an eye dammit. Okay STOP, this started as a joke, I got a little emotional here, sorry.

[@kristaw2686]

It's kind of crazy that even though I'm a Christian stay at home, homeschooling mom, this culture would've still thought we were a super rebellious "worldly" family because we watch Netflix, say "crap", and wear pants. 😅

[@maxmanx1294]

Pants?! Oh my gosh! Sinners! 😅

[@zzulm]

Its sad how religious people try to take control of vulnerable persons and isolate them so they stay vulnerable.

[@mariec3527]

Zzul Ma and people let shit like this go on

[@sallyc2679]

In Christianity mostly and in cults that’s true but it sounds kind of like offensive for someone in a religion for example I’m Jewish and they don’t make me to anything

[@Thia911]

@@sallyc2679 Interesting that the comment would "sound kind of like offensive" to you because you're Jewish, yet you feel it's ok to be offensive toward Christianity. Real hypocritical.

[@spacecase7566]

Sally Is here ask orthodox Jewish people what they experience. Every religion has extremes.

[@brendakabanda2181]

@@sallyc2679 you can save that bs. We have seen how Jewish women are treated when they try to divorce. Please. One of the worst religions.

[@lauraswann5543]

ALWAYS QUESTION AUTHORITY. God gave each one of us the gift of free will. Think for yourselves.

[@mfsstrpp]

We went through all of these programs including the home school program and even talked to Bill Gothard once or twice. We finally had to leave because of the cultish feel of this. We DID benefit a lot from the idea of "Wisdom Searches" which were just a daily bible study every morning with the family which had a very positive impact on all of us. It is unfortunate that this whole ministry seemed to get really skewed in relation to true gospel living.

[@mfsstrpp]

Additionally, the initial thrust seemed to be "here are the truths of scripture, now base your convictions on these" and slowly went to "here are my convictions, and they need to be yours also".

[@lucindaburke6987]

Hi Steve. I’m obviously late to the comments section but my brother and sister in law went through the program and homeschooled their seven children. You can obviously say what you want in how it helped your family but all I know is that IBLP divided our entire family. I have no relationship with my nieces and nephews because of it.

[@graemeharper765]

It always boils down to a guy just wanting access to multiple women

[@Sydnarella]

My family was in another "new religious movement" (cough cough) cult. Gothard's seminars were used more as supplemental material, but most of us were sent to his seminars. He lost me with the message that you should obey the male head of your family even if he is telling you to do something that is morally (or legally) wrong.

[@thetrintarianmessianicyahw589]

Morally and Legally Wrong. Nice. You really can make the Bible say whatever you want.

[@sarahs3988]

@@thetrintarianmessianicyahw589 You can't make the bible say that. It doesn't. As I read this comment I was shocked because as a Christian who discussed authority with my children occasionally I always follow it up with, as long as it doesn't lead you to sin. We are to live by the laws of our country, as long as it's not into sin, we are to obey our parents, or someone who is teaching you or watching you, as long as it is not into sin. Etc. Because that is what the bible teaches.

[@raizelm1578]

That whole male-dominated authority thing is very much a part of Mormonism as well.

[@kathyheitchue6069]

Raizel M Also most christian especially fundamental sects

[@kathyheitchue6069]

Raizel M Blame goes to the idiotic Eve created 2nd,from Adams rib bible fable

[@mariaavalon3730]

@@kathyheitchue6069 Yeah I would rather be like Lilith who left the Garden and became the Queen of Demons. Hell even the second wife was lucky that Adam didn't want her even though we don't know what happened to her. All I can think of is Bette Davis a very Lilith Spirited woman saying "Poor Eve!"

[@Michael-pf8we]

Mormonism is also a cult

[@nikichat4476]

Raizel M The Bible also teaches us to obey our husbands. It’s a true thing.

[@theasexualvampire13]

The answer to a happy, healthy family is one simple thing: trust.

[@DivineIntent888]

Damn it, I was so sure it was love.

[@candacecasey5634]

Love is definitely more important than trust. You can misplace trust but love real love won't mistreat anyone.

[@swim610]

I married a guy like this. Nightmare.

[@sarahelizabeth7705]

Tonya Stutz honestly as a Christian I could never marry a Christian man because of this type of lifestyle, its abusive by nature and so oppressive towards women.

[@lillylazer429]

Hope you got out. This is so much women blaming and shaming.

[@Thia911]

@@sarahelizabeth7705 So let me get this straight, you're a Christian, but you don't want to marry a Christian man? Wow... so all Christian men are cultic and abusive? "Submission" - yea that bad "s" word, doesn't mean = oppression nor does God intend for the wife or husband to be oppressed. People just misunderstand the context of that word in the scriptures.

[@OneWingedHoneybee]

@Kyril J You're making a lot of assumptions about someone you don't know.

[@girlsdigmytube183]

“Wives shall submit themselves to their husbands, as the husband submits to the the church, as the church submits to God”

[@HRH-THO-II]

The pain in the eyes and the voice of the guy with piercings is so deep. Kinda just wanna hug him and say you poor sweet guy, youre ok, youre a person and its gonna take some time but youre gonna be ok. Youre out now. Take youre time and work thru what youve got to work through.

[@sbeasley7585]

Yeah... You poor guy. You were taught godly character and now you say it ruined you.

[@elizabethbalvin368]

I agree; God bless that young man !

[@TradeofJack]

He's only "out" in one way.

[@ScrogginHausen]

All the cults are fundamentally the same thing, just a charismatic leader who seeks to dominate those who think the Bible is about us following rules to reach God when it's really about us being incapable of following the rules so God had to do it for us.

[@jullietowner2226]

Yes amen! Glory to our Lord and savior Jesus Christ. God bless💗

[@nicegurly456]

amen!

[@mindysommers]

Very good documentary. But for the love of God, cool it with the music. It is so distracting and intrusive.

[@steadyc9277]

OMG right?? I really wanted to watch the whole thing but it got SO irritating at times I had to hit mute and turn the captioning on!!

[@suzanneracine689]

I agree

[@Andrea1542]

The music is annoying and the constant volume changes suck. One person will be really loud then the next person sounds like they're miles away and muffled. It's a good doc though!

[@asianpersuasionmelly7847]

Mindy Sommers i agree

[@danwalk5881]

I liked the music. It tells you whats the sad bits an exciting bits lol

[@bluetickbeagles116]

This documentary reminds me of some Pentecostal beliefs of full submission and obedience to the pastor/prophet/bishop. 😣

[@mariatorok364]

gwen keto I’m sorry to tell you it’s not true, I’m Pentecostal since I was born (52) but in my church and i moved a few times they will never tell you to obey the pastor, they will tell you to obey the bible, of corse there are some rules in the church just to be order and peace but nothing that bad like here in this film, even here they had a few things according to the bible for example how to dress, I teach my 4 girl to dress nice but not to sexy and because they are beautiful girls they are always appreciated and complemented on the streets for baying cute and 3 of them have good jobs because they are smart, but living according to the word of God it’s healthy and good of corse again not going to the extreme, but being submissive to people in a way that they will dictate your life it’s very wrong, God gave us free will!!

[@farmchick1413]

Yep. The Bible doesn't teach this crap. That's why checks and balances are in place per God's word. :)

[@Ksklarge1]

My grandpa was a Pentecostal pastor and you are incorrect or went to one aweful church.... They do not teach to 'obey' the pastor....

[@wadewelch6849]

There is a difference between obedience to man and the culture he represents. Or tries to create or obedience to the word of God. The fist leads to bondage..the other freedom.

[@juniperseeds48214]

I agree Gwen

[@MarlomRV]

I'm from São Paulo, Brazil. I'm an ex Jehovah Witness. A lot of things go through my mind when I watch these documentaries. I mean, I could be dead by now, because I would entertain suicidal thoughts every time... I just wanted to die, because Armaggedon was near and I would not make it to the "new world", as I was not doing enough in "God's true organization". Cults are dangerous and sometimes... deadly...

[@claravieira9102]

Eu não tinha a mínima ideia que testemunha de Jeová era uma seita! Sinto muito que vive tenha passado por isso

[@mfrompa9641]

God bless all those whom had the strength to speak out! God bless all whom is still stuck in this repetition!!!

[@gratefulanon1886]

God bless you for exposing this. I went to several seminars as a teen. I threw all the hardbacks I bought a few years later. It was all based on works.

[@ToLoveIsToLive89]

I have met this man in person, at Erin Bates wedding, he was a total creep! It also weirded me out that they had a birthday cake that looked like a wedding cake at the reception for him!!!😣😬😱

[@andreanairvin7724]

This breaks my heart, for all the young people and children raised with these harmful beliefs.

[@elise2363]

This should be shown in theaters.

[@EDDIELANE]

I got out of a church like this and most of my family and friends are still there and not allowed to speak to me anymore.

[@lilli9408]

Cut the long story short: Men/ Sons are worth more than women/ daughters. That is basicslly the feeling I get watching this film.

[@isbsey]

This "man control" was just how it was for ordinary girls in the 1950s. You stayed at home until your father walked you down the aisle and handed you over to your husband. I left for London from a small Scottish town and I had to come home every month and walk up and down the high street in tight clothes to SHOW I was away to a good job in London and not dismissed to a great aunt until I had an unwanted (what a horrible word) baby. Ridiculous!! This was 1972!!

[@landlord5552]

Raised in same kind of culture, I can honestly say that almost all Evangelical Churches (baptist,pentecostals,methodist,bretherans...) share more or less the same values. Most of them are not evil at all tough.

[@smurfiennes]

Never join any club except cooking class or sport

[@desireebaird5862]

If the blind follows the blind they both fall in a ditch

[@aina3387]

We visited a "home-church" a few times in which the members were part of this cult. My dad pretty quickly realized what was really going on, and decided we weren't going back. Even back then, he thought it was cult-like. But my BFF's family continued to go for a few years. During those years, I was considered "worldly" and my BFF couldn't hang out with me. Jokes on them, because I turned out way more conservative than my BFF.

[@rickster348]

- sound like Jim Jones.

[@wellIdiditagain]

rickster348 more like the JW, Catholic priests, FLDS etc etc it's sad.

[@ingridmilliebobby-brown7653]

Though Jim Jones used hooked people in under a Christian-based/ Christian-masked philosophy, it was much different rhetoric than what's being used here. The bait-and-hook that eventually became Jonestown was initially geared toward the poor. The "family" archetype that drew people in was more about experiencing Jones as Father/ God, vs. the cult in this documentary bait-and-hooking people with delusions of totalitarian authority in their own home.

[@yungobaba403]

Growing up next to their building on Ogden always scared the hell outta me and I remember my parents constantly warning me about the people there

[@lesevans6567]

So, this was a Christian cult. And, it was built in broad daylight. It blows my mind. How many wonderful parents. Will see a blueprint for life. That someone has eloquently put together. And, they immediately say, we should raise our children this way. When they were doing fine already. And, if they would’ve let time run it’s coarse? They’d have been fine. Life goes by to fast. Teach your children that no one knows what’s best for their children better then they do…

[@Docante1]

Meanwhile Gothard has escaped his own allegations

[@Acts-hv8bh]

Some things Mr. Gothard taught was actually Biblically sound BUT if anyone read 1 Timothy 3:2, then any Christian knowing this passage would have easily saw a glaring contradiction with Mr. Gothard himself which was the following: He was never married....the only way this is excusable is if Mr. Gothard was a eunuch or unable to have sexual relations. The passage from the Bible (AMP version) says the following: " Now an overseer must be blameless and beyond reproach, the husband of one wife, self-controlled, sensible, respectable, hospitable, able to teach,.." So unless Mr. Gothard was a eunuch then he wasn't qualified to be in that role of teaching MARRIED men about family structure in the first place.

[@Tina06019]

Acts 051726 Now, THAT is an interesting insight.

[@sigalsmadar4547]

that is so unfortunate you think that. Moreso today with archaeological discoveries, the Bible is being proven over and over and over. Why would you not follow good advice on how to live a good life, loving and helping your fellow human?

[@thatonechick6744]

I was so close to being homeschooled with the ATI programn. Thank God that Gothard's teachings made my mom uneasy. Unfortunately I know kids who were in ATI... and some of those teachings made it into my church, homeschool co-ops, girl scouts and other social events. It took me years to find God... to truly find God. But what I went through is nothing compared to what these and many others have gone through because of Gothard. The only "sin" these parents committed was to try to make the world better for their family. It was the 80s and 90s. Christian's were looking for direction, wisdom and meaning. Then like that one young woman said, you just get sucked in. That other woman was 100% right. As Christians, we HAVE to look out for each other .... and as humans we have to as well. And that young man is changing the world. PS: this documentary was so well done! Kudos.

[@sandyforan3301]

Happened to us as well. Worked into church, social groups etc. The judgement from this cult was incredible. One came to our home to borrow something and noticed my painted toenails through my sandels. She actually said she would pray for me and my relationship with Christ....my nails were soft pink color.

[@Lacirose88]

Thank you for uploading this!!!

[@MsMdip]

With this thing about female submission fundamentalist Christians argue for, I always remember my dad describing his idea of marriage according to the Bible: husband and wife will become one heart and one flesh, but it NEVER said one mind, especially if that mind resides in only one of the heads.

[@SeafairZombies]

Glaring omission: Out of the thousands of people who went through the Gothard programs, they were only able to interview three former students for this documentary?

[@readthedwelling]

Oh man that music HAS to go.

[@Raquel-rg8eq]

Susie Moloney 😂😂😂

[@debmckay1909]

Please tell me it's gonna stop

[@psalm91.666]

What's going on with that lol

[@catxo1251]

😂😂😂😂

[@kcl43]

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@davidbrown-hf3ti]

My family wasn’t into this, but many folks in my church. One thing I thought I observed, was that I rarely saw any of the adherents give a big, free belly laugh. They’d smile or chuckle, but both usually seemed nervous or painful.

[@ClassifiedM96]

My uncle, a pastor, drilled these teaching into our heads during bible class in high school, I graduated the same year the accusations came out so I don’t know if he still teaches any of it... I remember clearly during class I would raise many questions and was usually met with a flimsy answer. Luckily I had a mom and a dad who let me develop my own opinions, for which my uncle constantly scolded my dad.

[@TradeofJack]

Holy cow. An inquisitive person would have to develop this intangible way of arguing in order to get a straight answer. Which only gets them in trouble and spoken to by some crazy eyed Edgar suit that happened to be stationed there.

[@amarketing8749]

Why is it impossible to find an Update not the Bill Gothard case ?? I can't find anything more recent than 2016. Has the case been settled, still ongoing, etc. If anyone knows and has a link to more information, please post.

[@amarketing8749]

Typo: on* the Bill Gothard case. I apologize, I missed the typo, before sending.

[@rvgypsy2909]

I'm 33 and still have scars from a childhood like this. So much damage done in the name of " religion" shame..

[@hopedunkel2298]

Fundamentals are all crazy. Devotion to your faith is good but when you control others, it becomes evil.

[@wrldnkaos76]

I was an l.i.t. At iblp in Indianapolis, Indiana. 1994. They are not lying. My parents sent me there. The whole building was covered in sensors and cameras. I personally was locked in a room on the 12 th floor for weeks at a time with a camera on me the entire time. The windows were covered and they only gave me a bible and a “fasting diet” ....period. I just didn’t agree with them or their beliefs. My parents gave them custody of me. when I tried to leave they called the police. I turned 18 inside that horror hotel. If anyone was there at that time inbox me.

[@jemgapuz4400]

I came from a Christian school like that and all the psychological and emotional scars the guy mentioned at 24:00 is spot on. Struggled with codependency and anxiety; and it took a suicide attempt and many years of therapy to wake me up to the roots of my scars.

[@katlibby83]

What an excellent, brave, and self-aware film. I loved it.

[@lv7118]

Kat Libby agree completely...background music unfortunately distracted from the excellent,incisive interviews though

[@akbarshoed]

Kat Libby this is a movie for sheep. You're so idiotic

[@evvalynnv7414]

Thank you, beautifully done. Again I'm reminded of the pain inflicted on children when the parents probably have the best of intentions. It is terrifying to leave, develop, catch up 'grow up' impossible not to rage at the loss of good self esteem, coping skills, normalcy. May God give you back triple fold what Satan has taken away in these cults.

[@puppy5255251]

I enjoyed this, thank you for posting!

[@LanaLo0000]

I greatly appreciate these people coming forward to speak on their experiences.

[@chellebelle914]

THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!! THANK YOU FOR TELLING MY STORY. BETTER THAN I EVER COULD! THANK YOU FOR BRINGING THIS TO THE LIGHT!!!!!!!!! THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!!!!!

[@tylerlasarow]

How are you going to take marriage advice from someone who was never married or had children of his own?

[@marissabones]

It's sad to see how some people can be so easily brainwashed

[@tatianapanferova]

Never trust guy with "GOTHARD" for last name, smh 😂😂😂☠

[@igotbandaids]

Psalm 118:8-9 8 It is better to take refuge in the Lord than to trust in man. 9 It is better to take refuge in the Lord than to trust in princes.

[@dazanii]

The way they describe the oppressive culture of ATI r minds me so much of growing up a Jehovah’s Witness. The rules based system, conservative views on sex, “stumbling” men, blaming every little problem you ever have in life no matter what it is on your not being spiritual enough or praying enough or preaching to the public enough, the whole umbrella authority model, so much of it is so similar.

[@inkyguy]

I remember seeing his literature years ago in the 1980s. One of the points that it made that forever stuck in my mind was that a man stealing food or medication to save a dying child must, according to the Bible, go to prison. I knew there and then that this man's idea of authority had no room for grace or humanity, that it was an exercise in Biblical fundamentalism, legalism and rigid hierarchical control of others.

[@SoCalGirl22]

“This is what the Sovereign Lord says: What sorrow awaits the false prophets who are following their own imaginations and have seen nothing at all!’” ‭‭Ezekiel‬ ‭13:3‬ NLT give ezekiel chpt 13 a good read, the lord only wants us to be able to discern what is true and false