The Curse of Economic Nationalism | Thomas J. DiLorenzo

Recorded at the Mises Institute in Auburn, Alabama, on 18 July 2019.
Mises University is the world's leading instructional program in the Austrian school of economics. Mises.org/MU19

[@velvetpaws999]

The (brave) New World.... This is what the USA is still being called in Europe. Without the 'brave', which I added in for literary and (not so??) obviously ironic reasons. As a child growing up in Germany, we learned in history classes about the origins of the USA. How its founding fathers wanted to create a better system for the benefit of its citizens. What this school teaching achieved is that even today, most people think the USA is a shining example of a better world, with a better quality of life, regardless of which part of "life" is considered. Everything there is simply "better", because it is "new". What that meant to most people is that the mistakes and weaknesses of the Old World system had been done away with, and that they seized the opportunity to create a more equitable society, where the old political schemes were revised to be more democratic and at a higher service to all of its citizens. As a kid, I also witnessed the presence of American troops in Germany. I was born 7 years after the end of WWII, so I only had hearsay about that war. But, I witnessed the collective feelings and expressions of guilt in the German population. Much of this is still there even in the young generation today. The allied troops were stationed in many south German cities, as part of the Armistice impositions put forth by the Allied Victors, USA, France and Great Britain. Mostly, we got to meet the Americans and the British in our villages every year when they did their maneuvers. I loved spending my afternoons with the troops. They were all young guys, very friendly and kind, just like big brothers. I pestered them with questions all day long, about their lives, the tanks, the helicopters and anything else. I got great practice of the English language out of it and many pen pals. The reason I am relating this is, because it contributed to creating more of an image of greatness and kindness in the mind of the German population. The victors were human, compassionate and "forgiving". Mentioning the Armistice further up, I want to add that Germany still has not been allowed to sign a peace treaty. What that means is, that we are not actually and constitutionally free to form an independent and sovereign new nation in Germany. We are still under the control of the Allied Victors of WWII. This may not appear much in everyday life, but it is important nonetheless. The "BRD" (Bundesrepublik Deutschland, Federal Republic of Germany) can be nothing more than a registered trademark, or business name, much like "IBM", or "GM". How sad is that? Very few people today actually are aware of this fact, as the surface appearance seems to tell that all is OK. The politics of the USA are very hypocrite and self-serving. Wars are good for destroying an economy and then coming in and rebuild it with your own merchandise, your own technologies, your own military presence. It is not about "liberating" anybody from evil, or about any other high moral motives. Profit is the driving element, nothing else. All the while, looking like the saint savior. Americans think that General DeGaulle hated Americans. He did not. He was just aware that at least one European Power should stay out of the NATO membership, so that at least one European (free) power could act independently from USA dictate, if necessary. Seems like a very healthy stance to me. Other than that, he never disliked Americans at large. I should write a memoir about all of this. After living almost 30 years in the USA now, with an American husband whom I love very much, I have been able to understand a lot of life and culture here from the inside, and it is in stark contrast to my theoretical knowledge and perception in my earlier life. For about a decade now, I have been asking hard questions to my fellow humans here about the way the USA is run. Nobody has given me any satisfying answers. Everybody sighs and surrenders to the obvious: we have an overpowering government, which interferes with everything, and there is nothing that can be done about it. Or, we are so lucky to have a government that takes care of its people, because the people need this. Anytime there is a problem, I hear this ominous question: "What is our government going to do about this?" Just hearing this question makes me cringe. I think that less "the Government" comes to do something about it, the better off we should be. Why can't we ourselves do something about it, whatever it is, as a collective, and fix it at our own level? Are we so stupid that we have no clue? Federal taxation, local politics and anything in between got me to study some of American history. The eye opener came when I found Di Lorenzo's book about Lincoln. For the first time, I realized that all my observations were not an illusion, they were real. Only now, I finally could see where the roots lay. I am still under the shock of it. And no, this is not an exaggeration. As a European, I think I have a different angle of understanding and reading the signs of what is happening here. Americans do not know Totalitarianism, nor do they know Nationalism, as they were practiced in Russia (USSR) in the form of Communism, and in Germany mostly, but also in Italy, Japan, Spain, France, just to name a few of the key nations, in the form of National Socialism. Germany pushed this to the limits with Hitler. Now, as I watch what is going on here, I can warn you that this nation is sliding into a similar situation. The signs are all there. It will be neither a Hitler replay or a Stalin script, but it will be a recipe based on blending elements of the two together and adapting it to modern times. Shivers down my spine just thinking of it. You don't believe me? Just keep going as you do and see where you'll end up. Maybe the citizens of the USA need to get a good practical experience of what that is. Nothing better than to learn from living it, right? Right. Five generations to dig yourselves out from it again, once it's there...at least. I am following the evolution of former communist countries, like Albania, just to name one. Interesting study, to say the least. Sorry for the long post. I just hope we can find a way to reshape this beautiful USA into something worth to be emulated and followed by others. It is not that one right now.

[@brianarps8756]

Underestimating Trump is the most common error of the age.

[@OdiousCoprophagus]

What are the cultural implications of the cultural/historical buzz around the persona of Hamilton around the time of the release of the musical? I didn't follow that story because I can't stand Broadway, is there a timely reason the man's story was brought into the public conscious around 2015/2016?

[@Freddy-Da-Freeloadah]

Hamilton was rumored to be of mixed race parentage... That's really all: Hamilton was considered by the producers to be a multi-cultural founding father. Hamilton's politics and policies are of accidental interest to these people. IMHO

[@senselessnothing]

Economic nationalism does not pertain to economics though. We're talking about relationships between coercive units, ie nations/states.

[@harrymills2770]

Yes. And what do you do if one coercive state is misbehaving?

[@senselessnothing]

@@harrymills2770 Depends on your firepower.

[@zubstep]

@@senselessnothing Even more depends upon the particular weaknesses of that state.

[@senselessnothing]

@@zubstep I think we can both agree that it's a very complicated matter. But what is certain is that with sufficient firepower you can "change their opinions swiftly".

[@zqflute3676]

Prof dilorenzo is a little bit more focused on the actors instead of ideas and actions. I think the actual actor is less important than ideas. Would be great if he can have focused discussion of ideas, actions and consequences.

[@Freddy-Da-Freeloadah]

RIGHT!: they are all dead anyways, so we can't hang them... But, MAYBE WE CAN HANG THEM!!! They (Hamilton, and maybe others?) are the heroes of our enemies! We Should let DiLorenzo hang them in effigy! Both aspects are important though. IMHO

[@ludwigvonsowell5347]

Joe Morton Hamilton and Jefferson were allies and enemies depending on the issues.

[@Freddy-Da-Freeloadah]

@@ludwigvonsowell5347 Whilst we can NOT expect (BIASED!!!) Mises Fellows to hang Jefferson in effigy, I suspect others will... Maybe soon, so GET READY!!! IMHO

[@ludwigvonsowell5347]

Joe Morton Jefferson was big on restricting interstate bank branches for example. A textbook anti Austrian idea.

[@ohad157]

Love that guy

[@bestfriendhank1424]

Milepost 0 in Council Bluffs, IA

[@houstontaylor442]

TDL is a motha-fucking gangsta. I wish he would fight A. S. Jr. In the prize ring, bare knuckle if possible. We all know who would win.

[@maverikmiller6746]

This whole speech is bunk. These all criticisims are directed towards "democracy" and "central power", not nationalism. There is nothing economically or financially wrong with a nation trying to produce as diverse products as possible by itself and selling it both domestic and internationally. As long as central authority does not metastasize in that nation there is not just nothing wrong with it, but the economical benefits would be incredible. Claiming otherwise would be same as defending "specialized production" fallacy which is the claim only some countries can produce some things cheap and good enough (which is now completely debunked). As long as you have access to base materials you can produce/manufacture whatever you want efficiently almost anywhere.

[@finnkrogstad2541]

Ideas so stupid that they have to be imposed by government force. You know that an idea is stupid when you have to use government force to impose it on everyone else.

[@ludwigvonsowell5347]

Very true, I’d have preferred him dive into tariffs and protectionism both at a national and local level.

[@thundaga4005]

You idiot, just because you wish something to be true doesn't mean you'll have it. Protectionist measures actually have unintended consequences and could end up producing the very opposite what the support of such measures wants. But you wouldn't know this without studying economics.

[@zackthebongripper7274]

@@thundaga4005 This is not an issue of "protectionism" or "economic nationalism." china does not play by the rules, because it is an illegitimitimae milaterisitc communist nation that dreams of empire. All these "free market" nitwits do not understand that one country can't play fair while the other one cheats.

[@aminuabdulmanaf4434]

@@zackthebongripper7274 What do you suppose China will do with the dollars they get from American consumers? eat them, wear them, or burn them to warm their bodies during winter? If Chinese are workaholics and are willing to subsidize the standard of living of American consumers, I see no justification why such a beautiful aid should be rejected by Americans.

[@kimobrien.]

This is why Imperialism is the highest stage of capitalism.

[@wouldbegood]

The Devil is in the detail.

[@atheplummer]

I know it's an anathema for libertarian thought to have any advocacy for tariffs in any fashion, However, If I may interject a thought about the possibilities and concepts as to why tariffs are favorable to America, as well as to the citizen, in lieu of Federal Corporate and individual income tax. If we think about the US Constitution in one of the core reasons for it's existence, it was designed to ensure free and fair trade among the states that chose to adopt, and adhere to the constitution. This is a 'right, with responsibility' for every state government, as well as the citizen within. This privilege, or right, should not be afforded to any other country on the planet, as they have not chosen to adopt our Constitution, and create a framework in their state regarding citizens rights, and all the other protections afforded. My thoughts are as follows: If I were king of America, I'd impose the following: 1. Eliminate all Federal welfare to three different categories. Individual, Corporate, and (the one that neither party ever talks about) State Welfare (grants and such to the state governments). 2. Eliminate the US Federal Reserve Bank. In favor of the US Treasury and the Social Security Administration collaborate on keeping a very accurate tabulation on the census of living social security numbers. The Treasury would then issue or remove currency from the money supply, based on a multiplier on the actual amount of SSN's in use (living SSN's). As the population increases, the government can inject more currency, if it contracts, currency must be removed at the same ratio. This will eliminate inflation, and over time, things will get cheaper (as they always do) increasing purchasing power. There would be no national debt, and hence no interest on the money used paid to the Federal Reserve. I believe this is the most effective way to lift poor out of poverty. 3. Eliminate Federal individual and corporate income tax. Make all taxes subject to collection from the nearest governing body, closest to you. When a middle govt. is getting it's handout from the Federal Government, they aren't looking at the individual's interest they are looking at the hand that feeds. Just like baby birds in the nest, when the mother is feeding them the worm. 4. Fund the Federal government with tariffs, as we did before... But not from a 'protectionist' viewpoint... But rather a flat rate across the board percentage on EVERY good or service that is manufactured outside our borders... Irregardless if it's manufactured by a foreign owned company, or even a domestic owned company. The reality is a tariff is nothing more than a sales tax to the purchaser. If the citizen wants to purchase a foreign made good, he just has to understand that he's going to pay a sales tax to support his country, since his dollars will be leaving his country, rather than creating a job/career for another American Citizen. Let's face it, America is the tip of the economic spear, and rightly should be... When we succeed, so do all other nations "A rising tide lifts all boats"...

[@jaredgarbo3679]

"4. Fund the Federal government with tariffs, as we did before... But not from a 'protectionist' viewpoint... But rather a flat rate across the board percentage on EVERY good or service that is manufactured outside our borders... Irregardless if it's manufactured by a foreign owned company, or even a domestic owned company. The reality is a tariff is nothing more than a sales tax to the purchaser. If the citizen wants to purchase a foreign made good, he just has to understand that he's going to pay a sales tax to support his country, since his dollars will be leaving his country, rather than creating a job/career for another American Citizen." This is basically a VAT that is used in so many other countries.

[@TheSummersilk]

You want to overcharge citizens for leveraging cheap foreign goods to meet their needs? The mental gymnastics......

[@atheplummer]

@@TheSummersilk Define 'overcharge' for me in this context. As if we aren't being overcharged with money printer go Brrrrrr now.

[@TheSummersilk]

@@atheplummer Leveraging government force to artificially inflating prices to favour national industry at the expense of the consumer? Of course.

[@atheplummer]

@@TheSummersilk As if income taxation doesn't do the same thing?, but on a more broad scope.

[@comesahorseman]

AKA, crony capitalism.

[@finnkrogstad2541]

Who cares about genocide when you can praise someone for their banking policies?