The Final KISS Show? My Review +Discussion About the "New Era" of

In my last Kiss related video ( • The End of the Road fo... , I was on the fence about buying the pay-per-view for the final KISS show on December 2. I went back and forth all week. As the day of the final show got closer, I decided to go ahead and do it. There's only ONE last show ever, right?
This video is my honest reaction to the concert and to the announcement made at the show about the future of KISS. I went in with an open mind. I admit to being more than a little confused now that it's over.
Find all of my other KISS related videos: • KISS and KISS related
Please like this video and subscribe to the channel if you have not already done so. Thanks.
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For nearly two decades, your buddy Dave has hosted a weekly radio show in Omaha called 'New Day Rising' which airs every Sunday afternoon from 2-4pm CST on KIWR, 89.7 FM - streaming at www.897theriver.com.
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Copyright Disclaimer/Fair Use Notice: Any video clips or still photos not taken by me are used under the principle of "fair use." Under section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for “fair use” for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, education and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing.
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00:00 Intro
00:54 The Pay Per View Set-Up
02:36 The Pre-show
03:49 My Review of the final show
06:32 The final set list
09:05 KISS previews the future
11:32 Final Thoughts

[@jakecamp12]

I did not pay for the PPV as I saw this show in 2019 when the tour started. My own opinion is that Gene wanted to have Peter and Ace there. I really feel he understood the moment and is at times angry with them because he wanted to go out with the 4 original members, similar to how the Beatles finished. I think it is Paul that did not want to have anyone else there as to this day, he is desperately trying to continue selling this version of the band as being the best version. The person I really felt bad for was Bruce Kulick. He has remained the good soldier and still could not get a call to take one last bow. I always thought Gene was the ahole of the band, but the older I get, Paul is definitely the ahole in my book. As far as avatar KISS, hard pass. I saw them when everyone was young and could sing. I don't need to see digital versions of them where Gene and Eric look 20 pounds over weight and Paul is unrecognizable.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Paul is the boss in KISS. That much has been proven over the last 25-30 years. I agree, Gene was more enthusiastic about including the original guys, and was generally more tolerant of their behavior. It's rock & roll for fuc%s sake! My last show was in 2019, as well.

[@freedomflyer6650]

💯 agreed

[@johnmarshall3903]

Bruce is a class act and they even screwed him too, after 10 years of faithful service

[@jakecamp12]

@@johnmarshall3903 could not agree more. It makes me sad how he is treated.

[@mizlayne6055]

I have read all the former members books it's very clear that Paul has a dislike for all the other members of the band so I'm not surprised that he would not want them for their final performance. I feel they should have been there though

[@LannieLord]

MOST of the fans would have been THRILLED to have Peter and Ace just walk out and BOW for a minute . If they knew how special it would have been for REAL to fans ....maybe they STILL would not have done it. Avatar Kiss , will not sail . It's like a Laser Show at the planetarium .

[@Thedarkstuff]

Agreed

[@BobWilcox-gd3tt]

Very disappointed that they did not acknowledge any former members in the show at all. What a shame especially for Ace and Peter. For a last show ever i thought they could have been rolling footage from the past 50 yrs or something. All in all a sad day for me to see it all end. Best band ever in my opinion.

[@Thedarkstuff]

We're in total agreement.

[@HomemadeGoalHorns.]

I agree, it’s just sad that they had to cancel some shows, Paul’s sickness came at the worst time. And he wasn’t even fully recovered during the last show…

[@robsingletary2383]

*Hard Luck Woman NOT Hard Like A Woman.....SMH@@alexmollon933

[@TW-vl4wj]

Going forward....I would rather see a really good Kiss tribute act...like Mr. Speed or any of the others!! Kiss was awesome during the Reunion shows with Ace and Peter!! Im good with my Kiss Records and the Memories 😊 keep the Avatars 😂

[@pasqualedaddario8302]

Exactly!!!

[@JesusisLord2000]

I did not pay to see it on pay-per-view, but watched a recording on KZbin and I agree with you 100%. So many wasteful moments and nothing new. But unfortunately, I know a lot of it is age with the voices that cannot sing the same notes anymore. That also goes for the recent reunion I saw of Guns N’ Roses, and a live show from Bon Jovi this year. Their voices were just not good and I read the comments and people just praise them like they sound like they did 30+years ago. They are all great bands, but many need to face reality. They don’t sound as good as they used to. As for the avatar show, that’s a big joke I wouldn’t pay a dime to see anything like that. In fact, I won’t even pay a dime to see these old bands live anymore at big venues. Happy to see them in their prime, but time to move on.

[@Thedarkstuff]

I have heard that about Guns and Bon Jovi, also. Haven't seen either since the 80s.

[@tenbroeck1958]

@@Thedarkstuff Ditto

[@hailmaryrecordings8255]

I think the AI “ Avatar Kiss” is mainly just cope for Gene & Paul. A way to have made the occasion not feel like the death of the band (to them), in an overtly “futuristic” way. I don’t see many fans really giving a shit about video-game Kiss, but these guys have proven skeptics wrong for 50-years, so who knows?

[@Thedarkstuff]

You are right that they have proven skeptics wrong. The entire idea of Kiss was mocked back in 1974. But, they have also been wrong about a whole lot, too. This feels like a Kiss Meets the Phantom level of ridiculousness. Maybe I will be proven wrong. But if this is the future of music, in general, I want no part of it.

[@AlmostReady504]

Mortality in general. The road each day we are all closer to taking.

[@lucas8095]

I would be happy if I never hear a 100.000 years and Black Diamond again I hated those songs for years 👀

[@dungeonsanddragons2049]

it feels soulless to be honest its not Kiss to me sure the models are kiss but thats not kiss

[@skymningforelsket1302]

A lot of those numb nuts will buy anything Kiss sells them

[@freedomflyer6650]

I couldn't agree more, It was a sad end and a very uneventful last show 😢🎸🎶🎤. As for the Avatar I just don't see how that will keep it going

[@Thedarkstuff]

Me neither.

[@paulmilovich2982]

So very well said!! Kiss is so incredibly "money hungry" that they all 4 will be back on tour by the end of next year. Look how Motley Crue's apparent retirement went. Great stuff!!!

[@Thedarkstuff]

If they were 10-15 years younger, I'd agree.

[@Strato13]

I'd actually go see ABBA's show if I could. They are doing a very cool Avatar hologram show as themselves in their younger years, but somehow look very tastefully done and cool. I've seen clips of it, and I would be open to it. For Kiss, everything has always been a money-making opportunity, and this media type direction will either succeed or fail.

[@Thedarkstuff]

ABBA is a pop band that hasn't appeared in public since the early 80s. Makes more sense for them.

[@ralphtarr5931]

I was just saw your review on the last KISS SHOW and I understand your negativity on Pauls voice but like you said he's 72 yrs old and let's not forget how powerful his voice was for so many years!. He pushed it for 50 years and not all vocalist age as well as others and it has to play on his mind, pride etc.. he WAS the best in his prime. That being said if I feel like I feel I can't imagine how he must feel knowing he's not doing it like he used to.. my humble opinion but I feel for the man. I've seen them live 15 times and his vocal abilities blew my mind and just give the guy a break. He's one of the best of all time. Peace and blessings to you all 🙏

[@Thedarkstuff]

He was amazing for a long time. Longer than most. But he needed to retire a long time ago.

[@debusen81]

You mentioned cartoons, but if they were actually hand drawn in a 70s style that would’ve been great. I like Kiss because they’re a nostalgia act for me. I don’t really like to imagine them in modern times ie avatars etc.

[@Thedarkstuff]

No teenagers in the future will get into KISS because of these avatars. It will be from old footage from the 70s.

[@mtumix]

Had so many problems here in Germany with PPV. I have an ultra fast connection but.there were several problems. The interviews in the beginning were totally out of sync in speech and picture. The show itself was filmed ok, but there was also a delay on Pauls guitar. He was far back an not in rhythm with the other band members. Maybe it was a mistake of the FOH engineers. Or he was not 100% there. Yes: I agree with you. There was nothing new and special. Maybe a direct talk to the audiance for several minutes would have been fine. No correct finishing point for such a great career. Not good...

[@Thedarkstuff]

We are in near total agreement. Greetings in Germany.

[@suzeldoodlebugs2568]

Why on earth would anyone pay to see an avatar??? What a crazy world we are living in. I saw my first KISS concert in a HS gym in 1975 along with Rush. I saw every tour after that through 1979... one concert without makeup, the Asylum tour, and never went to another one until the reunion. I went to seven shows and felt like I had been transported back in time and was glad I was able to bring my kids to experience the magic. After THE FAREWELL TOUR, I never expected them to put two others in Ace and Peter's makeup and continue on for another 20+ years!!!

[@Thedarkstuff]

No one will ever pay for this nonsense. They just pushed it back a few years. I doubt it ever happens.

[@kathylandis3395]

Dave I totally agree with u.For Gene and Paul not to acknowledge the other guys is bullshit.. the Avatar sucks because now we are stuck with Tommy. KISS ARMY FOREVER🤟🏻🤟🏻🤟🏻🤟🏻🤟🏻

[@Thedarkstuff]

Very disappointing ending to such a great band.

[@mattskustomkreations]

Tommy has a face like a shovel.

[@johnpatterson4272]

The KISS PPV was a great show. The lagging happened at the beginning of the show where the audio was out-of-sync with the video. Agreed, the hosts were weak paid shills, not KISS fans nor knowing of the KISS legacy, it was background drivel. The best, most revealing part of the PPV came at the end with the after-show interviews with some of the key players. Gene in retrospective, and Tommy whom wanted to be remembered. Shannon Tweed offered the BEST insight into the 'business plan' behind not including original members in the final show. The 90s AI avatar garbage was anti-climactic for the KISS Army for their decades of devotion.

[@Thedarkstuff]

I tuned out when Gene started talking about schmekel and his kidney stones.

[@martinone9]

The reason there wasn’t a reunion on this last tour or even an encore with the original members was because of Paul. It’s well known within the KISS circle that Paul calls all the shots,not Gene as some might believe.

[@Thedarkstuff]

It's been that way since the mid 80s

[@tomstewartdrums]

My first KISS show was Dec 1977 in Phila, and my last one was 2008 in Phila….with probably 60 in between. Been a fan for 48 of my 54 years alive…but I pretty much checked out of seeing them live when they dressed up Eric and Tommy in the make up. I held out hope that they would do the right thing….the ONLY thing really, and figure out a way to have Ace and Peter there at the last show….4 encore songs…Beth, Shock Me, Black Diamond, RNR All Nite….maybe have Bruce come out for HOF, etc. I didn’t buy tickets as soon as they went on sale because I wanted confirmation it would happen….Gene kept saying they were all welcome to show up, and I feel bad for people who laid out tons of money or flew here from other countries in hopes this last show would be special and a reunion would happen….based on the carrot Gene dangled. I held out, and as soon as Paul made that PISS comment on Stern, I knew I made the right decision because that put the final nail in the coffin. And as if it’s not bad enough that no former members were there, they weren’t even acknowledged. It’s like Eric Carr never existed. No mention of Bill Aucoin? Sean Delaney? Even Doc McGee? No speech….I mean, it’s absurd. Same show they’ve been doing for 5 years. This is how you honor and wrap up a 50 year career? EPIC FAIL. Missed opportunity. And the avatar thing is ridiculous IMO. Immortal? You live on forever through the incredible catalog of albums you’ve released that will live on beyond you…. Just like The Beatles, Hendrix, Elvis and Eddie VH…. that’s how you’re immortal, not via some AI cartoon video game simulation with canned music. As a one time thing, sure, why not. But this idea that it’s a new beginning is ludicrous IMO. Just keep releasing the deluxe box sets, old concerts and off the soundboards, and maybe some cool coffee table picture books of each tour etc. I’m very disappointed that they totally dropped the ball on this. Could you imagine what MSG would have been like if when that piano rose up out of the stage Peter was sitting there on his stool instead and he did Beth? The place would have gone mental. THAT’S how u make grown men cry.

[@bassislife-trh]

I was at that Philly show in '77 too. My first concert ever! I saw them again at Tower Theater in Philly for Lick It Up tour and my last was in Columbus Ohio for their first farewell tour. I had no desire to see the KISS Kover Band.

[@Thedarkstuff]

We are in near total agreement

[@JayRee1993]

It would've been that easy, actually. Ace asked for a quarter million, he wasn't showing up.

[@Playitstraight44]

I was going to buy the PPV just to remotely share in the moment with other fans even though I have not seen the band since their original (and measurably better ) Farewell in 2000. But when I found people streaming the first concert at MSG online the night before, it became a moot point to invest the money since the show looked canned and all I wanted from the finale was to see what the "surprise" was. Boy was THAT underwhelming as hell. Regarding your PPV purchase I understand you have one playback option included, but the Beth portion is cut out, so the jabs at the originals continue to be blatant and in bad taste. Watching this near parody of themselves as a final show really put that last nail in the coffin for me regarding any interest in checking on them anymore. It was very self-serving, very childish, and very much a Paul Stanley celebration for himself. He looked high and delusional in thinking it was all about him. And he gave a performance that looked like an old guy playing air guitar in front of a mirror while pretending to sing to a record. He could not have looked more self-absorbed and ridiculous all at the same time. The term Narcissism has a new poster child to represent it. Sadly Paul Stanley is once again drinking his own Kool-aid. When I hear the band or the blind followers talk about "accomplishment", I really have to call them to the mat. Over a 50 year span this band only spent 20 of it actively making records on a regular basis. They then spent the last 30 years playing nostalgia shows celebrating the first ten of those years, while trying to revise how new generations perceive those first ten years. So to see a final concert that was supposed to celebrate and honor THOSE years, and they only recognize themselves (along with two cosplayers who had nothing to do with it), is embarrassing and a joke. Paul Stanley always has a funny line I like to mock. He says, " We couldn't have started this without them, but we couldn't be here today with them." What the eye test shows is , " We couldn't have started this without them, so we have to pretend like they're still here." The band that went into the Rock n Roll Hall of Fame were the original four. The act that has been on the road for decades pretending to be that band is not recognized because they've accomplished NOTHING and contributed nothing to that legacy. So the "accomplishment" goes to the original four. And just like Stanley can not separate himself from the two men he hates most, history and the halls of achievement will ALWAYS see those two men as equal contributors, despite his efforts to expel them. The more he tries, the better they look. And Avatar KISS? RMFAO! Good luck selling that dated looking product.

[@BobWilcox-gd3tt]

100% on all accounts

[@Thedarkstuff]

Well said.

[@psxx]

Saw them first live in 1980 and watched a video of the last show here on youtube. And to say it with Meat Loaf: You took the words of my mouth ... we saw a small end to a great story 😞

[@Thedarkstuff]

Well said. A small end to a great story...

[@user-yo8rw6wr6r]

Ive seen Kiss in the late 70's and in the 80s. I was at the final 2 shows and the hype was much better than the shows. Sure, Like always the stage show was great but other than that, I thought it sucked. And yes, I paid attention to many things because of all the things I heard prior and Paul and Gene most definitely had some trickery going on with their voices. Almost sounded like they were singing over and album. I noticed I couldn't really tell with some of the videos on you tube but definitely in person. Yes, I understand that time changes voices but this was just as bad as Bon Jovis voice last year. Ughhh and The Avatars? A joke. Sort of took the luster away knowing Kiss went from a Rock and Roll band to a commerical to sell products.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Agreed. I won't be seeing Avatar Kiss.

[@cancelbubble6535]

I always figured they would pass the band on to new characters who would carry on as Kiss even though they'd just be "on the payroll" with Gene and Paul still running the show.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Avatars don't complain or ask for more money.

[@nighthawk1428]

I live in Detroit and remember the absolute mayhem whenever KISS played Cobo, even before Alive was recorded. Always sold out so I never got tickets, but Cobo was the most amazing arena. Replicating that amazing energy is not possible, and if KISS truly thinks that avatars, or even human replacements, can take their place, they are sadly mistaken.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Hard to know if they actually believe it, or are just always in promo mode. Never seen a show at Cobo; but when I was in Detroit to see them in '96 at Tiger Stadium, my friend and I walked by Cobo and Kiss was rehearsing there. Couldn't see anything, but I could definitely hear it.

[@Rock4UNow]

There's a Whole Market out there that draws thousands of people at one venue to see someone not even singing or playing an instrument. The new generation doesn't care about that stuff.

[@Thedarkstuff]

I hope that's not the case.

[@Rock4UNow]

@@Thedarkstuff I wouldn't have believed it if I didn't see it. Some guy was up there acting like he was controlling two CD -Rom turntables and this jammed packed venue was praising him like he was an actual musician.

[@David-ne6cd]

I saw Kiss in 87, 96, and 98. It was a dream fulfilled seeing them on the reunion tour in 96 at MSG. I've been a fan since 1976. Nothing will ever come close to the original line up and the magic they had and what they created. I think it's disgraceful and a slap in the face to every old school fan not to acknowledge the line up that made them famous and rich ! I will keep my memories of the MSG show in 96. I'll still listen to the records but Kiss became a joke 20 years ago.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Just keep listening to those original albums and watching the old videos. That was Kiss. Avatar/cartoon Kiss will flop and be quickly forgotten.

[@TwistedSMF]

My impression I am getting? It is the "AI" stuff. We may still have songs written by Gene and Paul, And we will get the computer-enhanced version of them singing the songs. As for the avatar shit? Yeah, I agree. I have really no desire to watch that shit on a giant IMAX screen or some horseshit like that. Or even if they do Holograms of them. They tried that with Ronnie James Dio, and it did not feel the same as the real deal. I am more open to the songs, tho. I can give those a try. Tommy said the best. This show was about Gene and Paul and what they did for Kiss. The sad part is what most have been saying. It should have been a celebration with all of Kiss, not all about Gene and Paul. The biggest snub to me was with Bruce Kulick and Eric Carr. People are giving Paul shit about his voice. It is what it is. I would have more respect for Paul just giving all he's got rather than mimicking a voice track. His voice has been gone for over 10 years now (more/less.)

[@Thedarkstuff]

KISS has been snubbing Eric Carr for more than 30 years at this point.

[@NilsKarczewski-pq2rv]

Thank God, it's over! This came down to a mercy- killing!

[@Thedarkstuff]

Ouch!

[@mr.c8033]

GREAT job on the review. Excellent.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Thanks.

[@pasqualedaddario8302]

I totally agree with you! In my opinion they should have stopped 1997 after the kiss reunion tour! Another note I didn’t like when Tommy Thrayer shot rockets that was clearly Ace’s gig! To top it off not a mention about the other guys who started it all is wrong. But over all it was a good concert better then I thought it would be. Also this new avatar thing is a joke WHY?!

[@Thedarkstuff]

Tommy has been doing Ace's rocket thing for years. I'm just glad they didn't have him sing "Shock Me" at the final show.

[@pasqualedaddario8302]

@@Thedarkstuff I understand that but he’s simply copying everything that Ace had done ! My opinion he should at least do his own original thing not copying

[@Thedarkstuff]

@@pasqualedaddario8302 his entire job is to copy Ace Frehley

[@officespace7777]

To be fair... It usually takes weeks to get over the flu. And Paul had to go back to work 4 days after having it.🤔 Paul was probably filled with meds just to get through the show. Also catching the flu at 70 is a lot different than catching the flu at 23. It can be downright fatal in your 70s.😢

[@Thedarkstuff]

I don't disagree, but his voice has been problematic for a decade - flu or not. But what it says to me is they should have retired before it got to that point.

[@MarYSolPopFestival]

THANK YOU! Great video!

[@Thedarkstuff]

Appreciate you watching. Thanks!

[@AlmostReady504]

You hit the nail on the head. You "don't understand".. who really does except them? Avatar Gene looks like the Gene of today. Eric and Tommy actually look like a hybrid and Paul looks like the Paul from tribute band "Mr Speed" If the Avatar idea can capture KISS using "AI" at their pinnacle of youth, excitement, physicality and voice it could be a good thing. Poor Paul has BEEN shot and they've stood there like statues for years. Mick is right 🎶"what a drag it is getting old" It's either THIS or milk some sort of television show where they do a worldwide search for their individual replacements. "The Next Kiss" . Then license all KISS tribute bands Either way they will be in control $$. If this ends up being lame be thankful we have the footage from the mid-70s my favorite era when I first saw them live and there was absolutely nothing like them. Many of us are closer to the end than the beginning ... it's been a hell of a ride

[@Thedarkstuff]

Thanks for your thoughts. I'd much rather see Kiss release more footage - which they definitely have - from the earliest of early days. That's all I want from Kiss at this point.

[@stephencraig7130]

Thanks for your opinion. My opinion is that KISS can't please everyone. They're not perfect by any stretch of the imagination. Who's going to know or even want to know you when you're 70? I'm just saying that they've been going strong all this time. Changes throughout the years, and they're still together. When a football team wins the Superbowl, you don't hear anything of past members...right? The fans don't own KISS. They've made their mark in the world, and it's my opinion that they will still be around way after you, myself, and all of our opinions opinions have left this earth!!! Peace.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Thanks for sharing.

[@metalheadbill]

Thank you for calling out the elephant in the room, Paul's voice was horrendous. I saw the Baltimore show a few days earlier and his voice was bad, but I think the MSG show was worse. That said, I had a great time and was glad that I went. However, I am also glad that I didn't go to the MSG shows because there was nothing different about them than any other show on the tour. The pay-per-view was glitchy as hell for us. We had to refresh it constantly because it kept freezing. The Avatars are stupid as hell, I'm not buying it. Disappointing is right.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Interesting note about Baltimore. I'm truly shocked the band did nothing special for the final show. Almost more shocked that so many people are defending that move.

[@stephengurr8365]

I agree 💯 percent with everything you said. Fan since 1976 when I was five years old. Saw em five times but none since 2000. I was happy to pay $40 for the PPV and I thought the production, as far as camera work and sound, was excellent. The show was not terrific. The only song I really got excited about was Deuce, maybe because Gene wasn’t lip-syncing. Paul’s lip-syncing was obvious and sad. They definitely should have recognized the other band mates. The whole avatar thing was lame, and as you said, the cover song also lame. This show was evidence that it was time to retire.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Their time to retire was 2000.

[@stephengurr8365]

@@Thedarkstuff Exactly.

[@waynebarczynski3310]

Great insite. Totally agree with you!

[@Thedarkstuff]

Right on. Thanks.

[@Lisztomania1]

KISS is still one of favorites ..... classic

[@Thedarkstuff]

Kiss 1973-2000 forever!

[@20yearsofblueskies]

three sides are kiss nut huggers--this was a very fair review--i was disappointed they didnt acknowledge former members too and pauls voice has been shot for years now

[@Thedarkstuff]

Thanks!!!

[@Saber808]

They are the biggest ass kissers ever

[@John-kw3nd]

Well said

[@Thedarkstuff]

Thank you for that and thanks for watching

[@doctorkayak]

Agreed 100%

[@Thedarkstuff]

Thank you!

[@garnetknight]

Abner Devereaux finally got his clones after 50 yrs!! 😂😂

[@Thedarkstuff]

I assume you saw Abner in the thumbnail for this video.

[@rmmccarthy1240]

Thanks, darkstuff for speaking truth. And congratulations to all iterations of Kiss on a well earned retirement.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Thanks!

[@rmmccarthy1240]

@@Thedarkstuff you bet🤘

[@jfoquendo]

Well done dude

[@Thedarkstuff]

Thanks!

[@josephfarr2988]

I've always thought KISS best songs are the deep cuts. Mainline, Room Service, for example.

[@Thedarkstuff]

True, and usually the case for almost any band. The singles are rarely the best songs.

[@josephfarr2988]

I agree

[@chrisbohner1092]

They should have acknowleged all members of Kiss plus Bill Aucoin and Neil Bogart Sean Delaney and Doc Mcgee...

[@Thedarkstuff]

No excuse for not mentioning Ace and Peter, at least

[@sylviamak2497]

I totally agree about the avatars kiss which is so unrealistic! And yes l certainly won't pay to go and see those avatars stuff!! Not worth it!!

[@Thedarkstuff]

It's crazy. Thanks for watching and commenting.

[@paulthomasbranda7591]

YOU ARE DEFINETLY ENTITLED TO YOUR OPINION, DUDE❤

[@Thedarkstuff]

I didn’t know that was in dispute 😆

[@JayRee1993]

Great video.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Thanks so much

[@Blueagle8u]

A lot of us at the last show,missed out on the free 24k gold plated “ golden ticket “ collectibles for the fans on the way out! VERY disappointed! And I was at their first show there too! Poorly distributed

[@Thedarkstuff]

I've heard there were only 1000, yet there were 15-20K at the show? Weird.

[@ukiahsguitarsolos3436]

Everything you said is fair. Good video.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Thanks so much. Appreciate you watching and commenting.

[@ernestoescamilla8894]

Man its just a super bummer that Ace & Peter were not invited to the finally show. I mean it hurts' it really really hurts n I'm so PISSED at KISS but in reality I heard that Gene Simmons felt bad that the original members would not appear. So it all points to Paul Stanley who apparently has the top power to make decisions n all I got to say to Paul is dude you can barely sing n by bringing in Ace n Peter that would have made up for the whole show but Mr. Paul Stanley what comes around goes around!! But also you would think Gene would step up to the plate n tell Paul hey these guys Ace n Peter deserve to do a few kick ass songs n rock .. an celebrate 1 of the greatest achievements in the history of rockin n roll the original KIZZ MEMBERS🎉 Bless these 2 fellas I got there back Ace Freely & Peter Chris.. love you guys! Paul your a Jerk off!!🤩

[@Thedarkstuff]

🤘🏻🤘🏻🤘🏻

[@SWEETFA24]

I was there my beef is the setlist.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Not sure how they couldn't fit in at least one different song for the last show.

[@waynebarczynski3310]

I thought the same thing about them recording new music and using the avatars to put it that would make more sense to me

[@Thedarkstuff]

The only way it makes sense imo.

[@AdamSmith-km1fn]

I was a fan when i was young, not anymore. I like their first 7 albums and bits and pieces others. I will say this, they know how to get KISS into the new generation.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Well, they did know that. Not sure about their judgment with this avatar thing.

[@johnm2617]

Dude you were spot on ! With the interviews ! How about when he was singing < Instead of talking to the crowd ! Paul < Embarrassing! Gene sang with purpose! Did great ! Thanks

[@Thedarkstuff]

Thanks. Yes, Gene was fine. All of them were fine except for Paul

[@annielanham-vn2ov]

I didn't notice that about pauls avatar until you called it....YOURE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT....the avatars are silly..im an old school fan....just not for me

[@Thedarkstuff]

It seems like an old guy's idea of "what the kids will like"

[@MICKEY4356]

Mr. Speed is a good tribute band.⚡

[@Thedarkstuff]

The singer looks like Avatar Paul Stanley

[@jimmyb267]

Saw then on the reunion tour in '96. They should have hung it up after that.

[@Thedarkstuff]

That or after the "farewell" tour.

[@m.b.boyack2228]

The word "Jukebox" comes to mind. A totally justified critique.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Appreciate you watching and leaving a comment.

[@31wozza]

wasp had all old band members on the screen for there 40th i see your point on the screen

[@Thedarkstuff]

Exactly. Thanks.

[@sloan12s]

I agree. Paul looks odd. I am positive they are going to re-render Paul. They may have run out of time on rendering before the concert.

[@Thedarkstuff]

It's weird that he's the only one that doesn't actually look like the avatar.

[@neildonnelly5029]

Im a long time kiss fan from 74. They really needed to end this a long time ago.

[@Thedarkstuff]

The farewell tour in 99-00 should have been the end.

[@nathanonearth]

I was there - the concert was amazing... Historic and the energy in the room was magical - so fun!!! Love the ai idea - the cool thing with it is the graphics can evolve as the technology evolves and all bands are going to end up like this. At some point. They’re kind of ahead of the curve and they’re gonna be able to control how it goes. It’s kinda like when Prince in the 90s said he’s going to sell music online and everybody laughed at him. Great stuff!

[@Thedarkstuff]

We shall see.

[@mr.c8033]

Tens bucks says they do a Vegas residency.

[@Thedarkstuff]

As avatars or real people? That's the question.

[@marciacorbin3513]

Thank you for saying what everyone else is thinking! I am with you about the New digital ere kiss who in there right mind wants to pay to see avatar's singing kiss songs it makes no sense. I guess they are just trying to squeeze every last penny they can it is just sad.

[@Thedarkstuff]

It's even more obvious now than it was a few months ago. I wouldn't be surprised if the entire avatar thing has already been abandoned.

[@savedtwice7925]

I personally don't think Paul Stanleys voice wasn't there because he was sick & it hadn't recovered . I saw Kiss live in Vancouver BC Canada Nov 8 /2023 way before Paul got sick and one of the first things I noticed was how Paul's voice just seemed to be done . I understand that in your 70s nobody can still perform as they did in they're 40s . Gene & Paul keep saying they wanted to go out now while they were on top . Lets be completely honest here , them being on top was 15 - 20 years ago . Not now ... they can hardly move around the stage anymore . Regardless I love Kiss and it was great to see them for the last time . Thanx for the memories guyz !

[@Thedarkstuff]

You’re right. I was being generous to Paul’s voice. Looking back, the reunion tour should have also been the end of Kiss.

[@savedtwice7925]

Yes ! You are absolutely correct there . Love the band but they were on top along time ago ... not now . Sad but true@@Thedarkstuff

[@Saber808]

So you saw Scabkiss

[@ELPADREAIRBRUSH]

They should have done FIREHOUSE !!

[@Thedarkstuff]

Agreed.

[@naithngr81-jh2bb]

3:25 they should have given at least 20 seconds to acknowledge all of the members of the band: Mark St. John, Eric Carr, Bruce Kulick, Vinnie Vincent, Peter Criss and Ace Frehley. Some people were wondering before the show if they were going to at least give the previous members a quick mention even if everyone knew none of the living members (not even Bruce, who seems to have the least issues) would even show up in the audience let alone appear on stage.

[@ELPADREAIRBRUSH]

@@naithngr81-jh2bb like dark said show their pics on the screen behind them people kept chanting ACE &PETER !! And Tommy heard us and just shook his head in disgust ! They’re were hundreds if not the whole pit chanting it !

[@MICKEY4356]

Tommy could have talked to the fans between songs. ⚡⚡

[@Thedarkstuff]

I wouldn't have wanted to hear that. Gene, maybe, but not Tommy.

[@allendean9807]

I’m just happy i saw the real farewell tour- twice. Oakland, California, and Wheatland, California. When i was 12 years old, 1979, Kiss was first concert ever, at the cow palace. San Francisco California. Amazing show. Saw them again 1996- 6th show of the reunion tour, Dallas Texas, and again the next year on Oklahoma City, Oklahoma. Then saw the psycho circus tour in Oakland, California. The last show i saw, in Wheatland, Pete was struggling. Ace forgetting his solos. Paul only played in spurts, preferring to dance and shake his ass. Simmons, so hoarse, he could barely sing. I thought, “this is good. It’s a good time to end this. They’ve made a ton of money over the last 4 years….” No. Nope, not enough for Simmons… 360,000,000.00, and not enough. I’m glad it’s over. And I’ll enjoy watching their video game characters crash and burn. The world moves on. Retire. You’ve got enough, Simmons. Stanley has about ⅔ of your wealth. He’s set, too. His great, great grandkids are set. Enjoy being retired rock stars…..

[@Thedarkstuff]

Loved the reunion tours, but yeah, by the "farewell" tour Peter was struggling and Ace was bored. But it was actually Kiss. They should have actually said farewell in 2000.

[@mcpeko5773]

AI and Kiss will make new record together I think! 🤩

[@Thedarkstuff]

Doubt it

[@andrewjohnson3238]

I want new music and new albums to tour from. I’ll go see the avatar show out of curiosity

[@Thedarkstuff]

Without new music, the avatar show is just cartoons pretending to play songs you've already heard a million times.

[@TimObert]

I enjoyed hearing the interview with Nick as I think he is hilarious, otherwise the thing with Tommy's daughter was awkward. The interview with Eric and Tommy was meh except for Eric going out of his way to give credit to Ace and Peter (but Eric has always acknowledged them). I saw KISS in '96-97 and then again for the Psycho Circus tour with my wife, and she had a hard time listening to Paul during this last show. I was hoping the band was going to at least thank the former members, and it's too bad they didn't.

[@Thedarkstuff]

I have no issues with Nick. He seems ok. I just didn't understand interviewing them, but having no time to mention Eric Carr.

[@seancurran3603]

Avatar Kiss is nothing more than a more expensive version of The Elder; and the results will be the same.

[@Thedarkstuff]

I would have said Kiss Meet the Phantom, but I think we're on the same page.

[@Mountaindewcheeseburger12]

What if its not AI but replacing paul. Looking at the avatar’s that might be the play.

[@Thedarkstuff]

That is weird, right? They all look exactly like the "real" guy, except for Paul??

[@Mountaindewcheeseburger12]

@@Thedarkstuff exactly when you pointed that out in the video and how they are insistent on using names like star child and the demon. i bet gene replaces paul and does more shows. Probably on a smaller scale but mid size areas or doing the larger casino/state fair circuit

[@lassel1644]

I agree 100% let another band put on the costumes instead

[@Thedarkstuff]

anything other than a cartoon playing Kiss songs - and probably not the original versions of the songs either.

[@Paneeks1960]

I don't know what to make of all of this. ABBA is having a very successful time with their avatar tour. So who knows? Maybe it will keep Kiss young forever. I could name 20 bands that I would have liked to see on some kind of avatar show. Yes it is not the real deal. But if it is planned right. It may be a nice take-in for one night celebrating the bands that you love. Thanks D~ Rob/Boston

[@Thedarkstuff]

I'm not buying into this whole avatar concept. They should work on enhancing old video footage and bringing it up to modern standards. I'd rather see that kind of stuff than cartoons. And if a band is too old to keep playing live...fine. Just retire. People should move on to younger bands who can still perform. It's okay.

[@WilliamCurry-bh3dk]

im not down with pre recorded that aint playing

[@Thedarkstuff]

🤘🏻

[@kevinsnipp4998]

To be fair that's got to be rough for a Singer to start losing their voice.. and then stay at the party to long just trying over and over... A guitar and bass player can keep on going and drummers usually keep up.. once that voice is done it's done

[@Thedarkstuff]

It's true. But, in my opinion, they should have said farewell after the farewell tour. Paul's voice was great back then.

[@edmakatu]

The Kiss Kruise 2024 will be announced soon and a residency at the Las Vegas Sphere is being planned

[@Thedarkstuff]

I won't be going unless Paul gets a throat transplant.

[@charlesscott9439]

I think it's ridiculous. I liked kiss when they were a band. They lied for three years about this being the final tour. Now say they're continuing. The Avatar thing is stupid and will be a failure.

[@Thedarkstuff]

The avatar thing will quietly fade away. Just like Gene Simmons Tongue magazine

[@AfterSchoolReviews]

I like the tommy and Paul. I thigh we were gonna get watching you but then it was dr love. I was being misled. Still love relive but I was being lead into we are watching you. Still good no doubt. But yeah definitely missed a thanking of all the other guys. And a different song. Still good but odd in ways. Avatar kiss cool maybe. Tribute bands are badass and more real. Avatars look like MCFARLANE psycho cicuis

[@Thedarkstuff]

I'm cool with tribute bands. They are actual people, playing instruments. I won't watch a cartoon.

[@mikesyria1787]

They own Ace and Peters image. They would dress any one up in their image

[@Thedarkstuff]

They do; but they can't put just anyone in that makeup and make me like it.

[@MCastleberry1980]

I thought for sure we'd get some official Kiss tribute act or something so at least its live music, but instead they looked at the cluster fuck of Metaverse Ozzfest and were like "How can we get in on THAT?"

[@Thedarkstuff]

I'd actually pay to see a band with Evan Stanley and Nick Simmons doing KISS. Short of that...good riddance.

[@KeithStLouis-yv3bd]

I can't be the only one noticing that the avatars of Tommy and Eric, look like Tommy and Eric, but the avatars of Gene and Paul DON'T look like Gene and Paul, comical lol

[@Thedarkstuff]

It's probably because they wanted the computer to make them look younger. Ship has sailed.

[@carminemodestinomarrano6658]

Its sad to Say but thanks God Its over....

[@Thedarkstuff]

Amen

[@user-vp4te2bs3w]

Kiss never said that they weren't going to make new music. They are just not going to Tour anymore.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Paul said more than 10 years ago that there was no point to making new Kiss records.

[@Nickelback2004]

Hey Man.. There was a lot that I agree with with what you had to say... The Whole KISS Computer idea is lame... the Paul Stanley Avatar doesn't even look like Paul... & Looks like he wearing a wig... I find Gene's Avatar is not that accurate either! I find his cheeks & even the Jaw line is Off! The Avatars for Tommy & Eric do look bang on... However I am not into the Avatar thing at all... & I speak from my heart, I've been a Die hard fan since I was 5 years old... I've been a fan 44 years now... & I am all about the real deal.. and that goes for any other band that I listen too.. If others choose to follow this Avatar idea, that is their own choice. I will always love this band, but following an Avatar Live concert Experience I just can't!

[@Thedarkstuff]

I’m with you. No Avatar Kiss. I’ll watch old videos from the 70s.

[@marcusharley3064]

Kiss is a brand name, they could literally find look a likes, and continue making shows. Yes there are those that are devoted to nostalgia part of Kiss. But a lot of us, would go see a show with Kiss look a likes. It will still be the genuine Kiss music, just lip singing by look a likes.

[@Thedarkstuff]

I saw KISS in the 80s, 90s, and even the 2000s. No interest in seeing lip syncing cartoons.

[@mattskustomkreations]

I will only see Avatar KISS if they digitize Black Ace.

[@Thedarkstuff]

That is my favorite comment by far!

[@mattskustomkreations]

@@Thedarkstuff Haha! Awesome! I dug your review btw.

[@tomstewartdrums]

😂😂😂😂

[@jeffmcpeek2526]

Yeah, I don't get it either.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Thanks.

[@saulhudson302]

While Paul Stanley was talking or shouting something at the crowd his voice sounded horrible though when they played he was singing good which wasn't him. Detroit Rock City, listen to the difference between 1 verse and the rest.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Right.

[@wussupitsmeyaboi1210]

I was there.. I thought they did.. good.. though yea, whenever Paul was talking, he sounded like he might've had a cold or something. It would've been icing on the cake if every prior band member, sadly not Eric Carr.. was performing.. think of it as the lineup for the MTV Unplugged but with electric guitars.

[@Thedarkstuff]

What bothers me the most is that there seems to be near unanimity among fans that acknowledging the former members was something they wanted to see at the final show. Yet, it will be spun at some time that it was "for the fans" that they did nothing.

[@wussupitsmeyaboi1210]

@Thedarkstuff that day I was thinking to myself "Ace better be there" and I was let down

[@Saber808]

So you saw Scabkiss.

[@wussupitsmeyaboi1210]

@Saber808 well it was KISS maybe not the lineup I'd hope for but they did well.

[@rrkpo]

I was lucky enough to be at the last show and it was a blast absolutely brilliant. Thanking everyone who had ever been in the group would have been tacky, considering some of them are deceased. As for the Avatars, you've really missed the point if you're the KISS fan you say you are. It's a way to continue to make money and to be honest why the f**k not. They tried with 3D and got slagged of for it, they took their make up off and got slagged off for that. Okay Avatars are not for me but there were plenty of younger people at the show who thought this was a brilliant idea. Older KISS fans will slag it off, but if it works why not. For me KISS ended on the 2nd December at the right time, for others it just the end of chapter 1

[@Thedarkstuff]

"Thanking everyone who had ever been in the group would have been tacky, considering some of them are deceased" - WTF are you talking about?! You've never heard of an "In Memoriam" dedication? Wow. And if that was tacky, as you say, then what about acknowledging the non-tacky living people like Ace or Bruce Kulick? Regarding the avatars, what the hell does padding Gene and Paul's pockets have to do with being a Kiss fan? What are you, 12?! When was your first show, 2018? At least you acknowledge that Kiss ended on December 2. On that we can agree.

[@stevelukac6614]

You are right as a kiss fan I have to say that Gene and Paul really screwed up Paul said what ever kiss fans want they do it well Gene and Paul you should of had Peter Ace Vinny and Bruce on stage and Paul you say that the current members can’t sing well you sound like shit

[@Thedarkstuff]

The whole thing was a major disappointment

[@johnyoungsman7752]

I agree with your take, and I DEFINITELY don't get the AI KISS thing. I feel like it falls flat, seems extremely dated, and to be honest, the avatars are extremely underwhelming, in my opinion. They feel very 1995-ish to me, and it seems Paul & Gene are hanging their hats on this premise, and it misses the mark! I know they have seen the success of the ABBA-tars show thingy they do in England, and Bjorn from ABBA is involved in the company that did the KISS avatars. I don't see this being successful in the same way, unless it's a Vegas attraction or something. Very disappointing limping to the finish line of a band that deserved to go out with a mighty roar.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Remember Gene Simmons Tongue magazine? Yeah...that's how we'll view avatar Kiss in a year.

[@hellasrockriffs6347]

Whatever happened to retiring gracefully...

[@Thedarkstuff]

That's so 20th century

[@keithnorton5849]

Avatar Kiss won't be complete without avatar versions of fake Peter Criss and Phil Donahue.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Fake Peter Criss has been denied his place in Kisstory. It's just wrong.

[@greggjohnson3835]

They have some good songs. They have always been a live act to see. They finished a few years late in my opinion. They are done.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Best band in the world from 1973-1978.

[@chrisbohner1092]

And forget about this Avatar stuff...its not Kiss.

[@Thedarkstuff]

agreed

[@xDIAMONDDOGx579]

Its funny, all the actors strike was going on, backlash on A.I.'s replacing actors and some how KISS thinks this is a good idea. I would of liked it if they got younger guys to replace them.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Sometimes bands just end. It happens.

[@joeshmoe9720]

It's working for ABBA,they make 2mill a week using CGI avatar shows.I think They saw that and think it will work for them.

[@Thedarkstuff]

Abba didn’t play instruments. Their fans have different expectations

[@tomstewartdrums]

ABBA hasn’t played a live show since I think 1980? They’ve lived basically as recluses ever since, So their fans were starved for anything. They also BUILT a special arena just for it….equipped with technology that enables them to do stuff u can’t do in a touring situation. And ABBA was huge in Europe, and that’s where they have the arena. I guarantee it wouldn’t be as successful here in the states. Plus it’s pop, people are ok with going and seeing them singing and dancing to tracks, and it will satisfy people who are going to experience a “live” ABBA show because most people probably never saw them in the 70s….they hardly toured. KISS is a completely different animal.

[@joeshmoe9720]

Understood but Gene & Paul see potential off what ABBA has done with their avatar shows apparently and the tech keeps advancing.We'll have to wait and see what the future brings. Will it not go over here? We can't predict that for sure.@@tomstewartdrums