The gun matters, mixing it up with the comments

[@dougr5330]

Its not the gun boss, its you. Do better

[@UrbanDefenseSystems]

I'm autistic, can anyone tell me if this was said tongue in cheek?

[@dougr5330]

@UrbanDefenseSystems was meant for the reader, not Ben. Just saying that most shooters can't out perform the capabilities of their gun. If you want to improve, train and practice. A Staccato isn't going to make you an instant pro shooter.

[@UrbanDefenseSystems]

@@dougr5330 I don't disagree with that.

[@CptHamYolo]

If you’re a bad shooter , stacatto will make you a better shooter ON THE STACATTO. If you’re a good shooter on a Glock, you’ll be a good shooter on a stacatto.

[@BenStoeger187]

Yes

[@darklyripley6138]

Which is why a lot of people are able to go from revolvers or DA/SA’s to Glocks/striker fire guns really easily. They started on guns that require solid fundamentals.

[@Digitally007]

2 types of people go to the range … one of them are gay

[@scottrousseau297]

"If you can dodge a wrench, you can dodge a ball." - Patches

[@Spac3Monkey]

Ben being into miatas is the most on brand thing imaginable

[@LiorIPSC]

Dear Ben, you're doing a credit to the shooting community by standing behind and defending your every remark and making things easy for everyone to understand. For me, this is pure gold! Watching your content is more often than not time extremely well spent. Here endeth the leghump.

[@coltsandbows]

You hit the nail on the head. My buddy got a Glock with a compensator because he has a poor grip. He is about 5’11” and weighs 215. I’m 5’4” and weigh 150 and I refuse to get a compensator, preferring instead to develop an effective grip. Two years later I am miles ahead of him in skill development and he has the same grip as before.

[@Kylef7735]

The compensator didn't make him suck. He would still suck just as much if you traded guns. Just like you'd still be miles better if you had the comp.

[@carlb86]

@@Kylef7735 I believe he's agreeing with your sentiment. Just pointing out the buddy opted to go with a gear improvement as the crutch.

[@krishall3187]

As a new shooter I agree with ben here. Training is the most important in the long run.

[@BigChavezChavez]

Interesting enough, I started off on striker guns and am a B class shooter with it and I got a staccato for something different and it’s really been an insightful way to access my fundamentals. I’ve felt like I have a much better understanding on how to shoot better now as a result of getting a “nicer” gun. Due to the xc being flat and soft shooting it really does expose your weak points imo due to it removing variables. As a result, I’ve learned more as to what I do wrong, can assess my targets better, and it’s forced me to get better to run the gun effectively.

[@chap23305]

I find the "better" the pistol, the more I revert back to old bad habits. Whereas if I shoot my Glocks, it forces me to drill the fundamental principles more, resulting in me becoming a better shooter.

[@shiftd_1114]

100% - "it's the archer not the arrow"

[@macfolkers1774]

I've said it recently that better guns are simply more forgiving of any deficiencies you may have.

[@chriskoch1145]

90% skills 10% gun

[@attakmint]

I shoot Open (I just think it's fun), and I 100% agree with something you said about how you need to push yourself harder because your gear is more capable. There have been quite a few CO guys I squad with who are surprised I wasn't classified higher. They see me shoot, and I'm able to easily do things in Open that are difficult in CO. But I have Major scoring, big stick magazines, a giant magwell, a nice SA only trigger, a fixed dot, and a giant compensator and popples to keep my gun flatter. The ceiling for possible performance is higher, so I need to push to have faster splits, faster transitions, and tighter accuracy at distance to keep up with the rest of the Open competitors. That was one of the things I noticed when I switched from CO - the mindset is that I need to go faster and shoot more aggressively in Open than my old CO pace.

[@crackshot-tv]

Ben you've changed my views on this quite a bit. I shot a practice match last week at the local range. I finished 9 out of 10. There are some good shooters in our club. I'm not the best, but I usually finish in the top half. Could I have finished higher doing the techniques I was using before (e.g. riding the reset, shooting slow, etc). Yes. But being a practice match I decided to really go all in on pushing speed. My shots opened up a bit and I hit a few of the no shoots on the tighter targets, all of them an inch from the edge. Not being used to calling my shots going fast like that, I also didn't follow up, so I took about 5 or 6 double penalties (no shoot plus mike) that night and the penalties quickly tanked my score. Had I not hit the no shoots, I would have been top 3. All of it is correctable and I know where I need to improve. I really need to tighten things up at higher speeds, so I'm working on correcting it before the next practice match next month. I'll be shooting at the level I was at earlier, but faster. So getting my ego out of the way, and being okay with taking a hit to my pride in front of the guys, but pushing myself out of my comfort zone, I think is the key to getting better. I shoot a glock 34, and its tempting to go out and try to get better by buying a stacatto, but the gun can still outshoot me at this point so I don't see a purpose in that.

[@jcoll6518]

I began with a stock combat 70 gov 1911 and had modifications done as I improved. Ultimately building it to a full house Blake Gann race gun. I think i appreciated the mods as my skill level improved. I shot several different types of competitions with this pistol from IPSC to IHMSA to even PPC, i guess you could say we grew up together.

[@slow2by2z]

People are confusing times/scores with being a "better shooter". It's like you said, your skills didn't change instantly by picking up a new platform/ "better gun". Your times may have changed, but that's due to the difference in features. It's not a sudden boost in your skill set. If you want proof, put the "better gun" down and pick the old one back up. If you go from a stock Glock with a dot to something like a comped/heavier gun/lighter trigger 2011, you may well see faster times. That doesn't mean your skills instantly got better. You are now shooting a gun that reduced the strain on your skills/fundamentals required to shoot X score/time. This made it possible to shoot the better times/better scores at your given limit of ability because some of those features on the racier gun absorbed some of the flaws in your shooting. If you had practiced hard with the Glock you will likely be able to achieve similar times eventually via recognizing your flaws and focusing on them. I'm guessing there would be some limit to this but a vast majority of shooters would never realize that limit. If you aren't a competitive type shooter but more of a "X time is good enough" shooter, maybe this would appeal to you. Someone looking to continually push their skills/abilities isn't going to be satisfied. Personally, I'm trying to practice fundamentals on multiple platforms to maybe learn something different from each and be competent with them in a possible defensive situation as well.

[@Glonk_Respecter]

Great insights Ben. I’ve pretty much always shot Glocks, including the last year that I’ve actually been training productively and shooting USPSA. I’m one classifier from A class, and I’ve never thought the gear was standing between me and the classification I want, the solution for me has always been skill development. I’ve always told myself when I hit M maybe I’ll experiment with different guns, but I’m sure my perspective will change by then so who knows.

[@JofoTubin]

It's more fun to drive a slow car fast than drive a fast car slow.

[@BenStoeger187]

I’m with you

[@Rubeless]

Unless you are highly skilled in driving.

[@Fonzypaintball212]

Does this mean the Glock is a the Miata of practical shooting? (Just got to that part of the video lmao)

[@blantant]

200% for motorcycles

[@lordhellfire153]

​@HWG-wm8ld I guarantee you Max Verstappen would still love to drive a Miata.

[@turkeyfish26]

Really enjoying these longer format videos

[@ColePetersen-t5m]

I noticed that when I trained with my LTT Beretta exclusively, I won the bowling pin match at my local range after taking a 3-month hiatus. That pistol forced me to have the best fundamentals, whereas my S2O allowed me to develop some bad habits. Another thing that helped was I really was forced to master the DA trigger pull, which stopped being a handicap.

[@bryanslittlegarage5724]

Love your videos, I just started shooting uspsa and I am working on my fundamentals that I am learning from you. I am older and trying to do everything right when you are running a stage is definitely harder than shooting the gun itself. ❤❤

[@dropmeA]

I started USPSA late last year and have run Glock, Sig, and 2011s in competition. I started with an XC because the gun was crazy to shoot initially, especially coming from Glocks. However, the Glock is easier with fundamentals because there is little thought, no safety, and you can really focus on not being terrible. Once you learn what it is to go at your highest level, the gun matters enough, but not a crazy amount. I can run a G34 about as fast as I can my Atlas, but the Atlas is easier and therefore I can run it faster. I run both Glock and Atlas routinely, but mainly the Atlas specifically for Limited Optics. Here soon when I focus on Carry Optics, it'll be the opposite.

[@JC-gs3br]

Started out carrying a 229 and my main range gun was a 226. Shooting a couple times a year and just enjoying good old iron sights. This went on for 8ish years. Switched to the 320s 4 years ago and everything felt easier. Added a dot and after some learning, it was way easier. In the last year of shooting my P, I've drastically improved... but, I've been shooting 2-3 times a month, trying to dry fire and going to matches. If I kept using my 320s, I think I'd still be at the same spot. Looking forward to your class on June.

[@audreecherie]

Grateful, it's reassuring to hear this perspective.

[@den_see]

I think my main takeaway here is always ask yourself to do more no matter what gun you use.

[@jerdog333]

2 things: 1. I love how angry great shooters get when a lesser shooter says "you wouldn't be as good with a stock gun." Haha. One B class shooter said that to a M, and the M got so upset, but he didn't show up the next match with a stock Glock 43 with iron sights to prove the other guy wrong. haha. 2. I've been in classes where there were fundamentally better shooters than me but I out shot them on certain drills / most of the class because I had a better set up fot that drill. They were using 1911s with iron sights and I had my Glock 19 with a SRO. They were for sure more skilled than me but red dots help so much with certain drills for the average shooter. Man they were pissed. haha.

[@vesuviateresearches1504]

People sometimes forget why classes and divisions exist, lmao

[@whiteyshark5826]

As a Spec Miata champion here in AZ, i agree.

[@guy2234-v5r]

From my observation, there seems to be "tiers" of mindsets to most people's shooting progression. The 1st mindset "tier" is simply learning the very basics, dedicated shooters move beyond this pretty quickly with semi regular practice, unless they are missing some mental faculties. The 2nd mindset "tier" is being able to shoot slowly and accurately with a high degree of consistency. This really shouldn't take more than a couple months of dedicated practice to reach and move beyond, but all too many shooters spend their lifetime in this mindset. Always shooting slowly to "get your hits" is an easy trap to fall into when one doesn't know better. Until they get exposed to the fact that shooting faster actually improves fundamentals, they get stuck here (sometimes permanently). It also doesn't help that almost every old school instructor reinforces this bad mentality. The last tier has the largest skill ceiling/gulf, but is generally about mastering fundamentals (which are stressed and improved by shooting at speed, doubles, the fun stuff). In my opinion. better equipment only comes into play for "tier 2" mindsets. By the time someone is in the third tier "mindset", they are learning how to make their fundamentals suit the equipment, instead of needing the equipment to suit the fundamentals.

[@the_bukkaking]

You totally missed the point, pay attention to what he's saying at 4:00, there's lot of USPSA competitors that are hot shit at A-zone shooting at under 10, but you give that same shooter a stock pistol and ask him to hit a headbox at 25 with unlimited time, and many simply can't do it. Tier 2 and 3 should hold equal weight. People overdevelop skills that are needed for their specific game and are lacking in skills that don't matter as much. I would say that nowadays a lot of guys new to USPSA bypass tier 2 and skip straight to tier 3 because everyone wanna be the cool guy.

[@guy2234-v5r]

​@@the_bukkaking I didn't miss any point, I shared my observations. From what you are saying, Ben's points got lost in translation for you, and you warped them into the wrong direction. You're getting hung up on semantics and trying to rigidly peg people into one and only one of these "tiers" when they really are just generalist observations on the stages/evolution of a shooter's mindset. It's not "Tier 2 is exclusively slow fire, Tier 3 is all fast fire." Example - one can be in that "third tier" mindset of continually improving fundamentals, while also working on how to get hits at further distances. The key point is they grew beyond the limiting mindset of always shooting slowly to "get your hits in", and never stressing their fundamentals with speed to see where things break down. As I said, most people never break out of this stage. I suggest you watch Ben's numerous videos on doubles drills, they can actually help you quite a bit with fixing issues that cause problems at longer distance as well as up close. Lastly, none of my experience with people who have that "third tier" mindset aligns with your final conclusions. In my experience, that "third tier mindset" person (who usually practices with speed) doesn't specifically struggle with getting hits at distance. Case in point: I just attended an outlaw match last weekend, with a squad ranging from newer shooters to A class members. One of the stages was multiple headbox-only targets at 30 yards, covered by no-shoots. 7/10 of the squad had little to no trouble making those shots. Again, I just don't see your assertions reflecting reality. If someone is just slinging lead at targets but never improving their fundamentals, then by definition they aren't of that final mindset.

[@MrSpotfocus]

@@guy2234-v5r I agree 100%

[@the_bukkaking]

@@guy2234-v5r based on your reply, I am going to go ahead and say that you are making an assumption based on my reply that I am a "slow down and get yer hits" guy, which is not the direction I was taking this. I shoot competitively as well, but I wanted to touch on the point that many younger shooters I see are content to just hose as fast as they can through the close range targets for the nice Instagram replay and collect charlies and deltas on the longer shots. So I respectfully disagree with your assertion that most "3rd tier" shooters have it together, when my experiences show the opposite, I stand by my comments that many undervalue being able to make clean hits on smaller targets. What separates a B-class shooter from an A or master is typically being able to reliably collect points at partial or long shots at a good pace. However the current year gun/internet culture encourages dudes to just go faster.

[@guy2234-v5r]

@@the_bukkaking You glossed over everything I wrote (again) and argued against your own points instead of what I actually said. A "third tier" shooter doesn't have everything down perfect, as I have said multiple times now. They have the mindset of mastering fundamentals, and will use speed to learn where things break down, because speed is the single best tool to expose where fundamentals break down. This applies to both close and far targets equally. Once again, you should watch Ben's videos on doubles drills, they cover this extensively. You're hyper fixating on long distance shots as a pinnacle metric when its actually a pretty small part of the equation. Do people mag dump quickly for Instagram, and not get good hits at matches? Yeah, of course. But, once again, those people fundamentally don't fall into that last mindset "tier" of people who are working hard to improve their fundamentals. I don't know how many different ways I can reiterate this. The. Distance. Is. Irrelevant. What actually sets an A -GM shooter apart is their ability to get points with speed at ANY distance. Long shots are just a very small part of a good skillset, and its far easier learning to shoot at distance than, say, mastering stage planning or handling transitions. But you don't have to take my word for it. You can watch any of these GM's classes online, and see how much of it is dedicated to teaching how to get hits at distance. The answer is almost none, because people who seriously work on their fundamentals already have it down. Its a far easier task than you are making it out to be. The people who don't have it down are not in that "third tier" mindset. I'm A-class, I regularly squad with guys who are A / M, and none of what you are saying tracks. The guys who win at my clubs get Charlies and even Deltas at longer distances. I don't know where you classify, but based off your comments here I would feel comfortable guessing its not highly or consistently. Too much of what you say aligns with what older guys who get stuck in a rut say. I would encourage you to step outside your comfort zone and also go faster, because that is the number one way to diagnose where you need to improve, regardless if you are new or a GM.

[@Veisz0311]

Open shooter here. My third match ever, i jumped right to Open mainly for fun until i started taking it serious and developing my skills. Right now i am currently an Open GM. However, after not touching a production gun for years and zero training, i decided to a shoot CZ P10 irons in the off season and the difference was incredible. Me pushing myself in Open BECAUSE i had a racier gun, translated over to other platforms. Not only was i way faster, but i was more accurate than i ever was with irons. Through that process i learned whats acceptable vs not, not over confirming sights, faster transitions and generally faster visual focus. In other words, pushing the boundaries with a faster easier gun, made me shoot less capable guns alot better. At the end of the day fundamentals are fundamentals but if you suck you suck. A nicer gun will only get you so far unless you take advantage of its capabilities.

[@leftyo9589]

better tools make it easier to build skills, they dont replace it. you got better due to practice, the better equipment just makes it easier to get from point a to b.

[@nopifogo]

Great nuanced conversation. Thanks Ben!

[@RetARMYjohn]

Great pieces of advice all through this video! Please keep it up!

[@tsama]

The gun definitely matters and I found that a better gun can help me find out what I suck at with my EDC. Now I shoot my EDC much better and can actually start practicing rapid fire properly without feeling like I'm just wasting ammo.

[@MrZola1234]

A little off topic, but I am just getting into pistols (stock cz 75 sp01, glock 34, SA 1911). Coming from a cowboy action shooting background, there was something very satisfying about the manual nature of a single action revolver and lever gun vs a modern pistol. I would expect similar differences going to a full race pistol compared to a stock pistol.

[@vesuviateresearches1504]

My 2nd gun, when I got serious was 40sw (back when 40 was a thing). It taught me a LOT for recoil control and getting rid of anticipation... you have to have the mindset for it though.

[@adamleighton8052]

For “newer” shooters, would there be any benefit for having/training with a double/single action firearm? Specifically the double action being a longer heavy trigger pull in the sense of trigger control. Would the investment be worthwhile in your opinion?

[@markevans658]

I’m focused on where the round hits, whatever it takes to make it better, training, better gun, whatever. Better skill will make you perform better and a better performing gun will also make you’re round hit closer to what it wants,

[@Katana_Gryphon]

Hey Ben, check out Humble Marksman’s latest video about gun weight vs trigger weight, it was so interesting to watch in such close timing to your video about better guns helping novice shooters :) I also like your point about a gun’s “easier” features making it quicker to reach an *acceptable level of competence* for someone’s use case. If someone is not intending to seriously train with their gun on a regular basis, then of course they want to chase the “best gun” because the “better” trigger in a Canik or Walther makes them achieve a higher “score” even if they’re not developing their skills. So they’ll spend $100 on an aftermarket Glock trigger instead of four or five boxes of ammo they could use to train with the stock trigger. Could also be a mental thing, they try a stock Glock trigger (which is perfectly serviceable even if most people wouldn’t consider it “good”) and they hate it, so they psych themselves out like “oh I can’t shoot this gun well, the trigger sucks” and thus don’t improve.

[@LiorIPSC]

The comments in that video reference Ben's own insights. Watching KZbin is like buying and selling guns - a hobby related to but distinct from competing with them.

[@Mrgunsngear]

🍿

[@patleavitt900]

In the same way a custom set of golf clubs will help you get 10 more yards but you haven't gotten better. And this will be realized when the guy with a set of old, cheaper clubs takes your money off 16 of the 18 holes. When that happens, guys look to the equipment to change, not their performance.

[@vesuviateresearches1504]

The turning point for me was hearing some guy brag about his $4k custom gun and how much better it was, then I beat him with a stock g19 & rmr. And I was only top 15% for the match (local). IMO the only time serious shooters should deviate from a stock glock/m&p type gun are right up front to build base confidence/engagement, or at the top when single digit% scores matter.

[@Rubeless]

You’ll understand when you get really good

[@WildBillShooting]

Still wanna hear that best El Prez time and at what yardage. Love you bro, appreciate what you do and will see you in class in August!

[@carlb86]

Ben, I enjoy the comparisons between shooting and racing. Totally agree that a faster car raises the scoring floor for the driver (laptime). The faster car also raises the skill ceiling. Ignoring driver aids these can be more difficult to drive near the limit consistently. So while a driver will have the faster laptime in the racier car, they may not be as competitive. Do you think that the racier gun follows the same trend, opposite or they completely diverge regarding this skill ceiling? Skill ceiling referring to extracting the maximum performance possible from the equipment.

[@SteinG]

When I switched to my tanfoglio Xtreme I noticed my shooting became better. After that I did realize most of it Was thanks to the gun so I kept pushing myself to be a little uncomfortable with the speed and so far I keep progressing. so I do get that at first a new shooter would think the gun really makes you, as a person, a better shooter but in order not to plateau you have to keep polishing and training skills.

[@175dan]

You emphasize becoming a better shooter rather than getting a better gun. So, if you get a tricked out race gun that's easier to shoot you won't be developing the skills to be a better shooter. It's like those rifles that came out several years ago that the scope would lock on to the target and the rifle wouldn't fire unless you were exactly on target. While that would make you more accurate it wouldn't make you a better shooter. I appreciate your approach to training. It's simple, easy to understand, and it works.

[@Qpoueoor]

Building a strong foundation will get you further once you hit a certain level.

[@RONALDREAGENN]

Ben can you talk about processing information? I feel like it’s a dirty little secret for high level instructors because it’s something that can’t be taught and would discourage future clients. I feel like the speed at which you and other elite level shooters can process information is rare and cannot be taught. It reminds me of professional football with how teams asses if they are going to draft quarterbacks. One of the major tests they give is being able to process the information really quickly. Can you talk about how much of a roll the speed at which you need to process makes?

[@priitvarno4542]

One thing that needs to be conciderd more then a pricetag on a gun is time as a resource. With a better gun you will learn the basics faster and can start more advanced training sooner. I started ipsc shooting with a glock 34 and was a below avarage shooter. Then switched to a racing gun and for me this unlocked some new oportunities. I was abel to hit all targets on the stages no matter how far or how small and this guided me to train more shooting on the moove and hit fast swinger targets and so on. Need to be more agressive and paln stages better. I also discoverd when picking up a glock then yes, i am a bit slower and have to focus more on the basics but im still used to the tempo of an open gun and that makes me peform better then shoot glocks only. So im still in the beging of my journey to become a decent shooter but a good pistol and Ben's trainig videos wil help me to improve🤠

[@bryanmartin2434]

Making the gun easy to use and the training engaging is important. Get the practice and repetitions. Once you're an above average shooter you can add handicaps to get better. The important part is to not get stuck in a rut. Once you're doing well, speed up or add some other handicaps. Reload, acquire your sites and transition, all these skills are transferable between pistols. Its like progressive overload in weight lifting. If you're lifting the same weight you wont get stronger.

[@Rubeless]

Depends on how you measure strength.

[@tomsanders6267]

What part of the gun is most important to you ? Or, what would you first consider modding ? Triggers ? Sights ? grips ? Internals ? Magwells....ect Say you have s stock Glock ? What mod or change would you first consider to make a shooter better ?

[@the.Tech.Maverick]

You look like a Miata driver 😂 Thanks for all the good content.

[@jaysazar]

A 2011 will make lacking fundamentals less obvious, until you crank up the pressure. I see posts on social media of sub 4 inch groups at 25 yards with someone’s new 2011 and they’re all proud like they figured it out. Let’s see a sub 4” Billy at 7 in under 2 seconds with the same gun, you’ll find the results aren’t the there because the training isn’t either. The gun doesn’t make the shooter, training does. 🎉

[@calyth6615]

It's not the gun until it's the gun. BHP clone was telling me that my trigger handling needs work, until it bit the web of my hand enough that my mind started not wanting to continue. I'll probably sort out the hammer and try again then. I'm a novice and I'm silly enough to take a 6" Chiappa Rhino to a IDPA-ish match, and I've got to work with the DA trigger under a timer. That definitely told me things I need to work on.

[@Isrrael]

Considering the advantages and differences between Carry Optics and Limited Optics divisions in USPSA, particularly beyond just the magwell, do you believe these guns are distinct enough to warrant their own separate divisions? Why or why not?

[@PnP-td1mt]

The amount of crap people come up with to justify their purchases. I shoot limited optics with an extremely aggressively gripped staccato XL. It literally chews meat off my hand if the draw is incorrect. Getting over the hammer and beaver tail is a lot harder than a striker fired pistol for me. I can’t draw as fast with my 2011’s that I can a glock or 320. Most of my shooting is defensive/duty which is done with a Staccato p19 heritage. I don’t just shoot competition… My edc is a p365xl with a Icarus macro grip. Trained and shot for years using P320’s. Yes the 2011’s feel like a cheat code in many aspects which has only helped me get faster with the 320’s.

[@lordhellfire153]

I deliberately bought my GF a Beretta APX because a P365 is fucking awful to shoot. Glock 19 to 17 sized guns are fantastic to learn on compared to subcompacts. You're less likely to develop a flinch, and you're more likely to actually enjoy your practice.

[@CoastalSet]

Meanwhile I'm just sitting here with my measly Rock Island 1911 in 9mm (so I can share ammo with my dad & simplifies logistics) that I got less than a year ago & before I got interested in competitive shooting. Not necessarily looking for advice from you Ben (but it would be appreciated), but aside from a Glock (I'll explain later), what would you recommend as a good starter gun for building strong fundamentals & would allow me to compete outside of Single Stack Division. For the exclusion of Glock thing, its mainly that I want to reserve that experience for when I build one since the tinkerer inside of me is more interested in messing around with 1911s & Glocks than when it comes to going out & shooting it.

[@onpsxmember]

If you have it easy with a .22 to punch out the same hole, just set a new standard that has to be reached. Make the target smaller, increase the distance, set a time limit. Maybe once we get the results we like easily with a certain setup, we stop looking for harder challenges that would be only achievable with said setup. Seeking the failure. EDIT: I stopped the video, it's already in there. Can you do a video when using a few different pistols with different triggers & overall weight is beneficial or detrimental. How long should one stick to one pistol and how long should be a rotation intervall?

[@onpsxmember]

Since you had lots of Beretta 92 series experience, how do the new competition models compare? FCG was probably fire control group.

[@nathandrel]

I'm seeing this on myself - with my canik rival s I can easily and consistently push myself on speed and accuracy, as this pistol is way easier to shoot that my glock 17 gen 3. Also - when shooting a glock I am under the impression that my fundamentals were all right and yet the group on a target says otherwise. There is so much less "static-noise" when shooting heavier gun with better trigger so I can clearly see any mistake I make. With glock... self diagnosing mistakes comes (to me at least) waaaay harder.

[@Osprey1994]

I spent most of my ammo on my little P365XL with a Shalotek XLC slide (P365X format before). When I finally got my hands on a 2011, it was hilarious how easy certain things became. Ideally I'd like to keep shooting about 300-500 month, but I might be without a job for a bit soon, and that means I might have to cut down to 50rds a week outside of competitions or classes if a really good class pops up. PS. Spent 3 years on the G19, I think that a Glock with an optic is actually stupid nice to shoot...I have been considering getting a G17 or G34 to replace my PDP.

[@Rubeless]

Get a CZ P10, at least try one. They have great triggers and upgrades are under $100. They have a competition model like the 34

[@jcb2920]

This may be slightly off target (pun intended) but watching this discussion convinced me to leave my optic(s) home and take irons to the range today. That may present an interesting challenge, and at least help maintain some level of proficiency with that platform. ‘Obviously dependent on one’s overall goals, but it sounds fun anyway.

[@MikeMcTigue-o8f]

I had a G17. Hated the trigger (lots of creep) and grip angle pushed my finger against the bottom of the trigger guard. My point is that the ergonomics of a gun can determine how it works for YOU and just training with a crappier gun isn't the right thing for skill building.

[@Rubeless]

You’re not able to adapt?

[@brad_1388_]

“The grip angle was bad” have you considered learning how to shoot? It takes me about 30 seconds to switch between a glock and 1911s grip angle, it’s not difficult

[@djkak5320]

Yup!

[@practicepractice5719]

Do you use stock Glock triggers? If you do not, what is a good, VERY reliable aftermarket glock trigger (low maintenance) ?

[@thebombasticbadazz4729]

timney 1 alpha + johnny glock combat conversion kit

[@turkeyfish26]

if you want very reliable, don't change the trigger

[@practicepractice5719]

Is the glock "Performance Trigger" as reliable (and low maintenance) as the standard? I prefer "reliable".....I want to go to the range to practice, not to gunsmith.

[@practicepractice5719]

I've used standard Glock triggers for years now and never felt aftermarket ones would be as low maintenance.....so I have stuck with the standard Glock OEM triggers. But if, in Ben's experience, he has found one that is better and just as reliable, I would be interested.

[@Rubeless]

The Johnny Glock trigger is great and regardless what people say about reliability, it is a Glock trigger with oem parts and is as reliable and safe as stock. If you want a better trigger without modifying your gun, get a CZ P10.

[@DefaultDadAZ]

I really only got into competitive shooting as a metric to measure my improvement after a really bad injury. Originally it was with my EDC which smaller pistol wasn't very competitive with anyone else at all. It also wasn't very sustainable for me because a large amount of stages/rounds would beat me up more than an easier shooting gun. There's always trade offs with platforms but I agree with you need something that's the right amount of frustration and you need to be able to push your metric accordingly. Do a good amount of 22 steel challenge with my son because it's cheap and doesn't beat me up, but I have to be that much faster with that instead of a 9mm.

[@Rubeless]

You sound like Travis using all the science words. Selfie crew

[@alexeisenhardt9299]

I am curious what gun Ben was using when he won the world championship

[@glefos3917]

Stock 2

[@shannonmarcantel7993]

For a new or someone that rarely trains and own something like a staccato but carry a Glock you need to train with the Glock at least equally. If you only train with the staccato because you shoot it better and you have to use the Glock in self defense don’t expect the same results. Not mention the crazy adrenaline and stress that will reduce your skill level with any gun.

[@Rubeless]

I agree and would say spend 80% of your time with your carry gun.

[@rolotomase1440]

There are people shooting 12 second El Presidente that believe they shoot one gun better than the other. Then there are people that shoot it in 4 seconds and recognize with a mag well they can shave off a tenth.

[@nahbrahhh]

I haven't shot a USPSA match yet. Can I take one of your classes without a competition belt/holster?

[@slick4415]

Ill bite, for someone who doesn’t shoot as often as you i think a person should carry the fastest gun they can as they cannot rely on their skills as much as you can and when we talking carrying life vs death you want every advantage this gun doesn’t make you a better shooter but you can absolutely train with it and become a better shooter

[@zachpfeifer7312]

Hypothetically, could there be anything to training with 2 different guns, one significantly racier than the other? I.e. train grip and trigger control on something a glock, and train higher levels of vision and really pushing speed with an open gun?

[@tracerxrider]

Already trolling with the thumbnail. Excellent audience engagement.

[@comadano]

Would you say it can be beneficial to train with different platforms? Curious to hear your thoughts on it.

[@Rubeless]

Why would you only want to be good with one gun?

[@xtreamar1550]

Have you heard of a company “flying Miata” ? They basically put a LS in the car and upgrade the suspension and then you will have a fast Miata

[@BenStoeger187]

I have a mach1 for that

[@donovanx85]

I may be misunderstanding, but if you’re comparing a gun like a Glock to a staccato and your skill set is decent your hit factor on sets of drills may not vary much, but it will be easier to attain scores with a gun that is easier to shoot?

[@Rubeless]

It’s like using optics, it makes it easier.

[@sdsorrentino]

If a violinist plays a concerto with one violin and then immediately plays it again with a different violin and does better, what made the difference, his skill level or his different violin? Your argument is pretty simple. You can't buy skill, but you can pay to remove roadblocks. The 2011 trigger can cover for a whole lot of bad trigger management that will show up immediately with a Glock. A very skilled shooter has better trigger management skills so the difference between the two will not be as obvious. A new shooter will not have the skill, so the 2011 trigger will cause him fewer problems than the Glock trigger. That being said, if a trigger is too easy, too soon in a shooting career, then the shooter may never have to develop good trigger management skills which will eventually handicap him even with a 2011.

[@MSmatt76]

I have to disagree with the Glock being hard to shoot. Police departments switched from double-action revolvers in the 1980s and 90s to the "plastic piece of junk" gun because, with a little bit of testing, they figured out the Glock was really easy to shoot and train new shooters.

[@Steel_shooter]

I think you might have misunderstood what was being said. This is not talking about being somewhat competent with a firearm, this is about getting consistently good. I can shoot decently with a glock, but I can achieve the same results easier with a Shadow 2. This means to get the same results with a glock i need to push harder. Does that mean that LEOs should carry Shadows? No. The police has some parameters they need in a firearm, that others might not need, and the opposite is also true. Going from revolvers to glocks is not a good example, going from, lets say 1911s to a glock, sig or something wold be more illustrating, as the revolver and the glock are vastly different systems. Bens point here, as I have understood it, is seeing what to train for with each different firearm, Shadows are heavier, lighter triggers, etc, making them easier to shoot fast and aggressive, while a Glock is light, has a (to me) markedly worse trigger, so more focus is needed on recoil control, grip, etc. He was not saying it is hard to shoot a glock, but its harder to achieve the same results with it as a gun that is more racing oriented. So yes, relatively speaking, compared to some guns, shooting a glock is harder, assuming the same skill level. So it comes down to training. If a glock shoter is on par with someone with a race gun, I would assume the glock shooter has better pistol skills than the other guy.

[@johnjohnalmand]

I love that Ben also likes cars. I really love that he likes Miatas. 😂

[@JohnDoe-mt8rf]

I never use the thumb safety on a 1911 or 2011

[@isaacmiller1943]

Just picked up and fired my first handgun today. I’m very familiar with hunting style rifles am a decent shooter with them. Bought a Staccato C2 with a comp, loaded up a mag and stepped out on the porch intending on shooting a stump in my yard. Saw a cottontail and put a round through its ear at 28 yards first shot. I have limited time for training, I bought the staccato because it gives me a boatload of confidence and an ability to shoot “well” right off the bat. I’m certainly going to get training and try other platforms, but my goal was to buy something very user friendly that I could start carrying right away. I also feel that in a stressful situation having a easy to shoot gun that does the work for you is valuable

[@Rubeless]

Sure ya did.

[@isaacmiller1943]

@@Rubelesswant proof? I got a picture. Or you could just run your mouth without backup and see how that treats you. I don’t get it when I see people acting like it’s hard to hit an A zone at 25 yards. I’ve shot plenty of deer at several hundred yards with rifles, same freaking principles. Just put the sights on it and pull the trigger. Sorry if your jealous or something bud, some people can some can’t

[@isaacmiller1943]

@AlphaMindset-zq5qv Yes, much like humans, Rabbits ears are on their heads. If I shot into your ear you’d die too. I’m assuming you’re so alpha that you only shoot targets not food. Ever seen a cottontail? They aren’t your fairytale rabbits with ears bigger than the rest of them. Just little nubbins on the side of the head.

[@isaacmiller1943]

@AlphaMindset-zq5qv as in Elmer Fudd? Yeah that was a comic book rabbit he was after. Not what they actually look like dude.

[@nflippo8]

If I’ve ever seen some bs on the internet this was it 😂

[@frccustomguns7859]

If you run a FRC, you will dominate.

[@brianz5579]

This video is convincing me to rip off the Apex trigger I use for my P10 for Carry Optics and just use the stock one lol

[@jacobpetersen5662]

If you have GOOD fundamentals and shoot a Glock well, you can shoot anything. If you need a 2011 to do well, you have poor fundamentals. I've seen it quite a bit. I feel a gun like .i.e a Glock, it forces you to work on your grip and trigger press, where a "race" gun, it's just not as important. It's important, but not AS important.

[@willy4869]

I shoot my glock better than my staccato. Practiscore confirms this. And it makes me so mad. The staccato was supposed to take me to the promised land.

[@PnP-td1mt]

I cannot get over the amount of people that flat make stuff up in the comments.

[@DJG37S]

Guns are like cars, a crappy driver can go out an buy a $500k ferrari and keep up with a good driver around a track who is driving a honda civic. But does that mean that equipment matters? Yes. Just like cars a bad shooter can actually get great performance, example an A class open shooter beating carry optics Master shooter. Does this mean that the carry optics shooter is a bad shooter? Nope?? because if you gave the carry optics guy a race gun, I'm sure carry optics shooter would whoop the A class open shooter. Now this doesn't mean that you should just forget about the equipment, in competition shooting, there is a reason why shooters like Christian Sailer, JJ Racaza, Nils, and most of the 15 carry optics national shooters shoot a steel/aluminum frame gun instead of polyomer.

[@TWOA-iu9ub]

Bowling with the guardrails will net you a better score, but you will not become a better bowler.

[@Brunoku]

I'm struggling with this question right now. I'm buying my first gun and I want a shadow 2, but part of me thinks I should just buy a glock to learn with for a while

[@samgoral4]

Get the one you want, you’re still going to learn and then already have the pistol you want

[@turkeyfish26]

Honestly, I would go glock and spend that extra money on ammo. I'm was in the same boat and decided on a g19 for my first. I've put about 1500 rounds through it since the beginning of this year and have noticed a huge improvement in trigger control, accuracy, and recoil control, and it's very satisfying to see myself get better. I plan on purchasing a lot more ammo and training even more. I can also carry it so I didn't need to buy another gun for that. Training is a LOT more fun than owning guns you don't shoot. Because of the learning curve with the glock, I wonder if I went with a shadow 2 or staccato I would have missed out on some of that experience.

[@Rubeless]

Depends on what the gun is for. The CZ is great at everything except carry. If money is a concern, then yes, get a striker fired gun, some education and ammo to practice. Glocks are great, and I have used them since 97’, but there are better options these days. Look at the CZ P10, it’s got a great trigger(better than upgraded gen 3 Glocks), is less expensive than a blue label Glock and fits most Glock holsters.

[@scubatankgabe546]

Both. I have both

[@daltontaylor113]

Buy the S2 if you think you want to ever get into comp shooting. It will save you down the road, and you can continue to improve on that platform while upgrading small portions at a time. Buy the glock if you just want to shoot at the range and have a defensive pistol.

[@hamtyboy]

This Simmer is starting to cook this frog....

[@LeifyGuy]

It's funny that simply stating the obvious would stir all this up

[@kevinmcdonald6849]

So the question is…. If you shoot a Glock for a couple years and develop fundamentals then switch to a gamer gun, do your fundamentals begin to deteriorate?

[@Rubeless]

They perish when you stop practicing. You just have to work harder with striker guns

[@danielweissenborn3508]

Does this mean youll be infinite if you are good on a yeet cannon?

[@071Tom]

Cheap or expensive get and shoot what ever gun gets you to go to the range and shoot.

[@samschipper6766]

Next up: Laugo Alien

[@Rubeless]

I wonder what kind of hate that will draw. Maybe not much since not many are out there.

[@aleks2194]

What is a fancy gun? Is all metal fancy?

[@Steel_shooter]

Well, add in gas pedals, compensators, custom fit, tuned parts, etc can certainly make a gun fancy, compared to a stock gun, some of them will even make it easier to hit the target, but at the end of the day, skill matters.

[@aleks2194]

@@Steel_shooter so a shadow 2 is not fancy?im just asking if anything over a stock clock is fancy

[@Steel_shooter]

@@aleks2194 Guess it depends on what you are comparing it to. My Shadow 2 is a good gun for sure, but I don't consider it especially fancy. To me it's just a good factory gun, but compared to a high point, sure it's fancy. Compared to a glock, no, i don't consider it especially fancy, just better suited for some uses. A production gun I consider fancy is the Laugo Alien, mostly due to the somewhat unique way it operates.

[@TheReloaderDude]

Well, as an old long-time shooter of USPSA and other organizations, it annoys me that all the divisions are going to the dots and new shooters come in and brag how well they shoot.. the only reason I switched to the newer divisions is because there actually being someone to complete against.. To me, the best divisions are revolver, single stack and limited 10.. they are just plan fun and make you work.. but with that being said, they are also dying out because they are too hard for the new crowd who just sprays and prays with the dots and high round counts.

[@MGMan37]

You're holding yourself back by not seriously trying a dot. It's not just magically more accurate but is a great tool for diagnosing what you're doing to your gun's aim as you're pulling the trigger. I would argue that irons can be more 'spray and pray' because you don't get that information. Don't forget, you still have to make hits, even with a dot. Nothing 'spray' about it.

[@TheReloaderDude]

@@MGMan37 don't get information? I think all the alpha hits speak for themselves.. But I also shoot pretty much all divisions of steel challenge, so I do shoot firearms with dots.

[@snakeplissken44]

Really? Beretta not accurate? I've never heard that.

[@paulfrancois7653]

Ben: "It's a nuanced topic". Me: Races to the comments to watch shit show with zero nuance 😅

[@georgecook5120]

@BenStoeger187: For years I've seen gun reviews talk about the trigger pull weight, where it breaks, take up, reset, etc. Usually, these reviews are on guns for self defense or high-speed low-drag competition shooting. Other than the trigger weight, I think the rest of these qualitative metrics are really silly. The reason being is those metrics originated from and pertain to slow-fire competitions like Bullseye. USPSA shooting requires quick and accurate shooting and it doesn't matter where the trigger breaks or if it "breaks like glass". Other than the occasional headshot at 25 yards or 50 yard standards, these qualities are irrelevant. Your thoughts?

[@MGMan37]

Nonsense. There's a good reason single & DA/SA triggers dominate. A smoother trigger or one with a shorter break means less work you have to do and less focus you have to put into it.

[@georgecook5120]

@@MGMan37 SMH. LMAO.

[@schadenfreud33]

Recurve or compound bow is basically the same question