The Right and Wrong Way to Make A Broken Character

[@Mangakamen]

If you guys enjoyed the video, please consider dropping a like, a comment and sharing the video around :)

[@joshuaagee-bass4049]

Liked the video but I feel Dabi was a much better example of how not to do a broken character than Toga

[@zerron2156]

Yeah it was great 😊

[@pupununu3024]

​@@joshuaagee-bass4049Same. I honestly despise him, my most hated character with Shitstain being a close second (mainly because the fandom love to parrot his views despite them clearly shown to be _wrong,_ ex. A hero like Ochako who's working for money, even if it's to heko her family, would be a target for Shitstain since it's "not ideal like All Might", and claiming all the heros who ended up quitting after the war were all fakes even though it's shown they had a lot to deal with after the war or weren't fully prepared for a war of that magnitude, ex. Animetoonia with his one video, etc.). The guy suffered abuse via neglect from Endeavor when he found out his Quirk was hurting him, then when he finds out he had _more_ children, he tries to burn a _baby,_ then tells his own mother she was sold into marriage. Then after his incident at the peak, he felt so alone when the Doctor and Shigaraki for One had so much wisdom, so he set fire to the kingdom, burned it down until it melted... then he goes all the way home like Gohan did during that filler episode... only to tirn and leave because he saw Endeavor training Shoto. *_He gave up his chance to try to fix his home life because his brother was training._* Even after that, he admits in his Endeavor is canceled tape that he murdered 30 innocent people-he looked these people in the eyes and basically said, "I'm gonna kill you because I hate my daddy.". Even then, he also admits to sending a serial killer after his brother who he said he cried to when it came to not being trained, which as shown in the flashback was him grying to wake him up just so he could vent, to no avail. He helped kill hundreds in the war and tried to kill more all because Daddy didn't tell him he could be a hero despite his power... he may be broken, but it does _not_ excuse his atrocities. The fact some people have the gall to be angry at _Natsuo_ for wanting nothkng to do with him anymore after not only his indirect murder attempt on him, but also for all he's done, pisses me off. If my brother did all that, I would call for his eternal imprisonment in a heartbeat, if not outright the death penalty. His little cry when it came to his end with Shoto did not move me.

[@MisteRRYouTuby]

Have you ever heard of or watched the anime “Black Lagoon”?

[@skyrimlover777]

This video in particular has been useful for things to avoid when I write characters like this. I dont really make stuff for anyone but me and a few friends to read, but I still hold myself to a standard that I feel like videos like this help uphold.

[@BeeRitual]

Stolas is punished for the purpose of making the audience feel sorry for him, not for him to learn or grow as a character, because his punishments are never for the shit he actually did.

[@austinlawrence6987]

Yeah and this is coming from a guy who lives Stolas as a character, he's not my favorite character in Helluva Boss, that honor going to Bee but i think's think he's alright.

[@cameoshadowness7757]

200%

[@Yan_Alkovic]

Comparing the Great Ace Attorney to Helluva Boss is not something I was expecting

[@dogma_baal]

"Hydrogen bomb vs coughing baby" type comparison

[@gnicole1700]

HONESTLY yea 💀 as someone who plays tgaa and watches helluva this was an unexpected video

[@Yan_Alkovic]

@ that’s uh Unexpected Didn’t think that Helliva Boss was a coughing baby

[@thebestadoringfan]

I saw Von Zieks, I clicked

[@shadywiskerz]

Idk how we ended up on this timeline

[@bahesb2419]

Another good example of a broken character for me is jason voorhees. He used to be a sweet kid that got bullied by others simply because of his looks and this bullying led to his death. Once his mother died after a rampage of revenge, jason came back from the dead to continue his mothers work, hoping it whould make his mother proud. What makes jason so broken is that jason is still a child inside and doesn't understand what he is doing is wrong, only doing what his mother did, like a child mimicking their parents. He also has shown to have standards like how he doesn't kill animals or children and only targeting those who are on his turf.

[@lawbook788]

I remember seeing a comic where Jason saw a kid getting bullied and saved the kid

[@mattd5240]

Name of the comic?​@lawbook788

[@ravencrow1011]

Didnt jason beat the kids in the sleeping bag?

[@CappyzEdit]

I never knew this (cuz I haven’t watch Friday the 13th) BUT HOW THE HELL IS THAT BEHEMOTH 11?

[@crbl1677]

Its more like a phantom power, similar to those ghosts who are like monsters even though they were humans before dying ​@@CappyzEdit

[@mrhalfsaid1389]

How to make a character broken? Simply boost their stats to an awful degree. Problem solved.

[@thefanwithoutaface8105]

30:21 Too me it is easier to sympathize with Toga because she did legit TRY to be "normal" as people claim to be after her parents brought her to quirk counselling. The problem is the Quirk is a part of her very body, her brain is hardwired to be interested in blood since consuming it is how her quirk works. She was effectively fighting against her own biology and never taught how to express that desire in a healthy manner and eventually she just couldn't take it anymore and snapped mentally. This doesn't necessarily excuse her actions, though it does raise the question of Toga's mental state as it can be argued that much like Twice, she is legit mentally ill and thus not in total control of her actions.

[@bishopspechulure9821]

This is where the series desperately needed to focus more on side characters. There's a pro hero called Vlad, who also has a blood quirk. What struggles did he overcome? Did he have similar issues due to his quirk? Important questions to ask when considering Togas case, but we never explore it

[@thefanwithoutaface8105]

@@bishopspechulure9821 I feel like Vlad had it easier as his Quirk allows him to control the blood in his body so it's less "villianous" Toga's quirk meanwhile requires her to consume blood which would be seen as creepy and unhinged even in their society. As such he likely didn't face nearly the same amount of crap as Toga.

[@bishopspechulure9821]

@thefanwithoutaface8105 But that's the thing, she's only required to consume blood to USE her quirk. She is not required to use her quirk in daily life eas a normal person. Plus, how do you know that having a quirk that controls blood doesn't create some kind of blood fixation in general? We don't know that because it was never explored

[@thefanwithoutaface8105]

@@bishopspechulure9821 Thing is while she doesn't technically have to use her quirk, quirks are effectively like muscles or limbs, you know they are there and on some level feel compelled to use them and since Toga's quirk is all about consuming blood, her brain is specifically hardwired to atleast find blood appealing compared to a normal person and even feel the desire to consume it.

[@kindasomeviews]

I just can't believe how mistreated she's been throughout the series. First off, it would've given folks an incredible message if she became a hero or part of the police force while resisting her urges everyday, having nightmares about it and everything. Also she didn't have to give Ochako ALL of her blood, giving her a cheapened death when fans really want her to keep living and gives her more opportunity to correct her behavior. Last but not least....The fact that she's drawn and shipped with Twice....Who's an older adult (30s) and she's 17....wtf Hori

[@PinkBB02]

i dont understand why Helluva keeps trying to make Stolas this sad, sweet character when all of his actions arent, like i just dont get it 😭

[@Opalhibiscus]

The real reason he’s always right and never wrong, is because he has the most songs and merchandise, he makes the studio the most money.

[@AndresMoralesMercado]

because he is vivzie's favorite and she will do everything possible to victimize him no matter at what cost. I no longer care that Stolas suffers the consequences because the writers were pampering him too much that just deleting him from the programs is the only solution to this whole disaster.

[@nightmarearcade2663]

Because Vivzie arguably doesn't have any idea how to write complex characters. Her shows when it comes to their base concepts are the kind of things that require complexity but everything is either black and white or just fumbles the ball when it comes to tackling serious topics. Couple that with the double standards certain story points and characters have then you have a show that no one on the crew seems to understand what the issues are and just refuse to acknowledge them.

[@nightmarearcade2663]

The show literally does speed run things just to get to the next plot point so often though. Like this is arguably one if the shows biggest flaws.

[@kyuremthefrozen8539]

@@AndresMoralesMercado yep

[@delphoxhoopa7289]

I love Stolas as a character, but even I'm not a fan of how the narrative ends over backwards to make him look sympathetic to point the characters he interacts with are written in a negative light or in the wrong to make him look better, or completely sweeping his actual bad moments under the rug. Comparing the current version to the Pilot is like looking at two different characters entirely, but not in a natural way. Hopefully he'll be held more accountable for his actions in light of the recent episode.

[@majesticgothitelle1802]

Not in the polit but the first season itself. The first season was stolas only interesting in having sex and humanizing blizz to just a sex purse puppy in opening and with his family

[@misterOrca4]

Since it's Helluva boss pretty much every character is supposed to be terrible, at least personality wise.

[@dmittleman9757]

He’s what some refer as “The writer’s darling”. That favorite character who gets all the sympathy and screen time, because the writers of the show just love them so much. For a while, it was Fizaroli, and in Hazbin, it’s Angel. Are they the main character? Not always. Is the writing good? Doesn’t matter. Does the audience event want to see more of this character? Don’t care.

[@delphoxhoopa7289]

@@dmittleman9757 It definitely shows. For Pete's sake, we're just now going back to murdering people on Earth, y'know, THE ACTUAL PREMISE OF THE SHOW, because so much of it is dedicated to shipping or Stolas.

[@devilheartcandy]

I hope Octavia gets to call him out with how he treats her, but I also feel the writers will portray it as Octavia betraying him and Stolas becoming even more tragic and angsty

[@thefanwithoutaface8105]

11:36 A key problem with Cinder is her backstory wasn't shown until she'd done so many horrible things that it's impossible to feel sympathy for her. She destroyed the peace of the entire world, murdered numerous characters, helped destroy two separate kingdoms and does all of that without showing a hint of remorse. Compare that to say Toga from My Hero. She also does horrible things but you can sort of understand her better as her abuse happened back when she was a even younger and atleast demonstrates on some level what she wants is something tangiable, acceptance. Toga was told all her life that she was a monster simply because she acted a way that was considered unusual due to her quirk, thus wanted to change the world to where she could be accepted as normal. That is an understandable and even tragic motivation. Cinder just wants to have as much power as possible so no one can push her around anymore which is pretty weak motivation.

[@TheDragons345]

More points to Toga, she doesn't tried or even think betraying the league of Villains. Heck, she wanted get revenge for Twice when he was killed by Hawks. Cinder doesn't give a rat ass for anyone, lied to Salem's face about the lamb ,even her biggest simp Emerald left and only "won" because the "Heroes" gave her the win.

[@therenegade4482]

Think it’s the point, cinder’s character at that point was “I’ve suffered so this is what I deserve” but as watts puts it she was just a child throwing a tantrum since she hasn’t really done anything to prove her worth

[@neilstone1788]

Not really. She was always pushed around when she was younger so it makes sense that she wants to have power so people can't push her around

[@thefanwithoutaface8105]

@@neilstone1788 Except she has that power already, she just wants more and more power without limit

[@HappyPotat]

I think people misunderstand that her backstory isn't meant to make you sympathize but simply to show what makes her, her.

[@rafaelbrites3607]

i think my big problem with the moderm writting is tat they think if a caracther had a tragic backstory, he instantly became a victim, and they got redemption's without facing consequences of their actions. That´s why i hate caracthers like sasuke, or the ghost verion from the anti -man and the wasp movie.

[@xxkankala1671]

You don’t have a issue with modern writing, you just don’t like a specific writing style

[@kurozunakabuto9682]

It's the lack of them serving time(in prison or manual labor) where I agree And I belive the death penalty should not be the solution

[@Pizza874]

TF u talking bout they literally had bro tied up and in prison for lord knows how long don't do my boy sasuke like that

[@neilstone1788]

Yet no one complains about Zuko not going to prison. Are we just forgetting that he hurt people? Of course we are because he helped Aang and is the leader of his own nation now.

[@venom-ez2oj]

Fun fact the descendants of Soseki had one requirement for him to be in the game. They had to keep that he hated his time there

[@jaredgarcia8638]

RWBY and Helluva Boss are both examples of what not to when writing tragic and broken characters

[@cryamistellimek9184]

RWBY is an example of what not to do in regards to anything and everything when writing.

[@ExponsiatoDonego]

@@cryamistellimek9184 Correction: RWBY after Monty. I'm glad that finally ended. The poor man has been spinning for far too long in the grave.

[@cryamistellimek9184]

@@ExponsiatoDonego No correction. I used to think that but even Seasons 1-3 are filled with bad writing. Cliche filled writing, bad displays of personality, pointless conflict, etc. I could also mention how the fight scenes that everyone praised in 1-3 aren’t actually that good but that’s a separate issue from the writing.

[@artistanthony1007]

​@ExponsiatoDonego RWBY isn't confirmed to be done, VIZ just bought the rights to the show and being quiet with no Volume 10 or content doesnt mean right away it's over, it's gonna still come but because they own it, hope some things atleast improve especially the designs because Volume 7-9 had unappealing designs, Ren is pretty cool but man I loved his previous Outfit the most and hope the new one will capture that or just look as good.

[@archivist_13]

Great Ace Attorney mentioned let's fucking go, it's so peak

[@eellsler]

I got so excited seeing van Zieks in the thumbnail 🙏🙏

[@AmyMartin_butDutch]

​@@eellslerfr this was the reason why i clicked on the video

[@riotkitty]

A good broken character is Nox from Wakfu. You see his backstory, and his motivation to turn back time to save his family, but the story doesn’t try to redeem him at all, because he’s still doing terrible things to accomplish his goal.

[@legendarycryptid2629]

@@riotkitty Nox is so damn good. There's a reason Wakfu fans hold him in regard as one of the best antagonists. His entire OVA was tragic to watch (different designs for his family sue to different studio aside), and even in the main show he has his pet the dog moment of reversing Alibert's aging and a brief father-to-father conversation. The fact he fails (either for unknown reasons currently, or according to someone else, a sacrifice from Nora in the original Ankama timeline (Guardians of Wakfu/Islands maybe?)) in the end when that would've actually been a happier outcome since he'd have genuinely undone all his wrongs just makes it hurt that much more. His soundtracks and leitmotifs are great, he's a crafty fighter, a genius of a mad Xelor (no relation to the Dofus villain Kerubim mentioned a couple times), and his final scene still gets me to this day.

[@Snearek]

Wakfu fans still exist?

[@fuse3657]

Nox is a fantastic example.

[@cryptic1999]

YES NOX RECOGNITION AND RESPECT LETS GOOOOOO!!!!

[@kurozunakabuto9682]

I like the way this was how it was explain to me ( by pat or woolie from castle super beast) Bad guy: No! It will be fine just let me win and I turn back time and everything will be fix with the people I killed will come back just fine Good guy:BUT YOU ARE STILL KILLING PEOPLE! Bad guy:but just let me win

[@mreverything7056]

Van Ziek’s was so interesting to me since I already played the other AAs. He seems like he’s going to be an Edgeworth, labelled as Reaper and being a flaming racist. But then you peel back his layers and find he’s… already very on board with proper justice. He would force a juror to testify and leak government secrets. It’s a very strong foreshadow for his true feelings on justice: it’s dark and muddy, and bypasses the law in some ways. It fits him as the reaper, but also doesn’t. To discover the man being so broken and closed off by his own past, really helps add up to how his backstory gets revealed. AND THEN THE REVEAL THAT someone he loved and trusted wasn’t murdered, but was a MURDERER, holy shit I could feel the man’s repressed pain attempting not to explode.

[@manuelmontoya8839]

Personally speaking, I would consider viewing Toga as something of a, "drug," addict at an early age. "Assuming," her parents have either struggle to or done nothing to stop/curb her blood drinking behavior she would likely go into a maddening spiral of hunting for a new high as time goes on. As such, much like any drug addict, she still needs to be held accountable for her actions regardless of her need for blood. In this light, Toga's behavior could be prevented, not necessarily by society, but her parents. If her parents are able to stop her from taking blood from random animals/people and teach her better ways of handling this blood thing, she would have a better chance at integrating with society than where she is now. This won't change the fact that it will be difficult to live in this society, but she will have better control over her actions.

[@Cityweaver]

Here's the only problem with that: her desire for blood is a biological urge/compulsion. At best, it's an urge, at worst it is a nutritional need. There are plenty of real life eating disorders for urges. And, humans DO eat blood. Yes, it is 100% her parents fault for not teaching her how to handle "this blood thing" because there are women who are compelled to eat clay, chalk, and other things.

[@Someone-or8tp]

@@Cityweaver I would say that being addicted to drugs is also a biological compulsion. once you start the drug, your brain becomes wired to crave it. so your biology/brain chemistry is permanently altered for the rest of your life. it's why relapses can be so scary and are always a looming threat over your head once you go through rehab, and it's why withdrawal is so powerful. They aren't exactly the same, but they can be likened to one another effectively. I don't think Toga can be called 'addicted', though. This does seem like an allegory for mental illness rather than addiction.

[@Cityweaver]

@Someone-or8tp Yes, but you have to invent the hypothetical of a drug and surgerically insert it into Toga's story to make your metaphor work. When you could just use food. I'm just saying. You could just use Pica disease. 🙂‍↕️👍

[@Someone-or8tp]

@@Cityweaver hey, that's actually a good point! Thanks for bringing that to my attention, I didn't know about Pica until just now!

[@roninwarriorsfan]

as a friend of mine said, Cinder has the personality of a Cinderblock

[@82844]

Man I wish her character is as dense as one.

[@16JPE]

Cinderblock from teen titans has more personality than Cinder from RWBY

[@nitrus1933]

Hey! Don't bring Cinderblock down to her level.

[@TadanoCandy]

I interpreted Toga as someone that wanted to be ‘normal’ but couldn’t be due to how she was born. So when she was offered to join the misfit villains, it was a way for her to be ‘normal’ (if everyone is equally unique, no one really is). She doesn’t have to kill, but that’s what her group does, and she’s loyal to the group

[@ilikebeanies3499]

Speaking of Vivziepop.. 💀 I hated the way Adam was characterized in Hazbin Hotel so much that I was convinced he was an imposter to the end. The 'mask off' should have revealed him as Mammon since they have the same kinda personality..... I digress. I rewrote Adam to be a 'broken character'. I'll be brief though, no essay here. I made Adam have almost the exact backstory as the show. He had Lilith, then she cheated on him and left with another man. But I also added that Eve left him as well because she's nowhere in the show. So I explained it as, she disappeared from his life. Adam is now alone, spending thousands of years just watching as his children on Earth grow and change and be happy. Adam becomes bitter and dull to any harm towards Hell. Which is the reason he teams up with Lute. (I made it so Lute is the one with the 'cause', who hates demons and wants them dead. Adam in my rewrite just supplies her troops and let's her do it. He is uncaring about his ex wife's subjects) Adam as a broken character works for three reasons. One, his IRL lore is extremely depressing on its own, minus the added fact Eve isn't his wife in the show. Two, Adam would actually be a complex villain this way. The kind of villain who can't be bothered to care. Who wouldn't call Charlie a bitch or anything, but would just roll his eyes at her yapping about redemption. Three, he's actually the main example Charlie is trying to make happen!! He's a HUMAN who was REDEEMED FROM SIN! Having a villain who's treated with more dignity that ALSO represents everything the hero wants is AMAZING. WHY DIDN'T VIVZIE DO THIS???????? Nah. Gey bird is more tragic guys, trust me. Adam only lost both his wives (allegedly) and pretty much has to spend eternity watching his ex grow an empire with her new man in Hell. Also Adam now has to pretend to give a shit about Charlie, the DAUGHTER of his ex wife. Hear her out on her redemption plan, after giving Lute the okay to slaughter them. Yeah. Stolass is way worse off. 🗿

[@Wolf_Blob]

He looks more like he's regretting the choice he made for Blitz, but isn't even worried about Octavia being now in Stella's hands.

[@charlie8829]

Especially when she’s physically abusive to stolas and it’s implied she mostly has custody over Octavia it’s rlly stupid of him to not even think about Stella possibly being physically abusive to Octavia. We don’t see it but from stolas perspective he doesn’t know. It could’ve been a way to show his neglect but that would mean giving their favorite twink accountability

[@artistanthony1007]

​@charlie8829 Viv wrote the episode, you know very well it's a Blitz first Octavia second thing, Viv said he and Blitz are in wrong but I never bought that bull, Viv even said she valued good faith criticism before Hazbin came and look how it is and look how Full Moon then Apology Tour are, Viv doesnt care and so Stolas only sees Blitz important first and foremost, Octavia second.

[@Scyclo]

i'm really getting sick of the Stolas Pity party they keep throwing, like HE KNEW WHAT WAS GONNA FUCKING HAPPEN WHEN HE DEFENDED BLITZ. I get it via is kinda stuck in a bad situation right now, but like seriously, i'm tired of the Woe is me woe is me shit with stolas...

[@everett910]

I assume stolas impulsively chose that action thinking he’d be executed and die, a romantic story book ending that would live on in the heart of blitz with none of the living consequences for him. Not thinking of Octavia and what it might mean for her since he was caught up in the moment, living with no powers, servants, or family and with the grand gesture “failing” might feel like a fate worse than death. Though if everything is all roses within the next two episodes *shrugs* unfortunate

[@Scyclo]

@@Randomyoutuber-4831 yes, and it could of gone one of two ways, the execution or the banishment, I expected a banishment because of his status and his life still being valuable on account of him just being a goetia. I didn't think he would be executed because as far as we know he can't die unless it's an angelic weapon. They still haven't confirmed if they can die to demonic weapons.

[@MagmaPaint]

Octavia deserves to be in a better show.

[@SpiderNightcrawler]

I'm a simple guy. I see Borok Van Zieks, I click.

[@Lightarrow5738]

An important thing with writing characters like this is finding what intent you have and how you want them presented. For a character like Toga, I’d say accountability is necessary for her, and her power existing should not be an excuse but the reason explaining why she was casted out. Then she can choose to try and contain her power or let it control her. Effectively leaving it up to the character. None of her killings would be excused. An example from my writing is my main antagonist. He has the tragedy of losing his wife, and in grief, uses her cells to recreate her. In the end, he ends up with what is effectively now his own child and wishes to control every aspect of his child’s life. His backstory isn’t used to excuse his mistreatment of the child but to explain how grief controlled him, leading him to insanity and obsessively controlling his child’s life. This keeps it solely up to the character, making him alone responsible for his choices.

[@Grand_Pangeo]

So, Gabriel Agreste's backstory from Miraculous Ladybug in a nutshell?

[@mittag983]

​@@Grand_PangeoBut Gabriel has his actions excused

[@Zetaforce-uv8el]

I think the best broken character ever written has to be Gintoki Sakata from Gintama. Throughout the show we end up seeing bits and pieces of his backstory in the serious arcs while the lighthearted arcs allow us to bond to him and his friends and it culminates in The Very Final.

[@Rabbitlord108]

Seriously glad you expanded on the topic of talking about broken characters. And it reminds me that I still need to get around to watching Amazing Digital Circus. Especially since episode 4 is coming soon.

[@nevaehhamilton3493]

Episode 3 came out just last October! I think you meant to say Episode 4.

[@Rabbitlord108]

@nevaehhamilton3493 Yeah. You're right. Fixed it via an edit.

[@bahesb2419]

I love seeing you talk about great ace attorney here, loved that game. Hope you get to talk about it more often in your future vidoes.

[@Cure-Skywalker]

Megatron and Optimus Prime from Transformers One specifically. Unlike other continuities both characters come from the exact same background and experience nearly the same hardships because of the system they're both. How it effects them and they're relationship (and how that relationship falls apart). It's near perfect way to show how two characters can start as the same place but take completely different paths.

[@KeeKage37]

Jinx from Arcane is an excellent example of a tragic character. Her parents died and had to live in the rough streets of Zaun. All she wanted was to help the people she cared about in her life. To prove she’s not a Jinx. But her actions only end up making things worse. She ends up growing up and being the strongest member of Sylco’s gang. But she’s still tormented by the ghost of her past. When Jinx’s sister Vi comes back in her life there’s a turbulent story. Can Vi save the sister she once knew and loved? Is the monster Jinx all that’s left? Or are the two not so different as people think?

[@PlanetZoidstar]

Stolas is a decent character...But he is a terrible person who hurts everyone close to him. It annoys me that the narrative defends and babies him so much when he just isn't a good person deep down. He's too selfish, short-sighted and reckless for me to like him, and Octavia has suffered so much for his self-serving actions. Realistically she should want to cut him out of her life the way Hollyhock did to Bojack. He ruined her home life, subjected her to things no child should see their father do, and broke his promise to her.

[@PlanetZoidstar]

@@Randomyoutuber-4831 I'm sure that's the character that Viv intended to write when she added more to Stolas' backstory and character, but the fact he keeps repeating the same mistakes and keeps behaving selfishly makes it hard for me to sympathise with Stolas. It's like with Bojack from Bojack Horseman (a show Viv cites as a major inspiration for Helluva Boss), who likewise is a flawed individual whose trauma and personal hangups keep getting in the way. The difference being that Bojack's shortcomings aren't treated as an excuse by the narrative. With Stolas they are, that and he has active villains working against him to serve as convenient scapegoats. That and alot of the times Stolas' worst acts are treated as misunderstandings to further absolve him of fault.

[@26th_Primarch]

​​@@PlanetZoidstar when was it ever "being used as an excuse?"

[@PlanetZoidstar]

@@26th_Primarch Stolas' shitty upbringing under Paimon is used to excuse the way he mistreats Imps. Stella being abusive excuses Stolas' cheating. Stolas "trying" excuses him neglecting Octavia. Loona literally tells her to give him a break. Stolas getting his feelings hurt excuses him for dumping Blitzo, plus the We Hate Blitzo club all rally behind him to tell Stolas he did nothing wrong. Stolas sacrificing himself for Blitzo excuses him for abandoning Octavia. Viv can never just let Stolas be "the bad guy" in a situation, there is 'always' a caveat to make him seem less shitty.

[@26th_Primarch]

@@PlanetZoidstar so you have zero fucking clue about how constant abuse fucks with people and doesn't understand the goddamn difference between context and excuse.

[@gnicole1700]

The problem with stolas is that I feel like he never learns? What exactly changed with him from his first appearance? He pinned after Blitz until Full Moon and then he was just heartbroken until Mastermind. His whole arc and character always revolves around blitz it's crazy. Idk why we can't just explore his relationship with Stella and Octavia WITHOUT Blitz in the picture?? If you compare it to Blitz, who gets regularly called out, he learns to change even when he has terrible coping mechanisms, you can see that he tries. He tries to take accountability. That's not the case with Stolas. In my opinion, two of Stolas' biggest 'mistakes' are neglecting Octavia and being racist unintentionally towards Blitz. The former was addressed, but never solved, and the latter is just almost ignored 😅 saying it's Blitz's own self hatred that made him THINK Stolas doesn't look down on him

[@dragonturtle2703]

I think it can sort of justify that. For a kid, when what is normal to you and sort of need to do (or at least are compelled to) makes everyone look at you and treat you as a monster, at some point you just accept that "okay, guess I am a monster".

[@82844]

When you finally meet people who rewards you for being a monster, you wont ever attempt to go back to being normal from then on.

[@thescotsman5366]

Just because someone hurt you doesn't give you the right to hurt other people. A lot of characters will be given a sad past, and that makes their actions ok and their instantly forgive

[@plumaDshinigami]

Don't make "they're sad because of thing" the excuse to forgive all their negative behavior. The broken characters people love or can truly empathize with are the ones who the story holds accountable. Even villains can be broken characters done right if the writer doesn't play favorites and acknowledges or is aware enough to see unhealthy character traits. Let's take Demona from Gargoyles as an example - she is her own worst enemy and the show treats her accordingly. She is a tragic Shakespearean villain, but the show doesn't redeem her outright by showing how her actions harmed others to the point it's obsessive how much she wants to harm and destroy humans. And for as sad as her backstory is with the whole losing her clan and getting cursed as well as used by other bigger villains like a pawn, her actions always come back to haunt her as they should. She still doubles down on her narrow-minded drive to get payback on all of mankind regardless of the consequences, but she is not babied by the writers. Meanwhile, Chloe Price from Life is Strange is mad because her dad is gone yet the game practically encourages you to help with her vices and let her easily manipulate Max into committing crimes and abusing her powers for cheap thrills or stealing from charity without anyone daring to question her or point out why all fo that is morally repulsive.

[@shinkaiatsuya950]

Backstory doesn't justify a shitty personality. Basically, why i don't like Boa.

[@thebadger622]

Hancock?

[@shinkaiatsuya950]

@thebadger622 yes sorry didn't know had go include whole name.

[@thebadger622]

@@shinkaiatsuya950 I just guessed cause there could be dozens of characters with the name *Boa*.

[@YingYangDragon42]

dude, D-16 from Transformers One is an exceptionally well written broken character

[@nishchayjain1121]

But he became Megatron.

[@danielferrieri7434]

Vasago: Why isn’t Stolas here? shouldn’t he be here? We must summon him at once! Andrealphus: I’ll Ignore That.

[@bahesb2419]

The only thing that whould have improved barok van zieks's redemption arc even more is if barok smiled(at least once)in the end.

[@pinnyalt.5323]

Or if he had his redemption arc a little sooner i think, in the sense of him having a little of his good side showing in the Adventures? Because we only see more of his character in Resolve, but people i see playing the Adventures ends up almost hatibg him, and having a little hard time liking him in the sequel (I personally really like his character, this is just a small critique i have)

[@JMBoote1]

Honestly, that's an Ace Attorney trope I'm glad they didn't repeat. Hell, it happens in the first TGAA game, Adventures, with Gina smiling for the first time at the end of the final case.

[@pinnyalt.5323]

@@JMBoote1 and to be honest, it was really funny Susato saying he must be smilling and the scene cutting to him not smilling at all, its in character with him at this point ☠

[@RetroFan2.0]

Thank you for this it’s just so important to show than tell when portraying a character who’s gone through some rough periods of their lives, I just done see any impacts stolas has gone through if the treatment he gives to others isn’t thrown back at himself for any sort of self reflection at any given point, when he’s being confronted with those that were affected by it.

[@Opalhibiscus]

This video made me want to pick ace attorney up again

[@IndyMiraaga]

Every game plus investigations are on Steam now.

[@ArissaHaque]

Yes you should

[@DylanoRevs]

My reaction of what happened to Stolas in Mastermind: "You brought this on yourself."

[@CountShaman]

Except it doesn't matter because he got what he wanted in the end; His dream lover kissing his feet. At the cost of what? His job that we only see him do once? His daughter that got shafted for whole seasons? Pfft...

[@blitz3391]

It's even worst when you realize everything would have been settled down if he had just said "My book? Oh yeah i gave it to him for a bit, but i was constantly monitoring so no big problem. He didn't steal it, it was a mutual thing. Oh and i got the book back, i gave him a cristal with the benediction of one of the member of the Jury. Sooo...yeah, we cool?".

[@hunterstorys9330]

​@@blitz3391Apparently giving it willing would make it even worse for stolas.

[@JoseCido-s3s]

​@@hunterstorys9330Still the crystal part would still help him, since the business of I.M.P be illegal anymore,Sure, there would still be some problems because he was handing over the Grimoire to him before, but it would still have helped him.

[@starwolfwing7228]

@@hunterstorys9330yea. True. Even these stones that take them to human world are probably illegal. And only royal class can use it.

[@CountShaman]

Mastermind doesn't hold Stolas accountable at all. All it did is frame him as someone who lied to make a heroic sacrifice, and that Blitz needs to suck up to him over it. He's not scorned by imp kind for his misdeeds, he's scorned because he "lied with good intent", even though he absolutely deserved to get his power stripped after everything he did. Him leaving his daughter will not be portrayed as a mistake on his end. It's framed as the villains "manipulating him", so he didn't make a "conscious" decision to leave her. Sure, with how often he made decisions that actively avoids looking out for Octavia (Not worrying about Stella assassinating him and endangering Via in tandem, going to a pity party instead of looking out for her) he totallty seems like a good father who wouldn't wrong his daughter if given the chance. This stupid bird can't face consequences to save his life. Literally. Sinsmas is going to be a trainwreck, isn't it?

[@bp3269]

As I was watching season 2 and with each new episode slowly accepting that the writing around the overgrown chicken is not going to get better (even though I liked him in season 1), my only hope was that at the very least they'd be shelving the toxic ship nonsense and only bring it to the forefront again near the series finale (as we know it's set in stone for some godawful reason). But it looks like the Eternal Stolas Pity Party is not only not ending any time soon, even well into season 3, but now we get to watch the entire main cast lead by his main victim (which is especially sad) join in and demonstrate for us the only "correct" way the audience is intended to feel about and treat the "bestest sad birdboi". Hey, maybe they'll actually retcon everything about him once again in season 3 seeing as too many people "simply still don't get how incredibly sympathetic he is". That's apparently one of the only few things worth sacrificing screentime for aside from unfunny jokes and showcasing the new merch drop designs in the form of "new characters" that contribute nothing to the episodes.

[@royalxprincessbaka6875]

This. No matter how much Vizziepop and her fans insist that Stolas lack self-awareness and that he will get called out I future episodes, Mastermind just double down that everyone against Stolas are one-dimensional evil villains and his punishment is only there to make the audience feel bad for him. The fact that the trial doesn't actually call out his action actions and instead have him lying to save Blitz and him losing everything is treated as more pity points for Stolas with Blitz (the only character that called out his actions and got treated as if he was in the wrong) takes him in and it's implied they get back to together despite Stolas never apologizing for his treatment of someone he claims to love. I know there is still one more to address that, but the fact that it I the season final and Stolas' own trial still portrayed him in the right, Vizziepop I never going to call out her favorite character.

[@SousukeAizen421]

what did Stolas did to deserve punishment ?

[@CountShaman]

@@SousukeAizen421 Lending Blitz the grimoire illegally. He lied about his intent to use Blitz to conquer the living world, but he still actually did it for personal selfish pleasures. But of course, he won't say that, because then he'd have to admit to Blitz that he's the bad one in the relationship.

[@bp3269]

​@@SousukeAizen421 The sexual coercion of Blitz into their deal, molesting him even outside of the deal, consistently neglecting his daughter despite promising to never do it again each time... to name a few. Now I don't know if you meant morally or legally, but what I listed are huge character flaws that fall more under the moral category. Which don't necessarily deserve punishment at all, that's not the problem. The problem is that when you have a character with such flaws, there are usually two ways to go about it: Option 1: You at most acknowledge the flaws, but you don't need the character to fix them because you want them fill an amoral role eg. Stella works as the resident "petty bitch". Option 2: You acknowledge the flaws, make the character do the same, then make them learn from it and gradually become a better person, all on screen eg. Blitz is awful->gets shit for it->improves, in simple terms. In this case it's important to also point out that the character should be improved by the overall moral standards you have established for your story, case in point by the show's standards it's okay for Blitz murder people for a living, therefore it's not something he needs to fix. The problem with Stolas basically is that his character is currently Option 1 in terms of on screen execution, but his presented role is Option 2 but skipping the progression straight to the outcome. Or in a more pessimistic interpretation, he is presented as a character who never had these flaws in the first place.

[@YouFoundTheOcarina]

I don't even know the other guy, Barok Van Zieks in the thumbnail and I am already down for the ride

[@skyrogue1977]

It’s been my head-canon for a while that Divine had a similar upbringing to Aki. Being from an affluent family with no real need for anything. However, while Aki was fearful of her abilities, Divine reveled, and possibly used them to torment people because he could.

[@Zetaforce-uv8el]

With what we know of Z-One and his meddling with the timeline and Divine’s unfulfilled war with Iliaster it makes me wonder if he’s a Z-One creation that went rouge. We know he’s made and unmade people due to the Momentum Express arc,who’s to say he didn’t make more people to beef up the signers in the final timeline.

[@bahesb2419]

Another good example of a broken character is rick sanchez from rick and morty. Spoilers for rick and morty by the way so be carefull. Rick sanchez used to be a sweet family man until a rick from another universe took it all away. Our rick started searching for the man who destroyed his life throught the multiverse but through his search he began to ask himself: if there's an infinite amount of universes with an infinite amount of each person, how did any individual life matter. This led rick becoming a drunken cynic with a god complex.

[@jaywerner8415]

I think the Problem With Stolas is their has been ZERO CONSEQUENCES for his actions. And with Octavia being relegated to the role of a "plot device" and making Stolas sad, Stolas hasn't really changed at all. He's still depressed, still locked in his Gilded Cage, STILL seemingly forgetting he has a DAUGHTER! BLITZ on the other hand once he got the Crystal SHOULD have been laughing all the way to the bank, HE WON! But he can't get over his feelings for Stolas. Speaking of the last 2 Episodes of Hellvua Boss season 2, HOLY SHIT that last episode was a Rollercoaster ride! And Stolas finally got some Consequences, all be it a legal slap on wrist. But that shot of him realizing he F@#$ed up when Loona Hugs Blitz, oooo that is some _Emotional Damage_ . And I suspect the next episode is gonna be interesting. (although now that I think about it, The Ice peacock will probably be defeated by the power of LOVE)

[@charlie8829]

My problem is he never once apologizes for his actions these “consequences” arnt used to give stolas a reality check it’s used to make us feel sorry for him

[@jaywerner8415]

@charlie8829 And your not wrong. I don't think anyone really cares about Stolas anymore, I stopped caring the moment he gave Blitz the Crystal. We only really care about what happens to Octvia at this point cus GOD that owlet deserves so much better. Although I feel Stolas did have a brief moment of a "reality check" when he realized "shit, I just gave up my daughter". At least I think he might have.

[@peterwinter1962]

I'd like to think going forward, with Stolas having lost effectively EVERYTHING but Blitz at this point, it will give him more perspective. That last scene from Mastermind certainly seemed like he realised what he did after seeing Blitz ans Loona hug. To me that read as 'oh shit, I broke my promise to my daughter and abandoned her'. At least that feels like the intent. Of course I could be wrong, as I was expecting after showing Blitz's side of things and how he messed up they'd show Stolas as well, but they could still be saving that for later. Since now he's been stripped of his power and everything. Sure for only about a hundred years or until Octavia can take over his duties, but by then it'll effectively be too late for him to reconnect with his daughter. 100 years may seem like a slap on the wrist, but that's a long enough time to nurse a grudge against him. Especially his daughter who rightfully is upset with him. I still like this show and I'll still continue to enjoy it with my mates and girlfriend. But I do want to be more thoughtful and critical while still enjoying it. Granted, hearin̈g criticism about something you like can still be hard. XP I've admittedly gotten more serious about good storytelling after having played a couple of games from recent memory and just being able to tell the sheer difference in quality easily. Of course, writing can be difficult. Anything creative can. But doing it ad a hobby myself, I do think it's important to know what works and what doesn't. Hence why I'm doing my best to try and engage with criticism from stuff I like, as tricky as it can be. ^^; Anyway, excuse me for the tangent there. I'll personally keep hopeful for where Helluva Boss goes from here. But I'll try to be critical as well.

[@jaywerner8415]

@@peterwinter1962 Well we do have the next episode and supposedly 2 more seasons to go. So, all in do time I suppose. Mastermind hit all the right notes for grate episode, hopefully next one is a good follow up. People seemingly criticize this show on a Dailys basis it feels like, talking about the same shit over and over again. Like Hellvua Boss and Habin Hotel are not perfect, but people make them out like they are an absolute MESS where nothing makes any sense. I too intend to keep watching this show to the end. The Characters/Character Drama are what make this show so memorable. The only "real" issue I can say I find with Hellvua boss, are some Characters feel OVERUSED (Blitz and Stolas for example) or UNDERUSED (Loona, Mille, Octavia). Like every single character is interesting and we all want to know more about them, but we just don't get that for some of them. Like, Season 1 was AWSOME, because we got a good flow of Character development and every character had their moments to shine and grow. Season 2..... I can only describe it as "The fallout of Stolas and Blitz's relationship", cus its MOSTLY been about Blitz or Stolas all season. The 2 episodes about FIZZ were GRATE! Mastermind was GRATE! Moxxi and Millie got their backstories this Season. Loona got her Backstory from Blitz's point of view (ill take it but I want HER perspective if she has one). So.... yeah, Loona feels under used this season, and it really feels like Octavia is just a Plot Device for Stolas and to make us feel bad for him.

[@misterzygarde6431]

If I could. I’d totally help Himiko Toga drain the blood of Cinder Fall because I hate the latter. Also how the hell hasn’t Himiko gotten any disease from any of the people she’s drained the blood out of

[@pumpkinwarrior7138]

It could be a byproduct of her quirk but also I don’t think she’s drinking blood willy nilly

[@kurozunakabuto9682]

Himiko quirk probably help her with any Blood negative effects Like how Bakugo explosion is his sweat but his skin and hair are not effective on him

[@Yogaji]

Toga, Shigaraki and Dabi were all products of Hero Society, who became broken characters and thus villains, rebelling against said society in revenge. But they did pay the price for it in the end. None of them "go to jail" because you have to be alive for that. And will forever be known as said villains with the exception of one or two people.

[@pupununu3024]

In regards to Toga, much like other villains, I like to live by the trope of Freudian Excuse Is No Excuse. Himiko got rejected by the world around her for her blood quirk being seen as creepy and inhuman... that's fine, but like you said, she really didn't need to go off and murder people for blood. One of the things that doesn't make me sympathize with her is the fact she's obsessed with killing and trying to live as the people she kills at times. She's a fan of the Shitstain, one of the characters I hate the most in the series (the first being Shoto's shitty eldest brother), and this drives her to join up with more murderers. Hell, she fell for Izuku just because she loves him being blood covered... Once she gets embroiled in the whole PLF thing, she tries to go on about how she wants to live her life without stress, and then breaks down when told she has to live with the consequences of her actions. To the end, she goes on a big rampage trying to keep on killing people because one of her fellow killers died, and the fandom really expects us to believe his killer is the bad guy because the guy wasn't well, which is just making excuses. That, and for some odd reason people like to think she's "genderless" or something because she can shapeshift? I really don't like that obsession... also something about people really thinking her and the space girl would be endgame and screaming at the author for "baiting" them... as a whole, I feel like Himiko could've been done better if they really wanted to do the Redemption Equals Death thing with her, cause the way I see it, she dies a villain even if space girl reasons with her a bit.

[@k.k8025]

I also hate how they tried to relate Toga with Ochako like, they are not two sides of the same coin or anything like I honestly don't get it

[@riotkitty]

If I had a nickel for everytime the Tumbler side of the internet wanted to push a serial killing shapeshifter as genderless non-binary representation, I’d have about four nickels. Including Orchimaru from Naruto. I don’t know what people are trying to convey with that trend, but it is very strange considering how many keep harping for positive representation while also at the same time, praising the most horrible characters imaginable for said representation.

[@ChildOfCosmos]

​​@@riotkittyOrochimaru I can kind of understand, since in Boruto he says that it doesn't matter if he's Mitsuki's father or mother since he's been both genders before when shapeshifting. But I agree with you, and I found it very weird when people tried to say that Camilo from Encanto has body dysmorphia/is trans... like, no? He just shapeshifts 😓

[@topcat59]

Honestly I feel like they should’ve gave Toga’s quirk some negative down sides that heavily encourages her to kill, make it more understandable why she believes being a villain is her only path in life.🐱

[@RJLiams]

Wasn't it because the villains actually accepted her? In a society that encourages quirks she was rejected, shamed, and shunned for her abilities. Like Shigaraki, no one saw any potential in her and cast her aside or forced her to hide her quirk. It wasn't until a villain saw the potential she had and brought her in. She felt like she actually had friends and a place she can be herself without worry. Her quirk doesn't need a negative downside. The mere existence of her quirk is the negative downside.

[@topcat59]

Toga wasn’t never encouraged to kill before she joined the league, since she killed her crush out of her own desires and no one pushed her to do that and she even tried to kill tomura when he threaten both Dabi and her when they tried to join up, it’s the main reason why she needs a few downsides on her quirk to justify the killings.🐱

[@nicholasfarrell5981]

​@RJLiams "no one saw any potential in her and cast her aside" oh please, say the same thing about Touya and suddenly you're a simp.

[@connorwood9211]

It was stated it affected her mentally giving her more fascination and desire towards blood. Issue is that aspect was barley touched upon

[@icarue993]

Problem is she saw drinking blood as an act of love, this is the downside.

[@Dummma]

I guess you could say..... Genshin really had a deep Impact on Barok.

[@dmittleman9757]

My current favorite “broken” character would have to be season 1 Jinx (I say season 1 because I haven’t and am not interested in seeing season 2). Not only was her childhood traumatic, with the effects still lingering in the present, but she tragically resigns herself to being “broken”. To her, there’s no going back and no way to course correct.

[@fionna_cool_girl]

Genuinely curious why you're not interested in watching season 2

[@AJ64]

@@fionna_cool_girl me too 👀

[@dmittleman9757]

@@fionna_cool_girlJust not really interested.

[@pumpkinwarrior7138]

@@dmittleman9757not being interested after the cliffhanger of s1 doesn’t even sound right

[@Jane_Doe-o4r]

@@dmittleman9757 Fair. S2 was....interesting, to say the least. S1 was better in my opinion.

[@86fifty]

Came for the Great Ace Attorney in the thumbnail, stayed for the absolute batsh!t KR Gavv lore

[@TerryB01]

With MHA and Jetjetsu Kaisen ending and people having mixed feelings can you do a video on the "right and wrong way" to do a series finale?

[@TheDragons345]

Personality to give Aki's parents some leeway(not excusing), they didn't/don't know jack about Psychic powers or anything supernatural and they just rich but normal people. While Toga's parents know what Quirks are and what it does to people, they could've sit down with Toga and teach her while supporting how to control her urges. Not telling Toga to bury her urges and live "normal" just like with Iceman and his parents from the Xmen which is kinda dumb considering the world of MHA where superpowers are the norm while Yugioh 5ds is somewhat grounded (Signers, Demons, and Robots not withstanding). I'm more sympathetic and understanding towards Aki's parents than Toga's parents, they had options and they chose a very bad one.

[@spicynoodles2742]

Can we add Catra in how not to write a broken character? like I love her character, but waiting 5 seasons to redeem her was dumb.

[@sunlesswarrior]

That's really the only issue I have with helluva boss Trying to portray Stolas as not in the wrong and such especially with how the writers keeps enforcing the idea he didn't do anything wrong. I love the show and quite frankly I personally love Octavia and Stolas but it is hard to ignore how they written stolas

[@EuletteAbenir]

Vivzie has a tendency to defend all of her favorite characters especially the ones that give her more money, like in Hazbin Hotel, how they all blame Husker for dismissing Angel Dust's advances?? Also apparently it's fine for Sir Pentious to be SAd and yet get sappy over Angel's backstory of also getting Sa'd? Talk about biacy

[@bahesb2419]

Another good example of a broken charachter is emio from emio the smiling man. Spoiler warnings here. He used to be a loving person that gone insane because of the abuse of his alcoholic father and the death of his younger sister, thus becamong the nightmare known as emio. What makes emio so tragic is that he isn't truly evil, just broken inside. I view him to be similar to classic horror icons like jason voorhees or leatherface cause like them, he doesn't kill out of malice but because they are still children inside and don't know any better. Because emio never got the pleasure of a normal childhood, he doesn't understand what is truly right and wrong and thinks he is doing his victims a favor: if they laugh and smile in front of him, to him, it means they will have a good life. If they show fear in front of him,to him, it means that they will always be afraid and killing them whould be freeing them from this painful world.

[@thatonevnguy]

What bout Orsted from Mushoku Tensei? Like this man is quite literally capable of destroying the world (according to Hitogami's words), but instead he's limited by his mana capacity and accepts Rudeus's help with solving all the problems. I've had a literal chills at the end when he helped Rudeus with defeating an overpowered enemy after saying "you've already done enough, thanks".

[@exaltedfinalist9488]

When I saw this video, I thought broken meant like gojo or Superman type of “broken” Good video nonetheless bro, keep up the great work

[@silverscorpio24]

Ironically, the biggest morally gray broken character RWBY had the writers turned into a crazy Atlas supremacist because they had the main characters lie to him for no reason.

[@BurningAzure]

Ironwood?

[@thefanwithoutaface8105]

Sensui from Yu Yu Hakusho could also be considered a good example of a broken character. He was born with incredible spirit powers which made him a target for demons, which he managed to fight back and kill in self defense and later became a Spirit Detective because he thought and was told demons were purely evil while humans were good. However, after meeting a friendly demon, sort of, and watching a group of humans torture demons for their own sick enjoyment his mind effectively snapped as he now couldn't tell if all the demons he'd killed in the past were genuinely evil or simply misunderstood creatures. This results in Sensui essentially going on a suicidal quest to open a portal into Demon World while also believing humanity is too evil to let live and destroy it.

[@erinlohnas5945]

I found Sensui's motivations weak compared to Younger Toguro. Yeah it absolutely sucks to have your worldview shattered, but Younger Toguro literally had all of his students butchered and he wasn't able to stop it. I think his loss was far more of a legitimate breaking point, especially since it comes out later that he wasn't the "big bad" in the end that the characters thought he was.

[@kindasomeviews]

I can see why we didn't bring him up, but still surprised we didn't talk about Guts. Wouldn't blame you if you made that Membership-only

[@hazelgrunts]

I want to like Stolas but I just don’t see why I should when he’s so inconsiderate of others. I understand that he never had a proper role model and doesn’t understand why the way he treats imps is wrong but he doesn’t have an excuse for how he treats Octavia and he is still responsible for how he treated Blitz. Blitz was very clear about how he wanted to be treated but Stolas chose to ignore it. Blitz has his own faults as well, but at least he’s likeable in some areas. (Obligatory “this is just my opinion”)

[@hazelgrunts]

@ I don’t think he’s some irredeemable monster or anything and I understand that the situation is complex, it’s just harder for me to sympathize with him than with Blitz because Blitz tries to better himself more, even if that often backfires and makes the situation worse. Perhaps part of the problem is simply a blind spot in my experiences as a person because I know that many people relate to Stolas and many people don’t like Blitz the way I don’t like Stolas.

[@starry-eyedatstarryskies1797]

I know you already did a video on him, but for me I think a perfect example of how to give a villain a sympathetic backstory without excusing their actions is Doflamingo. The audience can watch the tragedy play out and imagine how things could've been different while still hating Doffy for what he's done to not only Law and Corazon, but also the citizens of Dressrosa. I also think he's a far more interesting villain than Kaido, Big Mom, or Orochi despite them also having sympathetic backstory and are equally hateable.

[@Mohammed1000real]

Am i surprised that Helluva Boss completely fails at this? Obviously not.

[@HarleyCringe]

never expected to see a video comparing Van Zieks to Stolas but here for the ride anyway

[@Jellyfish667]

Stolas, they are setting it up that he is forced to realize why blitzed acts the way he does and why stolas addressing him in such a way made him act the way he did. They are setting him up to realize what he did. I do realize that both parties have done things wrong, and it was a mild abusive relationship where both parties were in it for personal gain then it formed into something more.

[@artistanthony1007]

That should've happened in Apology Tour :/

[@capybaragames347]

Looking back on this after the new Helleva Boss episode, they did seem to take your criticism of Stolas and gave him a whole arc about him accepting he was in the wrong for what he was doing with Blitzo, effectively saving Blitzo but taking responsibility for his own actions.

[@Toshineko]

This video essay made me glad I did NOT make Toshineko, Mason Smith, or any other villains in my story in any way sympathetic, despite their sympathetic backstories. Both of them were taken advantage of before and pretty much use people as pawns for their plans, with Toshineko using false flag operations to have two superpowers fight each other and Mason using his organization, the W.J.O, to gain profit and stroke his own ego. I believe people who try to write sympathetic villains can get this wrong. There's a difference between a sympathetic backstory and actually BEING sympathetic. If the writers can't give them any redeeming qualities, why should we the audience sympathize with them?

[@kurozunakabuto9682]

I generally love how Kinoku Nasu writes his broken characters But mainly highlighting the male leads Because whooo boy they are very mess up in the head

[@commonviewer2488]

Too bad 5Ds dropped the cult plotline, Aki's story was never properly finished. She needed to confront her abuser, who definitely survived the Dark Signers, because everyone else did! Plus, his interest in the Spirit World would tie into the twins as well! Divine could've targeted them, kicking off another arc.

[@SiliconSlyWolf]

You've expressed an opinion on the Net, therefore you have automatically pissed someone off, sad fact of nature

[@omarkumar8036]

24:13 😂Bruh ! What did I witness ?

[@hikarihakai1285]

Good old Kamen Rider Capable of really dark and really wacky goofy scene

[@BlisteredBlood]

I think I get Stolas in a sense as a character. He was forced into a life that just wasn't meant for him, his selfish bitch of a wife notwithstanding as well as the backroom politicking. By the same token though, his actions in how he goes about it doesn't exactly make him the so-called "perfect lil' angel" everyone goes on about. But when I compare him to this character, the differences are night-and-day. BJ Blazkowicz, or more specifically, from the Wolfenstein reboots, save for maybe New Colossus, depending on how you feel about it. This man has literally been through the absolute wringer, a war where America surrendered to the Axis after New York was nuked off the face of the earth, BJ himself had been in a coma for about 15 years after a failed invasion on German soil, his friends were killed right in front of him, but he just couldn't stop. Not until all of the Nazis were dead. During all of this, you hear BJ's inner monologue all throughout the first and second games of the Wolfenstein reboots where you can feel the agony of what he went through bear down on his shoulders like the stone Atlas himself carried. In short, the man was an absolute trainwreck of emotions, but he told himself over and over that he had to keep going. He had to keep fighting. But this presents a question. What would happen once the fighting's done? What happens when the war's over? Would he be able to finally rest? Could he finally put the gun down, unlace those wartorn boots and lay his head down on that pillow and sleep soundly? Well, that's the problem. The man never slows down and he doesn't know when to quit even as his body continues to age and wear down, so it's hard to know where the line's drawn at.

[@reptiliannoizezz.413]

I was not expecting to see a connection being drawn between Helluva Boss... and Wolfenstein Now you got me imagining a FPS set in the Hellaverse lol

[@BlisteredBlood]

@@reptiliannoizezz.413 I mean, there was literal demons unleashed by the Germans at one point in the '09 reboot, but it's been made non-canon.

[@icarue993]

I feel most villains in MHA are broken people, not just Toga. Higaraki killed his whole family for being shunned by his powers and due to the hatred of quirks all together due to All Might's teacher. This affected him being belief and now wants to kill everyone. Twice had a mental disorder accentuated by his quirk, that die to his economic status just created a cascade of poor descitions (which is probably true from some real life criminals). Dabi had Endevour as a dad... enough said. While its true that there's some accountability to be had, I think the reason they were all written this way is to show how there are no institutions that helped them (and or how easy its for them to fall with a bad mentor/experience). Twice quite literally can be fixed with some medication and therapy, his main issue is MPD. Toga, Dabi and Higaraki lacked proper paternal support that a proper institution could just take them to better parents/places where to teach them how to use their quirks (Cough Xavier's school of gifted children cough). For Higaraki specifically, if Aki is not at liable because she was tricked and saw how much life was better without her, I would say Higaraki would be in the same boat. All for One tainted the child's mind beyond belief, and wouldn't be surprised he organized everything in the shadows. Maybe its a bit political to say, but I think they just show how the lack of proper mental/developmental institutions can f* people up if they are not properly attended to

[@82844]

Youre right. Xmen had a safe haven while MHA had an outcast cult. Its an easy parallel how the hand that reaches out (which is MHA's over arching theme) is the reason why they have villains at all.

[@silverscorpio24]

If any of you have seen Gargoyles, good for you! You win at humanity! If not, uh, mild spoilers I guess. I don't know if he's technically broken, but my favorite antagonist of the series is David Xanatos (basically Tony Stark turned bad). He's selfish. He's egotistical. He sees (almost) anyone and everything as tools he can use. HOWEVER, there is an episode in Season 2 where he gets married to his girlfriend, Fox. In this episode, we meet David's parents, and we see pretty much why Xanatos is the way he is: his mom is an oblivious coddler and his dad is a massive jerk. David finds a time travel device, invites his parents to his wedding, travels to beautiful Scotland in the 1700s, and has everything arranged for a gorgeous occasion and his parents are the only people of his family he has invited. And his father is unimpressed. He complains the whole time. He doesn't like Fox's questionable background. He is unfazed at the magical device his son discovered. He even complains about the cost of the whole thing. We see the David has been trying to impress his dad his whole life, which drove him to become such a cutthroat businessman. And that in turn turned him into a cold manipulator. And he learned from his dad that emotionally investing in someone doesn't really get you anywhere, because they never return the favor. Even at the beginning of the series the Gargoyles turn on him (for good reasons) after he wakes them from their sleeping curse. After Xanatos gets married, we see a small change in him. He's still antagonistic and can't be trusted, he we see he actually cares for Fox. And even risks his life for his newborn son. And he helps the heroes save the world a couple times with no ulterior motives. He's the perfect broken character that's also a sympathetic villain.

[@irisravenhild9060]

I hate Solas,. He was an interesting character until the new writing of him in season 1 episode 7. And all the fan fiction of Blitz and Solas in episodes that are about their relationship is disgusting. I've tried to watch season 2 of Helluva Boss, but I had to give up after a few episodes.

[@videogamerzero1schannel]

Back at it again with another interesting topic & I love the section with the Yugioh & My Hero of the broken characters & know you just prefer one over the other on how they're executed but still acknowledging on they're still written good while also bringing up the flaws of both, which is totally fair now as for my good & bad examples of a broken character Tosai Furesawa aka Fret from Neo: The World Ends With You - I've brought him back on my Twitter account (back when I still used it but can't after the muskrat ruined the site) so I'll just repeat what I said while adding in new info because TWEWY is some of my favorite series of all time, he seems like a very upbeat going with the flow with everything but it's to cover the fact he's super depressed since he feels mega guilty from not saving his friend from killing themselves & in the end just resorts to putting on a mask by just pretending to be happy until he eventually looks up to Kanon since she was his hero as she was genuinely happy & confident in herself until something going on in the Reaper's Game, she gets erased & looks ready to be depressed & gives up on everything until some encouragement with Beat's own personal pep talk by not ever forgetting about her for what she taught him plus it was also why Rindo always never truly thinking for himself as he always followed Fret's lead & why he typically let others choose for him, which probably didn't help as Fret was masking all his personal issues, that might be me looking too deep but it nonetheless is a testament to how Neo TWEWY was a perfect sequel to this series for me & long time fans wanting a new game Reiji Arisu from Namco X Capcom/Project X Zone - Apologies for keep bringing up this series as much as people used to & still does dunk on Jasper Batt Jr. from No More Heroes 2 or in your case with RWBY & your birds of prey (Crow/Qrow/Stolas) but that's just how much of a testament to how much this series meant to me & why I'm upset at everything it is, now back to what I was going to say, Reiji is unphased at his tragedy which used to be a focus on in Namco X Capcom but by the time of Project X Zone 1 & 2, it NEVER gets brought up! He just reacts to Saya as another bad guy, THE FOX HAG THAT KILLED HIS DAD! This is like if Ragna from Blazblue never had that rent free hatred against Terumi despite being the guy that gave him the worst childhood imaginable! Or more popular examples, imagine if Samus never reacted to Ridely even tho that literal monster KILLED HER BIRTH PARENTS & FOSTER PARENTS! Or imagine if Cloud never reacted to seeing Sephiroth showing up even tho that's the guy that killed Aerith RIGHT IN FRONT OF HIM & burned down Tifa's home town! It's just so bad Reiji is such an after thought that has a tragic backstory but it's never elaborated since the Project X Zone series isn't interested in telling a good story, it just wants to weaponize the IPs of who's included in some of the worst game series I've played & why I'll actively hate this series the same way people still hate on Paper Mario Sticker Star

[@Benjamin-mj9pd]

Cinder is basically that girl on CoD who finds a good weapon and wants to Leeroy Jenkins it. Stolas is that guy who let his emotions dictate his actions and does bad things out of those emotions realized what he’s doing and is just now getting what he deserves.

[@patrickdees5256]

I love Van Zieks' character arc.

[@catboysephiroth560]

Very, very nieche, but I'd kill to hear you talk about Nox from Wakfu, and how desperation can spur anyone into madness. How obsession can make us blind, and ultimately how the resulting arrogance will kill you, and harm others. The voice acting (in english anyway) is a bit ameture, but Wakfu is still a fun series. Another character suggestion (also Wakfu) could be Rubilax, for how not to have a twist good guy. I love him, funny little earth demon, little guy, babey, but he's not really well written and his good guy twist is pretty forced and poorly excused.

[@michelleg2743]

I think Vash from Trigun is a good tragic character.

[@kurozunakabuto9682]

I seen the cinder backstory in a different story I read(manga) But there's only one difference the cinder mentor equivalent immediately ask "what happen! What did you do!" and later on regret on how he half-assed his mentorship and how he should have done better Like this should not be hard to mess up

[@mayzera]

The thumbnail made me realize that I hate Barok and Stolas for the same reason LMAO I would never have noticed it otherwise, ty I guess 😅

[@lunerblade13]

Speaking of Cinderella nikkes Cinderella is much more broken.

[@coolman229]

Another problem with Cinder’s backstory is that the show wants you to believe that Faunus are mistreated and used as slave labor. But instead of using Faunus as a servant and doing what we’re supposed to think is generally accepted in a lot of societies in Remnant, they use a human girl?

[@LoretoArtistry]

I'm just gonna leave this comment as a note for myself so don't mind me. Main points: 1. Does the character learn from their tragedy and change as a person? 2. Does the character fall into a deeper spiral and go mad? 3. Or does the character use go into a phase of hiding the pain? Tragic backstories should ENHANCE the character not an excuse or shield for them to use. How does the tragedy affect them as a person and future? 1. How does the tragedy affect their future descions??? 2. Will they learn to take accountability? This video was very insightful thank you very much :3

[@hanadunn7297]

I wasn’t surprised that Cinder was used as bad example of a broken character because her backstory felt like bad rip off of her character inspiration and was introduced far too late for anyone to care about it. Also making her start out as a psychopathic orphan who was sold into slavery was the worst approach because it made it impossible to sympathize with her or understand her even.

[@CringeAnimePFP160]

The director from Red vs Blue is pretty cool. I think he fits the broken character theme pretty well.

[@toadlord8594]

What About characters like Eren Yeager - when The Hero becomes The Villain.

[@littlelotus4572]

Naaa I completely despise Toga’s character, like boo hoo she was abused and bullied as a child but I some how don’t care after witnessing her off a number of people that are in the triple digits either by her hand directly or through assistance; she is just so narcissistic and irritating that I’m convinced that the only reason why people like her as a character is because she’s an infantilized cute girl that people with a “I can fix her” complex would go nuts over. Tbh all of MHA’s villains are fine up until the story tries to make you feel bad for them and then I’m just sitting here like, why should I give two craps how they parents personally abused them when they’ve got at least 3 graveyards each that they personally filled

[@ArissaHaque]

I LITERALLY SMILED SO HARD WHEN I SAW BAROK ON THE THUMBNAIL

[@RahRizzle123]

I hate how much they want to make you feel bad for Stolas. As an avid fan of Tomura Shigaraki down to his final moments I felt bad for him and do so many ppl. The way he was written gave him decent reasoning to some of his crimes and raise into villiany. The only issue was his end but let's not get into that(it pisses me off) His story is grooming and trying to shit down a system heros have stapled ever since quirks awakened. He's more sympathetic then a lot of characters. Hell most of the LOV are

[@HopeTatic]

BAROK VAN ZIEKS!??!!! YES PLEASE!!

[@KeeKage37]

I’d argue that Stolas did try and realize that he did wrong in apology tour. He even says in the song that perhaps he made mistakes in the relationship. It’s just that Verosika and Vortex are gassing him as background singers implying that he did nothing wrong. Kinda contradictory, but this is a Blitzo hate party there at. Wrong place for an unbiased opinion. As for the big reveal with the Asmodian crystal. It doesn’t help matters that Blitzo took every opportunity to not see Stolas so it’s not like they could talk before hand. Also Stolas has shown he has a hard time communicating theee things like with his talk with Octavia. And his only reference to romance are these tella novella that he watches. We’re big dramatic displays are key. I mean he has no relationship experience since his only relationship was arranged and it was to a hatful harpy that only tormented his his hole marriage.

[@g04234]

Speaking of Cinder, you can also try to make a video on the right and wrong way to make a power hungry character with characters like vergil from dmc as a right.

[@woeisme7441]

I like it when the bad guys are rat bastards at the end of the day. I can sympathize with how Toga came to be the person she was, and I'm fine with that being that. I don't have to condone her decision to be a rat bastard, it doesn't have to be rational because human beings are naturally irrational creatures.

[@arilumani6194]

Here are more video ideas: Phoenix Wright - Ace Attorney's Greatest Hero Redemption Done Right - Miles Edgeworth Eddie Fender - The Right Way to Make a Comic Relief Overhated Characters - Larry Butz The Right and Wrong Way to Make a Sidekick Maya Fey - The Right Way to Make a Sidekick Athena Cykes - The Right Way to Make a Heroine Terrible Characters - Sheldon Lee Redemption Done Right - Sunset Shimmer Redemption Done Right - Starlight Glimmer Redemption Done Right - Discord Pinkie Pie - The Right Way to Make a Comic Relief Sokka - The Right Way to Make a Comic Relief Terrible Characters(?) - Zephyr Breeze Magnus McGilded - The Successful Ace Attorney Villain Ashley Graydon - Making a Tragic Villain Mael Stronghart - The Right Way to Make a Twist Villain Villains Done Right - Redd White Villains Done Right - Luke Atmey Villains Done Right - Furio Tigre Villains Done Right - Damon Gant Villains Done Right - Roger Retinz Acro - Making a Tragic Villain Mimi Miney - Making a Tragic Villain Denji - Making a Tragic Hero Makima - The Right Way to Make a Female Villain Pain - Naruto's Greatest Villain Obito Uchiha - Making a Tragic Villain The Tragic End of Konan The Tragic End of Zabuza and Haku Itachi Uchiha - Making a Tragic Hero Overhated Characters - Trixie (My Little Pony) Franziska Von Karma - The Right Way to Make a Rival The Right and Wrong Way to Make a Mentor Jiraiya - The Right Way to Make a Mentor Princess Celestia - The Right Way to Make a Mentor The Right and Wrong Way to Make a Tomboy Rainbow Dash - The Right Way to Make a Tomboy Joseph Joestar - The Greatest JoJo Jonathan Joestar - The Most Underrated JoJo The Right and Wrong Way to Make a Stoic Hero Jotaro Kujo - The Way to Make a Stoic Hero Jolyne Kujo - The Right Way to Make a Heroine Part 8 Josuke - The Amnesiac JoJo Heroes Done Right - Johnny Joestar Kenshiro - The Right Way to Make a Stoic Hero Villains Done Right - Raoh Rei - Making a Tragic Hero (Fist of the North Star) Storm King - My Little Pony's Most Divisive Villain Shadow Tempest - The Right Way to Make a Female Villain Villains Done Right - Tirek Villains Done Right - Cell Goku - Dragon Ball's Greatest Hero Redemption Done Right - Vegeta Redemption Done Right - Piccolo Villains Done Right - King Piccolo Villains Done Right - Sosuke Aizen Samus Aran - The Right Way to Make a Heroine Villains Done Right - Amon Villains Done Right - Zaheer Azula - The Right Way to Make a Female Villain Ozai - Avatar's Greatest Villain Kuvira - The Right Way to Make a Female Villain Unalaq - Avatar's Most Divisive Villain Jenny Wakeman - The Right Way to Make a Heroine Vexus - The Right Way to Make a Female Villain Villains Done Right - Fawful Cackletta - The Right Way to Make a Female Villain Terrible Characters(?) - Wendy Oldbag Bell Cranel - The Right Way to Make an Everyman Hero Ethan Winters - The Right Way to Make an Everyman Hero Twice - Making a Tragic Villain Villains Done Right - All For One Villains Done Right - Tomura Shigaraki Villains Done Right - Dabi The Right and Wrong Way to Make a Sequel The Right and Wrong Way to Make a Prequel The Right and Wrong Way to Make a Sympathetic Villain Amuro Ray - Gundam's Greatest Hero Char Aznable - Gundam's Greatest Villain Haman Karn - The Right Way to Make a Female Villain Rustal Elion - The Successful Gundam Villain Terrible Characters - Kazuya Kinoshita Terrible Characters - Marinette Dupain-Cheng Villains Done Right - Johan Liebert Villains Done Right - Friend (20th Century Boys) Villains Done Right - Excelsius Winner Eustace Winner - The Right Way to Make a Broken Character Kay Faraday - The Right Way to Make a Sidekick Shih-na - The Right Way to Make a Female Villain Quercus Alba - Ace Attorney's Villain

[@samflood5631]

What about any videos relating to Tokyo Ghoul, Spy X Family, Zom 100, Delicious in Dungeon, X-Men 97, Kite Man Hell Yeah and Creatures Commando?

[@ryancarson6962]

The problem with this list is a rather simple one: what if he doesn't share these opinions? What if he doesn't think Starlight Glimmer is a good example of redemption? What if he simply doesn't care enough about the character or topic to make a whole video over it? What if he doesn't even know the series or character listed? I mean not everyone watches Miraculous Ladybug. There's just a lot of stuff you aren't considering when making suggestions like this.

[@arilumani6194]

@samflood5631 Those are potential videos too. MangaKamen should definitely make videos about these shows.

[@MissRora]

I must disagree with Athena being a good heroine. Her personality plays off Apollo and Phoenix's well, and got the makings of a good _supporting_ character, like filling Maya's shoes... but when the focus shifts to her, it feels like a fanfic writer creating their self-insert. As for a female protagonist _actually_ done well, I'd suggest Mythra from Xenoblade 2.

[@CringeAnimePFP160]

Damn you really planned out his whole schedule for the next 5 years

[@lioN1313yn]

One character you can talk about is the android uints from NieR Automa. 2B, 9S, and A2 have lots of lore behind them before you start the game which hides their tragic history and what makes the broken near the end of the game.

[@rachelmariecaberapacheco7942]

Jinx, a broken character...can a monster be forgiven?

[@javonscruggs8233]

My problem with Toga is she chose to hurt people and kill whoever she pleases without any guilt. Yes her backstory is sad but that doesn't execuse her horrible actions. She could have gotten her blood through other means like from animals or possibly a blood bank she chose to basically be a serial killer. I just don't find her that sympathetic to me.

[@samflood5631]

Is Lady Nagant sympathetic? I mean she was used by the Super Hero Community to kill anyone they deem a threat and she turned evil because she felt ashamed of all of the horrible things she’s done.

[@eriksvoboda6973]

@@samflood5631Nagant is sympathetic for what was done to her, but dumb as hell for deciding to work for that world's Satan when busted out of prison. Seriusly, she has issues doing morally questionable work for the government, but agrees to hunt down a kid for king of villains ?

[@riotkitty]

Yeah I have the same opinion about Toga, yes it’s sad that she is essentially a broken person who never understood society and why they were scared of her, but she is still a sociopathic serial killer. Heck I give some flack to her parents too, because I don’t know what I would do in that situation if that were my child, killing animals and drinking their classmates’ blood. I think Toga’s redemption should’ve involved her parents to some extent and clearing the air. Don’t have to become a happy family again, just having Toga realizing why her parents called her a monster and in turn, having them know where they went wrong in raising her. In my opinion, that would’ve done a lot in making her redemption in the story be more believable.

[@nicholasfarrell5981]

I'd be surprised that people think Toga's a tragic victim of society instead of just another monster like Touya, but then I remember that Toga's attractive and therefore those people will do _anything_ to defend their imaginary crush.

[@pumpkinwarrior7138]

@@nicholasfarrell5981I think if she has Inko as a mom she’d have been raised fine It wouldn’t have been easy but she wouldn’t have been who she is now She is a victim of society