The Titan Submersible Cataclysm: What we Know so Far (Special)

[@starrynyte158]

The horrible irony of a vessel's owner who thinks his vessel can't fail, going to a see a vessel who was mistakenly thought of as unsinkable.

[@alcerz984]

The titanics deceased got tired of getting bothered. There was no sacred burial.

[@GlueFactoryBJJ]

You forgot it being filled with wealthy people who were confident in it's unsinkabilty and a submersible named "Titan" visiting the "TITANic". Then again, I think James Cameron saw this irony also.

[@embersstark7126]

The legend has come full circle.

[@heartlights]

Needs a gay love story

[@isaiahaguilera7710]

There is a book called "The Wreck of The Titan" that was based off of the Titanic. So they literally named it after a doomed vessel.

[@thrillho4209]

9:05 'Needlessly prioritised passenger safety over commercial innovation' is such a mindblowing statement. Especially when discussing an industry that transports millions of people every year.

[@robrtfranchina]

The jackass in chief probably never looked up the word innovation because innovation was not utilized in the least in this case.

[@sgxthach]

"Now there's one wreck, sitting next to another wreck, for the same damn reason." This is so poignant and true. It's been over a hundred years since the Titanic sank and it still feels like we haven't learned from our own arrogance.

[@RCorvinus]

Thousand of years ago, the ancients knew a simple truth: those whom the Gods would destroy, they first made proud. Is it any wonder the level of schadenfruende leveled against the CEO?

[@youtuber5305]

Humans never learn. (Do I sound like Spock?)

[@DavidSmith-ze2wi]

@@RCorvinus Quos deus vult perdere, prius dementat. Those whom God wishes to destroy, he first makes mad. Seems it would have been a fitting company motto.

[@bobbyrayofthefamilysmith24]

@@RCorvinus Sure bro whatever

[@dougaldouglas8842]

Titanic, and Titan says something

[@deawinter]

There’s SO many problems with the Titan, but the one that gave me chills was the combination of “hatch bolted from the outside” and “equipment inside that isn’t tested for fire safety.”

[@deawinter]

a death so fast they probably didn’t even feel it was not the worst case scenario here.

[@MsSteelphoenix]

@@deawinter The moment I heard that, I was reminded of Apollo 1. Absolutely right.

[@cantfindmykeys]

What gave me chills was naming it the Titan(ic). Doomed.

[@seanrudy80]

As a former actual Submariner for 10 years, I can say that this thing was not a submarine. It was a literal deep sea coffin.

[@jefferynelson]

the thing about "no veterans need apply" , where else do people get real life submarine experience ?

[@ValMartinIreland]

Well said.

[@latenighter1965]

This thing made 20 bottom of ocean trips successfully. Even more then once to the Titanic. Hell NASA killed more people above ground.

[@guily6669]

@@latenighter1965 Well other submarines with crazy amount of years have done thousands of expeditions all over the place at high depths...

[@nickzeiders5952]

@@latenighter1965 a catastrophic failure rate of 5% sounds good to you?

[@Hykje]

Every time it dived the hull got a little bit weaker until it couldn't handle the pressure anymore and when carbon fiber is overstressed it does not bend it breaks with no warning.

[@NThaScopeStudio1]

They should have retired it and had the next one ready to go, the problem with people is they want to just keep using the same thing over and over again w/o repair, I am guilty of that myself on things like cars, if you want it to be at peak it's got to be serviced and in this case you can only use it a few times then retire it. R.I.P to the four that were just the passengers. I agree @doomspud6302 that the captain went down with his ship, that is noble enough for his corner cutting.

[@jdllewellyn5802]

Carbon fiber certainly shows signs of stress/fatigue as does the resin holding it. You'd have to look for it though. That's where the main issue seems to lay.

[@bobatesomemayo]

They wanted to be the spacex of ocean exploration, without realizing spacex completely refurbishes the rockets everytime

[@Eric..Cartman]

So, this sub imploded after 14-15 trips to titanic. With each trip making about 1 million dollars, i think , owner could have replaced this sub after every 10 trips( assuming, sub can be built under 3-4 million at max). But he was too greedy. He wouldn't let go of even a penny of profit.

[@pinecrustjuise]

@@Eric..Cartman this implies that they were aware it was weakened, which is clearly not the case as the CEO would not have piloted the vessel knowing it may not be strong enough for the voyage

[@Anzrul]

No click bait, no exploitation, no personal theories or explanation, just what has happened as documented but assembled into a credible and respectful video. Thank you Simon.

[@archieames1968]

lol 'no exploitation' what are you talking about? This video has ads just like the others and its on a current hot event. Granted everyone else is doing it and its he's just making a living and theres nothing wrong with that but still this is not Simon throwing himself into a burning building to save a puppy or anything like that.

[@hellbent650]

​@archieames1968 freedom isn't free

[@Anzrul]

@@archieames1968 What I'm talking about is Simon made a video that wasn't click bait, he didn't go on tangents or rants about his personal theories or explanations, he simply made a video that showed the already documented information from several sources into a single video and he did so respectfully towards those involved......kind of like I said in my original comment. To clarify, this is "as opposed" to Simon making a sensationalized version of events kind of video, taking advantage of the situation by positing rumors and theories in order to get more views.

[@waitingforanalibi2224]

I agree, but, and it may just be me. But I feel its still a bit too raw for a video on it just yet. I honestly do not know why, but I spent 4 days glued to the news and Ocean traffic and I genuinely cried when they found the debris. For me it was Suleman, a 19 year old that his life to live. 😔

[@waitingforanalibi2224]

The rest were used to risk taking, he wanted a Fathers Day trip to remember.

[@stonykark]

This is actually the first recorded instance, in all of human history and beyond, of a CEO learning what accountability means.

[@salvagedb2470]

Right there.

[@hurricanev6]

I think he might be a little short of brain function to learn anything at the moment.

[@InarusLynx]

I would argue that since the implosion only took 30 milliseconds and that they probably had no warning, he did not in fact learn what accountability means. He died not knowing he had died.

[@snipersquad01]

@@hurricanev6 he lost the brain function to understand accountability waaay before this dive

[@hurricanev6]

@@snipersquad01 lol true

[@kayakat1869]

I just got my aerospace engineering degree and the CEO and the people working at this company did exactly what we were taught not to do. In all steps of the engineering process, safety comes first. There is no project or innovation great enough that is worth dying for.

[@Shorty15c4007]

I love how the CEO thought of himself as a pioneer. He wasn't pioneering JACK! The engineers knew when a material was past their life expectancy and shouldn't be reused at those pressures. The more interviews I see of this guy, the more I'm amazed at how he ignored the obvious red flags. I feel sorry for all of the passengers trusting the CEO that everything was okay.

[@bobatesomemayo]

@@Shorty15c4007 He was pioneering the way to better regulation

[@dx1450]

He said if you're afraid of dying then maybe don't get out of bed. OK, fine. I'll stay nice, warm and comfy in my bed while you turn into rich guy soup at the bottom of the ocean...

[@bobatesomemayo]

@@user-uz8pp2tn6o Quit bein an asshole, she's explaining basic shit that this guy should've followed

[@stephenbain389]

​​​​@@dx1450the dreadfully flippant "don't get out of bed" comment shows us what type of person Rush was. There's a difference between common everyday risks and going somewhere that is outside of rescue and will kill you in less than a second if there is even a small oversight. You don't need to be an engineer or even particularly bright to know this. It should be obvious.

[@sielentbrat4005]

I'm an aviation engineer. Let's just say I'm terrified of Titan's features.

[@drewski5730]

And I’m a pilot who is still in shock about how unprepared they were for an incident, and how it was operated with such reckless abandon. Why wasn’t there an ROV on the mothership? What was the rescue plan? Where was the backup sub and pilot? What’s the point in 96hrs life support if a realistic rescue mission takes a week to mobilize? There was zero plan. Worst seamanship ever. Whoever is/was left in the company needs to be investigated for criminal charges.

[@babalonkie]

@@drewski5730 No emergency tethers. No emergency tracking. No emergency ballast. No redundancy propulsion systems. And the biggest and most advanced Navy in the world could not find the sub in the most documented part of the Ocean for days... and people want to travel in more dangerous space ships... It actually makes me angry that governments allow these people to put other humans lives at risk without checks and regulations.

[@evilwelshman]

Now imagine what marine engineers must've been feeling..... 😨😨

[@boneav83]

@@babalonkie The Navy heard it go bang when it did, you should be asking why they kept it to themselves until Hunters case was going on and should have been all over the news.

[@lasskinn474]

the features themselves don't terrify me at all. that they didn't have system to xray etc the structure etc between missions does, but the most fearful thing was that they couldn't afford to NOT dive financially - and that they couldn't in case they found a problem to make an another one. using a game controller, a touchscreen, that's not as scary at all and the control of the external features was wireless probably anyway(this actually makes perfect sense for safety of the hull). it's kinda sketch due to water and such, but there's very good reasons for NOT having mechanical controls go through the hull. that's what they based their safety on too, but the sketch part was that they couldn't re-certify it for a dive as such as they had no protocol for that and as said with backs against the wall to make the dives anyway for $$$, so they were playing roulette with the customers lives while telling the customers that it was super safe. it did have a locator device as well with it's own battery etc outside of the hull - that quit transmitting at the same time the comms were lost, so that's when it imploded and broke that too.

[@PoopaChallupa]

I feel bad for the 19yr old. He didn't even want to go. He did it as a favor for his father for Father's day.

[@imnotyourfriendbuddy1883]

let that be a lesson to you about pleasing others.

[@buffalosoldier4485]

Yep... that's what he said

[@malp6280]

there aunt said the other day on the news, they did this as a bonding "father son experience" ... yes he wasn't that keen but still went.

[@connormoylan2466]

Yea hes probubly the reason they imploded, if he werent there they would have lived to know they fucked up

[@laurafabianmarrero]

​@@connormoylan2466You need to stop talking nonsense. How is it his fault. You need help

[@SABRMatt2010]

The largest problem with Titan was that the pressure vessel was made of more than one piece. Every time you introduce a point of connection, you introduce a potential point of failure. All prior submersible designs made the passenger compartment a perfect sphere of solid titanium, not titanium end caps and a carbon fiber cylinder.

[@ildart8738]

Every time you introduce a company that cares about its' profit margin to safety concerns, you introduce it many (perhaps infinite) points of failure. The only constant is the profit. Look at the engineers at NASA that constantly warned about Challenger Shuttle's failing booster rubber rings before launch in 1986. The "effective management" never listened to them, they fired the engineers who spoke their honest opinions, and then they blamed the same engineers for the failure! Take a lesson from this failure. If if something your higher-ups does not feel right, it is 90% is not right. Quit your job, and work for someone who respects your opinion.

[@roystonboodoo7525]

The ring unto which the titanium cap was bolted was in turn epoxy 'glued' to carbon fiber hull ! Sheer Madness along with all else.

[@martinleavitt6094]

Well said!!!👍

[@jose.sosa777]

@@roystonboodoo7525I’ve used epoxy after drilling into concrete walls to install concrete, would that thing even be safe in the ocean after a couple trips? Absolutely terrifying 😅

[@1besieged]

The carbon fiber material was purchased on 'clearance' as it had past it's 'shelf life' as well, more hindrance to safety I suppose, should have had the vessel scanned for microscopic tears etc. after each 'trip'.

[@swimgirl24]

Rush genuinely thought he was smarter than everyone else around him. He was killed by his own stupidity and stubbornness. It’s so sad and tragic that unfortunately innocent people were killed with him. 😢

[@boblatkey7160]

And you just learned all this in the last couple of weeks?

[@evanmurphy2165]

Sounds a lot like a certain South African billionaire who likes to play fast and loose with rockets and regulations.

[@michaelmoore9518]

@evanmurphy2165 elon musk is a genius. This guy rush was to confident

[@themarlawnpodcastnetwork]

@@michaelmoore9518rush was actually smarter than Elon…

[@tiahnarodriguez3809]

⁠@@michaelmoore9518Elon is actually no different, and he’s not the smart one. The people he employs are. He just provides the funds.

[@gildardo]

They installed a thruster backwards and only found out when they were at the bottom of the ocean. Things just look worse the more we learn.

[@ublade82]

Whoops!

[@cavetroll666]

you almost cant make this stuff up watching all the interviews with Stockton Rush is just insane :O

[@remyrogers4]

Just common , doesnt seem real.

[@johno1544]

That is just ridiculous maybe he should have hired some experienced 50 yrs old white guys after all.

[@aluisious]

@@johno1544 what does being white have to do with it?

[@Kevin-jb2pv]

I like how this is the one case where a big Hollywood director actually has the right resources and expertise to comment on a situation like this.

[@jetsetjourneysofficial]

the guy who went down 33 times?

[@semaj_5022]

Oh yeah. James Cameron is probably one of the single most experienced people in the world in the field of deep sea submersible exploration. He is arguably a submariner and explorer who also happens to have made some movies.

[@adnaanu]

Yep not only did James Cameron visit the Titanic wreck 33 times but he also when down the challenger deep in the Marianna trench. He also holds a few patents for sub designs.

[@Oakleaf700]

@@adnaanu Not to mention James Cameron is also fundamentally responsible, respectful human being. He cares for people's lives, and said no way would he carry a passenger down with him in his own submersible. {Edit..Apart from causing suffering to people while making the abyss..I wasn't aware of that.}

[@murpmope9831]

@@semaj_5022hes said before that making titanic was just an excuse for Hollywood production companies to pay for him to go see the wreck!

[@carnoth9864]

I’m a former US Navy submariner. When I found out about the construction of this thing, you could not have paid me to set foot on board.

[@MrChristoferoful]

Can you elaborate sir?

[@somethinglikethat2176]

​@@MrChristoferofulcarbon fibre isn't great when compressive strength is needed. The resin is prone to failure and is very difficult to check for signs of fatigue. There are other things like being unable to exit the vehicle without outside assistance.

[@kingdubbs143]

Well said. There has been many explorations in many more advanced submersibles. THIS THING WAS PURELY A PIECE OF JUNK. Look at how it was put together. The other subs like David Pouge said had tons of controls and safety mechanics. This guy was just an idiot who tried to be heroic. But he finally understands what the engineers were saying.

[@shanewilson7994]

@@MrChristoferoful for one, carbon fiber is not a good material to use in this instance because if you've ever worked with it, you'll find out that yes its awesome, its strong, and when it fails it fails spectacularly.

[@MrChristoferoful]

@shanewilson7994 I have not worked with it but am somewhat familiar with it from Formula 1 cars and aircraft. Is the reason it is used on aircraft because the pressure difference between sea level and high altitude less severe? And, you know, maintenance schedules?

[@geodkyt]

Critical correction: Ocean Gate *lied* about University of Washington, Boeing, and NASA having *any* involvement in the design or fabrication of the Titan. UW assisted with the design of the *steel* hulled Cyclops, rated to 500 meters depth.

[@aaawac2174]

And they allowed them to use some of their facilities, but at no point did they actively consult in any form on the Titan

[@stephontheleft4455]

The Titan disaster is a testament to how we put blind faith in someone (Stockton Rush) who presents that they know everything there is to know about... anything. His maximum confidence in his vehicle, which lacked proper testing, classing and their desire to participate in extreme adventure/tourism, I can only hope, serves as a lesson for future enthusiasts. It's a tragic ending for all of them. Especially for the the 19 yr old who truly didn't want to go 🥺

[@1besieged]

The mom said her son wanted to go and gave him her seat. The dishonest aunt told a false statement.

[@ronque23]

I don’t give a damn that the owner had “good intentions”. It’s disturbing how little regard he had for the lives of his passengers to put them in that obvious danger. He just didn’t care. Pure hubris.

[@ezragonzalez8936]

i dont give a rats as$ what happened to any of the 5 clowns but I am disgusted about what happened the the 700 people who drowned off the coast of greece including nearly 200 children yet all the resources where being used up by these goons!

[@mequavis]

don't forget this man wanted to be captain kirk for real. he did this because he finally gave up. and a week before this happened grusch comes out and exposes the reverse ufo tech program. So all this time, Stockton could have been living his dream, but they stole it from him, and he ended up becoming this crazy water sub guy that had no ideas what he was really doing. sad when you really think about it. What could have been, the life he wanted, that he could have funded, and was technically possible. boy...he did go dum tho

[@mynamejef7963]

They still signed the paper with their own hands

[@bobatesomemayo]

He had his own blood on his hands. The other passengers in my opinion, were straight up lied to and just sold "GUYS YOU CAN SEE THE TITANIC!11!!" and then not fully told what a piece of crap they were going to ride in

[@mequavis]

@@bobatesomemayo agreed 100%, he murdered those people. he unalived himself and took others with him when you really get down to it.../

[@Justakatto]

That "safety is a waste" guy got that Darwin award. It's unfortunate that he took innocent people to the grave alongside him.

[@burningbarnavit]

I'm not at all surprised, but this was a damn classy way to make a video on this story, Simon. Well played, good sir. Well played indeed.

[@scroopynooperz9051]

a well known university engineering professor always tells his incoming class of new students "If you're going to design a bridge that fails, better make sure you are under it when it does." say what you will about cavalier Johnny Stockton Rush, and many will disparage him now, but the old boy put his money where his mouth is and he went down with the ship.

[@foxmccloud7055]

This tragedy reeks of normalization of deviance in the worst possible way.

[@BruceBoyde]

​​@@scroopynooperz9051yeah, you can't say that the guy didn't believe his own bullshit, unlike a lot of CEOs. Usually the bodies pile up and they claim ignorance, and then eventually documents leak proving otherwise. And fwiw, it sounds like the thing technically worked/had worked, but was clearly not being maintained and properly rebuilt as needed after dives, leading to a buildup of smaller failures. Doesn't remotely justify his utter contempt for safety, but makes some sense of why he was so damn confident.

[@drunkenhobo8020]

@@BruceBoyde It's a fairly common theme though. You become so wealthy that you can get rid of people who tell you "no". And when all you hear is "yes", you begin to believe you're a genius.

[@BruceBoyde]

@@drunkenhobo8020 Yeep, be it money or political power, it's really easy to surround yourself with people who won't tell you the truth. And I get why people don't like hearing the truth and want to dismiss it as nay-sayers and whatnot, but that extremely human flaw easily turns deadly.

[@rejvaik00]

Will Kohnen has the utmost massive respect I can give for doing his due diligence and trying to ring the alarm bells 5 years earlier in 2018

[@nt78stonewobble]

True, but at this point eg. Kohnen and Cameron, must be regretting they didn't try harder. I mean, maybe they could have reported them for false advertisement... something or other... to prevent people from going down with them. Of course, that probably goes for many things around the world going on right now and we can't all play guard dogs all the time. It's just such a goddamn shame.

[@rejvaik00]

@@nt78stonewobble No I think he did what he could do in the expert field he's in, he's not a lawyer nor familiar with intricacies of the law by any means He's a oceanographer and submersible expert I wouldn't have any regrets if I were him, he did what he could he tossed in his credibility as an expert in his field regarding safety and it was ignored There's not really much else you can do in that regard

[@nt78stonewobble]

@@rejvaik00 Yeah, I don't disagree, but heck even I'm kicking myself a bit for eg. Not doing anything, like a bad yelp review.

[@iamthebroker]

@@rejvaik00I imagine there’s a lot more that could have been done… and I agree with stonewobble.

[@rejvaik00]

@@iamthebroker I'm being specific to Will Kohnen, there's a lot more that could have been done from a variety of people but Will did what he could do and throwing his hat in the ring as an expert denouncing Ocean Gate for various safety violations was one the best things he did It's just sometimes even when you have the literal experts telling you you're wrong you need to redo this, their advice gets ignored There's just some people you can't reach

[@GRosa250]

The only thing I’m surprised about is that it lasted as many dives as it did

[@Author.Noelle.Alexandria]

Most of the dives didn’t go that far down. They were shallower, and a generic “30-something dives” could be claimed by omitting how shallow some were.

[@tiahnarodriguez3809]

@@Author.Noelle.AlexandriaSome of the dives went down to the Titanic. One actually got stuck on the propeller of the Titanic. Pretty miraculous it lasted so long when you consider this.

[@monarols4806]

@sadorablettv interesting comment. You degrade someone’s comment by making assumptions that you don’t know are facts yourself. Bit hypocritical don’t you think. Or is that the normal way you live your life. Do as I say, not as I do.

[@are3287]

@sandorablettv No need to project your inability to change car tires

[@just_some_bigfoot_hacking_you]

@sandorablettv It doesn't take an expert to point out CEO's stupidity and ignorance of safety regulations. Listening to experts also known as common sense that your pea sized brain can't unfortunately process, so I bet you're one of those fools who would willingly get into Oceangate's Titan and end up as fish food.

[@Annihilator2011]

The fact the window was only rated for 1300 meters shocks me it even made one trip to 4000 meters... Between the window and the hull it was a failure waiting to happen.

[@rixgaming9989]

that 's probably where it happened. If i had to take a guess i'd also say the window caved in.

[@JayDee-xj9lu]

@@rixgaming9989 But if the window caved in, why did the sub rip apart. Wouldn't it just instantly flood andthen equalize? I'm surprised that they didn't test it empty a dozen times on a long cable, and just wind it up and down.

[@rixgaming9989]

@@JayDee-xj9lu just watched some more stuff on it. You're probably right. The carbon tube caved in looks like or the titanium ends oppped off. The window would be the next best point of failure but i think in this case the entire chamber just folded to the pressure.

[@captiannemo1587]

The company would only certify the window to 1,300m due to its unique design. The planned design was still 4,000m. It’s buried in the 2018 court documents which the show writers should have read.

[@someguy4915]

@@captiannemo1587 Due to the way the window/viewport was mounted it was certified to 1300m, the window itself remains certified for 4000m. Compare it to a house where you fit a bunker door, the door is very strong but the doorframe is still just weak wood...

[@nickzeiders5952]

I think its actually perfectly fine to disparage Stockton Rush, he ignored problems and thought safety regulations were pointless.

[@tiki11111]

yep he got 4 people killed

[@dereksbooks]

To claim that the people who built this death trap had "good intentions," and that they shouldn't be "disparaged" is insulting. Everyone with any expertise kept warning them about their death trap, and their crazy CEO openly laughed at safety regulations and even boasted about "breaking rules." He and his entire team are disgusting. Sorry that I "disparaged" them.

[@sotnoscopes]

Yep. He could have explored alone, didn’t need to risk the lives of tourists

[@nickzeiders5952]

To be honest, the kid is the only one I feel really sorry for.

[@russell2952]

​@@nickzeiders5952There weren't any kids onboard.

[@PaulTheFox1988]

When I first head about this sub going missing I knew immediately that it had imploded, up to 400x atmospheric pressure (approx) on a poorly designed vessel was always going to end up in disaster. I really only feel sorry for the 19 year old, and I take solace that as terrified as he was, it would have ended instantaneously with no time for him to suffer. The ceo can rot in hell for all I care, it's not that he didn't know better, or that he was taking risks and was doing the best he could to minimise the harm from those risks, he actively flirted with death, sneered at safety, sacked anyone who brought up issues, deliberately avoided scrutiny, went out of his way to use untested/substandard/ill-suited parts, and in his arrogance and hubris took 4 innocent lives with him. Rules and regulations aren't there to get in the way, they're not because of health and safety gone mad, they're there to avoid this exact situation, they're written in the blood of those who went before, they're lessons taught and learned the hard way, and you ignore them at the risk of everyone involved. Deep sea diving is a well understood topic, we know the risks, and we have designed materials and procedures to deal with it, it's as close to a solved problem as extreme exploration can be, and yet we still have idiots who refuse to learn what we already know in the pursuit of money and ego stroking.

[@tripsrossi7038]

Ficking right

[@NewtypeCommander]

There is a saying within the aviation community, "for every rule written by the FAA, somebody died." If you ever take a look at the FAA rulebook, called the FAR/AIM, you will see that it is an extensively thick book.

[@laner.845]

@@NewtypeCommander I'm in aviation and yes, this is such a true statement. I've watched countless documentaries about incidents throughout the history of aviation that paved the way, usually in blood, for modern regulations and procedures. Their lives, to make the industry safer for ours. This CEO was needlessly reckless and hubris got him and innocents killed. The adults should have known better, but the teenager was just doing what his dad told him to do. In some cultures, you don't tell your parents "no", no matter how scared you are.

[@irvanray1898]

That's the most despicable character of the CEO, he actively avoids rules that were written with blood just because he wants to "innovate".

[@belle.m]

He thought he knew better than the ‘50yr old white guy’ experts he didn’t want to work with, and fired for speaking out, in favour of 25yr olds who used game controllers to operate a sub. He middle fingered the rules and regulations and people who knew more. Massive narcissistic megalomaniac.

[@danilecashin4126]

This man stated. “ sometimes you have to throw safety out the window”. He basically is responsible for killing those people unfortunately. This man strikes me as someone with a deathwish.

[@Shorty15c4007]

My guess he was too obsessed with Titanic he threw all of the alarm bells out the window. I still can't believe the interviews of this knobjob. I mean I like to cut corners just as much as the next guy but this goes beyond that. I felt sorry for the passengers trusting someone like that.

[@johnmcho]

I just don't know what for. It's a dive that's been done hundreds of times without incident. Why risk anything?

[@legoqueen2445]

It's one thing to have a deathwish and be happy to take risks with your own life, quite another to put passengers lives at risk. 'Sacrificing innovation for the sake of passenger safety' should be written across his grave stone.

[@patrickfarrell6353]

Death wish? Well, wish no longer. The last thing to go through his mind before he died was probably his ass. Like super fast. Light speed.

[@taraswertelecki3786]

A death wish that was fulfilled sooner than he thought.

[@thomasheerjr9268]

As a real submariner all I can say is that when you dive, safety is 100% the number 1 priority. Everyone is trained, you have backups and fail safe systems. Playing fast and loose underwater can and does get you killed.

[@mrparlanejxtra]

Really being in any kind of submarine is absolute stupidity. I once had to go in a decompression chamber as I got carbon monoxide poisoning from my Model A exhaust. That was bad enough.

[@Thesnakerox]

I'd heard James Cameron go into the technical detail about the Titan implosion...but the quote from him at the end of this video actually sent chills down my spine...

[@esteemedmortal5917]

Perfectly summarized the incident

[@hehoosmeltitdeltit]

Thank you Simon for a current topic that’s not clickbait and handled credibly. Please do more of these, there’s an appetite for reliable sources of information/news out there on current events. 👍

[@celticlass8573]

Hear hear.

[@jcook693]

Came to say that.

[@jefffoy530]

Agreed

[@dalaisdramalama4470]

normal for someone that makes his living on yt. they can't miss the chance to use such a viewer magnet, they have to jump on that train... but like you said, here at least they handle the topic like it should be handled.

[@thomaspick4123]

Simon, ask the Coast Guard why they spent millions of taxpayer dollars on their asinine search. Nothing was going to happen until the French submersible was brought in. The Coast Guard knew what happened. A 263 decibels toot to the sonic sensors. Cameron and Ballard knew right away also. Conflicting reports. Are the rivers of currents at deep depths, or is the water calm? I heard both stories. Someone is lying. Banging on the bull to signal for help? Wouldn’t that actually weaken the vessel and cause a possible hull failure?

[@NinjaRunningWild]

From the OceanGate wiki : *Rush's experience and research led him to believe that submersibles had an unwarranted reputation as dangerous vehicles due to their use in ferrying commercial divers, and that the Passenger Vessel Safety Act of 1993 "needlessly prioritized passenger safety over commercial innovation"* Anyone not doing their due diligence on the CEO of this inept company learned the price of that in savage fashion.

[@SPierre-dm4wo]

Pro tip for rich adventure tourists: if the submersible's designer says testing it is unimportant because almost all submersible accidents are caused by pilot error, it's time to bail.... especially if the designer's also going to be piloting it.

[@jnagarya519]

The first obligation of gov't is the protection of public health and safety from criminals, grifting thieves, and the irresponsible. Stockton Rush spent more on lawyers to silence his critics than he did on safety.

[@TRUMP_WAS_RIGHT_ABOUT_EVRYTHNG]

no kidding! pretty sure passenger safety should be numero uno on the priorities list.

[@defenestrated23]

"needlessly" is a load-bearing adverb in that sentence.

[@timoteubert7068]

One more mistake: Simon claims that the navy disclosed days after the Titan disappeared that they registered the implosion with their underwater acoustic devices. But according to James Cameron, they disclosed it within 24 hours, as he already sent E-Mails out that those people were lost on Monday morning, with the knowledge that the implosion was picked up by the Navy.

[@sunnyrogers7711]

A very sad story delivered so eloquently with the utmost of dignity, respect and insight. Absolute respect to Simon and the Megaprojects team. 🙏🏽

[@hankthepatriot3733]

Although the loss of life is sad, but what's even sadder is that it was avoidable 😢

[@breadmoth6443]

well i hope he serves as an inspiration indeed , to not hire diversity hires but more experienced people, and if that happens to be 50 year old white men , oh well. but heyho, diversity. wokery has now officially has a body count.

[@01oo011]

@@breadmoth6443🤦

[@MadSwede87]

@@breadmoth6443 wtf does that have to do with this situation stop spraying your mouth diarrhea

[@leighcounry9956]

Exactly! Safety is never a waste of time and money. The craft should have been remotely controlled with a tether linkage to ship, and tested unoccupied to that depth, a series of such tests over various times and conditions. There is a reason why there are regulations, for people's safety.

[@breadmoth6443]

@@01oo011 i mean its the truth though, if you find his video, he literally stated he didn't want to hire any 50 year old white guys , and now he paid the price... im not exactly gloating here, just pointing the obvious - hiring on diversity has now become fatal.

[@iambiggus]

The implosion would have happened faster than the speed of sound... faster in fact than the signals from the eye could be registered by the brain. It's a small consolation, but true: they literally had no idea what happened.

[@quest4adventure495]

The reporters that couldn’t comprehend why there wouldn’t be an effort to recover their bodies. 🤦‍♂️ kzbin.infoa5RW3EHSFTE?feature=share

[@awsumaustin7650]

Hopefully it wasn't like a movie where they heard a loud creaking sound before. That would cause them to die in panic mode

[@Mark-vn7et]

@@awsumaustin7650at that depth a small defect that occurs would immediately result in a catastroffic implosion. By the time you hear the “crack” it’s already imploded

[@jamestaylor-qb9wo]

Yea, they're wondering why the Titanic crew and passengers are welcoming them aboard

[@kriysixvector4552]

​@Mark-vn7et the sub had a hull monitoring system, and rumors have it that they dropped weight to surface

[@fauxpinkytoo]

It takes a fine touch to cover such a story without exploiting the dead. You did well, Simon.

[@dalaisdramalama4470]

Wrong! SO close to the event it still IS making money with the misery of others! If this would have been released half a year later then i maybe could agree with you. But this close it is jumping on the hype train trying get as big of a piece of the youtube cake as possible. Not only how you handle such cases counts, often the timing is important, too.

[@timetostartup3451]

Wrong… dude why put a downer on a compliment? Your watching this content to so does that make you a hypocrite? Or just a 🔔 end…

[@jbtechcon7434]

@@dalaisdramalama4470 So I guess you're against news? Because they report on deaths all the time. I guess you think they should tastefully wait half a year? Or maybe "think" is not the right word to use with you...

[@dalaisdramalama4470]

@@timetostartup3451 who says i was watching it? maybe i made a comment on another video, then got this recommended, instantly found it distastefull and only klicked on it to make a comment of diapproval. Instantly jumping to conclusions without knowing anything about me and the history i have with such things and writing a defending fanboy comment... guess that makes you a 🔔end

[@hanschristianben505]

@@dalaisdramalama4470 so… you’re telling us you’re making a criticism of a content you didn’t even watched and declared it as distasteful because… it’s making money… in that case, every content creator and every news media outlet (CNN, BBC, CBS, NBC etc.) SHOULD NOT cover this because they’re also making money covering this event (and every other event in human history, whether triumpant or tragic)… and speaking of making money, I’m surprised you didn’t called out the CEO/pilot of this thing… because, for all the grandiose and talk about adventure, innovation, experience etc. his company is also MAKING MONEY out of them. and you had the gall to call content like this as hypocritical? much WOOOOW. 🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️

[@andrewhohenthaner444]

Tastefully and respectfully presented by Simon Whistler and staff. What a sad case of throwing caution to the wind.

[@nftminter7922]

Props to Stockton for being on board his own deathtrap! On the bright side for him, he won't have to deal with the fallout of his words.

[@rubyharris4422]

He clearly believed his own hype to be on there.

[@timmeinschein9007]

Too bad it wasn't just him and his "Engineer" who signed off on the design aboard Titan on its last dive!!!

[@mementomori4972]

Boeing, NASA and the University of Washington denied being involved in the design of the Titan. OceanGate purchased b-rated carbon fiber from Boeing, which they got for a discount because it had exceeded it's shelf life. That's the corporation with Boeing the CEO was bragging about on his website. It also shows the lengths this man was willing to go to make this project sound more credible.

[@andrewstephens6765]

I’m kind of stunned that the host missed that. If he doesn’t get those basic facts right, how can you trust a lot of what he says. Especially since he runs other channels

[@tuff_lover]

@@andrewstephens6765 He's just farming views/$$$ at this point, never really liked the guy, albeit for slightly different reason.

[@stevelee5724]

​@@andrewstephens6765 Simon doesn't write this stuff. Don't you listen ? Dork

[@ricardobimblesticks1489]

​@@tuff_lover I think that is called being a professional youtuber, pretty normal. Bit odd that you are here tho :D

[@FireMageLayn]

This is not a deep dive video. This is a video intended to sum up what happened for laypeople who don't want a sensationalized story like the mrballen video I watched like two minutes of then had to stop because he was going on and on about them being alone down there. This is the sort of detail I'd expect to see in a deep dive on the topic.

[@Alienalloy]

As Scott manly said, “they went from biology to physics hundreds of times faster than a pain signal can reach the brain”

[@FairbrookWingates]

That is comforting to know. Drowning is my #1 feared "way to go" so the idea of doing so in a sub....it's good to know they'd not have even realized it. In a way, less terror than a surface swimmer drowning. Thank you.

[@IntrepidIanRinon]

Hullo there! (You see what I did?) But yeah... Scott's video was around an hour long...

[@robderich8533]

@@FairbrookWingates Close second place right after burning alive imo.

[@MattExzy]

Good for the passengers. Bad for Rush. I hope he had some inkling of what was about to happen and comprehended he effectively murdered those people and risked the lives of others.

[@matrinezkevin11492]

​@FairbrookWingates they must likely didn't die from drowning. They probably just either got instantly crushed by the vessel imploding killing them, or they lost pressure and their lungs and brain exploded from the atmospheric pressure well before even a drop of water got in their lungs

[@danielhale1]

I initially heard about this through the memes. Glad I finally investigated the story through a good source. This is deeply tragic, and that sleazebag CEO is entirely at fault. I'm most sorry for the kid, but the other passengers didn't do anything wrong either. If only we could get them back and leave the CEO to oblivion. With so many people ringing alarm bells for so long, there's just no excuse. This was pure hubris, probably showing that CEO was a narcissist. He fired anyone who disagreed with him or knew more than he did, and four people paid a terrible price for his fragile ego and moral cowardice.

[@jeffwenberg4321]

Not being able to open or even blow the hatch from the inside was a lesson the Apollo program learned in 1967 when 3 astronauts died because they were bolted in from the outside.

[@GetDerezzed]

I feel bad for literally everyone but the CEO. Hard to feel bad for a CEO quoted as saying: "Safety is just pure waste!"

[@RCorvinus]

It is clearly not a waste in an environment when one slip up is fatal.

[@donaldoehl7690]

Stockton Rush was an arrogant fool and a conman. Prove me wrong, not that it helps anyone now.

[@es68951]

The man is a murderer. It's a shame he can't be made to suffer more. His accomplices should be.

[@templarw20]

The remaining shareholders are about to find out that you can't sign a waiver for gross negligence...

[@smadge1]

If he intended to take the submersible solo, then it may have been a bearable cost. But that he took paying passengers to their deaths was pure exploitation.

[@jacobwatson4752]

I find it absolutely wild to hear Simon being so professional after watching brain blaze so much

[@WW3_Historian]

Me too! I suppose it's too soon to call someone a f'ing tool though.

[@abysmalprosecutor6182]

This whole thing kind of reminds me of Jurassic Park in a weird way. He was so obsessed with he could he never thought if he should.

[@someguy4915]

Well here he neither could build a proper submersible nor should he have tried.

[@jgreenberg]

As a pilot, I'm used to the heavy regulation surrounding aircraft and I was completely dumbfounded by the fact that experimental vessels could be used for commercial passenger operations. Seems like an insane oversight. As for Mr. Rush, his experience in aerospace should have taught him much more than it did. Laws in the transport industry are written in blood and as we continue to see humanity refuse to learn from Morton Thiokol vs NASA and Douglas rushing the DC10 to market, it's clear to see more writing is yet to come.

[@tobalaba]

it was not an oversight, he operated out of nation-states so he could do this.

[@RatBoi-tk2zb]

He got around any laws by calling it 'experimental' (they got the mental right) and the people going with him are not paying tourists, they are 'crew' . That is why he had a WIRELESS controller so he could pass it around and let everyone have a go at piloting. They have to do something or they would be considered paying passengers and now he has to follow in-place regulations. This truly is like gong to Fabricland and buying a bunch of bolts of the cheapest cloth they have and sew it in to a parachute. Well it worked 2 times before so therefor it is safe!

[@kumabear123nope5]

@ ratboi. Wait, WHAT? ARE YOU SERIOUS?????? 😨😱😰😠

[@Sniperboy5551]

They were in international waters, weren’t they? That’s pretty hard to regulate, especially when the company could be based out of any country… regulation seems impossible.

[@Author.Noelle.Alexandria]

Technically speaking, experimental aircraft can be used for paying passengers, and you do have to sign waivers. When you go to air shows and pay for rides on warbirds, you’re paying to ride an experimental. But given that those birds have scads of maintenance and are still subject to yearly inspections like any other aircraft, they’re a hell of a lot safer than a submersible that had no inspections. However, Rush also used the loophole of international waters to get around the feds.

[@randompseudonym4519]

I particularly like the anecdote about the time that the Titan was scooting around in circles on the ocean floor because a thruster had been attached backwards. What a bunch of cowboys!

[@Shorty15c4007]

Talk about being reckless and fearless. I mean its kind of cool that he was able to dodge all of the regulation and go see it multiple times, let alone once. But if you got shit like that failing in the ocean, the hell is wrong with this guy? Apparently the clear bubble window in the front is 7" Acrylic that goes from an outie belly button to an innie when you go lower into the ocean. He says you can hear it crackle under pressure. No concept of an inner alarm bell for the CEO. I feel sorry for the victims trusting this knob job.

[@stannyb3346]

​@Shorty15c4007 it is not kinda cool to dodge regulations, they are there for a reason and this idi1ot found out the hard way.

[@vitoratio2718]

@@Shorty15c4007what’s cool about dodging regulations?

[@dx1450]

@@Shorty15c4007 You mean the acrylic window pushed inward when they got down to depth? And you could hear it crackling? I'd have been terrified.

[@Shorty15c4007]

@dx1450 I watched the interview again and I was mistaken. It didn't go concave outward to inward. Apparently the pressures pushed acrylic dome in about a quarter inch and made a cracking sound. Obviously still terrifying. I think its hilarious that they got lost one trip for several hours and didn't bother installing some form of a GPS or pinging device. This guy really was "if we die, we die" 🤣. No wonder it took the mothership hours to realize something was wrong. They probably lose communication all the time.

[@IlRyanWilsonlI]

No joke I just thought to myself the day before this video dropped "I will watch Simon's video to understand this incident better" and voila. Thanks guys.

[@danielgranda896]

Thank you for this classy and informative explanation of this tragic event. I sincerely hope that this tragic lesson is not lost on all the other CEOs pushing the boundaries of exploration and design. Set your egos aside and make sure you consider safety and testing.

[@phoenixcierebiej9763]

Josh Gates, the host of TV's Expedition Unknown once rode on the Titan, and had this to say about it. And he has done some seriously sketchy stuff on his shows To those asking, #Titan did not perform well on my dive. Ultimately, I walked away from a huge opportunity to film Titanic due to my safety concerns w/ the @OceanGate platform. There's more to the history and design of Titan that has not been made public - much of it concerning.

[@notusneo]

The dude dodge a bullet a size of a Titan there

[@kevinquist]

wow. im not a james camron fan but that quote sent a chill down my spine. stunning. poetic and just. "......for the same damn reason".

[@cmcull987]

What angers me about this is the CEO's disregard for safety. He portrayed it as an idea that meant don't get out of bed, don't do anything, etc. But that's not life and there is always risk. How one mitigates or manages risk is important. I think he was willing to ignore serious concerns for the sake of his mission. My heart goes to all of them and their loved ones.

[@jnagarya519]

The CEO was a bullshitting jerk -- a LIAR.

[@hanschristianben505]

I agree… the absolute worst way of mitigating and managing risk is to ignore them… it’s like sweeping dirt under a rug… one may have taken it out of sight, but the dirt is still there…

[@NickanM]

He forgot that 99,9% of all safety rules are litterally _written in blood._

[@boringbastard4920]

I know what he meant. That safety will morph to statistic. Like this vid, looking for scapegoats for a incredible dangerous pioner adventure. When no injuries are allowed reported because of statistic, thats the endgame of HMS

[@JHNO66]

When James Cameron calls you out for ego…

[@captain_commenter8796]

A submarine that did not put safety first resting alongside a vessel that suffered the same fate is a tragic poetic end… May those innocent souls rest easy

[@nikitatarsov5172]

The only inocent soul here might have be the richkid that didn't want to join, but has been pressured by his dad (who is a billionäre in a pretty poor country - which is telling in itself).

[@game_boyd1644]

Rush was, by no means, an innocent soul. All their deaths are on his hands

[@rustythecrown9317]

@@nikitatarsov5172 we need more billionaires to take this trip.

[@novaliam7088]

Very well said.

[@cdavidlake2]

James Cameron was one of the first to call this out for what it was. Respect.

[@EmilyJelassi]

I’m absolutely amazed that anyone would willingly board a vessel helmed by a person who believes that safety isn’t the most important part of a vessel that transports passengers! This tragedy will most likely have far-reaching consequences for the submersible tourist industry. I feel terrible for the families and everyone affected by this tragedy. Thank you Simon and team for putting together such an informative and respectful video.

[@lauracatherine9925]

It's the it'll never happen to me mindset

[@Author.Noelle.Alexandria]

If you can’t eliminate ALL risks, then why bother mitigating any? Literally the Republican mindset on guns. It’s extremely dangerous, and innocent people pay the price.

[@Sniperboy5551]

@Author.Noelle.Alexandria Guns are a constitutional right, Republicans just care more about individual rights than Democrats do. Democrats always want to regulate your rights away, which seems to be the antithesis of “life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.”

[@TroyDejayzoo]

every fly on a commercial plane? ever ride in a car? everything has a safety/cost ratio. They could make these things WAY safer but it wouldnt make sense financially. Look at boeing issue with the angle of attack sensor and the planes nosediving. Safety second is very common for anyone pushing engineering boundaries, ie: space flight, the first time people went supersonic, the first human flight, beginnings of scuba diving, ect.

[@craighermle7727]

You can believe it and then forget about it. How many shuttles and lives did Nasa take?

[@johnbradshaw7525]

UK TV documentary maker Ross Kemp was due to to travel on the Titan to see the Titanic wreck. But the TV production company had carried out checks on the OceanGate Titan submersible, but had deemed it unsafe and unfit for purpose.

[@BenjaminCantabrana]

By far, the best,, most respectful , dignified mention of this tragedy. 👌

[@thekeytoairpower]

Carbon fibre is essentially string soaked in glue. If you pull string it is strong, if you push it it flops around and deforms. Same thing with carbon fibre. If you make a tube of carbon fibre and pressurize it from the inside the strands are pulled tight. It will hold. If you pressurize it from the outside... well the strings are getting pushed and you are mainly relying on the glue to stop them from flopping around and collapsing.

[@tt-ew7rx]

The metal structure is used to resist this pressure, not the carbon fibre.

[@vonfaustien3957]

@@tt-ew7rx the metal structure is the end caps and hatch most of the hull was carbon fiber.

[@221b-l3t]

​@@tt-ew7rxIt wasn't overwrapped, pure CFC. The epoxy was doibg most of the compression strength.

[@ml.2770]

Exactly. Well explained.

[@aluisious]

@@tt-ew7rx End caps? LOL. Yeah resist 13k feet of water on the center of a tube by gluing it into end caps. You can put titanium on the ends of a toilet paper roll, but I wouldn't use the roll to hang a suit from in the closet.

[@Fleur4848]

The University of Washington said - in the name of spokesman Victor Balta - that they were not involved in the design of the Titan, as OceanGate CEO Rush claims. According to Balta, they did design for OceanGate a prototype of another submarine that could go much shallower. The Cyclops 1 had a steel hull and could descend to a depth of 500 metres. The Titan went down to a depth of 3,800 metres.

[@one.traveler]

Boeing also stated they had no part, no involvement . No record of a sale either. They looked baffled.

[@HozelRocket]

Yep. Boeing, as well, disputed their involvement in this endeavor. Quite simply, Rush was a liar and thru his hubris and arrogance, killed 4 people. He chose to ignore safety, and additionally, hired younger DEI applicants instead of ACTUAL qualified personnel. In short, history should remember this egomaniac as a complete and utter failure... worthy only of our contempt.

[@QueenofMarine]

Rush also said he designed the sub in collaboration with NASA, who also denies any involvement. I think he was bullshitting people in order to make the sub seem safer and more legit than it actually was.

[@johnflanagan2316]

I think Titan imploded somewhere between 500 and 1000 meters. I could be wrong but I think she was

[@IhaveaDoghouse]

@@johnflanagan2316I think you’re wrong. From what I understand it was much deeper than that. Something like 3/4 of the way done the descent because they were a couple hours into it when they stopped communicating

[@tomduke1297]

"for the same damn reason"... that just hits the nail on the head.

[@celticlass8573]

No kidding. It really is an outrage.

[@elp2tlh]

The content was up to Simon's high standard. But what caught my mind is the intensity with which his writers and editors had to have worked to put out a product of this depth and quality as quickly as they did.

[@crazypoultry356]

Kudos to Simon and his team for handling this in such a respectful way.

[@superawesomefuntime2162]

As a programmer there is the joke "I don't always test my code but when I do, I do it in production". This situation takes that to a whole new level.

[@thecon_quererarbitraryname6286]

I know this joke intimately by practicing it actively. It's kind of embarassing and funny at the same time when it malfunctions during a meeting 😂🤣Welp someone broke it in a way I didn't think of 😅

[@elitecol69]

As a gamer, I concur

[@Patterner]

Testing is for Old White Men. (as an old white man and programmer i totally embrace testing)

[@trader2137]

it worked over 20 times...

[@blshouse]

@@trader2137 It worked until it didn't. They were playing Russian roulette with a submersible; its catastrophic failure was as foreseeable as it was inevitable. If the inventor hadn't died with his victims, he'd probably be headed to prison.

[@mekanickrew1932]

Built in Sydney, Australia, by the research and design company Acheron Project Pty Ltd, Deepsea Challenger holds the title when comes to being a deep sea monster. Those guys who allowed Titan to be used as a joy ride must be nuts.

[@BarbaricAvatar]

I knew it was the right decision to wait until one of your writers covered this story. Very well done, thanks.

[@katherine4283]

It’s sad that the 19 year old knew something wasn’t right and he did NOT want to go! Only to appease his father he went anyway 😢

[@mizeryluvkompany]

That’s what one article says. Seen a video with his mom and she said she was supposed to go but he really really wanted to go so she stayed back and let him go in her place. Very conflicting accounts by “family members”.

[@Sillylittletotebagqueen]

@@mizeryluvkompanyeither way he’s 19 and it’s not his fault he was there

[@1besieged]

According to his mother, her son did want to take the trip (she gave up her seat ) so the son could go, the mother and daughter were on the mother ship before her husband and son went into the deep sea, the comment you have is from an aunt who has little contact w/ this young man & husband (of wife ) wife's son .

[@thurin84]

he was a good son.

[@1besieged]

Not true, the aunt is not telling the truth , she is making up stories, the mom said they had little to NO contact w/ aunt. The mom gave up her seat to her son who wanted to go w/ his dad, that is what the MOM stated, I will go with that.

[@organbuilder272]

Powerful presentation, Simon. You outdid yourself on this one. That final statement is in itself a tragedy that it could have been spoken. Such a shame a young man died because he went along with his father's insistance. What a waste of life. Yes, Human arrogance, indifference to the dangers, taking risks. Trusting that which should never have been built, never mind used in such a manner. Thanks for stunning, shocking presentation. One of your best.

[@fastfiddler1625]

Those who don't understand history are destined to repeat it. I find it sad that Rush was able to keep people behind him. I have no remorse for his loss, just the four people he took with him. His blatant disregard for safety is reprehensible. He is right in that you have to accept risk in any endeavor. Flying planes, which is my job, is built on that. You set boundaries, you add contingencies to push those boundaries, but there's always a hard limit somewhere. Rush was using that mentality to fuel his own suicidal push to glory. And he was a totalitarian, who wouldn't let anyone else question his direction.

[@Kratos-eg7ez]

There's so much wrong with everything about him and his sub 🤦 literally could go on for hours about everything that was wrong. I just wanna add that when a criminal trial happens, I don't believe that waiver will hold. Him being criminally negligent was clearly the cause of everything that happened, and I don't believe a judge will value that piece of paper at all during the trial. So many things that was completely wrong about this, hopefully their families see justice for this tragedy, this was very very preventable but it wasn't. Safety was completely blown off, he had done absolutely nothing by the book to fuel his ego n to show how great he is, ignoring every expert along the way. 🤦 Just ew, the man n his entire attitude completely disgusts me, so does his ethics. Or rather, lack there of.

[@markrigg6623]

Personality disorders are just so insidious. What may superficially appear to be intelligence, drive and commitment could turn out to be self possessed reckless abandon.

[@Sniperboy5551]

I agree, he deserved it. He fired the engineer who tried to blow the whistle years ago, he did not care about safety.

[@ronch550]

​@@Kratos-eg7ezI wish he didn't join the trip. He should be cooked in court for what happened. What a terrible human being.

[@SpielkindFR]

Anyone even remotely curious could have found out that carbon fiber composites are utterly ill suited for this purpose with a 3 minute google search. They did not do their very basic due dilligence and, as far as I am concerned, are responsible for their own deaths.

[@wwx-lwj-ai-ni]

I feel sorry for that poor kid who didn't want to be there in the first place. Completely innocent in all of this and deserved no bit of the fate forced upon him :(

[@1besieged]

The mom said her son wanted to go on dive, thus she gave him the seat. The aunt stating otherwise has no contact with this young man , according to the mom of son.

[@bazzer124]

From Francis Stokes: “Whenever your preparations for the sea are poor; the sea worms its way in and finds the problems.” Cheers....

[@lknanml]

I spent 12 years in Army Aviation flying in helicopters. Safety when it comes to the machine is paramount. Misplace a tool. Anything you touched is grounded and searched till that tool is found. Backup systems have backups. Anything worth doing is worth doing right then you have the guy next to you check it out and then another as the experience levels rise with each person. QC.... In the air or below the water is no place for stupid accidents that could have been avoided by following safety rules. If safety rules are holding back your program you need to have another look at your program because you are NOT ready to go on mission.......... At least it was quick.. Never saw or felt a thing.

[@98integraGSR]

Same, brother- I'm Navy and generally work on things that go in, on, and under the water, but the same holds true with us.

[@ripley7222]

What was your favorite helicopter? Mine was the puma what a fine aircraft that was. Also the Chinook was awesome in what it could lift, very impressive

[@PetesGuide]

Excellent answer, and I upvoted it. I would suggest, however, that you read the various reports of cracking sounds being heard. Y multiple passengers, and consider that they probably heard the carbon fiber failing during the last few seconds or minutes. They apparently dropped the ballast at 3500 feet, so knew something was drastically wrong. As you say, they surely didn’t see or feel it. But I think they probably heard it.

[@dpeasehead]

@lknanml: "If safety rules are holding back your program you need to have another look at your program..." Well said! That, or seek professional help in dealing with your death wish.

[@lknanml]

@@98integraGSR Our base was right next to the ocean. SO MANY FREAKING BIRD BATHS AND WASHES.............. FU corrosion!!!! You guys are ON the water. You must just leave the fire sprinklers on 24/7..... J/K

[@justinbrockwell8396]

Several points of failure: Carbon fibre structures have mostly mono-directional strength. In compression, carbon fibre structures rely mostly on the strength of the bonding agent (resin) Cyclic fatigue with carbon fibre structures is a relaively unknown factor when used in compressive applications. The use of different materials (carbon fibre, titanium, and a bonding agent between the two) causes differing difflection between the various materials. Cylindrical pressure vessel and spherical titanium "end caps" causes a vast difference in the vessels uniform ability to evenly distribute the loads exerted by pressure. It will be one, or a combination of the above which caused the failure.

[@chrisnizer5702]

They're great when you need strength in tension, very unpredictable when it's subject to stress in compression, especially repeated cycles of enormous compression. If a void develops somewhere, the enormous relentless pressure will force it to propagate in milliseconds. The carbon fiber probably disintegrated into a fine talcum like powder.

[@tirex3673]

Or alternatively the window, which reportedly was only rated for a depth of 1300 meters, collapsed

[@ODiEdiTzZ]

If you look into it, the CF cylinder was made from unidirectional carbon laid in the circular direction. While this is by far the best way to make such a part and while it guarantees maximum resistance to inward pressure, the yield strength and UTS of carbon are incredibly close together. In aviation it’s well known that while you can search for and find cracks in metals using sonar, this just isn’t possible with carbon because when it cracks, it’s probably already completely broken

[@theaspiration]

You nailed it. The rates of compression and expansion are vital in so many mechanical applications and somehow that seemed fine to this "live fast, break stuff genius". I don't feel bad for him, I feel bad for those he took with him. He got what he asked for. The rest of them assumed he knew what he was talking about.

[@GamerX51]

@@theaspiration When you're dealing with underwater exploration, you never assume anything; you verify. And if you CAN"T verify, then you absolutely don't take some guy's word for it. These rich idiots didn't do their due diligence, and they paid the price. I don't feel sorry for any of them. Except maybe that 19 year old; he didn't even want to be there, and he only came along for his father's sake. I might have just a smidgen of pity for him.

[@jons4917]

This is the best video I've seen on the subject - gives as much technical detail as known, and highlights the flaws, whilst not overlooking the fact that people did die. Kudos the to the writer for their sensitivity here, and Simon for his calm yet compassionate delivery

[@Narxes081206]

I'm still can't believe people would pay $250,000 to go on this horribly engineered and unprofessional "submarine". The lack of dedication to safety by the CEO was beyond concerning.

[@verbalkint1770]

Mine neither.

[@latenighter1965]

It made 20 safe trips to the bottom of the ocean, including more then one to the Titanic. NASA has killed more people.

[@mdexterc2894]

Well, considering the number of people who backed out, quite, silenced, or just stopped communicating, I think they found clients simply from the number of prospects that he aggressively marketted to. Hell, he actually flew to one of those who backed out just to beg them to buy tickets

[@brunokirchensittenbach9294]

…” Wealth won’t make people inmune to stupidity “…🧜‍♀️

[@Jagdtoq]

A cheap gaming controller, bolted in so no way to get out from the inside and carbon fibre instead of high strength steel plus everything else would send any sane potential customer running for the hills

[@justandy333]

Stockton Rush's Damned Arrogance is what caused this. He ignored countless experts advising him that the sub was unsafe. All the cost cutting measures he took. The fact it was uncertified is the biggest of red flags. Sacking people for bringing safety concerns to his attention is unbelievable. I just feel soo soo bad for the 4 others who really didnt know the full extent of what they were getting themselves into. Such a sad tragedy which was entirely avoidable had it not been for Stockton's attitude.

[@jeffprice6421]

Yes I am sure Rush''s family takes solace in there not being any boring white guys working the design of the sub... In another interview he said he didn't want to hire experienced submarine engineers because they were boring white guys and not "insorational enough"... A HUGE red flag is not wanting experienced engineers, because experienced engineers would have asked incisive questions, and he didn't want that. He wanted to cut corners...

[@aluisious]

Who "certifies" submersibles for 13k feet of operating depth? It was a one off experimental vehicle. It was a STUPID vehicle, but not because it was "uncertified," because it was designed by lazy idiots and untested.

[@homespace1268]

​@@jeffprice6421He didn't want anyone who would question the safety...he wanted people who would worship him as a genius... arrogant and narcissistic.

[@marcoosvald8429]

HUBRIS

[@justandy333]

@@marcoosvald8429 exactly!

[@patgiblinsongs5]

Simon and team, thank you for providing us a more nuanced, respectful report on this loss of life. James Cameron’s remark was spot on.

[@holmesd5003]

The fact that one of the engineers was fired for calling the company out over the safety of the vessel is mind blowing. Corporate greed at it again.

[@harryparsons2750]

Corporate? Has nothing to do with this. It was the guy who had it made and didn’t think safety was important whatsoever.

[@farmsalot1233]

@@harryparsons2750 it's literally corporate greed.

[@cornpowa]

I think it had more to do with arrogance than greed. If it was greed, the CEO never would have went on one dive in that coffin, instead he went multiple times.

[@chrisfoster3772]

I own a chainsaw

[@nikitatarsov5172]

If it turns out this way, with no victims but richkids hold responsible for the lousy decisions of ther life - i'm okay with it. Really, more projects should offer 'interesting expiriences' which you can only join if you check both the box of 'too much money to spend' and 'no idea how reality works', because this combined ensures you're a very harmfull person to your enviroment.

[@donbruce2306]

Today on a very special episode of Megaprojects, we discuss the dangers of diving thirteen thousand feet under water in a submersible made of parts purchased from Camping World.

[@ESGamingCentral]

And Logitech

[@chrispavin1373]

Don't forget the carbon fiber tape he bought at harbor freight.

[@OskarasNauseda]

dont forget carbon fiber that was out of date

[@Antares2]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

[@airplanenut89]

One detail I've heard left out about Rush is that he was a flight engineer for McDonnell-Douglas, a company well known for sacrificing safety for profit, and who's business practices have now infected Boeing which purchased MD in 1997.

[@C2-GAMES]

We saw where Boeing comes with safety

[@airplanenut89]

@@C2-GAMES That's more of a recent development due to the remnants of McDonnell-Douglas' leadership taking hold in Boeing. Boeing used to be the absolute gold standard when it came to safety. Which makes it all the more disappointing.

[@randall39]

Thank you for not sensationalizing the results of an implosion on the body. Good reporting and I like your shows.

[@lukeoxley7548]

That quote from James Cameron that Simon left us with really hit home. I just wish that their families can get closure, either via court or just by knowing what happened

[@rustomkanishka]

What probably happened is that the craft imploded without warning. The people got turned into puree.

[@kevinscottbailey8335]

@@rustomkanishka James Cameron later said that it's quite possible that their system of failure warning let them know the craft was beginning to fail, and that they had dropped ballast and were trying to ascend when the implosion happened. It's not pleasant to think about, but I think it's very likely they (or at least Rush and PH) knew they were in trouble before the implosion.

[@travis8106]

People have travelled much deeper than this, repeatedly with success. There is no reason this should have happened. Stockton's pockets were deep. He could have afforded to make this safer.

[@dereksbooks]

He was crazy. No amount of money would have helped this guy design a safe sub because he was hell bent on fundamentally inappropriate materials and designs.

[@matthewdavies2057]

@@dereksbooks Grade B fiber to transport people. Jesus H. Christ.

[@reneedennis2011]

Yup. Good point.

[@doomspud6302]

The worst tragedies are the ones that should have been easily avoided. At least there is some small justice in that the captain went down with his poorly designed ship. Its just too bad he had to take four innocent people with him to his much deserved meeting with Davey Jones.

[@phalanx3803]

in a way he got lucky had he not bean in there he would be getting burned at the stake.

[@stannyb3346]

​@phalanx3803 only because he killed other billionaires, if he had killed a bunch of workers, he would've gotten away with it, guaranteed.

[@dx1450]

@@phalanx3803 And very rightly so. Imagine designing & building a death trap and then sending other people to their death in it because your hubris made you think you know more than the experts...

[@rlift]

I just find it weird that the kid's aunt said he was terrified of the trip, but his mother said in a recent interview he was ecstatic go down... She said that she was supposed to be the one going down but let him go instead.

[@martinleavitt6094]

Good point I heard the same conflictory statements....hmmmmmm...

[@isabellind1292]

That's what I heard as well. But neither should have made a comment, period! It was no one else's business. They'd been thrust into the spotlight and I don't care what the son said to either except I think every single adult can share the blame for allowing a 19 yr old to sign a death waiver before he took an adventure w/his dad.

[@typicalgamerkid1012]

Wasnt it the husband the wife was referring too, like the part where she said they were excited it was the her husband she was referring too, feel free to correct me

[@rlift]

@@typicalgamerkid1012 You could be correct and the things I saw could be referring to her husband, but everything I saw/heard about her comments mentioned the son and not her husband.

[@typicalgamerkid1012]

@@rlift Hm I see, thanks for your comment this is quite confusing

[@NightMotorcyclist]

Dr. Robert Ballard spent many years developing ways to visit the Titanic and his hard work paid off. The fact that the CEO of OceanGate said he didn't want old white military veterans to operate things because it's not "inspiring" just further proved this was a two bit operation.

[@misutatomasu]

"Let me ignore literally the only demographic that makes top of the line subs, I'm sure my fake virtue will save me from becoming a squashed canned fish food." The result:

[@marka4891]

@@misutatomasu Except it wasn't virtue. He wasn't trying to right a wrong, perceived or otherwise, by avoiding them. He was just a jerk whose hubris lead him to think that safety and good engineering practices were hindrances to innovation.

[@DanielleStarry]

Discrimination is bad lol

[@misutatomasu]

@@marka4891 Except "I hire young non-white people because they are more inspirational than 50 year old white men" is LITERALLY considered a virtue today. It had nothing to do with hubris or absolute confidence in his engineering prowess, he was warned several times by professionals in this specific field that the craft was not even remotely fit for operating at those depths. Nice try at deflecting though.

[@truth.is.hella.bitter8985]

He was literally a "Dare DEVIL."

[@Lanse1984]

The CNN interview with James Cameron is the only interview you need to watch. He explains what and why in details

[@Halcyon554]

I'm a safety committee member at my UPS Warehouse, and Stockton Rush's words are the very things I warn against. You're not LIKELY to die in common operations at UPS, but you could break a limb, get hurt by chemicals, hurt your neck and back...and I've seen walking wounded who got hurt years ago and their bodies just don't work the same way they do. Once your knee or back gets hurt, it's not going to be 100% ever again. I'm going there because safety is paramount. He doesn't get that innovation COMES in the form of safety. It's the difference between going home or not going back at all. It's the difference between industries like air travel and cars being a thriving industry or people shunning them because they don't want to die. I tell stories like this to new hires to impress upon them that the choices they make are choices that will impact them later in life. In the end if you want to be an unsafe person...make sure your unsafe practices ONLY impacts you. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink. But don't be a Stockton Rush where your unsafe practices impacts other people. I have sympathy for these people whom he roped into this dangerous venture. I don't have any sympathy for him. I hope he rots in hell.

[@martinleavitt6094]

Well said... 👍

[@Clothed-with-His-Glory]

Jesus doesn’t want one person to “rot in hell”. What causes you to think your escaping hell?

[@joem3999]

I've worked the two most dangerous jobs in the U.S. Logging and commercial fishing in Alaska. People that hesitate and constantly worry about safety are often the ones that get killed/hurt first. If not, then they get someone else hurt or killed. Usually the latter. Can't be insane either 🤣... You need to be safe, yet also have a contempt for danger. You need to be aware, not over cautious. An ability to think when terrified and move fast. Sometimes a lack of self concern is needed. While you stand there worrying about splinters we both get our skulls cracked by the chokers, or crushed to death by a log, or a boulder, or falling equipment, or maybe we just fell down the mountain... Ect ect.... No offense intended but I'd never log with you. If I got stuck on a ship with a union reg quoting type only one of us would return. The Bering sea is cold and my temper is hot lol. Ps. I will add that I had to stop that type of work. I had started second guessing everything. Lost my edge and ability.

[@Halcyon554]

@@joem3999 Thankfully I'm also not an idiot but I'd also probably not work with you on anything. For the record I'm a stickler on safety not just because of my work at my job, but because I'm a firearms guy. If you are gonna be flippant about safety in a situation where someone could readily get shot and killed because someone didn't care that much about safety then I don't want you within a mile of me at any range. Safety protocol and best practices are written in blood. I don't intend to add my own or anyone I know to that tally.

[@Halcyon554]

@@Clothed-with-His-Glory Who says I'm escaping hell? Gonna warm up a spot for you. You're just too blind to realize you're coming along. Keep telling yourself you're a good Christian and you're getting out.

[@bldos5362]

To do better, we need to understand ourselves more than anything else. Hubris and humility.

[@sgringo]

Thank you, Simon, for covering this tragic incident in such a thoughtful, respectful, way.

[@jnagarya519]

Why are we to respect stupidity?

[@iggi3985]

@@jnagarya519 Because the passengers weren't involved in its design, because all aboard were still human, because these men will be remembered for their bravery, as opposed to you, who will now forever lock your place in the low life category, to scoff at the deaths of these individuals. Shameful.

[@jnagarya519]

@@iggi3985 Yes: stupid risks -- in others -- are often mistaken, and praised -- at a distance -- as being instead "bravery". There are others who could have replaced the four that went with self-promoter and liar Stockton Rush, but they HEEDED THE WARNINGS so are still alive. Which is to be preferred, Mr. Non-Lowlife -- smart and alive, or stupid -- er, "brave" -- and dead? Rush spent more money on lawyers silencing the speech of his critics than he spent on safety. That is not "bravery"; it is moral bankruptcy, corruption, dishonesty. To bolster the false image that his was a credible enterprise he claimed associations/collaborations that were false -- he lied. Will you now argue that that lowlife exploitation of and disregard for the lives of others -- that lying -- is a form of "bravery"?

[@ashtonturner2862]

I will never understand people's obsession with the Titanic. The only person I feel sorry for is the 19-year-old kid who didn't want to go, but did for his dad for Father's Day.

[@aka99]

Well, don’t you think it is a morbid story? So many people had no choice or chance. Only to die there. I am interested, but not obsessed. Reading and learning, ok, but that’s enough. I would never want to see the wreck live. I like the Simulation honor and glory.

[@ashtonturner2862]

@@aka99 It's not original. There are thousands of morbid stories of sunken ships. Thousands of lives perished in the oceans. The Titanic is nothing special.

[@Shorty15c4007]

Bruh, I liked the movie just as much as the next guy but seeing something that big in an environment so dark and unforgiving? Hell no, I'd be shitting my pants too. Its megalophobia cranked to 11 lol.

[@MaddJakd]

It's a simple matter of curiosity. Folk want to explore such places all the time.

[@Fay_F_2]

@@Shorty15c4007totally agree . That environment is unforgiving . The only word that can describe it

[@Djoki1]

The CEO was dismissing safety, and he pretty much got what he was asking for.

[@soiledhalo2296]

Unfortunately, it wasn't just him.

[@LadyAdakStillStands]

I thought the US learned a lesson with Apollo 1. External only escape hatches are a 100% failure 100% of the time. As well as the need for backup systems for the backup systems. This will take decades to sort out and it will be decades before we try again.I choose to remember the crew as smiling, upbeat and excited for the approach and never knowing what exactly happened as it was too fast to blink. RIP Gentlemen. This decidedly did not have to happen.

[@kellyalvarado6533]

I said exactly the same. 60 years later and they still had the stupidity to lock people in. I wouldn't give a damn how much I wanted to go down there. You're not bolting me *inside*.

[@heckyes]

Humanity occasionally needs reminders like this. Reminders that there really are "experts", and that we ought to listen to what they have to say. The number of lessons we can all take away from this tragedy is very high. Maybe their loss of life can be seen as a teachable moment that will benefit future explorers.

[@earth0128]

Really hope 🙏 so

[@radguy72]

12:30 Communication being lost was normal because the CEO didn't like being contacted regularly. 4:48 The CEO claimed that it had that amount of oxygen but was never confirmed or tested with 5 people. 5:16 The "toilet" was a small, plastic, hand held urinal that you get in the ER when a patient can't get up. 5:28 The CEO said people mortgaged their homes to go on his trips, some saved up for years to go on the trip. Most of the time it was cancelled due to an issue and as far as I know, no refunds were given.

[@Halfdead211]

I know everyone has different interests but refinancing my house to go an experimental sub to see a wreck that can easily be seen all over KZbin seems insane to me

[@trader2137]

he didnt make money on the trips anyway, the cost of operation was way more than 4x 250k$, they used fundraising to finance the trips

[@blarghmcblarghson1903]

@@trader2137 Allegedly. We don't know how many corners they cut until their books are disclosed, otherwise we're taking the word of a company who was run by a man that openly lied for years about University of Washington's, NASA's, and Boeing's involvement in building his carbon fiber hull.

[@Author.Noelle.Alexandria]

@@trader2137 He got free trips out of it. Any financial loss was a tax-write-off. He had a pretty good scam going on.

[@celticlass8573]

I hadn't watched any videos about this tragedy, waiting to hear from someone who I knew would not only do it justice, but who would present the facts, without sensationalizing. Thank you for being that person, Simon.

[@AlejandroLZuvic]

I mean, I wouldn't say Simon's take is wrong but he left a lot of information out. He focused on things like the game controller, which many experts said "yeah, it's not ideal but it's not the first time we used off-the-shelves controllers" and then he never really explained what were the actual flaws in the design of the hull, the flaws that actually led to the sub imploding. He briefly mentioned why carbon fiber is such a bad idea for a submergible but there are so so so much more information about composite materials he doesn't even care to include, he didn't explain why building in three different pieces was a challenge. He mentioned some "bad practices" here and there but he really didn't give many actual details of the sub and how the dive was supposed to go. The explanation of the rescue mission is apallingly simplistic, there's no timeline of events, no list of vessels or even helping countries, he doesn't care to mention who actually found the wreckage (it was the French, the French arrived on Thursday, didn't even take time to say hi, dropped an ROV and bam, found it where they suspected it first try, James Cameron confirmed it). I like Simon's delivery but honestly I use their videos more like a "wow I didn't know this thing was real" gallery and when a subject really picks my interest I try to go to better sources.

[@danlw212]

Twobitdavinci just released an equally well done video yesterday about this tragedy. He comes at it from an engineer’s perspective. He talks a little bit more about the actual sub and the design/build process.

[@celticlass8573]

@@AlejandroLZuvic So you would have preferred a full-length documentary?

[@BIGNOIDS]

There are plenty of informed and detailed videos out there on this subject, it's silly to restrict yourself to just one source.

[@celticlass8573]

@@BIGNOIDS Where are you getting that I'm restricting myself to just this video?

[@sanjayrajsoni]

This is more informative than the hours of news channel dribble I listened to!!

[@michelleelliot2068]

In a sea full of clickbait, assumptions and even ghoulish glee thank you Simon and everyone at megaprojects for this somber, and factual presentation on this you truly are one of the very best content creators on KZbin. I would love to see more of these types of factual and current events type presentations from your channels as the world so desperately needs ppl that will put across only the facts and not spread misinformation for the sake of clicks. And for those taking any sense of joy from the deaths of the crew you should be ashamed of yourselves. As an engineer myself I understand very well that this vessel should never have been taken to the bottom of a swimming pool let alone the ocean but ffs ppl are dead and they have families and they were ppl themselves.

[@BIGNOIDS]

Bloody hell, take your tongue out of his hoop mate.

[@jnagarya519]

This doesn't report any facts not reported by the legitimate media.

[@golferorb]

I really don't understand why someone would pay $250,000 so they could see the titanic through a monitor. You can't even see it with your own eyes unless you are using the toliet on the submersible. I can watch a documentary if I wanted to see it through a screen.

[@MadSwede87]

you may be able to see a small part of it true the porthole (if the sub got one) but I rather see a video from a ROV

[@Korschtal]

It does give the impression bragging rights were a factor.

[@thebonefish]

Flex

[@deemariedubois4916]

Yes you can watch a documentary through a screen and you can do so while sitting on a toilet in the privacy of your own bathroom. Amazing time to be alive.

[@es68951]

Because people waste their lives doing immoral, corrupt, criminal things like Stockton Rush just so they can amass enough money that they get bored and don't know what to spend it on anymore. Then they spend $250,000 so they could see the titanic through a monitor.

[@lolzlolz69]

Jolly nice of them to already include a "...gate" suffix.

[@dak4465]

This is the only channel where im actually willing to hear about thhis event

[@Sahtoovi]

The controller is a red herring. Using video game controllers is very common, even in militaries, including the US. Even American nuclear submarines use playstation 5 controllers. Tanks often use controllers for the gunner, sometimes drones can be controlled using videogame controllers etc. The issue with the controller was that it was wireless instead of wired. A wired controller should always be used for reasons of reliability.

[@davidwilliams7552]

The military doesnt use off the shelf game contollers to steer their vessels though.

[@cb41503]

​@@davidwilliams7552still, they are designed to be like game controllers as much as possible, plus the one they were using is notorious for disconnecting

[@Sahtoovi]

@@davidwilliams7552 You still have to remember that this was a civilian vessel, not a military one. The standards are completely different with every aspect of its operation. A controller works just fine, literally all you have to do is to program the vessel to respond to inputs from the controller, which is very easy to do. The reliability issue comes from it being wireless, if it was wired it would be very reliable. And the US military does use just off the shelf controllers for some tasks, although for most they build their own controller-style tools. For example US military EOD robots are controlled with just off the shelf controllers, with a single google search I could find an article about one being controlled using an Xbox controller. Israel uses an Xbox controller, at least for now, on their not yet finished Carmel tank. American spy UAVs are often flown with Xbox controllers. The US military's HELMD is also operated by an Xbox controller. I am not completely certain but based on my research it seems like all of these are specifically Xbox 360 controllers, for which there probably is a good reason.

[@Sahtoovi]

@@Pifla Read my previous reply.

[@Sahtoovi]

@@Pifla I did and I do not see how it contradicts the fact that the US military does indeed use unmodified Xbox controllers for equipment.