THE ULTIMATE NBA GOAT DEBATE

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🟣VID I REACTED TO: • The Greatest Debate: A...

[@MarzTalksSports]

oh we out here fr

[@nathanwhyte9048]

Wsg Marz, y’all should make a vid on peak lebrons defense. I think it’s truly underrated abd so unique no glazing shit. I think peak lebron defense is better than jordan

[@Goatfan2k]

@@nathanwhyte9048no it ain’t peak mj is getting at least 3 steals and a 1 block or more it only until Rodman and pippen emerged Jordan defensive assignment got a bit easier and even then Ron Harper Jordan pippen were picking guys up half court

[@zacharyhupert2388]

We all know the real goat is 77

[@marcusht7352]

Deadass

[@DirtyDev]

Sage alt account:

[@cdeo4l668]

rs

[@d4bandit145]

The only good outlaws fan

[@tr3ymizzles542]

And 1 incoming

[@chase-iy9rd]

BSOLZ is literally one of the best youtubers man. he’s just a vibe

[@ericksaa1510]

da man. bsolz got crazy potential to grow even bigger then he is now

[@phoenixc6812]

@@ericksaa1510in what way?

[@ericksaa1510]

@@phoenixc6812 bsolz is entertaining af. being away from the podcast or sage he still articulates himself well in multiple topics. he also has more interests then just basketball. the nba community has professed a lot in how it views debates and discussions, making it hard to say something that hasn’t been said. he pivoted away from that with sage and became more light hearted but he can do what he loves instead of always basketball

[@Patrennessy]

A zibe, one might say

[@whooshbait4161]

LOW and Marz easily won the debate. People dont realize that when judging a debate, you have to base the winner based off of the points given during the actual debate. I can think LeBron is the GOAT, but if there's a GOAT debate and the people debating for Lebron shit the bed, then I'd have to say the people arguing for MJ won that debate, even though I think that LeBron is the GOAT.

[@Suge8263]

I just don't get the case for LeBron. When MJ did so much in little. And even by the eye test mj game just looks better

[@Cornell_Alvarez99]

Naw, Chill was cookin them niggas and they tried so much to move the goal post. That is why I don’t do debates

[@iamsheron7408]

@@Suge8263the eye test is subjective based on a my eyes test lebron is better you see how me saying that doesn’t really mean anything

[@devgocrazy613]

@@Suge8263The biggest deal breaker for me Bron’s success against a higher competition level and Bron’s overall game being better than Jordan’s. The arguements is essentially which weapon is better, a shield or a sword. A shield can support yourself and others, while also dealing out damage. A sword can kill with precision at all levels. Shields last longer than swords, but swords gets the job done more efficiently without aid. If you wanna kill a team, Jordan. Wanna win a series, Bron.

[@danyoung9832]

@@iamsheron7408eye test definitely important for things like defense or players you have never seen play before. You can’t just base every argument off stats imo got to be able to actually have seen the player play. That’s why I personally don’t even really include players from the 60s in my list cause I’ve never really seen them play and I would only be able to judge them based off stats or what someone else has said

[@Mark-The-Tenor]

I’ve heard all these debates so many times, and it always comes around to showing that Jordan was better even when things weren’t entirely going his way.

[@EastSideRudeBoy]

Pretty much

[@lankyknite]

Every ring Jordan won he was the favorite, so when weren’t things going his way. Cuz I’m pretty sure he got swept out the first round multiple times

[@iitzblitxen3770]

@@lankykniteMJ was the reason they were the favorite

[@lankyknite]

@@iitzblitxen3770 Jordan has a great team and coach in addition to him

[@Big_3000]

@@lankyknitebeing the favorites in the finals doesn’t mean anything and is a misleading statement. The Bulls were only heavily favored in 1991 and 1996. In 98, the Jazz were favored over the Bulls.

[@alexsmith3598]

"you could say LeBron was the reason they lost in MULTIPLE playoff series. Look at 2011. Anyways, next topic because I don't have any more expamples but 'multiple' definitely sounded better."

[@willllawhun9455]

Glad someone else pointed it out lmao

[@BLee09]

Who said that? Lmfao

[@marlowstanfield6815]

2007 Finals

[@pantelisellinidis5956]

2023 against denver is another one

[@fluff975]

@@pantelisellinidis5956 no tf its not, AD was inconsistent that entire series, LeBron was solid throughout and incredible in the elimination game

[@thekiller3475]

People bring up Scotty like LeBron, didn’t have a fuck ton of great players around him at least Scotty was drafted there. LeBron had to go and get help from players that are arguably better than Scottie Pippen especially Anthony Davis and Dwyane Wade.

[@puncho8799]

Facts!!!! 💯

[@Trvllumanati]

Don’t forget Kyrie

[@practiceyourart]

Cuz people are dumb. From his first 3 chips, the third best player on his team like Love was 27/12 the season before. Not second best, third. Then you have Bosch who was top 5 in PER the season before he moved to Miami. Then the year he won his 4th, AD was the 2nd best player in the playoffs after Lebron. People can think Bron is the goat, just use better arguments.

[@SomeSortaMentalWealthSeminar]

True, but they traded up from 8th to 5th for scotty 3 years after Jordan was drafted , Bron never had that situation to begin with or competent owners in Cleveland. The best pick Cleveland made from his time there (2003-2010) was JJ Hickson (@19th 2008) or Danny green (@46th 2009). With Bron bro Cleveland of all teams wasn't in the lottery to his credit and detriment lol ... As a result of dealing with the shortcomings of Cleveland as an organisation, he literally took on the additional work of recruiting / scouting for himself, baring in mind whilst at Miami his basketball IQ grew further and is factually generational . And tbh we already know he's a better owner than MJ rn lol. In terms of the narrative that Lebron's a choker, 'late game he's not that guy' , ' he gets bailed'. - I just have to laugh, because for all the things Lebron is genuinely accountable for he dosen't get the credit he owed lowkey. Like Drafting Lebron was essentially drafting a Player, All-star, Playoff pusher, MVP, Champion, Face of the league, Vet, Coach, Gm, Owner, Icon, Highest scoring NBA player ever ... it's not like its not a hard decision thou

[@puncho8799]

@@SomeSortaMentalWealthSeminar Most of what you just said is nonsense 🤦🏽‍♂️🤣

[@acedatninja23]

Buddy said thank God for Pippin like he said something you can say the same thing about James 🤣🤣 Kyrie AD Wade and Bosh I don't know I think LeBron had more help lol😊

[@edppoopsock168]

I rather have a consistent piece than constantly having new teammates because one got old really fast and the other decided he didn’t wanna be a Robin

[@kennethxu1789]

i mean lebron almost did it in 2007, but the spurs had an actually well built team.

[@Jerome7-v5u]

They acting like Rodman was a good player too. Bro was Draymond before Draymond but without the passing, scoring and everything else

[@Robertedwinhouse38]

But Jordan had pippen Rodman kukoc and Phil Jackson at the same time is the difference

[@jackfry5954]

Relatively speaking Jordan had more help that’s why his team went 72-10🤣 you can’t compare players teammates like that by decades cause obviously the talent as a whole is always getting better. You have to look at what the players did relative to their era it’s pretty simple actually🤷‍♂️ makes no sense how people will say stuff like this essentially admitting the talent in the nba has gotten better since the 90s but also deny that lebron would dominate during that era😭

[@somerandomcanuck9432]

I like the fact that Chill just made his Lebron defensive stats the fuck up. I didn't really understand if he was talking the 2016-17 season where Draymond won DPOY, or the year after that but just for some context. 2016-17 Stats: Lebron James - 1.2 STL & 0.6 BLK per game Jimmy Butler - 1.9 STL & 0.4 BLK per game Draymond Green - 2.0 STL & 1.4 BLK per game (Won DPOY) Also note lebron was tied in 5th place with Andre Roberson and Hassan Whiteside who for comparison posted these stats: Andre Roberson - 1.2 STL & 1 BLK per game Hassan Whiteside - 0.7 STL & 2.1 BLK per game Also note Jimmy Butler wasn't even in the top 10 in voting that year 2017-18 Stats: Lebron James - 1.4 STL & 0.9 BLK per game Jimmy Butler - 2.0 STL & 0.4 BLK per game Draymond Green - 1.4 STL & 1.3 BLK per game Rudy Gobert - 0.8 STL & 2.3 BLK per game (Won DPOY) So Lebron was either worse than or equal to either candidate in both stats (Other than blocks for Jimmy but honestly if 0.2 difference matters that much to you kk) I say this because if Chill wanted to make a defensive player argument about Lebron he should have used the years where Lebron was actually a defensive beast. Those being his early Cavs and Heat years. Lebron only averaged 2 steals once in his career (that being his sophmore year) and his highest blocks average was 1.1, twice in his early cavs career (2007-08 and 2008-09) as well as the 2021-22 year he player 56 games. Micheal Jordon in comparison, averaged 3.2 steals in his 4 season, and averaged over 2 steals a game for all but 3 seasons of his bulls career (His lowest being 1.7 steals) and the 2 wizards years (where he averaged 1.4 and 1.5, higher than lebron these two supposed DPOY years). Also note he led the league in steals 3 times (despite facing competition with all time great steals leaders like Payton or Stockton). Now for blocks Jordon only averaged 0.8 in his career, but he did average more blocks than Lebron's all time high in 3 seasons early in his career (1985-1988) with 1.2, 1.5, and 1.6 blocks respectively for the season. So not only is this a poor comparison, Chill just straight up made his numbers and therefore arguement the fuck up.

[@JimBob-jr5up]

7:30 In this scenario it will always be 6 in one city. Because its very difficult to maintain, retool, reload, for the near decade the Bulls and MJ did. Dont forget, more than 2 rings on one team is so impressive because its only a matter of time until teams and defenses adjust to be able to handle them. In LBJs situation, the only teams hed go to are stacked teams, ready to win a couple and then hes out again, going to an entirely new stacked team that will take the league a couple years to really figure out.

[@98ore]

people miss this aspect of it alot, of course he retired after 3, its not easy winning over and over again playing all 82 games or at least 80 games, giving it your all on offense and defense. and then came back and did it again, thats nuts.

[@ItzShashmaBrownskin]

Playing way longer and achieving less is crazy for anyone to call him the G.O.A.T When did we start awarding people for coming second place alot 😂😂😂

[@eberdamilcar2130]

That doesn’t take context into account. No matter how you see it Lebron was just put in way tougher situations

[@Logotokounmpo]

​@eberdamilcar2130 yeah I'm sure hand picking your team is tougher. Jordan also was also going through it in the 80s with a team full of crackheads and going up against lengendary Celtics and Pistons teams

[@ItzShashmaBrownskin]

@@eberdamilcar2130 he faced top competition in the finals and only the finals coz the east was ass. Then he got there what happened once we expected him to actually win he did 2011.

[@eberdamilcar2130]

@@ItzShashmaBrownskin even the players and teams Lebron played in the east would dog walk any team for Jordan’s era outside of the bulls. Players today are just much more talented than players from the 80s and 90s

[@Ghost-rb6cw]

​@@ItzShashmaBrownskin lol Jordan doesn't go 6-0 in the lebron era lmao 🤣 smh.

[@oephry3253]

I don’t think Lebron winning on 3 teams should be praised as an accomplishment. Like it is in a way, but what enables him to do that is just the player movement of the era. It’s not like Lebron went to 3 bad teams and turned them from scrubs to a championship on his own. He always had stars and new players coming in as well to improve the team. Now winning is still impressive but when people say that, it feels like they’re giving Lebron all the credit for turning ass teams into great ones, when in reality the rosters also change drastically once Lebron arrived

[@puncho8799]

Facts!!!! 💯

[@Brooklyn94269]

Shows his ability to win with different cores, different casts of players and different systems . Most players that win a lot typically have a familiar system and players

[@puncho8799]

@@Brooklyn94269 That’s not true because we all know whatever team, LeBron goes on and whatever system they are running before he becomes the LeBron system, which means bringing in players to stand around the three-point line and when I drive, I kick it out and you hit the shot

[@rockleesankleweights1268]

The reason it’s an accomplishment is because no one else can do it. The closest comparison would be the 08 Celtics and their the reason Bron had to go to the Heat. And lets be clear Lebron was drafted to one of the worst organizations in the nba outside of the big 3 the Cavaliers never put a solid team around him and when they did he won

[@DirtyDev]

“Player moment era” its not like he’s demanded a trade anywhere he’s only signed with different teams in the offseason which is something that’s always been an option for players, people paint it differently when a star player does it.

[@limitedbom2206]

Every goat debate is the same. Jordan fans say how good he was, how he elevated the game, he was the best on both sides of the ball. Lebron fans complain about how everything was unfair. His teams weren’t fair, his opponents weren’t fair, his coaches weren’t fair. It’s obvious who’s the goat.

[@robertoloor285]

a thinking like this is why jorsexuals are jorsexuals. Explain to me how jordan got swept 2x in the first round without excuses? Just cant accept the fact that Jordan had the best scenario for him getting drafted at the best org and gm

[@limitedbom2206]

@@robertoloor285 He got swept what excuse is there? They lost (best of 5) so they weren't good enough to win. What else is there to say?

[@robertoloor285]

@@limitedbom2206 Yes then you get the point. Jordan did not have success early but main difference is jordan was awarded pippen by his org. Lebron got who? A grandpa shaq? this is why lebron fans claim that his situation is worse or unfair. Jordan was placed into a position to win. He got a good org and that org turned the bulls into 72 win team arguable the best team of ALL TIME. Did lebron ever had to get that opportunity? Not even close.

[@jaridatkinson4907]

Chicago never won before mj and haven't won since they're essentially Cleveland in a better city

[@limitedbom2206]

@@robertoloor285 Lebrons team had the best record in the league for 2 years straight, but I guess they were trash. Plus, pippen was hurt all the fuckin time in the playoffs but they still won without him. Lebron woulda jumped ship year 2 with pippens injury prone ass. Jordan didn't run when things got hard, if it was inconvenient, lebron ring chased. Case closed, lebron can only win when his HOF level teammates are in their prime and healthy.

[@omgodogdeath9932]

The only reason MJs finals comp was worse than Lebrons is because he played in the better conference and if Bron played in the west he would not even make the finals as many times as he did

[@kenneth9338]

This is wrong the era in general was weaker than the 2000s and 2010s as a whole

[@Ghost-rb6cw]

Jordan did not play in a better east conference lol, only 2 teams push Jordan bulls to 7 games in the entire 90's but some how they're better?

[@omgodogdeath9932]

@@Ghost-rb6cw how were brons east runs harder

[@Jonas-PD]

@@kenneth9338The east was a complete joke the majority of the years Lebron played there apart from 2008-2012 when it was top heavy at best.

[@iamsheron7408]

That’s just an assumption that doesn’t really mean much to the argument at all

[@d34n_]

Marz was cooking and he doesn’t even think Jordan is greater than Lebron lol

[@DirtyDev]

yes he does.

[@d34n_]

@@DirtyDev His all-time greatest players list is on his channel

[@DirtyDev]

@@d34n_ oh my bad

[@jonnstewart2023]

he's already said he think that Jordan is better but that bron's longevity is why he has bron as the goat

[@MarzTalksSports]

@@DirtyDevdamn u said that with confidence

[@fijivine]

I don’t get the staying on one team argument for Kobe and Jordan because both of there front offices provided players like Shaq and pippen in there first 7 years while Brons best player was either mo Williams or Larry Hughs. If Cleveland didn’t fumble Boozer then I totally agree with the sentiment that staying with one team is harder but let’s not act like the Kobe and Jordan’s front offices wheren’t way better in the first seven years of their career. Also let’s not forget Kobe did ask for a trade before pau gasol got there which he was right in doing so because he was wasting his best athletic peak years…. MJ retired twice when the bulls lost interior presence (Horace grant) and the threat of firing Phil

[@Looptroop98]

Facts

[@Trvllumanati]

I get the one team argument perfectly. Would you rather be the head of a dynasty or win chips with multiple teams?

[@Looptroop98]

@@Trvllumanati Kobe wasn’t the head of the dynasty it was Shaq Jordan was the head but he didn’t improve any of his players they were already proven

[@jaridatkinson4907]

Lol he improved scottie alot actually

[@yunoAsta141]

@@Looptroop98who was proven on the bulls team 😂

[@c-biscuit632]

The most scrutinized NBA player lived up to all the hype and more

[@MonteYRM]

solz just doesnt want to argue about it anymore im not convinced you think lebron is the goat 😂

[@SmittyWerbenJagermannJensen]

Calling KD a playoff choker is crazy

[@TheBlankEvolved]

He is

[@SmittyWerbenJagermannJensen]

@@TheBlankEvolved but he isn’t. He arguably has 1 bad playoff series in his entire career.

[@dparks2856]

​@@SmittyWerbenJagermannJensen 2016 2021 2022 2024

[@SalRubino82]

HES NOT A CHOKER HE JUST CANT WIN WITHOUT A HOF STARTING LINEUP THATS ALL.AND EVEN WHEN HE HAD THAT ON OKC HE STILL SHYT THE BED.GUY IS A PUNK

[@SmittyWerbenJagermannJensen]

@@SalRubino82 ok lol

[@brrazzy8417]

Why would you bring LOW to that he literally is the least open minded person in the basketball community there’s no point in bringing him on a platform cuz your not gonna change his opinion or he won’t even be open to your take he always wants to prove how wrong you are😂

[@anthonyfelix9236]

Ive noticed that lately with LOW

[@peewee0224]

Bro he’s also insanely fucking creepy.

[@LavonMcLain]

fat people in general tbh

[@xxJay20sxx]

yeah LOW thinks he always right 😂 that’s why i prefer ticket over him sometimes because he comes off as condescending

[@qualinteranzy7948]

The kobe narrative is hilarious because as soon as shaq left kobe went on national radio and threatened the lakers to get him another star or he was leaving.

[@arsmith21781]

Chill is right about the Marc Gasol point the year he won DPOY, the reason is because the writers voted on DPOY & coaches voted on 1st/2nd team all defense. but the player who should've won it was Tony Allen w/53 first place(most) Lebron was 2nd w/52

[@DirtyDev]

“The writers ™️ “

[@justonerandomguy6580]

if were being real Tony Allen should have at least 2 DPOYS

[@shazebahmed0704]

MJ led the league in scoring 10 times And led the league in steals three times

[@dadillonful]

Against plumbers

[@Goatfan2k]

Lebron against podcasters 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@kenjiNaga]

I swear when they don’t got a comeback for Lebron greatness they bring up 2011😂😂 just like they only bring up jordan six rings

[@puncho8799]

Jordan 🐐

[@bagchaser326]

why do y’all try to erase 2011?? it’s not anybody else’s fault but brons that it happened 😂😂😂😂😂😂 not the GOAT

[@peewee0224]

@@bagchaser326because every single player in nba history has had bad series. It gets way overblown because it was a finals.

[@unlimitedz2.014]

I mean they said 2013 and explained how that also wasn’t a good performance

[@peewee0224]

@@unlimitedz2.014 25 11 and 7 with 2.3 steals isnt good????????? lol what

[@TheMissiIe]

The debate comes down to what you value most: Longevity - Lebron Stats - Jordan Peak - Jordan Accolades - Jordan The ONLY argument for Lebron is longevity, and it really isn't good enough to beat stats, peak, and accolades

[@DeMortuisAutNilAut]

Lebron could be considered the more versatile player with his passing and playmaking

[@puncho8799]

Facts!!!! 💯

[@josephvernon21]

more versatile ways to lose. plus jordan gets more offensive boards. and jordan was literally the best point guard of all time. where are lebrons seasons averaging 32-6-6-3-1?@@DeMortuisAutNilAut

[@peewee0224]

Lebron has better stats and arguably a better peak. Not to mention the thing I value most versatility.

[@TheMissiIe]

​@@DeMortuisAutNilAutI would agree as well. But Shaq, Russell and Kareem are the opposite of versatility and they're top 15 all time. Versatility can't be the tipping point for Lebron because then you must have Westbrook over Dirk all time

[@BAM2gz]

Did not think this video was gonna do the numbers it did 😂

[@puncho8799]

Marz and Low won this debate, hands-down even in the original video people were saying in the comments they won, and they only gave it to Chill for sympathy but anyone with a brain knows Jordan is the goat 🐐💯

[@eberdamilcar2130]

Objectively false

[@robertoloor285]

lmaooo the comments think they won the debate cuz chill's partner wasnt adding shit. But even when it was 2v1 (mars low vs chill), majority still sided with chill

[@puncho8799]

@@robertoloor285 No they didn’t. It was a landslide Mars and Low spoke nothing but facts.

[@puncho8799]

@@eberdamilcar2130 Objectively true

[@eberdamilcar2130]

@@puncho8799 the only two valid arguments for Jordan is that he’s a slightly better shooter and had more team success

[@dumpsterjuice6088]

your question was which is harder winning 6 rings or bron wins with 3 different teams he won 6 in a row😭😭😭 6 IN A ROW definitely harder

[@PlayersChoiceShow]

THANKS FOR THE LOVE! CANT WAIT TO GET YOU ON ONE!

[@zackrasphodos.2305]

Saying that lebron has done more improvements throughout his career more than JORDAN is crazy. Ok first off, who was lebron going in and who is he right now? He came in as a slashing/play making two way threat that you cannot stop from going to the rim. What is still his optimal play style today? Yes slashing/playmaking. He did improve in everything as he said, but lebron is still not a very good shooter. He is a serviceable one that can be clutch at times throughout his career, but he never excelled at 3 ball and midranges. His last playoff series should tell you enough that at the end lebron should not be shooting unless forced to/hot, since his production is way better when he is sticking to what he has been doing for his whole career. Now let’s go back to Jordan. Going into the nba do you know what was his weakness going in from college to the nba? His weakness was ball handling and shooting. Now let me ask again who was Micheal Jordan at the start of his career and who was he at the end? He started as a two way slasher that was weak at shooting and ball handling. But what did Micheal Jordan end as? One of if not the greatest midrange scorer, while also still being a hyper productive driver with the cleanest handles and footwork by his second three peat. Now. I am not saying that lebron did not improve, again he did and he did improve a lot imo. But when you compare him to a man who literally flipped his weaknesses into his strengths it becomes crazy, bordering on nasty when you glaze lebron so much that you say that he improved more than Jordan. At the start he was below or average in shooting, playmaking and ball handling. But at the end he was literally the best/nearly the best by his second three peat. Idgaf about the goat debate, mj is my goat yes but I respect lebron and people that have him as their goat, as honestly right now you can never have that one objective goat, right now it’s only “what do you value more?” If you value prestige, winning and overall the gap between him and the everyone else for his time you go Jordan. But if you value tenacity, longevity and consistency over the course of a long career then you go LeBron. So this is not me being a Jordan fan who wants lebron to lose, it’s just me being pissed off with the constant narrative that Jordan did not improve as much as lebron. That’s all folks. Thank you for reading my mald talk.

[@Kosithegod]

Playing in the post, the 3 ball, playmaking, defense, strength, efficiency finishing etc. All things Lebron’s improved on significantly. He might have been good at these things when he came in but get became on all time great in them as he progressed. Good passer to leading the league in assists. Good finisher to argueably the greatest finisher of all time. Positive defender to DPOY calibre, and so on…

[@zackrasphodos.2305]

@@Kosithegod Like you said most of those are something that lebron came in with and just refined. 3ball is uhh meh, he is serviceable rn I would say but not really good at it. I will say that lebron DEFINITELY is one of the best hard workers and skill developers. You can name peeps that had similar or more than lebron’s improvement’s throughout their career with your hands. But again one of those people is Jordan (people that improved more than him. Again he just refined his skills, unlike Jordan who picked up those skills while also refining everything else. Rookie lebron was definitely more a complete rookie. But Bron is still best utilized using his refined skill sets. Compared to Jordan who came in flawed and came out as the closest to perfect player ever, really the only thing he was missing was the 3 ball, more foresight/passing iq since his passes are more reactive than something he actively carved out. Ps - I definitely thing that Jordan is the best plug and play player in the history of the game, he won’t be able to solo carry as hard as bron does on a bad franchise. But lebron is downright detrimental to some already good lineups, because lebron without the ball in his hands is just downright trolling. Whereas you can put Jordan in any team and instantly that team will be better no matter the system.

[@GregoryKeller]

The issue I have with Lebron fans is that they hate providing context, Draymond and Lebron we’re not homeboys in the 2016 finals so anything he says post 2016 especially since he signed with LeBron sports agency should be taken with a grain of salt

[@andrewchester3527]

Anybody who thinks Lebron is the goat is a laughing stock to real hoopers. All of his goat arguments are narrative based 😂 when have you ever heard someone say “Jordan is the greatest because he improved” wtfff 😭😭😭

[@marvinj1000]

Longevity for lebron being than mike? Keep the same energy for John Stockton then bsolz stop calling John overrated

[@justinle8787]

Compared players from different eras is crazy, different rules, different play styles, different teams. What if Mj was drafted 1st to Houston and Hakeem to the Bulls, what if Wilt was with the Celtics instead of Wilt, what if Lebron was drafted to a better team instead of the unorganized Cavs. There are different Goats in different eras in my opinion.

[@practiceyourart]

Then Celtics would have won a lot less. Wilt's teams won a pathetic 7.5% more when he played vs when he didn't. Dude's the ultimate statistical anomaly that didn't impact winning all that much. Lebron was drafted to a bad team like most top players in the last few decades. That happens with almost every top player outside of exceptions like Kobe or Bill.

[@jjmav9]

Respectfully you just taking the fun out of the argument then. Obviously comparing eras isn’t ideal. By that logic, the evolution of the game is the only thing that matters, and whoever is best at the current time is the best period. That ain’t the point of the convo. The point is simply stacking them up against each other, and whoever has the better argument wins. It’s for fun.

[@derrrick7759]

29:30. LeBalco never won league MVP nor a defensive team in his 30s. Jordan won league MVP twice and 1st team defensive 3x in his 30s.

[@back2back379]

Chill brought up that Lebron got 5th in DPOY in 2017, as if it's a legitimate point that a single writer gave a 2nd place vote for Lebron for DPOY, giving him a grand total of 3 points in DPOY voting. That's as much of an anomaly vote as Carmelo Anthony getting a single MVP vote in 2013, taking away from Lebron getting an unanimous MVP.

[@BlackDTeach-tg8mj]

Two three peats is way harder

[@Robertedwinhouse38]

Not in the 90’s

[@bagchaser326]

@@Robertedwinhouse38notice how you have to bring up eras to downplay his accomplishments.. that right there makes him the greatest.

[@TambayLogic]

@@Robertedwinhouse38 not in the 90's cause its MJ.. try asking any other teams if they have the same sentiments as you have

[@TambayLogic]

even in the 2000's lakers and spurs dominated with 5.. in the 2010's gsw with the softest players ever got 3.. so how is it harder than the 90's??? maybe harder for lebron but not relative to the whole NBA?

[@Robertedwinhouse38]

@@bagchaser326 not really. Mj passed bill by downplaying his era.

[@SalRubino82]

THERE ARE 4 PLAYERS IN THE GOAT DEBATE AND EVERYONE INCLUDING KOBE FANATICS KNOWS THIS MJ,Bron,Kareem,and Bill Russell

[@Viper_75th_RR]

Jordan is the GOAT. More championships, more MVPs, more all defensive teams. Jordan won 10 scoring championships. LeBron won 1! What are we talking about.

[@dereklouther9372]

This dude bsolz is a damn troll lmao I love him

[@jakeadams7183]

Don’t really think they made a great case for Lebron. The debate often gets dragged into a direction that isn’t just purely hoop. Jordan was the better jump shooter, esp off pin downs etc.. better above and below the rim. Watch the film, the man probably has a 10 min highlight film of contact dunks. Better and more consistent defender, as gifted a playmaker, and that gets overshadowed by his scoring because he was that prolific. The creativity and cat quick first step as well. If you really break down both of their games I don’t really understand how you can say Lebron is better. Now if you want to make it into a debate about career numbers that define one’s greatness then that case can be made for Lebron. But jordan has done more in a 15 year career then Lebron has done in 21.

[@benbirrd788]

The tape dont lie

[@dunc1652]

When they say 6-0 , I just want people be honest about the competition the bulls were facing

[@franklynmaldonadogor2]

And when you go to the finals 8 years in a row please be honest about the competition lebron was facing!

[@ykg2393]

When you brag about winning on 3 different teams don’t forget to add he lost the majority of those finals on superteams.

[@KANEDAMU]

Trust in 20 years they gone the same.thing about lebron. Trust I lived long enough to see stupid kids say that. As if you can transport Jordan 20 face 2017 warriors. And you can't bring lebron to face 2042 who ever. They face who they face....... the queastion is.......at that time against their competition what did they do to them and how far were they better or worse to their completion. And I must day at those times with those championships the competition was great we just knew that Jordan was the best player on the court and we kept seeing his greatness beat those great teams. The bulls weren't shabby but honestly it was Jordan putting up 30 ppg and scottie at best 21 ppg. Against trams that had thei to 30 ppg star and their side Sar some years it varied 15 to 20ppg. Back then the super thing team wasn't that crazy in the 90s. It was the star and co- Star and Specialist for every other position.so Jordan should have lost at least one it was pretty even. Lebron lost 6 times because his competition was just so great. What will we say about the gears in the next 20 years. he one 3 rings he's the greatest because his compition was so good. He went 3 and 3 he's the greatest. This is a loser way of thinking.

[@Ghost-rb6cw]

​@@franklynmaldonadogor2 we ain't talking about the road before the finals bro we're talking about the finals lol, the finals is we're everything is on the line, it's insane how you Jordan stans just continue to move the goal post.

[@bboywolf]

​@@Ghost-rb6cwwhy? Because it doesnt suit your narrative. Lebron had 3 easy rounds before the finals. Jordan had to face pistons, knicks, heat, pacers, magic... miami heat in the east never faced a team as talented as them. Not once. It wasnt even close. Then finally lebron goes to the finals and then complains about the comp? He had a super team most of those years lol

[@JimBob-jr5up]

IMO the debate should be MJ vs Duncan, not LBJ.

[@mo.magas824]

$2000 for a chair is insane 😂

[@peewee0224]

the two dudes saying mj didnt even watch him play lol. the only guy who did picked lebron. kinda funny

[@settrender]

i hope BSOLZ takes this vid as a nod to the types of videos LKIAB should be doing to elevate their brand !!

[@SalRubino82]

IM CURIOUS IF THOSE TWO HAVE LEBRON RIGHT BEHIND MJ OR THEY THINK LEBRON IS FURTHER DOWN THE GREATEST LIST

[@TambayLogic]

jordan didnt have deficiencies he only needed to have a better teammates.. we can even argue MJ is much better player in the 80's but he will never win against a superteam boston with bird and lakers superteam with kareem and magic.. problem with this debate is lebron has alot of deficiencies at year 10 lebron still needs to improve his shooting like wtf your goat still needs to develop at year 10?? thats insane low standards

[@robertoloor285]

i dont get it, improve shooting like huh? isnt your goat jordan one of the worst 3pt shooters? even legends and coaches criticize his early years cuz he didnt know how to playmake and use his teammates (like lebron). The notion "lebron improves his shooting" is evidence that he is trying to get everyday, but statistically, he is even a much better 3pt shooter than jordan.

[@llkingproductionsl2154]

Jordan in the 80's mainly scored the ball and didn't produce winning basketball, but you just look at the points and assume he was arguably better in those years. Without Phil Jacksons system he might've just only cared about scoring

[@TambayLogic]

@@llkingproductionsl2154 jordan had a trash team back then and he needed teammates who had the same mentality as him who needed to improve like pippen.. if pippen was pippen in the 80's i believe they wouldve get further in the playoffs.. he needed phil jackson thats true but from the get go jordan was jordan he played hard everytime offensively and defensively.. no excuses like lebron had

[@TambayLogic]

@@robertoloor285 you telling me a shooting guard cant playmake?? isnt that the job of a PG and a shooting guard needs to shoot the ball?? dont be fooled of this new era do it all players bullshit cause lebron isnt even a good playmaker.. his ALL TIME #1 turnover leader tells you everything.. if you arent efficient in what you do then why bother?? jordan is the best scorer ever because its his job now tell me what lebron did that he is the best?? lebron only has 2-3 assist more than jordan but jordan had 5-7 more pts than lebron ever did.. jordan even has more blocks than lebron who is a fucking almost a center even in rebounds lebron is shit for his size.. do it all bullshit players that doesnt translate to winning are the worst players look at harden and westbrook

[@llkingproductionsl2154]

@@TambayLogic I agree with you on the fact that the bulls were not that good, some people forget the fact that they were a pretty young franchise when Jordan entered the scene for them so in a sense he has to create the teams identity, however LeBron in his first 7 years compared to Jordan’s shows that LeBrons style of play led to winning basketball obviously after those years Jordan for sure contributed to winning. LeBron In those years carried his team to 60+ win seasons and was expected to defeat 2000’s super team all by himself

[@zackrasphodos.2305]

Also 1500 dollars is 85470 pesos. So yes, 1500 is more than a years rent, since like middle class apartments are around 4-7 thousand a month. My moms photo studio + home with a kitchen, bathroom, two bedroom space and two larger spaces is 5k. And my moms studio is considered very well off, as most can only afford like, 1 bedroom 1 bathroom and one living space.

[@jont4117]

LeBron is my goat

[@3self]

Awe. That’s cute

[@jont4117]

@@3selfcute?

[@TheMissiIe]

​@@jont4117yes, cute and incorrect

[@puncho8799]

Jordan is the goat 🐐💯

[@Sf75178]

And why is he?

[@RackedupYe300]

So the only argument is longevity.

[@dereklouther9372]

No…. It’s not JUST Longevity it’s the stats it’s Defense its the presence around the league it’s media coverage the media hates Bron More then the media loves Jordan 😂 which is why the debate continues Lebron has 200M haters only one who has more then him is Cristiano Ronaldo

[@benjaminan1183]

33:05 LOW is insane for this type of narrative pushing, there's no way Bron's peak includes 2011, but not 08, 09, 10,17 or 18.

[@bboywolf]

Why? His best years were clearly in miami. He was the best offensive player and great defensively. 2018 he was not a good defender even if chill says otherwise. KZbin "lebron replies to being slowest player" literally was using all his energy on offense wtf

[@benjaminan1183]

@@bboywolf He definitely wasn't best offensive player on his team in 2011, that year and 2015 were clear down years for him productivity wise.

[@strangecoolguy3049]

​@@benjaminan1183fax. Bron peak offensively was like 2017.

[@Westbrook__]

Every argument for jordan boils down to only 6 years of his career because we love to convientely ignore every other year, meanwhile pretty much every argument against lebron includes every year or sometimes overly nitpicks the 2011 season... that is jordan fans. Just nit pickers who pick and choose when they wanna give a shit about stuff. LeBron James, is the single greatest basketball player to touch an NBA court. It's THAT simple.

[@kesenaememere8520]

Nope, Jordan is the Goat LeBron, is a chronic loser, 4-6 in the finals, with some of the best assembled teams in history.

[@Westbrook__]

@@kesenaememere8520 dawg it's a 7month old comment and idc. at this point I just think people who still think jordan is the goat, as dumbasses who's opinions don't really matter. Lebron surpassed him and you don't know basketball if you're going to sit here and say that lebron has had "some of the best assembled teams in history" with a straight face.

[@GameOnTheCourt]

Saying MJ got Scottie is the same as Lebron had KLove, Kyrie and a Jr coming off a 6th man of the year on the Cavs. Dwade, Bosh, Allen and Haslem as a dirty work guy. On the lakers had AD, Rando, Dwight, Caruso who was an amazing perimeter defender

[@GameOnTheCourt]

Then in 2007, that Cavs team was an elite defensive team

[@dereklouther9372]

@@GameOnTheCourtNO THEY WERENT LMAO 💀💀VERJAO IS GOOD TO U? Cmon Bro ur tweeking

[@MTBMeech]

Solz puttin that respect on Kobe name?🗣️

[@alieucamara8525]

Basketball jubilee is crazy 💀

[@kingdot9287]

my glorious king is crazy

[@kingdot9287]

as soon as I typed this dude said the fact thing in the video

[@chupapi6724]

i dislike these debates. why cant they all just be hokages respected for their own individual achievements instead of putting one down for another.

[@ChaseMartinOnly]

As soon as 2011 happened, all talk of Lebron being the goat disappeared. No goat is ever the 2nd best on their championship team over a 6 game stretch. That is pathetic.

[@bthermidorl]

The Heat should've made the finals. Lebron isn't getting penalized enough. I wanted the Heat to win so bad, I absolutely hated the Mavs. Lebron choking is beyond unexpected and inexcusable.

[@dereklouther9372]

People bring that up every time though. 💀 2011 was brought up every time lmao relax hater

[@bthermidorl]

@@dereklouther9372 Hey dumbie, you can't be hater if you speak facts. Lol LeBron can't shoot.

[@nosuitsgiven]

Lebron is your goat? Where you even born when Jordan played? Unfollowed, just kidding. Kareem did it without all the drugs btw.

[@JustAGoose_Z9]

TALK TO EM 🔥🔥🔥🗣️🗣️🗣️🗣️👾👾👾 i lied i don’t agree Lebron does NOT take PEDs 💀

[@nosuitsgiven]

6 for the same is harder because once you win everyone is coming for your system. They are dissecting everything and everyone is learning from the exposure. Different is a reset.

[@BabyIA3]

Were*

[@JustAGoose_Z9]

@@nosuitsgiventype shit, that aspect is mad overlooked

[@MrFrelix92]

Proof?

[@1coven]

Some NBA fans are so lucky that LeBron underperformed the way he did in 2011. Because if 2011 didnt happen, there would barely be an argument for Jordan 😂

[@nsavvy1020]

The fact that you blow over MJs accomplishments as if MJs Goat status is dependent on Lebron choking in 2011 is crazy.

[@RackedupYe300]

@@nsavvy1020yeah they sound so dumb .

[@ThaWaterBoi7]

The disrespect to Kareem Abdul-Jabbar is nuts. Being the all time scoring leader for 38 years isn’t even a top-10 most interesting fact about him

[@retrey63]

Respectfully noone cares

[@peewee0224]

He’s number 3 but that goat is mj and lebron and nobody else is close

[@ThaWaterBoi7]

@retrey63 respectfully, I do. But it’s an opinion space and you’re allowed to have an opinion. No hard feelings on the ignorant

[@jaridatkinson4907]

Kareem is 2 I still have magic and Bill Russell ahead

[@peewee0224]

@@jaridatkinson4907 delusional

[@llkingproductionsl2154]

Another thing to take into consideration is that Jordan's level of play before Phil Jackson was enough for him to get his points but barely enough to positively affect his team come team record, because of that the bulls in some windows had the opportunity to draft great talent and that main talent was Scottie Pippen. Lebron and his style of play simply produces winning because he doesn't just score, he also playmakes for his teammates

[@Suge8263]

I'm just confused The guy who lost more.The guy who lost. More style is conducive to winning. More than the guy who played with less talent and won more

[@Kosithegod]

@@Suge8263 Lebron won more early in his career and as a result his team got worse draft picks and couldn’t improve. Suffering from success is what he’s saying

[@drechester5171]

@@Kosithegodthey Jordan fans, they don’t like when you put things into context😂💀💯 LeBron the 🐐 simple.

[@omelettedufromage4]

I’ve never seen dude in the orange below the chest lol … seems so weird also going to three teams and three chips is crazy

[@puncho8799]

Not when you’re able to handpick your superstar, teammates

[@omelettedufromage4]

@@puncho8799 my rebuttal is .. I’ve seen mad niggas pick the superstar teammates .. and I’ve seen those same people either not win or only win one .. not 3

[@peewee0224]

@@puncho8799how that work out for kd?

[@omelettedufromage4]

@@peewee0224 lol I was gon wait till he replied to say how’d that work for kd or James harden or cp3 or kyrie after bron or Paul pierce after Boston or in Boston lol

[@peewee0224]

@@omelettedufromage4 exactly people make it seem like it’s so easy but all these other superstars failed at it.

[@derrrick7759]

11:15. He’s delusional lol. Yes, continuity is important, but LeBalco didn’t play with scrubs in Miami. He had superstars- Wade and Bosh. LeBalco so into himself, he gave the “not 1, not 2” speech lol.

[@ChronicalK]

LKIAB should do this… oh wait 💀

[@spaceman4653]

This narrative that LeBron "brought championships to 3 different places" needs to stop. LeBron has NEVER gone to ANY team by himself and won a ring...he always comes to a new team WITH 1 or 2 all stars. Ring Messenger is crazy smh

[@llkingproductionsl2154]

So just because he got himself help it devalues his accomplishments? If you want Lebron to join a different team by himself lets use similar logic with jordan without pippen, would he be able to win those 6 rings without him?

[@dontuse10]

Who has ever gotten themselves a ring alone? Players have had finals runs but, completely alone is unheard of

[@Jonas-PD]

@@llkingproductionsl2154No it means Kyrie, and Kevin Love ALSO brought a ring to CLE, Bosh and Wade to MIA, and AD to LAL

[@Kosithegod]

What did those players do before and after lebron. Besides wade none of them ever even sniffed a finals. Yet wherever bron went got a chip. Those teams were stacked because any team with lebron is stacked. Hell we even called the post trade 2018 cavs stacked...

[@llkingproductionsl2154]

I agree championships aren't done by just one person, the making of the team also should not matter unless we take into account some factors that might affect the odds such as team chemistry and the character of the players in the team. And using the same logic Pippen also brought 6 rings to the bulls and was a consistent factor for the bulls and Jordan for more time than every individual star player Lebron has played with @@Jonas-PD

[@raviolihands5347]

Magic won a finals MVP AND CHAMPIONSHIP AS A ROOKIE I DONT CARE WHAT LEBRON DID AS A 23 year old when magic DID IT ALREADY AND FINISHED THE JOB

[@vatoalfred5721]

LeBron - Longevity, Versatility and Greater off the court . . . Especially in the social media and super team era which makes this more impressive. Jordan - Accolades, statistics & peak

[@ImJayyFr]

32:00 Imagine calling 23/7.5/11 bad 😂😂

[@isaacsandoval482]

I’d be so upset if I averaged 23/7.5/11 couldn’t be me 😂

[@ImJayyFr]

@@isaacsandoval482 you’re right, you never could get that high. It’s okay. 😂🗣️

[@uwin23]

Stop acting stupid, we clearly comparing that statline to the goat standard which in that case was far from met and just putting a statline like that without mentioning the absolute dogshit efficiency certainly lacks a lot of context...

[@Isocentral]

People who say bron changes teams drastically let me break it down for you Heat: Bosh wade(obviously) and Mario chambers and ray allen let’s not talk like those other dudes were scrubs than he seen a young talent in Cleveland (kyrie) was in talks with trading Wiggins for love it happened and etc like stop it than he seen the decline in Cleveland didn’t wanna play their cause he seen his inevitable hardship that he didn’t want to face went to LA with a young core which were all good because the moment he traded them(for a top 5 player in the league during that time by the way) they all went on to literally make huge impacts and lead their own teams into the playoffs by the way than proceeded to get more role players for him and AD (two top 5 players) with pieces around them who finally made it to the finals in 2020 to almost lose to a jimmy butler sophomore season Tyler hero and a 3rd season bam and as much as people look at bron and say he carried I guarantee u put bron on that 2020 heat team he’s trading half that heat roster after he gets bounced in the first round

[@kidflashiv]

Mars without the hoodie is crazy

[@bones3142]

Legend of Winning is mad annoying, and idk who the guy on the right is but he’s mad annoying too. Guys who weren’t even born to watch Jordan gaping for him is crazy. I get if you think he’s the GOAT, no problem on my end. My problem is when Jordan fans are immediately like “why are we having this discussion, it isn’t a debate” like yes it is bruh. They’ve both earned that right, even Kareem

[@罗太永不破防]

if one player is compare with mj,then he is already success

[@MrGizzy84]

The only way i say Jordan is the goat is if you bring up the point he had his career and is the reason for kobes career

[@kinnyboy]

This MJ v Bron debate is ridiculous. I can’t believe people still have it 😂. It’s literally just an accolades Vs Longevity convo. If you value accolades more you’re gonna think MJ is better …. If you value longevity then you think bron is. That simple

[@dezzyyw7986]

Also peak. Cause if you argue peak at worst and best. Jordan’s better at both on both ends

[@AKRosarioMusic]

Phil Jackson could NEVER be the Goat cause of what he pulled in NY

[@shazebahmed0704]

Nah that boy is soft as hell my glorious king you sound like a fairy But MJ he’s the goat he stopped legends from winning championships

[@zinnn.8842]

Jordan is the Goat!!! Lebron is the Greatest plumber in the NBA.

[@rogermyles606]

Michael Jordan is the GOAT. LeBron ran when the pressure got to him

[@SmartPsychopat1]

LeBron is the better player, Jordan is the greater player.

[@foolishgenius]

What's Bsolz talking about the Cavs sign LeBron before they even made the trade for Kevin Love?????

[@AlphaGamingClubOfficial]

This kinda gave me the idea that the goat is MJ. They arguments was horrible😂and thank you B for giving Kobe his unrecognized flowers

[@dericksalvoro930]

If we just talking bout game, it’s still Jordan. People knock on Jordan because of how Lebron can pass and average double digit assists. But when Doug Collins was still the coach, he made Jordan become point guard and he was legit God tier at the time averaging a triple double. So Jordan is better in scoring, passing and defending. I’d give rebounding to Lebron just cuz of height but Jordan ain’t too far. Peak wise, Jordan better and accolades wise, Jordan still better. As much of a Curry fan I am, routing for Lebron would make Curry’s name better, I ain’t gonna lie and say Lebron better just cuz of Bias.

[@giovannifeliciano837]

I feel like we can’t discredit lebron for leaving that trash ass Cleveland squad. But saying that’s what’s happening but still

[@MrGizzy84]

it's harder to win with different teams as the star player.. you have to learn new everything and change your play style to get people looks that best fits them.. vs sticking with an already proven team and just fine tweaking it to improve where you lacked... AND THE MAIN ARGUMENT!!! JORDAN'S team were a few bad decisions from making to the finals without him... its damn near like putting kd on the warriors of course if you put an amazing player on an already contending team you gonna win

[@Luka-st4uf]

Bulls never came close to winning a ring before or after MJ so no it's not like the Warriors. And no Bulls didn't almost make the Finals without him, that's a made up agenda by Bron stans. They lost in the ECSF. That's like saying 76ers are a few bad decisions from making the Finals every year and therefore they are like the 2010s Warriors. If anything Jordan is the Curry of this equation not KD. Secondly, don't act like LeBron left his team for a "challenge", he left to create superteams.

[@MrGizzy84]

@Luka-st4uf Fam they lost in a game 7 to the knicks with dumb turnovers and reggie, and the pacers were not beating the bulls, so yes, they were close to making the finals in my eyes.. and im talking about that one year and the overall idea you have an amazing championship contending team and add a superstar to it, not the actual warriors dynasty... jordan left that team and they still had hope of winning lebron left multiple teams and they didnt even make the playoffs... so how does that not prove lebron was "carrying" his teams more than jordan was "carrying" his and yes he did because of a couple of reasons 1 the cavs weren't trying to bring anyone in that off-season to help put them over the top and 2 because of jordan he knew without the rings he would never be looked at as a potential goat.. fam jordan got to come in the league and didnt have the same pressure to be the goat like lebron did, so of course their paths are gonna be different one was having to prove himself and the other just was allowed to prove himself

[@eazymb.]

Draymond wasn’t lying when he said that tho. Y’all just don’t wanna talk about it.

[@TsoDrag]

if you want a dude to win And he does it in a way that seems wrong isn't that a killer instinct on him that he wants to do anything to win . I just thought about this and nothing to do with the vid it's just crazy that people hate him for just trying to win

[@shazebahmed0704]

There acting like lebron carried Cleveland to win the championship no Kyrie was on that team kevin love was on that team

[@Kosithegod]

Kyrie and Kevin ain’t even sniffing the 2nd round without bron let’s be real.

[@edmondli4933]

Kyrie had not win a ring since Lebron. Kyrie did not win even when he join up with kd

[@Clarenceisgoat]

Messi is the goat

[@SomeSortaMentalWealthSeminar]

With the SAME team around them as each-other ... 1989-1990 Jordan VS 2013-2014 LeBron ? ? ? Who winning ? ? ? ( Luol Deng's my goat anyway )

[@elimullen9864]

General being the best playing on three different franchises and winning a ring with them is harder … because no one has done it before … other players won 6 chips with 1 franchises

[@dylanpuchel187]

Nobody has won 6 with one team since the merger when there was more than 8 teams

[@adames127]

surprised LOW didn’t break that chair

[@kushkush24]

That six titles is less impressive it was really one run

[@kesenaememere8520]

You crazy

[@michaelmayers3622]

Mj not the most efficent scorer

[@shazebahmed0704]

Lebron james only has one scoring title 🤣🤣 MJ has 10 Lebron james is a better playmaker than MJ I give longevity to lebron but that’s it everything else MJ is better at

[@llkingproductionsl2154]

Scoring isn't everything, it also depends on what the teams needs you to do as well. Jordan had pippen who could be the main facilitator and be able to guard the best player so for jordan he would mainly have to focus on scoring. Lebron throughout his career never had a main facilator besides himself so part of his game is to facilitate and score the ball at a efficient rate.

[@lookatcodyman654]

Kareem greater than both

[@SalRubino82]

LEBRON IS SO GREAT THAT AT THE VERY WORST HE IS NUMBER 2 ALL TIME

[@cjt9264]

Where can we see this debate ? They never updated it on their channel