The Unreleased Secrets of Vanilla WoW

[@madseasonshow]

No one knows what "Endgame content updates" really means, but talking about some potential original scrapped content that would fit well should the Season of Discovery continue to go down the Classic+ route

[@XxHrallundeadrogueXx]

from the past 5 years of releases I can see the endgame no matter it being at first being extremely crazy but fun then it gettting nerfed into next tuesday and becomes slowly more boring and dies out. If its fun and alot of people are doing it Blizzard has like a itch to nerf it and make people "progress longer" to reach that point again that ends up never being reachable anymore.

[@papagnerd1943]

I want the survival profession!!

[@animalm4st3r]

i have no hopes for good classic+ content seeing how the classic team is messing up basically everything in the last few month

[@canht95]

Wish you played non-blizzard versions.

[@Fater9410]

Yeah this season of discovery feels everything but classic for me i have no idea why they make new retail wow instead of start this classic all over again 🤷

[@F12165]

Another big one was the Dalaran bubble.

[@kyotheman69]

bubble was just dome over Dalaran, we go in side in WoTLK when it lift in the air

[@Faude18]

@@kyotheman69 Incorrect. Dalaran was under construction because Archimonde destroyed it completely in WC3.

[@Infernal_Elf]

@@Faude18 yeah that is right

[@myssery984]

its was destroyed in war 3 lol

[@F12165]

@@myssery984 the point is it was there as an open storyline.

[@charlestonjew7587]

I remember our head Paladin in my guild was convinced that the legendary Ashbringer was hidden in the game back during Vanilla. He spent countless hours following wild goose chases with every rumor, hint or clue. I think the idea and the lore was fantastic and I really wanted him to get it. Eventually, he would obtain the Corrupted Ashbringer from the Four Horsemen in Naxx, which was cool in its own right.

[@MatthewTheUntitled]

Brother manifested that shit :D

[@JulesArchinova]

Guy was chasing the graal, we know only uninterested ones can obtain it.

[@charlestonjew7587]

@@JulesArchinova It was a Hunter weapon anyway.

[@ReedLovesBiscuits]

I wonder what he thought about getting it in Legion

[@charlestonjew7587]

@@ReedLovesBiscuits Me too. I long since bowed out of WoW by then. I imagine he would be indifferent since everyone could get it and there was nothing particularly special about it. Definitely didn't live up to the lore from what I've read.

[@nhymare5271]

One thing that always intrigued me was Timbermaw Hold. Not the tunnel, the REAL Timbermaw Hold. The massive gate in northern Azshara. Another place where nothing is really known about but which has big potential. Especially because there seems to be a cut off part in the tunnel between felwood and winterspring. That could be something enormous connecting those two zones under mount hyjal

[@ravador]

I don't understand why nobody makes this point, but it's obvious that Timbermaw Hold is right above Barrow Deeps, the place where you go wake up the Druids of the Claw and where Illidan was held in Warcraft 3.

[@Cutsc3ne]

It’s cause it was gon be a raid but got cut due to time restraints

[@Niffumable]

@@Cutsc3ne yer Mum 'got cut due to time restraints'. 😏

[@Niffumable]

@@Cutsc3ne yer Mum 'was gon be a raid but got cut due to time restraints'.** 😏😩🤌👅💢

[@blinddarm8478]

Turtle WOW has built an instance full of timbermaws in southern ashara. At the small mountain you can climb behind the sea, south of the nightelf post. It's awesome. You should check it out, they also built karazahn and SW vault into classic.

[@GoodbyeZek]

There's also Old Outland and appeared in the background of the vanilla art box. I could see a small leveling zone being added there. Hayven Games did an exploration video and it's basically Hellfire Peninsula.

[@jasosik]

its sad how many wow explorers are without us anymore

[@IvyTinwe]

Hellfire Peninsula was planned as a Level 70 zone, and it's in the original game files - which is why many accessed it via the Deadmines.

[@rickybindahoose6193]

Hellfire Peninsula was the first zone we all see. Its the login screen.

[@Draknfyre]

@@IvyTinwe Absolutely incorrect. The original plan was for Outland to be an end-game vanilla zone. They started work on it but they realized they wouldn't have time to finish it before the game was supposed to launch so they decided to turn it into the first expansion and greatly expanded it. The "Hellfire Peninsula" you're thinking about was the TOTALITY of what Outland would've been in vanilla. And you do not access it via the Deadmines. They are entirely unconnected. The area outside of the Deadmines map was a test area where they were messing with a few doodads for Outland. It was never meant to be anything, it was just a space they decided to use. The actual Old Outland was an island way on the edge of the Kalimdor map.

[@IvyTinwe]

@@Draknfyre Okay, "accessible" was maybe the wrong word, english is not my first language. But out-of-bound explorers always used a glitch there, this is what I meant.

[@gozcubukcu1]

You left out: The Dalaran Bubble, The Missing Diplomat Quest, Timbermaw Hold, Islands on the world map that isn't accessible. These are all I can think of but besides that great video!

[@BobOfBarons]

A ton of incomplete unfinished class questlines. personally would've liked to see those eventually turned into advanced classes but ahh well never gonna happen

[@Nameonly67]

Benediction staff for priest class eye of eternity quest, I miss that stupid staff model 😢 don't forget the druid class forms

[@Zoibek]

12:56 nice kickflip from that rat

[@Caine1996]

Mans never misses a moment to say "I told you so" about the WoW token and im here for it lmao

[@kyotheman69]

my god man, he just goes on about it

[@cardrave]

Why didn’t we listen 😢 oh wait we did, and blizz added them anyways (I quit from that news, if they add wow token to SOD or hardcore im just not playing wow anymore)

[@guillaumedarcoit7371]

I also like him dunking on the Horde on every opportunity 10:17

[@Psilocybin77]

@@kyotheman69 on his streams he's explained that he received a ton of hate from WoW fanatics when he saw where classic was going. There is nothing more toxic than a WoW addict spurned, so I get why he rubs it in.

[@BasicMaffs]

@@kyotheman69 he should marry it since he loves it so much

[@EJ_Red]

As a Blood Elf simp, I always considered Quel'thalas to be a missed opportunities in certain ways. The mystery of an ancient and magical elven kingdom being hidden away in Vanilla was always fascinating to 10-year old me. Even now in Retail it has a missed chance of having more since it was planned to have a Warfront in BFA but never came to be. If Quel'thalas is opened up in SoD then I may start playing again. I don't even need to play as a BE, I just want to see the kingdom as Vanilla-esque as possible.

[@captaintitus7711]

You might wanna change your mind on that.If close to vanilla as possible,you will see radioactive infected/high on drug elves model running around.Just jokin!Not a bad idea,but I dont think they gonna pulled it,even it is logical during vanilla,quelthalas already sort of allied with Forsaken.

[@lionheartfilms793]

Sometimes I still lay awake at night and wonder if there was a hidden unmarked quest to purify the Ashbringer in TBC

[@Xazamas]

Cynical response: it would've been datamined.

[@lionheartfilms793]

@@Xazamas I choose to have my faith in the light (*epic warcraft music intensifies)

[@Marunius]

I love the spirit of keeping gear relevant, would be cool incentive to go back to Naxx and then upg the sword to lvl 70.

[@Avrelivs_Gold]

in any case it would be like the Scarab Lord reward, only one should have it... but then again, this soulbound system doesn't make sense anyway today some whale would buy it and then quit the game = everyone else is screwed

[@Mito383]

"It's not fair to the Horde!" Madseason: "And I took that personal."

[@JulianaBlewett]

Meh, fuck the alliance.

[@Xazamas]

Horde intercontinental transit system guards: Elite level 60 goblins. (Zeppelin towers.) Alliance intercontinental transit system guards: Non-elite level 35 dwarves. (Menethil harbor.) After playing on certain "unauthorized" servers, I'm starting to lean towards realization that Horde was the real "carebear" faction all along...

[@Scytha86]

@@Xazamas Horde is not responsible for underdeveloped civilizations.

[@Henry_the_Eighth_]

​@@Xazamas Aren't goblin-run zeppelin towers neutral though? I don't think they attack either faction unless provoked.

[@Xazamas]

@@Henry_the_Eighth_ Despite being called "Steamwheedle Bruiser" they are tied to Orgrimmar faction and are hostile to the alliance. Also slight colrrection, they are "only" level 55 elites.

[@erejnion]

Timbermaw Hold really needs more content. That would give more content to Azshara too.

[@PootisPenserPow]

They already have a map from WC3, they just need to implement it

[@Phaxey]

I loved these secret areas in vanilla. It made the world feel alive and larger than it really was. But part of it was also that there were fewer Wikis around and they had a lot less info and more errors. This sense of mystery is very rare in modern games.

[@atraxian5881]

Inb4 it is revealed that "endgame content updates" is a switch to turn the old raids into level 60 heroic.

[@Walhor]

With titanforged gear!

[@Hummelz5]

@@Walhor as well as warforged kekw

[@Bouzsi]

And the new Godforged™️ and the new new tier called The Maker’s!

[@krispy4605]

Second this, really hope it’s not this way though as it’ll be the end

[@mitchconner2021]

Right.. Seems about right. Tell us they are gonna use unused stuff in vanilla then never do any of that.

[@brennanbaker8729]

I remember my high school buddy and I going into the karazan crypts by jumping through walls and its still one of my best(and first) core memories as wow player

[@itsdonewith]

Nothing like a new mad season video on a Sunday. Much appreciated!

[@CrazyZ66]

I was just about to write the same. What a cozy Sunday. :)

[@cairnex4473]

NOTHING in all of WoW has ever intrigued me like the original concept of the Emerald dream does. There is just something about that alien, otherworldly aesthetic.

[@matthiasr2643]

Alexstrazas breast reduction surgery had me rollin😂

[@Horstolord04]

They saw her rollin...they hatin

[@StealthBlackHand]

18:38 They founded Thaurissan in the redridge mountains because blackrock mountain did not exist yet it was created by the accidental summoning of Ragnaros. Which also scorched the redridge mountains and created the Blackrock and the destroyed zones are now called searing gorge and burning steppes.

[@Xazamas]

I'm also under the impression that what is now "Searing Gorge" and "Burning Steppes" used to be part of the larger "Redridge Mountains" -region, prior to eruption of Blackrock mountain (which sits right between the two affected zones.) What is now called "Redridge Mountains" is the unaffected southernmost part.

[@Zack_Wester]

@@Xazamas I think the Burning Steppes was part of Redridge Mountains at least part of it I seen no hint on Searing Gorge been part of Redridge Mountains

[@Xazamas]

@@Zack_Wester Would make sense. After all, the Ragnaros was summoned at Thaurissan, located at what is now the Burning Steppes.

[@Zack_Wester]

@@Xazamas one reason woud be that it would make Redridge Mountains huge. Like bigger then the Barren I bet.

[@Guilhermejow]

LOTRO worked quite well with instanced player home communities. I remember many years ago walking around a neighborhood in game and everything was well organized, as their object placement was restricted to inside their home and their lawn. Everything else, such as the streets and parks and markets were left as it was.

[@stephenmsawyers]

surprised while you were doing Azshara you left out the big gate protecting Timbermaw Hold. I've been curious about that place for 20 years XD . Great video

[@Henry_the_Eighth_]

Lol, you've unlocked one of my WoW memories. There are several gates to nowhere in classic wow and i had all kinds of crazy theories about them

[@madseasonshow]

Will probably do a followup to this, I missed a lot actually

[@Henry_the_Eighth_]

@@madseasonshow Please do. I absolutely love your videos, man, thanks for what you do

[@stephenmsawyers]

@@madseasonshow sweet!

[@xemuth1643]

Awesome vid as Always @mad

[@Jackfromshack]

Dark secrets and unsolved myths made Vanilla (every version pre-cataclysm, to be honest) an absolutely unique place. I doubt it will ever be possible to repeat this

[@田中太郎-s5h9x]

Old Azeroth has some much potential. I hope community keeps classic+ idea alive and we some day see some of these.

[@latham4575]

My favorite part of these recent videos are the "I told you so" lines. I was one of the people, like Madseason, that told my friends the boost would be bad for the game. They all just cast me out like some crazy prophet. And now down the line they're finally coming around. It is truly crazy how everyone was kind of in agreement that boosts were bad right before 2019 classic came out. And yet so many people rushed to the defense of the boost when it came out. It was an exact repeat of history... I think people just get latched onto the game and don't want to acknowledge when bad stuff happens to it sometimes.

[@shifterashtongue2684]

Think: we had literally 10 and 10 levels to farm in MONTHS and people kept crying to the point that those 1 day levels farmed get raid xp and a fully percentage xp buff. For the first time in wow era we get to level so different but people once more went MENTAL CRYING on reddit changing that

[@radfan7020]

people are betas who cuck to authority and power almost instantly

[@ageary07]

It was so much fun back in the day looking at those unfinished bits wondering what they would be, and if they would be patched in at some stage.

[@galeitiaa]

The amount of wonderment and unknown this game brought when it first released, it can never be replicated..Great video MadSeason!

[@TheWindcrow]

This mic makes the MONOtone so much better. Dashing like Johnny Awesome and Deep like the ocean.

[@Mastermind12358]

They could also connect the stockade raid with the sewer system or something, giving it an alternative entrance somewhere outside of Stormwind. Would be interesting to see the hordes invading the city through the raid.

[@geofft7664]

i like that idea, could be through the lake behind the eastvale logging camp or maybe something to do with that waterfall area you fly over when your coming from burning steppes

[@Tyranno-Bore-Us]

Back before Pet journals were a thing, I used to have a green ooze pet that I could take out and it would grant my toon a green colored aura.

[@nickcorcillo8479]

This is still around!

[@Tyranno-Bore-Us]

@@nickcorcillo8479 no way!!

[@insidetrip101]

the thing that always bothered me about the hyjal raid is that we don't know why that portal exists. Even in the tour that you have to take the npc says "they don't know what the infinite dragonflight have to do with hyjal but they hope to find out." Then later you go in, do everything, and there's not any reference to the infinite dragon flight.

[@mattroman5530]

thanks brother for a beautiful sunday video

[@madseasonshow]

Enjoy dude

[@RudysGarage]

Every time I watch your videos about classic WoW I get this overwhelming combo of happiness and sadness at once. I played from Vanilla until MoP, but from Vanilla to Wrath was the peak for me. Happiness because this game changed my life forever… the memories I made and things I experienced I’ll carry with me forever. Sadness because I long to relive those times. Classic gave me that chance, but the timing was just too late. I’m not in high school anymore as I was back then and with a family to care for it just couldn’t work, unfortunately. Thank you MadSeason for all these videos over the years. I wish you the best!

[@velmux]

In a way parts of Outland was also in the vanilla files, which would contribute to the questline to cleanse the Corrupted Ashrbginer. A remnant is in the Deadmines dungeon and there's also an alpha map of Hellfire Peninsula in the files somewhere. Or at least, used to be.

[@jmcke802]

Would love to see Madseason watch party for the old school Exploration The Movie and Noggaholic exploring films. Such an epic set of videos that really deserves to be seen by the modern audience!

[@MrUncrustable]

This music is totally the 1st temple's music in FF10.

[@audi_anon9173]

Well, the FIRST music I THOUGHT, was LOZ ALTTP's Kakariko Village prior to a certain part in the early game, I think before Zelda is captured or before we really start gathering the pendants of power or what have you.

[@ajthurman2250]

I really love the point you made about not being obsessed with hyper balance or fairness in Vanilla. I remember wanting to get the Westfall chicken so bad during BC, but i played filthy horde and couldnt. So i rerolled alliance just for that pet, and met so many new friends and found even more in game ally only stuff (like stockades) that I had never experienced before. Not aiming for that perfect balance makes the game seem so much more alive!

[@198sambrrs]

there are like 3 creators that I just like the video the second it loads and this is one of them. never ever disappoints

[@DrewPicklesTheDark]

Funny thing with Hyjal (and other off limit zones), you could just explore the whole thing with far sight lol.

[@psoffxifan4904]

I have been hoping since learning about the emerald dream in 2005 that they would add it to vanilla is some fashion, whether it be a private server going the extra mile or the official classic. I remember hearing about hidden gateways up on the cliffs in ashenvale and felwood from my vanilla guild that would eventually take you to the emerald dream and never being able to find them. The fact that they still haven't implemented the dream as a full fledged zone/zones is baffling to me.

[@Faude18]

There's one big problem with the emerald dream zone for Blizzard and for private servers. It's a really big space of nothing. It's mostly flat or tiny hills, everything's green, no objects placed aside from those floaty trees and some rock heads. Just watch a video of the zone and you understand what i mean. I played on private servers, i've been there. It's so far from being developed nobody can do something good with it. Some private servers used it as level zones and vendor zones and that's about it, though i'm sure you could do something more creative with the zone, it'd still suck in one way or another. Of all the things MadSeason mentioned the Karazhan crypts and Azshara crater are the only places with some sort of hope for content, because the places are already there. I think Grim Batol, Uldum, Emerald Dream, Quel'thalas and so on have no chance of being part of Seasons of Discovery. I don't see Blizzard terraforming much. They need all their 3D artists for their 2y schedule of retail WoW. In my opinion Blizzard should use either Tyr's Hand or/and Azshara Crater as some sort of endgame zone or raid. The former wasn't used before WotLk, the zone is big enough and i believe they could come up with some cool stuff for the Scarlet Crusade. Azshara Crater is a never released battleground. The zone would need some tweeks, but it's rather finished compared to anything mentioned in the video. They could repurpose the zone and go wild. Karazhan crypts as another raid or dungeon is also mandatory.

[@disrupt94]

You are reffering to the somewhat infamous Green smoke, which exists at a couple of spots. Yu could only access them with walljumping. The rumor around the time was that using a lagg-macro on the smoke would initiate the otherworld bugg, causing the player to disconnect and log back up inside the emerald dream. There is however not a shred of evicence that this was the case.

[@disrupt94]

@@Faude18 It's mostly empty because it's half the size of Kalimdor. If you were to concentrate the assets more it would not be such an issue.

[@TwobrokebyeOnline]

Check out turtle wow

[@Random25145]

Just goes to show how much effort they put into Cata actually...basically making their 3rd xpac a real Vanilla+ in terms of content with Post-Wrath gameplay. Would definitely be cool to see a "vanilla-fied" Catacylsm.

[@jamesk3914]

Yeah, my takeaway from the video is that Cataclysm was the release-ready version of all these unreleased zones.

[@bebejebe]

yeah looking back it's obvious that they ran out of old warcraft content and instead focused on finishing old plans that got cut for vanilla

[@kreuk13]

just gonna leave this here; "endgame content updates" means endgame content, getting updated. More like ST gnomers and BFD, less likely to be actual new endgame content. I would actually really hope any form of classic+ would come with a fresh experience, and not flow out from the SoD seasons.

[@rb-uu7du]

yeah SoD has been lukewarm to say the least, I don't have a lot of hope for blizzard to do a faithful vanilla+ as they want to funnel people into retail to buy expansions

[@SkeltherBot]

Sod is not really that fun :/ some changes are really nice, some are not. They go a little to far with changes IMO.

[@josejuanandrade4439]

@@rb-uu7du Maybe is for the best. Noone realy agrees what classic+ is so no matter what they do, there will alway be people complaining and saying "this aint it" Also the whole concept of Classic+ is stupid... literaly all people want is they to add content that was added in subsequent expansions to vanilla... that is beyond dumb... Take as an example here Guilneas at the end of the video. It was added in cata. A huge city, starting zone for a whole new race... and imo one of the best starting experiences ever. Why would i want they to force that content in the old version of the game with its limitations? ... Outland? It was its own expansion, why would i want a super downgraded version of that in classic? Now lets look at a diferent "classic+": Turtle wow... what they been doing is glueing, i should say forcing, new stuff into old one, like adding rooms to Deadmines, some that doesnt even make sense as the lab (they recently announced those changes, not sure if they already in) but like... that's so stupid... is a kid's idea of "better"... take something that you know is good and add extra crap atop like parasites or tumors.. "Hey i heard you like Deadmines... so we adding a bunch of shit to that iconic dungeon... like a Lab... why the fuck a LAB in a mine? because we are 12yr old!" How about a coffee shop for the defias laborer to hang in, or a daycare center for their children! The new Deadmines daycare center! Next patch: BlackWing Lair GiftShop! Buy your inflatbale Ashkandi!

[@rb-uu7du]

@@josejuanandrade4439 Project Epoch is doing a pretty good job imo. Blizzard shouldn't go into it with the mindset of pleasing everyone. Just finish the original design of the game, flesh out certain specs, complete zones that were left out and add in quest lines. Vanilla wow has a very specific tone to it as long as they stick to that it would be good. But, blizzard doesnt have the talent or vision to pull that off anymore, thats why we get jokes like SOD

[@melak01]

I agree 100%, sod with all those runes , it’s too much …

[@WadeAllen001]

The early druid quests were definitely written with the intent of their being a late-game zone (maybe even a druid exclusive zone) of the Emerald Dream. They talk about how your training as a druid will culminate in the dream. I feel like they probably had big plans of a quest line there involving Malfurion and revealing Fandral's corruption (because Malfurion, a major WC3 character, was conspicuously absent from WoW, the Teldrassil corruption and Morrowgrain quest line was unfinished, and so was the Eranikus quest line).

[@Forty2de]

Classic Plus being an "alternate timeline" is not the same as "alternate world". Events might unfold differently but I think the world will stay the same. That means many of the zones that were finished in later expansions will never see the light of day in Classic Plus/SoD. They could totally do Hyjal since the terrain is already finished and the zone is different before the cataclysm, it could be the story of what happened there before deathwing, but a zone like Uldum which wasn't affected by the cataclysm will never be introduced because they would basically have to port the zone as it is from cata for it to make any sense. I don't think we'll see any completely new zones in SoD, I don't think they even have a terrain/map designer on the team. They will use spaces that are already finished but they're not going to shape any new ones.

[@SomethingLame]

Irrelevant distinction

[@DeeFourCee]

The opening to the stockades raid could maybe be accessed from a sewer outpour along the coast in westfall. If they wanted to make it “unique” they could have two raids which take place opposite. The horde side breaks into the stockades, blasting our way in, to free someone. The alliance side is called in response to the horde invading the stockade and their version is to clear us out back the way we came. So we have two raids, which take place in the same place but are done in reverse with faction specific enemies that function the same. Even the loot can be the same as you can explain that the loot the alliance gets is the loot the horde stole from the alliance forces that the horde raid would get.

[@j.t8352]

The Final Fantasy 6 background music.... Oh the memories..

[@Patrick_0n]

It's not Zelda 64?

[@Nishinga.]

I've been taking a long break from SoD as I'm just really burnt out on it and incursions definitely played a huge role in it. But man...Mads, you never fail to get me hyped for classic WoW, it's like magic. I love how every video your editing and narration just continuously gets better and better. Thanks for all the quality content over these many years, we appreciate you!

[@shifterashtongue2684]

"incursions definately played a huge role in it" what did you have to kill mobs bosses group up and do quests? And you did try to be fast so you can have a good gph? What? You mean you played the game but you didnt like wow? Oh wow!

[@Nishinga.]

@@shifterashtongue2684 call down classic andy, incursions had a ripple effect on the economy and the morale of a majority of the players to the point where SoD is at it’s all time lowest now. *definitely is how it’s spelled by the way

[@shifterashtongue2684]

@@Nishinga. Sorry boss, when mages farmed any shjt repetitive farm killing endless mobs per hour in all versions of classic wow FOR YEARS you looked elsewhere, no1 of your kind ever said anything else ingame ever caused inflation apart from incursions and gdkp (and your kind aparently loves gdkp since they hate playing the actual game which includes OH SNAP! FARMING! ). now because you can do incursions WHICH ARE PLAYING THE GAME 101 but YOU dont want to, your kind flames without points in the web, and youre all hopped to any new content you can get playing cata while flaming sod, this is rediculously low in my eyes "calm down classic andy. No im bored to hear this trash from people who 1 dont want the good of the game and 2 dont play the last months, for CATA srsly cata and wod were the most clown expansions ever, and i can discuss on that, andy!!!

[@shifterashtongue2684]

I bet BET you dont have more than 4 days played at 50, and i have 17 and still enjoy to the max, ITS NOT THE GAME, ITS YOUUUUU

[@Nishinga.]

@@shifterashtongue2684 *ridiculously is how it’s spelled

[@riklaunim]

Worth looking at what Classic+ ideas where implemented by private servers and how those played out. Turtle, Epoch and even Ascension?

[@no-thanks-to-you]

I can't wait for Epoch, it looks great.

[@riklaunim]

@@no-thanks-to-you there can be many betas but only one launch. I hope they won't rush the release and delay if needed.

[@CaptainBloodsail]

I'm hoping to play turtle wow when I grt a new computer

[@georgeofkunstatandpodebrad8147]

@@CaptainBloodsail dude, Turtle would work on a toaster.

[@georgeofkunstatandpodebrad8147]

IIRC Turtle has plans for Grim Batol and later Quel'Thalas.

[@Adog-wh1pe]

I didn’t know so much of this it’s so cool what secrets are hidden in the corners of classic

[@davidknightx]

You know what I think would've been a great idea, instead of a housing district, have it lead straight to a giant hotel. Make it so rooms could be rented and only your guild and those on your friend list could enter your part of the hotel. That way, you keep the best of both worlds. A private space near a major city and still have a hotel lobby where everyone can hang out. Blizz could even have it so everyone's room is configured based on quests and the room cost gold per hour so the rooms would quickly free up. Now that I think about it...I know exactly what that sounds like. Terrible idea.

[@DKeverydaySk8board]

Love the video! One thing I think you missed is all the extra terrain in Stonetalon Mountains! If you manage to get over the large mountains, you'll find a lot of area with lumber camps, and other goblin buildings. Seemed like they intended to make the zone a lot bigger!

[@bjmw93]

Madseason is back in a big way! Good man

[@BarokaiRein]

Adding regular Ashbringer to the game would cause a massive influx of paladins. All ret, of course.

[@madseasonshow]

Honestly considering how well pallies have made out so far it wouldn't surprise me warrior prio though

[@bamma8821]

@madseasonshow hunter weapon come on now.

[@Syllvein]

I'm fine with the addition or restoring the quest line, however you want to look at it. Since you have to get the Cursed Ashbringer and it's a raid drop, it will make it far more rare then every paladin having it like in Legion.

[@Bronimin]

warlock prio for mists of pandaria glyph

[@brandoncastellano1858]

Our only corrupted Ashbringer we got from Naxx40 went to a hunter. A paladin gquit on the spot. It was hilarious. The hunter put Crusader, and much later mongoose on it and flexed for ages.

[@stevenswayze]

also the Dalaran bubble, That captivated me so much in OG classic, I was obsessed with content for it being added with BC or something and it never came, there is a lot of reference to it in the Mage questlines in Azhara I could be misremembering but I wish there was a way to access Dalaran in the bubble from the mage tower in Azhara or something

[@antongunther3977]

As much as I think classic+ would be cool I really dont think blizz would make new zones and add new meaningful content. I think at best we might get a few max level character improvements and maybe scaling a few dungeons into raids. (oh and world bosses since those are literally free for them to make).

[@johngallagher1905]

There were a lot of zones in Kalimdor that felt unfinished. Heck, most of the southern half felt like zones that you passed through to get somewhere else (Thousand Needles) more than actually spent time in. To their credit, Silithus did get a major update, since half the zone was missing. Though that was to drop in the new end game raid. The rest felt like they had something more planned, and left out, just perhaps not raid wise, which is probably why it stayed that way. Then there was the Isle of Dread which they removed outright in Cata. Seems like a good existing chunk of land to do something interesting in this time around, along with many other inaccessible Islands the map clearly had.

[@selwrynn6702]

The way to do player housing in wow would be to make it guild based instead of personal (unless you make a guild with just you in it) and then make it Garrison-esque but without any resource nodes. Utilitywise you could throw a Guildbank in there.

[@Parzival.007]

This is how Dark Age of Camelot did it. DAOC Was great

[@danfontaine8179]

Guild castle would be dope. Still though it would be lame not having anyone in the main cities. But it might be worth it if you can build defenses and raid other guilds’ castles and loot their guild bank lol. Also have slutty maids and be able to gamble with your guildies

[@selwrynn6702]

@@danfontaine8179 No I'm saying that through that portal in Stormwind you can build a garrison-esque guild hall, and it's just a place that guilds can congregate in game where the only actual thing to do there is access a guild bank, there is no raiding others or defending just a space that a guild can customize a bit and the only way to reach it would be through an instance portal actually in the cities so that people still congregate within them.

[@12grain]

Something that always felt like a secret to me was being able to get into hidden or difficult to reach places in the cities. This is more of a glitch but I remember in vanilla learning how to drop underneath Stormwind by jumping on one of the torches between the trade district and mage quarter. It was empty beneath but you could run to the other side of that gated off instance mentioned in the video and mess with people who passed by. Also loved getting on top of the gates outside by running up the hills next to it. Also loved figuring out how to get to the very top of Ironforge by jumping up some cliffs in northern Loch Modan or even cooler getting into Old Ironforge by dueling someone, being polymorphed near a wall, and porting into the new zone. Much like Hyjal, it looked like it was something created but never added right away. It was so cool being able to do those things pre-flying mount, made the game seem so much bigger.

[@GTAjedi]

100% NO Level cap increase. Also Blizzard is incapable of sticking to the spirit of vanilla. Look at SoD. It's retail gameplay in the classic world. Totally NOT vanilla +

[@Janhogeplein]

I do totally agree but i actually really enjoy sod. Yeah its not the classic + we wanted but its still pretty good imo. I hope there will be a era server for sod.

[@Pompomatic]

I've never understood why SoD is considered retail gameplay? Have barely played retail though so I'm missing out on a lot

[@GTAjedi]

@@Pompomatic Compare it to vanilla, where each class has 1 or 2 abilities and is individually weak. You can't run in to Deadmines at level 20 and just aoe the whole dungeon in vanilla like you can in SoD. Every class has been supercharged in SoD and it has retail-like boss mechanics now. Essentially the player vs mob power dynamic is shifted massively in favour of the player compared to vanilla.

[@SetariM]

"Not fair to the Horde" I mean I'm a diehard Horde fan but Horde get an early leveling dungeon with RFC in their capital city, if Alliance got a raid, meh. But you know people would shit their pants over it.

[@chewyrc9223]

Gotta love that fresh MadSeason content

[@Parzival.007]

Blizzard has SO MUCH to work with to make Vanilla WoW even better than it already is! Love these kind of videos! Thanks Madseason

[@RipleyD_ott]

im so glad youre back

[@snuffeldjuret]

20:00 I remember thinking (and still do) that was soooo coool. Really making that 24 hour day cycle work.

[@AsprosOfAzeroth]

*Hot take: Ashbringer in Legion was awesome!* I was there farming those oozes in the Plaguelands in 2005, I was there when Wrath launched and it was purified, I was there when the Ashbringer comics came out, so it felt perfect that I got it in Legion so naturally. Same way the Cata revamp felt right to see the story that I was part in continue. The argument "everybody got it" is kind of crap since WoW has conditioned players to ignore that their unique gear; weapons; mounts have multiples in all players. I never had any complained that there are multiple Invincibles...

[@mdiego3847]

You're goddamn right, it's a hot take, and you're objectively and morally wrong.

[@krste3000]

I had Thunderfury on my DPS warrior back in Vanilla. There was only one other person with the weapon on my server. The argument is spot on, when everyone can get an item, it shouldn't be a legendary.

[@Vanessa_exe]

it wasnt that all players got it, it was that *all* players where *given* it. if it was behind an insane grind, or hard boss, or just, anything beyond clicking "give me the ashbringer"- it would have been cooler

[@ruicorreia6373]

This is a mostly Vanilla video so this comment won't be popular, but you are 100% right! Ashbringer has been such a central part of the story that it transcended the item itself, so it made perfect sence to get it in a narrative format. Getting the corrupted version and killing Alexandros in Vanilla is not even canon lol

[@Infernal_Elf]

Its about effort and luck anyone that wasent blind and death at the same time could get the ashbringer in Legion.

[@gorex_xfiend420]

Every time I hear your intro I’m hit by an overwhelming nostalgia. Been watching you for years upon years and still am even though WoW has no place in my life anymore. Keep up the cool videos 🎉

[@krakenslayer9376]

Thanks madseason!

[@madseasonshow]

Thank you for watching

[@AlaskanEsquire-nm4mj]

12:18 Housing district.. Real ones will recognize that as Cut-throat Alley, an unpopulated location located in the Dwarven District of SW.

[@brelshar4968]

Phase 3 has been a disaster for SoD, they really killed the chill PuG vibe of 10mans. Also as we near level 60 the toxic world buff meta once again rears it's ugly head and the gate-keepers make sure to keep the game toxic for everyone else. Blizzard need to be brave and disable all of them.

[@madseasonshow]

Got a SoD video in the works right now actually, will be talking about its struggles

[@brelshar4968]

@@madseasonshow Awesome.. looking forward to it!

[@aboomer420]

Is it a bad time to start SoD then?

[@JeremyB1039]

@@aboomer420do cata

[@hotlikesauce]

@@aboomer420do Cata instead, feels the same as SoD but with better pvp.

[@Cyclone001c]

Couple other locations too - The Timbermaws in Ashara seem to be guarding what could one day be a raid entrance. There's an unfinished cave by the sea on the south western most point of silithus (enjoy the swim), and other structures hidden in out of the way spots. As for how to add these places... Increasing the level cap would be a mistake I think.

[@BasedHorrigan]

Our boy is back

[@toomuchsugar3960]

Unless it was different in original vanilla, the Stormwind vault instance was never accessible. Some private servers do place a teleport zone to the vault in the entrance, but it was never part of retail wow.

[@Cod3_nam3]

For The Horde!

[@dungeonsanddisclaimers4950]

A wave of new Dungeons or raids would be amazing! For example: underwater caverns Naga themed in Ashara, maybe Wintergrap’s Frost Whisper Pass battling Demons and Old God minions under the world tree, Emerald Dream, Titan/Oldgods creations in Uldum, Grim Batol’s crazy Red Dragons, Cult of the Damned in Karazan Crypts, or as you said Endless opportunities with Caverns of Time. Even if they aren’t full sized raids I would be excited to see these concepts come to life!

[@captaintitus7711]

Kara for me is Burning Legion inclined.For COTD,maybe we need to think new areas for them.Theres a lot of lore location never shown in WoW,or just a plain terrain that can be good use for expanding lore.

[@lychenthrope]

Yay, a WoW video. Feels cozy. Thanks Madseason!

[@RikkaFresh]

10:18 LOOOOL Thank you for that.

[@s1xto]

10:18 "Fuck the Horde!" i bursted into laugh in the middle of the night :D

[@twotimer6731]

I remember when Madseason would refuse to cuss. Those were the good days.

[@s1xto]

​@@twotimer6731you could say that he is in his Madseason right now :D

[@Lucifer11392]

Watching a new madseason Video is like cracking open a cold one with the boys or coming home after a long trip. Not just because of vanilla WoW but because of madseason.

[@Bigsolrac]

What i dont like about them doing all these secret zones like Uldum as content in future expansions, is that its obviously not the original idea they had, same with what happened with the Dragon Isles.

[@daranator2902]

I always love your videos. I love the World of Warcraft lore, but never really take the time to figure it all out. So I love how you summarize it for us, typically humorously

[@talir3337]

It's funny how people are waiting for modern Microsoft Blizzard to finish all this in Season of Discovery while Turtle WoW, a private server full of passionate developers and artists have already implemented almost every item on the list and you can play it right now. Full new zones playeble in vanilla wow and made in vanilla spirit like Gilneas, Hyjal, Thalassian Highlands (in Quel'Thalas). Full new dungeons like Gilneas City, Kharazan Crypts, Cavern of Times, Crescent Grove, Hateforge Quarry. New raid Emerald Sanctum (Emerald Dream). Currently working on Tower of Kharazan 40 man raid and Grim Batol 40 Man raid. They also introduced so much more like 2 new races in vanilla, Goblins and High Elves with new starting zones and Capital Cities. A new battleground Sunnyglade Vale, a new profession Survival and a new one arriving soon Jewelcrafting (not the tbc version but totally custom in vanilla style) new world bosses and so much more. Turtle WoW is the true Vanilla plus and the spiritual successor of vanilla wow. Unlike the lazy work of ActiBlizzard with Season of Discovery, Turtle WoW delivered a lot of great custom content, all crafted with love in true vanilla spirit and to make it even better, completely free to play for everyone.

[@Hazaak.]

If turtle wow was exactly that. then it'd be great. Instead Turtle WoW has changed a ton of systems that didn't need to be touched, and made the game even more aggravating to play than regular classic was. Their philosophy seemed to be, "If it's extremely grinding and kinda annoying to play, It's vanilla style!"

[@zepho100]

Passion > Profit.

[@talir3337]

@@Hazaak. Can you write any examples of this? From what I know they have done quite the opposite to the point where people are accusing Turtle WoW to be way too fast for a vanilla experience. For example they introduced tents that give fast resting xp thus reducing the leveling grind time or they introduced the rechargeable mace for ferals so they don't need to go crazy farming Gnomer. Many qol as well like mana tables, raid health stones, party buffs and longer buff times all to reduce annoying game mechanics.

[@AvelineMelena]

Turtle is such a treasure

[@davefifty]

yea they can make a portal in the back of rfc and make something cool for horde too. sounds fun. thx for the content

[@julio4494]

FOR THE HORDE 💥

[@christophermccutcheon2143]

I love that one started smiling when you said players started trying to figure out how to cleanse Ashbringer. And then I can hear your voice changing like you're trying not to laugh as well. I'm just waiting for the part about the gate in Azshara

[@hinkhall1186]

10:08 - 10:20 Yeah I'm pretty sure that's what the blizzard devs were thinking when they made everything better for the Alliance in Vanilla. Still didn't stop The Horde from being the better faction though.

[@dudemcfurgusson7179]

No, the unbalance didn't stop the horde from being the better faction. The paladin class did.

[@hinkhall1186]

@@dudemcfurgusson7179 Wait, you're telling me my shamans totem twisting tranquil air and wind fury totems aren't as good as a paladins one button before the fight blessing, the absurdity.

[@Studycase3000]

Thanks for all the great vids and hard work behind them of late. I am loving them. I hope you continue to find topics and inspiration to fuel the channel like crazy. Have am awesome week ahead

[@ThisisCitrus]

Dragonflight's Emerald Dream is so disappointing.

[@MatthewTheUntitled]

Dragonflight period is so disappointing

[@shifterashtongue2684]

Why do people keep on playing those shit expansions giving blizzard the money and the mood to make more..

[@pallieterwow]

I've only been following you for a few weeks/months but the intro "song" is already workin nostalgic for me. Hearing this one knows that he/she can expect a good wow video.

[@colesc6]

LETS GOOO

[@adriangar95]

I remember discover all this secrets with @HayvenGames, rest in peace

[@henrikg785]

10:16 filthy alliance. Instant unsub!

[@martinharder1424]

I absolutely love that youre using the WoW Lo-Fi beats as background music. Absolute baller renditions of the themes. There is a 1hr Thunderbluff Lo-Fi loop aswell. Very recommendable.

[@FantasyLofi]

thank you dude!!!

[@Do1an]

Pog

[@mattk38918]

Packing for a move and was listening to your old videos when this dropped. Thanks for making this work enjoyable!

[@blaine453]

beat to death video, you're out of ideas

[@Bazzabazeman]

Dude hearing the intro of your videos is so so good. I don't care what your content will be in the future, as long as I hear this intro I know I'm in for a nice time.

[@kibecawest9867]

A good example of player housing in an MMO where everything has a purpose is the stronghold system in SWTOR. Basically instanced areas that have "hooks" that allow you to customize using decorations you gather either by purchase or by looting. So, for example, in my Dromund Kaas stronghold I have an entire room dedicated to showing off my mounts, a general utility area (with mail, AH vendor, bank, server-wide bank, barber, etc.), various hang out places, and then some places to make it seem like an actually lived in home.

[@720zone]

MAN you videos are great. So happy you mentioned John's book. I just finished my 2nd read through. We're so fortunate to have that time capsule of the early development. Love the idea of implementing the Stocks raid for alliance. Perhaps we could have a Tauren 'Western' themed raid for the Horde, which John mentions was planned early on. Thanks for the great content.

[@chosenchad1155]

For those who are not high within the ranks of the Paladin Order. It is possible to obtain the Ashbringer.

[@ghostacola5113]

I missed this. I remember when you decided to step away from WoW and stuff, totally understandable but still it was a bit sad. I've been working on catching up on your videos now that you're back, and this is exactly what I needed haha. Thanks for the hard work as always Madseason!

[@Walterion]

Blows me away that Classic may not go down its own way, storywise. Exploring "What ifs?" usually leads to very interesting routes that may inspire other versions of the game to spawn, considering that it happened once with Dragonflight's talent tree taking inspiration from Classic's talent system. Awesome video as usual Mads, I hope you are doing well!