The Wacky World Of Racing Game Car Licensing

[@GamerAlexVideos]

And of course, let's not forget how every racing game with licensed cars is destined to be delisted in 5 or so years... we seriously need something to fundamentally change in that regard.

[@UltraViolet_Moses]

That’s an important point in addendum to this topic, the licenses are so short these days it’s almost criminal

[@adlibbed2138]

man I remember asking JDM devs why would they're using real brands, I just wished the best of luck to them to paying all the licenses every specified year or so via their sales' revenues in order to kept these games up on digital stores

[@NerfMaster000]

The only way to change that is to stop using licensed cars.

[@GamerAlexVideos]

@@NerfMaster000 I love fictional vehicles, but having no racing games with real cars would suck too. There is no easy win here unfortunately.

[@GoldenEDM_2018]

We already have the solution to that ever since the world wide web exploded. Its called piracy.

[@amirsuffian8643]

The Mercedes SLR situation is bafflingly hilarious. Based on what I've read, the licensing issues states something along the lines of Mercedes can't claim copyright because it was built in McLaren's HQ in Surrey and McLaren can't claim copyright because of the Mercedes badges and parts. Not to mention that these 2 companies are currently factory rivals in F1. When the Merc SLR McLaren was conceived, Mercedes supplied engines to McLaren F1 team. Long story short, Mercedes and McLaren had a fling, did the devil's tango, the Merc SLR McLaren was born and now both of them don't want to admit that its theirs.

[@serkankaratepe9305]

Mclaren and Mercedes are still partners as Mclaren uses Mercedes engines in F1.

[@UltraViolet_Moses]

That is utterly hilarious, gotta love stories like this

[@amirsuffian8643]

@@serkankaratepe9305 true. Despite that, both parties still refuse to fully claim the licensing for the cars presumably to avoid getting sued to oblivion. Still a shame tho. The Merc SLR is one of my favourites

[@serkankaratepe9305]

@@amirsuffian8643 yeah. Especially Stirling Moss.

[@davemk9]

@@amirsuffian8643 But this car exists in The Crew Motorfest

[@dyaanahmad5079]

Ah remembered the times when there were fictional cars or the now-deceased brands like Pontiac, Saturn,Saleen etc.

[@UltraViolet_Moses]

I miss when we had Saleen's other than just the S7 in games, superbly underrated "brand"

[@EmoDKTsuchiya]

Gimme muh S281E!

[@Twiggo_The_Foxxo]

Forza has added Pontiacs and saleens

[@simeonyves5940]

Saleen are still trading! The other two are defunct though :( would like to see some of the Trans Am Worldwide "Pontiacs" like the 7T7 "Bandit" one day however!

[@spyglass9188]

I miss the Renault Alpine A-110-50 and the Dezir appearing in anything except driveclub

[@TyCal_]

This is why I like how games like BeamNG and Night Runners handle their cars. Instead of having fully licensed cars it’s better to have an unlicensed car that looks similar enough to the real thing with enough changes to avoid legal issues. Gives both the devs and the players way more freedom with customisation, damages models etc.

[@Rockport1911]

Yes, not having badges and real names avoids alot of troubles. A small game like CarX Street can get away with that ( Not that you could actually sue a russian dev these days), but AAA titles want the realdeal not get viewed as cheap. Also BeamNG does it to portray aalot of car damage which would never fly with licensed cars. A few years ago we would atleast see ripped off bumpers and some deformation in racing games ( FH1 for example), but today there isnt much more than the " crumpled and scuffed" texture after a crash.

[@k.r.99]

That might be good for kids and casual gamers or arcade game fans, but Forza just not and never was and will never be about anything but real cars. It's literally the open world brother of a track racer simcade.

[@k.r.99]

A game like The Crew series or NFS series would work like that, but not Forza Horizon or Test Drive.

[@vorsprungdurchtechnik5]

@@k.r.99 Thank you for saying that. I don't know why so many people are okay with fake cars. There isn't anything worse for a car based game.

[@LowKLPZ]

Kid named GTA:

[@tiga8032]

Love your content mate. Fun fact, I'm one of the engineers that worked on the Jaguar Project 8 at Jaguar SVO. That 5.0 V8, was a beast!

[@UltraViolet_Moses]

wicked! That's awesome mate

[@nohalo3forme]

The “Ferrari doesn’t like customization” thing is interesting because in Motorfest, they have a limited amount of vanities you can put on their cars but it’s still more than Toyota allows, which is just horns and audio signatures.

[@林振华-t4v]

Ferrari is changing. Pretty much everyone is changing. Im sure it was not myth that old Enzo tell their client to "fxxk off" at in more than one occation. This may not be the case for Ferrari any more since Enzo's passing

[@lydiagalantmotherf]

​@@林振华-t4v Wouldn't bet on it though, I think it's very recently (think the last four years) that they've finally let up. In NFS Heat and in TDU2 you can change nearly nothing. They're snobs, that's it

[@funnyanimalworld7579]

Car damage on licensed cars is also masive issue. Thas why we have no realistic car damage in most racing games

[@alewis514]

Yes, very few games have good damage model. Usually the ones that do have fictional cars. I get that we have many arcade racing games where even a head-on at 200 mph doesn't really do much, but the cars are often not only undamageable. They're undentable. Can't even shatter the windshield or bend the bumper. They behave like static props on the map.

[@lieutenanteclipse9975]

@@alewis514 I'd imagine manufacturers do not want virtual crash tests to impact their sales or lead to unwanted investigations, be the tests truthful or not, as those would impact sales.

[@railgun517]

Meanwhile Burnout:

[@funnyanimalworld7579]

@railgun517 those are non licensed cars in that game

[@Pinsonneaultmotorsports]

This is why I still play FM1 on the original Xbox same goes for FM2. The damage model in both of these games are better than the model we have now

[@DeltaStridePLZ]

There was a lot of misconception about the whole Toyota thing too when someone questioned the Toyota UK Twitter account. Everyone took what they said as fact and ran with it proclaiming that Gran Turismo holds exclusive rights to the brand (which isn't true). The reason why they were most commonly seen in Gran Turismo is because they have a strong partnership (A given since they're both Japanese companies). Toyota has a bias that if you're a game developer in Japan you'll likely get access to the brand name easier compared to western companies...however that was then (2017) and this is now. Things have changed dramatically since then...Toyota slowly reappearing in games now like The Crew Motorfest, Forza, the new Tokyo Xtreme Racer etc... The reason licensing is kept under lock and key is because of licensing fees. Of course, there are many other factors at play, but diving into those would only complicate things further. Developers negotiate their own agreements with Toyota, which determine the fees they pay and the specifics of the partnership. These negotiations cover what cars can be featured, how they’re represented, and for how long they’re available in the game, among other details.

[@adlibbed2138]

Genki (Tokyo Xtreme Racer devs) is Japanese, so it's no surprise they're getting a pass in Toyota's eyes by default the special kind of outliers since 2016 however, would be Project Cars 3 and the infamous Fast & Furious Crossroads, both we're published by Bandai Namco, which also get their free pass by Toyota just because they're Japanese publisher by default as well

[@samueljones3668]

JDM Master also is getting a Toyota license. Lol.

[@DeltaStridePLZ]

@@samueljones3668 That's interesting. I didn't even know if they were able to secure it.

[@dbwatchet7292]

Need for speed has TOYOTA

[@DeltaStridePLZ]

@@dbwatchet7292 Which one has Toyota as of 2017?

[@k.r.99]

Worst case scenario: Imagine a game has to be delisted because of a single song or brand, who's license was too exoensive to make it same length as the others 💀

[@cmstrlisteningpostno.1269]

As far as I know, its what happened to Spec Ops: The Line since it used several licensed songs. It back on Steam but I believe the licensed songs are replaced.

[@Cat_in_The-Box]

​@@cmstrlisteningpostno.1269song licensing is equally cancerous, I hate all of it so much

[@adlibbed2138]

​@@cmstrlisteningpostno.1269I thought that game's a goner for good since that fateful day

[@danielllitpek2014]

Funnily enough, that's the reason Hot Pursuit Remastered is missing 3 cars. One of the cars being a US governmental police prototype (Carbon Motors E7 Concept, that game's only diesel car) and both the 722 and Stirling Moss editions of the SLR McLaren. So instead of cancelling it or having to delay it because of most likely fruitless negotiations, they just removed them

[@bitelaserkhalif]

GTA kinda did this. Compare song of day one ps2 game and defective edition, the later has removed songs

[@skrublordnord69]

Toyota being stingy about licensing is something that’s sort of ruined racing games for me. Because of that newer racing games are missing some amazing cars. The AE86, MR2, chaser, and ofc the Supra

[@UltraViolet_Moses]

It is an obnoxious shame, though the tide looks to be turning thankfully

[@adlibbed2138]

​​@@UltraViolet_Mosesespecially with the upcoming latest Tokyo Xtreme Racer game explicitly shows JZA80 Supra swerving around traffic in the highways in their most recent trailer video

[@fontheking5]

All these cars are in Forza horizon 5, but the Chaser is a hard to find car

[@elrinconcuriosodesally3528]

I've played a Japanese mobile game called Drift Spirits, and guess what? There's Toyota and not just since their Day 1 and that's it, they've been adding them more, then there's TXR and GT. The current rumor is that as long we're locals (JP Studios) you're good to go, I don't care what approach you have in environment. Funnily enough it features the Lotus brand (Drift Spirits ofc)

[@skrublordnord69]

@@fontheking5I know I’m mostly meaning other games

[@Gamezoner911]

10:35 It's not just even in NFS where Ferrari is extremely restrictive. In motorsport franchise games like F1 2010, every car's rear wing can be knocked off if you ram hard into it. All cars except the Ferrari, where you can have the most physics defying crash of all time, but the rear wing will never come off from the car.

[@Twiggo_The_Foxxo]

Suprised forza had the licensing to ascari considering that the car brand has been defunct for over a decade now

[@2021._.rav4]

And rossion

[@ch4ndemic]

Fun fact: Ascari cars built a facility in Banbury, Oxfordshire. The current occupants are the Haas F1 Team

[@ifanramadhana7833]

Even though brand is extinct, someone still has a trademark for it. Like Ascari, while they don't make cars anymore, the name lives as a circuit resort owned by the same person.

[@gabrielsobrosa]

Who remembers when Honda doesn't appeared in a racing game if had police

[@fenn_fren]

Try it in English next time.

[@1687bowen]

Once upon a time, Honda did not give a license permit to a racing game with Traffic on the track due to Honda's tuner being documented by Police

[@pixel7071]

@@fenn_fren try being mentally capable of believing that not every single person in the world is a native english speaker and that not every single person needs to know english perfectly to be given the privilege of commenting online

[@Puntatacosimuladores]

@@fenn_frentry it in not asshole next time

[@men5crumm]

​@@fenn_fren You speak english because it's the only language you know, he speaks English because it is the only language you know

[@nobel11]

I had that exact moment, in Gran Turismo 2 I believe. I had just bought my first car, a Ford Escort, and then got Gran Turismo 2 soon after. It was the first time I'd seen an Escort in a game, and it really was a special feeling, being able to drive my car in real life and in gaming.

[@ralphharrison6622]

Same for me. I owned a 7th gen celica, and was super fun using it in gran turismo.

[@Ghostbody]

Toyota saying you could experience the cars in game and not want to buy in real life unfortunately tracks with a very peculiar mindset of Japanese companies. Sega had a hell of a time getting games like Judgement and Last Judgement on PC because supposedly the company behind the talents being used (Smile-Up fka Johnnys & Associates) was, at one point, afraid of posting their stars images online because they thought fans wouldn't want to see them live.

[@givemeajackson]

That's the most backwards thinking ever... My first car was a lexus IS200, and i'd be lying if nfsu2 and nfsmw didn't play a major role in that. Now i've been with lexus for a decade...

[@Ghostbody]

Oh absolutely. I became enamored with the BRZ and the FRS a while ago because of the games they were in. I ended up getting a GTI and even to this day​ I mess around with them and often have it as my primary car in games that allow it. So it's ass backwards but that's just what they think for whatever reason @@givemeajackson

[@bitelaserkhalif]

Also, mgs games still region locked

[@MC-bh8ph]

It's always blown my mind that they don't want your money after a certain point, in the most money grubbing industry ever. And if it's really true that licensing prevents them from selling the game after a certain point because of the car manufacturers, why would they impose a time limit on their own commercials? The whole thing is stupified and makes me sick

[@richardgoed8101]

That problem only exists for discontinued cars, as they're no longer being sold anymore, and giving licences only hurts the brand more since people wanting something that they can't produce instead of a new one. Pretty much every brands now trying to contact studios to have their newer cars to the game as a way to advertise them. They want our money, but the thing is they don't want people to look at the brand because it is already known, they want people to look at their new cars to sell.

[@pyrosius8896]

Ngl, I still have a liking to the RUF brand. But really, branding has to be one of the most interesting aspects to a game and determining its roster.

[@Pri11-k7l]

I'll insane props to Polyphony and The Crew to have Porsche and RUF included in their games

[@dp12480]

after visiting the ruf facility, I found actually a strong relationship between ruf and porsche. So the unfortunate reality of ruf being gone is due to companies not needing it anymore. Hopefully they can realize the worth that ruf and other brands have even with a "similar" perception

[@D3Vlicious]

Hasn't Lotus being missing from Gran Turismo been all but confirmed as the new leadership not being happy with how little they were getting paid in the old licensing agreement with Polyphony?

[@teertaa]

Nfs is the weirdest racing franchise regarding car licensing imo. Like, they had exclusive porsche license but they used m3 gtr for their long living mascot. That specific car that made porsche mad all over, calling bmw a cheater. I just dont get it why didnt most wanted start with a racecar 911 instead

[@adlibbed2138]

Porsche Unleashed still agree with your points though, where the only time Porsche has ever featured as a cover car after that one game is like Undercover and 2015

[@swilleh_]

Because none of the porches are that unique. I like Porsche and nfs 2000 is still my top 1 classic game.

[@brxghtside]

the m3 gtr is so much more exclusive than any porsche really, and it turned out to be such an iconic car.

[@vista1456786]

(Speculation) That M3 was likely chosen for winning an endurance race (or championship) but I know it was a significant race in the endurance series. After that it just became really popular. In all fairness it was did have a great look and an absolutely amazing sound when it is the actual car (in some games it is a normal M3) and this is coming from Porsche's biggest fan boy.

[@ashman198]

Do you think Toyota is more willing to work with Japanese developers? They never disappeared from Gran Turismo, Wangan Midnight Maximum Tune, the Initial D Arcade Stage games, and even the new Tokyo Xtreme Racer has revealed 3 Toyotas, one of which is a current model GR86.

[@adlibbed2138]

if games published by Bandai Namco such as Project Cars (formerly) and the infamous Fast & Furious Crossroads we're any indication, it should've comes as no surprise they did although I can see games like The Crew Motorfest is signs of them desperately bleeding money due to the lack of Japanese published/developed racing games as of late, and the recent AC Shadows single leg Torii gate scandal might having their old guard higher ups might indirectly thinking thrice about lending over their licenses to Ubisoft and reconsider their licensing agreement policies

[@teertaa]

Also despite fh4 couldnt get toyota agreeing for the license at launch, they somehow added 2 toyotas before the mk4 supra greenlight. The land cruiser and the hilux. They get really creative by licensing through "arctic trucks" instead of toyota yet they are called toyotas in game lol.

[@UltraViolet_Moses]

Crazy the loopholes they have to go through

[@HyperVanilo]

I remember when that happened

[@NerfMaster000]

This is why I firmly believe in how GTA does it. Licensing friendly designs that are unique and you can still tell what it’s supposed to be.

[@naturalborndylla]

Honestly if Rockstar did a midnight club game but with the GTA cars they'd print money.

[@spideyplays6969]

@@naturalborndylla Holy shit that sounds brilliant! Rockstar is gonna delete your comment

[@ElTequilla]

I think Rockstar feels that the hassle of a gargantuan licensed soundtrack is enough for them to accommodate

[@MastermindAtWork]

@@naturalborndylla It can work. Midnight Club 1 and 2 didn't have licensed cars so I can see it being possible. Heck, they should be remastered in best case scenario.

[@vstaritz]

I think they just see Midnight Club today as entirely redundant considering GTAV and it's online racing is in a place right now that is almost certainly more successful and content complete as any MC game has ever been without putting in any of the work. A cool idea would be to subcontract someone and give them the tools to work on the V map and it's cars to make a dedicated MC style game with more features and reworked handling and balance. It would compete with Horizon at that point and Horizon would still be the better game unless they actually put in a significant effort. Ideally they would go all out with creation tools allowing players to really get in there. It think it would fill the niche for a true tuner larp video game.

[@FOREST10PL]

Fun fact. Toyota has a very long rally history. Despite that, only the current WRC cars are included in the EA WRC (and there were no toyotas in Codemasters' ghames since Dirt 3). Why is that? Very simple. It came out a year or two ago, that wen Codies were in a bit of a financial trouble, they missed a payment to toyota (that happened sometime in early 2012). Since then, they are basically blacklisted and current WRC cars in WRC are only there becasue of the WRC licence which forces their hand. They have quite a memory there to still refuse Codies BUT my guess is there probably isn't enough humility on the Codies side. Some of the most iconic rally cars are toyotas (Corolla WRC, Celica WRC) so it would be nice to have them in THE wrc game.

[@carcrasher88YT]

Part of me thinks that there's a very simple reason why classic Toyota rally cars aren't seen in the latest WRC title, but the current ones are. The sanctioning body of the WRC likely mandate current season cars be included in any title they license their series out to, regardless of any conflicts between manufacturer and publisher (since the latest title is an EA title), but classic ones aren't covered by that possible mandate.

[@VirtuaIceMan]

I was going to say this. The Celica and Corolla (at least) appeared in select WRC games by Kylotonn Racing and Milestone, before Codemasters took over.

[@Shftrz]

Funny thing about Toyota is that recently, the Chinese devs somehow got the license to use for their racing games. Such as - Ace Racer - Speed Drifters (also known as QQ racer. Theres like 4 different name for this game depends on region) - the upcoming global release Racing Master and NFS Assemble (known as the upcoming global release NFS Mobile.) Yes. Toyota in NFS after almost 10 years since 2015. Well its just AE86 btw. Except for Speed Drifters, which they got modern Sedan and SUV like Camry and Corolla Cross Pretty sure the existence of Toyota in these following games are to celebrate an anniversary of Initial D live action movie

[@Shftrz]

Oh another thing. NFS mobile just got license to bikes! These Chinese devs really got something when it comes to making mobile games man

[@simeonyves5940]

China does not have any Copywrite Laws and does not Obey the Rule of Law, so chances are the Toyotas are there *without* Permission from Toyota.

[@ArnoldTriyudho]

Man, there's a GR Supra in Racing Master

[@Shftrz]

@ArnoldTriyudho Oh my bad, really didn't know that

[@Twiggo_The_Foxxo]

​@@Shftrz and now unbound does too

[@EndermanLouco]

I can't talk about RUF without thinking about Gemballa as well Midnight Club 3 had a F355, a Cayenne, and a Porsche that i don't remenber exactly what it was, and i find it kinda funny since all 3 of them also don't have many customization options (but so does like, most of the cars on B and A class)

[@Mr.pawahh]

The other porsche was a 996 based car called the gemballa gt something + FYI the f355 wasn't actually a real as there aren't any real pics or Vids of it being driven or even showcased, it was probably R*'s way to play around the legal system and who could've helped them better than Mr gemballa himself

[@mbahpedia]

​@@Mr.pawahhGemballa F355 do exists, quick Google would show you press photos and in a Ferrari forum there is a screenshot taken from old Gemballa website.

[@naturalborndylla]

That Toyota account wasn't the main official one, it was the UK account probably an intern who didn't have the authority to make decisions like that. 100% its a money deal from the old Guard at Toyota HQ in Japan.

[@ShingoKirishima1997]

The thing I find funny about the statement is that Toyota still had appearances in new Initial D and Wangan Midnight games released after 2017 up until they returned to Forza. Which are both based on mangas featuring illegal street racing

[@adlibbed2138]

​​@@ShingoKirishima1997and to dug down the rabbit hole some more, the newest Tokyo Xtreme Racer game explicitly has Toyota Supra casually dodging traffic like it's first four Fast & Furious movies in the latest, pre-rendered trailer

[@yusuftegar6588]

Some of the licensing quirks i remember from playing various racing games : A. Juiced 2, in this game BMW and Mini doesn't have any aftermarket parts, only oem parts even though the game have emphasis on customization. B. NFS The Run, There is a section on the game story mode where your car get shot at during a race. Before that section you are forced to change car and all the 3 options are Audi. The cars that shot you during the race is also an Audi SUV. C. Driver San Francisco, There is scene when someone plant a bomb on a car. The car that get planted by a bomb and eventually blown up is a fictional car even though majority of the in game cars are licensed. (this one is more understandable imo)

[@dandrelowery3714]

Quick correction! The SUV the mob was driving is actually a Porsche 😊

[@carcrasher88YT]

Here's an odd quirk that's somewhat related to the first one: Need For Speed Hot Pursuit 2 didn't have NFS Editions of the game's BMW models, only stock ones and the police M5 (BMW takes pride in their cars being used for police duty), while Ferrari actually allowed there to be NFS Editions of their cars...although the NFS Editions of the 360 were strange, with Xbox, PC, and GC versions getting a purple-ish 360 Spider, while the PS2 version got a 360 Modena coupe that was listed as a 'Challenge Version'...though it was clearly NOT a Challenge Stradale.

[@VirusoDetectedo]

We need more poniatacs, fiats, and saleen's in modern racing games, like man... Where the hell are the days that Saleen was still a known Car manufacturer? Why are there not so many poniatacs in racing games? Fiats are another story though, but it also seems those are decreasing in variety by the second.

[@DrNeonCade]

Saleen S7, Saleen Mustang, Saleen Raptor. You guessed it.

[@Twiggo_The_Foxxo]

Forza added their newest saleen truck

[@PaperBanjo64]

Can we have a 1996-2002 NASCAR Gen 4 Pontiac Grand Prix race car?

[@just_your_localguard9612]

It kinda funny how much I'm willing to pay to race a grand am gt. Was first car i ever purchased on my own

[@FusionArmorX]

I think Ferrari also had a similar attitude towards _illegal_ street racing. Pre-blackbox era NFS games had Ferraris in them, but for the most part you couldn't use them in any modes that involved police.

[@keganmemestar4465]

You're partially true, which makes this ever weirder. I just booted up the PC versions of HP, HS, and HP2, and in both games with the subtitle 'Hot Pursuit' you can use Ferrari's in the Hot Pursuit game mode. Why not High Stakes, I have no clue. Maybe because of the vehicle deformation?

[@FusionArmorX]

​@@keganmemestar4465 Huh, the versions of HP and HS might've come pre-patched to enable the Ferrari cars in those modes. At least, that's what I've seen mentioned. It's speculated they dropped out is because following HP2 because the series started focusing on the tuner scene, and Ferrari wants basically nothing to do with that unless it's with OEM parts only.

[@Stormkrasher]

Only licensing issue I know of fairly well is the debacle with Pikes Peak. Now I don't know how track licensing works and/or differs from car licensing given so many games have many of the same tracks, but the first time it appeared was only a small 2.5mi recreation of a later portion of the climb in Gran Turismo 2 (which is noted as not being faithful to the original so maybe to cut down on costs... idk). The first major title where we got a fairly faithful recreation of it though was in Dirt Rally 1, and us rally folk figured Codemasters would likely hold onto the license and also put it into Dirt Rally 2 whenever that would come around (since we were still speculating at the time if there would even be a DR2). That wouldn't be the case as we'd eventually learn that Sony/Polyphony Digital bought out the licensing rights to Pikes Peak in 2017 (a year before DR2's release announcement) and it did seem like Sony/PD had something they wanted to do with it (a shame for us Rally folk but that's business we aren't involved in). 7 years later and we've never seen Pikes Peak officially return in any official, faithfully recreated capacity to the larger racing game world. In the meantime though, we'd get a modder who took publicly available LIDAR data and make a version of Pikes Peak in Beamng which ironically (and arguably) is the most accurate recreation of the hillclimb in any game to this day; and the Dirt Rally 1 version would eventually get ported to Assetto Corsa once modders had figured out how to go from the Ego Engine to Kunos' in-house system.

[@tomanderson6335]

Hot take: Polyphony squatting on the Pikes Peak license makes them worse than EA, since EA at least had the decency to include material covered under their exclusive Porsche license in games...

[@RACECAR]

Funny thing about Ferrari being picky is even in their GT Sport Inclusion, there were limits to what preset decals you could use in the livery editor which, try to act shocked, were all brands specifically associated with Ferrari's Racing programs (Shell, Motegi Wheels, Brembo, Sabelt, etc). So for abit of trolling, I actually saved a manufacturer decal from another car and after booting up the 458 GT3, Slapped a Nice and large TRD sticker on the side. Its dumb but not surprising considering how offended they were with Deadmau5's "Purrari" (AKA, the Nyan cat Ferrari) and actually sent a request for him to remove all that. The Lotus situation with GT supposedly involved the person in charge feeling like Sony didn't pay them enough so they threw a fit and never appeared again (which is why only the closed beta version of GT Sport had Lotus but not the full game) but that is really speculative. Would be rich considering they themselves aren't exactly...rich. As for the Ruf situation, I can only assume that Ruf and PD have had such a long relationship going all the way back to GT2 (Right around the timeline when that EA-Porsche Exclusivity was brewing) that even Porsche showing up doesn't appear to be really affecting it so I assume PD has been the only dev who's seen Ruf as more then just a Porsche Substitute (and has added a more recent Ruf Model that could be seen as a reflection of this). There is one peculiar issue I've noticed as of late and its not even with a Car Manufacturer nor its parent company: Its with Stanley (Owners of Tool Brand Dewalt). For whatever reason, ANY livery using Dewalt in GT7 gets removed. I would like to see if this is similarly the case with other games allowing custom liveries so right off the bat I'd appreciate it if any Forza players could confirm to me whether this issue is also present there as well.

[@Kacpa2]

I love the fact you shown 3000GT in Underground 2 specificly. I loved it and alwsys hated hownthey meber had it again not even as a carry over in Most Wanted. Audi TT, A3 Lexus IS300 and other csrs inroduced in UG2 were carried over for most part, and 3000GT... just wasnt. It would be a perfect fit in there...

[@SpitfireTheWolf]

The other problem I have with car licenses nowadays is that brands no longer have a spine like how they did in the early 2000s. Back then you could make a car as goofy and as wacky as possible or destroy it to your heart's content. It's VERY rare to see both aspects like this in modern games and it's quite sad

[@sehhmie5483]

Kinda sad because this, they stopped developing on car damage physics also limited creativity on bodykits Meanwhile its a trending that youtubers ruining a real life car without a single notice from them, weird

[@haystan02]

Apparently the WRC games have exclusive rights to Skoda's cars aswell, hence why they don't appear in anything else.

[@lon3lyRacer]

Rally licences are so weird. Ever noticed how some cars like the 98 corrolla are rarely in rally games? I wonder if its a licensing thing or just a popularity issue

[@spideyplays6969]

I wish Skoda would appear in other games too. Imagine specing out a Skoda Superb.

[@giothestupidass4136]

GT7 has skoda...

[@tomanderson6335]

Except they recently did a Vision GT car for GT7. Maybe it just applies to production/real world cars?

[@Jorg3Pinto]

A few exceptions on that, World Racing 2 featured road-going Skodas back in 2005, and Top Drives have 86 cars officialy licensed (both race and road cars), albeit on a card-game way, so maybe it's not the license itself, but how the cars are portrayed...who knows.

[@imrpovking845]

2:30 a Failrace approved landing from the police car.

[@kenbee1957]

Hehehe

[@placeholder2924]

In the early 2010's, Eutechnyx (infamous for Ride to Hell: Retribution) made a free-to-play racing sim called Auto Club Revolution. Their license for Lotus cars expired. They removed them from the web-based store, making them impossible to acquire by new players. Extending to all players with the 2.0 update, since the game was no longer using the old web-based UI. Early Forza titles included shop demo cars such as the TOM's W123. While now superceded by the likes of Hoonigan and Hot Wheels, Gran Turismo is the only game to include them, such as the RE Amemiya FD, Amuse 350Z, and so on. Ferrari had an exclusivity deal with Microsoft, starting with Forza Motorsport 3. Which is why Need For Speed Shift had an Xbox exclusive Ferrari DLC.

[@darexas1602]

Absolutely forgot ACR existed! Thanks for reminding!

[@SpeedAnarchy]

Ferrari and project Gotham where both good back in the day sadly you can only play on 360 or emulate on PC

[@markisaki979]

I miss those tuner shop cars in games that are not Gran Turismo. The RE Amemiya RX-7 is one of the most beautiful cars.

[@SpeedAnarchy]

@ what game was that juiced

[@SpeedAnarchy]

@ what game was that - juiced

[@aat8345]

ferrari isn't giving up anytime soon. the lb works kit in the new motorsport appeared after an absence since fh3 and then mysteriously disappeared a few months later with it being only acknowledged by a small line in the patch notes.

[@LegacyIvyTerascale]

we should boycott those licences ✊ is not like you can download a real car from the internet , making the manufacturer lose money

[@224L]

I can’t stand these greedy companies, but we would all be upset if somebody took something we built or designed, and portrayed it in a way that we did not like. I think the money some want (looking at you Toyota) is ridiculous, but I agree with having to obtain permission to use someone else’s design in your product.

[@224L]

I am mostly referring to brands that don’t want their cars in street racing games. And to be clear I would die for a new midnight club LA style street racing game with every car imaginable, but at the same time I respect the creators and their vision for their design

[@marcellogiovannini9072]

Dont forget about the absence of the Subaru in The Crew 2 and Motorfest!

[@cbennefeld03]

Another interesting case is Subaru and The Crew. Initially getting the BRZ in the original instalment of the game. It was later removed from the game for anyone that had not already purchased the car. (If you already owned it you could still use it) The brand has yet to appear in the franchise again, with little reason known as to why they left.

[@nololol]

assetto corsa spoiled me so much i forgot about this concept....shoutout to all the modders porting gran turismo/forza cars

[@dr.sivavignesh664]

Licensing has caused the grid games to be delisted. Played( replayed after more than a decade ) race driver grid 2008 ( through unofficial means ) and it just blew me away once again. It's not nostalgia, the game is just a masterpiece.

[@SpeedAnarchy]

Yeah. Hopefully gog on pc steps in

[@mijoges6288]

I’ve always found it strange that racing games have to strictly follow car copyright laws but shooters have nearly no limit to what real world guns can be included. I mean how many obvious glocks have you seen in games that just had a generic name like “Pistol”

[@adlibbed2138]

hell, even Medal of Honor Warfighter & Escape From Tarkov have all sorts of fully licensed weaponry, down to licensed weapon attachments for the latter might I add And I have yet to see these any of these gun/attachment companies (ie. Heckler & Koch, Colt, Knights Armament Company, SIG Sauer, etc.) pull a Ferrari/Lamborghini and suing games left & right for unauthorized use of their weaponry

[@MapleEmpire]

Audis also had trouble being added in NFSU, while also no newer models being added to Forzas (last i remember is the RS7 '21)

[@adlibbed2138]

hell, even Solar Crown appears to have the same issues as well, TT RS, 8 different variants of 2nd gen R8, and even the 2009 Q7, the latter wasn't even classic or anything prestigious like R34 GT-R or even R33 Nismo 400R

[@Acouplebands]

For some reason Audi and Mercedes new models have an hard time being added to video games. Seems like Forza is getting them a bit earlier than others but still at a slow pace

[@natha9745]

There's also Subaru, not featured in The Crew 2 and Motorfest, despite being in the first title. They also disabled the possibility for you to buy it in the first game (while it was still playable) Meanwhile, some independant game like Japanese Drift Master features a lot of Subaru... Some shady stuff had to happened between Ivory Tower and Subaru

[@adlibbed2138]

Japanese Drift Master is way too savage for a dev team of their caliber, I'm speechless they're even managed to get licenses

[@Leander98]

I feel like trying to consult legal teams at car manufacturers would have been a great addition to this.

[@UltraViolet_Moses]

It’s a fine idea, but they more than anyone know not to trust a KZbinr of all people with insider information. That and, very likely they wouldn’t even look my way

[@Exodus5ive-Zero]

Similarly to RUF, there's 9FF, a company similar to RUF in that they mod Porsches and release them as their own cars. As far as I recall, the only games a 9FF officially appeared in was Asphalt 8 and Nitro with the GT9 VMAX. However once Porsche's EA license agreement ended, the GT9 along with the RUF RT12S and CTR-3 got delisted from Asphalt 8's roster, available to those who owned them prior but unable to be bought after the Porsche update. It's a shame 9FF hasn't gotten much if any spotlight outside Asphalt, because some of their models like the GTurbo 750, 850, 900, GTT900 and of course the GT9-R and GT9 VMAX, are some of the coolest modded Porsches ever.

[@mbahpedia]

AFAIK 9ff cars is still registered as a Porsche unlike RUF which is a recognized manufacturer by German authorities. Tbf the reason I think why 9ff don't appear in more game is that they are relatively unknown to general public, especially now. They also went bankrupt but revived after that but frankly little heard from them ever since.

[@stratoos1]

There are other examples like in Midnight Club 3 they have to use Gemballa tuning brand to get their own version of Porsche 911 and Ferrari F355 for their game. Other than MC3, probably the TOCA Race Driver series had the same thing where they had to use Koenig brand to have their own version of Ferrari Testarossa, Ferrari 360 Modena, Porsche 962, and Lamborghini Diablo for their games. And I think the same Gemballa based on the Porsche 911 from Midnight Club 3 was also made an appearance too on TOCA Race Driver 3

[@mbahpedia]

I think most people didn't know this but according to Alois Ruf Jr (current RUF Chairman) interview in Magneto magazine. RUF exist in Gran Turismo not because they couldn't get Porsche but Kazunori specifically asked for it since he was a fan of yellowbird. In fact the lawyers that Sony sent to negotiate admit it to Ruf Jr that they could ask for more fee since Kaz insist that RUF must be in the game. That's why I'm not surprised when GT7 features Ruf. I do hope they can appear in more game. Especially their newer model such as new CTR and SCR didn't use any existing Porsche chassis.

[@Sir_Newkirk]

In a perfect world, perpetual product (car) licensing limited to a single release of a game would be a thing. You'd need to renew after every release not every 5 years after it expires. But alas.

[@obstlerpfeffiar8241]

A very recent example is the 911 Dakar added in FH5 since the Rallye Dakar is it's own thing they removed the Lettering on the rear bumper and called it the 911 Rallye (and the 959 as well)

[@equanimity92]

With Toyota, it kinda feels like they decided not to give out their license because they didn't want people to be reminded too much of the great cars they USED to be able to make...like A80 Supra,Celica,MR2,Hachi-Roku, RunX, Soarer, 2000GT, LFA, etc💔

[@streetpilot4098]

And then once they made the new Supra they were like “oh hey! We have a cool car model again!”

[@0Blueaura]

Remember split second? This game had awesome fictional cars

[@AlexanTheMan]

The biggest Achilles Heel in game preservation, next to music licensing.

[@Cat_in_The-Box]

No crashing, no destruction, no pedestrians, no cops, no customization, pay up millions oh and btw license expires in 5 years so pay up again or stop selling your game. Its a tragic system, both for cars, music and everything else.

[@isaacmayle6737]

This is perfect timing for this video seeing how Forza horizon 4 is about to be delisted most likely due to licensing restrictions

[@Redgfxr]

the world would be a better place if car brands stopped worrying about their reputation with those pointless licenses. It is logical that if we want to buy one of whatever brand cars there is, that decision wouldn't be affected if we saw their model getting crushed and we already see lots of cars in out everyday lives even in poor condition. I don't know if I explained myself but, we just don't care as consumers.

[@bsosmoove]

Im having nightmare flashbacks of brightly colored Rolls Royce Wraiths and Dawns with the forza aero wing tearing up thru the Aussie outback in Horzion 3 online

[@MastermindAtWork]

I hate that this is literally the double edge sword for racing games. Some people do complain and wish there were real world cars in some games but if you want that game to still be around in the future and worry about less licensing troubles (i.e. Burnout Paradise Remastered) that's probably your best option.

[@alewis514]

this is one of issues you run into if you give into this always-online digital distribution. You'll own nothing and be (not) happy. If you got a physical copy of a racing game from 2000s or 2010s these corporations can kiss your sweaty ass. You don't care about any licensing crap. You have a game in the same state as it was on launch.

[@Name-kd5jj]

I think the reason Toyota didn't want their cars in games is because they went about 20 years without making anything that deserved to be in a racing game. So all the Toyotas in racing games were from the 90s or earlier. They probably thought it would make people think Toyota has gotten boring (which they have) and it might effect sales. Now that they paid Subaru to build the 86 and BMW to make the Supra they finally have some interesting cars so they're back in the games.

[@AppleSlipper]

Well, the Toyota GR Yaris and Camry TRD got added to Forza in recent months, as well as the TRD Pro variants of the Tundra, Tacoma and 4Runner.

[@Minamoto67]

I think you could do another part of this video focused on racing simulators, as one of the moves that is most seen to overcome a licensing barrier is to license the race series, which means all brands involved in it. Toyota/Lexus appears in Assetto Corsa Competizione and EA Sports WRC due to the licenses from GT World Challenge Europe and WRC, for example. ESports in race sims also helps bringing cars as free DLC, but this is a thing only for Assetto Corsa, where the Dallara Stradale, Ferrari 488 Challenge, TCR spec cars from Honda, Alfa Romeo, Peugeot, Hyundai, Renault, Audi and LADA were brought to be used in competitive events but were made available for everybody to get them.

[@ImperialGamer5]

I still have my physical copy of Forza Motorsport 6. I wish I could have the opportunity to get most of the dlc cars like the NASCAR and Porsche expansions and Senna's MP-4/4, but I can't because Motorsport 6 was a legacy title and nowadays, I can't even complete nearly a quarter of the game's achievements because multiplayer was disabled and I wish these "legacy games" were renewed for a second chance at life. I love playing with the kinds of cars in the game ('94 Supra, Shelby Cobra, '66 GT MKii, Pagani Huayra, McLaren P1, NSX, Ferrari F40, GT-One, 787b, and so much more). The circuits were memorable for me, and the orchestral music mixed with light rock was so awesome. Downsides are the graphics (old but bearable), and if this game was renewed, I would want a custom animation for the pit lane where a fully animated pit crew refuels, changes your tires, and fixes car damage with either the Le-Mans style "Into the garage" repair or NASCAR style "beat it with hammers until it straightens out".

[@swilleh_]

Fakrari not appearing in Black Box era of NFS is a treat.

[@revoblam7975]

it also doesn't help that racing games have little to no representation of any modern common day street cars unless its Grand Turismo or a popular car like the Ford Fiesta/Focus, specially for regional variants like the Fiat Argo, Jeeps, the Peugeot Megan and the X06 Series

[@ThatScreaminCat]

RAHHH WAKE UP BABE ULTRAVIOLET POSTED

[@Nickfun1]

7:04 this is such a grand tour move lmao

[@lexusaristogs3002]

I think personally that licensing products back then isn't much of a problem since games were mostly physical media. But with digital media taking over, companies are slowly ditching the idea of physical media and games being increasingly more online oriented, licensing is slowly becoming more outdated as times goes on.

[@GT_Meria]

2:20 and then there are people like me, whose cars don't even have an Assetto mod

[@featherpheasant3851]

Was wondering if you could make a video about fictional cars in racing games

[@Blackwolf-ud5je]

Another thing worth mentioning is car dmg model/simulation has devolved over the years, cause brands are pissy about thier digital cars being wreckable.

[@sehhmie5483]

Meanwhile youtubers keep milking videos about destroying a REAL car, the hypocrisy

[@zeckor.]

0:27 Prostreet mentioned 🎉‼️

[@AidanBenny]

The Jensen Interceptor in another bizarre one appearing in Gran Turismo 4, Gran Turismo PSP and Gran Turismo 5 but was in the files of Forza Horizon 3 inaccessible

[@turdle837]

Jesus christ, I knew Ferrari are arrogant and stingy. But how much of an entitled and stingy child do you have to be to say "If you want our car in NFS, no aftermarket parts, only ours, the car will only look like we want it to look like!"

[@simeonyves5940]

Ferrari have had that view since they sued Willy Koenigg back in the 1970's! That clause basically pre-dates Gaming!

[@adlibbed2138]

I really think NFS should've just drop Ferrari onwards for their next game, like it or not just so we get to see Toyotas again but knowing EA, I doubt that would be the case, and if they did, they're probably gonna spending them elsewhere instead (ie. another Battlefield game that is)

[@Blackwolf-ud5je]

Fun irl story: there was a guy, Jean Blaton, he was a Ferrari dealrer and an amateur racing driver, he raced in Le Mans many times. He bought a Ferrari F40, than converted to a cabrio, and Ferrari got really mad about it. They banned him from buying Ferrari cars.

[@fenn_fren]

In a video game? Yeah, how about the same thing but in real life? Cause that's what they do.

[@dylhas1]

Shocked you didn’t mention the destruction of vehicles being greatly reduced, due to these carmakers it wanting people to see their car disintegrate on a 150mph impact. Which in my opinion is actually dangerous because people, even though it’s an extremely small amount, might think that the cars are safe to drive at those speeds because crashes don’t look bad, especially in “simulator” games. It’s sad. The original Grid and the early Dirt games had phenomenal destruction. It’s the reason I played them but now you can roll a car at 100 mph with “simulation” settings on and the car only has a couple dents and scratched paint. I don’t like marketing deals in games where it hinders the developer from improving certain aspects of a game, especially if they’re trying to be realistic

[@lapiswolf2780]

The Tesla Model S is in Asphalt 8. I remember seeing the Toyota Supra was *in* Asphalt 8 as well but by the time i found out about it, it was literally locked from purchase. I kind of want to see more games with well designed fictional cars now. They won't run into these issues.

[@NavGTI]

A recent licensing oopsie in Forza Horizon 5 is that the 911 Dakar is listed as the '911 Rallye' (badges on the car included) because the official Dakar game owns the licensing and trademark for the Dakar name. Even though Dakar is literally just the capital of Senegal and it seems rather impossible to claim that as a unique trademark. Like having to rename a Dodge Monaco because F1 owns the rights to it or something.

[@vstaritz]

Licensing is a scourge to modern racing games truly. People believe that the majority is more attached to the brand image itself rather than the actual look and feel of the car. I can really see a game today with much more reasonable graphic fidelity and no licenses but a gargantuan list of replicas. Unshackled by deals, you get to really tinker with them visually and internally. You get to smash them to pieces as well. Someone should get on that.

[@ianism3]

Toyota are an interesting one, especially in rally games. they've run a manufacturer team in the WRC for a while now, so their WRC entry has been driveable in every official WRC game. the official WRC games even got historic Toyota models in WRC 9, 10 and Generations, which released in 2020, 2021, and 2022, despite not really having much focus on historic models. but the Dirt series, which has more of a focus on historic cars, has not had a Toyota model since Dirt 3 in 2011. (us) fans assumed Toyota was absent from more recent Dirt games because Toyota didn't want their cars appearing in a game that was essentially a rival to the official WRC game, which kinda makes sense... there was a similar(ish) situation with Hyundai, which also ran a WRC team and had a car in Dirt 4 (2017), but only as DLC (notably the _only_ DLC for that game). the next Dirt game, Dirt Rally 2.0 (2019), was the official game of the World RX championships in which a few Hyundai i20 RXs prominently competed, coming second in the team standings in 2019 (admittedly the team was not run by Hyundai), but no Hyundais were present in the game at all. so that seemed to check out. but then Codemasters (makers of the Dirt games) obtained the official WRC license, so fans figured we'd get a bunch of Toyotas in last year's EA Sports WRC. NOPE. the game came with the WRC Toyota (it's even on the cover), and that was it. Not a single historic Toyota from the 90s, even though the game had 80+ rally cars on launch, including many obscure and rather unsuccessful ones from past decades, including classes the old Toyotas competed in and *won.* I just don't get it.

[@b.1570]

This comment 👆 I never understood that neither. Toyota rally history is the most remarkable and not seeing any of the their historic cars in any rally game feels like it's missing something and Toyota not willing to share it just because of stupid reasons like this it's even more stupid. At least in a better world theres art of rally with cars like the Celica ST185, the TCT and the 222D

[@Where_is_Waldo]

I've noticed that when you tune the cheaper of the two tesla models in GT7 to be incapable of driving in a straight line and incapable of having it's direction controlled by the driver, then set up a custom race against that car, the AI has no problem driving the car perfectly. I have no idea if that applies to all cars, I've only tried it with the tesla.

[@deezboyeed6764]

Another reason I absolutely detest copyright

[@jordansis0257]

I kinda wish some more games ditched licensed cars and made their own like the burnout series did for example. It makes the car lists more unique and it allows them to make proper damage models which really fits into certain arcade racers

[@AMV12S]

RUF doesn't make modifications in Porsche models, they buy the chassis and produce their own models. They are literally another manufacturer according to the German government.

[@iNathanLite]

Car manufacturers that get weird with having their sport and race cars in video games are weird themselves

[@Scorbunny_Loquendero_2000]

The more wierd one is Mecedes Benz in Mario Kart and would Mario Kart never introduced real life cars

[@darthblakie__]

There's another brand u forgot abt: Audi, they only want to be in games with realistic driving, which is why they didn't appear in NFS Unbound until this year, and it's also why they don't appear in many recent Asphalt games.

[@GoddessOfMisfortune]

11:18 OOF that aged very well with the CT push in both fortnite AND rocket league.

[@shifty1927]

Tokyo Xtreme Racer Zero has my favorite car list. And theyre unlicensed.

[@iamdwayne514]

Don't forget Lotus did not appeared in GT Sport and GT7

[@goodie2shoes874]

I really want more games to have fictional car lists. Ridge Racer and Burnout did this but never fully embraced it. Imagine a car list where every car drives as differently as a street fighter or guilty gear character in their respective game. Or each manufacturer having lore as deep as Kingdom Hearts. Inertial Drift’s cars have a unique fictional technology where their cars used alien like gyroscopes instead of combustion engines.

[@Zhawn7]

Ridge Racer does fit your second point. The lore in that series is excessive in a good way.

[@fenn_fren]

If they're done well, they're honestly often times better than irl cars anyway. For example, I've never touched any irl stuff in BeamNG nor GTA.

[@Larry]

Ironic that Ferrari is so strict about mods for their cars, when OutRun, THE most famous game they've ever been in, sports a convertible Testarossa! :D But, I remember Jaguar being super strict with their cars in early games, especially the Jaguar XJ220 game, loads of odd demands, like no showing the interior of the car, and the tyres can never show smoke Etc.

[@UltraViolet_Moses]

Absolutely, it's peculiar how Ferrari works, but I dont think any of us will understand how the brain of such an ostentatious company functions

[@lm_dccxl4078]

i really dislike how most of the racing games commumity simps a lot on toyota, just for a supra. they are literally saying that it disgust them to be on a racing western videogame, but still everyone go and kiss their ass when the brand is announced. its like nintendo.

[@simeonyves5940]

Then Toyota needs to be Punished for their Racism by being bought out by Ford..

[@artgokrew]

suprakids y'know everytime there's supra related stuff it's always the f&f livery or stanced with ear ripping phonk music, sometime I always appreciated a game as what it is I mean if there's a racing game with unbranded vehicle people ain't there for da car just for fun like supra is just there honestly and it exist but I sometimes don't really get the hype I honestly see it as a car

[@SpeedAnarchy]

But but Toyota trueno is for initial d kids

[@adlibbed2138]

​​@@artgokrewto put it on perspective, I actually seen more reasonably healthy debates within Lockheed-Martin F-35 haters and Boeing haters than I would on JZA80 Supra cultists, Veilside RX-7 fanatics, and by extension, the (modern) JDM community as a whole

[@Pinsonneaultmotorsports]

@@artgokrewthe only real supra is the MK3 and MK2 and don’t forget the 2000GT. The MK4 is overrated ASF as someone who has been in one and driven one it’s just a tuner car nothing special

[@Arexion5293]

Honda is extremely confusing. Appears in Need for Speed Underground 1 and 2 but there's no NSX and in U2 Honda is pretty much region locked. They didn't allow themselves to be in Tokyo Xtreme Racer 3 but the Drift side series was fine. They are very on and off in NFS games as a whole and have never been in Midnight Club. What's the deal with Honda?

[@miata0363]

Is interesting that Gran Turismo still remembers RUF. Back on GTS I was surprised when not only RUF returned, but it was a completely new model, the CTR3. And then in GT7 they added another new RUF model, RGT 4.2. I know people really want the Yellowbird, but is cool Gran Turismo adding RUF that weren't in GT before. I wish they did that too with the other brands instead the 20th GTR XD.

[@Pri11-k7l]

We need The Yellowbird

[@ZAYMANGAMESTUDIO]

I’m going to admit it. Licensed cars are a mess. With companies being more restrictive and protective with their brands, there will be a day when they decide to forbid games from using their cars. And no licensed cars ever again. If, some racing games were dependent on these cars, then, they will cease to exist, and racing games with licensed cars will eventually come to an end. As for some games where they use fictional cars since their first existence, they are less likely to disappear in the future.

[@TaimurAhmedRafe]

These, different type of videos than your normal game review ones are also pretty nice. Plus it helps they're shorter vids. Would love to see more. 😀

[@UltraViolet_Moses]

Glad to hear it, I'll be sure to whip up some more

[@HyperVanilo]

08:57 People are not buying brand new 90's Celica, MK4 Supra, and Corolla from your dealership, Toyota, instead they do it from other people

[@koenslinkman]

This channel never disappoints. Everytime i see a upload, i just instantly click and watch it. Love listening to your voice too

[@UltraViolet_Moses]

Thanks dude!

[@nsawatchlistbait289]

GTA, BeamNG and Night Runners prove you don't need dumb licensed cars for your game to work

[@adlibbed2138]

probably not GTA given it's clandestine nature of that game

[@madkaiser4887]

Never thought I clicked on a video this fast!