The XYSTON Star Destroyer vs. The ECLIPSE -- Who Would Win (and which is best?)

[@delliardo583]

The Eclipse wins on creativity alone.

[@cooperlevinson8149]

So true

[@anotherHelldiver]

The only thing more creative is the excuse your dad made to Leave you Didn’t even say “Going to get milk” he said the Car needed an oil change As Thrawn would say,a truly artistic Method

[@jamescourt6554]

@@anotherHelldiverno one asked

[@lenzi5119]

Who would win? *_T H E E C L I P S E_* or big ISD1 with smol pp

[@michaelscalese3142]

That is extremely op

[@PantherAusfD1944]

Big ISD1 with smol pp it will use the laser

[@illuminadi7055]

It will shoot out of the pp

[@cgi2002]

big ISD1 with smol pp gets to make 20-30 for the resources of an eclipse, so it brings friends. Also this fight really comes down to who shoots 1st, the turbolasers massively outrange all conventional weapons, and unless the ISD is infront of the eclipse, it wins simply due to been able to out turn an eclipse.

[@jimboydejuan7869]

XSD has shitton of Armada handles The Eclipse. gg XSD

[@PeteTemplar101]

At least the Eclipse having a superlaser made sense given its length, even if it could only crack a continent and not actually "destroy" the planet

[@ef-5tornado495]

I like the xyston but it would make more sense for the power of the super lasers on that and the eclipse to be swapped. The xystons should be able to crack a continent and the eclipse should be able to blow up a planet.

[@nat040496]

The Xyston just feels like a little kid's idea of a big threatening bad guy. "Like what if the death star, but like... mounted on a ship... and like... thousands!" Seriously it's nonsensically overpowered.

[@blackshogun272]

Even an ancient power-hungry Sith Lord would see the existential threat of having that many planet destroying ships across the stars. Like wtf would happen if one of your star destroyer crew want to start a coup or the ship's navicomputer and automated weapon systems went "murder all life" on ya ? That's why I'll fuck around with the EU having a superweapon here and there every once and a while but not literally thousands existing at the same damn time ! 😲

[@cgi2002]

@@blackshogun272 wise, but it's ignoring the obvious rule of WMD's in general, if you have 1, you can scare people in 1 place, if you have 50 or 500 you can scare everyone. As for them been overpowered it is, but it also makes sense, once you have the tech to mass produce super weapons, you do it, and you find ways to make them better over time. DS's superlaser was probably far more powerful than it needed to be, so the realised if we cut the power by X% it'd still work, and we can build a bigger reactor on ships, so do that, give it the smaller laser, and have it be a glass cannon when it fires. Stupid yes, effective tho.

[@blackshogun272]

@@cgi2002 *Bevel Lemelisk starts sweating*

[@2MeterLP]

@@blackshogun272 Yeah, old Palps must realise that ruling over a galaxy with no habitable planets is worthless.

[@kungolaf4499]

@@2MeterLP He could destroy a couple of dozen worlds, or a couple of thousand worlds to really establish his power in the galaxy. He could destroy Coruscant, Corellia and Chandrilla for example and make Exegol or Korriban the capital of the galaxy. Basically going full blown Sith like he couldn't with the Empire. This could have been the end game for the Sith. But apparently a small Resistance Force could destroy the Sith Fleet...

[@Thest-pg3hk]

This is just me, but I'm getting tired of Disney adding these supposedly over-powered ships and saying how great they are in the visual dictionaries, but then when we see them in the movies, they get destroyed as if they were nothing. The Xyston Star Destroyer is a perfect example of this. Great video btw

[@avantgardemetalfan]

Well according to the movie all the eclipse needs to do is attack the xyston class' superlaser and the whole ship blows up. It's not even a contest.

[@chrissonofpear1384]

To be fair, shields were not yet operational...

[@zanezen7441]

@@chrissonofpear1384 are they ever?

[@Unknown-hb3id]

@@chrissonofpear1384 And they didn't know how to fly upwards.

[@seldomlyrestless8113]

But if the Xyston class gets one shot off the Eclipse would go bye bye.

[@noconnection1839]

Plot shield was down too.

[@freedomfromthought8748]

Eclipse because it’s actually a creative original design

[@tennebrae2606]

freedomfromthought oh yeah because everything in Star Wars is so original. Like legends where the empire came back fucking 2 million times . Or how many sith orders there are in legends.

[@freedomfromthought8748]

A yes the two things that repeat a lot, that Disney basically copy and pasted. EU ideas repeat: unoriginal, Disney copies same ideas: do no wrong

[@tennebrae2606]

freedomfromthought first of all the palatine coming back has been done much better then in legends, it’s not explained in canon and that’s what makes is cool , and there is no new sith order in ros that’s just the rule of two unlike legends where almost every dark spider decided “ow sith are kewl let’s go be one” and the they magically have force abilities that are way to op. Third of all the yuuzong vong wich in my opinion is reason enough that canon is better ,the yuuzong vong are super marry sues wich I honestly prefer Rey over any day. And then take all of those thing copy them a thousand times and you have legends

[@freedomfromthought8748]

General Grievous ok that’s a lot to unpack there, I disagree with you completely on everything you’ve said. First, the emperors return was explained in one line from episode 3 which is a pathetic explanation. Second, there being no sith order is just confusing in ros since there seem to be thousands of sith in the amphitheater. Third, the yuuzong vong I do not know enough but I do know they do not fit the definition of Mary Sue. Lastly saying you don’t like op sith coming in or the yuuzong vong are Mary Sues and you prefer Rey is just negating your point, she is the definition of mercy sue, all powerful, undefeated, and earned nothing of what she was given. They literally retconned the ot so she could defeat palpatine.

[@plaguemaster308]

I dont see how original or creative things have to do with a fight against two star destroyers with death star lasers

[@innovator-sh910]

The main cannon of the Xyston bothers me. I think it’s way too strong.

[@andrewdowns9047]

On the one hand, equipping the ships with OP weapons is a good thing, as it allows it to perform the task of recreating Alderaan on a reproducible scale. On the other hand, it is not only a massively glaring weakness for the ships themselves, but presents the case of "why use the death stars when this thing works better?". I dont think its too powerful, but it logically would be too costly and too out of place in-universe for it to exist

[@jacksonscott3667]

It bugs me that the cannons are dozens of times smaller than those on the Mandator IV, given the insane discrepancy in power.

[@dr.boring7022]

Not as OP as the Suncrusher. A fucking starfighter, able to destroy solar systems. EU was crazy.

[@jonathanswavely7259]

agreed

[@viperson9818]

The main cannon is strong but some reason the entire ship will explode if that cannon explode. Like seen in the movie. We see a y-wing shoot at the cannon and the entire ship goes down.

[@TheArklyte]

Eclipse has less dead zones and more mass, better superstructure. Take a guess:D

[@adamorick2872]

Using long range the eclipse is almost entirely dead zone. You wouldn't be getting into brawling range with a Xyston against an Eclipse. You'd stay at range and outmaneuver.

[@TheArklyte]

@@adamorick2872 can you rotate the gun, Mr."Outmaneuver"? You do realize that the spinal mount of Eclipse is easier to put on target then that cockeyed pseudogimballed monstrosity the opposition glued to their ship?

[@cgi2002]

@@TheArklyte yeah except the Eclipse is so large and unmanageable it needs a week and a half to turn around. The Xyston can probably spin around a dozen times before the Eclipse even makes a single rotation. Consider both main guns out range the normal armaments of ships, so unless the Xyston drops out of hyperspace directly infront of the Eclipse or in really close range, it fires first, and whoever fires first wins. Also, if your hunting something like the Eclipse, you don't send 1 Xyston, you send half a dozen, you may lose 1, but you win regardless. Remember you could probably build 20-30 Xystons for the time/resources of a single Eclipse.

[@TheArklyte]

@@cgi2002 1)why the sudden "probably" in statement that Xyston is more maneuverable?(in space btw); 2)yes, it does outrange effective range of normal armament(effective range of beam is still a light minute though). Hence you must also say hello to Eclipse's advanced strike craft models compared to whatever few unknown TIE models Xyston has; 3)Eclipse has FTL inhibitor, Xyston doesn't. That means that Eclipse is free to jump around the battlefield and dictate the engagement angle and distance. Xyston is denied that advantage:P

[@cgi2002]

@@TheArklyte the probably is because I don't have the exact figures for an ISD's turning circle, the Eclispe however was well known to manuver badly, it seems to be a standard thing in SW that bigger ships turn slower than smaller ones. As for strike craft, I agree but your not going to jump in, wait for fighters to launch, then aim and shoot, you jump in, aim and fire as fast as possible, which should take seconds at most for a skilled crew. The jump inhibitors I accept, except it's still only capable of jumping in a straight line, and if it jumps away to turn then return, it also took that same jamming away, meaning that it's now pointless. I'm sticking with the Eclipse losing in a real world scenario simply because it's too sluggish. The only ways it wins is if both crews are dumb and come at each other head on, they jump in at point blank range in a broadside setup or the Eclipse is the attacker and it jumps in with gun on target.

[@srreina8117]

The Xyston is literally an ISD 1 with a tube strapped to its belly. Eclipse wins.

[@huonglan4346]

Srreina 811 XSD is much longer and more heavily armored than ISD-1

[@ceilyurie856]

@@huonglan4346 not really, it is aboiut x2 the legnth, if that.

[@dr.boring7022]

@@huonglan4346 "longer" "more heavily armored" I'm sorry, did we watch the same movie? Those things got taken out by Y-Wings. Weaker than regular ISDs.

[@redgroupclan]

​@@dr.boring7022 Right? Their armament may be better, but they have a giant weak spot that ISD's didn't have. They're glass cannons.

[@bensonfang1868]

Xystons have strength in numbers

[@shogun2215]

The Xyston is so unrealistic even by Star Wars standards, it disqualifies itself.

[@Revan-vk2ld]

This isn’t even a contest of course the Eclipse wins

[@rickyrackx8928]

Dark Side Darth revan I wish that ship was canon 😩

[@theodorewai2864]

The Xyston should honestly win. It outputs far more energy and really it didn't take long for it to fire.

[@marisacursedisame8413]

That is true, however I imagine you may be able to build several Xythons, maybe even several dozens of those, with the ressources needed to produce a single Eclipse (though the Eclipse is still super cool)

[@allnamesaretakenful]

The fight should never have been 1 on 1 considering that the Eclipse would take way more resources to build.

[@halempyrion4406]

@@rickyrackx8928 Yeah but it cant fire up.

[@TimaeusEXE]

It's honestly who fires their super weapon first

[@Cpt_Boony_Hat]

So probably who was the best sensors

[@alexanders2669]

Timaeus That would be the Xyston. Fires incredibly fast.

[@michaelramon2411]

@WaffulMann The Xyston appears to be far more economical than the Eclipse, able to be deployed in large numbers across a whole galaxy. On the strategic level it is a superior weapons system.

[@cgi2002]

@@michaelramon2411 exactly, its a throwaway super weapon. Why build 1 Eclipse when you can build 30 Xyston's and not be to worried about losing them in battle. There is however the danger of them been captured and used against you, a single one of those in the wrong hands could ruin your day.

[@batuhangocer6642]

Even if Xyston shots first it will lose because Xyston’s superweapon is in bottom so while Xyston moves up, Eclipse can shoot it with it’s superweapon or just with the guns and fighters it has.

[@UGNAvalon]

Regarding the Xyston’s maneuverability, I’m suddenly imagining a tiny Xyston gunning all its engines to escape the firing arc of the Eclipse’s superlaser, then making a hard turn so as to drift along the Eclipse’s broadside. In a single move, it’s escaped its opponent's primary kill zone, reduced its profile by facing the Eclipse head-on instead of broadside-to-broadside, and now has a wide target to fire its Own superlaser on. Would the xyston get past the Eclipse’s shields in that single continuous blast? Probably not. But would a heavy Star Destroyer drifting sideways while firing a superlaser be hilariously awesome? Hell yeah! xD

[@randomnepali7772]

X y s t o n D o r i f t o ? !

[@corrat4866]

Star Trek style

[@Kyo-bd4tw]

*_Deja Vu intensifies_*

[@Zeknif1]

"Sir... they have our flanks and are pointing their superlaser at us!" "Direct Turbolaser fire on their primary weapon." "Sir... the Xyston exploded." At the end of the day: There has been no indication that the Eclipse could be easily destroyed by weapons fire from a starfighter... the Xyston however, had this significant weakness put on full display on the big screen. The big unknown about the Xyston would be the effectiveness of its shields.

[@piercelindenberg6842]

Nuvakwahu The Xystons couldn’t use their shields on Exegol. That’s why the Resistance attacked them all at once instead of a few at a time.

[@Ariana321]

Never been this early before... and right as I'm ranting about how bad of a knockoff the Xyston was to somebody else too.

[@joegroves2517]

Man, I went into the movie excited for some goofy fun thinking "at least it'll be better than Dark Empire!" and left thinking "damn, why couldn't it have just been Dark Empire?" At least that had meaningfully different ships and I bet the word count on explaining Palpatine is 2-3x higher in a 6 issue comic run than a tent-pole movie.

[@geauxburns]

Xyston is the result of laziness and lack of imagination; "Let's make the new Planet Killing threat look like Imperial Star Destroyers, but BIGGER and 10,000 of them!"

[@brakdanych4329]

I would not call it BIGGER, it is only 2,4 km long, half km smaller than a resurgent BIGGER would suggest that he is 10km or something

[@NetherCrafterSMC]

Yeeeh why didn't they just make Palpatine the super weapon watching him fly around force draining planets would be so much cooler

[@DIEGhostfish]

@@NetherCrafterSMC Also they only made it bigger pretty late in the game, given the script treats them as modified ISDs, what with going through the archives for ISD weaknesses. JJ pulled his usual "It's too small" nonsense like he did when boosting what should have been the classic Enterprise till it was longer than the Galaxy class and almost as wide.

[@NetherCrafterSMC]

@@DIEGhostfish Agreed Palpatine being the super weapon would be much color

[@DIEGhostfish]

@@NetherCrafterSMC Eh I don't think that would be good either. It only worked for Nihilus because it was a planet of force sensitives and he was a leech that got even leechier around other force sensitives. (Which is why it took a fellow wound-in-the-force to kill him.)

[@derpyallan1435]

I love it when you talk about how AWESOME the Eclipse II is! It's my favorite ship)))

[@authentic229.14]

Its my too

[@akumaking1]

Last time I was here early, Kenobi just exploded Durge.

[@concept5631]

Back when Durge was considered by Disney to be non-canon.

[@keatonburton6064]

@@concept5631 Vengeance will be mine, Disney!

[@concept5631]

@@keatonburton6064 Maybe

[@theevildrummingsithlord1492]

Now that's a reference I wish more people got.

[@dragonleo_]

For some reason I feel Eclipse made more sense than Xyston

[@marrqi7wini54]

For power consumption yes I agree. If the Xyston existed in something like the legacy era or further, no one would complain.

[@cgi2002]

It does, but only because SW logic for ships is stupid to begin with. In reality you don't need a planet killing super laser, you just need to understand how to drop really big rocks on planets using tractor beams. Blowing up a planet is cool, but killing everything on it by dropping a rock a few km across works just as well and is far cheaper.

[@lukatomas9465]

@@cgi2002 Isn't that what the Vong did and how Chewie died?

[@cgi2002]

@@lukatomas9465 basically yes. It's already got a proper military name, it's a KKW (Kinetic Kill Weapon) or a KIW (Kinetic Impact Weapon).

[@marrqi7wini54]

@@cgi2002 You're right but Star Wars does have planetary shielding. So I'd guess they'd need something to pierce that. But the Mandator 4 (Shown in Ep8) can do that as well. Though it was a larger and less powerful ship. They should honestly invest more in that than planet dusting weapons.

[@hellohello7838]

Echarts ladder is litterly a Star wars fact book

[@GrendelMTL]

REALLY!? Can't we all just agree that JJ's uh "ISD 3" ? Ships are way OP and the victims of pure "we need a bigger plot" ?.... I'll take the Eclipse over the "Palpatine's OP Sith Fleet" any day

[@trevorp8124]

Eclipse wins because its cooler and doesnt also require an entire ancillary book to explain how they miniaturized a moons volume worth of power plants into one ISD

[@dr.boring7022]

The Star Destroyer had the high ground

[@primarchvulkan5097]

@@dr.boring7022 i get it because they were high when they designed it

[@Surtwo]

@Terix Septim they used the force.

[@DIEGhostfish]

@Terix Septim They could have made it work like a slightly weaker version of the Rogue One Single Reactor Ignition. But noooooooo.

[@Hybris51129]

@Terix Septim They take a big Kyber crystal and hot wire a few Snoke clones and use their connection to the force as a means to force and amplify the energy beyond what the crystal could hope to generate on it's own. Hence why they had spare Snoke clones in TLS. I put more effort into that than JJ and KK did at least.

[@peterotto8779]

Xyston's lame. They totally phoned it in. Sigh, I personally feel they straight up used the isd1 model from rogue one. Kind of shows where Disney SW's is at these days

[@hotsauce8780]

its because they did lmao

[@jakedempsey3809]

Thematically I like the idea of the Xyston. It's definitely the ultimate threat. I just wish they would've used a more impressive model, the recycling of the ISD is just so lazy and boring. My thoughts on this pretty much sum up my entire opinion of the film as "good idea, bad execution"

[@aidanpayne7843]

I remember it was even in a EckhartsLadder video where the StarWars miniature game had anew model that was a star Destroyer with a lateral superlaser that took up the entire middle of it, I will find the video and add it here. Edit: Here it is kzbin.info/www/bejne/iGe9dWSkp5qFn9k at around 5:20. Way cooler design than just and ISD1 and a dumb cannon glued to the bottom.

[@Forceman4077]

@@jakedempsey3809 Just look at the TFA art book they had TONS of new Star Destroyer designs. Yet they threw all of them out. I really do want to know if reusing the ISD was a creative choice (confirming that LFL is creatively bankrupt) or if it was a choice of necessity due to the tight production time frame (confirming that Iger and Kennedy screwed this movie by not moving the date).

[@jakedempsey3809]

@@Forceman4077 I think probably they just wanted a ship that looked identical to the old destroyers for the sake of nostalgia. I understand the idea, but playing it safe has been a major complaint regarding the entire sequel trilogy so I don't know why they decided to do so even more

[@gabebell924]

Okay so, just one thing I think is heavily undermined or unnoticed about the Xyston is how limited its superlaser is. It is, while on an axis can only go up and down as well as backwards I believe. Meaining, if it wanted to fire at a ship that was even just right in front of it. It would have to do what Ahsola did in that one episode of the Clone Wars where she turned the bottom of the ship towards the enemy. In order to shoot the enemy it would have to do this. The Xyston is a ship made to siege and bombard planets, not navy combat. So, in a fight with the Xyston I guess you could say the high ground reigns supreme.

[@piercelindenberg6842]

The Xyston that destroyed Kajimi was also destroyed. It returned to Exegol to monitor the fleet’s takeoff for problems, and it was destroyed by the Resistance.

[@Mjolnir117]

Everytime I see that ISD 1 with laser attachment (That’s exactly what it is lets be honest!) I can’t help but do a Dr Evil impression.

[@piercelindenberg6842]

I just want fricking Star Destroyers with fricking laser beams on their bellies! Is that so much to ask for!

[@MonkeyJedi99]

@@piercelindenberg6842 Giant fricken laser penises!

[@Blacksmith__]

After my second viewing, it really seemed like the Star Destroyer that was destroyed over cloud city at the end of Episode 9 was not a Resurgent. Do you think it was a Resurgent, and if not, what is it? #AskEck

[@viktorjoachimmoscoso6327]

It's xyston

[@tinyelephant1533]

I thought it was a SSD like an Executor

[@cgi2002]

@@viktorjoachimmoscoso6327 more than likely. We know for a fact at least 1 of them wasn't with the fleet.

[@keatonburton6064]

@@tinyelephant1533 For a second, I thought it was the Eclipse (Palpatine's Executor-class flagship in canon).

[@bloodbuzzohio7924]

@@tinyelephant1533 same, I immediately thought it looked like an SSD

[@samgiles20599]

The way the Xyston destroyed the planet to me looked like it burrowed into the planet's core and that somehow just erupted the planet, as apposed to the superlaser being really powerful.

[@dr.boring7022]

Still more impressive than cracking a continent.

[@thermalvision203]

@@dr.boring7022 *Cracking a continent with a single pulse, while the Xyston had to fire continuously to borrow into a planet to destroy it from the inside out.

[@samgiles20599]

@@dr.boring7022 Yeah but if all I was after was flashy explosions I'd watch a Michael Bay movie. Not exactly what I look for in Star Wars.

[@dr.boring7022]

@@samgiles20599 We're in a comment section comparing 2 superweapons from the Star WARS universe, and your argument is, "I don't like explosions"?

[@samgiles20599]

@@dr.boring7022 You got me there man. 😂

[@tinylegofiend8605]

It’s originality vs copy paste, they could have cut the middle man and done like a bunch of mini Eclipses

[@WarriorKidd06]

The Xyston may be the most overrated ship ever in the canon of Star Wars. All those ships. All that power and they get mopped up by a civilian navy.

[@Astraeus..]

You didn't listen to that one guy; they're not a navy. They're just people :P

[@Aedanthefirst]

The xystons also had no shields

[@andreacremer7747]

In a real battle with out Disney the Xstone Stardestroyer will Start to the begin of the final order and than they will wait with aktiv shield's. Bitte entschuldigt meine Grammatik, ich spreche normalerweise Deutsch.

[@Aedanthefirst]

@@andreacremer7747 I assume the German is intentional

[@samuel-myshells8959]

Aidan O'Rourke That’s because they weren’t fully deployed yet they had to leave the planets atmosphere to be fully deployed

[@Boxghost102]

Last time I was this early, there was still hope for the sequel trilogy.

[@Unknown-hb3id]

When was that again? It's been a bit.

[@s13gouf60]

2014

[@Unknown-hb3id]

@@s13gouf60 Ah, thank you, gouf sir. I also appreciate the lack of a question mark.

[@s13gouf60]

@@Unknown-hb3id Before the dark times, before the rat.

[@A1985Jonesy]

I really wish they would’ve done a different design for the xyston. I want to see ec Henry do a redesign it would be super sick

[@gimpytheimp]

Palpatine: Make sure the ships can be destroyed by simply blowing up the super canon Designers: But my lord, surely we can create systems to preven- Palpatine: NO! EVERYTHING MUST BE TERRIBLY DESIGNED!

[@Patrick_The_Pure]

You missed a "DO IT" opportunity.

[@AF-qc5vo]

@@Patrick_The_Pure *DEW IT

[@piercelindenberg6842]

Except for the Eclipse. The Eclipse was only destroyed because Palpatine triggered a Force Storm and got killed. The Eclipse II was only destroyed because R2-D2 took control of its computer systems and crashed into another Imperial planet-killing weapon.

[@xninewxw7559]

@@piercelindenberg6842 I don’t know man that’s worse a little droid taking control a entire super star destroyer

[@piercelindenberg6842]

@@xninewxw7559 sure, but R2 is no ordinary droid. Plus, he had backup.

[@liamharvey7165]

Always interested in the scale models you make in your videos. Always cool to see the sizes increase as the time and designs progress in different generations of ships.

[@AngooseTheMoose]

I've missed the versus episodes, keep them coming!

[@je2409]

I discovered this channel after TROS and I absolutely love every video. There’s not many people who focus on the smaller details and “what if” type videos. You and Star Wars Explained are 2 of the best Star Wars you tubers IMO

[@ht491]

Amazing video, perfectly analyzing the xyston’s weapon capabilities, love seeing battle of the dreadnaughts in the back

[@KriegsMeister27]

the XYSTON's are just so ludicrously mis-scaled for the strength of the superlaser that it is just ridiculous. Even if it has to shutdown all other systems on a 2400m long star destroyer, to say it even comes close to producing similar enough energy as a literal small moon of 160km diameter to power a laser that can destroy an entire planet is nonsense. Granted maybe the death star was only using a small portion of its total reactor power to create the laser, even .1% of its energy should absolutely dwarf the XYSTON's output a thousand fold. The Eclipse actually makes sense, an incredibly massive super star destroyer, which was still miniscule to the size of the death star, could only produce a beam strong enough to destroy continents under sustained firing. It logically follows established laws of the universe. Even if you added another 0 to the Xystons length, or hell even 2, can not make any sort of sense to have equivalent firepower to as the Death stars.

[@alexanderishere6205]

Keep up the work you should have a million I like your channel since 5k and it awesome to see what your doing now Oh and PS:first

[@Tayd0g]

Man Eck, I don’t know why synthwave and sci-fi universes and starships go so well together but they do. The lights dotting the sides of star destroyers are as dazzling and nostalgic as the music.

[@Amesang]

I'm voting for "Eclipse" 'cause I can at least spell and pronounce it; "Xyston" just looks like an _attempt_ at sounding "cool."

[@jonathonmaxwell2973]

That because I think it a roman word or Greek.

[@marrqi7wini54]

@@jonathonmaxwell2973 It's the name of a greek spear.

[@jonathonmaxwell2973]

@@marrqi7wini54 So basically the star destoryer line have Greek naming scheme.

[@marrqi7wini54]

@@jonathonmaxwell2973 It's usually goes by Roman language names. I guess Greek was chosen for this ship this time.

[@Cpt_Boony_Hat]

Could called it Dictator all a USS Dictator

[@beebeenyneeee7692]

Why not attach like 10 of the axial superlasers to the supremacy

[@juanlodri5964]

This video is literally the only good thing we can get out of Episode 9.

[@potatomancer4316]

It’s funny how all these super powerful and intimidating ships are introduced into Star Wars as being feared vessels but every time we see them, so much as a bad gust of wind can bring them down.

[@darkapostle1]

Whenever I watch the films and a character says "Oh no, a Star Destroyer!", I just sigh because I know what will happen.

[@marrqi7wini54]

The force takes precedent over technological and strategic superiority in star wars. Always like that.

[@jacobwarkentin2156]

To sum up this video: different gun, same caliber. But the eclipse has way more smaller guns strapped on.

[@jamesp7987]

My assumption is that the Eclipse, in terms of conventional capital ship weapons, has similar firepower to the Executor-class Star Dreadnought. We know that during the Battle of Jakku, there were several Starhawk line ships which were roughly the size of an Imperator-class Star Destroyer. It was said that these ships' shields alone could withstand the firepower of an Executor-class Star Dreadnought for quite a while. Given that a lot of time has passed since then, and that the Xyston-class is quite a bit larger than the Starhawk, we can at least assume that the Xyston's shields are a bit more powerful than the Starhawk's ones. This leads me to believe that, if the Xyston were able to manoeuvre out of the Eclipse's axial superlaser's line of fire, the shields, even at low power, would buy it enough time to fire at the Eclipse and destroy it. I think it makes sense that, while the Xyston fires, the turbolasers and ion cannons wouldn't be operational, and all of the other systems, including the shields, were operating at a lower capacity. I think it would be a serious design flaw if the shields couldn't at least operate at a low capacity while the ship fires its axial superlaser, given that shooting at it can destroy the entire ship. Also, this argument relies on the assumption that the Eclipse can be destroyed by the Xyston's axial superlaser, which isn't necessarily the case; there is a lack of empirical data to determine whether or not this could be the case.

[@bluerobin2982]

Xyston as it is more cost effective but the eclipse is cooler

[@Jfk2Mr]

Cost effective - I doubt, larger vessels are more cost effective (one a larger crew instead of few smaller that are summarily bigger), less machinery (even if is individually larger) required to have similar performance characteristics. But while cheaper in resources and manpower, such vessel is more expensive (in money) to produce, while entire series of smaller ships more taxes resources and manpower, it is cheaper (in funds) and quicker to produce.

[@splatoonistproductions5345]

I believe since the xysten is able to destroy a planet to the same degree as a Death Star, but only instead of being instantaneous, it’s takes about 5 seconds from point of contact, possibly even 15 seconds if the shield is strong enough. I think it was said the super laser of the eclipse was able to like two shot a planetary shield, and considering the singular blast of the xysten is 10x more powerful, it would be safe to assume that this ship given a window would be able to destroy the eclipse, but would need cover from other ships, possibly having two, sacrificing one which would open a brief window. also another thing to mention which I thought of. Both had similar roles but differed as well in purpose. you said that the eclipse was likely a galaxy hopper/conquer, while the sith eternal fleet was more like a galaxy killer. I mean sure, it cannot compete in range with the eclipse, but considering the sith fleet numbered in the tens of thousands (my best bet around 15k, also before I continue the empires fleet was around 25k but not all gathered like the sith fleet) could literally destroy thousands of planets and kill possibly sextillions of beings, that in of itself made the Xysten more terrifying to me, as one could destroy continents and planets given time whilst a whole armada could destroy thousands of planets near instantaneously.

[@youtubeisapublisher6407]

Eclipse, it came from the good version of Dark Empire.

[@timbartschwolfman]

2020 Notification Squad where you at

[@timbartschwolfman]

@Colm McReynolds Glad to have you on board

[@crusaderedit]

red leader standing by

[@CylixTheGamer]

Ghost Leader, standing by

[@timbartschwolfman]

@@CylixTheGamer Ghost Leader welcome aboard

[@straythrawn7861]

Gold Leader, standing by

[@El_Presidente_5337]

I would have prefered a few hundred Eclipses than thousands Xyston ships.

[@gothmoggaming]

Hey Eck and great video fantastic as always! It’s taken me quite awhile to get around to watching this video so I apologize, I was busy with my friends watching a movie and having a crap ton of coffee, then I watched the Fall of the Republic video and finally joined the big stream. That was a bunch of fun and really long too so good stuff! We as fans appreciate you Eck, keep up the great work!!!

[@MarksWorkshopcrft]

Not only do they both have planet destroying weapons but the eClips had more surface and inner cannons And was considered the most destructive ship in the galaxy on top of having a planet destroying weapon

[@jamieharris1256]

I love the design Xyston class the concept of putting a big space to ground weapon on the mostly unarmed underside of a star Destroyer really appeals to me. Feel like a natural progression for the ISD and it's focus on being scary overwhelming. But making it a planet kill was a bit much. I feel it would have served the story just a well if it was just a city killer like the mandator 4. You could still explain as a fleet they could destroy a planet.

[@evanhenderson1760]

yeah I agree, base delta zero could essentially be performed by one ship.

[@michaelramon2411]

I think the Xyston (and Starkiller Base) use a fundamentally different technology than the Eclipse/Death Star. The Death Star is a rather simplistic brute-force weapon, generating massive amounts of power through conventional reactors, focusing it with kyber crystals and then shoving it into the target so fast that the target overheats, shatters and explodes. Starkiller Base, on the other hand, used a fundamentally different technology - phantom energy. There was a few lines of weird technobabble in I believe The Force Awakens novelization about Starkiller using something called quintessence to turn dark energy into phantom energy, which it would fire and, after a trip through hyperspace, it would trigger a "pocket nova" in the target planet. What a pocket nova is is not entirely clear (none of what I just said is entirely clear, honestly), but it seems to be some kind of chain reaction within the planet that causes a massive release of energy. While the end results look very similar, the means by which the Death Star and Starkiller Base destroy planets are actually different. I believe the Xyston uses a much smaller amount of the phantom energy technology (it can't fire through hyperspace, so it doesn't need to eat a sun to fire) to destroy planets in a far less energy-intensive manner than the Death Star. We know that it takes some amount of continuous fire to kill a planet, and I think that is because the phantom energy beam needs time to burrow down into the core of the planet and kick off the pocket nova. Once it does so, the planet will destroy itself via chain reaction, with no further action or energy needed by the Xyston. What phantom energy actually is and why it causes uncontrollable explosive chain reactions, I do not know, but that seems to me to be the official explanation. The First/Final Order didn't just miniaturize a Death Star; they found a different, less power-consuming technology to be the central aspect of their weapons. (It is also possible that the battering ram laser from Crait used a similar technology - Finn calls it miniaturized Death Star tech, but it has a red beam and a continuous/pulse fire method, like the Xyston.) It is also possible that, rather than the conventional reactors of the ISD/RSD line, the Xyston uses ancient Sith power technologies - basically an upscaled version of the Sith battery from the temple raid episode of Resistance.

[@trilliasf]

Ah, theres my trusty ladder

[@Pastry656]

Eclipse is better no matter what as Dark Empire tech is leagues beyond Canon.

[@alifalaudin845]

Interesting, in Legend, there was one Imperial-Star Destroyer Mounted with some kind of Laser weapons and shape like Death Star's Main Laser weapon, called *Conqueror*. The weapon could crack the continent or melting the city according to wookiepedia, and possibly destroy a small moon.

[@bradenellis8125]

Remember when Anakin put a big laser in the belly of a Venator let’s do that but times ten thousand.

[@Cpt_Boony_Hat]

From a military development point of view that would make sense.

[@theevildrummingsithlord1492]

When was that?

[@c0ckNBallz]

@@theevildrummingsithlord1492 like in Clone Wars Cartoon and Revenge of the sith. There was two versions of Venator, one with normal hangar at Venator's belly and later on they were upgraded to replace that hangar with laser.

[@theevildrummingsithlord1492]

@@c0ckNBallz I see. How common was the "replacement" version? It seems very effective.

[@c0ckNBallz]

@@theevildrummingsithlord1492 well, i saw that Venator version at Revenge of the Sith only.

[@jakedempsey3809]

We're looking at this like the Xyston and Eclipse fill the same role, which I don't think is really the right way to go about it. The Eclipse is stronger, but it seems that the Xyston is much more economical. The ability to produce that many planetkillers suggests to me that the Xyston is better for conquering large swaths of territory. It's a better ship for maintaining an Empire because you can have one pointed at every planet in the galaxy, where the Eclipse is more offensively armed but requires much more time and material to build. Basically the Eclipse is a fleet killer and mobile headquarters, the Xyston is a tool for oppressing planetary populations

[@gracecalis5421]

If we're arguing economy and resource management, then the Xyston's existence itself is redundant. The ISD-1s are cheaper and easier to mass produce, not to mention more durable. They don't need planet killing weapons to enforce an almost entirely civilian population, in fact ISDs are perfectly capable of glassing planet surfaces if need be. The Xyston isn't fit for whatever role it was intended to fill.

[@jakedempsey3809]

@@gracecalis5421 to an extent I agree with you. The Xystom definitely isn't necessary. I do think they fit well into the story (despite the lazily recycled ISD design) as a vessel for Palpatine's "surrender or die" campaign. He's not shooting for a prolonged war, he wants everyone to give up at once, and the ability to destroy hundreds if not thousands of planets at a time would pretty well crush any dissent immediately. If Palpatine wasn't so overconfident he would've deployed his fleet before threatening the galaxy, and the war would've ended as soon as it began. So while the design of the ship isn't my favorite, I think it does exactly what it needs to

[@gracecalis5421]

@@jakedempsey3809 The Xyston numbered in 10,000, right? I'm just wondering how much ISD-1s or 2s could be produced from all the resources spent making the Xystons, not to mention RnD for that ridiculous cannon which really has no rhyme or reasoning of being as potent as it is for its size. The galaxy surely realizes that the crippling of any opposing capital ship fleet would mean absolute control by Palpatine; no point in destroying planets and losing insurmountable resources and assets. The Xystons are a reflection of Palpatine's inexperience has a military leader. Either that or a reflection of JJ's incompetence in writing. Or maybe a bit of both, yeah... let's go with that.

[@jakedempsey3809]

@@gracecalis5421 lol true. I'm not a huge fan of the Xyston, but I think they had to exist in order to be the ultimate threat of the entire saga. I understand Palpatine's reasoning for wanting to put a vice grip around every world. It's the same thing as ROTJ though, he's so full of himself that he makes a critical mistake. I think he had the fleet to conquer the galaxy and ensure a real, lasting Sith Empire and instead he stupidly leaves his entire unshielded fleet in a single place assuming nobody will attack him. It's the same thing that gets just about every Sith defeated though, so I guess I shouldn't be surprised

[@gracecalis5421]

@@jakedempsey3809 In hindsight, even the second death star was a stupid idea in concept. An even bigger battlestation that would still only have the combat effectiveness of its smaller older brother. But the way they handle the Xystons are just too... bleh.

[@aussiedogfighter285]

i think the xyston would win if it stayed out of range of the eclipse's conventional weapons and somewhere behind it

[@Zero-zb5ij]

Space Battleship Yamato vs the Eclipse It makes a lot of sense to me

[@thealexgundam5006]

Space battleship Yamamoto is like the eclipse on way more faster/ mobility/ I believe a cannon enough to destory a planet or continent. Can shoot hard shells/ beam cannon to destory several big crusier in a row.

[@TechnoMinarchist]

The Eclipse is part of the real franchise so clearly it wins.

[@paulsteinhauser434]

That's true.

[@Kai-ow9gi]

When seeing the Xyston all I could think about was Austin Powers giving sharks “freakin laser beams” quote but it’s an imperial giving the idea for a new ISD

[@UncleMikeDrop]

I thought it was kind of lame how they based the design of the Xyston Class on the Imperial 1. They should have based the design on the Imperious Class.

[@Laurentxoplex]

Imagine if they used only this instead of the xyston Star destroyer fleet

[@Edenium01]

Where the heck is The Eclipse in TROS anyway? Did they use The Eclipse's parts to make the Xyston ships?

[@nickmalachai2227]

Legends vs Canon. The Eclipse doesn't exist in canon, which is where the Sequel Trilogy exists.

[@alexblazquezvelarde8677]

@@nickmalachai2227 well, it actually exists, we just know it was a Super Star Destroyer that was in the Unknown Regions. It was said in the Aftermath trilogy I believe

[@rhymenoceros3303]

@@nickmalachai2227 The Eclipse does exist in Canon it was mentioned in the Aftermath Trilogy as having been hidden away in the Unknown Regions.

[@akumaking1]

@@nickmalachai2227 The Eclipse technically exists in Disney Canon; it's mentioned in the Aftermath books that it's hiding out in the Unknown regions. What happened to it during the intern into the Sequel trashheap is unknown.

[@chrissonofpear1384]

Generally hinted to be an Executor class so far.

[@MrTwbrien]

Before I make a choice there are two things I need to know. Does the Eclipse suffer the usual Imperial handicap of "we don't need that many gun emplacements on the bottom" and secondly, how well can a Xyston change altitude? That belly gun has issues but with a proper nose-up rise she'd be able to not just hit the Eclipse but drag the beam across it's enormous hull increasing damage done and if that beam can crack a planet I'd bet it would wreck the Eclipse, shields or not. The Imps would finally have the smaller, faster ship advantage..... in a Star Destroyer......

[@JessFromMead]

I feel like the supremacy would have been a more....formidable ship than the xyston.

[@Marinealver]

The Star Wars EU (AKA Legends) >> Di$ney Canon $tar War$ there is no contest Eclipse won.

[@zanezen7441]

Sing it brother

[@deadshot5007]

Bitch fuck off

[@thealexgundam5006]

@@deadshot5007 Someone a bit triggered

[@autismisuncontrollable4925]

The Xyston is scary, but not for the reasons you mentioned.

[@JakeDoesLifting]

Eckhart, idk if you’re still taking suggestions for the ship versus, but if you are, I wanted to see which would win between the Harrower-class Dreadnought, and the Venator-class Star Destroyer. But thanks for the video Eckhart and keep up the awesome content.

[@halempyrion4406]

Couldn't the eclipse just be above the off brand ISD

[@topphatt1312]

When the shot in Star Wars opens really wide and is pointed into empty space: shits about to go from 0 to 100 real fucking quick

[@TheRealCartman1]

I was hoping the Xyston would have to come together into a formation to form one super beam, like how the death star had 8 (?) beams coming together into a central beam.

[@brakdanych4329]

Like species 8472 ships from star trek

[@gracecalis5421]

That would've been cool. And required forethought. Which is probably why they didn't think of it.

[@haydenboisvert7111]

I was expecting the sith fleet to have multiple ships glass a planet in stead of each having a god damn death star

[@thorshammer7883]

#AskEck The Dark Empire vs Yuuzhan Vong.

[@grandace2]

THIS! I'd love to see how hard the Vong would get steamrolled by the Dark Empire :D

[@jameslee6216]

@@grandace2 especially since the Vong can't pull any stupid light-side force shenanigans

[@110100111000]

World Devastators would really piss em off.

[@kaysonoleen5261]

that would be fun to see

[@TheYungDyrude]

Literal genocide, specially if all super weapons are being considered active

[@darthvader2483]

This is a very interesting video but I have been looking forward to this!

[@chrissonofpear1384]

Good. Twice the pride, double the fall...

[@whitworthlime8793]

The invincible Vs an imperial 2. Who would win??

[@brotkannschimmeln2875]

If i remember right he already did that

[@whitworthlime8793]

@@brotkannschimmeln2875 so he did, thanks for the pointer. I did think it sounded familiar. Going to watch it now. 👍👍

[@chrissonofpear1384]

The giant Providence?

[@whitworthlime8793]

@@chrissonofpear1384 Yep admiral trench's flagship. Is been done though.

[@JIMvc2]

Invisible wins. No match

[@quesadilla6106]

No one talks about the fact that the one Xyston we saw destroy a planet is still out there in the galaxy.

[@blackshogun272]

No one also talks about how for a damn fact Rey didn't kill every last Sith (Cultist) in Palpatine's amphitheatre. Those fucks are gonna show there faces again one day with their Sith Emperor and Invasion Fleet catching everyone off guard and starting another Great Galactic War. History repeats itself ya know 💀

[@squarek123]

If Disney wants more cash, they will make Xyston: a star wars story

[@crocs4304]

This is like a Pro player vs pay to win player.

[@IQDESTRUCTOR]

I envisioned (and rationalized) the Eclipse (and Death Star by extension) to be a giant burst of energy, instantly overwhelming the target with a fuck-you-amount of energy, while the Xyston dumped all its energy into one very precise point, opting for a chain reaction via planetary collapse. it also incorporated that whole quintessence phantom energy space magic bullshit which apparently turned Hosnian Prime into a literal mini-star from power overload so there's that too

[@thorshammer7883]

Good thing I don't consider the Disney movies and comics canon to Star Wars. The Expanded Universe is the true canon.

[@brettcardon4552]

Eckhart, I appreciate your attempt to make sense of the nonsensical XYSTON Star Destroyer. It's power output is ridiculous for a ship its size, something the writers make no attempt to explain and comparing it to the Eclipse is effectively comparing the sequel trilogy to the original: there is no contest.

[@thorshammer7883]

#AskEck *Attempt 691* Do the Forerunners vs The Imperium of Man Pre Horus Heresy both civilizations at their prime military power with the Forerunners invading the Imperium.

[@Alan_Skywalker]

Xyston looks like a star destroyer captured by rebels.

[@andrewdowns9047]

Last time I was this early the EU was still canon

[@Mjolnir117]

Andrew Downs Still is to me.

[@sean7456]

It still is, bruh.

[@notablegoat]

Palpatine: I will conquer the UNIVERSE His Astronomers: Yes Emperor that is a realistic goal please don't hurt us again

[@SuicideNeil]

Re: post ep9; I hope Daisy Ridley stays in shape, I have a feeling Disney will come knocking in ~30 years time... :P

[@daviddouglass3606]

I hope not, but Disney is doubling down on making Star Wars a completely worthless brand.

[@shogun2215]

And she'll still be a terrible actress.

[@heavyarms55]

One thing is absolutely certain, the Eclipse is a cool original design and the Xyston is a rehashed model with a new gun hot glued to the bottom.

[@doncalypso]

I would assume the Xyston-class is faster and more maneuverable.

[@casbot71]

*What happens after ROS ?* The big question is does the Xyston cannon technology go mainstream? If that's the case it'll be like Earth in the 19th century with nuclear weapons, minor wars will result in planetary destruction all over the place, and if you're a species that only exist on one planet - goodbye. But mentioning a new trilogy raises an interesting scenerio, with Y-Wings with cannons slung under them one shotting capital ships… should be fun.

[@Lscott-fk2sn]

Spoiler he thinks the eclipse is the winner

[@bluerobin2982]

Bruh

[@bluerobin2982]

Why you spoilin

[@Lscott-fk2sn]

Lol

[@anzaca1]

7:37 SDs are explained to have the same power generation capability as a small star, so I'm not surprised.

[@Raccoonik]

#askeck Do you feel the Tector star destroyer was an improvement over the 1 and 2, by focusing on armor and reactor power? Or is it really missing out by not having a hanger?

[@Jfk2Mr]

I think Tector is somewhere between ISD-I and II (possibly even a bit better than ISD-II), and possibly it came at least few years before designing the latter ship

[@OrDuneStudios]

Tector and secutor are good cause they work to their strengths

[@MaximusOfTheMeadow]

Yes, please and thank you!

[@annihilator_ron7691]

uh yeah, i joined the discord but #captcha-vetification is nonexistant. as in, i literally cannot find it help

[@ht491]

About the question of the day, the ship that destroyed kejimi, I think ended up at Xogul, I’m pretty sure at least that there’s a scene with that same captain, the rising up around the galaxy also shows belators and assertors

[@ChronicAndIronic]

Duh the eclipse wins, its an SSD