Top 10 - Zee is Wrong

[@hypnotoad55]

Tom seemed to think Mike and Roy were wrong more than Zee lol!

[@eddieb8054]

It’s Zee’s curse. Being so perfect, he has to pretend to dislike stuff; so others can hound him about it.

[@revimfadli4666]

You're telling me he actually likes IRL modern jobs as themes?

[@izzathafiz]

The fact that Tom, Roy & Mike were not a united front in hating Zee is proof of how cool Mr. Zee "No Fun" Garcia really is.

[@nothing3376]

Cool second account Zee

[@shadowcouncil9570]

That's Mr. Zeevil to you sir!

[@hucz]

thanks for the spoilers 🙄

[@nothing3376]

@@hucz lmao pls be a joke

[@namelessfire]

Objectively the best intro Dice Tower has ever done. Good job, lads!

[@5ammy13]

Amen brother. Amen...

[@RadishTheFool]

It was amazing.

[@NATOnova]

lol absolutely. what's the name of the song used for this intro?

[@DTChrisYi]

@@NATOnova heh heh, it was a song my family recorded a few years back. We have a tradition of making gag songs, and my brother andI are both metal heads, so: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eIOxkJt4or2Wl7M

[@jonathansteele1801]

I thought the same!

[@Matt-ec1pu]

That intro was great!🤣

[@john-qz3fu]

Yeah it was hilarious

[@AndiVx]

20:50 "I'm making notes for a future video" xD

[@KeithWheelerBooks]

Any guesses on how many times Zee will say “RUUUDE!” in his reaction video?

[@bornofashes]

12 times, 6 of them in the last 30 sec.

[@BC_VORTEX_CHANNEL]

I am going with 50 times.

[@mbrochh82]

This format is genius. Was smiling all the way through it. So entertaining.

[@MartyKane217]

At 21:40 Roy mentions his favorite genre of games and Tom says "attacky games" which is hilarious, but the first time I heard it as "tacky games" which made me laugh so hard!

[@JonReid01]

Zee is the voice of the people!

[@rpm381]

Zee’s opinions are easily the most valuable to me when watching a DT review before buying a game, he’s great!

[@GamerLisa]

Same here more than this 3

[@luiscordoba3247]

No doubt about it

[@Richard-sy1ej]

I agree. If Zee absolutely loves a game, I know that there's a 99% chance it's not for me.

[@ziomalZparafii]

Yup, always happy to see Zee's review. Very precise and in-depth.

[@Manny-M]

Whether I agree or not, his approach is the best in the biz.

[@elayeth]

I do not agree with the idea of dropping a game from 10 to 6 just because other similar game came out.

[@KissellMissile]

I think a fair comparison is the original Spiderman Trilogy. I thought they were great when they first came out, but now I consider them okay, because I have seen how much more you can do with the genre. Sometimes novelty can over inflate an evaluation, so it is not lowering as much as equalizing.

[@Patronux]

yep, that's nonsensical. If you enjoy a game, and then a 2nd Revised Edition comes out with changes in the rules, does that invalidate the enjoyment you have with the previous edition? In any case, both games should have been a 10. Maybe give Agricola a 9.5 just so you can say "I like Caverna better", but dropping to a 6? come on.

[@ThymeKeeper]

I have to disagree with Mike about Deep Sea Adventure. I don't love or hate it, it's just sort of there, but Zee does not rate it lowly "for some reason". He has very specific reasons for hating it. That's true of Zee more than any of them. He can usually opine at length about why he likes or dislikes a game. He rarely just shrugs and says he hates something or falls back on "I don't know, it was just fun" if he likes it or hates it, He tells you WHY.

[@JonReid01]

Hear hear

[@DarthEd77]

I agree with most of what you wrote. Zee is excellent at articulating the reasons for why he likes or dislikes a game. That said, I don't think he's done that with Deep Sea Adventure. The only "reason" I recall that Zee has given for why he dislikes Deep Sea Adventure was when he complained that he scored zero once when he played it.

[@PamWD]

Oh, my husband and I can't stand Deep Sea Adventure.

[@LegoAssassin098]

@@DarthEd77 He mentioned on a top 10 that the cadence is messed up. Everyone drowns round 1, 1 person gets like 2 points next round and everyone else drowns, and then everyone drowns round 3 trying to outdo that guy. That 2 point guy wins. He says that it happens everytime, even when actively trying to avoid that and as such it's unfun. EDIT: It's top 10 turkeys from 3 years ago, Zee's number 5 (37:20) kzbin.info/www/bejne/aHuQl4iNaLKWbaOo=37m20s

[@DarthEd77]

@@LegoAssassin098 Yeah, well, Zee is wrong about that. I've played plenty of games of Deep Sea Adventure, and that is not how even most of the games I've played have turned out. Some? Sure. But not all. And when it does, it's still great fun, IMHO. EDIT: Thanks for the link to his specific comments.

[@ramonosuke]

“My number 8 is a classic, and you can’t hate classics, unless they’re classics I hate, in which case it’s okay.” Damn what a hilariously under rated line lol

[@utahman06]

That intro was incredible. That had Chris Yi’s fingerprints all over it.

[@mornarmornar8752]

That was fun 😂, looking forward to the reaction from Zeevil!

[@nickrehberg7333]

"Top 10 moons!" so funny : )

[@IndianaGeologist]

I love Mike, he brings so much life to the group

[@mattvucu6706]

I’m just so happy Tom kept saying blue moon city instead of blue moon. Love blue moon and that made my day

[@alisabaidukova7288]

I actually am thankful to Zee for mentioning Menara in quite a lot of lists that I ended up bying it and never regreted it. Unlike other dexterity games logical and planning part is as important in it as actual dexterity, or even more. Such a unique game. Such an underrated game or better say overlooked

[@freierfieserfriese]

Menara is a great game. I completely agree.

[@Puddleford]

Tom's wrong about Caverna changing Agricola so much. I can see a small change because something new exists but a drastic change? Nothing changed about Agricola just because Caverna came out.

[@tomasxfranco]

Dropping it to a 9 and putting caverna as a 10 to show the relationship would make sense, but making it a 3 or 6 is too low, IMO.

[@Puddleford]

@@tomasxfranco exactly

[@juleswo2987]

I always feel like the only person who thinks Caverna is just Agricola with extreme unnecessary bloat…

[@pad92011]

waaahahaha... this is fun! darn I miss Sam. He would've been great for this one!

[@codym6376]

Yes, would have loved and still hope for a Sam is wrong video!

[@utahman06]

Tom, I’ve tolerated a lot of your hats, but this one has gotta go brother 😂

[@RadishTheFool]

I wonder if he got it from a Dutch fan. It's that typical shade of orange. Getting it as a gift would explain why he kept it.

[@Michigan1985]

What do you have against wearing the bottom half of a traffic cone on your head?

[@whytemeet]

Mike was savage against Zeevil! Tom makes a great point about Zee only liking horror theme dungeon crawlers, that way always confusing to me too.

[@Grouik]

Very surprised about what Roy said about the randomness of Xia, because it is what we say about Ghost Stories. Mitigate the randomness. We win between 6 or 7 games out of 10. This is a very fun video. Thank you all! Such a joy to listen to you. 😀

[@randalladkins7452]

47:56 - Tom, you may have a point. I just saw Zee review a game called “Let’s Summon an Demon” and rated it an 8 out of 10! You should have waited just a couple of days to do this list!

[@LookAtTheBacon]

Check out his review of Demon Worker lol. He's all about that stuff...😅

[@rachelandryan]

I love Underwater Cities but man I'm with Zee, Pulsar 2849 is some hot (dry) garbage. Tigris & Euphrates on the other hand is an objective masterpiece that deserves a place in everyone's collection.

[@CatInFurnace]

Zee is easily my favorite reviewer on the channel but this has to be my all time favorite DiceTower video.

[@jherrenor]

Roy: Do things to mitigate randomness! Also Roy: Ghost Stories is too lucky and impossible to beat.

[@joshjenson8111]

He's not wrong, ghost stories is terrible

[@jherrenor]

@@joshjenson8111 It's only terrible if you don't like to plan or if you rely on lucky rolls. A lot can be done to mitigate the randomness if you play it correctly instead of hoping for the best every turn.

[@MythicosQc74]

@@joshjenson8111 He and you are wrong, Ghost Stories is a great game.

[@robo3007]

The randomness in the games Roy picked is fair. The randomness in Ghost Stories is not.

[@jean-nicolasgauthier5484]

Should be called "Top 10 Zee is not wrong and Tom take his defense"

[@muskyoxes]

There should have been a link to the Tom is wrong video. Now i have to toil in the minefields and find it myself. (I'll add this note before finishing the video because it won't come up - Zee screwed up the Hostage Negotiator review. He missed the basic strategy of it, then said it sucked because it was just random.)

[@tracieperez2629]

This video always cracks me up! Loved that Mike, Roy, and Tom could not agree on most things about how Zee was wrong. Hilarious!🤣

[@pluvia33]

I agree with Zee on a lot of things, such as Onirim being one of my favorite games of all time. However, I HIGHLY disagree with his general disdain towards deckbuilders!! So glad Tom focused on this point. Why is deckbuilding schlocky and overdone and lazy, but worker placement isn't??? Makes no sense!!! Still love ya Zee! ^_^

[@xtomvideo]

I love the banter you guys on dice tower have over the board games :)

[@max6jay]

I like the concept of the top 10, very fun to watch and the discrepancy makes it hilarious

[@nydaloth]

Roy is wrong about ghost stories. I have seen how most people play GS, and is by relaying too much in the Dice. To get better at GS you have to learn how to rely on the tile powers.

[@dapineaple]

Getting better is an understatement. The game becomes much easier when you stop relying on dice.

[@GrandElemental]

It is hilarious that he states so clearly that Ghost Stories is just randomness (which it obviously isn't, it is easily provable that good players have a much better chance at winning) and then goes nuclear defending the dice fest that is Xia - a game that I also like but is far, FAR more random and reliant on dice rolls.

[@viperfrag]

Zee likes Under Falling Skies though, that's a CGE game.

[@n8zimphotography]

This was a really fun concept for a top 10, I hope they do other reviewers. Though I will say I agree with Zee on most of these rankings, should this have been "Zee is right!"?

[@TheOldMan-75]

I don't have the same taste in games as Zee so I dislike most games he likes but I always know where he's coming from and understand his reasoning. He's a very good reviewer who just doesn't share my taste.

[@jameswoodard4304]

So...I assume based on his statements that Roy was aware that "Zee-Vil" was just about to uplaod his review of a game called "Let's Summon Demons," right? Cause if not...I think we might be on to something 🤔. Holy cow, guys! I was joking, but then I watched the Let's Summon Demons review and it's literally a game about collecting and sacrificing children and small animals to conjure demons. Zee gave it an 8, and said he really liked the theme. ... I think we may need an intervention.

[@vindachio1]

Starting to think a Mike is wrong video would be too easy. Might have better luck doing a Mike is right video.

[@horoyoh]

The intro is so good, I didn’t expect laughing straight from the beginning.

[@bullfrog417]

I feel like this was Roy's Top 10 Epic Space games.

[@gamegraves]

this series is just the best

[@ThomasHelms]

Considering how much crossover there was for 30 picks, Zee must be pretty right on most stuff.

[@jeremiahhammer2282]

Just one more reason (like we really needed any more!) why this is my favorite crew in all of gaming coverage. Tom gets into such a funny character mode during Roy’s #8, it completely reminds me of myself. I just feel a true affinity with these characters, and I can’t wait to finally meet you all in person one day. Looking forward to Zee’s response video! 🤣

[@MartyKane217]

Yes! I loved Tom's "bizarro preacher" character

[@undersci]

Tyrants of the Underdark! Fantastic deckbuilder

[@Tibbroar]

Tom clearly the only way you can redeem your reputation is to play Spirit Island live and be incredibly enthusiastic about it the entire time.

[@boardgameknight2791]

So much better than a roast. Love it!

[@CB-yh3db]

First time I saw “exploding dice” was in Chaos in the Old World.

[@jacobleonhardt4421]

Zee is fantastic. But I also like how close of friends these guys are that they can make fun of each other like this.

[@gamera2351]

Me after seeing Tom is Wrong: "Wow. Tom is wrong about a lot of the things they said." Me after seeing Zee is Wrong: "Its 3 guys complaining that Zee doesn't like a bunch of bad games."

[@jamesjacobthomson6198]

Spirit Island should be on this list!! :)

[@eisforelbowsmash]

I very much enjoy the banter and there was good energy, but I feel as if this list should be called "30 reasons why Zee has better taste than the rest of the dice tower". I agree with him on 90% of this list even though he wasn't there to defend himself.

[@Calistake047]

I knew Pulsar was going to be on this list the second I saw the title, lol.

[@tinstargames]

Menara is amazing! It’s not silly!

[@MeanNGreen17]

I don’t know who was the first to use exploding dice, but Chaos in the Old World did 5 years before Arcadia Quest.

[@robo3007]

Eric Lang still designed that one though. He just refined it with Arcadia Quest!

[@mattrounds1]

"His heart is two sizes too small, as is his, uh, yes... next..." 😆

[@jimgrant9081]

Hilarious intro and great video. So great how you can all joke and take a joke for entertainment value! So funny that a few of his low ratings might have been caused by "bad plays" with particular people that might have triggered a little contrarianism.

[@tylerbrown9797]

It is far past time someone took this cruel tyrant down a notch!!

[@Atlas-FM8]

This list reminded me of how right Zee is about things 😂

[@benjaminspears8488]

20:14 Tom’s reaction when Mike talks about Modern Art! 😀

[@DarthEd77]

How about a Catchupoolza for Duel of Ages II? Roy and Mike haven't played it. I bet Chris hasn't either. It would also be interesting to hear Tom's thoughts on it in 2021.

[@jeffwmoore]

When Fabled Fruit came out, everyone was like, "This game was made for Zee," and Zee was, "Nah." I love Fabled Fruit. Zee is wrong.

[@xavierpaquin]

Never understood Zee's love for Neuroshima Hex, so average

[@jamesnelson768]

Terror in Meeple City isn't a great game.... but it's ridiculously fun. I think it's probably a 5 as a game, but a 9 for how much fun it is.

[@chuckm1961]

Roy: regarding Xia: “Be smart. The game gives you ways to mitigate the randomness.” Roy: regarding Ghost Stories: “it’s all luck.” ??????????

[@francisd8650]

It's possible for one game to mitigate luck enough and for another to not do it enough, I don't see what the issue is

[@chuckm1961]

@@francisd8650 The issue is that Ghost Stories provides multiple ways to mitigate luck, but Roy mentioned none of them and specifically implied that there are none by saying the game is all luck. I am aware of the concept of things having gradients.

[@EpicGamingNight]

@@chuckm1961 yeah I agree! There are ways to mitigate for sure. I’m just not a fan of really hard co-ops and most of this is just joking around anyway! 🤷‍♂️

[@DarthEd77]

I've never won a game of Ghost Stories. If you're a grandmaster at Ghost Stories, I'm sure you can probably win using pure skill, but I think Roy is saying (and I kind of agree with him) that it's so difficult that the only way you can usually win is if you get lucky with how the cards come out, regardless of how skillfully you play. I'm sure that's a bit of an exaggeration, but there's no doubt that it's one of the most difficult cooperative games out there.

[@chuckm1961]

@@DarthEd77 I suppose there are some deck set ups that would be impossible or nearly impossible to win. On the other hand, given a typical draw of cards, better players are going to beat it much more often than less experienced players. No doubt, it is more difficult than your average cooperative game. They did not include an easy or super easy mode.

[@Iamwrongbut]

Best intro of all time😂

[@kirkwagner461]

Onirim is best as an app, because the app does all the shuffling. I think I'd get tired of it real fast as a physical card game.

[@dancondonjones]

Mike is right about Modern Art - at least righter than the others. That game is easily a. 9/10!

[@TabletopToolbox]

MIKE is RIGHT! Modern Art is FANtastic! I don't usually say this, but I don't think Tom and Roy "get" this one... :)

[@mydemon]

Zee should film his reaction while watching this

[@middleclassboardgamer]

Oh, there will be a reaction video. Tom’s reaction to the “Tom is Wrong” video is great, but Zee’s reaction to Tom’s reaction is EPIC!

[@mikaiou6159]

Zee just quietly sit back and watched these guys fighting each other lol.

[@robo3007]

Giving Arcadia Quest a 5 is madness!!! It's easily my favourite game of all time, pure fun in a box.

[@Tenebyss]

I’m in such a weird place with Zee because I think he’s the most entertaining member of this crew and I like the breakdown he does in his reviews, but I disagree with him the most of any of the dice tower members

[@leadbones]

Same.

[@AdamJorgensen]

Yes

[@dnaseb9214]

That opening 10/10.

[@juvigoat2168]

Thumbs up for the rockin’ hilarious intro!

[@thekradeht]

Hilarious video! Zee is like Data and Lor's creator from TNG, Often-Wrong-Soong! Either way, I love Zee, I love the channel, and this video is even better and funnier than usual. Thanks for the great content.

[@xxbriguyxx]

Tom seemed like a Zee apologist to a lot of Roy’s and Mike’s picks. Kind of counter-productive to the video’s premise, Tom….

[@loupdo7843]

I like Roy but whatever the top 10 is, it feel that the theme is top 10 space games

[@DailyGolazos]

I think a Tom is Wrong list would be quite a fun sequel.

[@hanng1242]

Zee pities the fool who forgot to add gold chains to the modified picture.

[@EfrainRiveraJunior]

Mike and Roy are too nice for a list like this. You needed to bring Sam as an invited guest.

[@MoriMemento117]

Yes on Chvatil! And on CGE! I've been a fan of Vlaada since Mage Knight. More recently, I've found myself buying CGE games as they come out in a way I do not do with any other studio. Their games are always just so unique and creative... but also designed very precisely with an eye on tactical decision making. It's hard for me to describe, but if I were on a desert island with only one studio's games to keep me company (and a friend), I'd probably choose CGE. Ahem, but I digress. I love Zee's opinions, but when it comes to the games from a certain central European country, I kindly agree to disagree.

[@suorastas1]

Hey I’m from Finland and I love Zee.

[@danielcraig6615]

ROY is totally right about Ghost Stories. I asked for this game last Christmas based on the rave reviews from Zee and Tom. I was really disappointed. Seemed very luck based. No worries though it just wasn't for me. They have been more right than wrong. :-P

[@TheEricBooth]

We need to get Roy looking at the camera more.

[@Indubitably14]

Just proved why Zee has been my favorite reviewer for nearly a decade. The app versions of Onirim and Neuroshima Hex are among my MOST played games (we're talking in the several thousand plays). Blue Moon is fantastic and the games they were crying about are ones I'm either no longer interested in or have no interest in playing haha

[@JJ_TheGreat]

So Zee is wrong about Blue Moon?... I think not!

[@kevinbhieey9188]

Zee also doesn't like having too many choices. He prefers simple (boring) Carcassonne to the actually-thinky Isle of Skye. It's something he complains about a lot and if he mentions it in a review, then I'm forced to discard his opinion, and I do agree with him a lot otherwise. Though he has been slipping in his old age. The Crew is amazing. Diamonds is meh. MEH!!

[@JeffGoris]

Blue Moon City is one of the best area majority games, ever.

[@dandurkin9735]

I think there was a mistake: this "Zee Really was Right" video got mislabeled. I enjoyed it nonetheless - thank you!

[@lupitajones7]

This was so much fun!

[@davidlewis5312]

He is wrong in his argument that analyst paralysis, which I like to call STALLING, isn't a problem.

[@xshadowscreamx]

‘’There is a few deck builders’’ -Tom

[@vodkaskoda]

I tend to disagree with Zee more than anyone. Mike is Right!!

[@TheProteanGeek]

Nah Tales of Arabian Nights Zee is the correct one. It is not even a game. It is so boring that I would rather stare at a wall than play it.

[@JeffGoris]

Tom: "I was pretty close to giving Agricola a 10 and then when Caverna came out, I dropped Agricola to a 6." I no longer have any faith in Tom's ratings whatsoever - there is no consistency. I understand if he thinks Caverna is the better game, it would get a 10 and Agricola a 9, maybe 8, but does Caverna coming out suddenly make Agricola worse than all other games rated 7-9? At the very least, he would have to rerate every other worker placement game a 6 or below if.

[@Kalahee]

I like Onirim, but I do agree on the artwork. It's not bad, but I'd like a graphic spinoff.

[@adriang9881]

When you go out to prove Zee is wrong and only prove that everyone else is more wrong….

[@maizetoken377]

Vlaada Chvátil is my favorite board game designer, hands down.

[@nickhayes1626]

Most of the time I agree with Mike, but he’s wrong on Neuroshima Hex. It’s definitely not a 10, but it’s a 7.5-8 easily.