Trope Talk: Damsels In Distress

[@breakinggreens]

My technique for this is: "Can the Damsel be replaced with a particularly expense vase?" if yes, rewrite or add some meaningful damsel scenes. If no... cool that's alright then.

[@Jasonwolf1495]

Chris Ray but what if the vase is magic and voiced by Ryan Renolds? I'd rather save that

[@mosesa.weaver3058]

Chris Ray: BWAHAHAHAHHAH!!!!😂😂😂🤣🤣🤣 WOW! Seriously, that one got me!!!😂

[@dragatus]

You make a compelling argument.

[@sailormonet19941]

Chris Ray oooohhhhh you went there!!!! 😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@deadaccount2968]

Now someone needs to make a "save the princess" story, but the "princess" is actually a vase titled princess. Bonus points for making the hero very confused at this turn of events.

[@ZombieChimpanzee]

"Escape is impossible." "bite me." great interaction.

[@annandres8483]

I would say that

[@epicwalrus7183]

Just don't say that if the one damseling you happens to be a vampire, that would end badly XD

[@Number1masksfan]

True

[@sassylittleprophet]

Someone should write that, where the damselled character riles up a vampire so much that they lose it and go in to mutilate/torture/kill/destroy them, but then the damsel turns into a vampire and massacres everyone, finishing right when their team arrives and is like, "See? I told you I can take care of myself."

[@plantlover3741]

@Epic Walrus I was actually thinking about making that a plot point lol

[@QuarionGalanodel]

One of my favorites of the "we don't see the damsel just the rescue" is when the comes to an empty cell and finds that the damsel has escaped on their own and now NOBODY hero or villain knows where the fork they are.

[@xxweirdofromspacexx1119]

I have an idea to put in my story that combines a bunch of ideas because I’ve been binge watching her trope talks, this story is gonna be a beautiful mess made of approximately 15,000 ideas from just trope talks and people’s comments on said trope talks. I love it.

[@QuarionGalanodel]

Another of my favorites: R=rescuers D=damseled character R: Friend we're here to rescue you! D: That's great! . . . From what?

[@ryankier5731]

I had an Idea about the rescuers getting there and the captors being in the cells with the damsel being nowhere to be found.

[@PlaystationSimmer]

@@QuarionGalanodel I need this to be the general premise for the next Mario game. Mario goes to rescue Peach from Bowser, but due to a misunderstanding, reaches her only to find her and Bowser chilling playing videogames and she didn't need rescuing at all

[@somedragonbastard]

@@PlaystationSimmer ...forbidden mario kart/mario party lore

[@Zelda00Gamer]

We never would've gotten Zuko as the Blue Spirit had Aang not been damseled!

[@hadeskingoftheunderworld7010]

True but aang attempted to and almost escaped as well as saving Zuko several times durring the escape

[@Rainbowthewindsage]

@@hadeskingoftheunderworld7010 yes because they also never forgot Aang is also a badass. As far as damsels in distress storylines go, I'd say that episode is a pretty good way of going about it. I could go on about how great that episode from the angles of character development, story telling, and suspense but I won't because then I'll have a huge long unreadable comment.

[@hadeskingoftheunderworld7010]

@@Rainbowthewindsage avatar as "hello future me" puts it is all things holy in Wrighting its one of my favorite shows

[@Rainbowthewindsage]

@@hadeskingoftheunderworld7010 I watch the Hello Future Me too, and I agree, he's completely right about that.

[@mirjanbouma]

@@Rainbowthewindsage the writing of AtlA is something else though. So much subversion of tropes, such depth ❤️

[@madmalkavian3857]

I don't know why I just feel like it would be funny to see a damsel in distress situation where the damsel is just too lazy to escape. Hero: *sees damsel lazily reading a book in a jail cell* what are you doing!? Why haven't you tried to escape!? Damsel: meh, you were gonna come get me anyway, so I'd figure I'd just get some rest and wait. *lockpicks the door and walks out* we going or what?

[@Ana-sh9oj]

The closer I know to that is a princess who was kidnaped and is okay with it because now she doesn't need to work and can sleep all day. She gets out of her cell like it's normal, usually to get materials to make her bed better, and then goes back and locks herself in the cell again. It's a manga called Maou-jou de Oyasumi, if it picks your interest.

[@madmalkavian3857]

Ana P thanks for the recommendation. I'll check it out.

[@dracocrusher]

Kind-of unrelated, but I love that there's just a scene in Seven Deadly Sins where the princess is kidnapped with the group's pig mascot character and after being like "Don't worry, I'm sure the main guy can save us because he's always there!" the pig just breaks down the door like instantly because he just had to take a shit. Just throwing that out there because I think it's probably my favorite subversion of the trope, lol. Just like "I'm sure he'll save us...." "OH GOD, WHERE'S THE TOILET!?!?" *solves the problem instantly*

[@garbageOwO]

One of my favorites was when Gilthunder (evil knight who is actually good) used his lightning shackles on the main group in the Forest of White Dreams and Gil thought that he had captured them for good. After a while Diane and Meliodas (a thirty foot tall giantess and the son of the freaking demon king) were like "nah, we've had enough" and casually broke the shackles.

[@cOmAtOrAn]

Princess Fiona in Shrek does something similar.

[@atticusv668]

I remember reading a post on Tumblr from a disabled girl who said she loved this trope because it sends a message that even despite a person's lack of ability, someone else would still want to care for them and help them. Which is cute...

[@nathanjereb9944]

Nice

[@johnwebb2736]

Awe😂

[@sarascarpati887]

this is relatable,tbh

[@eclypsaqueen7013]

nice

[@IsabellaMathew]

That is so wholesome

[@StarrTheWitch]

Dasmel saved by a villian working for his own motives AVATAR THE LAST AIRBENDER

[@Zappygunshot]

Good guys get damseled by bad guy who turns out to be good guy wanting to teach protagonist valuable lesson but goes about it in a weird way AVATAR THE LAST AIRBENDER Come to think of it, Avatar's had some really good damselations over the course of its run.

[@mapleseerope9381]

Zap Gun A:TLAB is just kind of amazing huh

[@hayleybartek8643]

"I'm not a woman!" Well, the standard trope would have you be one. And, you did reincarnate as a girl.

[@awsomesaucekirby]

Sammi Sydney I dropped my ice cream when I saw mokuba

[@ZeldaWolf2000]

awsomesaucekirby I love Mokie! 😀😀😀 He's my favorite! Plus, when he's capable, i.e., soul not out of body, he gets himself out of trouble the best he can, i.e. sheet rope in duelist Kingdom. Plus, I love the dynamic with his brother. Humanization for the win! 😀😀

[@AngelFace.273]

This helped me put into words one of my issues with the live-action Cinderella remake. When the stepmother locks her in her room, Cinderella not only resigns herself immediately to being damseled and does absolutely nothing to encourage getting rescued, she shows no distress whatsoever. In the original Disney Cinderella, she does everything she can to escape, even though she herself accomplishes very little to do so. She runs to the door to try and stop it from closing, she yanks on the door desperately trying to get it open, she screams and begs to be let out, she frantically encourages her animal friends to help her, and she comes up with a solution when those friends run into trouble before they can get her out. She’s the neo-damsel here, and you appreciate her struggle and ACTUAL DISTRESS. So when live-action Cinderella just sung to herself and danced around the room and gazed out the window, not even noticing her animal friends trying to help her right in front of her, it INFURIATED me to no end

[@scp--297]

So true. Like really girl? How is this better? The cartoon vision actually tries to get out and she does though all her hard work. The live action one decides to sing because she doesn't care or something? Yet she free (by someone else), they act like we should be celebrating. No, I celebrated the other one because she made a effort to get out, get the people to notice her and got her other shoe just in case the stepmother has a other plain to stop her.

[@chellismcelveen499]

In Ever After, the movie outright implies that Danielle (the Cinderella character) cannot leave because she has no where else to go or could end up being in a whorehouse. She also stood up to her abusers many times in the films and was whipped for punching one of her stepsisters. Near the end her stepmother sells her to a perverted nobleman out of spite, which shows just how dangerous Cinderella's world was. Danielle eventually frees herself by threatening the nobleman with a sword. EDIT 1/9/19 As for the live action Cinderella, she actually stood up to her stepmother twice I believe in the film. Near the end Tremaine found out and attempted to blackmail Cindy into getting close to the prince enough so Tremaine and her family could rise through the ranks and secure power for themselves (which is actually treason), but of course Cindy refuses, putting the prince and the kingdom before her own happiness and chance to escape. Right before Tremaine locked her up, Cindy asked her why she was so cruel. It's heavily implied that Tremaine was just like Cindy herself as a young woman but after her tragedies she became cold and bitter; Cindy would have been exactly like her stepmother had she succumbed to that same level of despair and bitterness. It was also her singing that led the Captain of the Guard to her cell, and when Tremaine tried to stop her, she makes it very clear that she was never was and never be her mother. At the end she forgave her, with Tremaine in defeat knowing that she couldn't twist Cindy into a bitter reflection of herself. In many way the 2015 Cinderella was just as powerful as her animated counterpart. Cindy would rather be locked up but still remain kind even still than giving into her despair and Tremaine's demands. The story is basically always remain kind, and just because you are bitter doesn't give you the right to inflict pain onto innocent people.

[@EmaA-pu7nc]

Well, during the time of the conception of the original Cinderella, women had no rights. Historically, and during their time, she’d be translated as a feminist, because she rebelled against the wishes of her abusers, who are also her family. But during this time, sadly, people see her as a classic damsel, without realizing the historical context behind it. She’s basically an ancestor for all of the modern-day feminists.

[@locasaly563]

What was she supposed to do? Jump out of the window??

[@AtomicF0x]

Wow, what an assessment. I never saw the live action one, but as I predicted with most of the live action _refakes_ , it doesn't sound good, even from just that takeaway. Good on the writers and artists of the original Cinderella to portray a level of genuine distress that the audience can readily invest themselves in.

[@Michael-Hammerschmidt]

at 11:42 when she mentioned "your damsel can be rescued by a straight up villain working for their own ends," I was entirely caught off guard by the fact she DIDN'T show Aang getting Blue Spirited away

[@Tree_-wp5zn]

Trope talk is truly nothing without Avatar.

[@rainbowwigglecactus6605]

@@Tree_-wp5zn truuuuue. Avatar does all the tropes, all correctly

[@Gloomdrake]

Daangsel in Distress

[@jillianh7565]

I think that’s a clever idea and could honestly see this happening in my groups dnd campaign. I am often put in the damsel in distress position because I’m in the wrong place at the wrong time. If Count Strahd Von Zarovich rescues me from whatever situation I’m in, it would leave the party scared, confused etc.

[@jhulpthefox]

SAME

[@alanepithet2931]

I... kind of want to see a story about a knight in shining armor trying to save a big bag of money now. Something that takes the entire story concept that goes with that and mercilessly satirizes it. That'd be a lot of fun, actually. Like. Have everyone else be cynical and hardbitten, and the knight in shining armor play up to the ideal with waaay too much passion about it, have the villain monologue about the things he or she is going to do to/with the big bag of money, have a dramatic scene where it turns out the knight is just as greedy as the villain because when he saves the big bag of money, he goes for the kiss with it. The whole 10 yards, really.

[@snowwonder9814]

Beowulf is a knight character who kinda does focus on saving a big pile of money he won, actually

[@SennaHawx]

Don Quixote?

[@robertlewis6915]

I don't think you can say he's an example of a person in for the money, since that never seems to be his primary motivation (though I htink glory might be one fo his big motives, as is cultuarlly appropriate), and he actually dies fighting for his kingdom's prosperity, not for any wealth of his own.

[@ethanotoroculus1060]

Wario once literally tossed the princess he just got done saving aside for her bag of infinite money.

[@hellothere2464]

Al this is kinda six of crows??

[@shadiversity]

Excellent justice given to an age old trope, love it!

[@phenjaws569]

Shadiversity hey Shad love your stuff as well

[@LimeyLassen]

Remember the golden rule: There are no bad tropes!

[@AlucardNoir]

I have to disagree Shad. Her take is great if the Damsel is an already established character and is either the protagonist or one of the main characters of the story being told. If she isn't... well, she might as well be a McGuffin for all that it would matter to the hero. She is someone that has to be saved, something that has to be done. Be it because the hero is good or because he is getting paid to save her or because he needs her for something.

[@forestelfranger]

+AlucardNOir In cases like that, the writer would need to make reaching the goa and the effects it would have, more interesting than the person being saved. Like why was this group hired to save the prince from the black knight? Maybe one of them needed money to buy a cure for a disease or get treatment for a sick family member. Maybe their family business is failing and it means so much to their father or mother, that they take a job no the side to help keep the business running. That and you are going by if they are a she. Lets not forget prison breaks are a thing and well armies. If two nations clash a few times, surely they are going have taken a few prisoners and well depending on the setting. Might be all or majority male. Which the hero or main character breaks and saves their soldiers from being prisoners of war. Which why could be any number of reasons, kindness, to gather a army big enough to take on the big bad or something else. Well to put it a better way. Like super hero like spider man. Classic spider man not current comic spider man. Where the main focus is more on how will the hero reaction. Are they worry they might fail, are they cocky and sure they can't? What happens if they fail and someone dies, how will they react? For well in super hero stories, given how often someone needs to be saved. Some of them are just going to end up as minor or background characters. Which given the most iconic version of this trope is someone trapped in a dungeon or jail. Well i do see a few people every now and then who go character can't break out on their own and that means they are a failure as a character purely do to that or in some cases it demeans a whole gender. Which one thing often seems to be forgotten, when i see that point brought up. The point of a jail, when someone bring up that point. When the point of a jail or dungeon is to keep someone lock away. Where if everyone was able to break out on their own. It would kind of defeat the point of a jail and bring up many questions. Like why does anyone still build jails or why does no one build a jail that works and does it job? In the case of a more super power character, why where they taken to a jail that was not design to hold someone with their kind of abilities and powers? That or well the Batman question, like why does no one have a issue with these villains like the Joker slaughter countless people, escape slaughter countless people again and repeat until forever. Which to be clear, yeah this last bit had nothing to do with you. Just something i wanted to bring up and through it might be slightly related to the topic at hand. Given people who tend to want characters to break out of a jail or dungeon on their own, no matter what. Tend to forget the point about a dungeon.

[@yogsothoth7594]

Its a good one but I can be over used. Star wars keeps bloody doing it and its completely removed the intimidation factor from its major villains.

[@teasmish]

Gotta love when your damseled character undamsels themselves but no one even noticed they were gone

[@liv.s.]

*That's just what happens to me when I get kidnapped in real life!*

[@howdypartner8326]

*CURSE YOU, PARRY THE PLATYPUS!*

[@laurdesz9050]

//wally west escaping the speed force that one time//

[@laurdesz9050]

ALSO: THATS JUST TRAUMA BABY Gods when this acts on self worth issues the character already had??? Abiut no one actually caring abt them or the fact that they're, or at least they think they are, incredibly replacable???? GAH THE ANGST!!!! I LOVE IT!!!

[@alexs5814]

This is the feeling i got every time there was an episode with all the pokemon doing something without their humans. Obviously Meowth had to be there for exposition but otherwose only us behind the fourth wall knew what happened to the 'mons and it was nice to see Pik and crew have some agency of their own.

[@Trust751]

Hero 1: ‘Hey, partner, you wanna give me a hand breaking out of this Citadel-of-Doom or what?’ Hero 2: ‘You know, I kinda actually don’t want to…’ 1: ‘…Are you serious?’ 2: ‘I mean, it’d just be insulting. Look at this. We have personalized containment cells. PERSONALIZED CONTAINMENT CELLS. These people cared so much that they designed and built holding cells specifically for you and I. All of the effort that must’ve gone into that. I think this is the nicest thing anyone’s ever done for me.’ 1: ‘I can’t believe you’re actually fawning over this.’ 2: ‘I can’t believe you’re not!’

[@letmetakeajormungandrattha8591]

Amazing

[@feihtyt2063]

Honestly me. I would do this

[@Pastshelfdate]

Thank you! Thais is so much fun! :D

[@shtuffs]

perfect example of stockholm syndrome

[@shtuffs]

@Nadia Syeda lmao

[@dimitri6387]

"Bestie smackdown lightning round" is possibly the best thing I have ever heard.

[@JennyBlaze253]

Every word out of Red's mouth is the best thing I've ever heard. XD

[@Number1masksfan]

True

[@vaughnjohnson8767]

Got that right

[@juliewinchester1488]

"Spot the Fetish" Makes me realize that of all the fetish stories I've read, damseling is... _surprisingly_ common. Like, damn.

[@IAmTheStig32]

That's exactly it. Damsel in distress started out as a money-making scheme for pulp story writers - a lot of these seedy magazines (like Weird Tales, the one that launched the careers of HP Lovecraft and Robert E Howard) paid a writer a bonus for having a scene from their story illustrated on the cover, and because "sex sells", lurid depictions of sweaty, scantily-dressed women chained up tended to sell well. So writers began including a damsel in distress scene in every story they wrote. It all started with money and the objectification and sexism grew from that.

[@MiniEarthmoverAriel]

@@IAmTheStig32 I actually like the damsel in distress stuff because I just want to be in the damsel's place for some reason. I don't see it as sexual but I hate that the trope is so overused and so bad when used incorrectly. (giving the characters no personality other then needing to be saved etc.) I just want to share my opinion on the damsel stuff, I might be feminist and might disagree with it when I get older sure but I just watch too many Disney movies.

[@josephperez2004]

-thinks back to how often April O'Neil got captured and tied up in the 90s TMNT- Oh dear...

[@Isokatmydydecsf]

@@josephperez2004 ...yeah.

[@rogthepirate4593]

And I mean, it's not like there's necessarily anything wrong with that. Even though there are definitely some *weird* fetishes out there, guess the occasional bit of bondage is pretty tame by comparison.

[@ginge641]

Another variant of this trope: the damsel has been captured and seems fine when rescued. Then, it is revealed either they were convinced to join the antagonists while captured and they're a double agent now or that they were always a double agent and used the capture as a way to deliver intel to the antagonists.

[@BigAmericanGirlFan]

That particular case was used for the A-Squad rangers in Power Rangers SPD and is set up using the show's psychometric character to note something is off

[@Stratelier]

They already discussed this in the video, where the damsel in question has turned/always been "evil" and this is only learned/revealed at their moment of rescue.

[@DavidbarZeus1]

@@Stratelier No, that's SIMILAR to what Ginge described, but not necessarily the same. In Ginge's version, the hero doesn't know the damsel is a villain until much later. For example, if you've ever seen BBC's Merlin series, Morganna does this to Guinevere in … I want to say Season 5, but Arthur and Merlin don't realize it for several episodes

[@rhiannonmeier4647]

And it's a wonderful plot twist

[@coyraig8332]

Or they rescued the wrong guy

[@acornm4121]

Rewatching this reminds me of one of the first stories I wrote where a character gets damselled and while the rest of the group is thinking of how to break them out the damselled character walks into the room and asks what they are doing when they ask him what happened he tells them that the villain was so busy monloguing that they forgot to actually lock the cell door

[@amandak.5967]

Lol, villain monologue- it backflips on them all the time

[@mixedmango2870]

Can I read this please

[@aperson1938]

Yes

[@the_katzy]

Publish. It.

[@sheevpalpatine1105]

you easily made 99% of all written damsels look like Peach

[@TheRoomforImprovement]

There’s another variation worth noting: The Reluctant Damsel, where the damsel surrenders to the enemy as a way to protect their allies. An example that comes to mind is Nico Robin from One Piece.

[@Hello-og]

The doctor (who's name I forget) in the first Halo Wars game allows herself to be taken prisoner to save Sergeant Forge, she does end up escaping without aid. Although she almost immediately nearly gets infected by the Flood, but gets saved by Forge.

[@PlaystationSimmer]

Aang did that at the start of Avatar to protect the Water tribe

[@cjlamb1687]

Also in the Mummy (1999) the main female lead surrender herself to the Mummy to save Brandon Fraiser.

[@jonathankent1517]

And then there's a variant I call the "Lost Damsel" where the heroes basically fail to rescue the damsel for whatever reason and the damsel dies or whatever. An example of which is also from One Piece, Portgas D. Ace.

[@missdemeanor608]

@@PlaystationSimmer yes

[@Vespuchian]

I'm surprised there aren't more video games that let you play as the damsel, perhaps switching back and forth between the damsel and rescuer(s) as each group does things that makes the job of the other group easier, culminating in a rescue that wouldn't have worked if either group had to do it alone.

[@PthariensFlame]

Broken Age did this reasonably well, especially in Part 2.

[@tylerr472]

Paper mario: the thousand year door is probably my favorite example of this.

[@pokekitty1]

you might like the ps2 game ico the first game created by the developers of the last guardian on the ps4

[@temptationofmemories]

Dragon Age Origins let's you either break out yourself, or wait for the others to come and rescue you.

[@HenriFaust]

@@tylerr472 This happens in both _The Thousand Year Door_ and the original _Paper Mario._

[@GiulianaBruna]

Perfect Damsel in distress: Mr Incredible. Badass damsel, become Broken damsel at some point, use the time escaping to find information and make an important ally, got rescued and learned that he doesn´t have to work alone...

[@windwaker105]

Such a good movie

[@Damascene_]

the incredibles is like the secind best pixar movie behind ratatouille. both were made by the same guy. wilding

[@octo448]

@@Damascene_ Placing The Incredibles as second to Ratatouille is a HOT take, and placing both above the original Toy Story is an even HOTTER take.

[@Damascene_]

@@octo448 ratatouille is a massive comfort movie of mine since im an artist. while the incredibles is technically better i cant help but see the former as higher in my mental list lawl

[@mxpronounced3224]

I really love when strong badass characters become a damsel in distress, and they have no choice but to sit with their thoughts. For some reason it feels really comforting seeing a hero needing some help too.

[@magnarcreed3801]

I’d hate that. Granted if you spend your entire life relaying on yourself… you don’t get to play damsel.

[@avivastudios2311]

as long as the person who kidnaps them is super powerful and you can believe the badass is in trouble

[@Maritimesgestein]

@@avivastudios2311 a god kidnapped you would probably work.

[@TheEtherny]

My favorite damsel is Esmeralda from The Hunchback of Notre Dame, she's basically all of them mixed together (except the broken one) it takes 3/4 of the movie to actually capture her even though that was the antagonist's goal in the first 20 minutes and when she's captured she's still herself and would rather burn than submit to a man she hates. It's obvious she can't save herself but she's never in distress waiting to be rescued, she was ready to die a painful death and this is what pushes Quasi to his limits. This never felt out of place and she was a fully fleshed out character who's badassery and damseling moved the story/character development forward while making sense.

[@whoknows7968]

Burning herself alive- THIS WAS IN A DISNEY MOVIE?!

[@mirjanbouma]

@@whoknows7968 you know, Disney has toned down a lot of their source material in their adaptation to screen, but there's still a lot of intense stuff. It's only often implied instead of spelled out or shown. Do you know how many people (mainly villains) fall to their deaths? The bad guy in Oliver and co gets hit in the head by a TRAIN. The villain in Mulan gets blown into teeny tiny beautiful pieces. And the scene where they discover the army is horrifying even without the actual show if corpses.

[@AegixDrakan]

@@whoknows7968 She doesn't burn herself. The villain pulls your typical "I have you now, my pretty. Either marry me or I will burn you at the stake", and Esmeralda spits in his face, prompting him to light the pyre. ...That said, The Hunchback of Notre Dame is pretty damn dark even for golden age disney.

[@whoknows7968]

@@AegixDrakan Yeah, it was the suicide implication that made me wonder how the hell that made it past scripting. I bet that movie is going to get a lot more attention after what happened to the Notre Dame.

[@c.d.dailey8013]

Emeralda is definitely one of the better damsels. She rescues Quasimodo in the Festival of Fools. She rescues Pheobus when the mill gets burned down. She rescues both at once in the Court of Miracles, when Clopin tries to hang them. I prefer different characters bringing thier own strengths to the table, so nobody is like dead weight. Having characters rescue each other is a good way to do it. I do like how strong and compassionate Esmeralda is. She had to deal with both racism and sexism. On top of that she also supports other outcasts.

[@werwolfnate]

Oooh Idea! What if in one story the whole damsel in distress thing becomes this elaborate plan by the heroes. Where the damsel is regularly kidnapped and the heroes play along with it and keep rescuing them . They do this because they're playing long term to infiltrate the base and completely annihilate it. Turns out the damsel plays the classic damsel but is actually a master of infiltration and subterfuge, using the multiple kidnappings as covers to pick and prod the bases defenses keeping a map in their head. When in the finale this is revealed and the "damsel" commands the heroes forces with their in depth knowledge of how the bad guys tick. It plays into the unexpectedly competent damsel, while subverting the classic version of the trope by making it intentional. I don't know if that's been used anywhere it just popped into my head.

[@carolinemcgovern4488]

Omg that's awesome!-

[@piggylady225]

Ooh, I LIKE it! You, my good sir, have just given me (and at least 20 other people) a plot idea!

[@shadowpod13]

Nathon Loring It's either Gaigin Goomba or The Game Theorists that did a vid about Princess Peach and that she's actually supper powerful, but she lets herself get kidnapped for the fun of it and so she can get rescued. Definitely give it a watch.

[@twi1875]

Can I write that for you?

[@lunab541]

This is so awesome! But how and for how long can the heroes, the focus of the narrative, hide from the audience that they know what they are doing? It would sure strike as odd if no one ever talked about the plan in the course of the story.

[@danielhale1]

I liked the parts in Paper Mario where Peach keeps sneaking out and finding out useful information for Mario, or sending him items to help him on his journey. Peach has things to do other than sitting around, it shows some character and initiative that we'd expect from someone used to leading a country, and it ties in nicely with the rest of the plot.

[@IndustrialParrot2816]

I was about to say that

[@catbatrat1760]

"that we'd expect from someone used to leading a country" Oh, I didn't even think about that aspect of it.

[@pRahvi0]

11:08 "This can be played for drama..." *cut to Anakin having failed his rescue attempt* "... or comedy." *Cut to Obiwan making a sarcastic comment about it*

[@kamille286]

literally my favorite scene in that movie XD

[@vullord666]

"You are a Master... master at getting caught"

[@Shoxic666]

"Good job"

[@ggyt1234]

Am I the only person who thought of that one Peppa pig episode

[@ggyt1234]

Am I the only person that thought of that one peppa pig episode when she said or comedy

[@izzy1221]

I love the 'Mentor gets kidnapped' subtrope. The interactions that come from it is so full of lovely lovely angst. It's amazing.

[@Jasonwolf1495]

Isagail my mentors never live long enough for that trope. Latest one made it to about chapter 10

[@arcticseanachai2283]

spoilers

[@CitraStitches]

Isagail Plot twist: My mentor is the villain.

[@D.Dragon]

It would be more interesting if they were a villain first and a mentor second. Like a part time job.

[@CitraStitches]

Douglas Dragon Fair point. Mine was a mentor who was always a terrible person, but the character was bad with them. When the character realizes they were wrong, they break away from the mentor. That's when the mentor becomes the antagonist.

[@academiacadejo3266]

Best Damsel in distress was Mr. Incredible, top notch, one of the best examples, he starts confident, get in to damsel mindset after he thinks his whole family is dead, gets rescued by a redeemed sidekick of the villain, get's saved by his wife, who punches the women, it's a fucking roller coaster ride

[@cocoabeanzwantstopuzzle]

I just thought: Has anyone used the trope in a way so that the damsel has no personality, but she slowly gains one as she realizes who she is?

[@PlanetZoidstar]

*Beastars Spoilers* A variation happens in Beastars, where Haru is kidnapped by the Shishigumi, she starts off feeling utterly worthless and puts up little resistance once escape is impossible. She allows herself to be threatened into stripping and resigns herself to be killed and eaten - but once the end draws near she decides she's not going to go quietly. She tells off the Mob Boss and spites him saying she'll be his worst meal ever. She dares him to eat her right there, right now - though she ultimately needs to be rescued, she grew alot from being damseled, coming to appreciate Legosi as someone who actually respects her and doesn't judge her, and she comes to value herself more because he showed she doesn't have to accept the feelings of worthlessness society drilled into her from a young age.

[@humma0]

I guess Piper from _Orange is the New Black_ is a good example. She started out as a naïve woman with no personality, and as the seasons progressed she bacame a total badass that everyone hated

[@laurdesz9050]

Yes!!!! This happens a lot in fantasy!!! I'm forgetting the names of both the series and the characters that im picturing, forgive me, but there IS a common idea of a character starting off neutral and without any real personality, and slowly sympathizing with the protagonists, and eventually wanting to help them. However, typically this character, via being a very low social class or a very high one, is trapped in the same physical (or symbolical) place they started. Say, a Nobles daughter stuck living her fancy life without a say in what goes on in court, or a slave boy who cant fight back because his family is still at risk of being punished if he does. Say, Winter in the lunar chronicals (The sci-fy version of snow white). To be fair, she has a personality, but thats because she's just about already "learned who she is" by the time we meet her. The learning happened before we see her on-screen, so to speak, and we get to see it happen through stories and flashbacks. Another example is Anakin Skywalker, he is a child who KNOWS he's in distress, but thinks he cant do anything about it, so he doesnt. Realistically, a child smart enough to program a self aware ai most certainly could've diffused any bio linked bombs that were around, but he'd been raised to believe it was pointless, so he never even thinks to try, or if he DOES think to try, never takes any action whatsoever towards that goal. And, even when given an easy out, he doesnt even WANT to leave, because his mother is STILL stuck in slavery, still in danger. Back to the lunar chronicals, we also have Cress, who is LITERALLY the sci-fi version of Rapunzel stuck in her tower, she stays in her satellite, listens to orders from above and does her good little tech-genius job For Queen and Country or some bs. She is, despite her internet freedom, a slave, but she never really tries to leave, or even improve her situation, really. She only stops when she finally realizes the end goal of the queen is to take over the world, and she finally acts out against the will of her queen, which gets her thrown in prison, which, with both brain and brawn together now, her and Thorne (her love interest) then escape from. So yes, this version of the trope exists (and honestly now that im thinking abt it the lunar chronicals nearly abuses it...), but its not that a personality-less brainless character winds up a prisoner, then sits there until they figure out that like, this is bad, its typically people who have been brought up in or taught to believe the situation theyre in is hopeless. Then, it takes figuring out that they NEED to fight back, both because it's their only hope at freedom, and because their sense of morality demands it, that they finally fight back and try to escape. Another good example is the earthbenders stuck on the floating prison in ATLA. While it takes Katara Aang and Sokka actively trying to break a few people out to instigate it, its the decision of the prisoners (who now both KNOW that they have a way to fight back, and that waiting for the war to be over isn't a goddamned survival tactic, its giving up) to fight back. (And while I'm talking about this scene can we acknowledge how amazing it is that this exact thing happens with hama later on? She's imprisoned far away from anything she can bend, but finds another source for her bending in order to break out, same as the earthbenders did. In addition, there is beautiful literary symatry with Toph breaking out of the metal cage by bending an onorthidox form of earth (metal), and Katara later breaking out of a wooden cage with an unorthodox form of water (sweat), in addition to that, neither would have been able to break out of the others cage (katara is useless against metal, and there was no one around to bloodbend, and toph, as shown, is useless against wood, and couldn't bend any of the surrounding earth either), and that BOTH could have easily broken out of either of the Prisons that their fellow benders had been stuck in, Toph metal bending on the ship, whereas katara could have (with the bending skill found in later seasons) torn the thing to pieces with well placed ice formation and some rogue waves, and in the waterbenders prison, Toph could, again metal bend out, and katara, like hama, could blood bend out. Beautiful, beautiful symatry) Anyway. A worse example is Daisy in The Great Gatsby, who you could arguably say is stuck in a boring life, tries to make her life interesting when she is re-inspired/sees a way out, then jumps right the fuck back into her "prison" when she inadvertently kills someone. Which is like. When your midlife crisis LITERALLY kills someone. Fun times. DOUBLE ANYWAY. Back on my main point, the reason we see the "born into the place that becomes their prison, and they're neutral or even an ass until they realize how physically or metaphorically stuck they are" type damsel in fantasy, is because its really, really easy to write in fantasy, and not really so easy anywhere else. In fantasy, you can show a noble girl hearing the whispers of the servents in the hallways, reading her fathers correspondences with an army general. She can secretly be a user of banned magick or, gasp, she could even just want to marry for love. Your heroes' cause is intrinsically right because they're the Heroes, and you villian probabky fits some kind of horribly immoral archetype that the Damsel can want to rebel against, moreso once they realize being true to themself is impossible if they stay where they are, which then MAKES them a damsel. Trying to translate that into say, realistic fiction doesn't work that well. Historical fiction could can work if you're going like, World Wars, the Troubles, The revolution or the Civil, (can u tell im anerican? i really don't know a lot of global War history that WASNT fought cause two kings wanted the same piece of land), basically, wars that had two opposing ideologies, and no, religious wars DONT work here (unless ur painting the crusaders as the bad guys, or at the very least misinformed. Ironically, if u know anything abt brit history, bbc Robin Hood did a half decent job of this, portraying not Islam as the problem, but ruling forces, and Robin actually has some serious cognitive dissonance going on, in which he is both firmly loyal to king and country, but really doesn't believe that either king or country is in the right in this war. *shrug* its kind of really interesting plot point, and I think its hillarious that it came outta britain). But like, a war where two countries competed over land or people maybe isnt... the best setting when we consider a modern audience and like, good taste and reading the room in general. But like, really, whats realistic fiction gonna do, have class bully Jame's neutral sister Charlotte realize bullying the poor kid is bad, but that she's trapped by societal standards to not treat them right? See, that just reads like a weak-willed character that u don't really have sympathy for, because even if all of her rich friends ditched her, shed probably be able to find better, not-bully friends with the rest of the student body. AND, her switching sides isn't really going to have any physical consequences for her,, she's not about to be locked up in her room all day, married to an old evil Duke, or hunted down like a down and imprisoned or executed as a traitor.. Unless you're working in a dystopia, or, at the very least, a fascist or totalitarian regime of a country, there aren't going to be lasting physical consequences to your damsel trying to "break free" if you're working in realistic fiction; there are EMOTIONAL challenges, but at that point you're no longer dealing with a proper damsel, youre dealing with a normal character undergoing emotional turmoil. Theyre not in Physical distress nor are they Physically trapped anywhere by threat of being hunted down like a dog if they leave, certainly not the way the same character in fantastical, or even certain historical settings would be. But yeah, "character is born into a possition that as they grow becomes theyre prison, and once they realize how truly entrapped they are, they try to escape" is a big, BIG trope in fantasy. Sorry for all the tangents,, but I hope this helped!!!

[@floricel_112]

This is how we got Salem, sooooooo

[@willieoelkers5568]

@@floricel_112 And Cinder, I'd say. Who now likely has most of the FNDM out for her blood.

[@hannahm7646]

"it's like a playground...but for emotionally ravaging your characters.... the best kind of playground for any author to play around in" This has to one of my favorite lines about writing I've ever heard. I had to stop the video to giggle at that for a min. Thanks for another great one. I too, love the Damsels In Distress trope when done right.

[@shadowpod13]

I just deleted the comment I made because you said pretty much the same thing. It's also how she says it as well.

[@the_katzy]

*God has entered the chat*

[@hellothere2464]

“Patience anakin. Control your insolence. The Count is concentrating”

[@chocochipjewel]

That episode with Dooku, Anakin and Obi Wan damseled by Hondo is one of my all time favorites because of how ridiculous yet believable the premise is. It has captive captor dynamics, the rescue squad dynamics, over the top rescue attempts by the captives and rescue team, it's just... Perfect. I can watch the 4 of them banter and trip over each other for days 👌

[@coltonwilliams4153]

Gods. You can feel the dripping sarcasm just reading this.😂

[@wildys6]

Come to think of it, there's also Bumi (Avatar last airbender) damseling himself in order to wait for the right moment to strike. Even refusinng rescue and imprisoning himself again after giving Aang some good old advice. Only to badass' himself out to show how incredibly op he actually is. Just, ya know, some food for thought.

[@CoolG97]

wildys6 Oh I just love the reveal of Bumi still able to Earth bend "They didn't cover my face"

[@RacingSnails64]

wildys6 princess bumi what

[@nidohime6233]

my tits Actually is a he, and king.

[@AlienBunnyRabbit]

And Toph in her own metal cage. By focusing her earthbending abilities on the remants on earth in the metal, she was able to get out.

[@galaxystudios370]

"well technically there are 85"

[@steampunker7]

My personal favorite example of this trope comes from Star Wars. Sure, Leia gets herself captured in the opening 20 minutes, but does she ever subvert that "Classic Damsel" all to hell. Shooting a stormtrooper, mouthing off to an Imperial Moff and Sith Lord, resisting torture, snarking at Luke and taking charge when he and Han discover they had a plan to get in but none to get out. She may be a damsel, she may be in distress, but there was no way she was going to take it lying down. :)

[@phenjaws569]

steampunker7 yep

[@piggylady225]

And that is why I love her!

[@devinsortor1809]

Yessss love that

[@shadowpod13]

Steampunker7 Your last part reminded me of Meg's line from Disney Hercules "I'm a damsel. I'm in distress. And I'm handling it. Have a nice day :)"

[@animeotaku307]

And even while still in distress she’s doing all she can to help the Rebellion. Resisting torture, lying about the base’s location, snarking at Tarkin. Even before she’s rescued the audience knows what kind of person she is.

[@archerhitthetarget]

These trope talks give me so many ideas for a book that I’m never going to write.

[@juliasnyder7284]

Theyre giving me good ideas for a book i want to write but probably wont ever :0

[@hogndog2339]

Write it then!

[@Blwbelle]

Stop spying on me

[@sinad0123]

"C'mon boss, say it. For old times sakes" "Kept you waiting, huh?"

[@jacobmcneer609]

what's that from?

[@Marx_D._Soul]

@@jacobmcneer609 Metal Gear Solid franchise.

[@dolphinboi-playmonsterranc9668]

@@Marx_D._Soul Particularly MGSV where the first part of the dialogue shows up

[@christopherbruderle684]

Damn I just realized that MGS5 does that a lot huh.

[@rahmanmoncatar9675]

SNAKE SNAKE? SNNNAAAAAAAAAAKKKKKKKEEEEE

[@hfar_in_the_sky]

One of my favorite damseling scenarios that's played for laughs is when the rescuer finds the captured person and goes "You're saved!" only for the captured person to go "No! I was trying to get captured so I could sneak into the evil lair, you idiot!"

[@kaboomgaming4255]

Or you can make that sad rather than comedic and the hero tries this in front of the villain, meaning the damsel has to lie to the hero and pretend to be a bad guy.

[@kaboomgaming4255]

@Black Stone but then the damsel kills the bad guy and runs away

[@kaboomgaming4255]

@Black Stone they try and do it secretly but the damsel finds out and backstabs the bad guy

[@kaboomgaming4255]

@Black Stone well, the damsel is still on the hero's side, even though the hero doesn't know it, and the hero is reluctant to kill the damsel in the first place.

[@atlantefou566]

I really like when two characters (often love interests) end up saving each other so often that they stop counting. That is my favorite "damsel in distress" situation.

[@metarcee2483]

Like Mario saving Peach.

[@seant1326]

What if the character captured is perfectly capable of getting out, but decides to wait and see how long it takes their allies to break in and set him free?

[@DavidbarZeus1]

That would be the Play-Along Damsel. The DID might be a prisoner, but they are going to make their capture very much worth it

[@juliasnyder7284]

"Took you 2 days this time... youre losing your touch."

[@lieeeleeee]

this sounds like a great spiteful lancer solo arc. rather than the lancer strikes off to try and fight the bad guy alone and bites of more than they can chew or any other lancer solo arc that gets them capture the lancer gets themselves captured to prove to themselves their allies wont realise theyre even gone or come to rescue them.

[@josephperez2004]

There is a variant of this where the DID is not escaping because being held captive actually puts them closer to some manner of goal. Entrapta is an example of this early on in the She-ra series, where it might be possible for her to try to escape, but the place she is being held captive has so much advanced technology, she much prefers to stay 'captured' so she can interact with it.

[@chaoticevilproductions7303]

Could be something like "So, you got captured again?" "I could have gotten out at any time" "So why didn't you?" "Well, you need help getting to the boss, right?" "Sure, but why did you have to get captured for that?" "That way you had a reason to come in. Makes it less likely the boss is gonna leave now" "Fair enough"

[@aslaksockcraft]

In injustice superman sheds light on an entirely unique variant of the damsel in distress. I'll call it the dormant kraken. Superman is captured by batman and stuck in a cell with red sun generators which strip him of his power. What makes this so great is that despite being completely helpless superman is suddenly scarier than he has ever been. He has failed, his best friend has not only betrayed him but also imprisoned him, he has never been angrier. Besides he is now in extremely close proximity to the protagonist and if he escapes will most certainly not only kill the protagonist but also all of his friends. Batman is no longer able to hide or go undercover. Also the inherently fragile state of his imprisonment means that the kraken will be unleashed at any time and without due warning. Superman is also able to talk to batman and try to convince him to let him out, as well as all of Batmans comrades. Somehow, despite being more subdued than he has ever been throughout the series, Superman is more dangerous than ever.

[@whoknows7968]

I know you made this comment over a year ago but the dormant kraken was the *best name* you could have used to describe this scenario.

[@barrybend7189]

Alita in Battle Angel Alita last order when the Jupiter empire captures her. It didn't last long as she hijacked the computers and Grey goos the entire facility and transports back to get in the fight.

[@robertlewis6915]

also known as the "wild beast at bay" or "in a corner" or "pushed too far" or "a step too far" trope

[@naomistarlight6178]

Yeah, it's always interesting to see what superpowered badass characters do in situations where they are unwilling or unable to use their superpowers. For example the 'Winter Wrap Up' episode of 'My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic', watching the fairies in 'Sleeping Beauty' try to make a cake and a dress without magic, I like stuff like that.

[@akaneriyun4774]

Another example of this is Tai Lung from Kung Fu Panda. He's immobilized and incapacitated neck-down except for his tail. And so, in order to get out, Tai Lung had to be creative and lockpick the main lock on his back using his tail with a feather a messenger left behind. Tai Lung was a damsel but a beast waiting to be unleashed.

[@youtubeuniversity3638]

An idea: Story where the "damsel" is literally just a vase. Very literal vase. Literally not a person.

[@omegabet3912]

We call that a McGuffin.

[@bachpham6862]

@@omegabet3912 Well, you can subvert both tropes by making interactions of other characters around the vase as treating real people. Sort of having the villain monologuing their intent and motive to a vase as a satire story.

[@lifeontheledgerlines8394]

@@bachpham6862 I... I need that

[@Heroshii15]

She can shapeshift into a vase.

[@clockworkpotato9892]

The vase is sentient and also the narrator.

[@TheKersey475]

Great video, but you've missed a sub-sub type of the "Neoclassical Damsel"-"Play Along Prisoner": The Trojan Damsel Basically this is when a character intentionally damsels themselves to accomplish a goal like acquiring information, stealing a MacGuffin, or even getting close enough to the villain for a kill shot. This can either be treated as a "all-along" twist or a cunning plan that the audience is in on and thus they get to enjoy the hero outsmarting her/his "captors". A great example is when Hiccup attempts this in "How to Train Your Dragon 2", he and his badass love-interest Astrid intentionally track down some Dragon Trappers and "surrender" themselves to the trappers with Hiccup cheerfully telling the trappers what they have and even "remembering" to turn over his weapons. Comedy bonus cause Hiccup is clearly in control of the situation while the trappers, his dragon, and even Astrid (the badass love interest) are all confused at what's going on.

[@akechijubeimitsuhide]

Also: Black Widow's intro in Avengers.

[@steampunker7]

That annoyed "these idiots are spilling everything" line she gives Colson as she is still securely tied to a chair and but moments ago looked like she was going to be tipped over a ledge absolutely sells it. For all their posturing and threats she had them right where she wanted them and they never even suspected. xD

[@tortture3519]

TheKersey475 5:25

[@TheKersey475]

I did mention that. She was talking about one of the subtypes of the "Neoclassical Damsel"; "The Play Along Prisoner". The KEY difference between "Play Along Prisoner" and "Trojan Damsel" is that the "Play Along Prisoner" has been captured/overpowered unexpectedly, but makes the most out of it and is more on-the-fly. A "Trojan Damsel" intentionally lets her/himself get captured as part of a plan and is thus more prepared.

[@schwarzerritter5724]

TheKersey475 The Trojan Damsel reminds me of early Dragon Ball. A monster is forcing girls in a village to marry him, so Bulma gets the idea to dress Goku up as a girl to find his hideout. This plan fails because Goku does not know girls do not pee standing.

[@hat-eating-cthulu-goat3221]

God I love this show.

[@staticshotaop561]

Hat-Eating-Cthulu-Goat I'm reporting this

[@MrThehatlord]

Hat-Eating-Cthulu-Goat I

[@christianmoralesortiz4688]

Hat-Eating-Cthulu-Goat I second that notion!!!

[@knif1e]

same!

[@HannibalHanslaughter]

Hat-Eating-Cthulu-Goat +

[@EvelynWn]

I think my favorite use of this trope is when it's a bad guy of some description that rescues the damsel. There's just so many ways to make that hilarious or heartwarming or both. It could be a "I'm the only one allowed to kill you so stop getting captured you idiot," or a "you were nice to me this one time and now we're even so I can hate you in peace." Or even a jumping off point for a redemption arc. I wish it happened more often.

[@wjzav1971]

"Do you think we could have been friends?"

[@allie.rain.arctaea]

I love how red separates trope from writing error.

[@qweadd6987]

i like ur pic

[@WulfieZi]

Damseling can lead to one of my favorite mechanics, which I shall dub the Failed Rescue and Subsequent Friend Making Come Around... the name's a work in progress. Basically, a not very likable character gets themself damseled, and this sparks a controversy within our band of heroes; some heroes want to rescue them, others think it's not worth the time. The ones who want to mount a rescue do so, but fail, causing the rest of the band to have to backtrack and rescue their asses. In the end they all escape and the initial damsel joins the band... or not, depending on how you want the story to go. I've seen this written well a couple of times and it's godlike.

[@demonicprinter]

WulfieZi this can go to a fallen hero story. A badass one. And the fallen hero can still actually do good, but despise the heroes who refused to rescue THEM. And create a monster of a threat for those characters, while the ones who were up for a rescue can convince them to return to full time heroism or have to face off with an entirely new nemesis they never saw coming. Ingenious.

[@thesnailphilosopher]

I had something like this, where our band of heroes are off to rescue a friend and then they meet a *new* friend who’s rescuing her friend from the same place, and it turns out that the person new guy is rescuing is someone who the protagonists don’t like. And then both characters join the squad bc the one who got damseled in the first place betrayed them. I cut this because I wanted the squad together at the beginning

[@andurilcuivie]

Eustace in Voyage of the Dawntreader, similar.

[@claireanela]

My favorite part about the Paper Mario games is that they show Princess Peach being sassy, trying to escape her kidnappers, literally beating up people who insult her, and still trying to be a good leader. Like, she’s a sweetheart, but do not mess with her.

[@saidpolat]

My favorite Damsel in distress is Roxane Ritchie from Megamind :D

[@joshthehollow5254]

I love how she's been kidnapped so many times that she doesn't even take it seriously anymore. Another reason why I love that movie so much!

[@besquareorbethere2680]

"YOU CALL THIS PREDICTABLE!?"

[@rayzersun6705]

@@besquareorbethere2680 "Alligators, yes!! I was thinking on way over" (sorry bin so long i forgot the dialogue)

[@Gormathius]

We need more sassy sarcastic damsels who keep cracking jokes at their distress.

[@Palemagpie]

"You know full well that we discontinued that program"

[@calamusgladiofortior2814]

Damsel mode is part of a broader writing problem I call, "Helpless Ninny Syndrome." HNS is a serious condition which renders characters, groups of people or even entire civilizations incapable of acting to better their situation. The only thing they can do is sit around and wait until the hero comes along to rescue them. The damsel in distress is one example, but in many stories featuring the "chosen one" trope, people just sit around being oppressed until the hero of prophesy comes along. This is lazy writing that ultimately hurts the story. Showing people being active and resisting, even if they are unsuccessful, makes the audience like those characters more and want to see them rescued. For example, in Star Wars, we see Princess Leia refuse to give up the location of the rebel base, even under torture or when her home world is threatened. She's not in a position to rescue herself, but she refuses to cooperate with the Empire, and we like her more as a character because of it. The Mexican villagers from the original Magnificent Seven are another example of victims done right. They're sick of being robbed by Calvera and his gang of bandits, but they know they need help. Instead of just sitting around helplessly, they take a collection and send a group out to find some hired guns to help them fight back. Even though the title characters lead the final defence against Calvere, the villagers fight alongside them. We see them going from fearful to defiant, and the audience is more engaged in their fate as a result.

[@stormcloudsabound]

Arthur Williams ‘original magnificent seven’ oh, you mean the seven samurai? /j

[@creatressanna8714]

@@stormcloudsabound Both versions do this. He's just clarifying that it's not the recent *remake* of the Magnificent Seven. Which I hear mixed things about.

[@meishuu]

yes! That such a bad trope and lazy writing, same with original "damsel in distress" trope.

[@torren4966]

The Mistborn trilogy avoids this problem pretty well while also making it evident that protagonist intervention is required to achieve victory. Which is done by having a faction of the Skaa (basically the equivalent of a slave-race, the other two factions being the compliant ones and the underground/criminal crews) just be a group of rebels that repeatedly tries to rise up against the Lord Ruler (the god-king of the Final Empire) but always fail on account of a lack of funding, training, and recruiting that allows the Garrison (the main military force of Luthadel, the capital city of the Final Empire) to almost immediately crush any rebellion that rises up, demonstrating that while it may as well be considered pointless to rebel, they still continue to fight in hopes of a victory and at the same time gives the main characters some material to work with when planning their rebellion

[@calamusgladiofortior2814]

@@torren4966 Agreed. Another good example.

[@MissEarthling]

"Distressing your characters is fun." YES. I torture my ocs so much that I think they're plotting a revolution aganst me.

[@Scalesthelizardwizard]

that sounds like a good plot for a Twilight Zone Episode

[@nathanjereb9944]

@@Scalesthelizardwizard it could start with a writer (or any other storymaker), putting their charaters through the wringer for his own amusement. Then slowly his day becomes worse and worse, to be reviled that his charaters where causing that misery. Ending with the writer about to be tourchered by said charaters. I will take my 1 million dollars for writing it for you, thank you

[@Scalesthelizardwizard]

@@nathanjereb9944 I don't have that kind of money lol

[@nathanjereb9944]

@@Scalesthelizardwizard well i do take other kinds of currency; souls, information, fried chicken. You choose which...

[@Blwbelle]

Maybe you can make a silly side story where they break the 4th wall and actually do this-

[@LokiScarletWasHere]

I like that. "Turns out my boss is a jerk. Wanna help me spite him?"

[@christopherrobia1350]

my favorite damsel situation is the damsel that actually saves themselves off screen and when the rescue party arrives the damsel says with epic levels of snark "what took you so long

[@privpi]

Or they just manage to keave the evil castle or whatever, and notice like a giant explosion from the rescue party battling the bbeg who doesn't even know they're gone.

[@DrMudarris]

Damsel in Distress AoT edition S1: Eren gets kidnapped S2: Eren gets kidnapped S3 P1: Eren gets kidnapped S3 P2: Eren does NOT get kidnapped S4: EREN KIDNAPS EVERYONE !!

[@blahthebiste7924]

Now that's what I call Character Development!

[@Stormkrow280]

I’m on season 3, no wonder that dude has severe anger issues.

[@burritowyrm6530]

Wonder if eren’s true motivation is claustrophobia

[@zFrizzi]

S4: Eren gets himself kidnapped on purpose

[@Wubster649]

There’s a episode from the Clone Wars, where Dooku gets captured by space pirates, Anakin and Obi-Wan bargains but gets caught and prisoned, however instead of a rescue party rescuing them, Dooku, Anakin and Obi-wan tries to escape from the space pirates and you have this nice banter between them.

[@red5t653]

Patience, Anakin. Control your insolence. The Count is concentrating.

[@thedawsonator1628]

"I would kill you both right now if I didn't have to drag your bodies" --Count Dooku, a guy who's just about had enough of this.

[@AlssyaMacki]

That episode was the best. All the banter, and Hondo!

[@hellothere2464]

I think it’s one of the best damsel tropes when the villain and the heroes are forced to work together because you get some amazing dynamics between them. Any time I see Obi Wan and Anakin picking on Dooku for anything it’s hilarious, and Dooku just being so done with the both of them is also amazing

[@williamrosen3179]

And the rescue party that was sent was Jar Jar and a few clones

[@catbatrat1760]

"It's like a playground, but for emotionally ravaging your characters: the best kind of playground for any author to play around in!" -Overly Sarcastic Productions, 2017

[@iainbaker6916]

Princess Leia in the original Starwars was another good one. Her capture was done well - small ship captured by big baddie ship, but wasn’t passive even then as she got the DS plans off the ship first. Then taken to the DS but still tried to save the rebels by giving false info - which resulted in her Homeworld being destroyed which probably mentally broke her for a while. She was trapped in a situation that basically no one could escape from on their own, but became invaluable to the rescue mission itself once the prison break started and saved both herself and the rescuers.

[@NarfiRef]

It took me far too long scrolling through comments to finally get to a mention of Leia.

[@iainbaker6916]

@@NarfiRef I know, right?

[@QueenBoadicea]

5:26 My recent favorite DID scene was in "The Avengers". Luchkov thinks he's interrogating Natasha Romanoff but she's actually interrogating HIM. When the ruse is revealed, she breaks free and beats up all the men in the room, leaving the old man dangling by a chain over a pit. Beautiful. I get all teary every time I see it.

[@hannahm7646]

Man that scene is so much fun. I love watching it every time!

[@QueenBoadicea]

Have you seen the new Wonder Woman movie? While it barely passes the Bechdel Test (the grown Diana talks to the Amazons about fighting and to Etta Candy [about shopping]), it is one great movie about a young goddess getting to understand the world, embrace her power, show compassion and kick ass like a boss.

[@hannahm7646]

No, I haven't yet!! I really wanted to go see it, but I never got the chance and I don't have the cash at the moment to go pick it up. My brother really liked it though.

[@QueenBoadicea]

I've seen it quite a few times since its initial release. There are free screenings outdoors and indoors and I search through park and library listings to find them. Try googling for free screenings and you may just catch it without having to pay.

[@somebodyactually1490]

QueenBoadicea and then it gets ruined in the second movie when Natasha is captured and is waiting for Bruce to rescue her to have the worst ship in the mcu shoved down pur throats when she could have easily freed herself and not have us have Brucetasha be a thing.

[@Trenzalore394]

My favorite thing, that I pretty much only find in fanfics, is when the one that always does the rescuing is damseled and halfway through escaping stumbles on the rescue party and is completely blindsided by the fact that someone is there to rescue them ("That's my job, what?") They usually have a lot of previous experience being left to break themselves out and everyone being chill with that, then new friend decides to rescue them instead cause friendship.

[@catbatrat1760]

I should write a fanfic about that.

[@revui834]

one time i wrote a "damsel in distress" plotline into a story where all of her friends knew that she could handle herself perfectly well, so none of them were even worried when she went missing; she showed up like four days later, completely fine, with some mcdonald's she'd grabbed on her way back from escaping her kidnappers.

[@MouldMadeMind]

This could have turned dark when it turned out she couldn't escape on her own, and now her friends don't try to safe her, convincing her she has been abandond

[@Blwbelle]

@@MouldMadeMind or she dies trying to escape Twist the knife even more :]

[@shadowrosegaming3566]

The McDonald's makes it so much better please did she get some for the others?

[@revui834]

@@shadowrosegaming3566 Nope. She bought 30 McNuggets and ate them all herself. She rescued herself, she gets the rescue McDonald's. No one else.

[@revui834]

@@MouldMadeMind Funny you should mention this, that does happen, sort of. The incident I described in my comment is very early in the story and acts as character establishment for her. Hammers out everything you need to know. She's clever, she's independent, she's badass. And, just as important, it establishes that the other people on the team know this and trust her. So, much, much later in the narrative, when she winds up damseled again, she quickly realizes that this is a threat she cannot handle. And the other characters realize this as well. And so does the audience. And there's something kind of fascinating to be found in a previously untouchable character being grounded in such a sudden, inescapable fashion. The other characters know that she's out of her depth, and they do come to save her this time, but she does spend a lot of time terrified by the idea that she'll be left behind and stuck there. It's great fun to write!

[@reveredrogue9725]

As someone who loves writing stories, this has become one of my favorite Channels ever since i discovered it. Not only did it talk about history, myths and such but when they started Trope Talk, my love for the channel just increased. Wished i could do more to help. Thanks for the great content.

[@Kit5une131313]

...and then there is the Damsel in Distress situation that turns out to be a trap with the Damsel turning out to be the villain...

[@aria5614]

There was a really good Russian animation about a group of archers falling prey to a pink rapunzel that played out exactly like that.

[@Tree_-wp5zn]

New super Mario Wii All that's all I have..

[@missdemeanor608]

Confused confusing confusion

[@SpaceCase132]

Wasn’t that the plot twist of Hoodwinked 2: Hood vs. Evil? Only done really poorly?

[@nathanjereb9944]

@@Tree_-wp5zn i think that is more of a "plan B" if bowser didnt kill mario at that instant, and mario got to the very big "destroy the bridge" button

[@TheStartrek99]

One of my favorite damselings is from Kim Possible, when Dr. Draken kidnaps Kim Possible's dad, because backstory, and doesn't even realize that his prisoner is his nemesis' father. The banter is glorious.

[@starstudios2959]

Speaking of Journey to the West, I'm really excited for part five

[@Emerald-DragonFlame]

DONT REMIND MEEEEEEEEHHHHH!!!!!!!

[@starstudios2959]

Awwww.... I had my hopes up

[@psychronia]

At least Red can count two digits higher than Valve. To be seen how long it takes to get one more on them.

[@rggrill3588]

First JoJo's Anime adaptation and now Journey to the West...why do such great series not release their fifth parts?

[@666melodeath666]

#part5never

[@ztslovebird]

Doug Walker of the Nostalgia Critic explained the hate for damsels best. It's not so much about anybody needing rescuing, but hating when a character either has no purpose besides being rescued or should've easily been able to rescue themselves (Dumbasses in Distress as opposed to damsels in distress).

[@steampunker7]

Yeah. I usually refer to such characters as the "Peril Person." The Damsel in Distress can be a one time occurrence with the option of subverting or deconstructing the trope. Case in point: Princess Leia. Sure, she's certainly in "Distress" when we first meet her. But she also takes an active part in her own rescue and any further danger she encounters though the stories she does so due to the nature of her position with the Rebellion and usually right alongside her comrades Luke and Han. The Peril Person on the other hand seems to CONSTANTLY be in some kind of trouble for no other reason than the hero can come to their rescue. Lois Lane and Jimmy Olson are usually this for Superman. Same for MJ Watson and Spider Man. Even Robin, the Boy Wonder, falls into this in some incarnations of the Batman franchise. Not saying these are bad characters and to be fair they do sometimes get sub plots or side stories for their own moment to shine or something to do when the hero isn't around. But often their defining trait is "get captured/menaced by the bad guys" and it can lead to them being flatly written or baggage writers don't know what to do with after a while.

[@DrMadd]

Here's a question, is a character a peril person if they went into the situation knowing the potential danger? For instance most of the time Lois Lane is kidnapped because she's being proactive and trying to report on wrong doings in Metropolis. She isn't Princess Peach who just gets kidnapped while sitting around doing nothing.

[@AngelofbrokenHalo]

Yeah, I don't take anything Doug Walker says seriously anymore considering his own personal idiotic behavior.

[@DrMadd]

A Complete and Utter Failure Unless I wasn’t paying attention I’m 90% sure that was never a complaint levied against him

[@bazinga743]

Dr. Madd I definitely remember reading that somewhere in the document but still my point stays the same that this comment is outdated after the documents were released.

[@g.e.causey]

There's nothing I love more than seeing the badass hero put into a vulnerable situation and needing to be rescued by their friends. It gives me a tremendous amount of pleasure.

[@brigidtheirish]

What fairy tales have you been reading? Because the ones I grew up with had princesses who took over the rescue as soon as the hero showed up. "About time you showed up. There's a huge sword on the wall and a magic potion that'll let you lift it. Stand behind the door so when the giant comes home you can cut off his head." "Finally, a hero. Here's a map of the castle with the locations of all the treasures marked. There's a horse in the stables out back. Don't step on the threshold stone or the door will slam shut." You know, stuff like that. Classic Northern European folktales.

[@RelativelyBest]

I actually love this. It's like the damsel has spent all her time observing the villain and thinking about how she'd escape, so she has this whole plan worked out except she can't get to the key to her cage or whatever.

[@MissDanyDae]

Id love the titles, thank you

[@karenkavon6957]

Mostly reading original Grimm- where women are allowed to be the Mother of The Hero (usually dead); the Villain, or the Victim (distressed damsel). It's.... Really depressing, actually, how they wrote their female characters, especially with how many stories they collected.

[@ioanab506]

also in Eastern Europe!!! most princesses have some kind of magic/psychic power which they use to alert the hero or help him

[@Pukeprincess]

Americans were given the Disney versions, cool princesses you got there

[@Masensory]

I like the damsel in distress trope because of one character that made me realise how flexible the entire situation is. Princess Parfait from Cucumber Quest seemed like a classic damsel at first she was something of a princess classic but her interactions with the "big bad" of the series shows how strong her character is and how complex the big bad's is. I only realised how much I grew to like this trope through her because of this video, so thank you Red for making me realise that.

[@ashori100]

cucumber quest? sounds like a Pr0n movie

[@JakFool123]

It's a (G-rated?) webcomic.

[@АлинаАхметова-у5ю]

You can say it's Gigi-rated, heh ^^

[@rai.2876]

glamourgirl656 o wow Someone who knows Cucumber Quest :DDDDD

[@ZanraiKid]

Badass in Distress reminds me of Iroh's imprisonment from Avatar: The Last Airbender. Talk about long-term storytelling and character building.

[@calebgardner7943]

How about a situation where the captor is so hospitable that the damsel wouldn't want to attempt a self rescue, because they're actually okay with being kidnapped? I think that'd be pretty entertaining.

[@calebgardner7943]

OR how about we spice things up with a villain being the damsel, and a hero being the captor? We'd get the same interactions that we normally would, but from a different, very interesting angle.

[@somebodyactually1490]

I think that ones actually happened in real life where about 6000 axis prisoners of war didn't want to leave Canadian prisons since they were treated so well.

[@missmorbid1439]

I think that’s Stockholm Syndrome

[@charlesdewitt8087]

@@missmorbid1439 With the IRL example. It was less Stockholm syndrome and more, not wanting to leave their nice barracks, with their nice captors, helping nice farmers pick their nice crops to go back into a war-zone where supplies are a constant issue, and the troops don't often have adequate winter gear, so they can go and fight for what is clearly by this point a lost cause.

[@missmorbid1439]

Charles Dewitt Oh, I was referring to the OP, not the IRL example.

[@danicajekic1595]

I think my main problem with recent damsel stories (ESPECIALLY in anime) is the fact that the bad ones always end up using the damsels as tools to further the power fantasies without giving both parties their time to suffer. And it sucks because it ends up undermining the badassery of the often female characters. I think the main reason why people started really hating SAO was that after all of the time spent developing Asuna into a more or less competent and self-sufficient character, when she was locked in the rape dungeon in the fairy dance arc she immediately fell into damsel depression and Kirito had to save her. And while that in itself isn't bad, it immediately angered me because the author never had the balls to play it both ways. Kirito was always saving Asuna or some other girl, he was never actually forced into a damsel role (also because she was continuously violated but her trauma was never addressed, so even her later arc felt superficial and she started to morph into the obedient girlfriend). He just became this white knight who could do no wrong, so every time the female characters exhibited moments of badassery following that shift in framing, it felt completely meaningless. Why am I supposed to cheer for these girls when I know they'll either be shoved to the side or saved by Jesus-kun from a video game monster or rapist? Idk, just my two cents. I haven't watched Alicization yet, so if someone's watched it or read the LN, let me know if things change.

[@josephperez2004]

Im sure someone else might have suggested this before, but if not, SAO Abridged addresses some of these issues and manages to make these story threads funny and/or satisfying.

[@ipromisethatserendipityisa9656]

SAO is very much a self insert for every plain guys to get all the pretty and bad.ass girls and play hero. So yeah its shit. What is there to analyze? 😂😂😂

[@fictionalcharactermov7471]

that isn't the reason it became somewhat dislike and honestly you don't need to have the female Character, saving the male character with an equal amount. Especially if that isn't the case for the story, and I don't see how it's an issue in anime. Not every character is meant save each other an equal amount of time.

[@TapperPlushMom]

Okay, I've watched the Fairy Dance arc a while ago, but I seem to remember that she did actually try to escape once. Or at least, I remember her getting out of her cage and stealing an important dealybob, and I can't imagine her doing that if she wasn't at least *considering* an escape attempt.

[@darleehart9782]

Thanks for defending the damsel in distress trope. It’s been one of my favorites over the years and can be the best part of a story when done right. My favorite part of a story is almost always character interactions, and this is just a Goldmine for that kind of thing.

[@Obi-Wan_Kenobi]

That was a fantastic video! I just came across your channel and am immensely impressed. I especially love how you provide so many examples from cartoons and movies I have actually seen and can relate too. Also, special thanks for using me as one of your damsel examples. ;-)

[@demi-femme4821]

Anakin: "We came here to rescue you." You: (Looks up at chains) "Good job!" Me: (rolling on floor laughing)

[@Stratelier]

The first time I discovered this channel I only watched one video (one of the many Trope Talk episodes, but I don't remember which one) and didn't really know what to make of it. This time, I started with the "Classics Summarized" and now the actual tone of the Trope Talk episodes make more sense.

[@jehovasabettor9080]

But what about the love triangle? Oh wait, wrong channel

[@immortalstranger8532]

Is that a Terrible Writing Advice reference?

[@rustyshovel7179]

that's just *terrible*

[@australiumbacon5598]

Jehova's Abettor Screw the love triangle! He has given us a love dodecahedron! That's the one true "awful writing trope".

[@GnarledStaff]

Thats what the villain is for! (She alluded to the possibility of this)

[@TheBitanian]

Don't forget the damsel that's actually a MARY SUE

[@theodoreringquist2486]

I had a plot thread planned where I damseled one of my most competent characters and put her in the damseled mindset. I'm gonna have to change that now I this has been brought to my attention. I anticipate a lot of work. At least I like this story and character enough for it not to be a chore. Anyway, I'm just glad I didn't have to overhaul this after I had the whole thing written.

[@nikitamalikov6683]

The only way to write good is to write bad. Keep at it!

[@enigmace9787]

A concept: pull the morality flip thing with one of the villain's subordinates and add a rescue romance. Maybe have the minion's original motivation have been that they were lied to, or they were an old friend of the villain who finally lost their faith that the villain could be turned back to good, or that the villain was blackmailing them with a family member who they rescue along with the damsel... Sorry, I should go write this myself.

[@theodoreringquist2486]

@@enigmace9787 xD I'ma be honest, I've completely revamped the characters and story to the point where such a plot wouldn't work at all, but that really could be a lot of fun. Enjoy writing that, fellow togetherslapper of syllables.

[@FireFlamberge]

*Inserts personal dissatisfaction*- (Wind Waker spoiler ahead) When Tetra is revealed to be Zelda and suddenly she becomes a gasping little girl instead of the wise-cracking pirate she's been for 80% of the game...

[@ilovethelegend]

I mean, that is REALLY only in that one scene, before she gets damseled, even. She DOES then proceed to help you whoop Ganon's ass.

[@matthewmuir8884]

Why do so many people interpret that Zelda scene in Wind Waker that way? Yes; Tetra's a wisecracking pirate, but she also easily blames herself for things. If you recall the beginning of the game, she only agrees to help Link rescue his sister after the Postman points out that the bird was originally after her. Her finding out that she's Zelda leads her to think that she is in-part responsible for the stuff Link's had to go through, and she gets remorseful and apologetic, completely in-character, for just the one scene. After she wakes up after being kidnapped by Ganon, she proceeds to help Link defeat and her personality is still that of the wise-cracking pirate!

[@matthewmuir8884]

@Brandon Quist In what way?

[@matthewmuir8884]

@Brandon Quist Ah; I see. Honestly, I thought it was an interesting moment that explored more of her character; I honestly didn't even compare it to Ocarina of Time. I agree that her guilt at that point is largely unfounded, but I also think _that's part of the point._ Where Zelda in OoT had been carrying her guilt for 7 years, Tetra is confiding in Link after being hit with a ton of stuff all at once.

[@thetapixie6638]

YEAH i was like "Cmon make a joke" because she was SO COOL before she was like "oooh im zelda? Better stay here where I'm totally not vulnerable instead of going to lead my pirate crew and whoop gannon with cannons!"

[@elderscrollsswimmer4833]

Oh my favourite Damsel in Distress stories are the sort where she does something so that the kidnappers end up being afraid of her and more than eager to see her gone...

[@lillieeiken2771]

Elderscrollsswimmer can I use that idea?

[@PhuiJingLing]

80's She Ra does that in one of the episodes and it's my favorite

[@thomasmackliley6117]

@@PhuiJingLing which episode exactly or if you don't know which season please?

[@PhuiJingLing]

@@thomasmackliley6117 The episode is called "Flowers For Hordak"

[@gayzell850]

I once read a short story( I think by O. Henry) where the BGs kidnap a young boy and the kid is such a brat that in the end the kidnappers end up paying the parents to take the kid back.

[@mellieblack8856]

One anime that I watched recently, Banana Fish, has a bunch of really well thought out damsel in distress scenes. The whole show is amazing, and really deserves more recognition

[@fluffydementor]

favorite damsel in distress... Tony Stark

[@yiklongtay6029]

Is he really a damsel if there was no focus on anyone trying to rescue him? Without an implied rescue party, we all immediately assumed that he wasn't going to be a damsel and escape

[@ryanm.8720]

*Most Prisoners:* Will they spend the rest of there life in here? Or will someone break them out? *Iron Man (2008): TONY STARK WAS ABLE TO BUILD THIS IN A CAVE! WITH A BOX OF SCRAPS!*

[@taiga738]

I love it when you analyze polarizing tropes and how they can be used well.

[@discreetscrivener7885]

This remains one of my favorite videos on Damsels in Distress because it doesn’t boil down to “DAMSEL BAD” and actually acknowledges why it can be an enjoyable trope and how to avoid the pitfalls.

[@666melodeath666]

Robin in One Piece was one of the best Damsels in Distress story she Damseled herself willingly accepting execution to save the crew at the same time shes kinda suicidal. Making the rescue of her one the most emotional moments in One Piece as well as Character Development for most of the crew. The Power of Friendship wasnt some Deus Ex Machina instead that Friendship is what helps them survive because all they want is to save Robin and make it back thus the fights were the most emotionally charged. They even declare war on the world to get her back which also progresses the story.

[@onehalfofunimportance4954]

I loved that arc!

[@Just_Some_Guy_with_a_Mustache]

The "I WANT TO LIIIIIIIIIIIIIVE" still give me goosebumps.

[@Mathignihilcehk]

I mean, normally, yes, but that specific trope is overused in One Piece. It happens with half the crew. 1: Big bad X threatens one of Luffy's crew. 2: The crew member thinks Luffy can't deal with the threat. 3: The betray Luffy. 4: Luffy launches a rescue mission. 5: They don't cooperate. 6: Luffy has to go out of his way to immediately destroy big bad X. 7: Crew rejoins. 8: Luffy forgives. OK OK, I get it, the first time it happened was great. That was with Nami, who betrayed Luffy to stay in Arlong's crew, so she could save her village. Obviously, she wouldn't trust this random guy, who she just joined, could take out a big-name pirate. THEN Robin joins the crew. She stays with him for at least a few weeks. Then she does the exact same thing Nami did. Luffy declares war on the world government, and by this time, he's said it a thousand times, he WILL become THE most powerful pirate ever, the Pirate King. He even flat-out insults Big Mom over the transponder snail and declares war with her and laughs. Next up, Jinbe does the same thing (although thankfully, he stressed that he'd be back), now worried about Big Mom, and then Sanji gets captured by Big Mom and does the same thing... so now Luffy is launching this crazy rescue operation to get him back, when he could've just fought Big Mom with all of his crew together on his own terms, now he has to run into her territory and battle her with less crew members. -sigh- Also not a fan that, in the anime, Sanji didn't stress that he intended to return after dealing with Big Mom. Had he done that, the Straw Hats might've still attempted an extraction mission, but they would've been able to be more covert and organized... instead of running around screaming for Sanji to come back. Covert missions, like the one Sanji undertook, are like a game of Bridge. You and your team-mate both have good cards to play, but you can't tell your partner exactly what you're going to do (cause then your opponent would counter it). Instead, you both have to predict what your partner is planning, and play into that hand, trusting your partner knows how to hint his intentions to you, and allowing your partner to win by leading, or following, into your team's strength. We KNOW Luffy can be covert at times. The whole -3d-2y thing was incredibly covert.

[@Raeker]

I was hoping for someone to mention this example, or possibly Nami (although a less good example). It can be said that One Piece does it too much, but like Red says that isn't a bad thing if it at least make sense - and the good thing about Oda's writing is that it always makes sense

[@666melodeath666]

mathig nihilcek Well I argue that Robin did actually want to die and sacrifice herself not like Nami who was clearly still on the Crews side and not really a damsel since she wasnt really "captured" she just had a messed up situation and she asked for help from Luffy. Robin didnt want help until she realized how much the crew cares for her. The only one who they really had to forgive was Ussop. There was no real reason for the crew to forgive Nami or Robin for things out of their control Yeah I was never that on board with Sanji leaving and the bad things you point out are mostly manga vs anime but it still makes sense within his character and even if One Piece sorta rethreads the Damsel trope Enies Lobby is still a great example of doing it right.

[@Jessie_Helms]

Obi-Wan's damseling in Clone Wars was brilliant writing. It wasn't because he was hurt, but because others were hurt every time he tried to help.

[@johnygoldbear8648]

I wonder if Tai Lung from Kung Fu Pands fits the "bad ass in distress", considering he was trapped in a lock made just for him, and the only 'hand' he gets and needs is a screw up from his keepers.

[@dj_koen1265]

Evil bad guy or ancient evil sealed away only to escape due to the inciting incident of the story is a completely different trope though

[@jooree7696]

Which, to remind, is a f**king feather

[@kimifw58]

If you count prisoners as damsels, that would be "damsel out of distress."

[@coltonwilliams4153]

@@jooree7696 Straight shit, that was one of the wildest prison breaks I’ve ever seen. That cat was unstoppable.

[@fishkittywhiskers5433]

i dont think so, the damsel is usually someone who's part of the main cast or is just generally considered to be good AKA someone who you'd WANT to rescue, tai lung is a villian, so i dont think that counts.

[@cairocopper3238]

Huh, gotta admit, you made me rethink some of my thoughts on damsels. Thanks!

[@anthonymedina9425]

There's a damsel in distress moment in the monogatari series (I think it was nisemonogatari), that I love, where the main love interest basically kidnaps the main protagonist to keep him from intervening in the story. Where he stays complacent and docile for most of the story, but when the others actually need him, it turns out that he was able to escape at anytime he wanted, but was just respecting his girlfriend's desire to keep him safe. And it's comedic, romantic, and interesting to watch

[@NoForksGiven]

I can't tell what kind of damsel Pikachu is. He tends to vary from "oh noes, i've been captured, wont someone help me? D:" to "this is fine."

[@SuperRegic]

Don't hate the damsel, hate the distress. That's not a direct response to anything I heard in the video I'm just proud I came up with that without hearing it from somewhere else first.

[@MadameTamma]

I always felt like a little bit of a hypocryte because I'm always pushing for strong selfsuficient female bad asses, but at the same time I kind of like the old fashioned "princess locked in a lost tower, we have to save her from the clutches of the evil knight" kind of stories too. Thanks Red for showing all the ways that I don't have to pick just one or the other. ☺

[@NotAFakeName1]

MadameTamma strong self sufficient badasses can be a bit of a narrative pitfall, male or female. If you're defined as being able to push your way through any situation, it doesn't leave a lot of room for flaws or character development. Now if you get yourself captured and need to be rescued/escape, that can be interesting, because then there's room for character development.

[@steampunker7]

As with all things tropish, the Damsel in Distress is, has been, and always will be a guideline and narrative shorthand, not an ironclad rule. "Distress" need not necessarily mean "helpless" and as Red points out there's a lot of ways to interpret, play with, subvert, or defy them. Case in point: while one can interpret "Damsel in Distress Classic" to in a negative, even condescending, light (i.e. women is too weak, frail, helpless to save herself) there is also a romantic, even gallant side to it (her potential suitor/friends care for her so much they are willing to risk their lives to save her.) Neither interpretation is necessarily wrong and liking the trope itself as a concept doesn't detract mean you accept and support the negative side of it.

[@blondbraid7986]

I've nothing against stories featuring rescue missions or characters that need help sometimes, but my problem with the damsel trope is how gendered it is, and that female characters still need rescue more often than male characters. There are too many movies out there where there is a team of characters, and the one female on the team is the one getting kidnapped. A big part of the problem is that in many cases, the girl getting kidnapped is the only prominent female character in the entire story. I don't think anyone would criticize the trope if there was a more even divide between men and women getting rescued on screen. The most obvious solution would be to either have more men needing rescue or more female characters participating in the rescuing.

[@carolinemcgovern4488]

@@steampunker7 Yes I agree with this!

[@grinko1222]

@@blondbraid7986 I disagree. Gender shouldn’t matter of the damsel is male or female.

[@dekushrublily]

There's one more way to end a damsel in distress scenario, one that can almost guarantee angst for days and audience tears. The heroes could utterly fail to free The Damsel. They're possibly executed JUST before rescue, either in front of one hero, or all of them. Without any time to process their grief properly, the surviving members of the group are scattered to the winds. They regroup later, older/wiser/stronger.

[@kingambrosius9125]

The One Piece method

[@gwenatabong6284]

I'm also sure a fire emblem game did that at some point, fire emblem awakening I think.

[@rhymeswithmoose228]

​@@gwenatabong6284 Spoilers for early story: Yeah. They fail to save Emmeryn, the main lord's sister and the ruler of Ylisse. Kinda different than this, though, because she's not a playable character. We also don't see anything from her time in Plegia, though that can be excused because Awakening basically never shows cutscenes in places without your characters. It's really great, and the fact that it leads into the chapter with Don't Speak Her Name makes it super impactful, to me, at least.

[@galaxystudios370]

I also thought of One Piece. Man that broke me.

[@defeatstatistics7413]

Final Fantasy X-2, the parallel trio of Paine, Nooj, and Gippal after the Den of Woe. Baralai kind of breaks that though.

[@ASquared544]

Lets be real, Mario is the reason we don't like this trope. WE GET IT! PEACH IS A HELPLESS LITTLE PUPPY!! NEVER MIND THE FACT THAT SHE HAS MAGIC POWERS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT!

[@zacharygadzinski3147]

And that she saved Mario and joined Mario in defeating Bowser. Yet after Super Mario Oddessy we're due for a sequel to Super Princess Peach and for Peach to evolve from mere plot device.

[@PhiGuy1717]

It's only in most of the main 2D and 3D platformers that Peach is a classic damsel. In many other platformers and especially the RPGs, she's more of a neoclassical damsel, a badass in distress, or even isn't a damsel at all. SMB2: Peach is a playable character from the start and is actually pretty broken because of her floating ability. SMB3: Peach isn't kidnapped until the last world of the game, and gives items to Mario beforehand. Mario RPG: Peach is kidnapped twice, but becomes a playable character after being rescued. Paper Mario: She spends her captivity gathering information for Mario to guide him to where he needs to go next, actually makes several escape attempts, and plays a big role defeating the final boss, who would've otherwise been impossible for Mario to defeat. Paper Mario 2: Similar to above, but her role in the final boss battle involves being possessed by a demon queen, beating up her captor, and serving as the final boss. Super Paper Mario: Peach starts out kidnapped and brainwashed, but is a playable character from early on and actually has quite a backbone. Mario and Luigi 1: Peach outsmarts the big bad who is out to steal her voice with a clever ploy. She still ends up kidnapped by the big bad, who for once isn't Bowser. Mario & Luigi 2: Peach uses a McGuffin to defeat and seal away the game's big bad at the start... too bad the big bad's sister was able to immediately defeat and kidnap her afterwards. The big bad's sister actually disguises herself as Peach for a time which is a major plot point. Mario & Luigi 3: Peach actually kicks Bowser out of her castle after Mario beats him up... Though nobody was prepared for the weird plot, where Peach is kidnapped again. Super Mario 3D Land: Peach is kidnapped, but she actually manages to beat up some minions and even makes an escape attempt. Bowser had use an army to catch her again. Super Princess Peach: Peach and the Mario Bros. swap roles, and she has to save them from Bowser.

[@doesntmatter2467]

The fact that she's actually competent somehow makes her worse.

[@booplesnoot1353]

this is why Zelda is better in every way

[@frannyc7248]

So people still loves peach and the Mario games

[@emeraldserena5591]

Through this whole video, my mind keeps going back to Holly Short form the Artemis Fowl series specifically the first book. [Spoilers] In the first book Artemis Fowl kidnaps Holly and instead of waiting around to be saved she tries to find her way out and success to an extent escaping her cell but not the house. Later she saves Artemis, his butler, ah, Butler and Butler's sister Juliet. To top it all of she even gets back half the ransom Artemis received for her safe return. She is one of the coolest characters I know.

[@juliasnyder7284]

ayyyy a Fowl fan! I echo the sentiment :) also the movie was *complete* trash, like if you agree!

[@VioletNKisHere]

Me and my online friends once came to the conclusion that if we were all captured, we would just talk and talk for a million years until the captor got so annoyed that we got all out. One if them wrote a story with that plot. We are such a weird bunch.

[@DimitriAlexandreBlaiddyd14]

This is basically the sixth episode of Helluva Boss lol

[@I3oo1ve]

I hate to tell you but Spongebob did this when Krabs sold his soul for 62 cents

[@abigailgriffin-wc3fm]

Oh yes, just sing the lyrics to some of the songs from cats they let you go

[@Me-vn3gz]

This just reminds me of that time when Rick Riordan decided to let Percy and Annabeth fall into Tartarus and stuff. It was very well written and I liked the way he showed how their characters reacted to the difficulties of their situation and how the rest of the seven (and Nico) were doing in their absence.

[@shadowmystic6717]

Kat The Nerdfighter SAME HIGH FIVE AND LETS BE FRIENDS

[@somebodyactually1490]

But they weren't damseled though...Nico stuck in the jar on the other hand was.

[@zeph769]

Yeah but do you remember that one time that he just straight up learnt how to control all liquids, and then Annabeth was just like "no don't do this incredibly useful thing again it's scary"? Shit was dumb.

[@somebodyactually1490]

Zephyr Nepres well he did choke a bitch with poison so I don't blame Annabeth for getting scared.

[@alex_ho]

@@zeph769 BLOOOD BENDING

[@heatherg1949]

Hey Red! I would just like to let you know that I appreciate that you take the time to explain some of the things you do. Like that, just because you prefer one thing doesn't mean the other is without value, etc. Just because you like and support "manly, badass, female characters", doesn't mean theres anything wrong with being feminine. (I'm not dissing the support of strong women by any means here) but many times I feel people get so caught up in supporting it that others kinda tend to get trampled, at the very least in situations where that is not the main focus of discussion. You just seem to do a good job at actually doing what many want or claim to do, and often seem to fall short of; being accepting/nice/not rude to everything while having personal opinions.

[@adrianmedeiros8431]

My favorite interpretations of Lois Lane and Mary Jane are unexpectedly competent damsels. With these two it's very effective because for the longest time they were the classic damsel stereotype in the minds of the general audience. So when later interpretations in the comics made them competent damsels, you kinda get the feeling that they're kinda used to it. Mary Jane got in danger so often in her teenage years/early adulthood that by the age she's portrayed in the contemporary comics, she became an expert at either avoiding it, escaping it herself or at the very least giving Peter some advantage in rescuing her.

[@newperve]

"I should hate out more than life itself. " You slip the darkness in so quick sometimes i almost don't notice it.

[@XShadOBabeX]

GASP!! OMG, your little princess damsel doodle at 0:56 is sooo cute!! I wanna hug her!!

[@Defenselessdamselindistress69]

Same

[@VoidKing666]

I think that’s part of the point

[@hyruleprotector6897]

I'm making a game on RPG Maker where the Male main character is damseled, and because of that the "Evil" Queen sees just how weak the main character is, and slowly fall for him, IS the one who saves him, and joins the team.

[@frannyc7248]

I would love to read that story

[@ForrestFox626]

Link?

[@legendarytat8278]

Mary Sue?

[@hyruleprotector6897]

@@legendarytat8278 You talking about the "Evil Queen" or the main character? Either way neither are supposed to be

[@hyruleprotector6897]

@@ForrestFox626 No, not Link

[@terukisuke5324]

Thank you for covering this topic, Red. Our latest generation appears to be obsessed with having strong female characters to the point where even when one DOES show up, nobody recognizes them or it's never enough. However from a historical standpoint, damsels needing rescue did exist. And, you know what? I actually find damsels ADORABLE, and I don't want to be ashamed for liking them. Now, don't get me wrong. I'm not saying I have fondness for characters with a personality of a bag of bricks. But there are characters with personality who seem like they fall into the damsel trope but nobody likes to acknowledge that they DO have personality... Such as the shy or wary personality. And this line of thinking has led to an over-saturation of spunky female characters whose purpose is only to "be strong" while shunning the shy unconfident characters who were never trained in combat from birth. Not everyone is a warrior... and I find that the loving hearts can be just as interesting as the fighting hearts. Think about it. The cute girl who has no combat ability yet has a heart of gold can spur on emotional dynamics, cause change of heart, make connections when a fiery personality would only ruin them (and when the fiery ones do make connections, it's so poorly written where it makes them look like a Mary Sue.) They act as a bridge for opportunity in a social way instead of a physical way. They have to solve situations through social means because they don't HAVE physical. A lot of times it will fail, if not most times. But, when she succeeds, it'll leave everyone blinking and asking, "Wait, that worked?" I wish people would be more open-minded towards the trope. I as a woman LOVE shy innocent characters because they're adorable, and it saddens me when everyone has to be strong now because it feels forced. People are strong in their own ways. They don't have to be a master of five different martial arts in order to be strong.

[@disasterrook2656]

Teru Kisuke yeah I agree it just seems that the media has just gone to over exaggerate both extremes to avoid this trope where the female is almost always just this huge badass or the always have them be more of a "girly girly" for lack of a better term that's complete uselessness is played for laughs.

[@cuervus_]

Teru Kisuke I also love them because of the amount of character development that they can get. And I'm tired of everyone only liking women because they are manly. That's a punch in the face to everyone who isn't and doesn't want to be manly.

[@terukisuke5324]

DisasterRook Yeah, and it never turns out right because the writers are making the effort disingenuous. If people are only thinking about themes, they forget how to make a person seem real, and that's how they become a trope in the first place.

[@terukisuke5324]

Nia. Exactly! I LOVE character development, and if a character has everything off the bat then they'll have no room to grow! I even have a character who was born into a mob family, and everyone has expectations for her that she has to be some gruff mob boss but she just wants to cook things and look cute and she doesn't want for there to be anything wrong with that yet people would look down on her for shirking her power if they knew her secret. She's not afraid to unleash her powers when she needs them, but she doesn't want to keep up a front all the time. She just wants to be herself, and that just happens to be a nice girl.

[@АлинаАхметова-у5ю]

Teru Kisuke I also like shy and innosent, traditionaly feminine characters, but it appears that it's realy hard to get it right. In my opinion, inability to write female charaters if they physicaly weak but strong in other ways is kinda responsible for modern idea that "strong female character" is almost never "strong feminine character". Girly girls often have all the traditionaly feminine weakness but none of the strengths. Shy and cute girls with heart of gold, are often passive, weak and dependent, but rarely have strengths associated with traditional feminity like being emotionaly supportive (like realy offering emotional support that has effect on other characters when they need it, not "author once told us that she support her friends") or being able to form connections with other people (even villains) and change hearts. I love realy like storng but feminine characters but so often girly girl are there just to look pretty and make other characters look cooler when they save her. It's easy to make interesting warriors and fighters but it's a lot harder to make an interesting damsel. Sorry for bad english I'm Russia

[@sandyholmerin2925]

Man I was suprised how well this trope can be implomented, Thanks!

[@feltrix334]

This made me realize that Holly Short is a Badass in Distress in the first Artemis Fowl book, which officially makes Artemis Fowl my favorite instance of this trope.

[@Manawolfman]

One of my stories I managed to get the furthest with was one where halfway through the story, the hero gets captured, and it's up his companions to rescue, which are a sorceress and thief coming to rescue the knight. The reason he can't get out himself is due to the usual chained and tortured scenario, but then also has a truth bomb dropped on him about his past that leaves him despondent.