Unravelling Deltarune’s Next Secret Boss with Airtight Thematic Analysis

You've seen me tackle individual themes, you've seen me talk about songs from the game, now what will you do when I... actually try to predict something? The web of confusion that Tobias Foxtrot has spun around us is finally beginning to unravel and I intend on being the crafty little bug that does it. This is a very muddied metaphor, so just watch the video and you'll understand!
Timestamps:
The Dark Truth (Prelude) 0:00
The Legend (Contention) 2:01
It's Showtime! (Meet Our Contestants) 7:29
An Ending (Conclusions) 18:09
ANOTHER HIM (Guess Who?) 21:32
Until Next Time (Postlude) 25:43
==============================
Twitter: vivat_veritas
Tumblr: tumblr.com/vivat-veritas
Patreon: / vivatveritas
Music Used:
Welcome to the World of Pokemon! (Pokemon Mystery Dungeon: Explorers of Sky)
Spamton (Deltarune)
It's Showtime! (Undertale)
Oh My... (Undertale)
You Can Always Come Home (Deltarune)
The Dark Truth (Deltarune)
Empty Town (Deltarune)
An Ending (Undertale)
Dating Tense! (Undertale)
Soul Sanctum (Hollow Knight)
It's Raining Somewhere Else (Undertale)
Undella Town Spring/Summer/Autumn (Pokemon Black 2 and White 2)

[@Vivat_Veritas]

Hey folks, thanks all so much for your various comments and opinions! It's been super cool to see everyone's thoughts and what you think could be potential for a secret boss. I just wanted to put a bit of an FAQ here so I don't find myself responding to every individual comment. Q: Why didn't you mention the chair/cactus/computer/trophy/commercial/etc? A: I only had so much time and wanted to focus on three, so I wanted to narrow it down to the three I personally thought were the most likely by the metrics I made up (see 7:10). Q: What about something that's television themed? A: The idea of it being something that is in the TV is something that is definitely likely but was outside the scope of this video. Q: What about Woody theory? A: Woody theory is great but I didn't want to invoke a specific person's theory, which might come as a surprise considering half my videos reference something Andrew Cunningham said. I feel like this video was a bit derisive towards the end and I didn't want an actual person or theory to get caught up in that. Q: Why are you so hot and cool? A: Being transgender does that.

[@lants420]

"being transgender does that" BASED

[@crimson-cloud]

As a trans women I can confirm that is almost always true not for me though asdklfnsg sfbjzgklkjb

[@lants420]

@@crimson-cloud as a trans man i can double confirm, and i’m sure you are cooler than you think you are 🖤

[@misadique845]

Still think the cage is likely.

[@quackelstheduck2040]

It's obviously the how to draw dragons book /s

[@kirbyridingyoshi28]

Personally, I think the remote is gonna be a Darkner who was "saved" from becoming a secret boss. After all, Susie digged it out of the couch cushions.

[@christiandidonna8808]

That would be pretty funny actually

[@just_peace]

Susie vs Gaster 1:0

[@kirbyridingyoshi28]

@@just_peace pretty much lol, my idea is that as Gaster was about to show the truth, Susie's' giant hand pulled them out of the cushions (which would be like canyons or something), and they became super successful really quickly afterwards. Then, they had the shadow crystal they got turned into the Shadow Mantle (by having it be incorporated into a cape), and give it to Susie as thanks.

[@ismetcancelik5052]

or she put secret boss in an opportunity it wouldn't get otherwise and that is why it requires shadow mantle which seam lost.

[@jadethenidoran]

That'd be interesting!

[@andtheniforgotit]

One thing to think about the previous secret bosses though... they're something you can't see, and never get directly hinted at. In fact, the secret bosses tend to come out of left field, and only make sense or seem obvious retroactively. You don't really know that cards are a big theme in the first world 'till you reach the card castle. As for the second chapter, spam emails are never hinted at, nor can you see any visual clue. It's retroactively that you think "aaah, of course, a repeatedly deleted and ignored spam email." Even though it's frustrating when one wants to predict and guess and feel like they have more information to piece it together... I have a feeling Chapter 3's secret boss will be something no one could see throughout the house or predict, but retroactively think "Aaah, that makes perfect sense!"

[@mrblakeboy1420]

technically, we can’t see the green crayon or the knock-off controller, we’re just told that they exist

[@dunnkids7263]

you can see the spam emails though? theres a recycle bin full of printed spam emails in the room

[@nraflower]

@@dunnkids7263you cant see them until after you leave the dark world though, before then you can only see outside the door to the computer room

[@dunnkids7263]

@@nraflower well by that logic any item in any room we havent been in could be the secret boss

[@nraflower]

@@dunnkids7263 yeah i agree

[@dragonfluf]

While Jevil and Spamton both had thematic ties to abandonment, darkness, and freedom, it's also worth noting the objects they're based on only have thematic significance in the context of their dark worlds. With the TV imagery we've seen so far, I think it's a safer bet to say chapter 3's secret boss will be something taken from television. A few guesses include an understudy, an outdated microphone/camera, a cancelled cartoon character, a washed up late night talk show host, an emergency broadcast, maybe even another commercial (tho i think that's unlikely since Spamton already fills that role). With that in mind, I really like the idea of the remote control being the secret boss, especially with the theme of control being right there in the name.

[@modestzachman758]

Good point, but counterpoint, the Dreemurr house has a lot more variety within it compared to the abandoned classroom and the computer lab. The abandoned classroom had games and toys but not much else. The computer lab had computers, but not much else. The Dreemurr house has a television, a kitchen, a bathroom, two different bedrooms, with each room containing a variety of different objects, and there is still only one TV. I still believe the TV will be the big bad of chapter 3. It just makes too much sense. What I am saying is that Chapter 3's dark world will likely be a lot weirder and a lot more varied than just a clean cut TV theme.

[@Splitboltxful]

this is kind of a deep cut, but when the king of spades throws off his cape at the start of his boss fight in chapter 1 toby said “cool mantle bro” in perfect text to speech on his anniversary stream before the release of ch2 so that might legit be the shadow mantle

[@Splitboltxful]

also bonus: Kris is definitely a big fan of joker. They’re edgy as all get out. Mfer literally has hair over their eyes lol

[@rich_gamer0667]

I think this too I think like we Will get the mantle from a boss or something

[@saurie7861]

go back to castle town in the middle of chapter 3 (perhaps the same way ralsei traveled to the cyber world) and side quest to retrieve the shadow mantle near card castle, and then return to chapter 3 to fight the secret boss.

[@aircraftgaming1994]

@@saurie7861 I believe the great door in chapter 2 says that it MAY never open again, not that it won't (if i remember correctly)

[@TrulySomeone]

@@aircraftgaming1994 * (It seems to be locked.) * (It may never open again.) Card Castle shouldn’t exist as there’s no dark fountain for it, but I wonder if maybe we’d be allowed (mostly by Ralsei) to create a dark fountain in that room AGAIN just to retrieve that item and then seal it quickly. Though I feel like he’d be way too against that idea.

[@saurie7861]

i feel like a censor bar could potentially be a big contender for a secret boss that no one is thinking about. People don't really like the idea of censorship, and censor bars would certainly fit the bill of darkness. And also interesting having a theme of being [redacted] massively correlating them to Gaster. Maybe it can even be merged with the 'friend inside me' idea, where the censorship secret boss is a sheriff who tracks down people they or Tenna don't like and want to 'censor' them. The personality and vibe could separate them from Spamton and Jevil a lot too making them more unique from the other secret bosses. Just some thought i guess. Need to think about it more.

[@cooldudeeveryday]

continuing snowgrave/bad route just gets your save file cancelled like a tv show

[@birdflox1337]

I'm surprised you didn't point out the secret bosses' seeming connection to toys. Spamton is supposed to represent spam mail, yet for some reason he's also very obviously inspired by marionette dolls, which becomes even more clear in his final fight. Jevil is a little more subtle, but I personally always thought he looked a lot like a stuffed plushie like Seam. I really like the idea that the secret boss for chapter 3 will be a character from some old cancelled TV show, represented by a woody-esque windup doll.

[@wolfkitty42]

I feel like Jevil could also be compared to a jack-in-a-box with his spring neck. I think that's the toy, right..? Hmmmmmm....

[@ADuckWithAYoutubeAccount]

⁠@@wolfkitty42IT THAT ACTUALLY MAKES SO MUCH SENSE. I also do like the idea of each secret boss tying into toys of some kind. I’d also like to add that there could be some kind of “Amusement park theme” present in the secret bosses. Jevil’s battle obviously takes place in a spinning carousel (hell, the background is a distorted picture of one), and the normal route fight with Spamton Neo has the hero’s riding on a rollercoaster the entire time. Both also have attacks that reflect that aspect of the battlefield: Jevil with the “carousel game” as he calls it, (the attack with the ducks), and Spamton’s attack with the moving carts I’m leaning towards these things being intentional, since the whole rollercoaster thing in Spamton’s fight was pretty out of left field. And doesn’t really seem to tie into other themes present with Spamton I have no idea what this could even mean? Maybe something to do with the “festival” everyone talks about in chapter 2?? (We do know it has a Ferris Wheel at least)

[@higueraft571]

And if you consider the more unhinged drug-induced idea... Potentially something comparable to Auto-Responder from Homestuck, even (potentially sharing a similar song, too). Considering Ch1 featured an unhinged purple clown who sees the world a as a game, and his "unreality", not to mention Carnival and Circus being nearly identical. Not to mention a Bling'd Jigsaw-like Doll with some relation to Souls (Wanting yours vs containing the Antagonist's, in this instance), with a song (Big Shot) being similar to another (Beatdown). Or the similarities of Light and Dark to Prospit and Derse, two forces in balance til the Players arrived, resulting in an inevitable loss for the Light, initiating the Reckoning (Angel's Heaven?) required for the Ultimate Victory. Gaster even functioning as a Lord English, with his fingerprints everywhere, potentially directly causing several events, and dominating an Aspect to a degree (Space?). Unhinged conspiracy ramblings over.

[@birdflox1337]

@@ADuckWithAKZbinAccount oh God... remember that concept art for Queen's castle, where Toby noted it should look like "that Toy Story ride"? I think the next secret boss battle may end up taking place in a shooting gallery attraction.

[@saurie7861]

i think chapter 3's amusement centered fight could likely take place in a haunted house or previously above mentioned shooting ranged

[@numberhaver7795]

The TV actually does have another connection to darkness. When you turn off a TV with a remote, it becomes dark.

[@leomathguy]

Underrated comment

[@SSADO-]

I AM SECRETLY READING THIS WHILE IN A COLLEGE LECTURE AND I LET OUT A LAUGH

[@leomathguy]

@@SSADO- sounds like a skill issue to be honest

[@CARCATGames]

With there being 7 chapters, there is a chance that Toby will use each chapter to play with a soul mechanic. Jevil was just a normal boss, but Spamton who is clearly based on Mettaton uses the yellow soul and is the only character in chapter 2 that does that. Toby said in the newsletter that chapter 3 is mainly about weird gameplay mechanics, and that may relate to the secret boss. Make of that what you will.

[@crabbchips4289]

I'm very in the camp of the secret boss using the purple soul and the "weird gameplay mechanic" relates to how the grazing mechanic operates while purple. Maybe you can move the strings closer and further apart where necessary?

[@flamingpi2245]

The purple soul is interesting. Trap mode, you’re literally moving on strings

[@dorukbozdag2716]

And it'd be interesting to see canon orange and teal/light blue soul modes,too

[@xpiredmilk5270]

Canceled cowboy segment could mean green soul

[@artemshevchuk6347]

I think that the purely speculative option is more likely than the others, since nothing pointed to Jevil or Spamton. If we knew that in chapter 1 the secret boss is associated with playing cards and abandonment. We would have guessed the joker card with 90% probability. In Chapter 2 that the Internet and abandonment, then the fandom would throw in many options like an abandoned account, a forum, a virus, and only someone would guess Spamton. Since Toby shared information that most likely the topic of Chapter 3 will be television, then the secret boss will most likely be some kind of abandoned TV show or genre. My fan theory is that the secret boss will represent a silent movie. Left unneeded after the addition of sound to movies and with a personal dislike for Mike, who is most likely short for microphone and the epitome of sound in movies.

[@bigbadgammagnome]

I had a similar thought, but I could never decide what kind of show it would be, silent program makes a lot of sense honestly. It'd be interesting how you could make a "silent" character talk through the game, maybe like how Gaster is "the man who speaks in hands", that character would have a unique way of being able to speak. Jevil and Spamton have their own speaking quirks after all, it would fit the third secret boss to have one as well.

[@doom64hunter]

This, but I think it's actually the cancelled Cowboy segment mentioned in the newsletter. It would explain all the Toy Story stuff Toby has been posting.

[@Slenderquil]

The idea of the boss being an actor for silent movies would be neat. You could find some really old merch of them tossed off to side of the road as you explore the chapter, and maybe you aren't even aware that they have a voice at all until they start monologuing before the boss fight.

[@drakath5727]

This could work if Mike was a chapter 3 boss.

[@wolfkitty42]

AHHHHHH! As a huge silent movie fan, I would love this. I'm working on some concepts for chapter 3 and in one of them I do have a silent as a boss- I'm not working on it super actively or posting it, but this thought has been so active in my brain..!

[@loganisanerd5566]

Great video! Though to your point at 16:07 , the only reason Jevil's Joker is related to darkness is that it was dropped under the cabinet that acted as the castle, and Spamton's emails were only related to darkness because they were printed out and thrown away in a bin. The couch cushions idea works in the same way.

[@undertraveler]

What about the book of hymns? It is clearly abandoned since the Dreemurr family, especially Asriel stopped going to Church, which like the flowers could represent the breaking apart of the family. The book of hymns could also connect to darkness through the aspect of Religion and potential occultism implied by Catti, two very overlooked themes in Deltarune imo. The freedom aspect is a little shaky though. But we shouldn't forget Spamton's talk of Heaven in regards to freedom.

[@itbetin230]

I was just about to say this! It can very much be connected to freedom if we think of it as "salvation"

[@doom64hunter]

Did they all stop going to church? I think only Kris has, doesn't mean Toriel doesn't go there anymore. But I agree, the religious themes are very overlooked.

[@undertraveler]

@@doom64hunter Yeah, I actually confused that with the diner. The bunny lady there says that after "things happend" only Kris and Asriel would still go there after church, not that they were the only ones going to church. But if the book of hymns was used by Asriel for choir stuff it would still count. Regarding the religious themes I'm still waiting for some youtuber to make an analysis on that, otherwise I'm gonna have to do it myself...

[@tanxplayer-7108]

it also works with the shadow mantle because when the shadow mantle is purified it turns into the sky mantle which give a resistence the electric and HOLY damage so it would it makes sense

[@doom64hunter]

@@undertraveler Hah, I've been thinking the same. Even the Festival, which is described as a Carnival, connects to the religious themes. It seems kind of important because the Christian Carnival is usually followed by Ash Wednesday, which could have some significance considering how monsters turn to dust in Undertale.

[@doom64hunter]

In regards to the discarded flowers and the TV remote, I have a feeling that these will actually be part of the final boss, and not the secret boss. The reason I think so is because these flowers are representative of the current state of Toriel and Asgore's relationship, which I personally believe will be the central theme that Chapter 3's main story will explore. It offers a great opportunity for a "Normal" route, and a "Weird" route, which would (in my speculative version of the ending of Chapter 3) involve Toriel cutting ties with Asgore completely, or making amends with Asgore. I personally believe the Weird Route would involve Toriel cutting ties and becoming more independent ("stronger", similar to Noelle in Chapter 2's weird route), while the normal route would involve her making amends with Asgore, representing a focus on friendship, much like with Berdly's fate in Chapter 2. Asgore was the chief of Hometown's police force (tying it to the overall Police & Criminals theme), and it's likely that the event that caused Asgore to leave the force also caused his relationship with Toriel to go bad. It would also directly tie the chapter into the more overarching mystery of Dess' disappearance -- that possibly being the aforementioned event. So Chapter 3's final boss will, I expect, involve the Television (Tenna) merging with the flowers in the bin, in itself becoming the amalgamation of the two central themes of the chapter, as well as being a direct callback to Undertale's Photoshop Flowey fight.

[@phlbbth5064]

something i've noticed that i've only seen a few other people mention (unless there's some comment here i haven't read lol) is that jevil and spamton's boss arenas are very much themed around carnival rides, carousel and rollercoaster for the two respectively it's practically impossible to guess what the future carnival rides are gonna be, let alone BOSSES but it's interesting. also, susie reminds kris that a festival is being prepared in hometown RIGHT AFTER talking about hypothetically bringing darkners to the light world, and that context REALLY makes me think it's something to keep in mind my personal guess is that the chapter 3 secret boss is gonna be themed around one of those carnival games where you throw balls / shoot a gun at bottles or something, utilizing the weird heart-shooting mechanic we saw in the battle clip from the spamton sweepstakes. people play these games to get a prize, so if chapter 3 happens to have a tv game show segment or something like that, i can see the ball throw game fitting thematically with the rest of the chapter

[@cosmicspacething3474]

Heart shooting mechanic?

[@crystalclover2247]

I personally think Chapter 3's secret boss could be a radio of some kind Abandoned as an outdated technology compared to television Could have picked up a radio broadcast from Gaster for its connection to shadow I'm less sure about a freedom connection but I'm sure once could be made As for a character, I think it would be cool to have them speak in third person as if it were a radioplay, I was thinking they would wear a noir detective outfit but perhaps it could change.

[@gaminganimators7000]

What do you think of the Twilight Zone theory where each secret boss is based on a character from an episode about 5 abandoned dolls trying to escape a bin. Each doll seems to have their own opinion on escaping and 2 characters match Deltarune. The Clown enjoys being trapped and sees it as freeing while The Hobo wants to escape just like Jevil sees being trapped as free and Spamton wants to escape.

[@IcyDiamond]

It’s definitely an interesting theory

[@hi-ougidemonfang]

Abstract entities like computer viruses can also be darkners so it could also be an off brand yoshi after someone threw him into a pit. Though that one line that references asriel confessing to this crime probably isn’t foreshadowing a secret boss. Though it would work thematically with themes of having no choice and wanting freedom.

[@hi-ougidemonfang]

The more I think about it the more likely it seems 😱 but it’s yoshi so it won’t happen.

[@develrandomdankmemes7586]

wtf this is genius actually of all the ideas ive heard this sounds the most like something toby would actually do also theres gotta be an amsa reference in ch3

[@ghifariasoka8272]

Okay, finally someone else on the "Chapter 3's secret boss is a game character" boat

[@IcyDiamond]

@@hi-ougidemonfangToby could also make a legally distinct parody of Yoshi

[@mrperson4542]

Personally, i think ch.3’s SB could be the VHS tapes the family have in their house. The medium of VHS has long since been abandoned due to the introduction of more efficient media formats like DVDs. In regards to why there’d be VHS tapes in the house, I’m specifically referring to the likelihood that the family in this world recorded various home movies on tapes, just like they did in Undertale. These tapes would contain personal home movies that, in the aftermath of the family’s divorce, would now be too painful to be enjoyed and would be stowed away in Toriel’s room somewhere.

[@Vakothu]

And from the True Lab in Undertale it's clear that Toriel uses VHS tapes, so it's not a stretch to imagine she did so in Deltarune too.

[@mrperson4542]

@@Vakothu Yeah i mentioned that in my second paragraph, and its not just Toriel who made home movies but the entire family.

[@riahnoel6680]

Based on the spamton sweepstakes, I kind of expect the next secret boss to bw some kind of wild west character. We got the sprites of Kris and Susie dressed as cowboys, but Toby Fox said that the cowboy segment might be "canceled." I dont think this means its being cut from the game; it think he means that the cowboy show was canceled by the TV station. Your video got me thinking more about it, and a canceled western TV show would tie into abandonment (the storyline left unfinished, the characters forgotten), darkness (the lack of stage lights, cameras etc), and freedom (most wild west storylines deal directly with this theme, featuring wandering lone wolf characters, escape from lives they left behind to go west, and the general vibe of wide open spaces). Also a boss battle based on saloon music would slap lmao. Great analysis of available evidence, I'll definitely be checking out more of your content!

[@notapro6430]

An important detail in favor of the flowers is what we know about the Shadow Mantle. Flowey (not Omega Flowey), maybe just by sheer coincidence, happens to have a literal unavoidable attack when we first meet them at the start of the game. It’s likely to me that the shadow mantle gives us a soul mode like how Spamton Neo’s was justice, which could let us dodge this unavoidable attack.

[@LiMe251]

Purple soul mode automatically puts your soul on the line you go to so it could be used to dodge attacks like that.

[@erikm8373]

My idea has been that it's Kris' old horned headband that they used to wear as a kid. Some people say that's what Ralsei comes from, but I don't like that idea as much. I think that having that as a secret boss gives more interesting opportunities for Kris as a character to face their past. I can imagine them showing up and acting like an old friend to Kris, excited that they're finally back so they can be together again. Maybe they could reveal some key details about Kris' childhood, but eventually we fight them by choosing to move on from the nostalgia of the past. It would fit with the abandonment theme, and if Gaster is the one handing out these shadow crystals, I can see him picking out something with a direct connection to Kris

[@aegisxor]

I think that Kris' headband is definitely Ralsei, but your comment about Kris' childhood was still very thought-provoking. Kris is clearly "adopted", and is the only human in Hometown as far as we know. Kris more or less fits in socially with the others at school, being seen as a weird kid at worst, so we don't really have a reason to question this arrangement at first. However, I think that this arrangement may be a bit of a special case. We don't know the broader context of how humans and monsters relate in Deltarune's setting. The "How to Care for a Human" book found in the library has me a bit worried though, for a few reasons. One, the title. "How to care for [...]" books in our world seem almost exclusively targeted at pets and plants. I wonder whether other monsters might keep a human child like a pet rather than treating it like a person. Two, the pictures of "unfamiliar humans" implies that there are humans Kris is familiar with -- seems extremely obvious at first, but unless something seriously unexpected is going on with human biology, where *are* Kris' parents? What happened to them? Kris quickly shutting the book after seeing the pictures of other humans makes me think whatever it was, it wasn't good. Also... the existence of that book implies that we're NOT in a situation anywhere similar to Undertale, where humans and monsters were at war. Wouldn't really make sense, unless things are gonna get REALLY DARK out of left field and monsters are killing parents and stealing children or something insane like that. So, Kris probably has, or had, a family... we are likely to either learn about what happened to them, or they will turn up in the story if they are still alive, at some point or another.

[@jargalo0098]

The problem with all of these objects/theories and the conversation around this boss as a whole is that people are kinda restricting themselves to physical objects that have been seen or referenced in the house. From what we can interpret of ch3, though, it seems like it will mostly be centered around TV show themed areas (weather report, cowboys, mafia). IN Ch2, most of the darkners, including the secret boss, were not physical objects at all, but digital concepts (like spam mail). I think it's equally if not more likely that the SB will be based off of a more on-theme object, something related to TV. SpookyDood's cowboy show theory is my personal favorite (and my bet on the actual boss) but I bet there are some other good ideas we could come up with if we let go of the focus on physical household objects. After all, the theme of the chapter is television, not "stuff lying around a house" (most likely).

[@develrandomdankmemes7586]

yeah i agree with you. another guy in the comments suggested it could be a discarded "yoshi" , i think more abstract ideas like these are more likely.

[@OriginalGameteer]

I've seen a theory that while the Darkners will be obviously based off TV stuff, it's possible their physical forms are based off various junk around the house. Tho who honestly knows at the end of the day

[@ghifariasoka8272]

I had a theory that the secret boss is a Sonic ripoff to reference the dead trend of Sonic-esque platformers. Games are entertainment afterall

[@noranester2009]

i love the “ITS NOT HIM” that has been circling around in the deltarune theory youtube scene for awhile now

[@doom64hunter]

The other thing I wanted to mention is that SpookyDood's Toy Story/Woody theory deserves more attention. I think it actually fits better than any of the three explored in the video. The gist of the theory is that the secret boss would be an abandoned toy (maybe Asriel's or Kris') that was the star of a cancelled Cowboy themed TV show, tying it to both the themes of being discarded and abandoned (which ties all secret bosses together), of TV shows (one major Chapter 3 theme) and of Law & Order (also likely a major theme of Chapter 3). The connection of Deltarune's Dark Worlds with Toy Story's major themes (toys coming to life, abandonment), in addition to Toby's weird Toy Story videos, as well as the hints at a cancelled Cowboy Segment in the Spring newsletter, all very strongly point towards a Cowboy-themed secret boss.

[@doom64hunter]

Criteria: > Being abandoned: Check. > Shadow Crystal: Nothing that speak against it. Though, Spamton's shadow crystal wasn't actually with him from the start, but rather, with the Mettaton Neo Robot that he takes over. Seam does explicitly state this in his dialogue. > Shadow Mantle: A mantle could also refer to a cloak, like those worn by Cowboys in Western movies. > Freedom theme: "Friend inside me" comes to mind. In the movie, Woody has a voice box that (seemingly) speaks independently through him, not unlike how Kris has a soul inside them (us, the player) that makes decisions. > Elaborate boss battles: A fight on horseback, during a wagon chase or a stampede or similar. Also, important to note that the boss fights always involve a carnival theme -- and cowboys do fit into this, more than flowers, a remote or a knife do. > Links to Ralsei and Susie: We at least already saw Susie in a Cowboy costume, so that checks out. > Part of their bodies become weapons or armor: Lots of possibilities with a cowboy -- a whip, a gun, a hat, etc. > Fitting in the Kris' Home: An abandoned toy definitely fits inside the place Kris and Asriel grew up, and it fits the TV and Police themes.

[@nuclearjello2243]

Personally with mike I think he will still fill a light antagonist role (similar to queen), because if the theme of the antagonists of the chapters representing chess pieces continues, it makes sense for chapter 3 to have two villains, as there are two dark rooks on a chess board.

[@whereismycup]

Gaster is just the fandom's "Fuck it I'm done with this bullshit"

[@KyleGK01]

Another thing about the discarded flowers: getting them from asgore to give to toriel is optional. You have to go talk to asgore and get them. Its not going to be there unless you go and get them. I think the flowers are going to be a cool thing that shows up randomly that will possibly change the story in some way. (Or possibly just make a more fancy trashy version 2 with flowers lol)

[@callumfinlayson-palmer8393]

There are flowers in the bin already but giving them may still impact it.

[@rion2499]

Nice video! :Dc One thing I’m thinking it could be is Kris’ horn headband from when they were a child. We’re all convinced that’s the object that Ralsei is in the overworld, that I think we’ve all forgotten about it. 🤔 I think such a secret boss could have very 😊interesting things to say about the nature of the audience perceiving Kris as a villain. Regardless so excited for Deltarune updates, and can’t wait to see more you your theory videos. ;3

[@michaelkindt3288]

I was going to the comments to propose this very idea. Given how Kris used to tie their identity to this headband, at how it represents a fantasy of reverse-alienation (for lack of a more sensible term) to their family, I personally imagine a darkener made from this headband literally thinking they _are_ Kris. And then this darkener could try to steal Kris's soul when they figure out they're not Kris, or something. It has a very strong discardability ties. Being a very stereotypical piece of a Halloween costume, it's very likely to be shoved in a box somewhere never to be seen again since, who reuses parts of a Halloween costume? Especially since these kinds of costume pieces tend to be very particular. It is also technically a piece of childhood clothing, something that is very often discarded for practical reasons. The only plant against it is the fact is typically an article of clothing. And clothing seems to turn into different clothing when entering a dark world, for obvious reasons. We currently don't have any evidence indicating that clothing _can't_ turn into a dark, but I could also see Toby making "clothes turn into clothes" a hard rule as someone whose whole shtick is deconstructing tropes, and as someone with a good sense of humor I can see the comedic potential in this rule. (Such as expecting a sock puppet to turn into a darkener, only to become a living gauntlet or something.)

[@higueraft571]

@@michaelkindt3288 >I personally imagine a darkener made from this headband literally thinking they are Kris. If you took the Dark Path and embraced the insane ramblings... Isnt there, by chance, a piece of "clothing" in Homestuck that fits that bill pretty well? Auto-Responder (who later renamed himself to "Lil Hal") quite LITERALLY is a Version of Dirk (a 3 years younger version in particular), created to respond to messages for him, and has issues with being his "inferior copy/a fake Dirk". Not to mention, Dirk sees AR as the "worst aspects of his personality", as well... AR later gets prototyped with Equius and, alongside half of Gamzee and Lord English, gets crammed into the puppet Lil Cal, and sent to the Distant Past, where Lil Cal plays a pivotal role bringing Lord English into the world. Also creates a second Antagonist, but not as important as LE. Then also consider there's already two other Components to LE that you could draw Parallels to, a Purple Clown who Knows Too Much, who serves his master faithfully, and a Puppet, a Vessel. (The former having a reference between the songs Carnival and Circus, and the latter between Big Shot and Beatdown. Perhaps Ch3's boss will be similar...?) Insane Ramblings over

[@notapro6430]

I think Tenna is manipulating Mike based on the lines about them, pretty sure they’ll both be the main antagonists of the chapter

[@TheSkyGuy77]

Anne Tenna and Mike Crow Phone

[@LiMe251]

I agree, also, chess theory can be used to support this, there are 2 rooks on the black side of the board, same for bishops, and knights [!]

[@sentineluno]

The two rooks...

[@matti.8465]

Gonna be honest, based on what little we've seen from Toby its VERY likely the chapter will be fully based on TV rather than the house, do the secret boss could be something more abstract rather than a physical object (like how spamton represents spam mail and not an object in the computer room)

[@RemnantCult]

Hell yeah, she's back.

[@_Pike]

He…

[@MorbyLol]

​@@_Pikewho?

[@_Pike]

@@MorbyLol Him

[@MorbyLol]

@@_Pike Gaster?

[@_Pike]

@@MorbyLol Are you autistic?? Strong autism vibes from this one

[@sanrusdyne]

Honestly my genuine guess for who the chapter 3 boss is gonna be is the How To Draw Dragons book we see in the hallway drawer. It works in a lot of ways with what we know about the secret bosses. Assuming toriel's room is the end of the chapter (i personally feel this makrs sense. As its the only room in the dreemur house thats locked to us as of right now) then we'd encounter and fight her pretty late in our journey. The dragon on the cover seemingly being oversexualized could play into the TV theming of the world, the idea that censorship prohibits creative freedom a lot on television definitley relates to the central freedom theming all the bosses have so far. She could be a painter or an illustrator which both works related to her real life counterpart and ties back to the idea of artistic expression and how it relates to freedom. This and also having some of her words bleeped out or dubbed over by an entirely different voice could also be an interesting way to relate back to the idea thay kris isnt allowed to say everything they want or is constantly having words shoved in their mouth by us

[@just_peace]

I think you're right on the flower trashbin _probably_ not being the secret boss but GOD am I looking forward to it being a normal character or an area... This has so much potential to have so much angst and to explore Dreemur's relationships in depth.

[@just_peace]

Also, very random, but this whole thing got me thinking that we haven't gotten a secret boss who's a girl yet..? Not that it matters really, it's just so accepted that 3rd dark world's s.boss is gonna be some tumblr sexifyible (sorry I made you read that) guy this thought never even crossed my mind

[@CalvinNoire]

If I remember correctly, one piece of dialogue says that asgore likes talking to flowers. So I can imagine the flower character(s?) Having a lot of information about the dreemur family, maybe even a bit of a 'Yandere' (Undertale reference) obsession to it (because of asgore).

[@basicmountaingriff]

the gaster cracktheory presented with a straight face exactly like the rest of the video KILLED me I think what I love about it is, stories don't always follow a simple pattern, and sometimes this is exactly what they do to you. they unleash something everybody thought was hidden much deeper on you immediately, although usually in a way that is not boring and which evolves everyone's understanding of the fictional world. that Gaster is not as obscure as we think and was simply out of our sight would be a mindblowing reveal. that's why, even though this is a cracktheory, I'm tempted to say it goes in the bin of "the only theories with courage" because you have to take a long shot to be able to guess what kinds of things a story could really do when it really has any options honestly I think chapter 3 would be a weird time for Gaster to show up if it was going to happen, but I have been severely wondering about chapter 6. that number is entirely too suspicious by now

[@Violet_Crumbs]

Banger video yet again, loved the spinning cat and lawyer at the end

[@orza20]

Just throwing this out there- given the TV remote idea, plus the mentions of Cathode's (crew), plus the possible television based/living room dark world, I think a battery that isn't compatible for the television remote is really fitting, since it matches previously mentioned names, provides a newer dynamic between the secret bosses, and personally i think has a lot of design potential

[@wolfkitty42]

I was drawing while listening to this and had to physically stop and stare open mouthed during your Gaster rant. I am very bad with sarcasm (and have seen some insane theories) so I was having trouble telling if it was a genuine theory or not. Your delivery also helped. This video was very engaging!

[@deebee5378]

I think the secret boss will be an HD DVD drive. Has to do with TV, has been discarded as a media format, is within Toby Fox’s age range to have experienced, and, most critically, would be very funny to me personally

[@morshmellow5755]

I've been going back through everyone's DR/UT videos and was rewatching yours this morning when suddenly this popped up in the feed. What timing.

[@TheAdvertisement]

Great video! It's a very thorough analysis of what we _know_ about secret bosses, and what we _think_ we know about them. Aka, what's actually a thematic connection between them that's going to be continued, and what's just coincidence.

[@Vivat_Veritas]

Thanks so much, I really appreciate it!!

[@elfertrn]

i would love the flowers as a boss if the flower character itself didn't care about it's own sentimental value, and the deal with them is the contrast of the player not caring that much but kris being heartbroken by a character who unintentionally is constantly representing asgore's love for toriel, with how the dark world makes characters represent their objects and with the dark world being new, the flowers are still not aware that they're just wilting flowers in a trash can, so the player is probably wanting to tell the flowers while kris is pushing back to keep a little bit of the "innocence" they represent with asgore still loving toriel and never knowing she just throws them away , and the theme of freedom is more about always being trapped but only now realizing it and losing your innocence, like how jevil made himself thing everyone else is trapped, or spamton knowing hes trapped but trying to make it big to get his freedom

[@elfertrn]

and the flowers could work as an equivalent to ralsei, while ralsei is a version of kris's brother who doesn't have to grow up and leave for college, the flowers are constantly in love and dreaming about being with their special someone, having a male and female flower on both sides of their head, never able to realize the other is there and yearning for eachother, but at the end they're trying to get as far away from eachother which leads into the secret boss

[@ChowderMeat]

Three things that could support the remote theory (albeit it's a big reach lol): 1. How a remote relates to darkness? The way remotes work is by sending binary signals to the TV. That binary takes the form infrared red light that gets flashed on and off. In otherwords a remote uses a sequence of light and darkness to communicate with the TV. 2. How a remote relates to abandonment- In recent years, traditional television has been usurped by the internet. People use television networks less, preferring to get their entertainment from streaming services and KZbin on their computers and phones. Personally speaking, I know my household got rid of our cable years ago and thus have ended up using the remote less. Perhaps something could be done with that? Instead of someone who had long been abandoned, we meet someone in the process of being abandoned? 3. My most hairbrained thought- A remote can refer to the object used to work a TV but the word is also used to describe something that is far away or distant. Perhaps a character could be conceived revolving around that word play like a person in a remote location, far away from the bounds of the game map? Is it a dumb pun? Absolutely. But it wouldn't be the first time for Toby Fox.

[@OriginalGameteer]

Can't wait for the secret boss to be behind a fake wall

[@somerandomyoutuber3509]

Other candidates that we have not seen yet may include; some kind of sentimental item, a lost toy, spare change, some kind of channel content that is often discarded, an old cd or vhs tape, M O S S , an old creation, etc. I feel like some kind of old sentimental object or creation fits best into the categories.

[@sephnitomsol2294]

Hell yeah, return of the queen -- I always love how you approach games through the lens of textual analysis; I find your videos very relaxing, and I love it when you present me with a new way to view Deltarune

[@Vivat_Veritas]

Thank you so much!! That means a lot

[@ohno6919]

Performing my sworn duty as a knower of wingdings: The text at 23:09 is unsurprisingly just 'GASTER'

[@zixvirzjghamn737]

This video "tastes" like something you would get if you threw Yourself(Vivat Veritas), a Video From JaruJaruJ, and A Video From Andrew Cunningham, into a blender.... I love it.

[@tentativegazer]

Nah this is a tad bit too safe to have Jaru DNA, I love the guy but that stuff gets WILD

[@YouMayKnowMeAsNate]

Very fun video! Glad to have you in the community!

[@JestroGameDev]

My idea was always that it could be asriel’s old game. He stopped working on it a while back, so it’s pretty abandoned, and it seems to be based off of Undertale which was an extremely free game. This is kindova stretch, but the underground was pretty dark at times (or maybe it’s powered off)

[@linkex2]

The knife also works from a gameplay standpoint, as Jevil turns into an axe for Susie, and Spamton a scarf for Ralsei, which could mean the next secret boss will give Kris a new weapon.

[@infizer0]

NEW VIVAT VERITAS VIDEO YAY!! This is a good video, I like hearing your thoughts on this topic! And thank you for pointing out the importance of considering Deltarune's themes and story when theorizing instead of just doing it for the sake of doing it. It bothers me a lot when people come up with theories without considering how those predicted events would actually fit in with Deltarune's overall message and various themes.

[@TheInfamousNumberEater]

I never really considered the TV remote! Thanks for pointing it out.

[@rebeccadavis3185]

What if it's the damn yoshi from the game and the reason you need the shadow mantle is because it's like the cape from Mario world

[@flannsyn]

It's going to be the pie. Susie and Toriel didn't finish it yet, it was abandoned and left in the dark kitchen. I'm going to return to this comment if my bonkers prediction comes true. Imagine.

[@Vivat_Veritas]

This is genuinely a banger

[@2024...................]

Plot twist: The secret boss is the How to draw Dragons book

[@insertnamehere1398]

mmmmm. the way that the categories could all easily apply to woody theory makes me grin. I am SO ready

[@AwesomeDr111]

On the topic of the TV remote and it's themes of control; The thing that it's supposed to control, the TV, had been non functional for an undetermined amount of time. It could provide some sort of relation on the player to the game/Kris. Just like Kris's similarity with spamton as a puppet with no freedom, and lost without something that's controlling it. The remote/player has no power or influence on the TV/game when it's inactive. Could be forshadowing a part of the game where we lose control of Kris for a time.

[@nebuleii]

thank u for fueling my deltarune hyperfixation.. :3

[@Wailerman]

I love the idea of Kris being an avid Joker fan

[@gq_skelly]

Based on chapters 1 and 2, at the end of chapter 3 kris is going to have to drag all of his furniture into the school's storage closet.

[@ihavenomouthandimustnya]

Jevil and Spamton both were seen as threats to the order of their respective worlds and thus were cast away. Both also had connections to the main boss as well. I'd like to think that the main boss (whether you think his name is mic or not) of chapter 3 will be a big wig TV executive. So I think the secret boss of chapter 3 will be someone who threatens the order of the TV industry. Maybe something representative of public access TV? I feel like this would also really tie in well with the theme of freedom bc the TV industry is well known for being very controlling and discouraging innovation.

[@ihavenomouthandimustnya]

I think the flowers and kris's knife are both really interesting concepts though so maybe we will see them later! Toby fox said chapter 3 is going to be less plot and more gimmicks so I think it is going to stay faithful to the TV theme and we might see more personal stuff in other dark worlds.

[@slavyanych231]

I have a theory that htird chapter might not have a secret boss that possesses a shadow crystal. My case is that 2 previous Darkworlds were created by the Knight and I think that is how characters like Seam know of what is happening in other darkworlds (they were created by the same creator and so infused with the same will). My idea is that Kris's Darkworld will work and feel quite differently BECAUSE Kris specifically created it as an escapist fantasy (my personal headcanon, yes it is quite simple). Of course, there is still a chance that Kris unintentionally added a secret boss from darker aprt of his psyche that could represent some of his fears or whatever. In this case i believe Seam would still not know about existence of this secret boss (unless Seam literally knows about cyclical nature of his world, aka that u can replay it over and over, like in a dialogue if you beat Jevil at least once and start a new save from chapter 2 you can just find a shadow crystal chilling in the player town on the left and Seam comments on you "forgetting you fought Jevil").

[@stardust7635]

My prediction’s for the proposed 1 the remote is some type of transport between the various TV Chanel themed sections who is constantly being fought over by other darkeners and has a fondness for Susie bc she saved them from the couch (is how she learns Darkeners are objects) 2 I think it would be funny if the knife Kris used to open the fountain initiate fight sequences over everything (Like a feral cat Kris set loose on the world) but can’t win any of them because they don’t have a wheeler. They know this and connately hold auditions for the position of “wielder of the weapon that made the dark fountain that’s keeping all you guys alive”. 3 if the dark world extends past the living room the flowers could be in a dump and is trying to make something new from the garbage. They would dislike Toriell on sight for discarding them for no apparent reason, if visited multiple times, Toriell will explain to them, (and by proxy you and Kris) why her, and Assgore separated.

[@SuperBatSpider]

I believe a possibility could be, since this is a TV world, a lot of shows are gone but stay around through reruns, never able to have more new episodes. If a secret boss was made of a character from a show trying to use the shadow crystal to go on another adventure or several, after it gave them awareness that their entire world is already over.

[@joewilliams-un8vu]

Maybe we use the purple soul. If the secret boss is in the Wild West area, instead of webs it would be a lasso/lassue. Also the secret bosses are themed around carnival/fair games so maybe the Wild West secret boss uses that game where you have to get your horses to the end.

[@lavendemon6906]

I love the idea of the discarded flowers boss concept, I'm not sure is as just a secret boss, but a boss that they encounter through the game plot. If Toriel is going to have any involvement in the boss battles for chapter three I think it would be great if she went through battling the flowers. I personally think that they could carry a lot of Asgores baggage seeing as he is already known to talk to his flowers. All of those awkward encounters and poorly planned conversations between Toriel and Asgore leave a lot of unresolved tension. Perhaps these flowers could speak for Asgore and shine a light on a different aspect of him that gives Toriel a better understanding of his heartbreak (and the player just generally getting a better idea behind their relationship seeing as the divorce is no longer due to dead children souls), but- uh you know I could just be hopeful that they actually gain a stable relationship (platonic or not) just coz I want Kris to be happy (.-_.- ;;) (sorry if this didn't make any sense the concept just exploded into my brain and I had to write it down before I died)

[@AbsurdistLemon]

The flowers speaking for Asgore makes perfect sense and this is the first time I've seen someone talking about it. While talking about Toriel and the flowers, Sans even said "nothing like a *captive audience*" (or something along those lines).

[@R0-83-RT]

A way the Flowers can relate to Kris & the idea of freedom is the fact flowers have basically no autonomy. Sure one can say that about any object, but the interesting thing about flowers is they aren't exactly an object, they're a living face, a living thing with no voice and next to no ability to move, but living none the less. For a more personal relationship with Kris flowers need to be nurtured and they either successfully thrive or die depending on their caretaker, with the flowers being ignored perhaps it can relate to Kris emotional needs being potentially ignored by Toriel. That last bit is speculation, though I do think more likely than not Kris and Toriel have some issues since it makes for good storytelling, and Kris is most likely had some emotional turmoil caused by the divorce of his parents and Asriel leaving to college, so I don't think it's too far fetched that their was an emotional need from Toriel that Kris needed that was unintentionally ignored.

[@ShadowSkryba]

What about The Cage? In the bed's shade Belongs to Kris for some time Literally meant to imprison

[@redpandadotjpeg2640]

Oh hell yeah I love this I’m of course thinking in the thematics of charcater And the Potential for this is very exciting The idea of the remote control is really cool- since tenna is presumably a TV maybe this Remote actually controls them behind the scenes or something Maybe to a reveal of “tenna isn’t the real villain, Remote boy is” yk? And since the new chapter seems to be based on genres of tv shows and stuff maybe a knife character could have a Horror/Thriller vibe :O Overall amazing video!! very fun writing :)

[@Apple1ceJake]

wait, is tenna short for antenna like the ones on TVs

[@redpandadotjpeg2640]

@@Apple1ceJake yeah at.east I think so ! :)

[@bigbadgammagnome]

starting off with pokemon mystery dungeon music, can already tell this will be a great video

[@KyleGK01]

Cant wait to see the pie in chapter 3. Also the heart cage is going to be a very, very interesting thing in ch.3

[@KMDmapa]

I personally think it will be some kind of TV graphic designer. You know, logos, animations etc. One fangame, Deltarune: Another Creation does a good job on this idea with their boss, Skraty

[@KMDmapa]

With the abandonment thing, well You don't see many people talking about graphic designers for news channels etc.

[@7awesomename]

My prediction is it'll be a soap opera or reality TV show. "Garbage TV." It's something we haven't seen yet. It's not like we saw a Joker card or a Spam email (afaik) prior

[@ShadowRevya9]

Think the weakness of this video’s thematic analysis is the central theme of the game doesn’t really support manifesting just anything inside the house (in fact your home life is probably what you’re fantasizing to escape from!). The dark worlds being mediums for escapism (toys, the internet, etc), chapter 3’s medium will almost certainly be television, which narrows it down a lot. Had been thinking the boss could be related to VHS tape or (owing to Asriel’s absence) video games but I really like the remote idea.

[@dcornect53]

I think the secret boss will involve both the flowers from the trash ande the "dissuaded boss drawing" on the computer in Kris's room. Since Asgore has this habit of keeping flowers under glass beauty-and-the-beast style, they may want freedom in the sense of being left to grow outside.

[@riflezen6049]

My headcanon for what the Chapter 3 Boss could be is... a VHS Tape. A VHS Tape, a wonderful memory recorded on it- happy memories of Kris, Noelle, Asgore, and Dess goofing around together. Memories that have become bittersweet and painful now, as times have changed... So, the VHS was shelved away in some obscure corner of the house, never to be seen again. The Darkner still remembers those wonderful times, and refuses to let go. They're stuck in the past, crying alone and forgotten, still sentimental about that wonderful time that constitutes their entire purpose. And the moment they see Kris in front of them, in the flesh, they see the light. ...And also they're a cowboy (err, cow... person? epic nonbiney), because of the death of the western.

[@poopdealer7096]

It could be the cage and how Chris threw his soul in it it gained a soul briefly and it could try to fight Chris to experience having a soul again

[@Kris.krisis]

The absolute madness that was the Gaster part HAHAHAHA

[@MegaLpso]

I honestly think that the boss isn't anyone of those things except maybe the TV remote. I think toby is going for the secret bosses to follow theme associated with the dark world. This theme is obviously television, so I'm thinking things associated with tvs, like movies, ads, and shows. The possibilitys are endless with this theme, that there are too many ideas that pop into my head. My main bets are: Sitcom, gameshowhost, forgotten children's show, cartoons, news Channel. Those are what I think the secret boss will be based on.

[@exammole4545]

I haven’t delved in the deltarune/undertale fandom in a hot second so my knowledge is fuzzy. Although I can’t give an idea on what the boss will be, I’m fairly sure I know something about their gimmick. Since Spamton could turn your heart yellow, and the fighting gimmick was a play on the shooting mechanic in undertale. I’m fairly certain the next heart colour will be purple, and it’ll be a play on jumping the lines. I say this because the yellow heart was the last colour to be obtained in undertale and I think they’re going in order of last seen to first seen ❤️💛💜💚🧡💙

[@semicolon4452]

It might be worth considering the angle that Shadow Crystals are tied to aspiration - it feels like the NEO part of Spamton was very important, that the body was full of the hopes and aspirations of Mettaton. That's what gave it the power that Spamton desired, and maybe that power is due to the Shadow Crystal?

[@the_british_isles]

i believe that the final secret boss might be the vessal that is discarded at the beginning of chapter one

[@cherrypuddles]

My personal favourite secret boss theory is a(nother)-him, a-Mario (or whatever legally distinct version Toby uses to avoid being assassinated by Miyamoto). Control: Kris forcing him to kill Yoshi has glaringly obvious parallels. Abandonment: Most of the gaming equipment seems to be have abandoned after Asriel left. (if that isn't strong enough evidence look up the sales of the Wii U) Darkness: Some people have speculated that the Shadow Mantle is a corrupted version of the cape from Super Mario World. Beyond that there's not too much. Other: Mario parallels Kris *really* well. His connection with Yoshi parallels Kris' relationship with Susie (or Berdly on Snowgrave), they're both main characters being controled by a player-entity, and you could argue Kris is the Luigi to Asriel's Mario (which would make Luigi the secret boss then, but that doesn't contradict any other evidence listed).

[@gravedigger69420]

it's a bit of a long shot now that i think more about it, but my first thought when you listed the criteria was the cage and wagon in kris' room. if i were gonna take an actual guess, i think chapter 3's secret boss is gonna be some defunct or outdated film tech - a vhs tape, silent film reel, maybe even a kinetoscope (my personal favorite option. imagine what a fight that would be - toby did say chapter 3 was mostly about weird gameplay mechanics.)

[@idioticlight]

8:50 i thought the secret bossrs being blood castes was already a terrifying observation, but thats even worse

[@embryodemocracy1275]

Your video actually gave me a small realization that Noone has brought up yet. Recently I was playing omori on Xbox until they removed it (WHY) and I found it interesting to have deltarune/undertale in mind while playing. It almost felt like Toby had played omori right before having THE dream. And this video got me thinking about sweetheart and captain's breakup, and how they both are the big bad of two separate sections of the game. What if toriel's house was one kingdom, and asgores shop was another? This would allow the discarded flowers to not be strictly dreemurr related but instead relate to the darkners and the dark world. Introducing 2 new kingdoms to us and the flowers being a flower kingdom darkner in a Cowboy kingdom darkworld.

[@embryodemocracy1275]

Its early in the morning

[@artemis_173]

omori came out long after Toby had his dream in 2013... He even said that someone is simultaneously working on something similar to deltarune a few years back

[@cosmicspacething3474]

I think the weather duo from the Spamton sweepstakes are possibly candidates for a secret boss. Category 1: The thing is, I don’t think the theme is abandonment. I think it’s being FORGOTTEN. “Don’t forget” is a phrase that’s repeated in Undertale, and Deltarune. The weather forecast is usually forgotten by the next day so they would fit in with that theme Category 2: Darkness. The Moon is associated with night, and Clouds block out sunlight in the day, so there could be some sort of connection there. Usually the weather, or any sort of news is told directly to the audience through the TV, so they could have some degree of self awareness. Category 3: Freedom. I’m not entirely sure about this one mainly because the we literally only have one line of dialogue from them so far. What type of freedom would they crave? I guess only time will tell.

[@brilliant_Potato]

I will be very disappointed if not all of the secret bosses are divorced

[@rafaelrivera7594]

I made a theory a while back that i dont know if it even relates to this but it was that every darkworld already exist not that there being created by the knight but the knight opening a gateway to enter and if many of these gateway open at the same time it can destroy the universe the spamton sweetstakes really helps this theory but i think the secret boss is gonna be the control remote or the plants

[@vevesumi]

something else the secret bosses could be tied to are the soul powers/colors from UT? we only have 2 examples now but it DOES look like its going backwards, starting with red and going to yellow.

[@KitzenVonCatzen1134]

one of my favorite theories about the secret boss has to do with the tv theme, and in that sense, is more similar to spamton see, when was the last time youve seen a cowboy/western show/movie? and what toby said about cancellation in the summer newsletter freedom... uhh... idk. i think this is worth considering but now that i think about it maybe not

[@eliascontreras5170]

Adding to the topic of freedom and as a fun fact, both the jevil and spamton neo fights feature the dialog "*The air crackles with freedom." whenever a turn is given to the player.

[@remukko5178]

I can trust a pmd ost lover........ i'll listen

[@kaulianpower]

when chapters 3, 4 and 5 come out most theories will get automatically discarded or confirmed, and we'll also get like three times the theories we had before.

[@GwainSagaFanChannel]

Take your time with your videos they always very enjoyable to watch maybe also poste a community message with video link

[@MordorfLemon]

I only thought of this while watching yout video, but if Asriel and Kris played in front of the tv it'd be reasonable to assume a toy of some kind fell under the cabinet, so maybe something like that? That could tie into the green crayon being missing in the box, but I don't know how well it'd play into the tv theme

[@AbsurdistLemon]

The green crayon could play into a green soul mode

[@bornasotoudeh4044]

I like the idea of the knife as a secret boss, but don't think it's likely. However, I would like to make one comparison. The knife might relate to freedom because it is forced to do someone else's will. The blade can't do anything on its own, it can only be used as a tool. That seems like a decent comparison to make.

[@Tristeve]

"Alright so i have basically nothing more to watch it's 1am and i need to wake up tomorow at 9am so i have no reason not to go to (try to) sleep" KZbin : *new vivat veritas video*

[@In.New.York.I.Milly.Rock.]

Secret boss will be representative of a cancelled TV show. Probably the cowboy one.

[@i010001]

Hmm... The secret bosses we have seen all have been contacted by someone before, or realized a truth. They have some deep history, and that makes them interesting. I think something with no foreshadowing might be a little underwhelming... But is there anything in the house which we have seen and from which we can extrapolate a history? For example, the Cat Petterz RPG may be a candidate? Just spitballing here... We have had that lore dump where Spamton sent Noelle a Pipis for a sister game to that one, which may be an association with Spamton to this series in general. The game itself was Catti and Catty's, and Catti taught Kris about the occult and was also close friends with Noelle (You have to have Noelle pet a tasque to learn that, which requires you abort a weird route by being nice to a tasque. But it's revealed she has, at some point, pet Catti.) These associations do imply some potential association with a shadow crystal - Maybe this is the game Noelle got a Pipis in, maybe Catti meticulously raised the perfect Goth Cat at a child, maybe a young Catti and Kris sat around doing Creepypasta Rituals on it, etc. There is also absolutely a theme of abandonment. The game itself was either never returned or was given as a hand-me-down to Kris and Asriel, which is a form of abandonment. But more interestingly, the Cat Petterz RPG would probably have a save file, or even a Virtual Pet inside, which was abandoned. If this is like a raising sim/RPG similar to Digimon World, for example, then a Cat in there was raised and played with and loved... and then one day abandoned by it's creator. This can tie into a few things - Susie is implied to not have a great home life, Kris is adopted and though their life is generally healthy (if not perfect) we do know they had some issues feeling normal growing up, etc. There is an innate, specifically parental abandonment angle there. On the other hand, if it's just an RPG about cats... Well, think of all the games you played and never finished. Here you have a unique case of a different party, on their own quest to save the world, following their own set storyline, only to have that be abandoned one day. That parallels Kris and Susie in an entirely different way, of course. We also have already seen parallels between Dragon Blazers and the Dark World adventures, so this specifically being an RPG which Kris has played in their youth may also have lore implications. And, it would all make for a rather fun battle, giving an excuse to transparently play with RPG elements - and we know the love Toby has for Retro RPGs In either case - Being a virtual pet chained to a cartridge not played in half a decade, or being an RPG protagonist shackled to a game's linear story? There's a lot of potential for a "Freedom" narrative there. And whatever it materializes as would intuitively be Cat Element - just as Spamton was Puppet, and with all the baggage attached to it that implies with that weird elemental pairing. Note that meta-narratively, it would make a lot of sense for the game to formally introduce the Elemental Resistance system in-game next chapter, as we have found several items with it and it has been hinted at with the message about the Shadow Mantle - So a player importing their file from Chapter 2 would already have some equipment to play into a potential Cat-elemental boss fight. That, and with the aforementioned potential for openly referencing RPGs, the potential for something involved and elaborate is there. And you even have an excuse for some really interesting music, given the retro game theme. And any equipment would write itself - You've already gotten a weapon for Ralsei and Susie. The next has to be Kris' weapon. And what else to obtain as a unique Kris weapon, but a sword from an RPG? Of course, that Cat Element thing is also a problem - Why, then, would we need a Shadow Mantle? Maybe they use Cat and Shadow attacks? Well, that's a musing, haha

[@TheSkittlesAddict]

My personal theory is: The dark world’s theme for chapter 3 is tv, right? Like videos and shows? Well, what if the secret boss could be apart of the whole “video killed the radio star” shtick? Imagine this. A 1950’s style parlor behind a tv show set. You get there by talking to a specific npc reminiscing on an old memory of a diner, and talking to him enough gives you the key to the back door of the set. It’s run down and disgusting, rotting food and drinks cluttering the place. The lights are off and it’s hard to see much, The fun gang comes across the owner of this establishment, a radio themed darker named dolline(mixture of Pauline and dolly, both popular names at the time.) she’s very robot like, has three sets of arms like a spider, and rolls around on roller skates. She excitedly brings the fun gang to the front bar, getting their orders and setting the rotting food down to them. She’s convinced this establishment is still running, that the radio is still an alive and popular thing in homes. She was told the truth about her existence long ago, and the idea of it spirals her into a madness where she goes into a denial about everything she knew and loved. To her, the diner is still open and she’s still the star of the show. The fight starts with her throwing a tantrum after Susie and ralsei try to tell her that there’s no one there but them. That this place is abandoned. Her attacks are things like throwing plates, extending her arms in a grab to try to get the soul, and other burger, fries, and milkshake related bullets and attacks. She could either play into the Green soul(giving them a plate to block other plates coming from all sides) or the Purple Heart(her spider arms, yk). It ends with her breaking down, screaming and crying about how all of this _is_ real, she _is_ still open, and that the new fangled TV will never go far. She’s still the radio star. She isn’t abandoned, left in the dark. She calms down and surrenders, having one final moment and leaving a shadow crystal behind.