What Actually is a Sorcerer?

Sorcerers have a real identity problem in D&D 5E. From common misconceptions about their origin, to subclasses that don't advance the already broad theming, sorcerers often feel out of place.
Here's my thoughts on making them work creatively.
#dnd #dnd5e #sorcerer #worldbuilding

[@trappleton]

Oh wow. "Lycanthrope who mistakenly believes they're a child of the tides" is immediately going into my overstuffed character ideas folder, I love it.

[@1manApocalypse_CP]

Just imagine the subtle hints and then the huge of "Wait, my power comes from the moon?"

[@Ditidos]

I see them as magical mutants, so their origin works on superhero logic (just magic radiation instead of regular radiation). A shame there isn't a radioactive one yet, it would drive the point home much better.

[@Alche_mist]

Make Radiant Soul sorcerer with this kind of origin and surprisingly combining radiant and sickness-inducing effects.

[@user-xv8lr9dc3v]

WebDm has one in their Weird Wastelands -supplement book. It goes Nova eventually 🧐

[@nyanbrox5418]

literally divine soul, radiation deals radiant damage, obviously, so if you want to blast radiation magic, go divine soul, reflavour it as a highly radioactive bomb user with spells like spirit guardiand being reflavoured as emmitting high levels of gamma radiation, slowly killing everyone around you if you want to watch people dying of radiation sickness, try the sickening radiance spell! even a tarrasque will die in it eventually, nothing survives that level of radiation for too long

[@Mochachocakon]

super heroes that are stuck with a D8

[@theapexsurvivor9538]

I mean, wildmagic is D&D magic radiation...

[@derskalde4973]

Want to your fighter to multiclass into dragon blood sorcerer? Why not take a look at Siegfried the dragonslayer? He bathed in the dragons blood, which made his skin invulnerable, and ingested a little bit, which caused him to understand birds. Talk with your DM, and if they give the green light, go slay a dragon. Alternatively, you can plan with your DM, that your character has latent sorcerous powers inside them. They have the potential, it just hasn't manifested. So maybe contact with a Power related to your latent abilities, or a very stressfull Situation, like a near death experience, for example, is what it needed for you to unlock this potential.

[@saeyabor]

This is why I think 5E Eldritch Knights should pick their casting stat; why EK itself, Bladesinger, and Dragon Disciple made more sense as "prestige classes;" and why 2E human "dual-class" and non-human "multiclass" made more sense. What's more plausible within the existing lore? A) "I learned some arcane magic the way a wizard does and work it into my fighting style *_instead of_* other specializations (Fighter subclasses), but I'm not a "spellblade" or "Duskblade" or anything else that implies an inherently magical-per-se martial art" OR B) "I was already a fully-trained knight when [events in adventuring career] fully activated my initially-weak sorcerer potential, and now I can multiclass into the real thing _with good synergy._"?

[@Drudenfusz]

I see Sorcerers like Mutants in Marvel, sure it can be passed down but one could also be the first to have that x-gene. Sorcerers as psionics would have the benefit that the matamagic would feel more fitting, sure, but overall I would say it reduces class identity, since then the class starts to feel much more cerebral and thus more similar to the Wizard.

[@TheGloryXros]

Yea, I always thought that if Psions should be in the game, they should be a Sorceror Subclass.

[@theintrovertedarcanist984]

This also fits well with the possible discrimination and extermination. Like a medieval fantasy Days of Future Past.

[@InfectedSean]

I've always defined sorcerers as "Innate casters", their defining trait being that the magic they use comes from within, as opposed to wizards, that learns spells by being taught or studying magic. The reason as to how they gained their powers, whether by bloodline or other means, was just flavour text, or an explanation.

[@erikschaal4124]

They are a source of magic. A sourcerer.

[@iremainteague5653]

The way I see it is that wizard's devote time and effort to learn magic, warlocks get given access to magic by powerful entities, and sorcerer's are magic innately. In the same way that there are academics who study mathematics(wizards), there are academics who make a name by piggybacking on others work(warlock), and there are occasionally people who can just do incredibly complex mathematical equations in their heads (sorcerers).

[@JacobGrim]

But what's stopping the Sorcerer from doing what the Wizard does to master their magic? Someone who can do math really well innately can still study math just like anyone else and use their talent to get further than those people (Basically wouldn't Einstein be a sorcerer who studied as a wizard since he was both talented and educated?)

[@harrysarso]

@@JacobGrim its not a good analogy its more like a handyman accidentally figured out the conversion from quatum to clasical gravity but isnt sure how he did it but somehow he can do it again

[@iremainteague5653]

@MrGrim-ml2un nothing is stopping them, but they'd be taking wizard levels if they devoted significant down time to study vs the sorcerous knowledge which is innate.

[@BeaglzRok1]

​@@iremainteague5653 I think the idea is closer to working out instead of studying biology. You can know how a muscle flexes or how your heart pumps blood, but it won't make you stronger or lower your blood pressure unless you use that knowledge to make yourself some sort of steroid or blood thinner. Sorcerers gaining sorcerer levels "feel out" their magical control based on lived experience, as opposed to Wizards that treat magical control as a subject of objective fact and study; the nuance between empirical vs logical. Warlocks are a separate camp, being enlightened by an outside Patron (willingly or not, GOOlocks for instance don't exactly negotiate terms for tutelage) to a separate way of existence, and being inducted to that ability to manifest a "new normal," almost like how a Paladin manifests abilities solely through self-confidence in the dogma of their Oath/lifestyle. Neither is natural to PEOPLE, but it's natural to THEM for all written languages to be comprehensible, or be so fearless in the face of supernatural power that grips the soul that it extends to your allies as well.

[@eatingtheleaf4659]

@@JacobGrimMagic ADHD

[@nagido2579]

I personally like the idea that the difference between the arcane classes lies in how they interact with magic. Wizards can't see, smell or taste magic, they observe the world around them and notice the effects of magic. They then study those effects, build foci and other tools that allow them to interact with magic and eventually create a spell to replicate the observed effect or at least something derived from what they observed. They are basically scientists. Warlock gain magic through their pact, and Bards ... well, Bards are weird. Meanwile, sorcerers DO see, hear, feel, smell, and taste magic. They can see the Weave, see how magic flows and interacts with the world. But there is a problem. What they see is too much for a mortal mind, and that's where sublcasses, and the limited spell selection, come into play. They are filters. A lense through which sorcerers view magic, meant to protect them. How do they acquire that filter? Completely up to the player. Maybe the God(dess) of Magic created a benevolent saveguard? Maybe some Being noticed the budding sorcerer, and gave a helping hand? Maybe the sorcerer likes dragons, and subconsciously called out to a scaly protector, thus gaining some draconic traits in the process?

[@JacobGrim]

I really like this explanation. However it still doesn't stop the Sorcerer from utilizing that magic perception to simply become a better Wizard, right? I feel like it would do nothing but enhance their wizarding skills (even just within those filters you talked about). And multiclassing doesn't make much sense either because it just makes both sides weaker in the end rather than enhancing the Wizard side or the Sorcerer side (you're never gonna reach 20th level in either of them if you multiclass, even though it would logically make you faster at progressing as a wizard or just more powerful as one) What do you think?

[@nagido2579]

@@JacobGrim Hm, yes, that is a bit of a conundrum, and sort of the problem with the Sorcerer in general, since the class essentially is a "Wizard" with a gift for magic. That being said, the magic senses don't need to be absolute, not at level 1 nor at level 20, and if anything, it could be said that every Sorcerer has an "awakening" -- the moment in life when they become a sorcerer. At that moment, they get a glimpse of the Weave (or whatever the DM homebrewed) in all its glory. Then their "filters" (i.e. subclass) come into play, and they see magic through a pinhole. Leveling as a Sorcerer is what allows them to see more. That's how the get access to more spells. The Sorcerer would have to progress as a Sorcerer to perceive more, and what they perceive may not be all that useful to a Wizard: "What's the Weave like?", asks the Wizard. "It smells nice, like bedding that dried in the sun on a beautiful sommer day ...", replies the Sorcerer. "Right ...", says the Wizard. Obviously, this awakening could be described with different senses. The Weave isn't something physical, nor something meant to be perceived by a mortal, meaning that the brain would interpret it in any number of ways that can be entirely unique to the Sorcerer. A grand melody, a soft breeze, a symphony of fragrances? Anything goes. Maybe something like that?

[@crunchydragontreats6692]

@@nagido2579 Sometimes the Weave smells like the color of 9 on a high mountain breeze. Sometimes it feels like shape of liquid brimstone in the space between a dragons heart beats. When a sorcerer glimpses the Weave, they can only express it in a Synesthesic way that the learned wizards cannot comprehend. The wise Druid might glean a better understanding than the wizard, but the artistic bard just gets it. Of course each sorcerer will interpret the Weave differently and each might interpret it differently depending on what they are doing with the Weave at the time. In my opinion. Allegedly. Grab your ketchup and crunch away my friends.

[@Dunybrook]

Sorcery based on Constitution instead of Charisma is my favorite idea for D&D. I usually do tie all spellcasters to bloodlines such as warlocks giving rise to sorcerers, sorcerers to wizards, wizards to bards, divine casters to mystics, etc. But always let the players come up with their own origins if they want.

[@JediNiyte]

I actually like that.

[@deaconlasagna8570]

yeah theres a cool logic to that: normal mortals make deals with immortal beings, this causes their descendants to be influenced by the magic of those beings, and then wizards are the non-magical nerds who study and learn how to reproduce the magical phenomena of sorcery. and bards are... just scallywags who study just enough wizardry to be REALLY good at the lute and have a cool time?

[@JediNiyte]

Great video, G! I've always thought of the distinction between arcane casters (Wizards, Sorcerers, Bards, and Warlocks) this way. When they cast spells, they're doing the same thing - using metaphysical linguistics, somatic geometry, and material catalysts to bend and reshape the foundational laws of nature. However, they come to their knowledge in very different ways. Here's how I see it. Wizards are the hardworking disciplinarians who hunker down, do their homework, and grow in power fueled by love of the subject matter. They're the consummate good students who may not be rich or talented, but they get there because they refuse to give up. Warlocks fast-track their understanding, doing an end-run around the hard work by learning short-cuts from otherwordly entities in exchange for something. I think of them as the rich kids who can afford private lessons and high-end tutors, being able to avoid the traditional education system altogether...for a price. Bards to me are like the kids who figured out math because they took piano lessons. Their art gave them insight into the larger patterns underlying reality and they were able to make intuitive leaps into the knowledge. Think about the kid in your math class who ALWAYS got the right answer but could never show their work. They just always said it FELT right. And finally Sorcerers. You know that kid in your college math class that NEVER came to class but showed up for the test and aced it anyway? That's the sorcerer to me. The kid that was BORN thinking in equations and probabilities. He does calculus in his head the same way the rest of recite nursery rhymes, and can't understand why no one else gets it. In my head canon, they're all doing the math, they just come by their ability to calculate in different ways. Does that make sense?

[@crunchydragontreats6692]

Best analogy I’ve read. All of the magic users (not just arcane) have something outside themselves to help them in manipulating and manifesting magic. All except the sorcerer. The sorcerer can just do it. Grab your ketchup and crunch away my friends.

[@pwnyboy9714]

In my little hobby project, Sorcerer Subclasses are called Awakenings to avoid the perception of needing to be related to a Bloodline. The only requirement for a Sorcerer is that they own their own Magic. No one can take it away, they simply have magic that awakens in their being. There is one fringe case in my system, The Iconoclast Sorcerer, or "Kaiju" sorcerer, who harbors a powerful entity within their system that they draw on and transform into but that entity is not likely to with hold its power when it counts since it dies if its host dies.

[@jgr7487]

I still want to play a situational (non-hereditary) Shadow Sorcerer, who has low Int & low Wis. "I was walking back home, got the wrong turn & found myself in the Shadowfell. Since then, I got these wicked powers!" That said, the bloodline related Sorcerery might be even a marker of title inheritance or something that helps someone to become a noble.

[@BeaglzRok1]

Sorcerers I find are best used as a result of magic manifesting from the character's environment that alters them biologically. You can spontaneously be born a Sorcerer of almost any type when influenced by the right circumstances, and can be made into a Sorcerer if you encounter something powerful later in life that thoroughly changes you to your core, like the radioactive spider bite from Spider-Man. Examples: A Greyhawk Valley Elf was born with Shadow Sorcery on account of his people having historically been in close proximity to portals to the Shadowfell, it manifesting more as a matter of recessive traits becoming apparent in the bloodline. This led to immediate discrimination, seeing him as a threat to the people and an omen that the Shadowfell threats that drove them from their ancestral home have followed them into their last bastion. None of this was helped by the local Wizard King having outlawed Sorcerers in the name of public safety and imprisoning him for his own experiments into the Shadowfell's magic, before the elf escaped to the ancestral dark forest to plot his revenge. A Realms High Elf of the Dalelands was a fraternal twin born with Phoenix Sorcery, having been said to "have inherited all the magic of her brother as well as her own" with no other explanation really being known aside from being from a distant line that claims exceptionally minor nobility of Myth Drannor. Her son, to his disappointment, was born with next to no natural magical ability, (the child's father being a very accomplished Druid could mean the magics were neutralized, she could be a magical siphon,) but no one really knows for sure why and to their at-most-14-INT knowledge, there's not much any of them can do about it. A Krynn Human goes on a madcap experiment and infuses himself with dragon blood in order to make himself a Draconian, instead merely manifesting draconic magic as it integrates into his body. This is seen as both a clear threat to the political balance if the process can be replicated to produce magical warriors and as such is condemned as an absolutely insane act that has no business being done. How you differentiate them from Warlocks (who are also vague and misunderstood) is that they're the result of a normal person learning a method (intentionally or not) to harness an internal magical potential in their soul (may be granted for those that like a Fey/Fiend retracting Warlock powers on a whim, may be inherent if naturally self-confident and ambitious; NOT a barely-controllable font of endless power like Sorcerers have) in the same way great beings of immense ability force reality to bend to their natural state simply by existing; an Efreet causes flame to spontaneously appear to mirror its attunement with the Plane of Fire, an Archfey magically imposes obedience to their personal fey rules through innate Charm or Fear. This idea is rooted in its original 3.5e iteration of Warlocks being closer to what 5e would call an Innate Spellcaster, with at-will Invocation spell-like abilities that don't require components beyond the Action of effort to warp reality, instead of a Spontaneous/Spells Known caster with a set amount of stamina/control over magic in the form of Spell Slots. Will say up-front that this interpretation ignores the other 3.5e part that says that Warlocks explicitly come from magical bloodlines and are "born, not made," before going on to say that like the Sorcerer they might just be the initial Pact-maker or a blameless conduit or tool of supernatural powers. This all being opposed to 5e that offers all Warlocks as merely knowledge-seekers: either CHA-based students of unorthodox teachers in exchange for unorthodox payment, despite patrons like GOO or Fathomless more likely than not having no clue that the character exists to teach; or CHA-based Clerics leading cults of praise for powerful beings and randomly being inspired by forbidden lore counting as a Pact. Example: A Realms Human whose ancestry traces back to Zakhara, Land of Fate and home of Genies, took over a Pact with a Pit Fiend for the strength and knowledge to fake her death and leave the band of smugglers she was stuck with, hoping to make a new life as a musician that she dreamed of when she was a child. Per the terms of her contract, in exchange for further tutelage on how to wield her powers in the way that she wants (lightning instead of hellfire, illusions, charms, teleportation, levitation/flight, Tongues and True Polymorph. Basically, Fey/Bard magic), she must slay powerful creatures with either her Eldritch Blast or her Pact Weapon, damning them to Hell and servitude to her Patron. She does her best to only kill Evil creatures to do so, hoping it'll be some small recompense for selfishly taking life for personal gain and bringing more fiendish influence into the world. During her practice of harnessing innate magic, independent study, and MANY instances of telepathic communication with fiends and later aberrations (up to and including face-tanking EIGHT Mind Flayer/Elder Brain Mind Blasts in under an hour), realized that the reason her Patron never revokes her power is that the magical potential isn't his to revoke, and taught herself to augment her magic with mere thought, willpower, and natural ability (Spell Sniper with Sorcerer spell list Shocking Grasp, Metamagic Adept for Distant + Subtle Spell, Synaptic Static). Any children she has will be influenced by the cacophony of powers she's dabbled in, as well as the magic of her Fey Wild Soul Barbarian husband, and will in order of likeliness be born as Tieflings, Wild Magic/Storm/Aberrant Mind Sorcerers, and/or capable of being taught to be Fiend/Fey/Genie Warlocks. Assuming it's not something barely related like a Divine Soul Sorcerer due to Torm being thankful for the safe return of his Planetar, completely unrelated like Shadow Sorcerer due to the mixing of Fiend and Fey, or nothing special at all because it all cancels into a soup of too much spice. Psionics are an odd beast, being perfectly fine as a non-magical parallel to magic, but due to the use of Power Points can sometimes come off as a weird INT-casting Monk, and due to its unaffected-by-magic nature easily falls into "Mewtwo Wars" if there isn't any other alternative to Mystic/Psionicist to counter them from being "better magic." That being said, I think they're the nice third point on the triangle: Psionics are non-magical, a product of your biology (trained, untrained if prodigy), and based in mind-over-matter willpower (INT/very maybe CON if it's the "power nosebleed" type of psychic); Sorcery is magical, a product of your biology (untrained or created), and based in harnessing the constant buildup of generating magical energy (CHA/CON); Occultism is magical, not a product of your biology (soul power), and based in mind-over-matter willpower (INT/CHA, depends on patron/character).

[@rpghorrorstories]

I dunno, wizards may have written the book on magic, but what did they study to write that book?

[@devourlordasmodeus]

The weave

[@claude-alexandretrudeau1830]

For all spellcasting classes, magic is something you do. And it's hard and that's why you have to pay a price, whether it's studying at the expense of everything else or entering in a form of service. Bards are the lucky ones because they get to study the efforts of everyone else and replicate through art. Others may have paid the price, but a price was paid nonetheless. But for Sorcerers, magic is something you are. By virtue of that, it is therefore free. That's why I never felt like they belonged. If magic is free, why whould they be restrained at all? Why can't they be a full caster on top of being a full fighter? It's not like they are bogged down by studies or devotions. It just grows on its own along with you.

[@danielwesley5051]

An interesting concept that could spice up sorcerers is an equal and opposite effect for magic. The potent energies of magic affecting the user in several different ways depending on the kind of spells they use. Fire sorcerers might find their hair turning red and their temper shortening as their skills increase. A master illusion sorcerer might constantly shift form with his shifting moods or become a compulsive liar.

[@armorclasshero2103]

I'd say ranger is the class with least individually. They're basically just fighters with the outlander background.

[@frankb3347]

Drawing from real life history in my setting the nobility is all about maintaining the bloodline. Often leading to arranged marriages and even "family loving". Which can lead to things like distinctive chins and whatnot.

[@sketchasaurrex4087]

I really like the sorcerer-wizard dichotomy. Both are shapers and conjurers of the very same arcane magic. One calls upon something unique within himself, be it blood or his soul/essence, where the other had to study and practice to summon forth the same spell. The reverse is that while the sorcerer has some innate knowledge because it's like breathing for him to cast a spell, he is not as well versed and studied in it. The wizard has spent countless days reading texts, practicing the proper gestures, reciting the correct incantations, and gathering the needed materials to tap into the magic. The wizard is far more knowledgeable and varied, able to apply his knowledge and change up what he can cast while the sorcerer is limited. One is lucky to have been born with innate magic, the other has desired it and worked diligently for years to understand and shape the world with his will through magic. It's really cool. Don't sully it by reflavoring it as psionics, that's a disservice to both sorcerers and psionics.

[@Alche_mist]

When it comes to spellcasting abilities, I can see it work based on how the characters invoke them: Intelligence casters take magic like calculus. They have to learn the subtleties and practice. This is what Wizards, Artificers and Bards do. Charisma casters have their powers tied - whether tightly or loosely - to some supernatural beings that had to "activate" something in them, giving them their boons (not necessarily willingly and maybe for a price). This is the way of Warlocks, Paladins and Clerics. Finally, Druids, Rangers and Sorcerers would be Wisdom casters. Their power comes from and grows with their attunement to their surroundings (not just natural, but also the intuitive understanding of the magic flows) and even themselves.

[@chadam917]

Clerics cast from wisdom and sorcerors cast from charisma though

[@caseyw1288]

I love this! I personally would put warlocks in intelligence (to give the flavor of being taught magic by a powerful being) and keep bards in charisma (with the idea that their magic comes from others' perceptions of them based on their performance) but i am a big fan of wis based sorcerers

[@morrigankasa570]

I unfortunately don't have a group to play with:( But I have created 12 different lvl 1 characters in case I found a group. 1 of them is a Chaotic Neutral Female Sea Elf Far Traveler background Storm Sorcerer. Her Father is a Tempest Domain Cleric & her Mother is a Swashbuckler Rogue. She was born during a massive Storm caused by Stronmaus and was influenced/changed by that storm. So her father helped teach her somewhat how to control/use that magic, SINCE he understood much of it being a Tempest Domain Cleric.

[@noelle1943]

Our problem with sorcerer is the fact its not a choice, you were just given this power for free while everyone else had to work for anything close.

[@tkc1129]

When I first started playing, I briefly wanted to multiclass into Sorceror, but my DM told me I couldn't. He said since sorcerous power is hereditary, you can only be one starting at first level. I didn't like that idea and still don't. I think there should be other paths to that power, especially since it encourages players to game the system at a meta level and not necessarily do expand their PC's story naturally. But it was his prerogative as the DM, and I wasn't married to the idea. I don't think hereditary magic is as problematic as people think. This is a game where you can gain power by making deals with devils, worshipping evil gods, and literally killing people (winning dangerous encounters, which usually involves killing). Not sure how those things are fine, but hereditary power isn't. But like I said, I think it is good to give players options. And you gave some really good examples of how to do that. I wouldn't necessarily agree that encountering a Mind Flayer tadpole is a good example, because Mind Flayers despise magic in lore. Anyway, good vid.

[@evannibbe9375]

The stat block for Mind Flayers certainly disagrees with opposition to magic.

[@patricksullivan6988]

I've always had a soft spot for sorcerers. The class has a built-in hook with tons of roleplay potential and flexibility to make as you'd like. Especially the unchosen nature of it. I love the idea of a sorcerer with a complicated/reluctant relationship to his/her power.

[@hartthorn]

A thought I had, but that would require a significant amount of support, would be if each Sorcerer subclass included their own unique metamagic ability. This is absolute spitballing, but something like Draconic Sorcerers that can spend X Sorcery points to change any saving throw in their spell to a Charisma Saving Throw as they just bully the magic into you with Draconic Majesty. Shadow Sorcerers that can blow some Sorcery Points to turn themselves partially immaterial any time they cast a spell for a turn or two. Or a Storm Sorcerer one that lets them boost any spell that deals Lightning or Thunder damage. So you can shape a greater identity to the subclass, as well as influence builds in subtle ways.

[@gabrielrussell5531]

It's funny you mention Harry Potter as an example since he masters his innate magic through academic means, which kind of demonstrates why having Sorcerer be a dedicated class rather than just subs for Wizard/Cleric/Druid to represent people who do that kind of magic innately is goofy. The 5E playtest Sorcerer actually managed to distinguish itself: It was a more martial half-caster that worked off of spell points and gained mutations based on their bloodline as you burned through your points. At the start of the day they were a caster with a bit of martial stuff, by the end of the day they had draconic claws, scales, wings, and breath but they were out of magic.

[@OrangeTitan2]

Best way to take a level of sorcerer: talk to your dm about the intention to do so. Work together and maybe by the next level up something funky will have happened to you to work with.

[@verityverri6506]

In my old and abandoned homebrew setting, sorcerers were the result of a potion made out of old ones chthullu like blood. The twist is, nobles kept that a secret and everyone though it was bloodline dependant, which was used as an excuse for some pretty horrible actions where sorcerers where forced to "unconsenting internship ".

[@dahuntre]

I love the idea of breaking “pure bloodline” superstitions with something like this. The magic isn’t actually hereditary, the nobles just create that illusion to justify their grip on authority, and tangible power in this case. It could also be that the nobles are fooled themselves, like their mansion has a magical meteorite underneath that’s empowering them, and they hardly leave the cushy mansion out of paranoia and displeasure at “lower” people

[@Existential_Tempest]

​@@dahuntre This whole conversation and the concepts discussed feel very familiar... Spoilers below: Fire Emblem: Three Houses, anyone?

[@moicanosto1564]

Simple, its the best class.

[@CeleriaRosencroix]

As a result of watching this video, I have become inspired: I will be working on a revamp of the Sorcerer which forcefully shifts the class around to have a greater sense of identity and uniqueness in the world. Doubling down on the pariah impulse-- that is, the fact that Sorcery might mark the individual as someone *apart from the norms of their race, or from humanoid society in general,* I have determined that the best way to do this is to shift them into a class based on mutation: they will be *infected* by magic, inherently changed so that they become more monstrous and visually set apart from other people as they develop. Subclasses will be about what monster Type they become most like. Aberration Sorcerer, alongside the Dragon Sorcerer, and Fey Sorcerer too. The only question will be: why aren't all adventurers like this?

[@cocaloca5402]

*Skip to the bottom for my Homebrew shenanigans* So I started with D&D 5e, the first character I played and the first character I made were both Sorcerers. "How is it different than a Wizard ?" I asked "Well the Wizard studies magic, takes time and has to keep a spellbook and choose which spells he'll have, but you are like magical yourself you can always cast the spells you know" "Oh neat" I thought back then. But of course after playing for a while...and getting rather well acquainted with the system and its classes, the "selling point" of the Sorcerer was lost on me. Everyone is a "Spontaneous" caster in 5e, even those "that prepare" they are only limited in so far "which spells will you spontaneously cast this day" the Sorcerer's "hurr durr innate magic" felt exactly like the Wizards tbh. Sorcery points are not that well-made of a feature, you'll get 2-3 potent rounds possibly and then be relegated to the usual stuff. Feels worse than the monk's Ki. So after playing 5e for a while my impression of the Sorcerer had shifted...while I loved it narratively it really felt like "Anemic Wizard" , *15* spells known by level 20 is simply ATROCIOUS for a full caster that has no auxiliary functions. Wizard can have way more at his disposal AND in reserve, plus Ritual Casting. Metamagic did not feel like a sufficient counterweight to all my perceived issues. I then happened to play 3.5e (a Druid, but that's not relevant) and naturally I peeped at the Sorcerer...who was oddly bunched with the Wizard. Now even though Core rulebook 3.5e feels extremely bland and dry....man does the Sorcerer *feel* different. getting 6 spell slots across all levels and 43 spells to choose how you'll individually cast them *FEELS* like you are some sort of super-charged magic battery. The wizard needs to choose the spells and the instances they'll cast them from the daily alotment but not YOU, nah you can blast whatever you are packing at your own discretion and nobody has more gas in the tank than you. Of course the Wizard gets their bonus feats allowing them more Metamagic options and crafting (which feels a bit more appropriate for the nerd class) But man, where 5e seems to suffer in the Sorcerer's form (narrative) and function (mechanics), 3.5e nails the function. Sorcerer feels like a very nice "alt-wizard" Unfortunately, replicating something similar in 5e is not all that feasible the way spellcasting mechanics have been altered. But what I ended up with was a series of homebrew tweaks. - You can be your own arcane focus (not my idea but rather prevalent) provided the spell has no consumable materials - Each Origin gets a suite of bonus spells (Lunar gets 5) so you'll have 25 by level 20 and a lot of the thematic burden is carried by your choice of subclass freeing up your spell selection. - PHB subclasses get an additional ability at 6th level to bring them up to par with the later ones. - You can use your own spell slots to activate spells from magic items even if the item is out of charges - You can use your own spell slots to recharge magic items It ain't much, but at least it enables that feeling of "you got innate magic from within" at my table

[@rikospostmodernlife]

I think that if anything it is bards that should have the identity crisis. They are redundant, they either are born with their magical talent - _oh, wasn't that a Sorcerer?_ - or, hinted by the word 'college', they study their craft - _that's a wizard right there_ - so what defines a bard besides making magic "through art"?

[@anova5965]

Yes, I love bards but as they are they feel more superfluous. Though I'd rather get rid of wizard to solve that.

[@clintonbehrends4659]

the way pathfnder handles it is that they study it but unlike wizards what they study is more akin to poetry as oppposed to the wizards math

[@Bubben246]

Simple. Make bards a short rest-based support class, and lean into the Bardic Inspiration dice more.

[@arthurpprado]

I like to think that a sorcerer can be anyone who spends enough time under the influence of a certain power. It works with bloodlines, as you literally develop as a lifeform under the influence of your own genetics or your mother's body, but it also works for many other types of sorcery. You can spend time close to the north pole and as such, witness a six-month long night, with the moon being the only celestial body nearby to exert its influence on you. Maybe you got lost in the Fey Wild for too long and the abundant but unstable magic of the place messes with your soul and your bodily functions, so now you can influence reality but not to reliable results. Maybe spending too long at sea put you too close to the aberrations living in the depths and rearranged your mind's inner workings. This way, it still feels like a major occurence and something which doesn't occur too easily, but it also preserves the fact that the character is not as in control as they think they are

[@lua-nya]

I a year or two ago played a paladin that I originally didn't want to multiclass into sorcerer. But already had some "descended from celestials" stuff like having spent a feat for True Speech whenever speaking Celestial and of course family backstory so after decades of going about in the name of serving Mystra at one point decided to study how to be a bard and somehow ended up awakening her latent Divine Soul Sorcery. Her grandma was really proud that her sorcery resurfaced after skipping a generation.

[@jgr7487]

Besides the bloodline Sorcerer & the event-related one, there's the Monk like Sorcerer, who meditated so much on the Weave & Magic itself that they became Spellcasting incarnated.

[@TheNinjawithboots]

You've earned yourself a subscriber in me. I hope to engage with you and the community you're building more as you continue to grow. The content you create is top notch, and I'm glad I discovered your channel.

[@et2792]

I am doing the constitution adjustment. and then considering something like metamagic costs health.

[@ladyofpain]

They are a specialist in a single school of magic. They cast this magic better than a wizard trained in all spells. They can not cast spells opposite to the specialist school.

[@ogrehaslayers605]

Sorcerer is my favorite class... But every edition could really stand to give them some love.

[@zygzlz]

I always loved the idea that sorcerers are just randomly chosen by magic opposed to wizards who have to go to school lol

[@jamesm2577]

I think this is all the more critical with playtest sorcerer having full arcane list access ritual casting etc and the most recent 2024 wizard packet being little more than low level sorcerer abilities at later levels with later level costs

[@samfish2550]

I honestly feel sorcerer should just function fundamentally different from the other arcane classes by doubling down on SP, like full on remove spell slots and give them more points to cast from directly, I'd even go as far as to allow mm options to stack on a single spell, maybe at +1 SP to cast per option, you could even get real nutty and make some meta magic debuff the spell and reduce the sp cost to cast.

[@kelpiekit4002]

A big way that could change sorcerers could be if their metamagic options weren't limited to spells. If they could use their sorcery points to aid other spellcasters in range that would be embracing their roll of shapers of magic and turning them into a strong support role. Looking at some sources we can also entertain mechanics for flavour to sorcerers. If they are like X-men mutants then they may have more power than they control. If they get emotional the GM could decide they spontaneous cast a spell from above their level (without cost) as a problem to now deal with as they try to calm down. Borrowing from Discworld and The Dragon Prince sorcerers may be a source of magic, making them targets of wizards who want to drain them to add to their own spell slots. Though both of those would be very specific narrative choices to include.

[@Tokmurok]

Superman is a sorcerer by that definition. The guy who is allergic to magic.

[@burntninja450]

Eschew Materials: ignore material components or arcane focus components for spells that don't have a stated gold value of 1 gold or above. Your body IS the arcane focus. Sorc Points are a smaller pool based on 1/2 Prof + Con and resets on a short rest. Having a Charisma helps you control your magic effectively. Having a high Constitution helps you pull more power out of yourself to manipulate into your magic. That, or Sorcerers get a number of short rest spell slots equal to their Constitution, and is otherwise similar to Pact Magic.

[@robttore2]

One thing I like the idea of, is sometimes they're born in a place that has Power to it. A Shadowcrossing, a place that was a Dragon's Hoard a long time ago and it still has the Dragon's magic held there... So on so forth

[@hanzzel6086]

The Discworld series has a pretty unique take on Sorcerers. They get their magic by tapping into pockets of Creation leftover from the creation of the world, and thus are pretty much limited only by their own imagination. Unlike Wizards/Witches who (usually) can not create/destroy "energy" (it's explained in one book somewhat like this (paraphrased): "if a Wizard wants to lift a rock X distance, he first has to find a similar rock precariously ballalanced on a cliff X high and "nudge" it over, he can then lift the original rock. Spells are just a way to make finding the rock faster/easier"), and thus are relatively limited in what they can do. Sorcerers are also pretty much extinct both because they used up all the Creation pockets in their Wars, and because wizards/gods/demons/literally everyone hunted them down because they were wrecking everything. And then thier are the gods, who get thier power from Belief. And demons, who just kinda exist, mostly through Belief.

[@jamesgordley5000]

*Historically* the term sorcerer referred to a very particular way of doing magic. Sorcery was invoking powers from spirits/beings from the non-material world which you were in communication with. That’s why a sorcerer could (in theory) gain a lot of power from just knowing how to reach the spirit world and deal with the entities there. A relatively easy and potentially dangerous way of doing magic for an otherwise unremarkable person.

[@samfish2550]

I kinda always felt that meta magic should be able and designed to combo together, either removing the 1 mm option per spell cast option as a minimum, or even expanding the list with more weird little options like letting you knock enemies around with spells and other little things that could lead to weird interactions with your lingering aoe spells. Really double down on getting creative with what you choose and how you use it Also hotter take. The sorcerer should have no spell slots. Just sorcery points that are used directly. Lastly I'd say that some meta magics in this system could act as debuffs that reduce the sp cost of the spell you use.

[@1997dartagnan]

Sorcerers are my favorite class flavor wise, but good lord, they get the shortest of end of the stick design wise. No bonus spells to fit their subclasses, no changing spells on the daily like cleric or druid, and no particular solid identity. If you looked up the definition for “trade off” you’d find the literal Trojan horse and then the sorcerer class

[@UnswimmingFishYT]

It's kinda funny that when you think about it, all three more magic-based classes mostly fit a Marvel superhero. Wizard is Doctor Strange, warlock is Moon Knight, and sorcerer is Phoenix. If you go by it's actual description, the sorcerer really is just a perfect description of a long list of superhero stories. The best thing to do with it would really be to disconnect it from normal class selection and have it be it's own system. Put in a rule set around sorcerers being more of a mini-class that you might end up with if certain things happen to the character. EG: A fighter gets hired to go kill a mind flayer, but in his fight with it, by either very good or very bad luck, some of it's blood ends up in a wound on his arm, and right as he's killing it it attempts a psionic attack which gets messed up by his axe in it's head. After probably a rather unpleasant experience recovering, he develops mild psionic or illusion-type abilities directly connected to him rather than any skill. At this point, the character would get a sorcerer effect added to him. It would be far more interesting this way as a way to alter characters mid-playthrough, and with things like this happening, it would legitimize the typical folk tales and myths of magic creatures like unicorns granting special powers when you drink wine made with it's horn sitting in the mix. Bizarre ideas like this would have more of a reality behind them, and encounters with innately magical creatures would be more interesting if people knew they sometimes led to weird accidents or agreements with fairies to infuse people with tiny portions of their magic, granting things like a very small chance for normal weapons to pass through the person like a yeth hound.

[@reddiamond2547]

So many people forget sorcerers aren't just born with magic

[@danwebber9494]

I’ve always loved the idea of a constitution caster, but it could be very broken. I would make sorcery point cause damage that can only be naturally healed. Two or three times the spell level? At 5th level you could self harm up to 36 hp. That’s a heavy tax for a single score build.

[@Lilith_Harbinger]

I don't think you can just replace Cha for Con on 5e sorcerers and call it a day, it requires a lot of work and basically a whole new class to function. I do have a template for a homebrew "shaman" class that is a Con caster with the gimmick that their spells do self harm, but not always damage. One subclass is the blood mage which simply inflicts self damage after casting spells, and has damage related shenanigans. Another is called "addict" which is any kind of spellcaster that takes substances or drugs to enter a "trance". They inflict on themselves random status conditions instead of self damage, potentially limiting what kind of spells will be effective on their next turn (for example giving themselves an accuracy debuff, poisoning etc). Unfortunately i never finished the class and of course never tested it. Was amusing to come up with ideas though.

[@danwebber9494]

@@Lilith_HarbingerI like the sound of that. The game needs a caster class that really feels unique.

[@AzraelThanatos]

I think the majority of the linking of Sorcerers to Bloodlines was from 3.5...most people knew that Sorcerers came out as a weaker, more limited Wizard in how things played out. And the early suggestions that their power came from inheritance kind of ended up giving a solution. The main fix that I remember seeing a LOT of places houserule in, even something that was a consensus on the old WotC message boards was to use the bloodline rules from Unearthed Arcana and give Sorcerer's the weakest version for free and let them upgrade if they want (essentially, getting, basically, a +1 LA effect for free that could heavily theme the class by what would be gained). And you had bloodlines pushed into things by both WotC and Paizo (You had several heritage featlines for sorcerers, and the Dragon Compendium also included things of the type). Then you had variants like the Battle Sorcerer who could be wandering around in medium armor at later points along with the Stalwart which had more HP... Hell, you had D&D Online which also heavily modified the Sorcerer...where you had a tradeoff, Wizards had versatility while Sorcerers got a heck of a lot more casting as they leveled up.

[@crunchydragontreats6692]

I created a sorcerer “bloodline” (Pathfinder - first of its name) that erupted (a term used in White Wolfs Aberrant) when the marker from a pact from generations before was called in. A creature from the shadow plane attempted to manifest in my characters body. During their coming of age celebration. They were beaten back and forced out by a combination of his family’s efforts and his own force of personality. The family was killed (as far as my character knew) buy his own hands while being possessed. A few months later a bloodline was formally introduce that was about 85-90 percent exactly what I and my GM created. The pact began what would become the Romani of that world. In short, two star crossed lovers ran away into the dark forest and made a pact with the creature there to escape their marital obligations to others. Many, many generations later the creature called in its marker. An all access pass to the prime material plane in the form of their descendent. My character never knew if they were the first or if they would be the last. They really had no idea at all what truly happened or why they could do what they did. Grab your ketchup and crunch away my friends.

[@anvos658]

This issue is far more why I like alternate takes that make the difference between sorcery and magic in other settings that sorcery is more formulaic/ritualistic magic where it doesn't rely on the magic of the individual, but rather a magical art dependent on wielding external sources of power, that you draw out their essence and then manipulate it, whether willingly given or forcefully taken from the source. It makes the line between mage and sorcerer so much easier to define and meaningfully different. Sure this interpretation muddles the line between sorcerer and warlock, but warlock easily just makes sense as a subclass of sorcerer, who specializes in getting their power from a certain area.

[@SonicSanctuary]

Sonic being a sorcerer..... wow thats neat!

[@damongraham1398]

I like the idea of a half Elf natural born wereleopard Eldritch Knight Lunar(Divine) sorcerer.

[@hellsente7826]

Import rules from White Wolf and Onyx Path games involving humanity (from both Vampire games), using the example of magic points from Glamour in Changeling: The Lost, and power source from emotions from Wraith, the paths in Baldur's Gate I and II... mash them together and make a sorcerer have an internal struggle balancing power (as something tied to what manner of creature the power in the blood is from) and humanity on the level of their very identity

[@propoppop9866]

Prehaps bloodlines are not actually just handed down through generic inheritance or simple virtue of being a child but its just tradition the child (or atleast the eldest one) gets the ritual or item of power. Prehaps the goal of all sourcers is to gain enough power to imbue there decedant although prehaps its not allways a decendant. In exeptional circumstance maybe a sourcer cares not for family and gives there ritual of power for some other reason. Also this makes starting a sourcery bloodline difficult but possible from any random sourcer to begin.

[@worldwarwitt2760]

The pact could come with inheritable benefits. So the first generation would be a warlock, the second generation would be a sorcerer.

[@VelociraptorsOfSkyrim]

I am quite fond of the Sorcerer Bloodlines aspect. I have some ideas on how anyone can suddenly start a Sorcerer Bloodline. Usually depends on the Sorcerer Origin. For example, someone who grew up in or around Dragons may develop Draconic Ancestry Sorcerers. Magic can act like Radiation. Different creatures have different "Wavelengths" and effect the environment differently

[@GoldmaskisBased]

I never understood the trouble with multiclassing into sorcerer. It could mean that you only just awakened to your powers. it really is as simple as that.

[@GoldmaskisBased]

Honestly they need no change. they really lend themselves to chosen one stories and are perfect for character themes of hard work vs natural talent. Also of being forced into undesireable destinies,

[@bonthebunnycat667]

@@GoldmaskisBased It's cause optimizers always multiclass later into Sorcerers for min-max builds, it gets kinda boring when everyone uses Sorc as a dip :/

[@dylansmall9699]

I am in the camp of remove the sorcerer class entirely and shift the parts that are interesting into either the Wizard or Warlock. Warlocks get some of the appropriate subclasses and wizards get metamagic. Metamagic to me makes it feel like the sorcerer is the true master of the Arcane considering they can reshape the nature of spells. I feel that should be something wizards can do. I also don’t like the idea that sorcerers seem to have magic just because and don’t have to really work to gain magic. Wizards have to spend years of study and experimentation to gain it. Warlocks have to give over portions of their soul and servitude to gain magic. Druids have to abide the laws of nature, clerics and paladins must abide by the rules of the deity, and even bards need to learn performance arts and the magic underlying art itself. Sorcerers are just born lucky.

[@Dnd-Versatility]

I've upgraded meta magic so you get one sorcery point at level one as well as one meta magic option. Then sorcery points go by level and you get an other meta magic option at 3rd 6th 10th and the usual

[@HiThereImLily]

Sorcerers in my world get their power from a connection to the life energy of the plane itself. This bond can be kickstarted by another source, but you are always born with having it, bloodline or not. Before the creation of magic as it is today very few could cast and as a result sorcerers were considered to be minor gods themselves. Those who did get their powers activated later on are considered druids, and their bond to the planes is a lot different, especially since they need years of training to achieve it. Both classes got an elemental table to start with which now works on constitution, and I'm treating classes for sorcerers more as 'specialities' they picked which were created when magic entered a job based system. Finding proper homebrew for that may still be a challenge, as the current sorcerers I'm running on this ruleset are an elemental storm sorcerer (after their birth element of storms as well) and a wild magic mage (who rejected the job system but can't control his original element). I might eventually see if I can change existing bloodlines and create some subclasses that feel like they work in such a setting.

[@MiningwithPudding]

Warlocks get their power from another, Wizards get their power by manipulating/absorbing magic around them, Druids from nature itself (socially acceptable Warlocks), Clerics from their god(s) (also socially acceptable Warlocks), Bards by plucking the strands of magic like another instrument, and Sorcerers have a little magic generator in their soul (they are their own magic source)

[@UrktheGurplin]

The best solution, is to completely switch the flavor and nameof Warlock and Sorcerer. It all makes way more sense.

[@YeshuaAgapao]

Sorcery in Gary Gygax's Dangerous Journeys Mythus is empowered by a pact with the netherealms. 5th Edition is probably pulling from that.

[@zimthefan6258]

Despite warlocks being my favorite idea I dont like them being a lone class they should be a themed subclass for each class. This actually adds to sorcerers in my opinion because invocations that give at will castings really feels like YOU ARE MAGIC maybe your patron is just legitimately giving you your own full potential

[@draynaruegames]

The way I see it: Warlocks consent to their power, Sorcerers do not

[@natanieldahle3387]

Sorcerer could have a spiritual connection to magic enabeling them to control it better. People can be born with it. Study magic and get enlightend, have a great enough understanding , or something else. Magical? incidents (be creative). Warlocks could have a chanse to become a sorcerer when being bestowed with power.

[@mikeknight6556]

A warlock could be the start of a powerful sorcerer bloodline...

[@PsychadelicoDuck]

I feel like part of the reason why the bloodline thing is so sticky is because it is the closest thing they have to an identity. Personally, I'd like to see Sorcerers lean more into it and become the "monster" class, for people who want to play as a dragon, or an aboleth, or a solar, or a beholder, etc. etc., without completely imbalancing the table or having to deal with the headache of level adjustment or anything of the sort.

[@BlazeMakesGames]

Yeah I really have always wanted Sorcerers to be Con based. Constitution is a very underutilized stat especially in 5e. The only class that uses it to any meaningful extent is Barbarian and even then I feel like a lot of people just use Medium Armor instead. Having Sorcerer based on Con would really help set them apart from the other casters in a unique way, especially since they're so close in mechanics and spell selection to wizards. Plus part of the intent of sorcerers is that they're better at combat magic and general blasting. So having their magic based on Con means that sorcerers will be naturally more durable and better at maintaining spells than other casters. Plus I've never been a big fan of the interpretation of Charisma as "the power of your soul" or whatever. For bards they cast magic through performance so it makes sense that they use Charisma. Warlocks strike deals which means they have to negotiate for their power, which is arguably Intelligence but reasonably charisma. Paladins are divinely gifted so it kinda doesn't matter but they are also generally meant to be a beacon that represents their oath so I can understand how Charisma is at least Relevant. But yeah if a sorcerer is all about their magic being inherent to their being, whether it just be their bloodline or something that has changed their physicality in some way, then yeah make them Con Based. It's just more interesting that way.

[@DBArtsCreators]

I go with the simple solution: sorcerers are the magical equivalent to barbarians (and perhaps paladins & druids). Raw magical power, be it 'awoken', from a bloodline, gifted/absorbed, or even 'trained'/harnessed (in the sense of a witch or psychic 'opening their mind', not a wizard's intense technical study), which the sorcerer grows within themselves like a fire. Fully innate to themselves once their (unless the character's world/story dictates a different design) that they can't be cut off from in any traditional way.

[@Pengalen]

Per DND descriptions, all the Magi in Ars Magica are both sorcerers and wizards. Tolkien elves are also DND sorcerers. When going with the DND meaning of Sorcerer, I generally prefer the bloodline explanation, which needn't necessarily be draconic. It could just be from any inherently magical race as an ancestor (or just being an inherently magical race), but it could also just be a strong inherent magical ability passed down through a human family, and does not rule out a spontaneously appearing sorcerer either. It could just be that the right confluence of "magical proficiency genes" happened to collect in one person. It sort of makes sense for sorcerers to also want to study wizardry, but I can see why many might not be able to, or might not want to. I would suggest that probably wizardry was invented by sorcerers at some point, if you're going with a natural history, rather than god of magic X did it. Much as in Ars Magica and Harry Potter, it could be interesting to require someone to be a sorcerer in order to become a wizard, and from there it just depends on how much they lean on which talent set. You could even carry that one step further and require all non-divine-intervention based magic classes require you to be a sorcerer first.

[@timbomb374]

It's funny in a lot of setting this would be pretty much the only class

[@anthonyhernandez7799]

11:49 homie just described the plot of the X-men.

[@Windowsprodukt]

Going into this video, the only defining characteristic I have of what makes a sorcerer, is that they have no defining characteristics, and any skills they might have are either incidental, or unrelated to being a sorcerer. Edit: After watching to the end I still feel the same. Being born was the most defining moment of the sorcerer's life.

[@firebladeentertainment5739]

My wizard was accidentally infused with a black dragons souls power, physically transforming her into a half dragon and making her into a black dragon sorceresse. im very much for having your choices in class represent in your characters appearance. although not many notice it really, my characters two tone hair is actually a sign of her status as a cleric chosen by one of her tribes deities, an archfey. He does dote on her but also reprimands her for not training her clerical side, being somewhat happy that atleast she does her duty of "keeping the balance between life, death and undeath". remember, a cleric can also be INVOLUNTARILY become one too if they have been chosen by their deity for a duty.

[@tekiyuyami6406]

I define a sorcerer, in the context of Harry Potter let's say, as a wizard who has gained skill far beyond the need for a focus. If focuses aren't really part of the magic system, they're probably just way stronger then any run-of-the-mill wizard. Merlin for example.

[@zach415]

I once played a shadow sorcerer who got lost in the Shadowfell at a young age and was raised by the Raven Queen. Because of this, it warped his physiology and he became a sorcerer because of the magical essence of the Shadowfell weaving itself with him

[@grayrook8637]

Ya know I always wondered why Charisma was their spell casting Stat. Then I looked up Cahrisma and find another meaning for it is favor, gift, or grace and I guess it makes sense. Words are fun.

[@Billyblue98]

Not necessarily for D&D, more so something I'm working on for myself, but the way I like to think of things is to treat both the Wizard and Sorcerer as two styles, or subclasses, for a general Mage class. I do this for a few classes, really, so my class list would look more like this: Barbarian Fighter Rogue Acolyte (Cleric, Warlock) Druid Mage (Sorcerer, Wizard) Monk Artificer Bard - Paladin and Ranger I decided to treat as multiclass builds rather than full classes of their own. Paladin would be Fighter + Acolyte, and Ranger would be Rogue + Druid + Fighter - The classes are arranged in sets of three. . . Three Martials up top, followed by 3 magic users. . And then there's Monk on it's own followed by Artificer and Bard to signify that my ideas are not fully complete just by D&D. . At least not 5e. What I would do is follow up the magic users by three psionic classes, of which the Monk is one of them, but just as the magic users are one Arcane, one Primal, and one Divine, so too are the psionic users diverse in their origin. The Monk is spiritual, then I add in the Psion from 4th Edition as the classic psychic, and a new class, the Specter, based on ghost-like abilities. As for the Artificer and Bard? For my own ideas I'd classify them as Specialists rather than magic users (though that doesn't necessarily mean I'm taking away their magic, at least not entirely) and separating out the Alchemist from Artificer as it's own class, as it feels like the other Artificer subclasses are all about metalworking (Forging weapons, forging armor, and making a freaking cannon), and the Alchemist is just randomly. . . a potion brewer, lol. Speaking of cannons, though, the Alchemist can have a gun, just more a rifle or pistol. As a treat. And they can make special gunpowders for giggles.

[@basvandiepen2772]

3:42 unless it's a blood pack. exchancing blood.

[@kereymckenna4611]

I've been loving my warforged clock work soul sorcerer. Not a matter of bloodline but he was literally built to channel magic

[@Tarvok]

Imagine a concept of magic as sort of a community of tiny living things, animism as applied to particle theory. They all have their own desires, laws, and loyalties, and are all part of a community with government and law and everything. Magical practitioners have methods of influencing and/or commanding "magic" like a living entity, each in their own way. Clerics are like functionaries in a government's bureaucracy. They are granted certain powers, to be used in the execution of their office. Their power is dependent on that function; if they lose their position, they lose their authority. Warlocks, conversely, get their power from a more personal relationship with someone of less, shall we say, "official" power. We can imagine the sponsoring entity as being the equivalent of a merchant prince, a powerful lobbyist, a crime boss, something like that. Unlike the cleric, the warlock can become a power in his own right over time, as he learns the organization and accumulates social capital. Speaking of learning, the wizard is like a lawyer. He learns how the rules work, the ins and outs of magical law and the inside baseball of the organization of magic, and applies them toward his own ends. A guild of wizardry is kind of like a big firm. Bards exert influence over magic the way celebrities influence government: simply put, the magic is a fan of their work. It's like a comedian getting out of a speeding ticket because he makes the cop laugh. Actually, the speeding ticket analogy works well here. The cleric gets out of it because he had his lights and sirens on. The warlock gets out because he has powerful friends. The wizard gets out of it by leveraging some obscure point of law. The bard gets out of it because omg, look who it is. And then, there's the sorcerer. The sorcerer commands magic by right. He possesses authority because of who his ancestors are, or because some powerful entity granted them their authority. In that second example, they sound a bit like a warlock, but where the warlock leverages accumulated favors and such to wield his power, for the sorcerer, it's like an inalienable right. These are the old line nobility, possessing ancient rights by virtue of nothing more than who they are.

[@GoliathPyroson]

I think one fun idea is making Sorcerer’s Wisdom based

[@jabadahut50]

For my world the difference between a sorcerer and a wizard... a wizard bends energy to match the weave and release a spell in concert with the magic networks of the world. Sorcerers however instead bend the weave to the latent energies of the world letting them bend the magic in ways a wizard would require immense amounts of study to reproduce... if at all.

[@dinomarinovic5241]

That is something that always made me thinking, If sorcerer has to have a bloodline and if magic is inside his body, why wasn't it constitution caster lol

[@theprinceofawesomeness]

In my Fantasy World a creatures genes and gods are closely tied together, any one with devil genes is bount to hell (imagine Tieflings and Aasimars). A Sorceror gains powers related to thair genes, be it a inheritance or investitud of higher powers

[@C4MG1RL]

I always liked using the "close encounter with magic" as an origin or similar. One thing I REALLY want and worked out a homebrew for once was Fiendish bloodline for my tiefling. But I prefer the close encounter. We had a campaign start with all of us being locals of a village that was going to get attacked so I had the origin be "A miraculous survival of dragonfire heavily burned her and infused her with draconic magic" or "Young potential wizard went out on essentially a class field trip and touched an artifact that infused her with storm magic. And yea for the casters I always envisioned it as: Wizards- lack a natural affinity to magic but theough study learn it like a science to manipulate it and cast Druids- similarly but with the forest. Through their connection to nature they have a give and take relationship. Like the Force or witches. Bards- use art to flow with magic and create effects. Bending the river delicately with tune or leading spirits as such Warlocks- Saw the wizard and figured there's an easier way. They have a tap that feeds off the cable of some other creature basically Clerics- The druid but with faith in a divine Sorcerers- theough birth or circumstance they are innately in tune with magic. They are magic. They can see it, taste it, smell it. This lets them tweak it and change it. Where wizards are restricted to what paths have been found like using a simple map or directions, sorcerers are like the local that has lived there knowing every path known or secret. Every shortcut or such.

[@jacquecortez5014]

Get this. Sorcerer class is the only class where the character is born with it. Sorcerer can become a wizard but wizard cannot become a sorcerer.

[@vasilkalov2622]

A way to differentiate Sorcerers from Warlocks - did the source of power (patron) willingly grant his magic to the character? A sorcerer's ancestor celestial didn't intend to make his children magical... he just wanted to fuck. Yet his child became a Sorcerer. That same celestial later willingly granted a human his magic, turning them into a Warlock.

[@TwoHams]

In my world i took the trope of dragons sleeping in lairs all the time and made their dreaming affect the physical world. Long story short a character ended up being the focus of a powerful dragons dreaming for an extended time and unlocked sorcery.

[@ShiroNekoDen]

The problem with meta magic it was never exclusive to sorcerer's then suddenly it was and then meta magic adept made it non exclusive again. I think that they should take dragon disciple's mechanic of slowly becoming the bloodline source and attach it to the sorcerer's level so as they grow in mastery and keep tapping into their powers.

[@Zthewise]

Here's a take on Dragon blood sorcerer, desperate for power. You drink dragon's blood, and the type of dragon the blood came from dictates the powers you get.

[@michaelday6870]

From a world building perspective, sorcerers and warlocks could lead to a magical arms race. Different factions trying to figure out how to turn someone into a sorcerer/ make a pact to become a warlock. If you could figure out how to mass produce them, they essentially make wizards, who are very expensive to train, obsolete in favour of sorcerers who have their magic innately.

[@agustinvenegas5238]

Sorcerers still need to learn to control that power though, you might make a hundred of them in a year dipping kids in dragon's blood but they're still all first level and will need roughly the same time a regular wizard would to gain further levels

[@michaelday6870]

@@agustinvenegas5238 I suppose that's true, so maybe wizards would receive a bit less funding than be made obsolete.

[@gandalftheantlion]

Constitution tied as a core is actually a nerf... to the roleplay portion, since you lose access to powerful social skills and bringing the Sorcerer down.

[@BestgirlJordanfish]

I think by this point they can seriously just scrap the sorcerer and remix the wizard and warlock to include those conventions. Bloodlines and Pacts can really be seen as two paths to the same thing. The idea of a smaller number of powers that are At-Will (class features and cantrips), charisma magic from the relationship to greater power, and refreshing magic is both sorcerer and warlock. And then for things like meta-magic, I don’t see why that can’t be matched with wizard. PF2E and wizard crafted spells shows well enough that wizened wizards can use their knowledge to hack and transmute their spells. It’s like modding a game because they get how that design works. They can and maybe even should drop the sorcerer and very little would be lost. Give Warlocks flexible Spell Domain and let Wizards do meta-magic and charisma and sorcerers being dropped is fine. I definitely hate the approach for Constitution classes. It creates this redundancy and single ability dependence. Though changing it so concentration is Wisdom instead of Constitution would even things out for Charisma and Intelligence casters, representing focus (hence why perception, insight, monk and ranger features, will saving throws). Tying it so badly with “bloodline” also makes multiclassing less open. Anyone should be able to become anything if given the right circumstances and opportunities/practice. So yeah, I think scrapping the sorcerer will give other classes stronger identity and expression and make the game easier to learn.

[@Lilith_Harbinger]

In D&D 3.5 both wizard and sorcerer could use meta magic. The distinction came from how they cast spells on a mechanical level (the video addresses this). In 5e however all casters cast like 3.5 sorcerers, so yeah now sorcerers are not different from wizards.

[@zimattack9994]

I like ssorcerer favorite was a draconic blood tiefling the first of his blood the by product of a cult of tiamat.

[@Itachi45481]

I always thought you as an individual who is exposed to magic aka; your parent is magic like a dragon who sired a kid, you live near a few wild or shadowfell portal, struck by a natural magic event, or you got cursed but it worked out for you. I think blood or magic events can work in tandem considered how often they can happen and to any species but hey i never heard enough about blood purity thing most sorcerers i encountered in game was either dad was a wizard, i slept next to a glowy rock, lightning struck me, or mums a dragon.