What Did Our Ancestors Really Eat? | The Great Diet Debate | The Proof Clips EP

🔍 Discover the Truth Behind Our Ancestral Diet! 🥩 Are We Really Meant to Eat Meat? 🌿 Explore the Evolutionary Debate with Experts. Is Our Longevity Linked to What We've Eaten for Millennia? 🤔 Dive into the Controversy and Uncover Surprising Insights! #AncestralDiet #HumanEvolution #HealthDebate
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[@wendywitchner6790]

No steak or bacon since 1976 😳Not only survived- I thrived. I’m 66 - the same weight as my twenties and maintain excellent muscle mass for my age. Veg for decades and vegan for 12 yrs. 🌱💪🏼!

[@HelenEk7]

Some people are more genetically adapted to a vegan diet, so I suspect you are one of those. A lot of people however arent genetically adapted to eat like that, and they tend to end up with health issues, despite eating the "perfect" wholefood vegan diet.

[@vlatkomarjanovic6594]

What do you supllement?

[@tsebosei1285]

​@@HelenEk7that's an excuse. It's been proven what caused the problem was not the plants it was what they were adding to those foods. The problem is not the plants it's the add ons

[@wendywitchner6790]

@@HelenEk7 14 yrs ago I was told by a kinesiologist I would die if I did not incorporate meat into my diet. Obviously she was wrong 🤔

[@embeeNIC]

@@HelenEk7ever heard of epigenetics?

[@SkyRiver1]

Obviously people will eat anything to survive. Fortunately many of us are now in a situation wherein we can decide our own diets. Some of us make that decision based on the most valid facts we can find, some don't care and eat what they want to, but most find "facts" that fit their desires rather than learning how to differentiate between spin and pecuniary interests (sometimes by industries, others by quack MDs wanting to get rich on the power of the placebo effect and elimination diets, and the false belief that MDs are authorities on nutrition) and evidence that actually reflect our best knowledge.

[@pgmadnesssmith5370]

Humans evolved by being opportunistic, it’s a large reason why we’re successful. Nature selects for our ability for reproduction ….not for longevity.

[@lf7065]

This 👍🙂

[@rasputozen]

Right, but when we live in abundance and can choose whatever we want at the farmers market or grocery store, we don't need to exercise every ability of our opportunism.

[@seitanbeatsyourmeat666]

Exactly. It’s one reason we have so many autoimmune diseases today; that hyped up immunity helped us in the past (like surviving the black plague), but it’s over-reactive today and shows up as rheumatoid arthritis, or lupus, or sjogren's, or Hashimoto’s, etc later in life… much later/longer than we’ve ever lived. It’s not that these diseases are actually more prolific, it’s that we’re living long enough to experience them :(

[@knockingseeker]

@@rasputozen Nobody said we should but at the same time a chocolate bar won’t kill you.

[@Msv-js1dm]

BOLZANO, ITALY-Analysis of Otzi the Iceman’s stomach contents indicate his last meal included the fat and meat of ibex and red deer, whole wheat seeds, and fern leaves and spores, according to an Associated Press report. Otzi is the name given to man who died some 5,300 years ago in the Italian Alps and whose frozen, mummified remains were discovered by hikers in 1991.

[@lf7065]

We were, and are, omnivores. 🙂

[@lf7065]

@@panes840 I watched the docu, and Dan Buettner very conveniently left out any animal product consumption of the peoples he features. He briefly showed them herding goats and milking them and that was it. Nothing shown on them consuming the dairy and meats. 😐

[@jy3185]

@@panes840 Blue zones is an observational study which holds no scientific credibility at all. It is to sell you on their belief system and that is all it is.

[@rebeccabriggs2982]

​@lf7065 very true they eat plenty of meat, except 7th day Adventists. He left out Hong Kong as a blue zone which has longevity on a high meat diet.

[@seitanbeatsyourmeat666]

He also had atherosclerosis

[@tzu-hsianglin7011]

We should let them do their carnivore diet. I want to see the long-term data of this diet. You can't even find many anecdotes of people doing long-term carnivore diet, it's just too new. The carnivore diet is not ancient it's doable because of industrialized farming. It's not possible that his ancestors had stable meat consumption during the Ice Age. Don't respond to them, let them keep doing their things, we need those data!

[@MmartinL]

The problem is if people can't adhere to it long term and the data will always be missing, but they will always be selling it. Look at keto, it has been around longer, but do we have any research for longer than 2 years?

[@rebeccabriggs2982]

Maggie White is 82 and carnivore for many decades. She is still doing full days of hard work on her ranch.

[@MmartinL]

@@rebeccabriggs2982 Now find these carnivores in a cohort and show that it is generally a good diet 👍

[@rebeccabriggs2982]

@MmartinL time will tell as people flood to carnivorism. Until then I'm an omnivore as we have always been. I do think we have too much processed foods, altered fruits etc... not natural. So I'm careful with what I eat.

[@user-ud5sm2de4l]

...So you have never heard about the Maassai or the Inuits? Was not possible in the past.... have you taken a look at paleontologist findings? Tons of broken animal bones are always found on ancient human settlement... inform yourself before talking bullshit. Have you ever seen a salad in a cavern painting?

[@mjs28s]

@6:05 Those USA numbers for blood pressure HAVE to be people that are medicated. There is zero chance that a group of average people have blood pressure that low without medication as the vast majority are in bad shape and eat terrible diets.

[@ultmiddle4991]

Water: A Biography by Boccaletti, explains about the influence of water on the development of civilizations. I learned that when there was plenty of rain, grains and plants were consumed and traded; when there was drought, natural flora took over and ruminants grazed these ecosystems so meat became the mainstay

[@ultmiddle4991]

@@panes840 At least in the First World Realm

[@catobie1948]

No scientist here but it seems people ate what was available. They didn't have supermarkets or meat delivery services. If you had to eat grass or cactus or iguanas you did. You can't prove anything 2000000 years ago. I live through my own 75 year experience. I ate home cooked food, then i grew up and i ate processed food and junk food, then i got some health issues and started cooking rather than eating out and stopped processed food. It made a difference. I'm doing OK. Do what's best for you but it seems to me it isn't either or...there's a lot inbetween. But then i didn't have a bazillion dollars for research so...

[@arleenm7367]

In old history most of the hunters were the men, and most of the gatherers were the women. Since old history and nutrition books were mostly written by men, I'm wondering if hunting has always been over-hyped as the primary source of food whereas plant foods have been dismissed as less important because it was mostly "women's work" to gather it.

[@Jeffs60]

Who wrote the bible men or woman? And in the ice age were the animals eating ice?

[@knockingseeker]

True in many tribes it’s possible men came back with no food often and they only had plants on those days

[@stanefferding]

“I feel dumber now” 😂. Stop playing chess with pigeons gentlemen, it’s too painful.

[@jeffreyjohnson7359]

Chaffee reveals himself when he says "I don't care" what studies say.

[@Amshatelia88]

Dr. Chaffee talks about lions, but what about primates? Humans are not descended from lions, we were and are primates, have been for millions of years. What do wild primates eat? Primates are basically frugivores, with some leaves and seeds (and infrequent cannibalism). Why doesn't Chaffee promote the gorilla diet?

[@swites]

Dr Chaffee has a bite force of ~140psi, has thin fingernails that snaps if he catches them on a tabletop. And can run at about 20 to 25kph(average human). And cooks his meat on a BBQ or gas stove to make it soft enough to eat. But yes he identifies as a lion who has a bite force of 650psi + retractable sharp claws, 7cm long canines, and who can run at 70 to 80kph. Hear Dr Chaffee roar!!!

[@Vegan_4The_Animals]

@swites right on 😆

[@weston.weston]

Simon kept it classy, I like that style. I also don't like the negative energy of some debates. Just state your position, the evidence and move on.

[@ultmiddle4991]

And I would like for the debaters to switch sides in the middle of the presentation and defend their opponent’s camp. Then we all have a chance to learn fuller truths.

[@CarlYota]

Ben Shapiro said it best. Paraphrasing here: conversation is about seeking truth and communication. Debates are about making your opponent look as foolish as possible. Debates do not change minds. There are effectively tribal warfare. They are stupid and pointless.

[@gerard6629]

It never ceases to amaze me how people claim a certain food is good for longevity. Eat in a healthy manner to be healthy and you will increase your likelihood to be healthy until your demise. Let’s stop acting as if we know how to live longer, let’s live healthier. Meat or veggies is a personal decision.

[@pdog5091]

Omg the best part of this is that that’s supposed to be a response to the question asked.

[@brendawood6712]

Thank you, Simon

[@HakuCell]

i think that if we were so evolutionarily adapted to meat, we wouldn't get atherosclerosis from saturated fat.

[@TheProofWithSimonHill]

But atherosclerosis doesn’t really kill people before they have babies so that line of thinking doesn’t follow.

[@DillaryHuff]

If they still have records of our time, a million years from now, they'll likely see that obesity rates were at an all time high, and we weren't doing all that well when it came to diseases in general, despite our high standard of living and absence of naturally occurring, environmental hazards. I think people tend to seek out new diets today, exactly for this reason 😅

[@CarlYota]

Because we don’t eat food nor do we have physiological stress. We eat barely edible food like products designed for profit not health. And we are physically sloth like. Psychological stress is sky high which makes things worse. But these modern problems are the problem. And instead of addressing this people want to bicker about one whole food versus another. What did we start doing in. The past 100 years? Carbs are ancient fat is ancient meat is ancient plants are ancient. Unlimited calories is new. Refined food products are new. No need for physical effort is new. People need to use thier intelligence instead of thier tribal ape brain.

[@BryanMartinlaxcoach]

Wow, what an awesome discussion. When people like him are bought and pd for by meat dairy and egg industries it makes sense what he's trying to do. He probably wouldn't even want to debate with Simon and the archeologist Simon talk about. Dumb is dumb!

[@jonmoore4588]

Not related to this video, but just a suggestion for a future debate/video.....an examination of the rda's (and how best to achieve the same) for leucine, isoleucine and valine for those of us who are very active and following a plant based philosophy. I'm sure an interesting debate could be had on this topic.

[@NickSheppardsheppsta]

Let's not forget about the 10's of millions of years prior to the palaeolithic era. If our pre-hominid ancesters had evolved to a predominantly herbivorous diet and evolved to include meat (out of necessity), it doesn't mean that meat replaced plants, just that the species was more versatile. The fact that we still have a very long digestive tract that has a strong bearing on our health, suggests that it is not mearly an evolutionary leftover. If anything it suggests that meat consumption was a necessary supplementation during times of hardship to maintain biological fitness of the species but not necessarily better thereafter. In summary, meat eating was likely a necessary additional adaption during the paleolithic but not necessarily a replacement for plants, especially since the neolithic.

[@CoachedByKenny]

We can be healthy and maintain muscle mass as we age with both a healthy omnivorous or plant based diet. The common ground should be to reduce ultra processed foods and drinks, to have a focus on protein whilst maintaining energy balance within our diets for our individual goals.

[@markschuette3770]

the best diet is the one that has the least negative impact on the planets ecosystems.

[@jy3185]

Which is acres of cows. The same acreage of planting vegetation kills more wild animals then human killing cows for meat which is necessary for health. So twisted the thought process of vegans pushing their beliefs and lies.

[@rasputozen]

That's certainly one important attribute.

[@Manskeeeee]

The best diet is the one that makes me feel the best. I'm not going to sacrifice my health for the ecosystem lol

[@rasputozen]

It's the exact opposite. Fruits, vegetables, beans, grains and potatoes can be grown locally in any region without pesticides. And doing so takes up 1/10 the land and resources that animal ag takes even in the best scenarios. Even when it's not local, the shipping via cargo freight is a tiny fraction of the emissions best-case animal-ag practices put out. The clearing that you describe is for feed crops to feed animals. Animal agriculture is among the most inefficient and destructive practices currently being done on the planet.@@puidemare2337

[@v.a.n.e.]

grazing grass seems promising, although eating plankton would be equally tempting idea. I couldn't recall if there is other diet that has less negative impact on the ecosystem, but I doubt breatharians would agree with me.

[@romenorom]

Interesting debate. My take is. In my country (Slovenia) even 50 or 60 years ago they didn't eat meat every day. Because they simply couldn't afford it. The same is true for people who live in the 19. or 18. century. So claims of the eager meat eater are false. On the other hand, tribes' daily chores require more physical activities than people who work the 9 to 5 in-office work schedule. So high carbohydrate intake is beneficial for tribal people. How beneficial is for typical modern world people?

[@brandongibson9545]

It's also important to note that the animals and sea life that were eaten were foraging on plants with the food chain taking us right down to the krill and seaweed this enabled Man to obtain a complete amino and omega 3 profile for survival. I imagine this was how the Bearing straight crossings were possible with no plants.

[@yoso585]

I’ve seen a Ted Neiman presentation where he showed a variety of research, all of it showing convincing data that tracked linearly with processed foods being the only correlation to negative outcomes. But that doesn’t mean that restrictive diets based on ideology fit the mold either. They might. They might not. They are so fringe that they really haven’t been studied.

[@Parker_Miller_M.S.]

A great argument I hear often from @TheNutrivore during debates around eating red meat and animal protein heavy diets is the idea of antagonistic pleiotropy with foods we've been "adapted" to "thrive" on. My understanding from hearing Nicks point of view (apologies if I leave anything out and not speaking on behalf of Nick) on the subject/idea is because we are more accustomed to eating these familiar foods, such as red meat, there comes the trade-off of potentially superior short term health and performance during years of development and sexual maturity where survival is most necessary for the continuation of ones genetic lineage, however this potentially greater fitness comes at the expense of long-term health. Conversely, foods that we're not as adapted to, because they're newer in the food supply, do not confer the same detrimental long-term effect.

[@Mastermind1776]

I think this is a decent perspective, but I feel it tends to be limited in what can be evolutionarily selected for. I think it is good to steel-man the case that Dr. Chaffee and some others have for longevity beyond the reproductive window. We are a tribal species where our ability to pass on knowledge and experiences to younger generations is extremely important to our survival and reproductive success. This can create an evolutionary advantage to humans that can live longer and preserve these experiences, especially before we had technologies like writing to preserve and pass on knowledge better than oral traditions used by our ancestors. We can all agree that our ancestors dealt with many more adversarial conditions than we do now that lead to early deaths unrelated to dieing of old age. Just having offspring doesn’t mean you will be successful as a species, especially for humans that have relatively long periods to get to sexual maturity and relatively few young compared to many other mammals. This requires a lot more resources to raise young, which on its face may seem to be an evolutionary disadvantage to us as a species compared to others. Unfortunately I think we can get a bit too caught up in the idea that all evolution selects for is reproduction when it does have the capability to select for other traits, cultural ideas, and systems as a whole that promote generational success outside of immediate reproduction and single generation rearing.

[@stellasternchen]

I can't take Chaffe seriously after the debate with the vegan doctor, where the study he cited did not confirm his argument but disprooved it. And the quality of his evidence was phenomenal XD. His main argument was that humans in the stone age adapted to an all meat diet, and thats why carnivore is the perfect diet. His source? A study where an outhor argues that the human body composition today clearly shows that we have been predators xD. But hey, seems his entire channel is based on such quality of evidence. How are there people believing in this nonsence?

[@kunahs_ohana]

Well done boys 👍👍

[@northerncoloradotransparen1454]

Difficult to have a successful debate with people who live in denial. Chaffee has always twisted the real facts

[@northerncoloradotransparen1454]

Use your brain and apply some common sense. Carnivore's consume animals alive, raw, and uncooked. Generally starting with the A-hole and or genital's. Animals part are highly processed like most of the Western diet! How can you force animals in existence, blow them up with chemicals at 10 times the normal growth rate for slaughter? Nothing natural about that scenario other than ridiculous dreams. Chaffee is a liar and full well knows that Animal Ag. is the leading cause of disease in every country on earth?!? If it were not then why are we now using nearly all antibiotics in animals? . To stop the spread of diseases?>???? DUH!@@_miranHorvat

[@chrisconklin2981]

We can never fully know what the diet of early humans was. Those who idealize a dominate meat eating diet are guessing. The typical lifespan of a Paleolithic human was 33 years.

[@chuckleezodiac24]

lower "life expectancy" in indigenous populations is due to highly increased rates of infant mortality (20-40%). "Human bodies are designed to function well for about seven decades in the environment in which our species evolved. Hunter-gatherers have lifespans with an average modal age of 72 years. On average, 57%, 64%, and 67% of children make it to 15 years among 'untouched' hunter-gatherers, forager-horticulturalists, and acculturated hunter-gatherers, respectively. Of those who hit age 15: 64% of hunter-gatherers make it to age 45, with 61% of forager-horticulturalists and 79% of acculturated hunter-gatherers. From age 45, the mean number of expected remaining years of life is 20.7, 19.8, and 24.6 for hunter-gatherers, forager-horticulturalists, and acculturated hunter-gatherers, respectively." Gurven & Kaplan, 2007.

[@ordinaryguy815]

You guys look healthy AF though

[@musclehustle4566]

You guys closed the case with this episode, really awesome arguments..... Those carnivore guys are going around in circles, just can`t understand why they are more openminded....

[@aubreyvandyne5284]

People crossing the barrier reef could have brought nuts, seeds dried out fruits, dulce, nori, and all manner of dried vegetation.

[@blackmarketarmy]

Just curious, what lead you to start incorporating eggs?

[@coreydohmen]

Earlier in the ep he was explaining how only after purchasing and taking a bite into a burrito, did he realise that it had eggs in it, and rather than throw it away, he opted to not waste it and eat the rest of it.

[@blackmarketarmy]

@@coreydohmen Thank you

[@deancooling3480]

What about our flat teeth (twenty molars for pulping plants - molar, Latin for 'mill stone') not pointed ones; amylase in saliva - the enzyme that digests carbohydrates; low hydrochloric stomach acid (aids in digesting protein); clawless fingers; long digestive tract - in comparison to carnivores with short digestive tracts relative to body size; just for starters. John Robbin's 'Healthy at 100' shows four long-lived traditional cultures that ate mostly plants (less than 5% meat). And Blue Zones populations. the list goes on, and on...

[@Vegan_4The_Animals]

Great points

[@roswithabed3650]

Well... if there was "only ice" the other guy watched the wrong movie. The big and small plant eater's that became "meat for predators" ate what? Ice and water? 🤦‍♀️🙈 I do not get it how people can construe such illogical "facts" and keep it up.

[@MichaelToub]

U make great point about McDonalds !! U make a better point !

[@Vegan_4The_Animals]

Yeah, that was great.

[@denniscerletti2244]

I'd say where in the plant kingdom do you get Vita A, Vita K2, Vita D3. Plants have Beta Carotene poorly converted to Vita A, K1 not K2, D2 not D3. Look into the studies of Weston A Price and his book "Nutrition and Physical Degeneration" and you will see what happens when missing these nutrients.

[@TheProofWithSimonHill]

Vegans generally have adequate vitamin A status. Re: vitamin K2, there are two main forms in food, MK4 and MK7. MK4 is primarily found in animal products and MK7 primarily in fermented foods like Natto (fermented soybeans). See table 2 here: www.researchgate.net/publication/11980998_Determination_of_phylloquinone_and_menaquinones_in_food_Effect_of_food_matrix_on_circulating_vitamin_K_concentrations MK4 from animal products is not bioavailable even when given in mega doses you can not really normally get from foods. For example it would take about 80 large eggs to get this amount of K2. See here: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3502319/ Re: Vitamin D3, the best sources are sunlight or supplementation not animal products.

[@mattellis4270]

​@@TheProofWithSimonHillI think that you're right with a lot of this but removing animal foods is too extreme. Our ancestors and modern long living humans of the world never remove animal foods. Look at Dr Greger, he's now clearly malnourished, his teeth are chipped, broken and crooked, this is due to Vitamin A and calcium deficiencies etc...

[@seitanbeatsyourmeat666]

I’d like to know why evolving to be healthy on a meat only diet is possible, then why is the reverse not also true? A vegetable only diet being healthy… get that meat doctor to answer that one, because humans have always eaten vegetables and fruits. We’ve eaten whatever is available, since we were always at the point of starvation

[@mremtb7689]

The may have, but they only ate limited fruits for a month or two each year when n in season and they were very different to the fruits we have available all year round now. Ours have been so selectively grown they contain so much more fructose. Think about what number and type of fruits were available 300,000 years ago in Africa?

[@jamescokl3]

Genetics 80% lifestyle and diet 20%.

[@Barbara-ch3qf]

I’m curious what made you decide to reintegrate some animal products into your diet. Are you doing dairy as well as eggs? Is this switch tied to your interest in athletic performance? Just curious, no axe to grind!

[@sschreck08]

He didn't. He was served meat by accident. You have to listen to the whole podcast.

[@Barbara-ch3qf]

Thanks, I was confused!

[@chuckleezodiac24]

Vegans always bring up the modern Hadza diet of 65% carbs. times were different during the Pleistocene. macros varied based on geographical region, ecosystem, climate, season, food resource availability. plenty of megafauna for 2 million years. sapiens turned to agriculture when populations expanded and animal resources declined. some Paleolithic sapiens ate more meat, some more plants, some more fish -- depending on their location and the time of year. diet variability is what allowed sapiens to expand to all corners of the Earth.

[@SkyRiver1]

I beg to differ: I think you have it backwards. Humans did not resort to agriculture because of expanded populations. Those that employed systematic agriculture allowed the populations to expand. Most humans were forced to give up hunting/gathering because the groups that developed farming were able to support more people per square mile and support military deployments to protect population centers and to war against them.

[@modo1896]

We also know that around 20% of the Hadza diet comes from honey. Conflating all their carbs with plants is misguided. Especially when their honey comes with a generous serving of bee larvae.

[@chuckleezodiac24]

@@SkyRiver1 "Thus, the introduction of agriculture cannot be directly linked to an increase in the long-term annual rate of population growth. This conclusion is consistent with recent genetic analysis showing that human population expansion worldwide predated the introduction of agriculture." -- Zahid, Robinson & Kelly, 2015.

[@SkyRiver1]

@@chuckleezodiac24 There's expansion and there's expansion. I guess we are referring to different degrees of expanded population. You are referring to the expansion of an invasive species into available territory. I am disputing the conclusion that the advent of agriculture was a stratagem to adjust to the extermination or die off of megafauna. I propose that this was not the case. Where were the megafauna that died off in the areas were agriculture first took root? No megafauna that I am aware of, but a large natural variety of suitable native flora, "domesticable" fauna, the fertile lands and suitable climates for such an transformation -- and the first professional military. I am proposing that the adoption of agriculture was the only viable alternative when confronted with the potentials of kingdoms based on agriculture, and came about mainly due to human conflict, not the scarcity of giant sloths or woolly mammoths. Of course there were the exceptions wherein hill tribes of hunter gatherers or the more likely pastoralists (who were hardly hunter/gatherers) became parasitic to agricultural based cultures, but for the most part it was either transform, or be conquered or supplanted. On the other hand there were several incidences where an ag based economy when provided with the possibility of reverting to hunting and gathering did indeed abandon agriculture. Until the sod busters and their professional military moved in.

[@TheRealJackMahoffer]

OK. I just had to laugh at his Ice Age argument. If there were no plants around and only animals, then what were the animals eating? Themselves? At some point, did all the herbivores completely die out?

[@lf7065]

Right,lol

[@Amshatelia88]

Thank you! This is such a glaring hole in his logic, if there were no plants then what was the "meat" eating?? Were mammoths and tigers and humans all eating each other? Lol

[@wfpbwfpb]

Stop trying to use logic with this type of person. The obvious brain deterioration he’s suffering from would never allow him to understand what you mean. He is a friggin moron. Simon IS right, plants for the win every single time. Being capable of “surviving” on meat means it can only be used temporarily and occasionally……….for survival. This is not the same as thriving. I’ll take long term health over short term pleasure every time.

[@Manskeeeee]

There are many plants humans can't consume that animals can.

[@vlatkomarjanovic6594]

Grass was there, and some animals evolved to digest it, humans to day can't digest it

[@undergrace1808]

Follow the money ppl. There is no subsidies going to big broccoli or the fruit industry.

[@TheProofWithSimonHill]

Following the data and methodology is more important, though money can influence those for sure.

[@plantbasedposer]

I think the carnivore argument is that a vegan diet, over generations, will prevent procreation or proper growth over time. And I guess that's TBD as vegan studies haven't been able to show vegan diets over generations. So it ''doesn't matter'' if you live long if you were raised eating meat growing up. And I think they have a point because depending on *how* a vegan diet is planned you can either grow things (I'm thinking IgF1) or not grow things. It's more than just simple nutrients

[@Joseph1NJ]

W-H-A-T-??? That's ABSURD!!

[@rasputozen]

And once the multi-generational studies show the same thing the longterm studies show I'm sure you won't move the goalposts again.

[@knockingseeker]

It’s possible but very unlikely if adequate nutrition is met.

[@plantbasedposer]

​@@knockingseekerI agree. I don't see it happening.

[@v.a.n.e.]

so, Is it reasonable to conclude that humans could not even evolve into beings that could survive and thrive on an exclusive plant-based diet, since it was impossible for those who were on such a diet to be even fertile?

[@themekfrommars]

We use gasoline fuel in cars because it is the most energy dense, which means fewer stops for fuel. If you are an early human and don't have a shopping trolley to fill with foods brought in by air freight, you chose to prioritise collection of the most energy dense foods/lowest opportunity cost to collect. These are seasonally available meat, fish, root vegetables, fruit and nuts. Surely no more logic is needed?

[@HelenEk7]

I agree with Simon, eggs are awesome.

[@sschreck08]

He was served eggs by accident. He ate the burrito because he didn't want to waste it. He's not going to start eating eggs or meat anytime soon. Don't get your hopes up.

[@dyldabeast9176]

Yeah how good is eating the period of a bird!

[@DillaryHuff]

I don't know if there's a Centenarian population today that's thriving on only eating meat, but I also tend to not be a big fan of people referring to the diets of Centenarian populations as an indication of what we should or shouldn't eat. There might be certain habits or lifestyle decisions worth paying attention to in the observations of those groups of people, but I seem to often find a lot of inconsistencies in how different people present these diets and habits. I talked to a guy last year who grew up and lived for most of his life in Okinawa, Japan. Okinawa is one of the Centenarian populations that are commonly referred to as an indication of what one should eat to live long these days. And this is of course only an anecdote, but that guy mentioned that Okinawans have traditionally been eating high amounts of meat compared to the rest of the Japanese population, in addition to vegetables, and more recently, processed foods as well. Their transition to a more plant based diet occurred during the current century, according to him. Yet, whether or not they have their longevity benefits as a result of eating plants or eating meat, seems to change based on who's reporting or referring to it. And I get the impression that the same confirmation bias tends to occur when people refer to other, Centenarian tribes or populations as well. Doesn't matter if it's the Hadza, the Okinawans or various tribes around the world; it seems to me that none of these people ate exclusively meat or plant-based diets throughout their entire lives, but there's a strong tendency for a lot of people who observe their diets to only see what they want to see, or not dig deep enough to confirm if the duration of those diets is long enough to warrant the attention that they often get.

[@robertlyons991]

The two different tribes one from Africa the other from South America eat mostly carbs because meat is not an abundant food source. When meat and fish are in abundance then that is the preferred food source but as populations increased meat and fish as the main dietary food became increasingly scarce. These two tribes that are discussed do not have large populations but their meat sources are scarce so they survive on carbohydrates and very little meat. I think if they had access to large quantities of meat then meat would be the staple as was with Eskimos and North America Natives.

[@TheProofWithSimonHill]

And what makes you think they’d be healthy?

[@robertlyons991]

@@TheProofWithSimonHill I’ll answer your question with a question. Why would you assume they were not healthy?

[@robertlyons991]

@@TheProofWithSimonHill Simon, do a deep dive into the nutritional profile of beef, fish, seal, buffalo, walrus, polar bear then you’ll become enlightened on why I think they were healthy. I’m sure Eskimos found some arctic plants edible as did North American Natives but their diets were mostly meat and fish. You give to much credence to someone with a PhD who outright dismisses any other diets other than what he recognizes. That PhD..Piled Higher and Deeper. Do your research Simon.

[@peterz53]

Just check out what the paleoanthropologists says. And keep in mind that people evolved over hundreds of thousands of years and their ancestors over longer periods in very different climates. Focusing on one small time slice, land bridge crossing, is idiotic.

[@KarlKrassnitzer-mm8wb]

The kenians with their ugali or the ethiopians with there injera are the best Marathon runners. It seems they have evolved to this Diät. The scandinavians eat more meat or fish and are tall. So the Massai. Seems they have evolved also to their diat. So eat this to what you personally are evolved best.

[@mremtb7689]

The McDonald's analogy is totally nonsensical and they have the whole evolution thing backwards.

[@TheProofWithSimonHill]

Can you elaborate please?

[@andrewroberts8959]

Is this the same person but with different hair cuts, or are they different people?

[@rebeccabriggs2982]

Lol that was my question at the start! Either that or brothers or dopplegangers

[@ordinaryguy815]

Brothers from different mothers

[@JosephHoggang-bk4bk]

Even the bible says that plant eaters are healthier than carnivorous people

[@MichaelHorstmann]

I’m sure when they do eat meat, it’s game meat. It’s lean, like 1 or 2% fat. Not 80/20 ground beef like Saladino.

[@TheProofWithSimonHill]

Wild animals do have a much smaller percentage of saturated fat than farm animals.

[@galahadthreepwood]

Lean game is not what we evolved eating - it was high fat megafauna.

[@stevelanghorn1407]

Wouldn’t it be great if Simon could arrange a conversation with non-plant-based Doctors / Nutritionists, instead of the usual dialogue with “compatriots” from the vegan / vegetarian pantheon? People like Dr Zoe Harcombe or Dr Paul Mason for example? That would surely make for an interesting listen.

[@lvhdmya4807]

Most are biased or delusional or downright lying

[@Manskeeeee]

Yeah, this podcast is just a circlejerk now. I'd like to hear differing opinions from other experts.

[@dyldabeast9176]

Can’t have an intelligent conversation with a grifter. The honest people go vegan because that’s what the data shows is best. Unfortunately those honest people sacrifice a lot of revenue because people don’t want to hear it. Might be one of the reasons Simon changed the name of the podcast to the proof.

[@robertlyons991]

Eskimos didn’t eat plants just meat and fish and very high fat and were very healthy until introduced to the white mans diet.

[@TheProofWithSimonHill]

The Inuit have similar rates of heart disease to other populations and in fact their rate of ischemic heart disease has decreased since 1965 with the westernization of their diets. pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12535749/

[@ajc389]

Apparently our neanderthal cousins ate a carnivore diet, they are extinct.

[@chuckleezodiac24]

apparently our Homo habilis ancestors were plant-based. they're extinct.

[@PauIdenino]

​@@chuckleezodiac24Proving the point

[@chuckleezodiac24]

@@PauIdenino it's called Human Evolution. plant-eating hominins began scavenging animal carcasses, then stealing kills from predators & transitioning to persistence hunting. increased brain expansion & the development of language - improved communication & cooperative skills - tool & weapon production - use of fire & advanced hunting techniques -- culminated in Homo sapiens as apex predators at the top of the food chain.

[@tsebosei1285]

That doctor is a scam

[@pacificislandgirl]

Diet choice in the past was determined by the geological environment. The warmest location had more plants. Get real you guys.

[@blackmarketarmy]

They understand warmer climates had more plants. You are just calling them out for nothing. What's your point?

[@JustJulia-qt9nh]

He’s also making anthropologic assumptions about people’s environment during the ice ages that’s probably not correct. We now understand that the majority of native Americans probably did not originate from a land bridge crossing. Also, people would not have lived ON the glaciers. They would’ve lived south of them and migrated northward with their retreats and back southward with their advance. Edit to add: Chafee REALLY doesn’t understand anthropology. He says we evolved to eat meet over 2 million years. Homo sapiens evolved about 350,000 years ago. Each hominid species had different diets due to nutrition availability. Neanderthals, Denisovans and Homosapiens all coevolved and probably all had differences in diet similar to what we see across the globe today (variety wise-minus modern and processed foods obviously)

[@TheEzmoShow]

my grandfather and father both only eat red meat and high saturated fats their entire lives. They are still walking around without any health complaints or pains and aches. They are active and thriving. My mother, on the other hand is an omnivore, eating mainly salads and plants/grains, with some meats here and there, but she's in and out of the hospital on various medications for her health. I see it in front of my eyes which route i'm going. I dont need "studies" (potentially bogus - anyone can put down numbers/percentages on paper to suit their narrative) to tell me what i'm experiencing and seeing in front of my very own eyes. Good luck with the plant stuff folks. ..like seriously.

[@user-ud5sm2de4l]

@@user-xg5rc9yi4d hahaha a genetic variation... so funny! So you think that we have genetic variations in our specie that make us carnivore or herbivores? It would be a unique case in nature... we are all the same specie, we have all the same physiology and metabolism. We run on cholesterol. We're carnivore. Hearth diseases are provoked by metabolic syndrome caused by carbs diets over years, nothing to do with carnivore diet and eating fats.

[@Zenjohnny]

Do you track every single meal they eat in their entire life? Smoking, alcohol, sleep, and know their genetics? Enjoy your anecdotal experience mate

[@blackmarketarmy]

My grandparents smoked a pack a day and lived to be 95 so let's just all smoke cigarettes all the time

[@user-ud5sm2de4l]

@@blackmarketarmy The difference between your example and the other one is that smoking causality has been well demonstrated, explaining the mechanics of harm to the body. On the other hand, high cholesterol is just a correlation statistic, which clearly happens is that diabetes, obesity and metabolic syndrome and insulin resistance raises LDL and triglycerides due to the over consumption of carbohydrates. Heart attack and health problems obviously occur in those situations, but has nothing to do with cholesterol being the cause of the health issues… cholesterol is needed and good for your body, eating cholesterol, and avoiding carbs will save you from heart diseases. So don’t worry about your total cholesterol, keep your HDL high but eating fish/meat and doing exercise, and keep your triglycerides down by avoiding fructose/fruit and carbs.

[@TheProofWithSimonHill]

Be careful of anecdotes, people have made it to 100 smoking their entire lives and they have grandchildren like you who could make interesting conclusions from that contrary to data.

[@uog293]

Simon ! Come back to the light

[@dyldabeast9176]

You sir are the one living in darkness

[@gregcarrick4785]

Love Dr Chaffee

[@MmartinL]

Everyone is entiteled to like whoever they want. In your case an uneducated swindler. 👍

[@johnr8095]

Of course our ancestors are meat. Agriculture is a modern idea. And you couldn’t eat predominantly plant based diet if you didn’t have access to supermarkets.

[@Jeffs60]

Hadza have a life expectancy of 30 and low cholesterol levels which are bad for cardiovascular health and strong immune system to prevent disease and infections. The Maasai also have very low total cholesterol levels of about 120 mg/dL yet George Mann got the arteries in the 1970's of Maasai who died and they had extensive atherosclerosis like that of very old USA men. This is because Maasai eat a high carb plant diet. Those people who say Maasai eat mostly all meat, milk and blood diet was a myth started in the 1860's. You don't have total cholesterol levels of 120 mg/dL, and low LDL cholesterol levels eating a high animal food diet. The low cholesterol levels of Hadza and Maasai, this causes heart disease, cancer and immune system problems.

[@IntuitiveCoachTheresa]

There are so many things wrong with the current points of view on this subject. First of all, there is no actual evidence that humans or any other creature have been around for "millions of years." Secondly, human physiology is clearly designed (created) to be plant based, although we can eat animal foods and survive, even thrive. Obviously. From a Biblical perspective, with the right climate and availability of plant foods humans would prefer and would flourish with such a diet. Lack of ability to grow enough produce/plant foods to sustain caloric/nutrient needs, especially since the great flood, left humans with the necessity to eat animals and their eggs and milk. But this is not ideal and if whole plant foods were available and people could farm without colonial/exploitive interference, more people would likely be plant based. Doesn't mean that people can't be healthy and live long, productive lives eating animal foods though. Someday people will stop arguing about the obvious.

[@beepbeepnj2658]

And there is also no evidence that what is in the bible is from God or is truthful. James 1:27 calls it a religion what you are reading. The dictionary says religion is a set of beliefs. 2 Tim 3:16 says all scripture is inspired by God. But if something is truthful, then why would it have to be inspired? Psalms 137:9 - 2 Kings 6:29 tasty food.

[@IntuitiveCoachTheresa]

Jesus said to him, “Have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.” John 20:29 For God is Spirit, so those who worship him must worship in spirit and in truth. John 4:24. It's about belief. Our beliefs live in our heart. God wants our heart. What we believe determines what we worship. He is SPIRIT, and so yes, the writing is inspired (in-spiration-"spirit within") by his Holy SPIRIT. We are free to believe whatever we want. Best way to determine if what we believe is "truth" or not is to see the fruit of those beliefs. Do they bring life, peace, joy, forgiveness, power, love, which the Bible says are fruits of the presence of God's Holy Spirit living within? If not maybe we need to assess what we "believe." Shalom!

[@beepbeepnj2658]

@@IntuitiveCoachTheresa You talk a lot about beliefs, so based on facts or beliefs which is the real verse that tells the truth? How did King Saul die? 1SA 31:4-6 Saul killed himself by falling on his sword. 2SA 1:2-10 Saul, at his own request, was slain by an Amalekite. 2SA 21:12 Saul was killed by the Philistines on Gilboa. 1CH 10:13-14 Saul was slain by God. Remember God is not the author of confusion. 1 Corin 14:33 1 Peter 3:15 says always give an answer. 1 Thess 5:21 says prove all things.

[@IntuitiveCoachTheresa]

For the preaching of the Cross is to them that perish foolishness; but to us that are saved it is the power of God. 1 Corinthians 1:18

[@beepbeepnj2658]

@@IntuitiveCoachTheresa I asked you a question based on real bible verses and you did not follow what your religion dictates you to do. Are you really a Christian? If so, follow the rules and always give and answer and prove all things the best you can. How did King Saul die?

[@user-ud5sm2de4l]

You guys are so lost… What Dr Chaffee is saying is that humans evolved to be carnivores, so that’s what we are. Therefore a vegan diet goes against our biochemistry. So any “study” that finds that kale is great for your longevity and meat produces cancer should be taken with a grain of salt, as it’s hard to believe that a Lion could be healthier eating lettuce or a cow could live longer eating burgers.

[@swites]

What? With our puny bite force, pathetic week jaws and teeth. Tissue-paper thin skin. Brittle fingernails which break if we catch them on a table top. And with a top speed of about 20 to 25kph (average human). Also we see in colour whereas carnivores have very limited colour vision which helps us identify things like brightly coloured ripe fruit in the forest. We produce amylase in our saliva specific for breaking down carbohydrate in plants. But we're evolved to be exclusively carnivores? That makes absolutely no sense on any level.

[@vlatkomarjanovic6594]

​@@switesdon't forget, rocks, spears, traps

[@user-ud5sm2de4l]

@@swites Oh, man… always these absurd vegan arguments… Humans evolved from apes, which are mostly herbivores, along with our weapons, tools and fire. The evolutionary attribute to become hunters is the BRAIN! We don’t hunt with our claws, we use our intelligence to create weapons and traps. Nice video that shows it: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jKeseZKCbKp9aqcsi=8NSAFaPUguAbDEc2 Regarding amylase, it is normal, we’re not pure carnivores so we need it to protect our teeth from decay, even some dogs have it.

[@privtprofile24]

He will answer these questions with random mechanisms. He will also just throw out the study you showed. You can’t argue with people like that. They have a belief and they won’t stop being dogmatic. I cant stand people like that.

[@chuckleezodiac24]

i know, right? Vegan fanatics are the worst! you just can't reason with their cultish ideology.

[@vlatkomarjanovic6594]

It is not about studies or trying to convince someone it is how you feel on a diet. Personally, I discovered low-carb 2 years ago, and I can't go back to a high carb, high fibre diet. I was killing myself, I had high BP, IBS, and 15kg more.

[@davidhogg1216]

Carnists are so embarrassingly biased to support their present meat diet. Research is showing a predominance of high fibre carbs in the past . Opportunistic meat eating was there as a survival mechanism but plant based is the self evident diet of our species. Refining that diet with modern day data is the way to go just as Simon asserts.