What It Means To "Mask" As An Autistic Person & Why I Don't Do It

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#autism #autismacceptance

[@im1penguin]

Vaush anti masker arc begins now

[@Ari-nw3qy]

DOCTOR FOWCHEE!!!!

[@aceshigh1984]

@@Ari-nw3qy one mask, two mask

[@baronblackdragon9078]

1 MASK 2 MASK

[@caixiuying8901]

Incredible comment

[@jons4934]

@Baron Black Dragon that time period was so incredible I still remember it

[@melineeluna]

I got diagnosed at age 30. The most soul crushing part of needing someone else to fill out a questionnaire on my behavior was not getting a receipt of my weirdness from someone I know. It was going through the questions beforehand, to determine who would be the most suitable to fill out the forms. I realized that no human on Earth knew me well enough to actually give informed answers. Even my family didn't see me often enough to know how I had behaved in the last 6 months. I didn't understand how lonely a bunch of papers could make someone feel until that moment.

[@Karen-0]

I’m curious what the questions are.. 😣

[@russellmo94]

no one is autistic in a vacuum. no one is autistic in a room without neurotypical people.

[@OblivionFalls]

That sounds so awful :( I was diagnosed in person, by a doctor, when I was 7 years old. We sat in a nice room. They talked to me as a friend, we played board games, they gave me logic puzzles, and generally kept me engaged. It was fun, and I felt like they really cared about me and had an interest in my mind and how it worked. I thought my diagnosis was cool when I got it. That being said... I grew up in New Zealand. I guess not everyone gets nice things :/

[@oolacilesbotnet6564]

Well, you're not doing yourself any favors by following Vaush that's for sure

[@CEOofAutism]

@@oolacilesbotnet6564 you comment on every video I honestly think you’re a fan

[@boredofcorn3151]

One reason I don't specifically tell people irl I'm autistic, unless I trust them very well, is because of how goddamn infantilizing people can be. Hell is in fact other people

[@asherroodcreel640]

If they believe you

[@rockfire1669]

I infantile them back, granted I am “lucky” with my autism because I give off the impression as someone who “studies a lot”

[@ElHabsburgHechizado]

@Asher Rood Creel that irks me so much. They'll say stuff like well you have a job, went to school and seem pretty normal. Yeah, that's all nice and dandy but they don't get to see all the anxiety about social interactions, going off in random ass historical or political tangets for hours or when I get so overwhelmed I shut down for a couple days. They're only seeing a slice of someone else's life and invalidating the rest of their experiences

[@Hekinsieden]

"Hell is in fact other people" This shit is sending me down a dark and isolating path of cringe and mental degen. I hate people so much.

[@usrnewxnew5227]

Honestly the lion's share of mainstream autism awareness media either is insanely infantilizing or outright calling autism a disease. With shit like that so prevalent that it (kinda) represents autism and autistic people, it's sad that people treat autistic people this way but it's not surprising. Whenever I see massive channels about awareness about disabilities and disabled people (neurodivergents included) the subject is always presented in an insanely sugary, idealized way. It's nauseatingly saccharine. They _never_ interview them like a normal person. It's always "they're so lovely, so sweet, so caring, a bright ray of sunshine". I'm not even neurodivergent myself (so far that i know of), and i know I'm supposed to feel uplifted but it just feels so... _wrong._

[@than217]

Doctor: "Give these personality forms to your friends to fill out." *patient gives forms to friends* Friends: "Yo giving me a personality form to fill out was the most autistic thing they've ever done. Definite weirdshit behavior." Doctor: "So your friends said you were weird as shit." *comically large rubber stamp across file*

[@danielberkowitz1304]

Literally this.

[@verbatim7508]

That would only be their reaction if you somehow forgot to tell them why you were giving them a form to fill out about you in the first place.

[@munchkingod6]

I actually laughed out loud. +10 points to you.

[@blau6832]

Any professional who does that personality form thing is dropping an enormously gigantic turd on the hippocratic oath.

[@justinebpheartss]

This made me laugh since it literally is. I used to play a makeshift economy when I was 7 with cars and bricks, calculating payments and income. I thought "this is normal"

[@robynsummer7068]

I’m autistic, and I’m constantly worried that I’m coming across differently than I intend, or if people see me differently than I think they do.

[@lord6617]

I guess I've never looked at or asked about whether I'm autistic, but I am constantly wondering/fearing the same thing. Its not a great thing when you are constantly feeling as if you are an alien trying to convince people you are a human, lol.

[@asherroodcreel640]

@@lord6617 I guess that's one way to describe it, for me it's always been a worse incompetent normal person or an unkillable joke tornado who pisses everyone shitty off and I try to chose the latter, though it's not like neriotyplical people know how to communicate too

[@invaderghostkungfu]

the thing is that they do, but they do for everyone, so it's very manageable, because it's the default. As long as the outcomes of your actions tend to net positive interactions routinely, you'll probably be fine. It is okay to come across differently than you intend as long as you come across sort of similar to how you intend, and clarifying (usually) never hurts!

[@hoboryan3455]

I don't have autism but I am very co-dependant and worrying what others think is a very core part of it. I wonder if there would be some co-dependency tools that might be helpful to you. Might be something to look into. hope it helps.

[@ItThatStares]

same

[@SilverDragonJay]

The way we treat "special ed" kids in public school is absolutely horrendous. My brother got put in there and I'm convinced it has ruined his ability to be academically successful. Even though he's perfectly intelligent, he kept having to take, and retake the same algebra course, not because he wasn't passing but because he "couldn't be put in any academic courses that didn't have a special ed teacher on hand." The process for removing him from special ed was also incredibly convoluted and difficult and as a result he ended up horribly behind when he finally got to community college. In the end, he has decided to not even pursue higher education and is now just trying to treat his mental illnesses (unsuccessfully, because how we handle mental health conditions is also fucked) and get a job. Honestly, I almost feel like you should be able to sue for neglect with how special ed kids get treated and how perfectly capable kids get tossed in there to rot under the assumption that they're just dead ends not worth educating properly. Its disgusting. If anything, the special ed kids need _better_ treatment then the normal ones. If you're operating under the assumption that they have an up-hill battle to be educated and independent, then you should give them a boost instead of shrugging and doing the bare minimum. Class sizes for special ed classes are naturally smaller too, so there's no reason why you can't evaluate them on a case by case basis and determine what they are individually capable of. "Oh, you passed algebra with a B! Good job, would you like to move into pre-calc and try it out? We can have you meet with our special ed councilor once or twice a week to evaluate how you're doing and make sure that you're keeping up." Something like that. But no. Its just a different one-size fits all program that makes the assumption that you need help getting dressed in the morning and spelling your own name correctly, in high school.

[@thejackal007]

I agree on this. Thinking back to my school, the special ed class that we would see in the yearbook had a mix of those that had some sort of cognitive difficulties and also some kids that literally were lazy. I don't mean that as insulting as I was friends with 2 of them. Later in high school, they were in the "normal classes" and had no issues. Neither got necessarily stellar grades, but they also did not have either autistic tendencies or actual cognitive difficulties... they just didn't really strive to do well in school and, thus, were tossed in with people that really needed to be there for one reason or another. This of course was some years ago and I really hope the system has improved since then (I'm not really sure how well the concept of ASD was really known back then). Sometimes, I think that class was a catch-all for people of various situations, and nobody really had the full training needed to really place everyone to the best of their needs.

[@Dave102693]

I can confirm, and it did erase my desire to go college, and now I’m working on fixing my mental health.

[@DrTssha]

This is incredibly similar to my own story and I agree on wishing I could sue the school system for neglect, as I think it did actual psychological damage. To this day my worst fear is being trapped in a school. Unfortunately, this means I can't pursue higher education, despite the fact that I really love to learn (I wanted to be a scientist, but 10 years of university education is not happening with my issues). It's basically driven me to not try, and to embrace passivity. I'm still working on myself, and I've made progress, but I'm 39 years old and I've never had a job. I'm not going to succeed conventionally, so if I'm going to do something it's going to have to be via unconventional methods of getting my foot in the door, or in unconventional fields where there's no conventional career path. Until then, I'm dependent on disability payments and family support (which, speaking of, I'm incredibly fortunate to have the latter because the former isn't livable).

[@anthonynorman7545]

Isn't filing a formal complaint to the board of education able to lead towards a civil suit against the district?

[@JamesClark993311]

They threw me in those classes and it honestly just held me behind in school and when I got into high school I ended up not giving a shit and not really trying because my education was broken by being in those classes. The best way I can describe the classes is that they're basically free daycare

[@greyestplayer]

I was diagnosed with autism when I was like 3 or 4. In elementary school they didn't think I would graduate high school until I was in my early twenties, but then I went on to graduate high school a trimester early. They really set their expectations low when someone's diagnosed with autism.

[@BillehBobJoe]

Isnt that called twice exceptional?

[@zeroxwarrior]

@@BillehBobJoe yeah it’s called that. I have high functioning autism(technically I was diagnosed with Asperger’s) and adhd school wasn’t kind for me not that it was hard never did homework aced all the tests barely got through with a C. Let alone the 10 years of speech therapy classes I had to attend and the other kids being complete shitters to me. Best years of my life I rather hang myself. Ngl college was a dream compared to high school and middle school. Fucking had agency to work on what I want to do and not have tediously busywork cus the teacher was too lazy to actually teach and treated as an adult.

[@circamagic]

For sure. Hopefully that stigma is slowly changing now that more peeps are receiving their diagnosis and being open about it. We all have our super powers.

[@caucasoidape8838]

Then compare that to someone like Chris Chan.

[@Darth_Insidious]

The first principal of my elementary school wanted to transfer me to a different school's special ed classroom when I got diagnosed with ADHD. Luckily I had kindergarten teachers who advocated for me because who knows how much that could have stunted my growth. I'm pursuing a Master's degree in Robotics now.

[@Alefwithhat723]

My sister's autistic. She was diagnosed at 18, I think. She stopped masking and started asking questions about what different things I say mean. She's starting to pick up on sarcasm at 31. I'm proud of her. She's weird and cool and I love her!

[@uncomfortabletruth3831]

Good for you, she is also lucky she has you, that comfort of engagement possibly allowed her to reach that level.

[@thekarret2066]

Aww that's awesome. C:

[@joylox]

That's like myself and a friend. We can never tell when each other are joking, so we just continue on half joking, half wondering if it's serious until someone says something so outlandish it must be sarcasm! My family is similar as I can't read my dad or his dad's emotions whatsoever. My mom says that's the British style of humour, but it's so hard to understand.

[@SwordmaidenGwen]

That helps a lot honestly, I just found out that I'm an autist and I'm bugging my friends and family with tons of questions too. It's crazy how different we are and I just never realised.

[@soulstealer5625]

The sarcasm point hits hard, my sister is often sarcastic but it genuinely impossible for me to determine when she's being sarcastic or when she's sincere. Maybe that will change when I hit 30.

[@Allison_Hart]

I absolutely relate to this woman. I used to have friends who would just constantly make fun of me, past what I felt like was an appropriate level of friends dunking on each other, especially because I didn't reciprocate it. (Past trauma makes it hard for me to tease people because I just assume it hurts them the way it hurts me?) Sometimes I just wanted to be a party-pooper and be like, "Yeah, I have autism and you're actually really hurting my feelings right now and making me feel stupid." A lot of times it seems like, you're still expected to do everything a neurotypical person can, and people get mad at you if you can't, but then there's the added "bonus" that they also infantilize you and make fun of you. So you lose no matter what. That's what I *felt* like...But then I realized that I'm never forced to accept being treated in a way I don't like. What helped me realize this was joining a friend group where people would just straight-up say, "That hurt my feelings," "I don't like this," "I don't like things like that being said to me." And that was just wild to me. I never experienced it before, where people were just open and honest about when they wanted something to stop. It was a whole other level of vulnerability, and I found it difficult to do at first. But I'm getting better! It helps that it feels really good and cathartic to get it off your chest when someone upsets you. And then, there's actually a chance they won't do it again next time!!

[@apolloforabetterfuture4814]

♥️♥️I can completely relate... highschool especially fucking sucked.

[@rikifromplanetk8305]

:))) nice to know im not alone on this one :)))

[@SwordmaidenGwen]

Congratulations! It's wonderful to find people who aren't asses, isn't it? My fellow autist partner of 9 years, and my two besties who are blunt as all hell despite being NTs are fantastic and I love them to bits. After finding your small circle of accepting good people, ain't nobody need anyone else, the whole world of haters can go suck it xP

[@BandieDiamanda]

I'm starting from 0 trying to build a support system and I've started to tell people more 'bluntly' that theyve hurt my feelings or crossed my boundaries. im tired of overexplaining myself/being placating about it cause it feels like demeaning myself, and it didn't help when i did; the vast majority of people will take either of my choices as offensive and nope out immediately, which is hard to not let get to me after it being such a heavy pattern. your comment gave me hope that there are oases of people who will take it okay when i just say 'that hurt my feelings'. i hope i find one soon.

[@Surelockohms]

My doctor said I was definitely Autistic, but asked if that's something I want on my medical records. I wasn't sure what to say at first, then she said you're smart enough to understand what it would mean. I said no, because my family has hinted at trying to control my life when I had health issues. Just the knowledge and being able to learn from others has been a great help.

[@APairOfOldSkoolVans]

Do what you gotta do to protect yourself from your family dude

[@johnJohnsonsonson]

@@APairOfOldSkoolVans Getting diagnosed is the only way you can receive treatment.

[@russellmo94]

@@johnJohnsonsonson not entirely true! it would depend on the care provider, and insurance. you treat symptoms, not diagnoses. often in situations like this they will diagnose the issues autism causes/exasperates (anxiety, depression, agoraphobia etc)

[@neverbackdown1918]

What made her say you’re definitely autistic?

[@theowainwright7406]

Say yes if u need treatment like ur life is really bad and it could be cuz of that, say no if you feel like life is goood

[@OnlyRoke]

The "smalltalk exists so people can gauge each other's positions" thing is also something you can see wonderfully in those cagey interactions in action movies. You know the ones. The ones where the hero is in hiding and someone walks up and it's like "Nice weather eh..?" and then they have a short back and forth before it's revealed that the person is either there to help the hero, or be an opponent. Literally the Captain America Elevator moment. Two sides size each other up and evaluate what the other person is about by virtue of light conversation.

[@Eryna_]

what??? really? I've literally never heard this before. Look, I can usually figure out what's happening socially, but REALLY? How the fuck was I supposed to figure that out? Usually what happens is 1. I find a contradiction between the expected and the received social communication, 2. I either ask or try to figure it out on my own first, 3. it becomes another channel to look at for future situations. Something didn't make sense, and it happened to be sarcasm? I check the things it could be, then respond from there. Sometimes, people break the norm and then say that it's actually still sarcasm, and then I get confused, but usually I'm good.

[@dogearflopper7011]

NORMALIZE 👏 BEING 👏 WEIRD 👏 AND 👏 CHARITABLE

[@asherroodcreel640]

Yeeeesssss

[@asherroodcreel640]

YEEEEEEEEEEESSSSS

[@Kickiusz]

Absolutely this, but not in a "being weird if you have a paper for it" way. Like, a lot of people I know who are fine with autistic people have this odd double standard where they seem to be ok with my weirdness only after they learn that I'm on a spectrum. Which, for one, is treating autism like a disease and for two must be shit for many non-autistic people. Neurotypicals can be weird too. And I mean _weird_ weird, not "I'm talking to you about menial shit to gauge how you feel about me instead of just fucking asking like a normal person" weird).

[@SarahRoseCO10]

These types of videos from Vaush are always really interesting. I really think he should keep leaning into the social stuff like loneliness, autism, talking to women, making friends, etc.

[@michaelthompson679]

Coincidentally all of it applies to me very heavily

[@jgreen2015]

you want someone who doesnt have a clue how autism is diagnosed to make content about autism? 🙄

[@briang2500]

I had a neurologist that recommended a degree of masking; I created and memorized conversation trees so that I could have responses ready in conversations. I just could not have come up with verbal responses quickly enough otherwise. I can go off script much easier now, the work of building out those imagined conversations (and plenty of RPGs) have built up my verbal communication skills considerably.

[@embrikchloraker8186]

Dialogue trees are a very good way to view it. Vaush also used it in debates, which makes sense given how many canned right wing talking points I've heard. I used to look down on myself for thinking of immortal responses in my dialogue tree. (Being more consequentialist now, I find that absurd, but understandable.)

[@LimeyLassen]

I think dialog trees make for good training wheels to get you started. When I was in high school people would come up to me and say "'What's up" and I would get paralyzed trying to figure out what they meant by that. Nowadays I"m over it, when I saw the wrong thing I just play it off as me being an eccentric free spirit.

[@marocat4749]

Honetly games ar a pretty solid testing ground too, of dialogue trees, lik th world as serious very weird game with dialogue trees, is a good way. And ames are great at building social skills, thats why kids do it, and adults. So good tip. Alo th world is a stage... yada yada , is a good way to view things, like a play but serious and more complicated with everyoe a main charactr..

[@apolloforabetterfuture4814]

We have to literally remember NPC dialogue trees...

[@matiaspereyra9392]

i mean yes, going from full unconscious masking to no masking at all has to be so tough especially if you don't know or can't figure what not masking is like or entails inside your head, it's like when a chronic liar tries to improve they are not told to just stop lying but to maybe catch themselves after a lie and walk it back here and there they are also encouraged to share something they know they'd lie about once in a while when the chance is right

[@skeletalvenatus5307]

I'm autistic and didn't know about the term "masking," which perfectly explains how I conduct myself around strangers. Around friends and in safe environments, I become more of an extravert; but, around strangers, a fog takes over my brain and I begin hyper fixating on my every word and movement. I also can't stop worrying about what the other person thinks about what I'm saying, and I frequently leave conversations beating myself up over little things.

[@michaelthompson679]

Wtf same

[@darlalathan6143]

So, that's what masking feels like! I'm so sorry you feel that way!

[@olbluelips]

Good description

[@HenrythePaleoGuy]

Likewise, and I haven't been diagnosed myself. Posture, how I think my face and eyes look, it can be pretty maddening.

[@joylox]

I hadn't heard it worded like that, but it would explain most of my childhood. Once I learned to talk, I'd share my special interests with anyone I knew and trusted (my parents probably heard me talk about owls so much...), but if I didn't know someone, or didn't trust them yet, like people at church, or when parents would pick up kids from school, I'd hide. It would be so hard to get a word out of me if it was someone I didn't know. Thankfully I've been able to learn and improve, so at least now I can talk to new doctors about things, order take out, and at least say hello to people and answer basic questions. Although I do still infodump on people I like, whether that's talking to my mom for almost half an hour about a pasta sauce I made, or telling my significant other about the TV series I've been watching.

[@sanitytheorist8221]

I've never really been in a position where people explained why small talk is actually engaged in in a non-flippant way, so this explanation actually helped a lot. I've been told I come off as antisocial for being very brief in response when it's offered, and now it actually makes sense.

[@korganrocks3995]

For me the main point of small talk is figuring out if the other person has a sense of humor, because I've encountered several co-workers(usually kindergarten teachers) who look at you as if you murdered their firstborn if you crack a joke while you're on the clock, and it's really useful to sniff them out early so you can put on a serious, professional mask when you're around them, and also to know to NOT be around them unless you absolutely have to! 😄

[@arsenal4444]

See the issue is I understand it's purpose, but the fact of the situation is I AM antisocial

[@Rhodair]

@@korganrocks3995 Important distinction.. I wouldn't say it's good at gauging someone's _capacity_ for humor. It's mostly just useful at finding whether someone's _style_ of humor vibes with you or not. You could always have someone rolling with one topic while other topics fall flat. Something to be avoided is making 1-2 jokes, getting little response, and then assuming that person has no humor. They also could've just been lazy or bad jokes.

[@korganrocks3995]

@@Rhodair I mean people who seem genuinely offended at the idea of trying to inject some humor into the conversation. Anyone who will say "that's not funny!" while others are laughing at something perfectly innocent is someone I feel confident describing as lacking a sense of humor. If we can't laugh at a 6-year old saying something wacky, why the heck are we even working in education? It sure as hell ain't the pay!😛 That said, I agree about finding out if someone's style vibes with you or not. I've felt closer to some people after 2 minutes of small talk than others that I've known for years.

[@Rhodair]

@@korganrocks3995 yup yup, fully agree with all that. I just felt like reminding people to not get overly discouraged or think they've got someone figured out after only a few interactions. It could've been the topic or way it was presented... or the person could be a stick in the mud😛 Best to still give people multiple chances across different days.

[@lunarrobot9714]

"Yes that WAS the Vaush Pit." OK I'll admit it. I snorted. 😂

[@union1st]

I was diagnosed with High-Functioning Autism and I've been infantilized by my family for pretty much my entire life. Everyone knew I had autism, including extended family. It felt alienating and isolating since I was never able to socialize with strangers when I was little and my only sociable friend I had around that time was my cousin that my mother hated because of her bad relationship with her mother and gaslit me into situations where I should never feel comfortable being around my only outlets of social interaction. I've delt with this until recently after getting banned from my grandparents but thankfully I've opened up in high school and made many friends. The family that I've lived with is completely fucking dysfunctional and it drove my mental health to the ground. I could talk about their derangedness but I'd be here all day.

[@thedemonhater7748]

The infantilization is the worst. They assume you’re mentally handicapped because we can’t register their social cues as well. Even if we’re obviously intelligent, fully capable individuals, they just can’t *help* but be judgmental.

[@marocat4749]

Goo you fiound a beter found family :(

[@thesupertendent8973]

It's good you've gone far man, fair play. And coming from a similar place if you ever feel doubt, or think peoples opinions of your personality they themselves judge you for not conforming to unfair social standards can go fuck with a splintered wooden dildo

[@zeroxwarrior]

Jeez that’s rough

[@warlordofbritannia]

My mum (who is also on the spectrum) still does the mild infantilization at times, but that's always more been *because* she understood what I was going through rather than a feeling of alienation.

[@acenewtype8544]

When I was diagnosed with what was called Asperger's at around 5-6 years old, my parents made the decision not to tell the school about it, in fear that I would be treated differently. I was mild enough where pointing it out would have made things more difficult than they needed to be. I'm happy that they did and feel looking back that was the right call for me. I felt like I had a normal childhood and was able to adapt well and not have it affect me much in my life.

[@ericwolford5685]

My parents never had me formally diagnosed, but my mom always knew I had it. I'm glad she didn't have me enrolled in SpEd.

[@Darkloid21]

You got lucky then.

[@YeTism]

lucky you. i wish i had been more secure in myself

[@Dave102693]

You’re so lucky

[@seanbeadles7421]

Being autistic drove me to getting an anthropology degree to try to understand normal humans. I had “pity friends” in school but there are enough weirdos in the world that you can surround yourself with a social group of neurodivergenr and accepting people if you want. I also don’t really mask much either but part of me wonders that burly white dudes like Me or Vaush are able to get away with not masking as much because we’re white dudes in a position where being weird is more “okay”

[@asherroodcreel640]

Probably, have you read the dawn of everything yet?

[@seanbeadles7421]

@@asherroodcreel640 nah I’ve read Debt and parts of Bullshit Jobs in my undergrad but I haven’t gotten to the new book yet. Rip Graeber.

[@asherroodcreel640]

@@seanbeadles7421 that's guy was so fucking cool he's my favorite expert, smart but not exceptionally so, focused, relaxed, mischievous increably thoughtful and unrelentingly loyal to truth, makes me tear up just thinking about it

[@chriswhrtn]

i feel like comparing life to a video game is the number one sign of autism

[@phillemon7664]

or any piece of media really, I found myself doing this all the time with SCP when I was 14-16, it really annoyed my dad... I didn't get diagnosed until I was 20 years old. It explained so much, my best friend said he knew a little bit but he also said I was almost like a normal person so he didn't get too confident of my autism prior to the diagnosis.

[@asherroodcreel640]

@@phillemon7664 that's just having a hyperfixation, which isn't necessarily an autism thing

[@johnjordan211]

Meh not really.

[@littlemoth4956]

My life is like a video game trying hard to beat the stage

[@MyceliumNebula]

I'm also an informally diagnosed autistic. My college counselor had a previous career as an autism evaluator and, when I came to her about some issues I was having with my roommate, she said I was almost definitely autistic. My roommate, the same one I was having issues with, told me that when I pause to find the right words (similar to how the tiktok person at the beginning said "choosing dialogue options") that it was annoying, that I was doing a worse job communicating, that it was weird and off-putting, and that I was making the situation worse. Just trying to choose my words was a point of contention. Masking as an autistic person is less like a debate and more like a test and if you fail that test, you lose all your friends.

[@yeah5895]

I don't do it mostly because I'm functional enough people even doubt I have autism and it'd be too tiring to mask. If people don't like how I am, I see it as their loss. Also, my parents also filled forms for my autistic diagnosis. I also filled it, though.

[@johnharvey5412]

As someone who has recently realized I'm autistic, it never dawned on me that people weren't picking dialog options based on what they thought the other party wanted to hear.

[@tjeanvlogs9894]

On the spectrum and have a moderate TBI. Masking is a way of life for me. It is a tool I use just like my wheelchair, that allows me to function outside of a prepared environment. It's hard work and I love the time when I don't have to use the tool just to participate.

[@Teacupvamp]

I got diagnosed literally last year at 20 and realizing ive been unknowingly masking for 2 decades and learning to demask has been such a freeing and terrifying experience. I finally feel like myself and not exhausted 24/7. No clue how I survived school tbh.

[@oolacilesbotnet6564]

If you asked me I could have told you that way earlier. You're a useless Vaushite, after all

[@Sergio-nb4hj]

I relate to this so much, although I only found out at 22

[@xthna]

What Vaush said about small talk is spot on. I used to despise it because I felt like everyone was boring and not exposing their interests so readily like I was, but then I started thinking about it a lot because it seemed so common with everyone I spoke to and got the same takeaway in the end. Knowing that changed how I conduct myself and engage with others. Not to say I'm being dishonest, but being a bit more open-minded to the direction the conversation is taking and why people would open up with something so seemingly boring.

[@lazerhosen]

Vaush, I love it when you use the mouse pointer to "talk with your hands" lol

[@ohyeayea68]

Special education's the absolute worst. Imagine being constantly singled out when all you wanted to do was disappear. I felt so infantilized too, getting taken out of my home room to participate in some speech therapy session (when I spoke just fine, didn't need it at all, did my own thing and didn't bother anybody). The worst part was no one told me about my diagnosis until I asked one of the special ed teachers why they were always surrounding me with kids who had it, and they were just like "well you're autistic too". Always been a mental struggle accepting this part of me and the way it was treated by my education system only worsened it.

[@daddychristmas9257]

I wish I had this video 6 years ago god damn. Thanks so much for speaking about this Vaush, not knowing your masking can really lead to you getting deppressed

[@distorted_imagination]

Dude, I've been masking for 35 years thanks to my parents. I stopped 7 years ago and I've lost so many friends because I'm too weird. The one or two friends I have left are really cool, completely sincere and understanding.

[@distorted_imagination]

Oh, and yeah I'm the blunt and off-putting as well.

[@ApartmentPrepping]

As a man with autism I sometimes wish people understood I get super anxious very easily. If only they understood the world from inside my head.

[@asherroodcreel640]

We need to put them around large birds

[@bb-3653]

Alot of people think men being awkward out of nervousness is weird. Because of the whole confidence thing they associate with men and manhood. It's fucked. Like we are human too. I'm not autistic but as someone who's been shy and anxious sometimes I can see people's reactions, I can only imagine how autistic peoole feel. 🫠

[@sea_triscuit7980]

@@bb-3653 try going into the Marine corps...I only lasted 9 months before they kicked me out due to my undiagnosed (at the time) autism

[@Hekinsieden]

They never can, they never will, and they will never care to.

[@bb-3653]

@Sea_Triscuit yeah alot of society doesent want to be charitable to neuro detergents at all. I can only imagine fam. The bullying too. People seem to have more trad thought processes and "pull your self up by your boots straps" mentalities in the marine corps, but correct me if im wrong. So they blame everything on you as if you did it on purpose or at least act like it. I myself think I have ADHD , not sure, but it seems more and more like I do and with other people's honest opinions (not that i think it makes me an outcast). And the way I was treated sometime makes me think its a result of that potentially. Like people treat you like your seem clown sometimes. It's nuts.

[@dumbledoratheexplora1140]

I had an autistic friend that commited suicide. I wish the world was kinder.

[@miniroundaboutinbrum7915]

I never thought I masked but turns out it’s a term used to describe a lot of different things. It’s the social burnout that tells me I mask. Too much going on too many people to see and I need a couple days not doing anything to recover. Yes everyone has always called me weird. But they also seem to find me pretty hilarious as I have a limited filter “say what you see” lol

[@nathanmiller3891]

This holds true for us ADD people as well. It's often hard to properly people when trying to control quirky behavior.

[@leikfroakies]

A lot of ADHD people are autistic. It's also the last step before identifying as autistic

[@thekarret2066]

@@leikfroakies A lot of folks who have Bipolar also have ADHD, maybe there's a step in that direction, too.

[@FishfaceTheDestroyer]

I was put in special ed, and I distinctly remember being in a class where I was the only person who didn't have some kind of serious cognitive disability. I remember this because I recall turning to the teacher quietly and asking why I was here, because I could tell I was different. I didn't get an answer.

[@caucasoidape8838]

I was struggling the hardest in math, yet I was put in special ed for 2nd, and 3rd grade...yet still went to a normal class for math. Does that make any fucking sense? Some of the kids had deeper mental setbacks, while some were poorly raised by parents, and looking back I'm pretty sure one was being abused.

[@PeopleBeingBadOnline]

It's better to use support levels instead of functioning levels. Functioning levels are really based on how someone on the outside sees the autistic person. How well they mask/do neurotypical things. "High functioning" people may not get the support they need and "low functioning" people are often infantalized, thought to not be able to understand, mental ages are assigned to them. Masking is what causes depression in so many autistic people. It takes so much energy and you don't feel connected to very many people, even relatives. ON TOP OF THAT, people often STILL think you're weird, they'll still exclude you. I swear to god neurotypical people are the ones with the "deficits". The shit they do don't make no fuckin sense.

[@thepanda9782]

Honestly I think the switch in language is just another way for Neurotypicals to avoid uncomfortable language. Especially non-autistic parents of highly disabled (multiple comorbidities) Autistics. Support levels and functioning labels are used in the exact same way. In practice they literally do nothing to un-infantalize Autistic people, or accurately describe them. Autistics with "high support needs" almost exclusively have comorbid intellectual/cognitive disabilities and often physical disabilities on top. I think we should just say it for what it is: comorbid Autism (and maybe even specify intellectual and/or physical disability). Its not the Autism that is "severe" or "mild". Its the increased barriers created by other disabilities that make their Autistic symptoms more obvious, or "severe", or the person in general needing high support. Like when we talk about other disorders/disabilities ~ someone isn't a "high" or "low" support need Dementia patient because they do or don't have a comorbid intellectual disability. It isn't "severe" Dementia just because they have comorbid physical issues. Severity or need for support is either holistic (not blaming it on one disorder) or considered for each individual disorder. Someone's Autism can be "mild" but the symptoms of their intellectual disability can be "severe", or vice versa. Totally agree on the masking thing though. Its definitely an unfair expectation people have. As a AuDHD woman in Nursing it's basically impossible to avoid.

[@tomisaacson2762]

I don't see how "support levels" is less infantilizing than "functioning levels". Then again, I never see the point of taking the next step on the euphemism treadmill so I probably don't know what I'm saying.

[@thelanktheist2626]

@@tomisaacson2762 “support” insinuates that there’s a level of help required from others, while “functioning” insinuates how useful one is to a neurotypical society. It’s two kinds of words, support just fits the “spectrum” more.

[@russellmo94]

eh this is just a preference, it means the exact same thing, and it’s going to hold the exact same weight and merit depending on who is saying it.

[@russellmo94]

@@thelanktheist2626 what the words insinuate changes based on who’s saying them and the context they’re saying them in, they are able to be used in a way that is entirely interchangeable and truly synonymous.

[@andythedestro12]

For that girl, like is there a world where people like her and she doesn't have to mask? Yes. She just has to make it though and find people who like her idiosyncrasies.

[@caucasoidape8838]

LMAO

[@thetree7403]

Neurodivergent people are herd animals. Eventually you always WILL find a group of lil quirky gremlins, who understand You better than anyone neurotipical ever could and it will be amazing, and it will feel like home

[@vanyadolly]

This. I have an autistic friend since childhood. The rest of us always noticed she was different and a bit weird, but I thought she was funny. She never masked and that kind of bluntness can be refreshing. It isn't always easy to communicate, but we're still best friends.

[@nochillwill4667]

I'm not sure if I am autistic, but hearing what masking is sounds like the "canned chat" I had for people who don't know me. It make conversations exhausting and not worth having.

[@ArgoIo]

"Canned chat" just sounds a lot like what people refer as "small talk". I hate it, but it seems most of society just expects one to have this impro comedy routine ready at all times.

[@eldritchtourist]

People with ADHD often experience a huge overlap in these things, so you should look into both. I'm pretty extroverted and empathetic but I can't handle being insincere at all without exhaustion. When I mask I take the insincerity to heart and get depressed-- the self I'm presenting to others is the self I take to heart. Very all or nothing.

[@arsenal4444]

@@eldritchtourist you're me fr, stay strong out there, it ain't easy being genuine in a fake world that keeps trying to make me fold to their ways I wish I could meet peers I get along with in real life, my faking limit's been reached, I guess 7yrs of not relating to anybody around me was my limit

[@hollytastic]

I have ADHD and it’s taxing on me to try to focus on boring things like how the weather is even if I understand the social gauging that is done via small talk. I hate it because if I don’t have the energy to mask in those moments I’ll zone out and look rude when I don’t respond appropriately. Especially if it drags on beyond a normal amount of small talk.

[@jed2746]

My friend was asking me the ADHD question form. They got to ‘Do you have trouble staying on your seat?’ I was crawling on the floor at the time, and I couldn’t give a good reason why…

[@comedyman4896]

No one ever tells me I'm a weirdo. They just ghost me with no explanation.

[@phillemon7664]

I can't even tell when I'm masking or not, I don't think I really ever did because people used to always think I was weird but I wore it as a badge of honor. People ended up really liking me in the last two years of high school because I grew really confident and owned my eccentricities. But then covid19 happened right when my last semester of High School started and because I struggle with keeping up on social media (it makes me really anxious and I don't feel very comfortable seeing everyone's personal lives and I don't like constantly keeping up with people I don't have strong emotional connections to) so I pretty much lost touch with almost everyone else besides a couple friends I really vibe with. I didn't get to go to graduation in person, prom didn't happen, and the musical we were rehearsing didn't get to happen (Into the Woods, I was the old man). So you could say I hit rock bottom, I almost failed senior year because I just didn't I could bear doing online schoolwork because it didn't feel like I had that social aspect so my mom had to step in and help me finish. The things that got me through my intense stress was me binging political content (which was new to me at the time) due to ideologies becoming interesting to me because my (then) recent hyper-fixation on SMT (Shin Megami Tensei) and that's how I discovered Vaush and have been watching him since, also Vaush would resent this but P5R (Persona 5 Royal) became my favorite game of all time during this rough period because it gave me the strength to face my new situation and to power to improve myself while educating myself on the correct political positions. I'd say I've come a long way, I'm currently working (legal videographer through my family business my dad started) right now, am on meds that treat my bipolar disorder (I neglected to tell you that I was in a constant stream of manic and depressive episodes throughout the first two years of the pandemic but my two friends I've stayed in contact with helped keep me relatively stable until I started getting treated), I recently restarted my workout routine, became hyper fixated on One Piece, about to start getting my audio technology certificate in May (going to become a full time audio engineer sometime in the near future), and Persona 5 Royal is still my favorite game of all time (lol). Overall I think I'm on a good track and feel really good about myself, these last two years have been rough but I feel like I can power through whatever may happen next as long as we believe in ourselves and our cause.

[@emilyrainflower25]

I’d rather be weird than a basic, boring person with no personality. I really have no desire to fit in with people who aren’t interested in meeting me where I’m at. I’m not gonna make small talk, I’m not going to dress the way everyone else does, I’m not going to sacrifice my mental health to seem more social. I like who I am.

[@robynsummer7068]

A fantastic and deeply relatable segment

[@VelcroPoodle]

Oh man. Comparing masking to debating was... really eye-opening. That's like, 75% of my social interactions outside of my husband.

[@FictitiousCtrlGames]

I'm one of the few who fell in the special ed death pit. It was just adhd and trouble adapting while my mother was in rehab. I'm 30 and I'm still academically recovering from the school systems and my parents mistakes. Those decisions ruin lives I swear. It wasn't fair for me to be grouped up with kids who shit their pants.

[@caucasoidape8838]

It would indeed suck to have to share a class with a young James Rolfe. Seriously though, I was treated like a dunce in elementary. I vote no on any public education funding for my state.

[@Dave102693]

I’m fkd from it as well.

[@thekarret2066]

@@caucasoidape8838 You realize that in order for them to do better, they'll need more funding... right?

[@caucasoidape8838]

@@thekarret2066 You think funding will stop teachers from leading bullying campaigns? lol

[@thekarret2066]

@@caucasoidape8838 What bullying campaigns did teachers lead?

[@hellomiakoda3782]

Dropping the mask (it wasn't a choice for me, I hit burnout) and wasn't able anymore), and finding other autistic people to be friends with, has been the 2nd largest improvement in my life.

[@Chazreal]

I have a younger family member who casually suggested that I may be autistic. Being raised by alcoholic parents definitely gave me an unconscious masking complex I am recently becoming aware of. I always had problems with social interaction due to atomization at an early age because of frequent relocation in my childhood. I tend to bounce back and forth between masking and being unfiltered. Hopefully I can find an affordable way to get myself psychologically evaluated so I can stop trying to fix myself and not risk making myself worse.

[@amoros798]

just wanted to say this is a really cool thumbnail! some great thought went into that i can tell!

[@TheBigEvil]

That's a really nice thumbnail image.

[@blackonyx9842]

My mom was abusive and basically forced me to mask (even before I was diagnosed). I'm 26 and only now am learning to unmask. Instead of learning actual skills to manage my issues and live successfully and healthily, I learned how to *act* "normal" (to the best of my ability). The pressure to act in a socially appropriate way all the time is really damaging and actively prevents you from developing necessary skills to manage your mental health.

[@coffeemaenad7455]

Lack of self-awareness was me. I was late-diagnosed so I didn't know why all my attempts at socialising were going wrong. I just blamed myself and lived life under an umbrella of "All my instincts are wrong all of the time, I'll just try to shut up and not annoy people." Then as an adult, I tried hard to work on not being a loner anymore and socialising 'better', because it's not fun. And I found I was just exhausted all the time and it wasn't much more fun than just being a loner was. Getting my diagnosis really changed stuff for me. I could reframe that as "Not wrong, just different." And it meant I found the joys about talking about special interests with other people who were like me, and I could explain my perspective when fuckups happened as just as valid as the other persons' and I could actually talk with people about myself and my life as I really am and not as the theoretical "normal" person I'd been trying to be. It was when I first discovered that socialising can be energising and actually fun, and not like a test that I was never going to pass anyway. I really does make your life a lot better. Like yes, of course you have to be considerate of other people, but we get that hammered into us so hard, we can forget that we need to be considerate to ourselves too. And that's just as important

[@coffeemaenad7455]

@Goth Chibi I was pretty stunned after a lifetime of feeling completely different and isolated, that actually a lot of the things I'd been saying were quite common. I'd been going round saying 'It just feels like everyone else got the script and I didn't', and I was amazed by how common that sentiment actually is! That's another great thing, we get to find out we really aren't the only one. And absolutely, being liked for yourself by just one person is so much more rewarding than sort of being tolerated by lots of people you always feel on thin ice with, it's just worlds apart. Still comes with challenges, but I wouldn't go back for anything

[@mineneuryuu3623]

Thanks for uploading this after the vod got taken down. This video helped me immensely.

[@normalgamergal]

In hindsight, I think I had a lot of autistic friends growing up. I remember one in particular in middle school who would often say rude and sometimes even mean things. At first I had a hard time hanging out with her, but I've always been the person people confide in, and when she revealed that she just didn't understand social situations and knew she was saying the wrong things but didn't know how not to, I immediately was able to see her (and her comments) in a different light. We went to different high schools and lost touch, but I still think of her as a pretty good friend at the time. Once I knew she wasn't saying things to be cruel I was able to brush off the rude comments pretty easy. Don't know if this has much to do with anything, I just kept thinking about her during this segment.

[@otterbeans]

I've been lucky in the sense that, like vaush, my family has always been okay with my autistic shenanigans. They never discouraged me from being a weirdo, having hyperfixations, etc. This allowed me to learn how to determine on my own when to mask and when not to. With strangers, bosses, co workers, etc, mask on. With family, friends, in autistic spaces, etc, mask off. This lets me survive in society while also having genuine relationships with people who like me for me. The one thing that's difficult is gauging when to take the mask off with someone that could be a potential friend. There's always a point where I have to decide if I think someone is possible friend material and show them the real me. That doesn't always go well. Sometimes I get rejected, which is hard. But when it does work out, it almost always leads to very valuable friendships.

[@sdstacey46]

I'm 44, just diagnosed in 2021. As part of the process my sister filled out an evaluation per my request (the diagnosing professional, as part of the process, needed at least one evaluation from someone who'd known me since childhood.) IDK what my sister wrote in the evaluation, but she lost her sh!t when I was diagnosed and to this day doesn't believe it because she has an autistic grandson and I act nothing like him *eye roll*

[@asherroodcreel640]

All back people know eachother how else would it work

[@rainbowkrampus]

My cousin is severely disabled and autistic. There is a long history of people in my family exhibiting autistic behavior. But most of this is from people who were full grown adults well before asperger's became a formal diagnosis. But of course, when I get diagnosed later in life it's "No, you're not autistic." Because of course, I'm not like my cousin, who is their strongest reference frame. Guess it just means more work needs to be done to get the whole "spectrum" idea out there to the general public.

[@rippspeck]

Ah, the joys of family. Isn't it great how your closest people can be the most cruel? I hope you give your sister an appropriate echo.

[@Terminalsanity]

This is the part that drives me nuts about Neruotypical people and how they tend to fail grasp what it means to be on the spectrum: When you by your nature you experience the world in almost exclusively contextual terms the specifics of how your autism expresses itself is largely determined by your individual environmental conditioning and circumstances of course the things you might hyper fixate on or the way you might strum are going to be different from someone else on the spectrum just like whatever coping mechanisms you do or do not develop aren't going exactly the same either and that's assuming your on the same part of the spectrum. Pretty big difference from being verbal vs nonverbal.

[@dmanzawsome]

I'm on the spectrum but i work in one of the most socially demanding jobs. I'm a personal trainer and its very exhausting to wear a mask for hours so it starts to slip though the day. luckilly im jacked so ppl dont really care im a bit strange.

[@asherroodcreel640]

Hey can you tell me about body mechanics?

[@asherroodcreel640]

Serously, what weird things are you going to do talk about muscles

[@dmanzawsome]

@@asherroodcreel640 when im bored I do strange excersizes because they help me feel stimulated. So mid training I might start hanging by one arm or something.

[@asherroodcreel640]

@@dmanzawsome well how else are you going to get ripped?

[@descendantofartorias2067]

I never really learned how to mask all that well, whenever someone talks to me I just act extremely politely and try to find the dialogue option that will lead to the least amount of socializing. Even very short small talk conversations take an incredible amount of emotional energy out of me and I fucking hate being forced to be around other people. My goal in life is to get as close as I possibly can to living as if solitary confinement allowed pets and video games.

[@jonasharp3]

Those forms are also used for ADHD, but honestly I think giving them to friends is not the play. I had to do one of these when I got diagnosed with adhd, and I only gave a form to my brother. I didn’t have to get multiple people to do it, just him. It was definitely kinda eye opening to see how he perceives me, but it still felt safe since we are close. If I had given that to a group of friends, I’m sure it would have been very hard for me to cope with their responses. I feel really bad for this girl, and honestly I relate to her on many levels. Seeing people honestly depict what they think about me, I think would really cause me to spiral.

[@adabsurdum5905]

It's pretty easy to say "don't mask" when you don't have a boss 😂

[@rainbowkrampus]

Yeah, his advice here is very myopic. I agree that masking is harmful. But there are in fact degrees of harm and sometimes masking helps avoid some of the more severe forms of harm. Like, losing your job.

[@tomisaacson2762]

Yeah, the idea that masking is bad and shouldn't be done is a privileged af take. I wouldn't have my job if I didn't mask.

[@FunFilmFare]

True! Or if you work from home.

[@descendantofartorias2067]

@Maxamillion same. I don't hate working but I loathe being forced to be around other people.

[@emporioalnino4670]

Yeah you literally can and do get in trouble in life just for behaving autistic. If I'm at a job interview for sure I am gonna be masking, cuz if I don't im not getting shit.

[@autisticberserker1807]

I don't need small talk to get a read on someone. In fact, small talk actually interferes with me reading people. When I small talk, that is me masking so they don't get a read on me. It's me playing dumb. I hate masking but if I don't then I freak out the whole room with the intensity of my matter of fact-ness. Small talk, is masking.

[@wonder_9315]

I’ve never wanted to give someone a hug so bad in my life oml she seems so sweet and I just want her to be happy 🥲

[@gembish1681]

My folks had me diagnosed in early childhood, and I always knew that I was autistic and that it meant I was a little different from other people, but they never went further in helping understand HOW I was different. I honestly believe they had the best of intentions and thought that it was a matter of socializing it out of me, but instead I just had to mask for basically my entire childhood snd school career while also not having any reference or support system for how to live AS a happy autistic person instead of just trying to pretend I wasn't. I literally came out as bi before I "came out" as autistic to my close circle of college friends, it had had that much shame ingrained into it.

[@loopholesloopy]

I think people are mistaking masking for acting a little different based on the social circle and context, it's really normal to act differently to your boss compared to your friends, there's also formal and informal settings, you wouldn't crack jokes and be cheery as a funeral for example.

[@mr.irrelevent8956]

Anyone who is friends with someone out of pitty doesn’t deserve to have friends

[@SuperGoki]

Vaush, learning you're not formally diagnosed makes me feel a lot better about not being able to get diagnosed as an adult. I'm unformally diaagnosed like you are and I've realized I don't need to spend hundreds of dollars for a piece of paper to confirm what I know about myself.

[@willstout5988]

Id love to talk to the commenter saying they learned to socialize from Persona games. I'm a sociologist and just started playing persona 5 recently, and have been thinking a lot lately about its portrayal of social bonds, and how it rewards tailoring your responses to be in line with the feelings of those talking to you. It's a very empathetic game.

[@justinh9482]

5:00 i love how vaush still talks with his hands, he just uses a mouse to do it

[@ltfringr]

Great, now I'm never gonna unsee that every time he does it

[@almosthelpless9374]

1 MASK! 2 MASK! DR. FAUCI!

[@runagaterampant]

SQUAWK

[@saininj]

FACTS AND FIGURES FACTS AND FIGURES.

[@ironickrempt]

TRUST THE SCIIIIENCE

[@Kickiusz]

NUMBERS ARE GOING UP

[@CassieAngelica]

This is why I never got an official OCD diagnosis.

[@firefly5677]

I didn't realize I was autistic until much later in life. My parents never took me for a diagnosis, I guess the thought never occurred to them they just thought I was kind of weird with anti-social tendencies and social anxiety. It definitely makes my time in school make a lot more sense now

[@raywilson641]

This is where I'm at right now. Over the years I've gotten very good at giving very controlled, measured responses so I don't come off as a wierdo. If someone catches me in an interaction by surprise or situation im not prepared for then I've accepted the quality of the conversation is going to be bad because I'm nervous and searching for good responses. Bad part is everyone thinks I'm shy because I don't speak often in a lot of situations. I just have no idea what to say while maintaining the "I'm a normal person" front in those situations. So I just choose saying nothing instead. I just wish I could confirm if I was on the spectrum or social interaction is just hard for me for some reason. If I'm just shy or anxious or something? Impossible for me to know without a professional.

[@aguspuig6615]

hey, in trying to get inforned on this stuff, could you explain to me a situation (can be real or hypotetical) where you have put up this ''normal person'' front, and also tell me what you wouldve said if you didnt have to put up that front, im trying to gauge what separates being ''wierd'' but ''norma'' from being autistic, because i feel like we all have shit we would say but we dont in most cases, except if we are with someone we trust and knows us well.

[@andreakoroknai1071]

Spitting facts here, a lot of this resonates with me so much as a person who isn't diagnosed, or maybe I was but my parents kept it from me, the part that hit me the most was the pity and how when you improve yourself people will often be annoyed by that, it took me until age 37 to recognize this and move forward from it, I used to think well, they'll like me more when I'm more successful, lose weight, feel better mental health-wise, like I somehow had to earn people's friendship, but it's not the case. Also, I've noticed that if you're weird in the way that we tend to be, certain people get annoyed by your competence or your accomplishments, it's a short version of the pity to annoyance pipeline

[@jambott5520]

Im fairly loud and autistic, and I have never been able to mask. I tried for a while, it did not end well. I have also been able to deal with people who give me shit for it well, there are a few essentially scripts I have learned for certain situations which come up a lot when it comes to people being shitty for autistic traits that I have. There is another method I have to deal with this stuff though, the grey rock method. Usually this isn't a choice, it's what I do when I am overwhelmed naturally, I just kinda stop talking. My longest sentence in this state is 'I dont dislike you, im just tired'. But for people I dont like, they get nothing. And it works amazingly for people being shitty, rarely at first, but over time they do genuinely get bored. A lot of digs neurotypical people do are because they want you to change to their standards, if you ignore these and dont change, they will get frustrated and stop. Also I did not realize thats what small talk was about, I just happen to enjoy learning what's going on in peoples lives like jobs n shit.

[@aquagirl555]

it may sound a little silly, but shows like My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic, helped me understand social situations better, and be more self aware of what little masking i did, on whether they were worth keeping up or not for my own safety and happy.

[@theanimaeffectofficial9778]

As someone who was formally diagnosed in November of 2021 I can attest that I was required to have my partner fill out an observational form as well. It was extremely infantilizing to have to have my partner confirm all of the behaviors that I described about myself and clearly demonstrated within the course of the interview with the neurologist. As someone who is on the high functioning spectrum it felt extremely belittling to have to have someone qualify my statements about myself, especially when the doctor that diagnosed me even said that after interviewing me for an hour I was a textbook case. So why did I have to have my partner fill out a form that rated things like my ability to clean, wash take care of myself etc? To me it felt like the degradation and infantilization was the point. My statements about my experiences and behaviors are only valid if a NT person directly validates them. Extremely frustrating, but i'm glad I got my diagnosis.

[@asherroodcreel640]

Meat packing

[@kappadarwin9476]

I think the reason why they had your partner fill out the form is because most people ether don't know or are afraid to find out they have something so they downplay it.

[@theanimaeffectofficial9778]

@@kappadarwin9476 Nah its just standard protocol. I came to them for the appointment seeking them out desiring a diagnosis because I was convinced I had it. I just agree with vaush here that requiring that as standard protocol is infantilizing and should only be a thing when its obviously needed due to their age, or lack of ability to function.

[@sc6658]

I’m a 27 year old woman who was diagnosed with autism at 11 and I mask also hard that I didn’t even realize it. I only realized how hard I masked when I did shrooms once and I dropped all ability to mask until the trip ended. 😭

[@mistalod]

If you mask, people fall in love with the mask. But behind every mask, is ANOTHER MASK!

[@greywolf7577]

"No one cared who I was until I put on the mask!" Bane.

[@Pluveus]

The conversation between Spiderman and The Vulture in homecoming is a perfect example of a complex game of cat and mouse hidden behind small talk.

[@Alaskan-Armadillo]

Eh.. I tend not to talk about being on the Autism spectrum much because of how the times I have been open about it people have dismissed me or they have alienated me. Honestly my experience with people has been a mix of hit, miss, or just don't understand. I have a lot of very close friendships but there have definitely been times that people just hated me or didn't understand me. It is tough though because I have gotten in trouble before in a lot of situations for not understanding social cues and when I explain how I am on the autism spectrum and struggle with social cues people will use that as evidence and say "Well no wonder you're so weird" It really just gets me so angry seeing this Tik Tok trend because now people all of a sudden care about those of us on the spectrum. It is as if we need to wait until social media starts covering an issue to start caring about it but if it isn't trending on social media then it isn't relevant to the conversation. Edit: I think another issue here is how the woman I am assuming who is also Latin feels betrayed/slightly humiliated. I mention how she is Latin because of how culturally we as Latins have been enculturated to highly value friendship and to be pitied is seen as humiliating. Any other Latins feel the same? It could just be me but I was raised with the idea that if someone pities you they're really mocking you and not genuinely feeling sorry for you.

[@asherroodcreel640]

That's people for you

[@korganrocks3995]

Unfortunately the whole autism/adhd thing is still very new, so people have a lot of ignorance and misconceptions about it. I grew up in the 90s, and we'd never even heard of autism... Hell, we barely understood homosexuality at that point! People were either normal or weird, and while people are more exposed to these things now, it'll still be a couple of decades before it really sinks in for normies.

[@westcoastseattleboy784]

Masking is a useful tool to have in your toolbox. Sometimes the best thing is to just fake your way through an interaction. The challenge comes when you can’t control it or don’t know where your actual personality starts and the mask ends. That’s a recipe for burnout and distress

[@stevenricks1703]

I tried for decades to figure out the formula for social responses that seemed to be so instinctual for everyone else. I never considered that I might be neuro-divergent. A couple of years ago, a series of coincidences led me to take an online autism screening, and the score was in the range of "very high likelihood" for ASD. That hit me in the face pretty hard. I started reading more about autism, and one of the first things I read about was masking; what it is, and how it's really unhealthy. I realized that my "search for the social formula" was really just a "search for how to mask better." It felt like someone was leaning over my shoulder and whispering, "Hey, that thing that you can't figure out no matter how hard you try - It's okay.. You can relax. You don't have to figure it out." It was validation on a scale I had never felt in my life, and I sobbed for over an hour.

[@FloralHaze]

You snapped with the thumbnail ngl 🔥

[@ThePhilNews]

Wait schools in the US have your medical data? What the actual fuck? The only medical data our schools ever get is a medical certificate once a sick leave exceeds 3 days. That would be a massive intrusion on privacy where I'm from.

[@MrHat.]

It's important for schools to have medical data, for required vaccinations, known allergies, etc.

[@themadrose4334]

Are you from Germany?

[@12DAMDO]

i only mask around normies, but never around my friends.. i believe the moment you have to mask around friends it devaluates the core-principle of friendship, and at that point "friends" are nothing more than acquaintances... if you can't be yourself around friends, then who _can_ you be yourself around?

[@brainstewX]

She seems pretty normal. If her friends would hurt her feelings like this without a second's thought, wouldn't it indicate that they're the ones lacking in social skills?

[@miniroundaboutinbrum7915]

Ha ha the double standards of the neurotypical’s. It’s the same thing with “empathy” the most empathic people I know are on the spectrum

[@Terminalsanity]

Okay here's the thing if you're on the spectrum and you don't bother to mask most people will assume you're an absolute asshole or entirely aloof because unless you're legitimately engaged on the topic of discussion your naturally flat atonal replies conveyed with a similarly blank flat expression will convey disinterest if not dismissal. A Neurotypical person is not likely to respond well to that sort of response, knowing that you're on the spectrum will not likely change that either. Case in point a typical conversation starter is "How are you doing/feeling" for a person on the spectrum unless recent events are making them feel a certain way in that (and its very obvious when person on the spectrum is feeling something) their honest natural answer 95% of the time would be "I don't know" or "I don't really feel anyway, really" again delivered with a naturally flat atonal voice conveyed with a blank flat expression. That will typically will kill any conversation to be real fast. So after enough experience a person on the spectrum will invariably figure out when a Neurotypical person asks "How are you doing/feeling" they mostly are just looking to trigger an reason to talk about how they're feeling and what's going on with them so they'll get better results if the inflect a bit of enthusiasm in their voice and facial expression and say "I'm doing well/fine. How are you doing?" with any luck the resulting conversation might wind itself towards subjects of interests and the mask can drop for a bit but without the masking there usually won't be a conversation to follow at all. Honestly telling a person on the spectrum not to mask is kind of awful advise yes not doing so relieves some stress but it also causes other stressors and is likely isolate and distance you from other people because most people won't even try to meet you halfway and they can't ever really do so if they tried. That's why woman in the video is reduced to tears. It like telling a black person not to code switch: nice in theory but you're effectively telling them to set aside their metal detector while strolling through a minefield. All the more so for a young woman or woman on the spectrum. Vaush can more easily get away with not having to mask becasue boys/men are practically socially conditioned to be half on the spectrum (Seriously being mildly autistic was once described as being hyper-male minded) so long as Vaush can unapologetically steer the course of conversation to subjects he has an interest in people can find him engaging even captivating but take away his ability to do so and its likely a different story.

[@miniroundaboutinbrum7915]

@@Terminalsanity wow you put a lot of effort into your reply. I usually condense to blunt responses. I totally agree with everything you’ve described. I didn’t realise for years. I mean I was in my late thirty’s when I saw a video of myself (I don’t recommend this) and heard how monotone I sounded. Something clicked and I realised when people used to ask me. was I being sarcastic? or they started laughing. In fact, it was me just answering honestly and it comes over like a deadpan comedy sketch.

[@eldritchtourist]

@@Terminalsanity I don't think that's a totally fair assessment of Vaush. Vaush has multiple videos giving advice on conversation and social skills and how to indulge your own passions while still showing interest in others. He's clearly practiced social skills, and social skills aren't purely about being fake. There's a grey area between unchangable symptoms of neurodivergence that you have to HIDE and things that just need practice and better understanding, thus stop feeling exhausting and wrong (if it doesn't feel exhausting and wrong, it isn't masking). You can be a neurodivergent version of a person with good social skills instead of a neurodivergent person faking not being a neurodivergent person, and that difference seriously matters because it changes how good or bad your mental health is. No, you can't just stop masking without any new replacement methods for interacting with others, but that doesn't mean masking is good and the only way to do things. What's more important is to stop masking so you can learn to work WITH your neurodivergent mind instead of AGAINST it. You can't learn skills that don't hurt you if you stay locked into the stuff that's hurting you, you have to be more of a blank slate to have the room and authenticity for that. It'll cause some strife at first, yes, but that's how all deprogramming works. It works the same in many other types of therapy and self-reflection. I've experienced it with unlearning the survival strategies I learned to deal with my childhood abuse.

[@Terminalsanity]

@@miniroundaboutinbrum7915 Well this subject hits me where I live because I'm on the spectrum and I find I do have mask to get by. My icon is a mask partially for that very reason: an expression of the absurdity and tragedy of having to put on a mask not to pretend to be someone else, but in an effort to allow people to understand me as I actually am. Its a bad joke. Such is life, plus in consciously learning how to better affect my vocal intonations and inflections I also learned how to be very good at doing impressions and accents which is rather fun source of amusement. I just try and play the cards I was dealt as well as know how and get as much enjoyment out of the game as I can.

[@RexxyRobin]

omfg your explanation of small talk was so helpful. I never saw the point before but now I think I might actually be able to find it interesting

[@spencergiddings8228]

I hate this because I had the same reaction as the chatter who said "wait, isn't this how everyone thinks"

[@Come0ndeath]

Oo love the thumbnail for this vid. Very symbolic in separating the mouth from the mind. Props to the editor

[@hagoryopi2101]

I mask, but I don't think I'm autistic. I don't have an issue with normal conversations when I'm comfortable, I just struggle with emotional ambiguity and learned to respond to that by suppressing my emotions. If I can't interpret the situation as good or bad, safe or dangerous, my brain has a bad habit of defaulting to the worst, and therefore feeling like I can't relax the whole rest of the time. It makes it hard to initiate conversation because I don't know if someone wants that right now, or to take criticism or confrontation (even if it's constructive) because I don't know how seriously they take it, how far they might push. Which really sucks, because ambiguity is kind of the default of life, especially social life.

[@thebreedinghousewife8818]

this is why i refuse to use the label as a “high functioning” ASD person; the stigma kind of sticks from elementary school, like being treated differently and having personal classroom aids; people ascribe so many things to the label and i’d rather just be seen as the person i am

[@anthonymorris9061]

At fifty -eight years old, I don't know if I have autism. But I'm pretty sure that I do. Masking is what I do most of the time. I actually have to remind myself to stop it when I'm home. Even when writing in my journal, I tell myself to write what I really think not what I think others would consider appropriate.

[@lukemayes5007]

So nice to hear, I've always been real big on not masking because I have to put a lot of effort into understanding what others mean by their words and if they're not willing to put that same effort towards me then I really don't care about whatever misinterpretations they fail to to ask an explanation of

[@warlordofbritannia]

Was diagnosed at 9, now nearly 26. Over the years, I've embraced my eccentricity and made it a strength. I'm straight forward with being autistic, both for my own sake and for others. Also at this point, I'm largely able to automatically come up with the socially correct responses but remain introspective and have times where I need to consciously think out what I'm supposed to say. If anyone out there is a teenager and/or is recently diagnosed--it honestly gets better. When you embarrass yourself consciously think about it as something to learn from. You need to make those mistakes to build up self-esteem. Once you know what you're good at it'll be way easier to deal with other people. (Like grinding in an RPG, come to think of it...) When people know you're aware of your weaknesses and are making an active effort, they tend to be far more forgiving when you do make mistakes. It's really nothing to be ashamed of.

[@jimmymcgill7370]

I can’t even mask. Was never able to pull it off. I just gave up lol.

[@IsThatAShortJoke]

As an ADHD person, masking is a genuine problem. I have trouble stimming unless I'm listening to music because I masked the ADHD leg shake so much due to childhood trauma. I was diagnosed around age 8 btw.

[@hollytastic]

I feel you. ADHD as well and I remember ridiculously clearly being screamed at during class in elementary (by a teacher) for stimming with a pen. I was clicking it and didn’t even know I was doing it. I also used to twirl my hair with my fingers during elementary school and my teacher threatened to call my parents and have a conference with them about my inability to sit still. 😔 As a result I can hardly do it today unless I’m distracted by music or a video that is playing.

[@ratking1330]

Small talk is like when you send a scout unit so you can get a rough idea of what you're dealing with

[@caucasoidape8838]

The great majority of the time, I already know I'm dealing with people I dislike.

[@themajesticspider-man6116]

Jesus, I felt absolutely fucking awful for that woman. Like, to the point where I physically felt like shit and it makes it hard to do work (currently at my job rn lol). ❤

[@nicolasgomez4052]

For neurotypical people, socializing is like breathing in auto mode; for autistic people, socializing is like breathing in manual mode, all the time, for the rest of time.

[@DGAMINGDE]

It's insane that it is mandatory for people with autism anywhere (and other mental conditions) to have extra classes. Me and my brother have ASD (although he has a bunch of motoric conditions as well) and while I went to a regular school, he went to a "Special School" (actual term for that in Germany). I had problems in my school time, but what is happening to my brother is kinda insane. Teachers in those special schools feel so stressed, that I feel like they go to insane solutions and don't seem to have actual plans. This is a thing that especially harms people with mental conditions, that sometimes need a bit of help, to be as good as others in life or even better in some cases. You can actually see how some "solutions" end up being extremely strict. For example teachers in the special school of my brother, take extra time to look at the homework of students. In my last 2 years in regular school I basically never did homework, but was able to answer homework questions on the fly, without ever doing it, as I am good at understanding writers. I got As in many of this classes, despite not doing homework, because the teachers were chill, never looked at the text and saw my contributions. In the strict environment of special schools, I would have probably failed many classes. Tbh I also believe that creating an environment for neurodivergent people alone is a terrible thing, as the are basically taken out of regular society, don't even get a chance for a fair shot in life. My brother has many mental problems due to school work stressing, which has lead him to be unable to find solutions on topics and if something is too much for him he will basically strike and will be violent, if somebody tries to force him to do anything. Teachers in turn blame him for not cooperating and tell him he has no chance to finish the year (tbh the few things I hear out of that school I believe are unironically criminal, because he got diagnosed with anxiety and depression due to it). In contrast I believe, while neurodivergent people in neurotypical environments may be frustrating in situations, helping them within these environments can easily open a positive conversation on accommodating all individuals. I have heared autistic people dooming sometimes, that they are a liability and I think it's so incredible stupid. My hot take is that environment has a massive effect on austistic people, in both bad and good ways. There is a reason, why a massive amount of people with autism isn't even able to be employed, while at the same time there is a large list of either diagnose or like autistic people in power in both present and past. I honestly believe that autistic people are kinda like if you take sliders in a video game to both positive and negative extremes, I often experience that I am far better or far worse in situations than many other people. I don't think that there a many studies on this, but I would bet that autistic people are both overrepresented in positions of power (often undiagnosed), while at the same time being overrepresented in the unemployed population. It is an unsual theory, as that breaks many models on how we think about people, but it's what I have experienced myself and see positively and negatively in other autistic people.

[@oolacilesbotnet6564]

I ain't reading all that. I'm happy for you tho or sorry that happened

[@asherroodcreel640]

Meat packing

[@asherroodcreel640]

@@oolacilesbotnet6564 Who the Hell gave you a Kidney?!

[@Helaw0lf]

Special education classes were just a dumping ground for troubled teens not asd like me. No wonder I view my teenhood with a dark lense best left to forget and move on. 🙂

[@aguspuig6615]

i feel like everyone should have the ability to be ''autistically focused'' on stuff, but when you draw the link to autism it HAS to be a disability, its a wierd contradiction