What to do after creating distance from a narcissistic abuser

[@freedomwarrior5087]

You're not going to prove anything to a narcissist.

[@Hawaiiansky11]

Yes. They turn EVERYTHING around and will leave you dissatisfied.

[@SendItForward]

@@Hawaiiansky11 yes! I learned Don't Share. Even when I am asked about My day or what I did, the answer, for him, was nothing bc if I did "share" it was just belittled or I'd get a response of "I would have done this or that" which was ALWAYS better than what I did or said. It's like he only wanted to know so he could point out his perceived flaws in me. I schemed a scenario one time to give him, from one of these past episodes where HE was king, and made it as if it were my doing (he didn't remember) and even THAT was reconstructed into a BETTER scene if HE was the creator yet he was!! It was taken from him! That showed me how screwed up he was and just plain ole inconsistent, mostly with himself.

[@ASMRyouVEGANyet]

Even if you have a recording they will figure out a way to distort reality.

[@Z1nny]

​@@ASMRyouVEGANyetthey exist in a delusion. Sadly, reality and logic don't work there.

[@rwdchannel2901]

@@Hawaiiansky11 The narcissist will invalidate anything the victim has to say and try to manipulate by capitalizing on anything the narcissist did for the victim in the past.

[@freebird189]

Jay could you do a video about REGRET?? not living to full potential (past) due to narcissistic abuse and feeling like you lost your “best years “ 😢

[@moonshineonme75013]

Yes ☠️ Please

[@dancinginthepurplereign4126]

This is so important. I feel like I am playing catching up.

[@SusanaXpeace2u]

I know, I feel sad sometimes. I'm OK being single and I value my secure ok job, but I could have a good relationship, a vocation, a circle of friends from college.....

[@artandculture5262]

If you cut a path through, at all, you’ve become something beyond what you were conditioned to be. Why not salute that while realizing that every transaction of value will be in the new healed state. Some people lose everything in accidents, crimes, and other unexpected events. Why not walk forward with perspective that you won.

[@rachelmaxwell5953]

I think acknowledging and grieving this 'loss' is really important for our healing.

[@produceman13]

It's so interesting how narcissist parents will use that word "love" without knowing what it is...

[@SusanaXpeace2u]

Yes, what does it mean to them..

[@produceman13]

@@SusanaXpeace2u I think when a narcissist says "I love you" it puts a responsibility on you to give them love. But it's not reciprocated very well on their end. So "love" in this sense is more like an obligation...

[@melliecrann-gaoth4789]

@@produceman13 I love my favourite handbag, best set of golf clubs, my stuff. 🤔

[@jnl3564]

I have found that what they usually mean is “need”. When they say “I love you” they really mean “I need you” and they honestly believe that’s what love is. Dependency.

[@Hawaiiansky11]

@@produceman13 I used to hate those words, because the implied rest of the message was always "...which means, you are obligated to put up with abuse of you and not question a thing, or ELSE."

[@chantal4113]

The way I have chosen to think of closure after having to go no contact, is that my silence speaks louder than words. Any time I said no, stop, that hurts, don't hurt me, that became a weapon that was used against me, and their abuse increased. I see that trying to reason with an unreasonable person gets us nowhere, and causes more harm to the survivor. The closure is the cut off itself, which sends the message that their abuse is not acceptable, and will not be tolerated. This involves taking back our right to exist, free from abuse, and to associate with safe people, as we learn to identify and honour our experience, thoughts, feelings and needs.

[@3rdStoneObliterum]

EXACTLY EXACTLY EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I think the same. If we had tried words, they would have been disrespected and mocked. The silence is something awesome and total and complete and victorious.

[@markartist8646]

They are like a robot that only knows its programming...Sadly that will NEVER change.

[@Sarara-mv5sx]

Such a healing comment. Thank you. 🙏🏼

[@daisyrelaxedsounds]

❤Survivor

[@qrisstrongmountain780]

Many years ago, a Native American friend told me the best way to handle this kind of unfulfilled anger is to write it all down, then burn it, releasing the negativity in the smoke. I kept a journal many years, but this has been very healing for me. He would also toss a little bit of pipe tobacco into the fire for the prayers of hope, release, & forgiveness afterwards. I hope this is helpful for someone!

[@NoMoreMrNiceGuy2003]

"Letter Never Sent" style from REM: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nnbagY2vj5yfgM0

[@sanctusthree]

I might try this.

[@mirivmd]

Thànk you so much:'(

[@dark7angel456]

I heard about that too and I used to do that but I kept on to them all instead of just burning

[@seekingthemiddleway4048]

I stopped seeing my mother after giving her a series of warnings about her behaviour which only infuriated her and made her ramp up the abuse. Following this she told everyone that she had no idea what she had done and that I must be mentally ill. So I wrote her a list, with bullet points, explaining why I would no longer accept her rages, abuse of me in front of my children, her blackening of my character to my friends and partner behind my back, her lack of respect, her refusal to respect my wishes/boundaries etc etc. She never acknowledged the points on the list which she called "weird nonsense" and urged me to see a psychiatrist. Then after a few months she wrote again asking, "What is wrong with you?" ....so I resent the list. This happened 4 times in the first 5 years of email contact only.... and then I stopped replying. She's just written again saying, "But why won't you come and see me?" It has now been ten years since I saw her or even wrote an email or replied to her. Seeing her name in my in box yet again has caused me huge anxiety. Sending the list all those times turned out to be pointless. There is no closure, ever.

[@soniahathaway1]

Don’t ever bother trying please! I tried when I returned to UK after 15 years no contact. She used me during Covid lock downs while my poor sister golden child could not fly frequently from Canada. Then she did her evil behind my back, WITH the partner I had been with! Turned out he was a Narc too. Both had started a smear campaign behind my back before I even knew. I felt broken, my partner became dangerous when I broke up with him. My siblings sided with mother and now X for self preservation/inheritance, whatever (she has hurt them in ways too). Went no contact, non molestation order, new job and healing with Jay Reid. No Contact always! ❤

[@tracyross5831]

THERE'S Closure........Block Them, Ignore Them and ALL THEIR "Flying Monkeys".......LIFE is TOO Short 🤞🤞🤞❤️

[@beatrizvignoli4053]

This discourse about disrespect and boundaries violated is also often used by the narcissist as a devaluing strategy: boundaries are not clearly set from the start by the N and then at one point your "transgressions" begin to be denounced by the N as a way of guilt-tripping you and trying to make you feel less than them. Victimization is a favorite tactic for covert narcissists.

[@pearpo]

That’s tough. I allowed certain family members to reveal their true colors in their own time. The haters became evident. There was no point for me after a mild discussion with a family member when I told him I was disappointed and he immediately went to the offensive against me even though he had cut me out of the family nearly two decades before.

[@pearpo]

I struggle with this too. Please know you moving on to your best life free of their abuse is the best closure.

[@DHW256]

Many children try to gain the approval of the narcissist parent, yet they face continued ridicule and devaluation no matter how successful they become, no matter how many times they prevail against the impossible. Our mother was constantly belittling us over-achievers while praising her flying monkeys regardless of our "success". I was an adult before I fully appreciated there was an abusive pattern in everything mother did, and I realized her neglect provoked the flying monkeys to remain under her control, while we scapegoats flourished. It was all quite absurd, and I finally "dropped the rope" after 46 years of trying to gain her approval. Life improved immediately. Mother is dead now, and her flying monkeys constantly find their ways to self-torment and distress, and there's no helping them realize that they, themselves, are their greatest stumbling blocks.

[@vemo916]

It takes radical acceptance which is symbolized by the rope. And to find closure differently. This takes working on ourselves and in my case years. Keeping the channels of communication open hurts us again and again. No contact which includes not having their messages reach us is the only way to heal eventually. They will never stop the abuse.

[@melliecrann-gaoth4789]

Yes. They keep at it even with very limited contact. It’s all about control.

[@kimlec3592]

The parents who hurt you over and over will never change. Same with partners & friends.

[@Tinky456]

No my mother of 82 was subtly putting g me down the other day in front of her friend! I mentioned we need to love ourselves and she said Oh that is old hat, came out years ago. Her friend said it is important and they talk about it in AA ! 😅 I felt vindicated by her friend buy thought, gosh this woman still needs to give me back handed slaps! Need to put more distance in!

[@pearpo]

Do what you need to. I didn’t go no contact. They cut me out.

[@pearpo]

But I didn’t run behind chasing abusive behavior begging to be included by people who don’t value me, my wellbeing, my health or happiness.

[@thescapegoatclub]

As a fellow scapegoat, for what it’s worth, I would gently suggest that ‘Serena’ put her energy into healing herself, rather than trying to get a narcissist to admit their mistakes. For me, that would be a lifelong wait…l thanks for another great video and putting us scapegoats on the map! 😊

[@cynthiafortier2540]

So well said.

[@matilda4406]

the answer is satisfactory when you realise that they are incapable of making any such evaluations, any goodwill or any closure. That's the difference

[@TatjanaMur]

Gently or not gently .. it is still a suggestion. "Heal yourself" sounds to me as "calm down". I think that this types of suggestions are completely missing the doable action points and therefore are useless. It's like gently saying to a 80 person who has never touched a smartphone "Text me Telegram".

[@thescapegoatclub]

@@TatjanaMur what doable action points would you suggest for Serena?

[@TatjanaMur]

@@thescapegoatclub Particularly to Serena I would not suggest anything. First of all, because she did not ask me. However, what I think works well for closing the loops is Gestalt Therapy .. especially Empty Chair talk. For processing the grief (not having a loving parent/s) I would go for the GriefRecoveryMethod. And, I need to point out that I was impressed with how you handled my critical comment. You asked a clarifying question before going after me. Cool.

[@mamabear71234]

I was always optimistic and a "go getter". The narcissistic people in my life loved to sabotage any type of success I had. The financial abuse was absolutely draining. They loved sucking out my energy. I became to exhausted to work.

[@1RPJacob]

_When you don’t give a sh$t, you can’t be manipulated_ Stop giving sh$t about the relationship with a narc and immediately you’ll see them panic as their power over you disappeared.

[@dominique7269]

True but what they then do is smear you. Which is infuriating. But unfortunately, is what it is.. gosh why are they so pathetic.

[@dark7angel456]

I had many try this with me They think its normal to do this to someone

[@dark7angel456]

​@@dominique7269what happened to you

[@lindac6919]

That's sounds easy...but a baby and a child are dependent on their relationship with their narky parents. A roof and food every night are needed for survival. And some sort of positive reinforcement is needed for the soul's survival.

[@maryannecomment3302]

It is very difficult to become emotionally independent if one stays in contact. Because it can seem that the narcissist has changes/his/her views. But that is temporary. Once you are sucked back into the relationship, they use your hunger for validation or whatever it is you still seek from them, against you. They enjoy your attempts to get something from them, that they will not give permanently. It is your weakness and their power over you. That is how they experience this. So you are absolutely right. Do not seek anything with people with narcissistic traits, look for it where it can be found.

[@persasrho4799]

Both my parents are dead. I still yell at them.

[@areuarealman7269]

I'm scared of smiling and dancing when my dad dies but I'll die 1st evil people outlive good people because they have no emotions.

[@lambsauce1468]

I like to think when my parents die my grandparents will be dealing with what they did to cause my parents to be so difficult.

[@soniahathaway1]

Live this…I reckon I will yell at mine, especially mother! ❤

[@soniahathaway1]

Love🤣

[@dahliafiend]

⁠@@areuarealman7269I’ve seen this narcissists who thrive because they don’t experience true empathy. My ex has a trail of pain and misery behind her in numerous exes. Not just myself. Two suicides. Drug abuse and povertly. She’s ten years older than me and I’ve had cancer twice already at 47. She married a wealthy older man and lives a comfortable middle class existence. But there are so many examples of people who’ve died due to depression and abuse. Many sociopaths do live long lives. All I know is my ex knows that I know who she really is. Nothing can take away from me. Not even death.

[@rachelmaxwell5953]

Jay, when you say "well I hope this was helpful..." I always respond in my head: "you have no idea just how helpful this is!!!!" Your videos are massively accelerating my healing and transformation 👍🤗🙏

[@SusanaXpeace2u]

Yeh, my parents have told anybody who'll listen that I'm mad, bad sad.....😑

[@kimlec3592]

If you think this is all in your imagination, please bear in mind millions develop depression & anxiety, delusions etc, due to the neglect & constant verbal emotional/psychological mistreatment/abuse. My brother felt the lack of care from our parents early on. My parents' version of "care" was to drag him from shrink to shrink. His so-called friends could not be bothered to come to his funeral, at the age of 32. Maybe they felt ashamed. This type of abuse is completely debilitating. The one brave shrink who told the truth to my mother when he said my brother would have been better off homeless. I was my mother's attendant, therapist, slave & object to be screamed at. My father was in the habit of screaming & threatening my brother when he was at his most vulnerable. Some people should have their children re-homed. This is just a fact.

[@jann4sundown]

There should be medical checks on the parent/child relationship.Too many people are too selfish to raise children without abusing them. Yes, they should lose their children--but the systems we have in the USA are in chaos and need to be reorganized to save children.

[@annewoods3528]

I fired all of them 5 years ago. The most explanation I gave was ' it was all too much too late'. I simply insisted on they not contacting me. I didn't deliberately planned my action. It just felt necessary. Looking back, I'm so glad I did. It's delicious and empowering. Through my action, I let them know I know they sacrificed me, and I don't appreciate it nor do I forgive them.

[@kippka]

LOL, LOL, LOL! Every time Jay quotes a familiar phrase, like “My daughters acting strange …” it cracks me up! I got that one from a parent LAST WEEK (along with, “You’ve been kind of distant lately”). Seriously, the direct quotes of familiar phrases are mind-blowing. Thanks, Jay!

[@dancinginthepurplereign4126]

Right? It's exactly what my narcissistic parents said about me.

[@dominique7269]

@rebekah on a spiritual level yes, they all possess a certain spirit. That’s how worldwide, all tactics and behaviours are the same..

[@rockdown3602]

My dad tried to blame my husband for me not being around Christmas. I don’t think he could absorb the fact that he ruins every Holiday and I just dont want to deal with it any longer. Finally figuring out as I approach 50 the game I have been forced to play my whole life. I hate how he uses my mom to guilt me into doing things. It isn’t about her when he guilts me, it is about him and what he wants. Mom is codependent and is happy to see me but understands if I don’t come around.

[@Ariadne76-k3d]

In my opinion it's worth it to let abusers know how you feel prior to cutting them off. I don't think they will ever take it in, but might as well get it off your chest! Either way they are going to smear you. Then close the door for good and don't waste your time on them.

[@tagaway6173]

Yes, in Serena's particular situation, it feels she needs them to know how she felt, even if they don't change.

[@emmalouie1663]

if the narcissists are relatives and one has no real support system, it is very very hard to leave the family system

[@kameshiam1674]

When I was young, my mom would pick at me, if I appeared to agree with her, she would leave me alone. If she believed my thoughts were different from hers, she would bring me hell. So glad that I grew up and got away! She was such a bully.

[@Hislittlelamb]

Thank you for addressing this. In my case both my parents had been gone for years and it was my siblings that were continuing the abuse, and specifically an older sister. She & I had just "reconciled" after a 3 year banishment (violated my boundary which she called a misunderstanding) when I started therapy the beginning of this year. It was a 'tentative' reconciliation I did mostly to please the other siblings and out of curiousity, but it was only group family texts updating us on family news so a good medium to practice gray walling. It only took my therapist the 2nd or 3rd visit to identify the Dysfunctional Family dynamic and told me my whole family were ganging up on me. I didn't believe him at first, but as we delved into my childhood and I learned about the Dysfunctional system at play I was able to have a breakthrough memory about my mom (wishing I was dead or never born) that changed everything. Once I saw through the illusion of our "Family Image" and the truth about our mom, my violent abusive older sister as her 'enforcer', the memories of how I've been scapegoated and abused by the entire family came flooding in. It was like waking up from a Cult, I had an entirely different perspective of our "Family Image", our mother, siblings and extended friends & family. I went through Facebook and deleted all the photos I could find of mom, I went through my apartment and got rid of whatever things I'd kept of hers, statues, clothes, purses, jewelry, etc. Same with the hand-me-downs and gifts (religious) from my sisters. The family chat we began in February ended 7 months later on Sept. 17th. My older sister sent out a group text about an extended family member whom I have blocked, whose father had been accused (by my cousin who was his wife at the time) of molesting me as a young child (6 or 7) which of course, my mom and siblings don't believe, then purposely deceived me about it for decades. I responded politely, said I would pray for her, then set a firm boundary "going forward do not include me in news about anyone from that family". A week later, in the middle of discussions about a relative who was admitted to Hospice she popped in with an update on her as if I'd never said anything, intentionally violating my boundary (she's not going to let the scapegoat tell her what messages she can and cannot send). I clicked on the offensive message to show it had been read. Then I blocked her and every one of my siblings, all their families, friends, everyone who was still in the "Cult of Mom". I have no common ground with them. I certainly don't share their view of our mother and the thought of having a conversation or contact with them is utterly repulsive to me after the ways they have so viciously and unconscionably abused me, my children and my grandchildren for decades. I have no desire to re-engage in that game of Tug & War on any level. I'm done and my focus is 100% on healing from the trauma and creating a new life for myself.

[@melliecrann-gaoth4789]

Boomer Jen. That is a very tough life story. Compassion to you and I’m glad you have a good therapist. Keep healing.

[@diannalamantia1702]

Dear Jen, I think we are at a similar place in healing. You and your therapist moved way faster that me and mine. That’s a gift. Thank you for sharing your experience. I, too, have dropped the rope. Not surprisingly, the siblings really seem unaffected. My mom wants everyone to appear good and proper like a living family does. And I won’t pretend that. Feel loved any more. It has required a great grieving period for the. Relationships I never had and the ones I hoped to have wit them. I suspect that my brother and sister did not grieve. Mom is crushed and behaving well for the first time in a long time. It’s that, or I drop the rope again. I stop answering call and texts. I do not engage when word salad is thrown. I require them to treat me as well as they would treat a stranger. And that has to be good enough.

[@Hawaiiansky11]

You and I are kindred spirits, my friend. Narc mom, absent father, siblings who treated me like something to laugh at and about. I was a joke to them all. I was the stupid kid (and still am, at age 52!!) It did not occur to me that my mother gossiping about them meant that she was gossiping to them about me, too. I was a young teen. I had found one person who back me up and challenged their assignment of me as the family lowlife, who they then forced me to push out of my life (see: "Ella Enchanted"). A repressed memory, of that lovely man who challenged that assignment, who coincidentally, had a very abusive, malignant narcissist / church 'leader' father, came to me this spring, which blossomed into the enlightenment that not only had I been tortured so that I would stop thinking about him, relegating the memory into a subconscious 'vault' of sorts, but also.... My siblings were never there for me. They 'protected' me from someone who genuinely cared about me, but did NOTHING to protect me from friends and men who openly abused, betrayed, cheated on and mistreated me in front of them. The ONLY person in my life that they found 'dangerous' to me was someone who was good to me. Narcissists encourage / force / coerce us into relationships with people who abuse us...IMO, so that the narc can justify their abuse of us. I care nothing for any of them. Sharing DNA means nothing to me. It meant nothing to them when I was an innocent child, a hopeful teen, or for decades after. It means nothing to me now. When I self-published a book about these memories and gave each of them a copy, only one of three siblings reached out to me about it. They all talked amongst themselves about it . The 'spoke-sibling' just offered me an impassionate message about how other people let me down, and that the lovely person was really a cad, and that I needed to read my Bible more. So yeah, Fuck them.

[@makaylahollywood3677]

Both parents are gone. Four siblings group ganged up on me just before mom gone. My mother said they were all wrong. She said i was smart- they were screwed up. I was close to my mom. I miss her. I try to connect with another younger sister- once close. But, she connects with those who hurt me. She gaslight me, and can leave me out. I dont think she cares at all. I care- and, it hurts.

[@Hislittlelamb]

@@makaylahollywood3677 It's amazing how similar our stories are, it's as though there's a Dysfunctional Family Playbook they all follow. A major turning point for me was coming to the understanding that we were all trained & programmed from birth for our dysfunctional roles. I was trained to be the Lost-Invisible-Middle Child/Scapegoat and my siblings were are trained and programmed to see me as such. They really aren't capable of perceiving me in any other way than through the "Cult of Mom". None of us have ever been taught a way out, we've all been crippled to perpetuate the system. The Scapegoat is actually the lucky one, because they're the one most likely to break free.

[@anna2belle783]

To randomly called Serena: They know what they did, and they know what they're doing. The texts aren't just bait - they're a prop for smear campaigns and gaslighting. That's why it's "I hope you're having a nice day" instead of "how are you", "how've you been", "how're you doing". It's a prop. The texts are their props.

[@Hislittlelamb]

Anna2 Belle7 ⬆⬆⬆ This right here, nailed it! ⬆⬆⬆ We don't want to think it's true, that our family would do this intentionally, but believe it. They've done a lot, lot worse and will do everything in the power to keep the truth hidden. It's why they scapegoat in the first place, to cast their deviousness onto someone else.

[@melliecrann-gaoth4789]

@@Hislittlelamb kinda like how I still trip myself up badly thinking the best of people. This is a very helpful insight.

[@melliecrann-gaoth4789]

Anna2Belle7 this is a huge insight. Wow.

[@katieg7679]

I really struggled with this and I’ll share something that is helping me the most, because I would swing between wanting to rescue my parents and earn my way back into the family then feeling angry like I needed to cut them off. I found that seeing them in my mind as not my parents anymore, that they are simply family members that have no power over me, I feel the most freedom. I think it’s the same though, dropping the rope means not needing anything from them, which could be their approval, validation, etc. It’s amazing how quickly you will lose interest in them when you can find other ways to meet those needs.

[@jnl3564]

I felt like I was programmed to take my vulnerability to them as an offering. Now I see that even my anger and rational discussions were just a demonstration of my vulnerability and in essence a plea for them to give me back what was taken. It’s like the voices in my head were always telling me that I had to keep trying, and the arguments did seem rational. In the end, I had too see that I was being delusional, that the arguments weren’t rational at all, that it was a compulsion to keep engaging with them. I felt I had no power to do anything different, I was afraid of the future. Looking back now, after being no contact for for 14 months, I see that I was learning. I was observing the consequences of engaging with them and it was more pain. It helps so much to do what Jay suggests, to find support where it is given freely. Sometimes it takes a while to realize that the parent’s well is dry and there is no water. You’re dying of thirst and you think “maybe this time there will be water to quench my thirst.” I did have to believe that as a child. Really, the well never had water, and never will have water, and accepting that truth brought nothing good but positivity to my life. Joy, peace, power, intimacy in relationships, self esteem... I could go on and on. None of it would be possible if I were still running to that empty well.

[@dancinginthepurplereign4126]

It's so wild that I relate to Serena's experience. All along I didn't want my parents to even love me, I just wanted them to stop abusing me. Love was never even on my mind. Since going No contact, I get very angry about how they treated me. My parents act the same way as my biological parents. They say I am crazy.

[@joellenklemek138]

Yep me too. With my whole family. Only want them to not hurt me. Don’t even know how to want more than that from them.

[@chantal4113]

Exactly. "I just want it to stop."

[@z1z2z3z]

People don't want to accept such horrible behavior can be done by parents. They are not people we can be close with, if they don't want to see you and validate you. My family also thinks I am wrong. I get angry as well, and I'm learning to just notice the anger without concentrating on it. It comes and goes. Grounding techniques help.

[@mm669]

As the family scapegoat, any interactions with my siblings (Father dead, mother has Alzheimers) just leads to more pain. I do everything I can to avoid any encounters with them at all. It's sad because that means no more extended family functions but I'm accepting this fact.

[@mamaJmama]

I read what you wrote and I am not alone. ty.

[@SendItForward]

Yes, I love the "just drop the rope". For me it was tied around my body and took me some time to get it off then drop it. I'll never have closure and I guess that's what I really wanted but I realized too that if staying or leaving were basically the same in the sense of "closure", I'd rather leave. I've known of ppl who stayed and the person died and they STILL had no closure. It's akin to me wanting to be taller and hoping one day I will. I just had to accept reality, walk through my grieving process and somehow my heart kept beating.

[@slindilekhumalo6221]

I can't believe that in just a week watching your videos, I feel different after so much therapy and life coaching, I was so stuck but now I feel lighter,,thank you so much,,may you continue with these encouraging and enlightening videos.

[@traceyseier329]

Some of the books I read early in my journey suggested that confronting the abusers was needed to get "closure". But with a narcissist, they've ignored decades of explanations, pleading, and fighting. They have proven they won't change and won't listen. The only thing to do is to deeply accept that fact.

[@fredhubbard7210]

Interesting and subtle discussion. I would offer this: What they love--is to see you react, the best thing is (as my wife says) "Go dark." If they contact you just say, "I would love to talk, but now is not a good time. I will give you call when I have a chance. Lovely that you thought of me" Do not give them the pleasure of seeing your pain. Do not let them think they have the upper hand... They have spent a lifetime pissing on you. Let them find another place to piss.

[@dark7angel456]

My experience with narcs and absorbing their negativity led me to internalize that this is the only way to escape torment and my own self was distorted and put on a high Shelf. Self abandoned for years. My hurt is always there and nobody seems to care of the void they create.

[@brada-smith2807]

What is so frustrating when parent reacts like that, like offering warm, but superficial texts trying to draw you in, is that the message that gets conveyed is WE are the ones with the problem. I left home at 20, and it took a few years for them to realize I might not come back. I re-emerged in my mid 20’s and it was a though they felt humbled. I think the message we need to convey, to family and self, is “I have the power to abandon you.” If they don’t understand that, they still see you as an object of their own complexes. It’s terrifying I know. That’s why between step one and two (first understanding what happened, and then making space) is that mid step of securing a supportive environment, at least to some extent, before you step away.

[@danitaoliver264]

❤YESSSSSSSS JAY, THE VISUALIZATION OF DROPPING THAT ROPE IS PRICELESS, LOL.......... THAT VISUAL WORKS BOTH WAYS, IMAGINE THAT ROPE BEING DROPPED, THAT THEY ARE CONNECTING THEMSELVES TO US WITH........... THE EMPOWERMENT OF IT ALL..........PRICELESS!!!!!❤

[@CherrysJubileeJoyfully]

I actually did yell and scream and continued to do so on KZbin but I did so knowing nearly my entire family is beyond hope. I did it from 4000 miles away. I did it from a place of personal security and all it did was push more people away. I lost a few extra friends and family by doing this but I knew what I was willing to sacrifice for my sanity and to give myself the painful freedom to allow me to help others. The best revenge is living a joyful life

[@lauriedmills7581]

Learn to live with the existence of injustice and that some people refuse to love you and even wish to hurt and harm you and not care at all.

[@ericmoore9444]

I feel like I get treated like this by everyone. It’s so painful.

[@joellenklemek138]

I do also get treated this way. Especially by old childhood frenemies who gossip and have not grown out of our small and small minded hometown. I have so many texts from my passive abusive family and friend groups exactly like this. What is the response to give? Nothing?

[@ericmoore9444]

Exactly, they want to bring you back in to treat you badly.

[@knick9318]

Change your body language, try to speak more assertive and always stand up for yourself no matter what. Also get bad people out of your life. That's what I have done and I have way less encounters with self centered assholes bothering me. Body language is probably the biggest thing. If you look down all of the time and don't speak up people will see that they can treat you like shit. I hope that helps because it helped me and I can't stand constantly dealing with bad people.

[@ericmoore9444]

That’s very true! Showing some strength goes a long way.

[@diannalamantia1702]

And fill the void with other kind people. Lift your eyes and see them on the sidelines. They are there and precious if you will find the courage to engage them, however slowly. ❤

[@rosemarythyme8595]

For me, just absolutely ghosting the three narcissists I dealt with in my life is enough because the satisfaction of ghosting them is healing for me. I just simply do not ever have to deal with them again or be around them and that is more than enough for me. I am absolutely content with who I am after everything I’ve been through. I know what I am, and I know what I’m not. However I wish it wouldn’t have taken five decades to come to the realization that I don’t need to put up with vile people, and that I do have a choice as to who I choose to have in my life or spend time with.

[@moirabijker]

Thank you for this video and sharing your wisdom. I dropped the rope, walked away and blocked my mother who is a covert Narcissist and her flying monkeys, my brother and sister, two years ago. I don't feel like I have closure but I have accepted that this will never happen. What I am really struggling with at the moment is my ex-husband who is also a Narcissist. Due to us having shared custody of our children (a boy and girl twins, 9 years old) I can't cut off all communication. He viciously abused me throughout our 7 year marriage. We have been divorced for 5 years. I find myself wanting to believe sometimes that maybe he isn't that bad but deep down I know he will never change. Also I find myself in a position where I am still financially dependent on him for child support and helping me find a new apartment to rent, that is for my children and I. I have been so depressed for months now and don't know how to move forward with my life as I have no ambition and just feel burnt out. Sorry for the long message.

[@rachelmaxwell5953]

Sending you a big dose of light energy to boost your healing ✨💕 you have survived so much already, you ARE strong. What can you do to relieve your heart? Nature? Taking yourself to a nice café? Push yourself to take the first step, then you can do what you like. I've been rock bottom too, I never thought I could lift myself up at all but we can!!! 💕🤗

[@melliecrann-gaoth4789]

Moira Bij. You are not alone. Breathe by breathe. Step by step. It is positive that you have more awareness about your ex husband. There is nothing easy about this but the more real we can be the better for our kids. And that’s something we really want for them. Take care- this is a positive space here- there’s a lot of women who experienced abuse from their own mothers and then married a man not dissimilar. Maybe different packaging but same core. Mind yourself, give yourself a bit of kindness in very, very small ways, burn out is real and slowly we can come back from it or move on from it.

[@moirabijker]

@@rachelmaxwell5953 , thank you kindly. I intend to get myself a nice pair of summer sandals today.

[@moirabijker]

@@melliecrann-gaoth4789 , thank you for your kind response. My dad died 4 years ago. He was a real monster... alcoholic, child molester and wife beater. No wonder I married a horrible man. But I will do my recovery - one day at a time.

[@SJD36]

:( praying for you. Its rough. My mom and siblings are like that too. Just recently took steps to walk away. Still get texts though. Might have to be more precise than saying I need space. Sorry about your husband being that way. That's sounds really awful .

[@sanctusthree]

I am 59, and just recently realized that I was raised in a narcissistic family system and suffer from complex ptsd. This perpetuated itself throughout my adult life as I continued to enter relationships that were similar to the family system I grew up in. My question is, how do I let go of the memories of the abuse that haunt me? Also having lived so many years not even seeing how abusive my relationships were, I thought I was at a place of forgiveness and peace with those who perpetrated the abuse. The reality was, I was so conditioned to accept the horrible treatment of others, I did not even realize how horrific and unconscionable it was. Now that I have woken up to it, I have no idea what to do about it, or how to interact with the perpetrators I have to see and speak to from time to time.

[@thesehandsart]

All confronting them did was to further cement that they don't care with their punitive and demeaning reaction... No more!

[@hstjames5609]

This is the best I got from my narc Mother: "Yes you did have some very difficult parts of your childhood which caused you great unhappiness and stress. Clearly all of that has been difficult to move on from. I hope you can find the strength to do so." 💀 they are dead inside, they cannot offer healing, only hurt ❤

[@sarahjena1851]

Lol they always find a way to make it your fault. 😂

[@Hippowdon121]

I've heard very similar things a lot of times myself

[@florag8358]

i honestly think that the best remedy for survivors of extreme narcissistic abuse and for them to get the satisfaction that they crave without throwing bricks through windows is to make a KZbin video and put it all out there. Now all we need is for someone to help us with a checklist of how to put it all together.

[@YuvrajSingh-yg7sn]

Exactly 🎉🎉

[@kimberlymccracken747]

Excellent content. It's surprising how they all use the same low-down tactics on their own children. Humility is non-existent with narcs. Thank you, as usual Jay 💙

[@charlesp.8555]

Right? It’s like the exact same story over and over.

[@daisyh8481]

i didnt know what good others were, i kept meeting ass holes. now i just stay alone and im very happy

[@petrastrong7799]

An essential piece of the first step is to take responsibility for our part. No, we are not to “blame” - - but we had best suffer the reality of our part in falling into this arena. Seen that way - we learn, heal and grow immune from future abuse. And that lesson is the only thing one can ever expect to get from a relationship with a narcissist. You need to start mattering to your self!!

[@le_th_]

They know EXACTLY how they harmed you....they simply DO NOT CARE.

[@samf.s.7731]

They know when you start to do that, they try to draw you back in. Don't fall for it. You won't get closure, or acknowledgment of what they did, believe me... I tried. But when they realize you're onto their sh!t, that's when they deploy other tactics.

[@brada-smith2807]

Another thought pertaining to finding a safe environment to “come out”: I created such a remarkably false self to cope with the guilt and self hate, quite a likable one. Radiant and generous to a clear fault. And yes, relationships built on that false self seemed “safe”, but that was because I still hadn’t revealed any of my actual traits or values. A people pleaser, like most of us scapegoat are I imagine, might feel surrounded by “safe” people, but that’s because many people expect us to be that sweet self sacrificing false self. A test I have, is “imagine I could “shine” in front of this person. (Whatever “shine” means to you). Would they be happy and support me? Or would they be threatened and shut me down?” I still have very few of these people in my life. Plenty of people who are willing to hear me talk about how broken I am and how I struggle. Few who delight in me displaying strength. I am glad to hear about the Facebook page. Will be good to connect there. Does that make sense?

[@miuthub7954]

Absolutely makes sense. The effect of NP conditioning has widespread effects. I do catch myself noticing that people who I thought have good intentions towards me may actually not have good intentions. We'll keep growing and do the hard work and our people will come into our lives.

[@sylviagibson568]

Thanks for this. One hard thing is that I've also had to "drop the rope and walk away" from my sister and brother who play the role of "flying monkey" and amplify my mother's cruel distorted perception of me. I wish so much that they could see and acknowledge what a good person I am, but everytime I try to talk about the situation with them they say that I'm "mom-bashing" that I "have to let it go" or worse, that I am a "mind fuck". These are people who I love and who I thought were stable pillars in my life. I like what you say about nature filling a vacuum, and I already have many healthy friends and "chosen family", but I still feel so sad about not having an honest and deep relationship, especially with my sister. We were close as kids, but I realize that her peace and "golden child" identity (including financial favor) with our mom rests on me being "inadequate". I also have let go of desiring the same financial assistance that my sister receives. I'm trying to see it as an opportunity to walk away, not look back, and live my life freely on my terms. Thank you for your videos. They are spot on.

[@elyse2440]

Wow Jay this video was amazingly insightful! I've been trying to make sense of everything for the last year finally looking the truth in the face after coming across one of your video's one day. Now I can see through your analogy what it's all about and what I am really supposed to do and why its so Important. The psychological emotional tug of war between the narcissist can only be done by dropping the rope and pulling away and turning back to yourself and not looking back so you give any power away or get sucked back into the game. You hold your own power fully when you turn away and walk in their opposite direction. We give our power back away a little more each time we look back and second guess ourselves. By turning inward we support our own truth, perspective, and ultimate reality by affirming to our ourselves who we say we are without the external validation or influence from another. Owning your own Power is really about owning Who You Are. Each step you take farther away will dissolve more and more of the invisible energetic bonds that have held you captive through a Trauma Bond in which you had to bond to an abusive person and submit your reality for their version of reality in order to survive. Breaking free of narcissistic abuse is really about this process. I've been no contact for almost a year even though they think I'm just taking a break I've secretly been running as far away as I can psychologically and emotionally and it's been a confusing and challenging journey just to trust myself in breaking free. Now I know all I have to do is keep going forward and keep Not looking back or maybe I will turn into a pillar of stone... Sure feels that way to me. It's a journey of Self Partnering and never looking back. It's an old World It's a new world It's a bold world for me And I'm feeling Good -Nina Simone

[@mpsorr]

I really like this phrase "Drop the rope." Having little catch phrases, like mantras and affirmations help me a lot when I'm in a moment to remember to shift to my new mindset as I'm healing. Whenever I talk to a certain person and feel like I want to say something about the past and/or how they're being a total hypocrite, I'm going to say this in my head and picture it. I think it's a powerful image to see myself just drop that rope and feel all the tension drop. Instant relief. Such a good one!

[@robinjessop6607]

We are everything good they are not and they hate it. None of it was our fault. They are our toughest teachers to bring us back to our true amazing selves!❤

[@mrskmonster]

This is exactly where I am. I actually DID tell my dad that I was hurt and that he was gaslighting me. Now he's just sending meek, bland texts as if nothing is wrong.

[@shloby953]

Ah man I feel that kid who sent that to you. It's so frustrating because they will never level with you ot reason with you. It's like talking to a wall

[@cynthiafortier2540]

This is me and my family. I had to walk away, I had enough. So so sad though. Thankyou Jay, l love what you do for us, and that beautiful soft voice of yours. My Dad raged alot, so I love your approach. Blessings to you sir!!

[@bogumilakitowska-marszalek789]

"drop the rope in the tug of war" to truly win; to win true meaning in your life - What a brilliant statement!, pleanty of appreciation from my side

[@nidhiempaynado1018]

Great video, as always. I have dropped the rope realizing no engagement i could have is going to be positive. My favorite thing in this video is the void left can be filled with positive relationships and self validation. I plan to achieve so much that I have been so limited to do in the past while healing from this trauma. Rope…..? What rope??

[@nataliastimac1695]

Do you ever talk about how children take on traits of their abusers as part of survival??? This has come up in my therapy and I have had narcissistic parts that show up for me. I am not a narcissist but I parts that have taken on some of those traits.

[@onehuman5325]

What about the double bind of scapegoat and rescuer as well, so dropping the rope is also having to deal with the responsibility of the suffering of others?

[@TheLordsbattleaxe]

Been kind of lost since no contact I admit.

[@aniabrandt7]

Hearing this story is like my life story. Is hard to break off as there r feeling's & emotions. For the inner peace set boundaries & distance

[@elizabethash4720]

My father use to say to me" you're a very strange girl" I thought, I know I won't buy into your behaviour, but I didn't know he was a narc. Now it all makes sense, I was right in feeling the way I did. I had felt so mentally traumatised by his abuse, this video helps. Thanks.

[@fk3972]

Wow, my mum used to say the same to me. Never understood where it came from. And now here we are both watching Jay Reid, and learning about narcissism! Funny that.

[@elizabethash4720]

@@fk3972 fancy that. Pleased to meet you. You are definately not strange.💖

[@SlavicGirl.]

Smh, it’s like talking to or about a stranger child that you see on tv, like a fictional character or something. Narcs can’t connect on meaningful level, so carnal, egocentric, so draining

[@elizabethash4720]

@@SlavicGirl. That's exactly how I felt, like some other woman, rarely a child. Just so totally weird, I was ashamed he was my father and saw how kind my friends fathers were to them, in comparison. I always felt empty before and after he passed. I don't remember ever shedding a tear for him because there was never any feeling of love or compassion, it was more a kind of eerie estrangement.

[@SlavicGirl.]

@@elizabethash4720 I understand

[@peaceangel-rl2hf]

Very useful advice, spot on...I needed to hear this to validate my slow recovery . It's amazing how similar our experiences as children of narcissists are, you could have been describing my childhood as Serena's

[@macareuxmoine]

Thank you for this video. To me this is one of the most important topics in the process - the one where the most difficult and important growth needs to happen - that where the emotional ties to the narcissist are loosened. All the other steps prepare you for this: learning about narcissism, learning you deserve(d) better, learning there can be another world out there and finally bringing physical distance betwee you and the narcissist. But once you’ve done that you’ll notice that you still have the narc(s) within you: you miss them, you long for them, you refer to their internalized voice in your daily decisions, you wonder if they will spend the holidays like you used to, how their life will continue to develop, how you could be part of that etc. And under the pressure of the separation pain the narc(s) will start to look less evil than they actually are, the pains they inflicted on you start to look less severe, hell, you even wonder if you yourself are responsible for them having been inflicted. And here is this crucible moment of really dropping the ties to them… of reassuring yourself, believing your own voice, acknowledging your pain, holding on. This task of not only mastering physical but also emotional separation is the most daunting yet consequential imho. Thank you for laying out a bit of a roadmap for that - I will check what else you have put out on the subject.

[@gammayin3245]

This helps me so much - perhaps more than you can know. I appreciate you!!

[@caobranch]

Hi Jay! I really appreciate all of your videos. Could you please do a video about having two parents as narcissists, then marrying an even more dangerous narcissist before finally discovering NPD? I feel like a complete idiot. At this point, living in a domestic violence shelter with no hope. I would have committed suicide by now but for the deep love of my children (in their 20s). I actually live on Bush St. In SF. Will contact your office for an appointment. So glad I found your channel. Thank You 😊.

[@macareuxmoine]

I don’t know if you still need this assurance but you sure are not an idiot. Obviously Narc ‚love‘ is the only version of love you ever learned to recognize and that’s what you found once you were let lose into this world. You have a task of relearning in front of you… but reading the comments of those who’ve done it makes me think it’s a worthwhile endeavor. Bon chance!

[@HowAboutThat3]

This is an absolutely fantastic video. Thank you SO MUCH, Jay. You say new things in a really effective way. I love how your videos focus on "what to do about it". They are really clear and empowering and easy to uptake and put into action. Thank you! 🙂

[@hstjames5609]

Frankly I feel rage 🤷🏼‍♀️💔

[@AZDC99]

3:27 "Today's video is the third pillar called 'LIVING IN DEFIANCE OF THE NARCISSIST'S RULES'". Amen! Slowly I found myself tricked into living in a different world than what should be. I gaslit myself to support this stuff for too long too. Regaining myself a little slowly but surely

[@Joanna-np6fx]

Serena took the words right out of my mouth!! Well said- great response and so helpful. Need to replay this particular video a few times!

[@peacenquiet77]

This is what I’m going through - so thank you!

[@fashionforwarddd]

Very well said, I really appreciate your videos and the way you explain things! Thank you!

[@kristinanne6534]

I love the idea of dropping the rope! It's really helpful.

[@Ariadne76-k3d]

I also want to say I like the new chair! It is classy and classic.

[@sarahbrown1398]

Brilliant.

[@joaopedro.guidicini]

Olá, Jay! Moro no Brasil e gostaria muito de fazer seu curso, mas infelizmente não sou fluente em inglês. As aulas dele por acaso possuem transcrição? Pois assim conseguiria traduzir e compreender.

[@mamabear71234]

The most frustrating thing I have experienced is how the narcissist plays the victim.

[@RippleDrop.]

I've called my narcissist mother out many times. She never takes any accountability. What's the point? Just deflection and gas lighting follows where my lacking trust in self is already poor.

[@JessAnonymous]

She won’t unless she hits rock bottom. There’s a high chance her mother also treated her the exact same way. Just know that none of it was your fault and continue to educate yourself as much as you can. I feel a shift in the word and narcissism is being talked about more than ever. People are becoming awakened and your mom will expose herself to others eventually

[@emlijo]

I tried to get a closure, to speak my opinions etc. Nothing worked. The only thing that worked for me was to put up boundaries when they abused me which made them hate me even more (who am I to put up boundsaries to them and claim my worth?) and I let them ”scapegoat” me after that with the usual smear campaign and reject me. That was the only way for me to ”get rid” of them. But now I have these nightmares every night with them in it, I guess I’m processing feelings etc. And I have this guilt, and I feel evil, useless, can not relax. Although they are far away now it’s like my whole system is so triggered. After watching videos here I can see it’s common and an expected effect after distancing from everything. But it’s so hard, and I pray every day to not give up and find strength. And when I have a good day, the next day will always be the worst. Because I have to deal with all the guilt, fear etc for being happy and enjoying my life and taking steps forward the day before. This is terrible and I really hope that one day I and we all will be healed again and be happy, and this will just be something way back, a memory, a bad experience from the past. And not something we have to live over and over and over again… 🙏 Jesus save me! ❤

[@eprofengr6670]

Good points. How do you think that aspects of narcissistic abuse overlaps into parental alienation behaviors in divorce cases ?

[@mariamalhotra8228]

I had Borderline Personality and Complex Trauma as a consequence of Narc abuse from my parents and siblings. Scapegoated and ostracized, daily attacks, ganging up on me, hourly betrayals and humiliation all while my smug mother looked on, pleased.

[@pattyrooney1323]

I moved 2,500 miles away from the clan cult in 1974. In 2022 I started "no contact" with 2 lukewarm Christians, my "older" sis+ female "cuz" the flying monkey. Both articulate liars, stirring up b.s. In May 2023 I went no contact with the whole family + so-called friends. I'm 71 years old this month. Best birthday ever!

[@JustineDelforge]

Thank you for making these videos. The manner which you speak is so kind. Thank you!

[@jreid-heal-narcissistic-abuse]

You are so welcome!

[@DavidFraser007]

Forget about their opinions, they are just projecting their fears and jealousy. It's quite pathetic really.

[@tnt01]

100%

[@RippleDrop.]

A child can't just forget it. Not even as an adult.

[@makaylahollywood3677]

I slowly distanced from my siblings with nobody saying a word. It's tricky, since I did walk away, why would I expect them to say anything...but, it's still feels odd.

[@soniahathaway1]

Stat away from them. ❤

[@soniahathaway1]

Or stay away rather

[@hightechpickers4365]

letting you walk away is the best gift they will ever give you. Don't expect more of them.

[@ConveyApp]

My ex-wife. Our relationship was approximately 19 years. It took me a very long time to realize I was in a very abusive: physical, emotional, and mentally abusive individual. I was 23 and she was 32 when we got together. She had been my employer for 2 years prior to getting together. Finally she crossed a line for the last time. I went no contact. Anyways I go through these blocked memory dumps and get super angry and upset. Plus the sexual betrayal I finally discovered is just too much…. Anyways I have been thinking and this proverb about a scorpion and frog. It’s in the scorpion’s natural to kill the frog. It’s just what it does…

[@sylviaking8866]

I would go not contact or at least as little contact as humanly possible depending on circumstances.

[@CTSCAPER]

Excellent question and excellent reply. Thank you!

[@lynny5908]

Is there anyway that you can turn up the volume of your recorded lessons and daily talks,? Even with the volume turned all the way up to high, the volume of your voice us still too liw to be able to really hear every word that your saying. And I really want to be able to gear your voice clearly and loudly enough as I find your talks and lessons very helpful and dense with alot of meaning compacted in what you say. Thank you so much for anything you could do on your end to make your voice louder. I greatly appreciate your help and support and the important help you provide for us all out gere

[@kimberlywatson6718]

Thank you so much!!! :Lisa 💝💝💝💝💝💝💝

[@eyeonrecovery8319]

Another great video! Thank you so much, Jay! Very useful and informative!

[@Joanna-np6fx]

Such great discussion and very helpful feedback and reflections!! 😊 great job!!

[@emilianolopez4289]

Hi Jay, thank so much for being there, and for this video. I would like to ask you if perhaps you could create a video with advice on how to deal with the feeling of utter impotence when facing a much stronger opponent pysically or finanncially and how to dal with the feeling of lack of power fear empytiness humilliation indignation and heart broken after being beaten, punched attacked, and humilliated by an abusive man. I could never trust the police to do anything they are corrupt and minimize the damages these people caused me, I feel hopeless impotent empty humilliated disrepected to the core, with a lot of fear, broken emotionally, an I am a strong man psychically, but I feel heart broken and impotent and too vulnerable, not safe in this world. I have tried to cheer myself from within all my life however when the it happens that the narcs have more power psychically or financially, or they are among corrupt state authorities it feels impossible to deal with them and feeling SAFE. I lnow I am not superman, but still I dont seem to be abl to FOGIVE MYSELF for allowing their abuse. I just CANT

[@ninagalluzzo6943]

Thank you so much for this valuable informatipn..i really needed tp hear this ☆☆☆☆☆

[@colleenstudio]

Thank you. What happened to your yellow chair?

[@antjestr1047]

I understand that its important for healing to find safe others, but I feel like I'm in an ice-cube ... I feel so shallow and I just cant get close to people ...all conversations seem kind of empty....I just cant connect with people its all on a surface level ....:/ there come words out of my mouth but I cant feel a connection, my eyes feel heavy, my voice for me feels melancholic.... its hard :(

[@soniahathaway1]

Keep listening to these videos snd take time to recover. It will get better. I felt this way in the beginning.

[@antjestr1047]

@@soniahathaway1 thanks!

[@stacykelly7651]

Very helpful, as always. I too have wanted my pound of flesh. I know I will never get it.

[@rleeann5798]

A book I'm finding helpful in this journey is Leaving Home: The Art of Separating from Your Difficult Family by David Celani

[@4Beats4Me]

A victim might never realize the manipulation into adult life, most or all of a very short life.