What were the objectives of Sauron? - Motives, Values & Philosophy of a God-King

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

What do you imagine Sauron would have done as God-King? Thanks to Teleperónwë MC, TheCapitaineMax, Domenic Minniti, John Smith, Forrest Johnson, Lucas Devick, Paradox, Observer, Otto Sol, Samuel-A001 and Gabriel Yalap for their support! I very much appreciate the support who goes directly into funding my artists! Consider supporting me here: www.patreon.com/join/LOME

[@Ryo-sj8wn]

If not every one started out evil in the Tolkien-verse then how did Malkor become evil?

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

@@Ryo-sj8wn Melkor fell to evil because he wanted to be Eru. He was very powerful to begin with, and he wanted to create using the flame imperishable. But he could not find find the flame imperishable. We see Melkor creating things of his own in imitation of Illuvatar, but orcs are his byproduct. Melkor wanted to be like Eru.

[@Ryo-sj8wn]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT Thanks, I did not know that.

[@denniscleary7580]

I believe he would’ve conquered most of middle earth and expanded to far possibly discovering a whole new power out in the void.

[@denniscleary7580]

Sorry I’m a little late, excellent video as always 👍

[@NOIDEAIWILLJUSTUSEHAILEYIGUESS]

Its funny to think that he was so impatient when he waited very patiently while scheming against his enemies. It might’ve been in the wrong direction but at least Sauron was able to fix his impatience.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Yeah, he patient with his impatience in certain cases :P But the impatience also led to his downfall, for he wanted the head of the heir of Elendil all too soon!

[@patrikrathousky5791]

But then again, whats impatient for a neigh imortal being?

[@taelorpickel2830]

@@patrikrathousky5791 Nigh?

[@ingold1470]

@@patrikrathousky5791 It's like being hasty for an ent.

[@paradox7358]

"The road to hell is paved with good intentions". Some of the worst acts imaginable have been committed by those who thought they were doing something righteous or for a 'greater good'.

[@powerofroses1670]

so long as they dont hurt others they r good. everyone has a right to do what they want. whether they r straighy gay or lesbian. this is a free country.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

That's why Sauron's evil from Tolkien's perspective is such genius! Well said my friend!

[@Thumbdumpandthebumpchump]

@@powerofroses1670 I think you misunderstood the man's comment. He's talking about Hitler, Ceaser, Stalin, etc.

[@totmgsrockxd9900]

@@Thumbdumpandthebumpchump Don't forget Mao. Single most lethal dictator in history. Even Genghis Khan has a lower body count than Mao. And yet I'm sure that somehow Mao believed his repugnant actions were "for the greater good."

[@judsongaiden9878]

"The greater good." *Shut it!* XD

[@user-qf6yt3id3w]

Sauron is such an enigmatic character.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Indeed!

[@LordTelperion]

The ultimate foundation of Sauron's agenda was the shaky assumption that the Valar had truly abandoned the world. However, we see Sauron quite nervous over this principle assumption, obsessing over signs and portents. Sauron freaks out over the slightest indications that the Valar might take action, such as a change of the wind coming from the West, stars showing themselves in spite of his enveloping dark, Eagles appearing at conspicuous times, etc. And he was right to be nervous; even though the Valar held themselves back by their self-imposed ban on direct divine intervention, they were focused like a laser beam on what was happening, tipping luck in favor of the Hobbits and allies of the West...and maybe even convienently tripping up a victorious Gollum at the Cracks of Doom.

[@dogbert14]

It was actually Eru who caused Gollum to fall into the Crack. Sauron was being watched more closely than he feared.

[@Rotisiv]

@@dogbert14 It almost makes you feel bad for him. It was a hopeless situation for him ever since the moment he decided to join Morgoth in his rebellion against God.

[@bobgatewood5277]

​@@Rotisiv he should've known better

[@Voyagerthe2nd]

Good guy Sauron; Gave out gifts Developed industry Created thousands of jobs

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

:P

[@EdgarStyles1234]

Fought for equality for orcs and dark skinned men

[@penultimateh766]

Ha ha. Since you apparently hate capitalism and your own employer, maybe you could explain why he HASN"T kept you from quitting your job to do subsistence farming and eating exclusively what you grow and raise yourself? Oh, right, because you are NOT a slave....Except to your own lack of skills....

[@cool06alt]

@@penultimateh766 i see you are bots, this will be interesting. A comment that has nothing to do with any stuff that you mention can spawn...rethoric like yours.

[@di3486]

@@penultimateh766 calm down, Tolkien hated allegory.

[@tlotpwist3417]

He wanted to revolutionize jewelry but jealous elves and humans guilds attacked him to steal his new product before he could get it patented.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Good one :D

[@jhoku1]

Sauron would have called his rings Saurings but no one wanted market them. 😔 That's so sad

[@blackmetalnazgul4519]

Always love hearing your voice say "Sauron". 👍🙂 are you ever gonna try to collab with other Tolkien channels like history of the ages? That be would great. 👍

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Glad to hear that you notice the correct pronunciation! I actually collabed with "The Clueless Fangirl" on my Galadriel video, definitely recommend you to check it out. Also taking part of a large collab with all the Lotr channels in the upcoming future ;)

[@blackmetalnazgul4519]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT I look forward to seeing it 🙂you're one of my top 3 favorite channels next to history of the ages and men of the west 🙂🙂

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

@@blackmetalnazgul4519 Thank you :)

[@Crafty_Spirit]

Has anyone ever calculated the land area controlled by Morgoth respectively Sauron? Morgoth's rule on the eve of the war of the wrath was near total if I remember correctly, and Sauron never held wast sways of Middle-Earth for long, but Middle-Earth is also larger...

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

During the War of the Elves and Sauron, Sauron held far more land than Morgoth ever did. Beleriand is quite small :)

[@dodgykingdom7502]

Sauron was quite cunning, very talented in corruption.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Indeed! Very!

[@nicholasmaude6906]

He was a control-freak obsessed with order, his order;).

[@c.ladimore1237]

i was about to say "like an oil company" but then you mentioned efficiency and economic well-being of all, and well, sauron would have been better than what we have now...

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Ada Cardano for a better system!

[@Celedan]

Sauron would make a great modern architect.

[@KTChamberlain]

In a way, Sauron was like the Pompey Magnus to Morgoth's Sulla. In Sulla's civil war Pompey was Sulla's lieutenant and Sulla bestowed on him the moniker of Magnus meaning "the Great". When he held extralegal tribunals on Sulla's enemies, magistrates told him that what he was doing was illegal (which it was), to which he responded, "Cease quoting laws to those with swords." When Sulla died we get this sense that Pompey wanted to be as authoritarian as Sulla was and when he provoked Julius Caesar to start a civil war he fled to the east and he did become more authoritarian as he gathered strength. If he had won he would have proscribed his enemies by stripping them of Roman citizenship, to steal their wealth and property like Sulla did. So no doubt Sauron would be like Pompey at his worst dialed to 11, what with being a Maia and all.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Such a great example. I have never delved into history, but this was a great example kt :) Your comments are always so special, thanks for taking the time!

[@Crafty_Spirit]

It's a fun comparison and Pompey surely minted coins with his portrait in the East which reads like a proto-authoritarian move, but at least someone wept when he passed, can't say that for Sauron 😅

[@MrCrownedClown]

It is a great comparison, even though it does not work in some details. For example, Sulla is quoted to have feared Pompey and nearly executed him. Also, it cast Ceasar as the good one and that does not seem right. But the example shows how the corruption through role model which happened to Sauron happens in the real world.

[@MrCrownedClown]

Small addition and the enemy of Sulla, i.e Gaius Marius, shows the concept of corruption through ambition very well.

[@KTChamberlain]

@@MrCrownedClown True, that's why I only mentioned the parts that were relevant to the analogy.

[@PhantomBones101]

Hearing this makes me think villains that were once good and have good intentions are starting to overshadow villains who are simply evil forces of nature. Whose only goals are to simply spread evil as opposed to more lofty goals.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Well said!

[@wolfsbanealphas617]

wasn't Luicifer once good it makes them real shows it can happen to anyone and how formjable they are. Also sauron is the face of the devil but at his core he is morgoth

[@KTChamberlain]

Another theme I noticed that's present in Tolkien is unity vs. uniformity. In both Melkor and Sauron, they both assert mental dominance over the orcs they command. When Sauron rose in the wake of Melkor's demise, he tries to use rings of power to essentially focus his mental power like a lens to debuff psy defense and up his psy offense. I'm sure Tolkien himself understood that a garden or a forest never looks beautiful if all the flowers and trees are exactly the same. Variety is the spice of life as they say and that's true even in Middle-earth.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Very good reflection, I had never viewed it in that way KT, excellent view! You should make Tolkien videos honestly.

[@timmy1014]

Crazy idea….morgoth seduced Sauron…like a fanfic,”hot slightly evil man charms a blacksmith,who’s torn between duty and love” anyone?

[@InfiniteDarkness7756]

Sauron's so badass. I wish we got a solo movie and a solo game on him!.

[@Domina7ion]

I do wonder how saurons human allies in the 3rd age would describe him and their relationship with him.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Very interesting indeed. Morgoth returned?

[@Domina7ion]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT or maybe we are basing our knowledge on Gondors view and they didnt worship him, but he had deceived them in less direct ways. Like promises of prosperity and equality or something.

[@waltonsmith7210]

Hes an immortal being with mysterious powers. You cant really blame them for thinking hes a god. What are they supposed to think?

[@Domina7ion]

@@waltonsmith7210 Do you think they think he is an evil god / associated with Melkor?

[@MrAlias-oc8uk]

Largely Canon: Sauron's Empire was not some grand bureaucracy with himself at its center. This only applied to Mordor. Mordor did not have the military might to fight the entire world at once, so Sauron had to get clever about how he wanted to rule the World. Namely, by creating a feudal system with himself as God-King, proclaiming himself Morgoth returned. Sauron could not bust down the door of every one of the Haradrim Chiefdoms, or the great Kingdoms to the East, so he instead traded with him, decieved them, fed them lies, and demonstrated his own divine power, instituting his own worship and the worship of Morgoth over a period of centuries if need be. Through these methods Sauron could turn enormous Empires whose might eclipsed even that of Mordor to his service. When previously he could only field perhaps one hundred thousand Orcs, he now had *millions* of Men at his beck and call, which he could call upon at will. Somewhat Speculation-y: But there was a flaw. A crack in Sauron's Empire. It was a patchwork. Made of thousands of allied Kingdoms whose only common unfiying factor was Sauron, it is not unreasonable to assume that Civil Wars were quite routine. Any hopes of cooperation or a common logistical train also went down the drain because when Sauron called upon his Empire for troops, they would not all use the same Swords, or Bows, they would all get whatever they could find and them send the troops. While Sauron's might was certainly unopposed in Middle-Earth, it was also a fractious one, plagued with infighting and so far from the divine efficiency he craved. It is, indeed, the bitter irony in that Sauron turned to evil to create efficiency, but was forced to settle for inefficiency as he squandered his power. Evil never pays.

[@einsoldaten1591]

Finally The legend is back!

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Thanks Marc :D Love your support always!

[@limsagen]

when you realise that one of the greatest villains ever written was essentially a gentrifying property developer...

[@Crafty_Spirit]

Imagine you are a level 1000 god and decide to live amongst level 1 peoples instead of gaining the good favour of the level 10'000 gods... it's likely that you get mad from being so immensely more knowledgable, physically and mentally stronger and way more experienced than 99.9% of people around you...

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Cool analogy!

[@Crafty_Spirit]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT You know one of the things that makes the whole story including the Silmarillion so melancholy is that all evil and most good characters grow weaker over the ages... at the time of LotR, it's like the battered and bruised remnants of the old ages meet for a final encounter... Sauron after losing the Ring probably never exceeded level 300 or so 😅

[@_semih_]

@@Crafty_Spirit And however, level 300 Sauron was still too much powerful than the average Maiar of Valinor such as Olorin(Gandalf's true and unlimited form) also we know that other Maiar frightens of Sauron

[@TheBayzent]

Nah, you don't get mad, you help when people ask for your help, but for the most part you keep to yourself, sticking to your hobbies and enjoying the small things. Source: I'm in immensely more knowledgeable, physically and mentally stronger and way more experienced than 99.9% of the people around me.

[@Crafty_Spirit]

@@TheBayzent Are you being sarcastic? Because there are grammatical errors in your post that subvert the message, not to speak of the conceptual errors within...

[@johnysnoww3831]

The answer is. Total control of everything and perfect order under his rule.

[@johnysnoww3831]

He had diffrent goals than Morgoth.

[@beeftross3000]

This is awesome bro

[@TheVoiceOfReason93]

The unfortunate reality is that most people will just stop at knowing that guy is evil, never mind the reasons, motives, beliefs or intents behind it.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Agreed. People become evil for reasons! Well said :)

[@davruck1]

That's why many people unexpectedly end up following and supporting evil leaders like Stain and Hitler. Both of those men wanted what was best for their country, order and a better world. To achieve their goals they robbed people of life and liberty. Many people today would still gladly follow such men, if it meant ridding the world of certain groups.

[@TheVoiceOfReason93]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT Thanks! It had to be said.

[@kevinrussell1144]

Why is a black widow spider "the way it is", unable to do anything but weave and bite, kill its mate, suck the life out of insects, and spawn new little monsters? Was it, or any of its evil ancestors, EVER good? Did any of them ever donate food at the pantry or help a crippled hopper across the road? No. It was MADE/evolved that way, by design or "chance". My thesis: Sauron NEVER could have turned out any other way. He was designed to be Sauron. If he wanted, while in his uppermost closet in the Tower, he could dress up like Galadriel, or even have his bestie Orcs refer to him as "Peaches", but he always remained......Sauron, until the Ring was fried, as was "Peaches".

[@MemoryTroll]

Great video, my friend!

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Thank you mellon! Appreciate it :) Keep up the good work; as I have said before, I love the style of your videos!

[@C-Jay_Underground]

Amazing video again! I love how you make these long videos

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Thank you for your kind words! And, yes, indeed I am Norwegian :) Well spotted!

[@C-Jay_Underground]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT I figured! I'm Swedish so i can tell! ;) But your accent really fits this theme perfectly! Ha en fin dag min vän!

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

@@C-Jay_Underground Ah så kult! Ha en god dag du også, söta bror!

[@C-Jay_Underground]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT Ja, vi elsker dette landet! Min Norska Middle Earth bror!

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

@@C-Jay_Underground Vakkert 😍

[@captainbeeflaps5612]

Be prepared for sauron to be made to represent the "white male patriarchy" in Amazon's 2 nd age series 😂

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

xD There's so much potential for him in that series, i hope they do not ruin him :)

[@penultimateh766]

Racist! Sexist!

[@captainbeeflaps5612]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT i really hope they do it justice , would be great to see the blue wizards and sauron manipulating the men of the east , Numenor ect but i hope they leave real world politics and stick as rigidly to the tone and style of the source .. We do not need gratuitous sex and modernised marvel esq dialoge to enjoy Tolkien , just look at the original flims , flawed but masterful nonetheless and not one silly soft porn scene or daft dialogue.. in my view they really showed respect to the source and that is why it works so well .. Proof : The Hobbit Trilogy , no orgies but plenty of slapstick, an unbelievable love story and bad cgi replacing practical effects that took you well away from necessary belief suspension .. i hope Amazon has taken note of star wars recent failures and other failing franchises but i am sceptical

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

@@captainbeeflaps5612 Keep it simple, and keep it Tolkien :)

[@captainbeeflaps5612]

@@penultimateh766😂

[@morgothbauglir8687]

All he wanted was love ❤️

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

He is definitely underrated. He had fair motives

[@powerofroses1670]

???? maybe he couldnt have sex with women. 😉😉

[@powerofroses1670]

or else end up with support payments. 😋😋😋😋

[@theflame5919]

@@powerofroses1670 Desire 4 power, has nothing to do with anything else, but severe addiction to power itself. Power corrupts, and absolute power, corrupts absolutely. At least that is certainly true for mankind. Sauron not being human, yet sharing same frailty and addiction to power, and obsession with it, is weird if you think about it.

[@melkor3496]

lol

[@jackruby6696]

Sauron was the good guy. Illuvitar was a callous scientist who’s hands off experiment led to meklor doing so much damage. Illuvitar is also omniscient and all powerful and when he does intervenes he does it in such a sloppy way like sinking an island full of innocent women and children

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

I also dislike Eru's destruction of Númenor honestly.

[@Crafty_Spirit]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT It seems like every time the Valar or Eru intervene with a combat move they overshoot and destroy whole landmasses. Now perhaps they can't wield their force more fine-tuned (have you ever tried to rescue a trapped insect without squashing it? And add evil insects all around that you have to kill) and this may explain why they intervene only few times, as they know each time it comes at a great cost for living beings and the natural environment. Maybe even the destruction of Numenor was more a side effect to the main goal, breaking the earth apart and lifting Aman into space? You know, that would have produced enormous waves anyway, and Numenor was relatively close to Aman or the epicenter of Eru's intervention. Perhaps Eru learnt from this and mourned the destruction - he or the Valar later sends the Istari, who act more humble. But it could also be that in his view, the evil spirits in Numenor proofed to be a threat to both the realms of Aman and Middle-Earth (he maybe figured that if he let's them get away with it, they would vent off in humiliation and vengeance on the Middle-Eartheners). It's also possible that he thought that he could not cleanse them of their greed, that they were lost to evil like say Orcs. Also perhaps this is just what he does, if someone breaks a contract - Ando was gifted under the premise that its inhabitants would never sail West, and when they did, Eru demanded the gift back.

[@3rebornxd]

Kinda like the god of Christianity as well...sloppy at best.

[@Simon-vt1zp]

Sauron was just misunderstood. We should have a world leader like him in these troubled times.

[@oldkingspook]

In concept perhaps, but in practice, you would not enjoy having your free will stripped away to serve what Sauron deemed as the greater good.

[@artugert]

Our world leaders are like him, merciless and lusting after power.

[@eluilus4017]

@@oldkingspook god's enemies devil demons all their lies plans deeds be binded failed punished destroyed in the name of Jesus Christ!

[@seanmoran2743]

He is behind these troubled times

[@ewanmenziesstevens5211]

love your videos

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Thank you Ewan! Always love your comments!

[@donweatherwax9318]

1:29 that painting of the burning-face guy is really eerie. That one penetrating eye. The 2nd image following, is another favorite. Great cut @ 3:52 . 9:37: Holy crap. 15:07 - love this shot. 15:37, ditto I love the music track, 15:00 to 16:30. The shot at 17:08 is cool. What's it from? The painting of Aragorn at 17:44: Made. Of. Awesome. And two nice ones right at the end, 19:01 and 20:43. Just a great edit, throughout. My compliments.

[@sharontaylor777]

I always wonder why someone would want a whole army of incompetent slaves. Maybe Sauron represents an archetype of a dictator.

[@kevinrussell1144]

I DON'T agree. Sauron was always evil, never good. Name me ONE good thing he ever thought or performed? He and Morgoth were disobedient, proud, and bent toward evil from DAY ONE. Saruman, too.

[@mightydwarf104]

Great video mellon are you going to make first age videos?

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

I finished my first age world map this week. I have also hired a first age artist to work on characters from that era. However, I do not have the material yet to bring the videos I want from the first age. It's still a project for the future, but at least work has begun!

[@marckrieger3277]

Good sum up of what sauron wanted and what he did in the end. And you also mentioned that tollkien seems to have strong feelings against industry (Sauron and Saruman beeing students of Aulë the smith of the valar) or like you put it the misuse of it. It is actually really sad that not even in the main books we don't get to know much about what sauron really wanted. The only thing that bugs me is how sauron came to work with morgoth. Aren't theire goals the exact oposite. Melkor wanting to destroy all live while sauron want to make a paradise (or his version) for all living beeings. Can't wait to see the amazon series, i hope they show the war of elves and men against sauron.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Very great observation that Melkor and Sauron had different perspectives. I found it to be the same: Melkor want to destroy, and Sauron to align, so thats is quite conflicting. However, some of Sauron's motives comes along with those of Melkor; for to begin with Sauron's strive for order would surely be needed. In the end though, Sauron would likely have objected the designs of Melkor in my opinion. We will certainly see the War of the Elves and Sauron. Also, one thing to note, Tolkien doesnt dislike industry in itself, but the abuse of industry (like you note). Aulë for instance, were also impatient when he created the Dwarves, but he quickly offered to destroy them when he saw that he had acted against Eru. Aulë manage to repent right after he realize that he made a mistake. Sauron is in a sense too proud to repent wholly. Thanks for your support Marc!

[@marckrieger3277]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT As it was said in an other video maybe sauron was just impressed of melkors power and his defiance of eru and the valar. Maybe sauron saw his alliance with melkor more as an means to an end.

[@IsaacKuo]

This dynamic reminds me of the Netflix Castlevania series, where Dracula wishes to destroy all of humanity but one of his (two) human followers wishes to save humanity and have Dracula impose an order of peace that will reduce human suffering. Things don't work out so well for Hector ... at least so far.

[@shanenolan8252]

Thanks just started

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Glad to see you here as always Shane :)

[@shanenolan8252]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT thanks always a pleasure to be here , loving the video great art choices and writing , well done my friend

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

@@shanenolan8252 Thank you!

[@georgebond4787]

No one says "Sauron" better than this guy! X

[@Abstracto107]

I think Tolkien wanted to make two embodiment on chaos and total ego Well you can ques which one is Morgoth and Sauron.

[@patrickb1303]

He wanted to increase the economic well being at the expense of the world itself destroyed and burned in the fire of industry. Wow if that isn’t exactly what’s happening to our world right now….. we just have a million Saurons instead of 1 haha.

[@mszalans4817]

For me, he still remains Mairon in some part. His works and acomplishments are admirable considering what amount of odds and enemies he had to face, pretty much alone.

[@bmxdoe]

Alone by choice, he never stopped being maia, but what he "accomplished" was nothing but death, evil and destruction in the name of power, echoing Morgoth by only twisting what was already there or using Morgoth's leftovers. He did nothing admirable

[@EwingAmaterasu]

@@bmxdoe what is admirable depends on the point of view. For Sauron himself and his orcs, what he did was the ultimate good.

[@FeguerFineArt]

Sauran lives in the world today and we need to fight him with everything we can!

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Indeed!

[@bishopmuzoreva5533]

No he is only in lurd of a ring

[@eluilus4017]

God's enemies devil demons all their lies plans deeds be binded failed punished destroyed in the name of Jesus Christ! 🙏

[@monitor-mindtheover-void6712]

Good or Evil, Sauron is f🤬 incredible. I love him.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

A masterpiece of an enemy!

[@monitor-mindtheover-void6712]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT yes, I recently noticed that even though they wanted to dominate everyone, Melkor and Sauron were the people who truly showed free will Tolkien's works (if there was free will). If Ainur were ideas of Eru taken form, Melkor and Sauron should have been Eru's will and complexity in my opinion.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

@@monitor-mindtheover-void6712 Very good perspective. Indeed Eru "introduced" evil so that experience it would take place and the second music would be even greater!

[@monitor-mindtheover-void6712]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT yah, that makes their presence even more significant.

[@eluilus4017]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT he is god actually Book is written from demonic perspective God's enemies devil demons all their lies plans deeds be binded failed punished destroyed in the name of Jesus Christ!

[@ahkuna8181]

From what game is the footage?

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Its not from any game, one of my artist produce illustrations who I animate :)

[@ahkuna8181]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT Thats imperessive, I realy thought that the scene from 10:17 was from an actual game!

[@seanmoran2743]

Sauron possibly represent Modernity Materialism and Scientific Determinism

[@andrewbatist6355]

my personal fanfic is that after Thuringwetil´s death ( probably in tol in gauroth ) he turn way more bitter than he was. this is even before the war of wrath. he must have become hatred itself after losting every single attachment he ever had.. aule, melkor.. with thuringwetil alive in the second age, he would have had at least something else. more than just cruelty, loneliness and rage. by the way, the large bats alive during second and third age. i bet its their offspring

[@_semih_]

A nice one but I don't think that Thuringwethil is dead. It seems Tolkien just forgotten her or abandoned this character same as the Stone Giants in The Hobbit. I'd like to believe if she escaped the war of wrath and still hiding in somewhere in the Middle Earth and even Sauron doesn't know what happened to her. (Tolkien never wrote anything about her death. So it means there's a possibility of her being still alive)

[@andrewbatist6355]

@@_semih_ i would love if thats the case. but i felt my fanfic shattered a little bit when i saw the term " luthien diguised herself with the SKIN of thuringwetil. " i really dont remember if thats in the Silmarillion or somewhere else. well, lets hope that she had many leather skins in her wardrobe. or that this doesent mean anything and its just another enchanted mantle of luthien.

[@andrewbatist6355]

@@_semih_ my personal vision for instance, would be that thuringwetil appeared for Sauron in Taur nu fuin when he tought she was dead. there they made a nest until the war of wrath, when, somehow, numenorians or noldor or eldar manage to slain her. Sauron only seing her body after talking to Eonwe. i see this situation as being the most tragic thing imaginable for him, becouse even though he wouldnt repent to the valar anyways, he tought that at least he would be with her in middle earth. her death at that point in time would be, i think, one plus big reason why he was so personal during the next ages. and i like your vision. the woman of the secret shadow would easly hide anywhere.

[@_semih_]

@@andrewbatist6355 that "skin" might be like an illusion same as the magic of Felagund finrod. Remember they bore the orc clothes and he cast a spell above himself and the other companions so they disguised as orcs. So their elf looking skins(and Beren's) turned into orc looking ones too... In my opinion Tolkien meant Luthien wears Thuringwethil's clothes and disguised as her.(Also it means Thuringwethil use to live with Sauron in the tower?) Otherwise it would be very psychopathic deed. Just imagine an elven maiden while she skinning another woman's (Thuringwethil's) skin??? And remember Thuringwethil was actually a woman not an animal ... That story would be really disgusting and horrible. As I said Tolkien never wrote anything about her death. Most of the nerds use to say that she was 90% a Maia. I don't think that a Maia was basically got slayed without any struggle/fight 🤷🏻‍♂. We know what exactly happened in the tale of Beren&Luthien Thuringwethil never fought anyone in the story. I liked your fanfic tho :)👍

[@andrewbatist6355]

@@_semih_ thanks. well, all of this does makes sense, im glad im hearing from someone else. but i personally believe she was a full Maia. after all, the maiar have so many different levels of power. and since " she used to fly to Angband in Bat form" she looks like a shapeshifter able only to change into two or just a few forms. perhaps a Maia of Orome that joined Sauron after Melkor´s release from mandos time. or during his sentence or even before. when Orome used to hunt down melkors creatures before the awakening of the elves. if so, in the former two options Sauron and Her would have Angband, in a sense, all to themselves. what do you think ? when do you believe she started her evil career. hey, my instagram is andrew batist 9237 i will eventually make fanfic arts of the Silmarillion

[@nathaniellong4281]

You talk some about Ainur who are impatient. I'm still having difficulty understanding how a being that will live forever could be impatient.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

I guess one could view it this way too: since you are immortal, you want interesting stuff to happen :P I get your argument tho

[@IsaacKuo]

You might find it strange that young humans are the most impatient humans, seeing as they are the ones with the most time remaining them. And yet here we are. Maybe it's the same principle with the eternal. They are eternally stuck in that youthful impatience.

[@hellhell5800]

The servants of aulë should really spend some time with the lady of mercy... Would avoid lots of trouble

[@Rotisiv]

Why didn’t Aulë teach Sauron that Morgoth is bad? Why did he let one of his greatest Maiar slip away from his grasp?

[@kevinrussell1144]

Funny that you start your story with Mairon. I thought the WHOLE story began in the mind of Eru?

[@cynfaelalek-walker7003]

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

[@eluilus4017]

God's enemies devil demons all their lies plans deeds be binded failed punished destroyed in the name of Jesus Christ!

[@TheKurtChaney]

Seems like the dwarves were not so easy to control they kept their rings on and and still didn't serve

[@zico739]

So “just because” basically?

[@frauleinhohenzollern]

Why do some people really lean into the rolling of the R's? Is that the actual pronunciation?

[@PakornThaipituk]

Sauron wanted to be god emperor of mankind uniting every factions in middle earth, but he was not that gold.

[@eluilus4017]

Sauron was god

[@eluilus4017]

God's enemies devil demons all their lies plans deeds be binded failed punished destroyed in the name of Jesus Christ!

[@BoomerSlayer21]

He reminds me of a Sith.

[@eluilus4017]

I think they are same

[@eluilus4017]

God's enemies devil demons all their lies plans deeds be binded failed punished destroyed in the name of Jesus Christ!

[@carsonianthegreat4672]

You can’t say he had just motive when Tolkien despised Consequentialism (the framework Sauron operated under) and made this known in his writings.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

It began with fair motives, but we know the consequences thereafter. It was to illustrate the point that he was not evil to begin with

[@MasterOfTheElements]

Mordor is my favorite place in middle earth if I could live anywhere it would be in Mordor

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

:O

[@eluilus4017]

God's enemies devil demons be binded failed punished destroyed removed from everywhere in the name of Jesus Christ!

[@OrchestrationOnline]

Myron is such a bubba name...and I say that as the direct descendant of an auto mechanic from Arkansas. Mairon'll fix up that there Middle-Earth for ya...fix it up REAL good.

[@MarkaNgamer]

I don't believe Sauron had any good intentions after the First Age. His days under Morgoth sealed that long time ago.

[@twilliam043]

Why couldn't Sauron just use the Numenoreans into his proxy army to establish order? Why not turn his greatest threat into his weapon once he successfully subverted Numenor?

[@PleaseNThankYou]

😂already watched this one. Great topic. I highly suspect that AULE is at fault in all of this mess.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

:P

[@tevinramon5763]

For me, the Valar come off as self-righteous.

[@DeeArr]

This show a deep misunderstanding of the LotR Legendarium.

[@englishtea6490]

Sauron is the good guy, the fellowship and elves we’re evil for trying to stop the lords work

[@icarus-wings]

But why Middle Earth? Sauron’s desire for power would be akin to you or I constructing an ant farm and lusting for the power to rule over the ants. It doesn’t make any sense.

[@DanIel-fl1vc]

Man am I tired of seeing this recommended to me, not because of the content but because every thumbnail makes Sauron, Bombadil, Glorfindel, whoever it is look like a fashion model. If they were real, trust me fangirls and fanboys, they would not bother with lip injections and makeup. Just a comment on the thumbnail, moving on.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

This depicts Sauron when he was in disguise as Annatar and seduced the Brotherhood of the Jewelsmiths. He took the appearance of a fair elf.

[@DanIel-fl1vc]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT It is possible to be a beautiful elf without looking like a woman. This is something the films never understood. Legolas, Thranduil and Celeborn in the movies are not very masculine.

[@totmgsrockxd9900]

"The ends justify the means." The root of all that's atrocious in this world. Hitler, Stalin, Mao, they all had the same philosophy, and carved out large swaths of the human population in the name of their delusions of "the greater good." They were also hypocrites, just like Sauron, because their acts defiled the earth and its people. The ends do not justify the means when your means involves stuffing millions of people in death camps just because they worship a certain religion. Or when your fortresses literally scorch the environment around them to cinders.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Well said!

[@greenman6141]

Since Hitler, Stalin, and Mao have all been dead for some time, the world must be a great place. OhShit! It isn't. ANd what country has been responsible for most of the deaths. THe good old religious right USA. Who overthrew every democratically elected government from Indonesia, Turkey, Greece, Iran, Zaire, every central american country, every south american country, and on and on. And put in place death squad using military dictatorships. Not to mention the endless money and arms to support other horrible dictatorships like Saddam Hussein (yup, he was our guy. Saudi Arabia, Pakistan etc...) There's a reason that every other country in the world hates the US. I mean really hates. I can tell you that people will be polite to Americans, but they totally hate the country and everything about it. Electing a President who thought that dropping a nuclear bomb in a hurricane would "kill" the hurricane just proved everything they thought. Once the Americans leave the room, they all just shrug and make the finger circling around the ear sign.

[@PsychonautSaiyan]

I disagree… genocide of the human race would justify the means for this earth & its other inhabitants assured survival….

[@geeljire9247]

Stalin turned the USSR from a feudal country to a spacefaring nation, Hitler lifted the economy of Germany and wanted to free it from international trade by expanding the lands of his race, east. Mao wanted to progress the agrarian output of China before he could uplift the urban working class. What do they all have in common? they all inherited poor and wartorn countries and took desperate, yet calculated measures to save it. It wasn't "the ends justify the means", it was "hey our country is fucked, but we can save it through x and y".

[@pete6705]

I didn’t read the lotr books, but one issue I had with the movies was that there was no clear motive for Sauron, he kind of just seemed like Dr. Evil. Wanted to destroy the whole world and replace everyone with Orcs for no particular reason, just to be a dick

[@JeffRebornNow]

Pete, I wiII try to expIain. ToIkien created a mythoIogy that was part Christian part pagan. He created a bunch of gods Iike in Roman and Greek mythoIogy: ApoIIo, Zeus, Poseidon, etc. But these gods were in turn created by the One, Eru, who mirrors the God of Christian mythoIogy. This God, Eru, aIso created a god caIIed MeIkor, who, Iike the Christian deviI or Lucifer, wants the abiIity to create things Iike the One. He can't create anything himseIf but he can corrupt what Eru has created. He aIso can corrupt the Iesser gods (sort of Iike angeIs in Christian mythoIogy) that Eru created. One of these Iesser gods was Sauron. The whoIe thing foIIows the pattern that MiIton set up in Paradise Lost, where Lucifer says he'd rather ruIe in HeII than serve in Heaven. EventuaIIy MeIkor is captured by the other gods and thrown into the void but Sauron, MeIkor's chief servant, escapes to continue MeIkor's desire to corrupt aII creation.

[@l030co]

He just wanted to make middle earth great again 😔

[@eluilus4017]

God's enemies devil demons all their lies plans deeds be binded failed punished destroyed in the name of Jesus Christ!

[@Domina7ion]

Sauron did nothing wrong

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

"Created millions of jobs :P"

[@rev.paull.vasquez4001]

@@LoreOfTheRingsYT Hahahahahaah

[@eluilus4017]

Yes he is god Book is written from demonic perspective

[@shdwbnndbyyt]

Sauron sounds like Karl Marx. Both had lists of ethnic groups that must be wiped to bring about their utopia. Karl Marx published his in his writings, a list of people who had not achieved true capitalism (many peoples of EVERY continent -- about 75% of humanity), and it was this list which was used by his admirer Adolph (per witnesses, he stated in private speeches that his goal was to achieve Marx's utopia, whom he greatly admired... Most Russian ethnic groups were on Marx's extermination list, thus Adolph did not support their version of socialism).

[@artugert]

Marx talked about the “specter of communism “. I think Sauron is a manifestation of that specter.

[@eluilus4017]

Sauron is god and Stalin Stalin saved the world from one world demonic totalitarian regime - nazis islam communist are all that.

[@eluilus4017]

God's enemies devil demons all their lies plans deeds be binded failed punished destroyed in the name of Jesus Christ!

[@TRivan-kx2bi]

@@eluilus4017 Stalin was a communist dictator. So, while he did fight against the Nazis (who were fascist ), he wasn't against communism. Sauron isn't God, if anything he's much closer to being the Devil. You have a very twisted view of Tolkien's books if think Sauron is God.

[@tehwatcherintehwater2022]

Sauron is better than Marion ever was!

[@geostyma]

As a person that knows spanish i appreciate the rolls of the R's in the diction.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Glad to hear that. Its in fact in line with the Sindarrrin pronunciation :)

[@franek_izerski]

And now he's back again, weaker than ever, but still intend on ruling the world of men, now that all the Elves have gone.

[@mingthan7028]

His will to dominate All Life..?

[@eluilus4017]

He is all life He is god God's enemies devil demons all their lies plans deeds be binded failed punished destroyed in the name of Jesus Christ!

[@nole8923]

So, in essence Sauron was like Vladimir Lenin.

[@ihabmax8545]

sauron the best

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Yeah :)

[@EdgedShadow]

Why are all the bad Maiar Aule's? Feels like he's always getting screwed over.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

In my upcoming video that will be explained :)

[@MrSmetanka]

Vote Sauron! Make ME great again

[@judsongaiden9878]

Order without justice is tyranny. When order is oppression, chaos is justice. Of course, I mean Chaotic Good. Even Chaotic Evil hates Lawful Evil.

[@Michaelkayslay]

He wanted to clap Galadriels cheeks

[@TheGoddon]

My man has an accent.

[@MasterOfTheElements]

I love order too, oh no I hope I don't turn evil!😈😂😂

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Same xD

[@justinah7400]

Communism but he called it Socialism

[@eluilus4017]

No Communism is demonic God's enemies devil demons all their lies plans deeds be binded failed punished destroyed in the name of Jesus Christ!

[@eluilus4017]

Sauron is god

[@procrastinator41]

WFC

[@waynemarvin5661]

No one is the bad guy in their own autobiography. There's always a rationale. I think you hit it with the Order versus Chaos dichotomy. Sauron desired Order, which precludes freedom. There was, of course, an element of selfishness; the belief that only he could establish the 'right' order in the world. Order vs. Chaos = Regimentation vs. Freedom. Sauron didn't see himself as evil. Neither did Pompey, Sulla, Napoleon, Hitler, or anyone who tried to establish some sort of Purpose and Order to things. To champion 'Freedom' (as I do) one must expect a measure of chaos to come with it. Bottom line: No advancement with Order, and no organization with Freedom. Sauron was the bad guy if you value Freedom, and Gandalf was the bad guy if you desire organization.

[@IsaacKuo]

Gandalf strove for order, but he recognized that it should be in service to caring for all - not just the folks at the peak of the hill. After all, his efforts were ultimately directed ascension of King Aragorn. So, Gandalf was absolutely okay with order, but not order for it's own sake. The leaders had to be worthy of following.

[@totmgsrockxd9900]

@@IsaacKuo Yeah. Sauron meanwhile wanted crushing dominion over everyone else for the gain of nobody but himself. He believes it would benefit the collective but when you see how his fortresses literally suck the life out of the environment, he really only cares about his own self-benefit.

[@waynemarvin5661]

@@IsaacKuo I respect your opinion. However, Gandalf was sent by the Valar to 'aid' the free people's in the battles against Sauron. He was not sent to establish any kind of order, other than re-establishing the Numenorean realms in exile. I don't recall him expressing any compassion for the Dunlendings, for example, or the people of the Harad. He was concerned only with the Realms in Exile. So Gandalf's 'Order' was the Valar's Order. And the Elves. The Valar didn't concern themselves with Men, excepting the Half Elves (Elros and Elrond were Never referred to as 'Half Men'. The Valar and Gandalf wanted to establish Order, yes, but Their Order, with Them in charge. Not really that dissimilar to Sauron. I agree with you that Sauron was selfish and self-centered, but I don't see any real difference in the aims of either side. Kinda like trying to re-establish Israel after a couple of thousand years in the middle of an oppressive Islamist regime. No matter what you do, Someone is going to be hurt. If the Free Peoples of Middle Earth prevail, Some people will be happy, but not everyone. If Sauron prevails, things will be bleak, yes, but I'm sure the Valar would come to the rescue eventually, if they could be persuaded to care at least a little about the 'Second Born'.

[@eluilus4017]

God's enemies devil demons all their lies plans deeds be binded failed punished destroyed in the name of Jesus Christ!

[@LinkLegend0]

I'll save you 21 minutes, he wanted a ring.

[@TRivan-kx2bi]

You missed the point of this video, it's about Sauron's motives. It's not about him wanting the Ring, it's about why he created the Ring in the first place.

[@LinkLegend0]

@@TRivan-kx2bi you missed the point of my comment.

[@mos4396]

👏👹

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Thanks my man :)

[@beeftross3000]

Ahh yeah...This is the shit

[@petiepablo]

why must you end every sentence in a down note? I had to stop watching the video because of how annoying it is that you speak like this

[@geeljire9247]

Do you have OCD?

[@strongsuccessfulweeb1400]

Amazon..please dont suck

[@andrewbatist6355]

china is Morgoth. north korea is Sauron

[@eluilus4017]

Liars be punished in the name of Jesus Christ!

[@geeljire9247]

@@eluilus4017 Bruh, calm down

[@grandadmiralzaarin4962]

Sauron shows a lot of similarities to the Judeo Christian Jehovah...unquestioning obedience, jealousy and lack of understanding of anything not himself while desiring blind obedience and worship.

[@LoreOfTheRingsYT]

Indeed! Well said

[@rev.paull.vasquez4001]

Uh, that’s the exact opposite of the Judeo-Christian notion of God.

[@grandadmiralzaarin4962]

@@rev.paull.vasquez4001 not really. Last I checked Jehovah is responsible for a global genocide, nuking two cities, dividing all of humanity through different languages, sanctioning genocide, slavery as well as wanting eternal worship while holding grudges against children and grandchildren for any perceived slight done by their ancestors and of course ruining people's lives just to make a point for his own ego. That's from his own book btw. Pretty sure he and Sauron have way more in common than you'd like to admit.

[@rev.paull.vasquez4001]

@@grandadmiralzaarin4962 First of all, Jehovah isn’t his name. That came from beginner’s mistake in rendering Hebrew into English. 2nd, assuming we’re talking about the Judeo-Christian notion of God and not some other conception of God attached to the word “Jehovah” I’m not aware of, He is not responsible for nuclear weapons & I should very much like to know how you can connect the work of Profs. Fermi, Oppenheimer, et alia to the direct intervention of God via a definitive, recognized prophetic utterance that directly applies to it and only it. Regardless, all of the rest of your list of classic misunderstandings of scripture are irrelevant to Tolkien who was a faithful Catholic, called his stories Catholic (in the broad sense), and created a cosmology heavily influenced by Christian cosmology. Eru Illuvatar is the direct parallel to God in the Silmarillion, not Sauron. Eru Illuvatar is not a direct representation of the Christian notion of God either. Sauron is no more like Illuvatar or God in the story than you are to Himmler.

[@grandadmiralzaarin4962]

@@rev.paull.vasquez4001 Firstly, you can refer to him as Jehovah, Yaweh, God, or Allah as it derives from the Abrahamic idea of an all powerful monotheistic god. Secondly, 'nuking' can be used as a replacement term for annihilated as it simply implies wiping out without a trace or to utterly destroy something which does apply to the Judeo Christian God's actions on Sodom and Gomorrah. Further, you err in attributing Tolkien to parallels which goes to the point of allegory, which he openly criticized the use of. His works had some inspiration from various mythologies, but specifically avoided being direct equivalents to those, unlike C.S. Lewis and the Chronicles of Narnia which are direct allegorical parallels to the aforementioned Judeo Christian beliefs. Sauron does share a multitude of similarities with the Judeo Christian god, regardless of whether you are uncomfortable with that or Tolkien's intentions. Sauron does, in fact demand worship, he is cruel, he is arrogant, he has no issue with visiting ruin upon anyone that he deems deserving of that and is utterly incapable of accepting that he can be wrong in anything. It is not a list of misunderstandings, it's specifically stated in multiple versions of the Bible, the Torah scriptures. Whether you acknowledge it or not, the imaginary deity in the Judeo Christian religions is a pathological narcissist with a history of both committing and condoning genocide, infanticide, slavery, abortion and ethnic cleansing, not that he's alone in that as most deities have at least one or two catastrophic events they are responsible for and all are narcissistic in the extremes wishing for worship and servitude.

[@davruck1]

Bill Gates is Sauron.

[@eluilus4017]

No God's enemies devil demons all their lies plans deeds be binded failed punished destroyed in the name of Jesus Christ!