When TF2 Weapons Were Different

[@icetide9411]

Honestly, I love the old Panic Attack because it was just fun to ambush with Beggars Shotgun. Fun weapon design

[@technical_difficulties_]

I kind of hope that those stats will return with a new shotgun

[@gangstascout3593]

NOOOO IT WAS NO THE MEEEETTTAAAA THEREFOR IT WAS NOOOT GOOOOD

[@KishinAubrey]

@@technical_difficulties_ it should be the shotgun from meet the dumpster diver

[@owenblount7334]

I miss it

[@d_inkz]

@@owenblount7334 me too

[@geasscrazy]

As someone who hasn't played tf2 in years, when you said "The bazaar bargain doesn't lose a head when you miss" blew me away.

[@Tumbolisu]

bazaar bargain is basically better than stock now. the only downside is that you loose your heads when you die. that just means that anybody who is (compared to the enemy team) so good that they never die, shouldn't even bother using something else.

[@Honey-Biscuit]

Oh boy, the bargain I remember penalized you one charge for scoped body shots, and ALL charges for a scoped miss. Even still, I picked it up when it was added and (especially now in its current state) will never put it down.

[@DaRippa58]

@LOAN NGUYEN Don't forget the bug that the game calculates how many heads you have "collected" using the Barzar Bargain, basically if you get killed by a demoknight, he gets all the free heads that you had

[@TheCosmicUprise]

@LOAN NGUYEN honestly even if you suck at headshots but can stay alive its still better. If you can't land just like 2 headshots you probably shouldnt be playing sniper :p

[@Meshric]

For the Soda Popper, timing minicrits weren't too hard as you could just switch to your pistol to stop the meter till you needed it, and then you pull out the pistol again for pistol minicrits. As for the "No Fall Damage" on the PBPP, it was to synergize with BFB since you couldn't doublejump to negate fall damage. Also the Dawnin's Danger Shield initially just gave +25 HP with no added resistances that were added later, and was honestly the most balanced version of the weapon.

[@Lol-zw8ks]

I agree with everything here except for the last part. The added 50hp basically meant a sniper with it would out duel a sniper with it almost every time. That’s why Blue called it the “sniper deleter” basically if the enemy sniper had one on you had to have one on too

[@Meshric]

@@Lol-zw8ks That's not the original DDS, that's the post Summer Event 2013 update DSS. And that was the sniper dueler because it gave the Sniper 150 HP and 15% bullet resistance so you'd be able to trade headshots and live. The original DDS only gave the 150 HP with 0 added resistances, which unless you are being pocketed by a medic you would still get one shot by quickscopes.

[@Lol-zw8ks]

@@Meshric ahhh gotcha. My mistake

[@edfreak9001]

@@Meshric oh right, they did that to give the set bonus effects when they broke those up without realizing that set bonus was only remotely okay because you were using the Sydney Sleeper

@@Lol-zw8ks Can that not be negated by simply charging your shot a little?

[@Gabberz123]

Jesus. I knew it's been a long lime since I played... But all the "used to's" are exactly what I remember them as 0.o. God damn I'm old

[@triton62674]

Same! I can't remember these stats being any diffeerent

[@LordVader1094]

I'm the same way! I honestly prefer the old versions

[@dumpsockpuppet5619]

Indeed, i never was a hardcore player, but o had at least a functioning knowledge of most weapons and the meta around them, and suddenly comes this video and tells me it has been all since been thrown, buried and forgotten FeelsBadMan.jpg

[@derpyquagsire6678]

1. 2:06 the fall damage immunity was for so you don't have to double jump in order to avoid fall damage. 2. I'm surprised didn't talk about the baby face's blaster since it originally had less damage, a tighter spread, a harsher movement speed penalty, no clip size penalty, and you lose all your boost from jumping and not just double jumping. Yet its still better then the one we have currently because of the stupid boost lost on damage effect.

[@anonymousaccordionist3326]

The Baby Face's Blaster doesn't fit the theme of the video because, despite having been drastically reworked, its purpose was unchanged. Do damage, move fast. This video is about weapons whose changes totally replaced the initial purpose.

[@mr.attacker3392]

all it take is 25 damage and its all gone

[@gregorymirabella1423]

@@mr.attacker3392 it's actually 24, the boost meter only fills to 99%.

[@taramaruiz23]

It’s not that bad…

[@mr.attacker3392]

@@gregorymirabella1423 i did not know that thanks

[@lordcole5138]

The sandman and cleaver combo should have been mentioned. I loved the combo when it was around

[@derdoctor1895]

Yeah, unfortunately pussy noobs (supposedly) whined it out of the game now sandman is just hot garbage.

[@AirKangLocker]

Its gone now??? Smh

[@bostoboy5128]

All scouts fun and viable weapons got fucked tbh. Shortstop,PBPP,Sandman and atomizer all really got changed just enough to where theres barely a point to using anymore and that still makes me salty to this day

[@ayyimyou546]

@@bostoboy5128 the atomizer is still good though, it grants a triple jump which helps alot for extra horizontal movement

[@NoSoupForYouu]

@@bostoboy5128 I'd say atomizer had a fair change since they removed the damage taken for it but I do miss being able to triple jump without having to pull it out first.

[@SlurpyTheDog]

3:38 This Soldiers reaction to taking out the tele even though he died is everything

[@Wolf-kx8li]

just popped down here to check if anyone else noticed lmao

[@DotDotDotDashDashDashDotDotDot]

He died in peace, he did what he wanted

[@badopinionssquid1735]

The legend pickaxe

[@PatCatzz]

Can we talk about how the old powerjack's only downside was "no random criticals". Even back then the stock fire ax was completely worthless.

[@davidegaruti2582]

The thing is : why melee as pyro ?

[@dogdog357]

​@@davidegaruti2582funny

[@billybill1270]

You could control when you got the Soda Popper's mini crits by switching weapons just before the meter was full, since it only filled while the weapon was active.

[@vigge111111]

Ye i was thinking of commenting this as well. Weapon was changed cus of how op it was Weapon is still a burst damage machine but imagine the way it use to be with on demand mini crits lmao

[@c1oudsky]

I think changing it to fill with damage is the right thing, but I wish it would give you the crits instead of the damn jumps (with some additional penalty if you wish) considering its design is a mix with the crit-a-cola

[@drivanradosivic1357]

I would make two versions of the Soda Popper, one with a Hype meter for the Jumps and one with the Psyche meter for the minicrits. Both have a meter to fill up before use.

[@Kohchu]

@@drivanradosivic1357 They already had a different version of the Soda Popper before that. It was called Crit-o-Cola. The reason the Soda Popper was changed, was because it was just a better Crit-o-Cola. After all, why spend your secondary slot to get Mini-Crits and take more damage as a risk, when you could just run the Soda Popper to get free mini-crits, lose no damage because the faster firing and reload speed makes the Soda Popper's DPS on par with Stock, and still have a secondary Pistol to also deal Mini-Crits. This is why it was changed to have a different gimmick.

[@TheKingMgee]

I don't know if this is still true, but I'm fairly certain the Persian Persuader is the only weapon in TF2 that has no stats in common with it's original version (apart from no random crits).

[@appelofdoom8211]

The darwins danger shield also has no stats in common with the old version anymore.

[@flareonguy7922]

I miss the old persian persuader where ammo gave health, nowadays its just another sword that gives charge on kill. I don't ever see other people use it either, so I hope that one day our gods at Valve will come home and fix it.

[@obad7633]

@@flareonguy7922 it also allows you to infinity charge on certain maps if you Mao out the ammo spawns so it does have its uses

[@percher4824]

@@appelofdoom8211 To elaborate on this comment a little for those who don't know, DD once had bullet resistance with a trade off for explosion vulnerability. It also had a version where it gave +25 health for the explosion vulnerability, I think. I'm not entirely sure what the even older version of it did though, but I do remember that its set bonus was headshot immunity, or something along those lines.

[@somerandomgamer8504]

@@flareonguy7922 Wut? The Persian Persuader is widely used...

[@LunaticWithALicense]

I vividly remember running around with the soda popper doing many circles in spawn trying to build up my hype meter, rushing out, and dying immediately afterwards.

[@SmashuFlashu]

Man, it is so weird to see the "original stats" images, like they are some kind of ancient information. To me, when I see the Soda Popper, I still think of it as the weapon that gave you minicrits for running. But is has been 8 years since it changed!

[@PARKERSHAW]

During the powerjack section, i was like 90% sure that it still healed on kill but maybe i’m wronb

[@luigifan4585]

@@PARKERSHAW it still does, but only for 25

[@monsieursp00ky44]

I remember when Heavy could eat his own right-click sandviches, and while I get not being able to anymore from a balance perspective it still makes me sad

[@theamazingspiderwuss4236]

I assume you used to be able to toss down a shitload of sandviches using ammo crates to effectively be your own immortal pocket medic?

[@thisaccountisntreal107]

@@theamazingspiderwuss4236 not really You were limited to the one sandvich deployed But almost no heavies used the eat animation; they all just dropped it and ate the deployable

[@pokeman5699]

i hate the idea of weapons becoming simplistic and boring when there's always someone out there who'd rather see a creative weapon with unique stats get butchered for the sake of "balance"

[@derdoctor1895]

Yeah, devs are assholes for doing it. Should've stopped making updates after End of the Line, after it things only became worse.

[@James-oj6ru]

Same, I some weapon? I welcome the change very much but for some?… nah, I prefer it being unique because Jesus christ

[@SharkyMcSnarkface]

I fear the day they may actually make a balance pass and try to “fix” the backscatter. They’re gonna massacre my favourite scout weapon.

[@getaround1276]

I don't know, like a world with og sandman and all of the different ways spy became fuck you tanky, not to forget unsplit equalizer, unnerfed natasha, reserve shooters that minicrit all forms of bring airborn including jumping and climbing stairs, unmitigated crocostyle snipes, and all of the others does not sound like a fun game.

[@DannyCheezits]

some funny ones you missed: * the sticky jumper could have 8 stickies deployed at the same time * the eureka effect used to only be able to teleport you to spawn (on right click) and its downside was that you couldn't haul buildings. It was eventually revamped into having the current hud but at the cost of half wrench-hit effectiveness (upgrading, healing, refilling, boosting, all were half as effective) *the rocket jumper used to look exactly the same as the rocket launcher and it made your equalizer taunt not kill you * the shortstop boosted your healing amount from all sources by 20%, so a pocket quick fix made you immortal almost * the phlog used to give you fucking ubercharge and a full heal * the loch and load used to be able to 1shot light classes because of a damage bonus on top of random damage spread

[@edfreak9001]

i miss the fake equalizer taunt jumps

[@Qobp]

Also both of the jumpers used to give you 100% self damage reduction in general, making caber demo even funnier (esp when caber one shot light classes)

[@gabrielraynard8056]

Except for the eureka effect and the sticky jumper. Tbh, the core function is still the same, you practice sticky jumps with the sticky jumper and perform a teleport with some button with the eureka effect. It's still the same thing

[@northropi2027]

honestly surprised the shortstop didn't come up, the old healing bonus was a big draw for me personally and there's really not as much of a reason to use its current state.

[@doctorbielen]

I always wished they made it so the phlog was about self healing (and maybe some overheal) instead of crits. Really lean into the whole “non-teammate pyro” kind of ideaz

[@thee_val]

Started playing TF2 again during the summer, and seeing all of my beloved weapons nerfed and completely changed was a bit of a whiplash effect for me. Had to relearn, even learned stuff this vid.

[@derdoctor1895]

Devs ruined the game

[@HaVaJawbreaker]

i thought you were gonna go more in-depth with the reserve shooter dear god that weapon

[@AnnaSue81]

oh my the demons

[@GelyelFish]

I miss the old(?) Reserve Shooter. Don't play TF2 anymore, but the knowledge that my strange one doesn't function with my other strange Pyro weapons anymore makes me sad.

[@AnnaSue81]

@@GelyelFish u like suffering of others?

[@Meshric]

It was a mistake giving it to pyro in the first place. The weapon was not meant for him, doesn't fit his classes aesthetic, and was added to him silently in a random update

[@erike5865]

Surprised you didn't bring up the loch and load, I felt the change from +20% damage overall to only to buildings was a big departure from what made the original one worth using.

[@3chmidt]

meanwhile soldier just can one shot all light classes with the direct shit with similar effort as playing demo i hate valve for nerfing demo into the ground except for his stock weapons

[@nilIune]

rockets have fall off damage direct pipes do not that's why the direct hit is fine but they nerfed the loch n load

[@Qobp]

Also the loch n load has the full blast radius. Hitting a heavy and killing the medic behind him with the loch n load was silly.

[@blackjaguar7720]

@@nilIune u mean that its better without fall off damage? wth?

[@nilIune]

@@blackjaguar7720What?

[@davis3138]

Enforcer that did bonus damage when not disguised seems so much better. Like a dedicated gunspy weapon, you forgo the deception tactics in order to be more dangerous head-on.

[@velocilevon]

Was easily the most satisfying weapon to go gunspy with (aside from the ambassador). Scouts would chase after you, thinking you're an easy prey, 2 good shots in close range and they're down. Could give pyros a run for the money; hell, if you had real balls, you'd take on a soldier head-on xD. Oh, it was also a good middle finger to razorback snipers. I think the appropriate nerf would've been to reduce the ammo in the clip, to 3 or 4 shots.

[@wolfcl0ck]

I adore listening to people talk about the escape plan and equalizer because i have never found two people who share the same opinion but everyone seems to insist that what they think is the same thing that everyone else thinks. I have gone on pubs only to ask about which one people prefer, and I always hear either "Escape Plan sucks because ability as a melee weapon is stunted by the mark for death" or "Equalizer sucks because it encourages a risky play style that's superfluous with random crits anyway" and neither person on either side of this argument even acknowledges the other's existence.

[@elecman748]

Both equally suck

[@edfreak9001]

i still don't really think pre-split equalizer was that crazy, maybe nerf the base damage a bit and you're good

[@edfreak9001]

@Albertinho Um ferro you can't oneshot people w/o random crits, can you? Anyway, like I said, lightly nerf the base damage.

[@mothichorror446]

@Albertinho Um ferro there's an answer to this that every class can pull off to some degree of success. You shoot them with a gun.

[@mothichorror446]

@Albertinho Um ferro yeah, but by the time they're strong enough to be obliterating everyone they'll be at like 20hp

[@Meshric]

The Equalizer back in the day was used more as basically a better Escape plan, hell the Equalizer then used the weapon model that the Escape Plan uses today, so in a weird sort of essence the Escape Plan is more like the old Equalizer than the current Equalizer in all but name.

[@TheJosiahTurner]

i remember when the short circuit's primary fire would delete projectiles, yes the rapid fire one, basically making you unable to be attacked by any projecile, then they changed it to the 2ndary fire, before the energy ball

[@mysteryguitarhaziq]

Mfw no one remember the sandman change... It really made a weapon from a Default for Montage scout mains to a forgotten thing

[@theamazingspiderwuss4236]

I still use sandman as a “fuck you sniper I just smoked you with a baseball from across 2fort biiiooootch” factor.

[@patnewbie2177]

I remember when it could stuff Iver's, and even after they nerfed it, you could still totally stun someone.

[@fangrowls6336]

They could have kept the sandman clever combo since that wasn't the problem. The problem was the stun. The thing is I'm pretty sure that someone under the slow effect of the Natasha if hit with the clever will get critted EVEN TODAY. No idea why the slow effect of Natasha is coded as the same with the old sandman stun

[@Succer]

2:06"The fall damage negation was pointless because the Baby Face's Blaster punished you for jumping." Fall damage removes your BFB speed meter if you fall from a high place. How is it useless to negate that?

[@jaredparks4713]

That's a recent thing; originally, the BFB used to remove ALL of your Boost for ANY jump, so the Pocket Pistol giving you fall damage immunity was to compensate for not being able to jump at all.

[@Kihanacloudy]

Back then, the BFB did not deduct boost on damage taken, only when you jumped. Even so, being able to not worry about fall damage if a soldier popped you up or if you had to drop down a ledge was reason enough to use the PBPP, even without the ridiculously powerful 140 base health.

[@halt1931]

1:22 Should mention that I believe the hype meter only built up while the weapon was active, meaning that you could run around until you _almost_ had hype, then switch to a secondary or melee as you approached someone, and _then_ pull out your primary to have the minicrits activate immediately. It was pretty hated for being effectively free minicrits on demand for the scout.

[@6447912]

Yeap. So when you saw a pistol-wielding scout run towards you, you were VERY AFRAID!

[@SoulBro12]

I would love to use the old Phlog just so I can see people rage at Valve for 4 years and having their pleas amount to nothing

[@appelofdoom8211]

Some men just wanna watch the world burn

[@bill-zc1wi]

Old phlog wasnt really good..? You had +10% more damage, but you werent invincible on taunt.

[@even1381]

The older Phlog had a hidden stat. (which nobody really complained about) It restored all your health with full mmmph. but was removed after a month of the being ubered during the taunt being added in. This made the Phlog incredibly broken. A pyro with full mmph can taunt and be ubered and be fully healed have no consequences.

[@owenblount7334]

@@bill-zc1wi but it also refilled your hp

[@hairyspider151]

I would love to use the current Phlog just so I can see people rage at Valve for 4 years and have their pleas amount to nothing

[@afrodita2157]

7:47 the natasha also used to have 300 ammo

[@tomlawson4713]

The old Powerjack also used to overheal you if the health restoration went over your max health, so you could just go on melee sprees with it pretty easily.

[@popcorn-sx5rb]

i will say in my personal opinion the quirkiness of the old panick attack was way more fun that what it is now. now.. its just another shotgun, its a good weapon but i'd rather have the old one back.

[@vastowen4562]

8:14 Honestly, I'm mildly tempted to make a 3 hour long video essay explaining exactly why I hated this video. Just for the memes, of course, and after the first 10-15 minutes of making up reasons to hate this video it'd probably turn into the youtube version of a filibuster until the 3 hour mark was reached where I talk about nonsensical tangents. Probably give a couple book reviews. Jake's Magical Market was decent on first read but after you finish the book you have the thought, "that's it?" It seems like there was one, maybe two content drafts, then the author/editor decided it was good enough. There are several holes in the story and a few examples of foreshadowing that leads to nothing, many unexplained plot points and characters, and the ending was strange. (SPOILERS) turning him into a time god was cool, but why did it take him months to figure out time + portal = time travel? I figured that out the instant he tried to combine the powers. I was instantly like oh, he can time travel now, that's cool. Then he went on a several month journey before he made the smallest of connections in his tiny peanut brain. Then he just.. becomes a time god. The end. Wow. What happened to the friends that went through the portal? What about the other friends that they went back to? After he gets kidnapped you literally never see them again. They were all princes and queens and shit. Why did they all converge there? Why were they never brought up in any other scenario? I can't just accept that their presence had literally 0 effect on anything besides teaching Jake to fight and having cool friends. Why the fuck would you give them such important titles to never use them in any way? It doesn't make any goddamn sense. And the foreshadowing. Some motherfucker said "watch out, I can tell you were trained by elves, and if I can, other people can tell too!" and then nothing ever came of it. Literally nobody ever mentioned being racist against elves or anything. Just some vague shit about "elder races." God dammit. I'm only bitching because this book doesn't feel like one that can have a sequel, at least not one that makes sense. The explanation of "oh, it ll be explained in the sequel!" could make sense if the book ended when he went through the portal and ended back up at his shop, but instead he became a god, and it sets up for a completely different plot where he changes the past by fighting other gods. That's not the kind of thing you lead back to tie in all the other stuff that's left unexplained. It sets up for a completely different book. And that's not it either. Why was there this weird rushed romance? I don't feel anything for the characters when it's mildly hinted at, then they both decide to have spontaneous sex and "break up" and then he acts like his whole life just ended. And his trauma with the torture. I understand, trauma, but he never works through it or anything, after it happens he just uses it as an excuse to be a worse person and that's literally it. Nobody ever talks to him about it or anything. Just uses it to be a dick to everyone. Then the whole "order" arc. He joins the Order of Runic Knights, then he betrays his team and steals a griffin egg and their secrets and leaves. There's this whole fuss about hiding and hoping they don't come for him that leaves the reader in suspense, expecting some sort of kickback, he even almost comes into contact or sees his old teammates a couple times, but then they just leave the planet and it's like nothing ever happened. Nothing comes out of that conflict at all. Anyway, thanks for reading my rant. This is a small snippet of the script for my upcoming 3 hour video essay titled "Why Great Blue's Video Titled 'When TF2 Weapons Were Different' is Complete Dogshit and Absolutely No Other Topic." It's a working title. honestly Great Blue if you reply to this I'll feel obligated to actually make the video. No promises on how long it'll take me though. and wtf am I gonna do in the background, for something for people to watch while I ramble? Upload random gameplay footage? Memes?

[@jetstream9406]

Saw the comment before I finished the video and got very confused

[@vastowen4562]

@@jetstream9406 Lmao yeah this comment is a rambling mess that makes 0 sense with no context

[@FoxMan_FF]

Surprised you didn't mention the Sandman. I only just recently found out about its change from stun to slow and I'm still upset about it. The synergy it had with the Flying Guillotine is gone, too.

[@lok4890]

I would like for the crit on slowed tragets to still be a thing, but good bye to the damn stun. That shit was just obnoxious.

[@mysteryguitarhaziq]

@@lok4890 Then it has become another pile of trash like the sun on a stick but worse. If u think the stun was useful as a solo scout think again

[@lok4890]

@@mysteryguitarhaziq Fuckhead i mean the flying guillotine crits slowed targets.

[@James-oj6ru]

Sure, why not @@lok4890? There are so little weapon that combo with effects that… this is kinda unique, and besides, it’s not like your other subweapon as a scout is any good

[@tau-5794]

They could maybe balance it by still stunning people, but 25 damage from any source snaps them out of it. So you can use the cleaver combo (also return that weapon's original stats) or use it to set up an easy meatshot.

[@thefurryhuntinscout4554]

Holy shit, I kept remembering something about the Soda Popper giving mini-crits at some point and just thought I was going insane. Good to see that I haven't lost my mind. I think.

[@Crimsyn_]

A weapon combo I really wish I had more time playing with was the cleaver+sandman combo. Sure I died to it a lot of times back in the day, but its such a cool and unique playstyle that I wished was better at the game to give it a try

[@givemegrape1688]

The degreaser is another weapon that’s had it’s original purpose changed from a M2 machine to a more effective combo weapon.

[@Meshric]

How? It's original stats was 60% faster switch speed for a measly 15 less afterburn damage. Nothing in It's stats effected airblast, and it was a better combo weapon as it's faster switch speed applied to all weapons not just itself. And this was before valve buffed the general switch speed of all weapons sl if you weren't running it, comboing was all but impossible.

[@givemegrape1688]

@@Meshric my mistake, was it not the degreaser that traded damage for reduced cost of airblast? Or was that a different flamethrower? The degreaser may have gone through a couple of changes because I distinctly remember there being a flamethrower that had a reduced airblast cost as b4nny complained about it for a long time lol.

[@Meshric]

@@givemegrape1688 The closest thing I can think of is x10 server stock flamethrower, but no actual unlock has ever helped with airblasting. What b3nny might've been referring to was how airblasts worked as a whole. Before Jungle Inferno, it used to push enemies into the air at the same speed, trajectory, and distance regardless of where you M2'd from, leading to a borderline automatic follow-up attack. Combine this with how fast the universal switch on the degreaser was and you could pretty much auto-delete anyone in a "combo" with either the flaregun, pre-nerf reserve shooter, or original Axtinguisher. It wasn't the most busted thing in the game, but it was really easy to spam with how every successful airblast would get the best result and it could be infuriating to play against

[@givemegrape1688]

@@Meshric huh, ok. Strange, I could have sworn there was a primary that reduced airblast... oh well.

[@Appletank8]

@@givemegrape1688 That was the old Backburner. More damage for no aurblast.

[@PantheraLeo04]

Claymore is the correct pronunciation, Scottish has weird spelling rules

[@NinjaKatzKool]

So does english

[@samdaman2939]

I’m surprised you didn’t put the Persian persuader on this list because it use to collect ammo and change it into health.

[@alexandredesouza3692]

I used to have a "Jump Scout" Loadout, consisting of Soda Popper, Pocket Pistol and Atomizer. Couldn't kill a fly, I was the fly. I could basically speedrun CTF games by jumping over the enemy's head.

[@Total_DuDe]

Old x100 Panic attack was one of the most amazing things I had ever seen.

[@immortalsun]

5:33 “Kick player: OMEGATRONIC” Welcome to Team Fortress 2. After nine years of development, hopefully it will have been worth the wait.

[@norrecvizharan1177]

Damn, even though it's been years since I really frequently played, it feels really trippy to have been able to point at just about every weapon example in this and go "yep, I remember that". And I only started playing in 2012/2013 or so, give or take. But man, that's how ya know the gameplay was super memorable. Those were some good times, I tell ya.

[@frailty7280]

I stopped playing tf2 around mid 2018 so a large amount of these weapon changes from Jungle Inferno are still very fresh to me, so the idea that a lot of people might not know how broken the Reserve Shooter was pre-fall 2017 is really funny to me

[@blacklight683]

2:50 Biggers bazooka with the old panic attack not very effective but it's just a gimmick and fun It's all fun and (game)micks until someone ambush you

[@effelero1786]

The EXACT reason why the pocket pistol gave you falldmg immunity is you you don't have to jumo before landing to negate falldmg. You can still run off of ledges, and you did with that kind of speed bc most of the time it was a very good escape route.

[@its_speedyboi]

Im happy to get to be in one of your vids, and it was fun to play with you for a while. I was the pyro that you torched in the pond on sawmill at 3:59

[@runningwild09]

as someone who hasnt played in years, it feels nice yet reminds me of how long its been since all of the "this is how the weapons were", is how I remember them. Interesting to see how the weapons have changed over the years

[@thenoobman8824]

1:00 OH thats why there is a crit a cola strapped up in it i was thinking about this for a lot of time wait why do u craft it with bonk atomic punch instead of crit a cola doe

[@jamesahibbard]

7:35 The original Bazaar Bargain lost ALL heads on a miss, and subtracted a head on body-shot.

[@quinnmcmurtrie8022]

You know what I like to do with the Panic Attack? No, not use it as a combo weapon for Soldier or Pyro. I use it kill others as a Fat Scout and say the gun is absolutely fricking op.

[@derdoctor1895]

Panic attack is shit

[@James-oj6ru]

The panic attack at the time is ok, it maybe not a good weapon in comparison to like… the other shotgun but it’s unique… _I just wished that the buff didn’t result in removing it’s voice though_

[@theunidentifiedchangeling9451]

(2:50) I remember using the Panic attack when it still had those stats. I honestly got confused to why it felt different after coming back to play tf2

[@sigmundfreud7903]

I remember that short time period when the ambassador had no cooldown with its headshot crits.

[@itsyourpardner]

As someone who never got to see the olden days of tf2, videos like this are really fun

[@TheDrunkenTankard]

As someone who had played tf2 since 2008, videos like this make me feel old.

[@itsyourpardner]

@@TheDrunkenTankard any memories you have of it. From just a random veteran, what was it like?

[@derdoctor1895]

You've missed the most fun of TF2. Nowadays it is grey and 40% more boring to play.

[@PandoraSystem]

absolute fossil here, I remember the original version of a lot of these mostly because I haven't played the game in so long I never knew they were changed in the first place 🤣

[@Doomsday9872]

Honestly same. Had to do a double take when I learned the Persian pursuader now gives charge instead of health

[@jaredparks4713]

You don't know how much I miss the pre-Jungle Inferno Panic Attack. I LOVED that thing, and its completely gone now.

[@owenblount7334]

It made and continues to make me sad

[@lok4890]

Not technically, x2 servers still keep the old version

[@iug5672]

7:06 what weirds me out the most out of this initial backburner stat is that this weapon was added in the same update airblast was added to the game. So up to that point, players (specially pyro mains) were already used to playing a mostly flank, ambush or just "light and run" pyro. And they just gave us a weapon that could do the same shit but better

[@rocwolfe2674]

The old panic attack lived up to its name since when you were on low health it allowed to load and fire shots quickly but very inaccurately, like shooting in a panic. Also the Phlogistinator is one interesting gun that went through a handful of changes. I remember back when activating Mmph would give you ubercharge the entire time you had crits and not just when you taunt as well as fully healing you to your max health

[@Appletank8]

The problem, though, was that in a panic you wanted to fire off a shot now, not wait for a reload first. Also, the wider spread means you're more likely to just do chip damage anyways

[@derdoctor1895]

@@Appletank8 the reload on low health was fast af

[@Appletank8]

@@derdoctor1895 yeah, but by then your bloom was also extremely terrible, so unless you were at point blank, or your opponent had less than 20 hp left, you're still going to die.

[@xilefm-4517]

Even if it was completely all over the place, I miss the original babyface's blaster which exchanged all of your vertical mobility for incredible horizontal mobility at the cost of being incredibly slow to start. (+Tighter bullet spread +High max speed -less damage -slower base movement speed -lose all bonus speed upon jumping)

[@Tumbolisu]

the +25 health claymore is also when they added the extra charge on kill, which was (and still is) kinda insane. since it gave you health on kill, it was super easy to chain one charger after another without having to retreat.

[@majickman]

4:47 lol the random crit bind from the pyro after taking absolutely zero random crits in the fight

[@JBD0909]

Man, some of these weapons I didn't know were changed. I've been playing TF2 since 2014, and man, the memories.

[@NotSoMelancholy]

This was nice to watch. Coming back after so many years, it explains why I had some items equipped or why some felt so different to me.

[@appliedatoms7066]

This is a fun vid, but there's a decent chunk of info that was just missed. With the original Soda Popper, people figured out real quick that there was a way to control when your mini crits activated. If you let the weapon charge until the meter was nearly full then switched to your pistol, the moment you switched back the bar would fill and you'd have your mini crits on demand. The fall damage immunity was actually better with the Public Enemy set than it was just about anywhere else, as was the whole weapon really. The original BFB had you lose all boost on any jump, so you had to play in a very different way with Scout. With no air jumps, there was no way to prevent fall damage when falling from a height, so the no fall damage attribute was necessary here more than anywhere else. Come to think of it, since you couldn't dodge in the air the extra health was super useful for a BFB scout, and with all that speed Pyros were probably much less threatening than normal. Early versions of the Panic Attack, especially when you could hold the shells in the gun, were actually better on Engie than the current version. The PA's incredible utility as a combo weapon isn't relevant on a class where it's his primary weapon, whereas the prep required didn't matter as much on Engie. While the Powerjack has been reworked over time, it wasn't just one update that changed everything. For a while we had the speed boost and +75 hp on kill that could overheal before both of the latter stats were nerfed or removed.

[@stefaniemay5080]

Having not played TF2 since like early 2013 and somehow falling down the rabbit hole of your videos, it's super wild how much things have changed

[@empdisaster10]

Honestly, the soda popper granting mini crits kinda makes sense when you think about it from a weapon design side. The underside of the barrel has a can of Crit-a-Cola so it would make sense that it would grant minicrits. Though i do like the more change to vertical movement ability to line up with the rest of the set because the winger and Atomizer both affect your jumps so it would make sense the primary of that set would also affect your jumps

[@dreadgrave3379]

Weapons in TF2 today feel pretty jank. First thing that comes to mind is the GoRU, draining Max HP doesn't indicate anything to the enemy since only Spies and some Medics can see enemy HP on top of it just looking /wrong/ on the hud. Second thing is the Loch-n-Load still having two barrels after years of being a three-mag weapon. Sure being able to one-shot scouts was busted but there had to be ways to fix that without completely breaking the concept of the design. Those two examples kind of extend to the most of the weapons, simple archetypes marred by a lean towards competitive play in way that crippled game-feel. What used to feel like an inventory of side-grades with some wacky additions that lead to new playstyle now feels like the Dev team tried to romhack their own game into being the "Street Fighter 2: Rainbow Edition" of TF2 minus the fun. Legit, why do the stat sheets read like something from a 12 year old's custom server.

[@ZekeGraal]

It's 2022, and I had no idea that the Panic Attach had been changed since added. I have still been treating enemies who use it as if they could rapid slam lead into my character... huh.

[@sunfish2]

Not to mention about the Pretty Boy's Pocket Pistol, it used to be garbage for a time because it gave you a damage vulnerability on top of being a weapon you're supposed to use to heal. Fascinating video!

[@derdoctor1895]

Really? It gave you free hp and fall damage immunity. If anything it is garbage now.

[@Varron22]

I remember when the Cow Mangler first came out. Couldn't be pyro blasted. Right click would shoot a giant mini crit ball that set the ground and any one near on fire if they somehow didn't from the explosion. And the reload was average with no ammo limit.

[@PlutoDarknight]

Your Eternal Reward used to disable Spy disguising altogether instead of just taking a full cloak charge to disguise. It also didn't drain your cloak faster while, well, cloaked. The Half-Zatoichi used to be completely unable to be sheathed unless you got a kill with it but also restored full health on kill (without the overheal). The Sandman used to stun enemies at maximum range or inflict a 'fear' effect on them after a minimum distance (like certain Halloween effects or Saxton Hale in VSH, effectively slowing and disarming the enemy). In the same context, the Flying Guillotine (the Cleaver for short) used to deal mini-crits past a certain minimum distance while dealing full crits to stunned targets, though with the removal of the stun on the Sandman in the JI Update, the crit effects from the Cleaver have been removed as well.

[@theflyingchipmunk9123]

I think you should've also mentioned the old Loch n' load, I remember using that so much when you pretty much had a Direct Hit that doesn't have damage fall off and did 130 damage. The good old days. Also cool to see the powerjack in here.

[@blackisbackblack9105]

3:31 This soldier can smile for he has won. (Taken from chat by the soldier who destroyed the tele)

[@3chmidt]

i miss the health bonus on the claydhaeh mòr, i want a sword that i can use without being a demo or hybrid knight

[@ultimatederp5069]

I really miss the balance of 2019-2013. Yes it was VERY unbalanced but it was also equally fun. I think current TF2 has too many weapons that are weak. Some weapons that were completely op are now terrible and I think the game is worse for that. I'd love to see a rebuild of this game with another balance patch to buff some weapons. Don't nerf anything because that's boring.

[@mmmscrumptious8247]

1:56 the pretty boys pocket pistol was actually a good combination with the baby's face blaster, because your lack of jump use meant you couldn't negate as much fall damage with your second jump. The pbpp was key in escaping and stuff if you had the baby's face equipped

[@generalasswasp2765]

That soldier nicknamed "pickaxe" during Powerjack presentation is... something unique.

[@TheMagnumDon]

dude I knew I remembered playing with the Natasha with the stat that healed you on hit but I only started playing TF2 back in 2014 and I doubt it was a community server I also remembered that the mad milk also gave minicrits ontop of the healing which made me think it was a direct upgrade to the jarate but these memories are so vivid

[@flameoguy]

I remember the Brass Beast used to give you a massive flat health and damage boost. Basically made you into a gun emplacement.

[@DawnApon]

I feel like there was a point in time where hype didnt build unless the soda-popper was the weapon you had out, so you could bring your hype meter to the edge and swap back to it when an encounter started, I vividly remember this as a strat I used atleast once, but it could totally be brain mandella shit.

[@carterklassen405]

Having fall damage immunity makes PERFECT sense with baby faces blaster since you can’t jump again to break the fall

[@shivernaut8607]

1: the old soda popper only filled its meter while active so the strategy was to pull out your pistol right before it was full to get the mini crits when you needed them. 2. the pocket pistol worked really well with the public enemy set because usually scout needs his double jump to cancel fall damage, it was specifically useful for the baby faces blaster which punished you for double jumping.

[@Just_E116]

I feel like they should bring back the old panic attack in the form of a new weapon "the beggars boomstick" or something like that

[@gregorymirabella1423]

2:12 the health bonus wasn't op, it was removed because you didn't know if the scout had it or not. 3:47 the original stat was +25% damage done. 5:35 those are the tough break stats, not the gun mettle stats. 6:41 everyone sued the l'etranger for the saharan spy set. the increased cloak time was added when the set bonus was removed.

[@OcanJi]

THAT FIRST ONE MAKES SO MUCH SENSE, let me explain. When I first started playing 4/5 years ago I liked that one because of the design, but I never truly understood the meter or the soda theme it has. I always thought that it would be better if it gave mini crits, and charging it by running makes so much sense cause it's a soda so when you run with it it gets shaken up

[@TheSpazhero]

Engineer note: The pompson used to not have the reduce uber and cloak on hit effect, and bullets traveled through multiple characters. It was great for holding down choke points since the akward moving slow bullets would hit someone backing up 3-4 times, and if you were crit boosted, or had minicrits from a soldier you woul almost certainly kill anyone unfortunate enough to exist in your choke point

[@tubebrocoli]

The first version of the Enforcer was wild. I mained spy at the time and no joke, medics would kritzkrieg me for a revolver clip because the burst damage was so insane and the first shot of the revolver is accurate, meaning that for a moment you were simply a better sniper with no tunnel vision and better escape prospects.

[@triton62674]

I can't understate how fun the dead ringer was before it was nerfed, being able to run straight through a barrage of rockets and pipes, take riskier strats using the DR as a safety net not to mention the cosmetic buff (the Saharan Spy set in this case), were some of the most fun times I've had on tf2, too bad those days are in the past.

[@Germanica1871]

I loved the old Soda Popper so much it feels like the update that you have to do damage to build hype is something that was added a few months ago. It has been so long but feels like yesterday.

[@surytrap]

5:15 did you even expect to hit that shot

[@HaaraaldEriksson]

I missed the Sandman on this list. In its first iteration it could fully stun ubered players!

[@theBuzz76]

2:04 That's where you're wrong. Back in the day, the public enemy set was amazing. I remember being on hightower and being unkillable with it. Yeah you couldn't jump, but you could run off cliffs and you didn't have to jump to save your legs in exchange for your speed boost.

[@fractalisomega9517]

The fall damage immunity on the Pocket Pistol actually worked VERY well with the Public Enemy set since the BFB punished you for jumping and you would usually use your Double Jump to negate fall damage if you walked off a ledge, having this immunity is huge

[@muta8693]

I only just started playing again after a 8 year break so this video is super helpful for me to understand the new weapons lol.

[@jjbussey]

Ngl, I actually kinda hated the change to the panic attack, mostly because it messed with my fun little soldier loadout of running it alongside the beggars bazooka and the equalizer

[@Snowfireblues]

The old Panic Attack synergized disturbingly well with Engineer, since engineers aren't as mobile, as scouts nor as tanky as any of the other classes that can use a shotgun, Engies have to play somewhat sneakily, set up in weird places and make a slow advance to the back lines. The advantage would be that you'd have a super high burst of damage for the surprise, and a sentry and dispenser to cover you when you were reloading. The distraction provided by sentries also allowed you to get more bullet sneezes than you otherwise would with another class

[@bishopbrennan3558]

2:03 I'm afraid you're wrong regarding the PBPP being useless with the BFB; if you jumped to avoid taking fall damage that would reduce your boost, so the PBP's solving that issue was very useful.

[@exploertm8738]

It's wild to me that I remember most of those stats, heck, since I quit TF2 long ago I didnt even knew what their current stats are now.

[@Masupups]

The old Shortstop was awesome, then they gave it a lame shove. I also liked the item sets but that was before pay-to-win was more common so Im glad they changed it. Great video, man.

[@TheTrueEvilSpud]

The PBPP did work well with the original baby face's blaster because when you fell off of heights or got knocked into the air by explosives you wouldn't need to use an air jump (consuming your entire speed buff) in order to negate fall damage.

[@Nikolai0169]

2:00 the pocket pistols fall damage resistance did have a point, as you couldnt double jump to negate fall damage without loosing your boost

[@giovanniromeo380]

the old panick attack was amazing on battleengineer, in combo with the pistol I used to be an absolute beast

[@DJL3G3ND]

wow the panic attack change was only jungle inferno? I thought it was long before that. I guess jungle inferno was longer ago than I thought