Will Latin Mass GROW or DECLINE? with Fr. Murray and Dr. Sirilla

[@monty2020-i5d]

As a member of the TLM I love Francis sooooo much😍, He has driven millions of Catholic refugees to the Trad mass.

[@deluge848]

Great comment Paul!!!

[@marilynBgood]

Right!? ..talk about being the devil’s advocate!😂

[@artdevivre2]

​@@marilynBgoodindeed. Thats a very strange comment about the pope that want to destroy the latin mass

[@Jayce_Alexander]

Unfortunately our local Catholic church that celebrated the TLM was forced to stop doing so. As a result a thriving community that filled the church every Sunday is gone, and the two NO masses the same church celebrates are attended by a small handful of elderly people. It won't be long before our church has to close down, thanks to the stubbornness and authoritarian tendencies of Pope Francis.

[@kathycorkery]

Can’t , or why not... go underground with TLM?

[@marilynBgood]

The nearest FSSP parish to me has grown from 500 parishioners to over 1500 in the past several months

[@Donnybrook10]

The closest to me is 3+ hours away. That's untenable. SSPX is my only option and that's an hour away.

[@erikriza7165]

no surprise there

[@karlheven8328]

That is great too ​@@Donnybrook10

[@mathiasbustos5261]

Maybe because he forced bishops tu shut down Diocesan TLMs… Traditiones Custodes is not a win for trads, it literally destroyed families lives by breaking their parishes up and forcing them to go look for a home elsewhere

[@marilynBgood]

@@mathiasbustos5261 You hit the nail on the head! 100% agree!!

[@frankmarano7530]

The SSPX church I joined in summer 2020 tripled in size the past 2 years. We are expanding the TLM in all SSPX parishes across the US and international.

[@marccrotty8447]

The FSSP is seeing similar growth. I am glad for all Latin Mass communities.

[@lourdinacarvalho]

The Holy Ghost, the Advocate is working in wonderous ways.

[@PadraigTomas]

May good men who have a vocation go to our priestly orders who are keeping the ancient holy mass alive.

[@TaurusNecrusProductions]

Thank you for the very encouraging interview. We are very hopeful for the future of the Latin Mass and the restoration of the Church (and the Triumph or the Immaculate Heart!)

[@TaurusNecrusProductions]

Sacraments and Magisterium are in Latin

[@thedon978]

There is no question about it: The Apostolic Mass (TLM) is not only here to stay, it is growing in popularity, worldwide. Why? Because, at long last, the faithful are maturing in their Faith. Everyone knows that something went very wrong 50 years ago, and that things have worsened dramatically these past 10 years. The People of God want a return to normalcy. The TLM is the first step in that right direction.

[@kitstr]

That’s what scares Bagolio. He wants it stopped.

[@Donnybrook10]

which is exactly why Francis seeks to destroy it.

[@TheTruthPilgrim]

TLM is the Tridentine Mass from the 1500s not the "Apostolic Mass". It is a beautiful expression but not the only beautiful expression of reverent liturgical worship.

[@markrome9702]

The Latin Mass is not Apostolic.

[@toussaintmaxwell8071]

@@markrome9702 it is. Council of Trent just canonized it.

[@rosarosario1375]

Praying for the return to traditional rites in the sacrifice of mass... 🙏🙏🙏

[@OrdoSanctiBenedictus]

Coming home and will attend my first LM this Friday

[@charlesfarley5736]

THE UNDERGROUND CHURCH IN CHINA KEPT THE FATIH ALIVE THROUGH THE TC. AND NOW THEY ARE SUFFERING AND THEIR GOOD BISHOPS ARE EITHER DEAD OR IMPRISONED. PRAY FOR CHINA. PRF

[@deluge848]

Largely in part due to our "pope"

[@fobbitguy]

The Chinese church was sold out by pope Francis. The marxism of pope Francis drove me to the TLM and also as a witness to freedom of speech. Francis censured the TLM and every time I go I'm standing against Francis

[@tavares4224]

Count with my prayers

[@yu-ningrose-marykuo5312]

I am from Taipei, Taiwan, i go to Latin Mass.

[@margaretbeveridge5743]

Our Eucharistic Bread in the wilderness.... I grew up with the Latin Mass. I married in 1965. The changes were held in check through our last five Bishops. Mass is celebrated with reverence. However, during the lockdowns from Covid 19 I had time to re-read books I has read long ago, leading to lots of reflection. My "revelation", if you will, occured at the end of a Sunday Mass. Our priest said that we attend Mass to encounter Jesus. My mind began screaming silently, "When, when, when!" The priest, the readers, the announcers NEVER shut up. There isn't the remotest possibility to encounter Jesus. We are even supposed to stand until all have received. Years ago with small children, I selected a close to front pew and I'm still there. After I receive Jesus, I kneel. Even then about two sentences long is the amount of time allowed for saying anything to Him never mind listening. I'm sorry, but now I feel it's bloody awful. This wash of speech just never stops. Beginning to end there is NO silence. Even the choir in Latin allowed the mind to reach out to God. Not so now. It just never, ever, ever stops.

[@bluschke52]

I totally agree I went to a NO mass recently and the nonstop action and noise was unsettling. I just couldn't pray.

[@marccrotty8447]

@@bluschke52 Silence in the Latin Mass contributes to its reverence and holiness. I now only attend the NO for social obligations. My heart is not in the new Mass at all.

[@dasan9178]

The problems you cited are just part of why my husband and I now drive 2 hours each way 2x a week to attend mass with the SSPX. Another big issue we have with NO masses is the immense disrespect shown to Our Lord in communion, especially with regard to everyone trampling Jesus. Communion in the hand causes countless fragments of Jesus’ Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity (small pieces of consecrated hosts broken around the edges no matter how carefully they’re handled) to be scattered on the floor, which EVERYONE then tramples regardless of how they receive. Nor are the unconsecrated hands of the Faithful supposed to touch the actual Body of Christ, nor any of the vessels or cloths that have directly or indirectly touched consecrated hosts. Nor are unordained people supposed to be in the sanctuary area. In short, the insults to God are so extreme, we couldn’t justify even stepping foot into a NO church any longer.

[@ldav2006]

OH SO TRUE! I go to Latin Mass monthly near me but have to attend NO other times. The noise is non-stop. There are kids and adults walking around during the Consecration! Apparently they have to make a trip to the restroom thru the entire Mass. Women at the Altar doing their 15 minutes of fame. I actually walked out one Sunday because the talking from behind and in front of me was just too much. My sin but I just became so angry I wanted to scream. No reverance at these Masses whatsoever! I feel guilty for judging and ask for God's forgiveness and tolerance. I can't change it! Prayer is the only answer!

[@commercialrealestatephilos605]

Agreed, Reduced in many ways to mere entertainment. The weekday mass, stripped from all the fluff is absolutely beautiful. We’re not there to be entertained, or for a Bible study. That expectation is the result of Protestant influence in the liturgy.

[@vinceandpatricia]

Latin Mass will grow! I’m blessed to be at SSPX. Father Murray, thank you for your profound perspective.

[@ryanhudson7521]

Me too!

[@tGtg24689]

🎉

[@concernedcitizen780]

Banning truth, virtue, meaning and purpose will not eliminate such things. The traditional Latin mass has all those things

[@DrewMureiko]

TC only made all the conservatives in the NO masses more curious of what’s going on. A complete backfire of the intent of TC

[@littlerock5256]

Folks in DC and northern Virginia, who had diocesan TLMs greatly reduced, and feeling the brunt of TC. I am sure it doesn't feel like a complete backfire to them.

[@eringraass5500]

I’m sorry, that’s awful.. there is no where I’d rather be, than at Latin Mass. It’s beautiful and my soul soars up to God.: I almost can not go back to NO…

[@littlerock5256]

@@tercionovohispano7139 I think Francis and his conciliar hierarchy is trying to corral all the 1962ers who won't go to the new mass into the SSPX.

[@ceuser3555]

Don’t we all love Pope Francis? He is carving his name in history.

[@littlerock5256]

@@tercionovohispano7139 "The only reason I can think of that would explain this behavior, is if they consciously want to destroy the Church. Is that it? It's that the reason?" That's what I think. "I would probably go to SSPX if that was the only available Tridentine Mass." The 1962 Missal isn't quite the Tridentine Mass as it had the Canon altered, among other things.

[@amberohearn5860]

This is so helpful and hopeful. Thank you all for the clarity!

[@rmravon]

Thank you for your hard work and dedication. Loved your final comments on the show. God is in control.

[@katiem3184]

Dr. Sirilla was my favorite professor at FUS. 🙌 So good to see him here!

[@batboy49]

We have to get to mass AT LEAST 30 minutes before mass begins to get a seat. The one advantage to a NO mass is that you almost always can get a seat no matter how late you are.

[@peskyjesuit9021]

I go at least 30 minutes early to our NO Mass for the silence. By 15 til it sounds like a stadium at times.

[@PentaRaus]

@@peskyjesuit9021 A stadium of empty seats, NO can only entertain the brain dead.

[@lalliepombuena6023]

I just started going to TLM last year when I felt so spiritually dry and churches were closed. I started looking and found Mater Dei in Irving Texas. So surprised that even if people attended mass with masks, we still received communion on the tongue! Then, I attended high mass…that was it!!! The reverence has no comparison…nobody talks after mass…just took worship to a whole new level for me! We had about 1500 for lent, the church has to construct a cover in the parking lot to accommodate everybody!!

[@charlesfarley5736]

Thank you for this wonderful interview.

[@billzupancic4863]

Fr. Murray references the release of Traditionis Custodes from the Vatican as having been in Italian, and a subsequent translation in Latin altered meanings, causing a different interpretation of meaning. It was one of the many reasons that Latin was ALWAYS the official language of the Roman Catholic Church. It was used for the definition of doctrine and all legal documents as well as the Canon law of the Church. It was used for historical reasons and for ACCURACY from the standpoint of stability.

[@TeresaAvila1]

The unveiling has begun. It will grow. Thanks be to God!

[@scottweeks6379]

Archbishop Sheen in his narration of the beautiful Easter Mass of Our Lady of Sorrows Church in Chicago so many years ago said....." It is the long established principle of the Church never to completely drop from Her public worship any ceremony.....object....or prayer that once occupied a place in that worship"!

[@kitstr]

Brilliant, thank you !

[@Runsfrombears]

I think of that statement often

[@lourdinacarvalho]

Through the prayers of archbishop Sheen, mother Angelica and all angels, saints, martyrs and faithful on earth,. Christ's church triumphs even more.

[@dogetv5702]

Love it! Need to get rid of the Novus Ordo altogether... TLM is the sole future of the Catholic liturgy!

[@Thomas-dw1nb]

Love Fr. Murray.

[@DylanGames1000]

I really wish you all would move to central Kentucky. Taylor, green, Adair, Russell, Casey, baron area. Lake Cumberland green river lake area. Central ky or south central. There’s nothing here but norvos ordo masses and it’s growing everywhere but here. The closest to where I live is an sspx church 2 hours away. Please consider this

[@brownmullins]

I pray constantly for TLM. I am a baby boomer protestant who has a deep devotion to TLM. God bless the holy tradition.

[@melindahagelsieb3634]

Wow, you are a protestant? Anytime you want to be received into the Church, ask the Pastor and you can start the process. Many blessings! Thank you for your prayers!

[@brownmullins]

@@melindahagelsieb3634 You are generous and God bless you richly for your kindness. I grew up blessed by good Roman and Hebrew mentors who taught me true reverence for the holy. I am a fourth-generation original Methodist. God bless you for your kindness.

[@billzupancic4863]

A wonderful forum. Thank you all for this presentation.

[@kathleencurran7805]

Thank God for the SSPX.

[@Salvatore218]

I am a faithful Catholic. I pray for the Holy father and the bishops. I go to and participate in the TLM. I will let the Holy Spirit work in me. May God bless us all.

[@nejcskrbec2793]

It's not fair to imply or claim that the SSPX is somehow "paraecclesial" or outside the Church. It is still the largest TLM community in the world and the only option for receiving traditional sacraments for many people, especially after TC. God bless!

[@patrickwils700]

Also it is NOT outside the Church. There has never been any schism.

[@kings-Rex]

Exactly!

[@marccrotty8447]

Think about God using a single Bishop to preserve the Mass of All Ages. He was alone against Rome and the world. Truly remarkable.

[@mikeyangel1067]

If SSPX are not visibly united to pope and accept Vatican Council 2, the SSPX is de facto “para- ecclesia”, an separated community. Come home fully

[@marccrotty8447]

@@mikeyangel1067 If Rome and the Magisterium are not visibly united to 2000 years of Sacred Tradition and The Mass of All Ages, they are separated from the Body of Christ.

[@judithmcrae3704]

There is no comparison one is a Sacrifice & the other is Protestant meal. I don’t believe anyone other than a Priest should be distributing The Holy Sacrifice, most people who receive Communion in the hand probably don’t understand they are walking all over Our Blessed Lord because of all the particles being dropped from hands

[@ColleenW2019]

I so agree. I came back to the church after 50 years away and was absolutely appalled at what I saw--laity handing out the Precious Body like Halloween candy! I had no clue about all the changes.

[@marccrotty8447]

The Bishops have a current program to teach the truth about the Eucharist. I don't know the content, but will not be successful until they use altar rails and Priests to distribute the Blessed Sacrament.

[@annemarieelizabethrosevolo4366]

@@marccrotty8447 Well, what about those folks who cannot kneel because of age or health issues?

[@marccrotty8447]

@@annemarieelizabethrosevolo4366 Wow, you have quite a good name. The elderly stand at the altar rail for the Priest to place the Host on their tongue. No issue at all. My point is to reject "chow line" reception in the hand. No lay folks on the altar (other than altar boys reciting the Latin responses) or distributing Communion. Attend the Latin Mass to observe reverence and devotion for the Eucharist.

[@maryannelindenberger6199]

THANK YOU!!! LLOVE FATHER MURRAY!

[@Timbry95]

Pretty surreal as a net alum 13-14 to see dan driver on here. Keep up the amazing and much needed work guys!

[@lizhalpin8610]

The only way the TLM will grow is through prayer, prayer, prayer. We must pray for our priests. ALL priests! I’m starting a 54 day novena for just that! That all priests will see the beautiful sacrifice of the TLM and want to say it. Help the TLM with your prayers!

[@melindahagelsieb3634]

A devotion to Our Lady of Sorrows too! ✝️❤️ Thank you for your prayers! Praying too.

[@taxfree4]

Quo Primum, being a papal bull, supercedes anything any future pope, council, bishop or cardinal's letter, decree et al authority. If they even attempt, and they have, they excommunicated themselves. That is why the Traditional Latin Mass was valid then, is valid now and will forever be valid, as Quo Primum demands "in perpetuity" for all time. No need to have an hour discussion on "What if".

[@batboy49]

I think that the church is hierarchical in time as well....prior decisions CONSTRAIN future pontiffs.

[@taxfree4]

@@batboy49 Thats the point of Quo Primum, to deal with all future heresies and infiltrators that were to come, Vatican II especially. That is why it is a Bull "in perpetuity". The True Mass was the only way to make sure it stayed true to Christ who instituted it for His Church. The salvation of souls is the only purpose for the Church here on earth and only through the Mass. Hierarchal governess by Christ Himself through the gift He gave in that Mass.

[@ejcrispin]

Thanks!

[@Momof15plus]

Fr Murray makes the same arguments that Archbishop Levebvre made when Pope Paul VI wished to force him to give up the Tridentine Mass. The Pope didn't have the right to do that then any more than he does now. The archbishop chose to be loyal to Pope Pius V (Bull Quo Primum) instead of Pope Paul the VI. He chose wisely. The difference is that Fr Murray is applauded by most conservative Catholics, the Archbishop was labeled as reactionary, stubborn, disobedient, etc. He had the grace to see that the NO mass would lead to where we are today. Hence, the consecration of bishops to save the true Mass.

[@DominicMazoch]

In the Ambrosian Rite, there is a parish for the Older Missal in Milan.

[@patrick2576]

Latin mass will grow as it is from God , priests will come as the Latin masses have loads of alter BOYS , QUO PRIMUM

[@jayhunstiger3609]

Altar, not alter.

[@patrick2576]

@@edm-london1660 it has nothing to do with preference " and all about proper worship of GOD , LATIN IS A SACRED LANGUAGE THAT IS AND ALWAYS WILL BE ATTACHED TO THE CROSS OF SALVATION !!! And as far as a middle class only being attached to the TEAL MASS you can forget that idea , any any who get to experience it love it

[@patrick2576]

@@edm-london1660 read Quo PRIMUM and how it CLEARLY says NO VERNACULAR at the penalty of anathema !!! Tradcats read this and it makes them think hard , novas ordo catholics avoid seeing this and get mad when it's pointed out and turn on the traditionalists , that's what iv found to be TRUE and FACT

[@patrick2576]

@@edm-london1660 read Quo PRIMUM and the catechism of the council of Trent

[@patrick2576]

@@edm-london1660 thank you , you just proved me right in what I said about catholics that don't want to see , and now your turning on the tradcat for pointing out quo PRIMUM " people tell people about GOOD BOOKS AND ARTICLES ALL THE TIME .

[@duaneadams5210]

The modernist mass finally modernized me out of the church. Since the church apparently wanted to become Protestant, I joined a Protestant church for several years. I found that Protestant Church to be more "Catholic" than the Catholic church I left. I finally found a Traditional Mass and came back to the Catholic Church. After I retired, I moved to southern Mo. where the TLM was only available once a month on a Wednesday evening, so I attended once a month. After that priest finally retired, the bishop did not (or would not ??) replace him with another who would/could celebrate the Mass. At the present time, I am drifting without a church to go to and I WILL NOT attend the local modernist mass that drove me away in the first place.

[@HappyAmerican]

There are weekly (Sunday) traditional Masses offered in southern Missouri and on the other side of the River, in Southern Illinois. Look closely and you'll find them.

[@PadraigTomas]

A respectful, concise, and clear letter to your bishop is well worth the trouble. Keep it short. Two sentences is a good rule. Some parishes will have an early mass on Sundays with no music. No music and the Roman Canon (eucharistic prayer number one) are tolerable. Have you researched the presence of Byzantine Rite Catholic parishes. The Orthodox Churches are Apostolic. They are preferable to being separated from the sacraments. God bless you.

[@peskyjesuit9021]

I know we have to pray for the Pope but, and, I have a hard time with it. I find myself asking God for a new, a Catholic Pope most of the time. This turmoil is getting old but there's no way I'm giving up on the Catholic faith. Christ His self built the Catholic Church.

[@rosierose3257]

Very sad that the Latin Mass isn’t available at all Catholic Churches throughout the world. Speaking from Australia …. I have to find a Latin Mass on the internet - would love to be able to go to my local parish church. Don’t go to church anymore, only to funerals and for years haven’t been able to identity with proceedings. I find the Latin Mass to be spiritual, beautiful, uplifting. I’m even thinking of occasionally going to a Greek Orthodox service to recapture a sense of mystical spirituality - this includes the beautiful music. I love Gregorian chant which we used to hear as a standard part of services. We need these spiritual expressions of faith in this present unsettled world.

[@ericklingele661]

We have a beautiful NO church in my town with a gorgeous high altar covered by a baldechino. We were advancing a petition to the pastor for one TLM Mass at our parish, then to the bishop and then to Rome. Then the Holy Father squashed new TLM parishes/Masses in the middle of this process. My wife and I still pray for the day that the Extraordinary Form of the Mass is celebrated at our hometown church. The Benedictine Monastery in town now offers TLM to the college students during the school year. It is a great start. FYI - The TLM Mass we attend has doubled since before the plan-demic.

[@melindahagelsieb3634]

I think the Latin mass WILL grow. It has been growing in my own diocese since about 2010. We have 3 parishes that have the TLM. Each parish is 25-30 minutes away from each other. New families coming!

[@IslamicOrigins]

Grow exponentially.

[@gentz8310]

True

[@sharonlong7232]

There is hope!

[@janetplonka8110]

We have to thank Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre who continued on what was passed down to him from Fr LeFloche from his seminary who taught PiusX & other traditionalists holy saints & popes. He never deviated from the mass of the ages & the truth! Ho SSPX

[@Geersification]

Thank God, the FSSP HAS NO restrictions as per Pope Francis

[@Spiritof76Catholic]

The goal to double size of the Latin Mass in 10 years is good but what we really need is a separate and parallel movement to fix the NO? It is the problem. The five things I appreciate about the Latin Mass allowed in two parishes by the Bishop in the Oakland Diocese: 1) reception of our Lord Jesus Christ in the Eucharist from only the priests consecrated hands while kneeling and on our tongues, 2) our priests who say the Latin Mass, 3) our beautiful choir singing beautiful liturgical songs in Latin, 4) the beauty and reverence of quiet worship, 5) the beautiful and pious people who fill the Latin Mass with so much joy and thanksgiving.

[@nathaniellathy6559]

Fix Novus Ordo by replacing it with TLM.

[@Spiritof76Catholic]

@@nathaniellathy6559 Maybe although I not an advocate of that. You have to remember that we have two generations and 50+ years of people who grew up with the NO and it’s all they know including the horrible hymnal. Throwing them into the TLM would be a disaster as big as the switch from the TLM to the NO. Millions of people left the Church, 50K priest and a hundred thousand religious sisters. Not to mention the gutting of our beautiful churches. And yes as has it been analyzed ad nausium the NO can be fixed.

[@erikriza7165]

it is kind of ridiculous to think there even IS such a thing as a Novus Ordo or a Roman Rite any more. I was in High School when the changes started, and it quickly exploded into a vast array of all kinds of things to happen during Mass. It seemed that the only qualification to be a "liturgist" was to have a wild imagination. It has long been not true that one could go to Mass at another parish and experience the same Mass. It is impossible to know what might happen, or what awful music will be blared into a microphone. Is it any wonder that so many have just quit coming.

[@lsees5753]

Father Murray, thank you for shaving this morning!

[@philcortens5214]

Samantha ​"So while many want to resist we have literally no one to go to. And bishops who won't let our priests learn it." You probably have the SSPX within a half a day's driving distance, which Bishop Athanasius Schneider endorses. If you have no TLM, picket the NO.

[@janetplonka8110]

Growing, growing & growing! Go SSPX!

[@ericj.m.j.5500]

Thank you very much great podcast, I'm in agreement with St. Pope Pius the fifth and what they codified back then...

[@jenniferrogoff8459]

Thank you so much for this helpful discussion!!!

[@Ritamichaels1]

"With God all things are possible"

[@AyakoTachi]

29:40 the situation of priests in diocese where the bishops haven't said anything yet was super interesting to have explained. I would like to know more about the potential situation with TC after Pope Francis (age 86)

[@OrdoSanctiBenedictus]

It's very curious indeed.

[@marymcclavey8395]

There is a Ukranian Catholic Church not far from where I live. The liturgy is distinctly Eastern. If the Vatican can handle that along with other liturgies within the Catholic fold, why the aggression against the TLM?

[@danielmaloney1251]

They talk about the Novus Ordo as if it's the same Mass it was in 1970. I was an Alter Boy then and the Mass today is most definitely not the same Mass. It's ever changing. We still had Alter rails back then. Let's talk about the ever changing Novus Ordo instead of addressing it as if it hasn't changed over the last 52 years

[@nmfd72]

of all the Popes that occupied the chair of St. Peter, Francis has caused the most confusion and damage so far into his papacy. Bergoglio wants to start his own Religion, it is very evident that he does not believe in the Magisterium of the church or he feels it contains grave error. I pray that the Lord will send us a Shepard that will unite our church and recognize the beauty of the TLM and continue to allow those that feel an attachment to it to continue to worship in this rite. The TLM deserves it's place of honor along with the other rites that the church has recognized throughout it's rich history.

[@elainepellas3112]

anyone looking to a TLM in eastern/central Pa, look at Queen of Peace in Patton Pa. we have TLM weekly and a growing community.

[@bluschke52]

I love archbishop Lefebvre who I think is a Saint. Pope Francis is behaving as an anticatholic.

[@patrickmelling8404]

For a moment I thought you wrote 'alcoholic' 😂. But you're right he doesn't like the church. Why else does he live outside the papal apartments.

[@christineOfs]

Latin Mass is the true mass of Jesus Christ, Apostolic and true worship of God. We know God doesn't want his house of prayer of immorality and communal gatherings, but the Catholic Church Jesus shed His Body & Blood is for our Salvation out of great love for us, not for freemasons and ecumenical paganism. Enough! The Saints would NEVER accept a new mass -- all was Revealed by Jesus, sealed by the Holy Spirit!

[@SisyphusOfAlice]

Interesting. Saint Pope John Paul II accepted, participated, and offered the NO Mass.

[@kiq654]

Language is just a tool. One can enjoy any message, correctly, in any language he or she wishes. What makes christianity different? We know masses have little value of intellect behind them. Medically speaking retards wouldn't have problem understanding most rituals once explained in full patience. What are you afraid of? Dead language shouldnt be left to dead, but living should use language that is still vibrant and modern, like italian for example or british etc.

[@illyb514]

Haven’t there been Popes, Saints and Church declarations from the past (maybe St. Gregory and/or Prius V? among others?) that basically have stated no permission is needed and furthermore that a Bishop or Pope cannot restrict any priest from offering the Mass of the Ages ever? I don’t know, I’m stupid, somebody tell me? I remember reading things to that effect in several places and not schismatic material either. The New Mass, though valid, is deeply flawed, I can’t see how restricting it in the first place was ever a just command that required obedience.

[@philcortens5214]

Who ya gonna call? Why, the SSPX, of course. Preservers- and guardians-in-chief of the TLM. Without whom there would be no TLM today. Indeed God uses people. He used Archbishop Lefebvre. Is there any doubt of that and if so why?

[@TheGenoveva7]

Yes, count me in to be a monthly donor. There is nothing else in the world that is more worthy than the propagation of the Mass of the Ages. Thank you gentlemen for your faithful work. God bless you and God bless especially the SSPX. I am very grateful for lockdown because that’s where God directed me to go after I was restless. I couldn’t go to my daily mass. It was really by Divine Providence that I came to discover the most 1:01:34 reverent celebration of the mass.

[@christopherconey732]

Concerning the mysticism of the old Mass, the word mysticism is etymologically cognate with mute, that is, not speaking, that is, silence.

[@dorothysewing9997]

My diocese in NJ has essentially suppressed the Latin mass, and it’s very difficult to find one that is close by.

[@nenettehechanova]

ı LOVE TRADITIONAL LATIN MASS 💯💯💯

[@sunthunderstv2244]

I thank God that we have pope Francis...a real pope and vicar of Christ...may the Lord protect him from all his adversaries within the Church.

[@Mia-dj1dt]

WHY??

[@nicolasjuandecardenas7921]

NO parishes are dying out.

[@priscillatutuvanu9799]

The father the son and the Holy spirit 🙏 keep saying our Rosary our weapon against the devil. The Latin Mass belongs to the Catholic communion on the tough not in the hand that be longs to prodestant in the hand .Hold on to our Latin Mass all the way Come holy spirit fill the heart of the faithful and inkindle them the fire 🔥 of thou love stay grounded with jesus in the Latin Mass

[@MMichiganSalveRegina]

Im only a few minutes of the way into this now but why does no one ever ask Fr Murray to explain his dissertation about mons lefebvre?

[@breakthroughmadeinusa9184]

Exactly! Not a word spoken about Ab. Lefebvre or the SSPX. I just waisted an hour of my time.

[@bdok7607]

As a faithful catholic, would it be a sin to reject V2 and it's "spirit" and suggest rejecting this council , on the basis that it causes more confusion than good for the salvation of the souls?

[@DeeDee-my2tl]

If I'm not mistaken, ad orientum is prohibited in thr DC diocese

[@lcunningham1776]

Wonder what the Jesuits of Henry the 8ths day would think of their son Borgoglio...

[@sluzardo5879]

Bishops don't have to carry out all the Pope's wishes.... Ever since the Vatican II Council Bishops have been recognized as sharing Pope with the Pope, although under him, and Collegiality can be the one arguement that can be used to disagree with the Pope's wishes on this one.

[@Momof15plus]

I ask respectfully Fr Murray. Would you have said these things to or about Pope Paul VI back in the day? Would you have told him he didn't have the right to take the Tridentine Mass from us? Would you have told him you prefer to stay loyal to Pope Pius V?

[@matt70736]

What about Quo Primum and Trent on the mass?

[@VeronicaBrandt]

C S Lewis described the idea in That Hideous Strength where things are getting more polarized and that's part of the plan.

[@marccrotty8447]

Veronica. Lewis's "Space Trilogy" is so excellent. "Mere Christianity" is my favorite Lewis work, despite the several Protestant references and sentiments. I recommend this to Protestants who are on the fence about Rome.

[@lcunningham1776]

Hoping for New Jerusalem, Rome isn't looking to promising anymore. Not since the extramarital/ecumenical prayer group in Assisi and Pachamama... Looking like sedevacantist position seems more rational.

[@dallasboyan6303]

What are the theological differences of TLM, SSPX, FSSP? Where can I get trustworthy info on this.

[@rickhnat9641]

No theological differences, the FSSP is considered to be in "full communion" with Rome where as the SSPX is in some way canonically irregular but masses, sacraments and ordinations are valid, this week😊. It could all change tomorrow with Pope Francis in charge.

[@rickhnat9641]

The FSSP was actually started by several priests that left the SSPX when Archbishop Lefebvre consecrated 4 priests as bishops.

[@charlesfarley5736]

How do I donate??? Pat Farley

[@erikriza7165]

i think a lot of parishes would do less harm if they just didn't unlock the Church on Sunday.

[@robertdunn6064]

posted in my blog

[@adelinomorte7421]

*** latin mass will never ends forever at it not an important subject as you think, the most important point in the language is to understand the words spoken being Latin, French, Italian, Swedish, English, Portuguese, Greek, Chinese, or any other as long as a communication is a fact, but I know why people make such a fuss about it, some people are fascinated by the "mystery" and prefer not to understand in order that the mystery continues, like the circus magicians "ocus pokus". Yes I know, due to my traveling, in some countries I did not understand the language, like Dutch, Germany, Greek, but with Englishsh, French, Italian, Spanish and Portuguese I had no problem.***

[@nunagoras]

You have a wonderful point for your regular street Parish elsewhere, but the other way round would also be true for Cathedrals, very touristy sites, or congregations with a large number of migrants within them. Novus Ordo in Latin; which remains being the official language of the Church and the Holly See, which is a State as well; should to be offered regularly for said large touristy sites and / or those special communities to have the Mass as universally available as for everyone of us. And FYI; I know several very liberal Church goers, some of those most here in those boards would consider as apostates at very least, whom very much enjoy the Mas in Latin, and whom wouldn't mind attending a TLM from time to time! So; now: Nothing really against the TLM for me at least, but: Sedevacantism; refusal to accept Pope Francis as a true Pope. Antipopism; hatred reactionary activities, hate speak, merging with far alt right groups, involvement in racist activities; actively promoting political activities for Donald J. Trump, invlvement on criminal actions, among others, that should of course to be banned from the official Church!... And sadly that is for what TLM is being mostly used to in the day to day life of most of their organizations, with the odd notable exceptions here and there.

[@jolindo6724]

I left the Church at the end of the 70's due to the changes post Vatican II, so why would I be even remotely interested in being coerced to go back to what l consider sacrilegious. If it was not, then why are our churches, convents and monasteries empty and the Pope closing what few are left and appropriating their assets.

[@kateguilfoyle5155]

A “flawed ecclesiology” in the traditional Latin Mass? That is an outrageously arrogant attitude towards the Mass that dates back to the Apostles and that has nurtured the saints of the Church for 1,969 years. And what exactly are the fruits of the new Mass? Tens of thousands leaving holy orders and millions leaving the pews. Perhaps that might be a sign of a “flawed ecclesiology”. And so how does a Mass constructed by a Freemason amount to a better ecclesiology???

[@lcunningham1776]

@usdadsasda why would St Peter speak Greek in Rome? In the provinces, to Greek speaking Jews, I understand. But why do you put on the Latin community the language of Constantinople? Are there Greek inscriptions in the catacombs of Rome?

[@philcortens5214]

As a Catholic priest or layman do I need (the Pope's) permission to do what's necessary to save my soul? I say it's spinach and I say to h*** with it.

[@ad-ko5iy]

They could not erase it in the 70s and the 80s. Who think they can erase it now ? when we are so numerous, when we can communicate with internet ? They could't erase it, because God love it. and God doesn't change. If God is with us, who could stand against us ?

[@edwinkubena9944]

With me it is The ONLY Mass period….

[@debralittle1341]

We need a new Pope

[@carolgall3271]

Why dont the bishops that believe in the true Magistram awaken the pope up. When will we go back to the communion rail, priests worshoping the Lord with their backs toward us? LATIN IS THE TRUE LANGUAGE OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH. How can you give such glory to Pope Francis????

[@annemarieelizabethrosevolo4366]

Would need a good translation of the Mass from Latin to English!

[@patriotsru.s.2642]

By the grace of God, I will no longer attend the Novus Ordo Mass, which is essentially a Protestant service. A sentiment I happen to share with a former regional director of the FSSP.

[@EpoRose1]

I’m sorry I missed the livestream!

[@fredphilippi8388]

The Latin Mass was not the Mass of the Ages. It was a child of its anti-Protestant times. I would suggest that those celebrating the Novus Ordo try to foster a sense of the transcendent in that rite. But let's move on into the future, not live in the past.

[@thomasvanantwerp728]

Why do you use the term "traditional Latin Mass", instead of "the Tridentine Mass?" Historically, it has always been known as the Tridentine Mass.

[@brianbacon5149]

+JMJ For many people, the term "Tridentine " wrongly implies that the TLM was invented at the Council of Trent. You often see that the media calls it the 500 yo mass. In reality Trent made official the Mass whose lineage is Apostolic. The TLM is 2000 yo. Their interpretation of "Tridentine " is understandable given that the flawed Novus Ordo WAS invented whole cloth in the 1960s. The NO ruptured with the constant Tradition going back to the Apostles.

[@thomasvanantwerp728]

@@brianbacon5149 Then maybe it should be referred to as the Historical Latin Mass. Thank you for clarifying this for me.

[@brianbacon5149]

@thomasvanantwerp728 +JMJ. But it's not historical. It's celebrated today throughout the world unchanged in its mystical essence. Traditional is the correct descriptive in that it conforms to the Church's 2000 year tradition. Pax Domini vobiscum.

[@breakthroughmadeinusa9184]

SSPX

[@Safe-and-effective]

It seems it will be the sole choice.

[@littlerock5256]

@@Safe-and-effective There are sedevacantist chapels.

[@Safe-and-effective]

@@littlerock5256 Since Francis will soon have trannies giving out the Holy Eucharist during new age rituals, a sedevacantist chapel is not such a bad idea...

[@alisa4124]

@@littlerock5256 He who prays with a Schismatic commits a mortal sin called "Communicatio in Sacris"

[@littlerock5256]

@@alisa4124 That changed at Vatican II. Unitatis Redintegratio says that such prayer is not only allowable but desirable. The post Conciliar popes (and other clergy of every rank) have done it over and over again. And they don't limit themselves to schismatics, they are fine with praying with heretics and pagans. In Philadelphia recently, Archbishop Pérez celebrated the centennial anniversary of St. George Greek Orthodox Cathedral by not only attending but participating in the Hierarchal Divine Liturgy Schism involves the rejection of the authority of the pope, but that requires a valid pope. The SSPX fit the definition of schism to a tee.

[@firebearfl643]

Have you seen Pope Francis lately? He's not looking too well, so we need to pray for him and pray for the next conclave to return to a state of sanity, turning away from modernism when electing the next pope.

[@gtaylor178]

Abusive fathers need to be challenged, it goes without saying scared children will fall down before him, but faithful loving sons and daughters always challenge absurd bullies.