Abortion: Not Just a Women's Issue? | Real Time with Bill Maher (HBO)

[@Airehcaz]

this is the type of conversation that make people annoyed at “the left” because it’s just common sense to understand that saying “women” in the context of abortion is referring to (biological)sex. Those few trans-men out there are not being called-out, ignored or attacked by someone speaking simply, by using the word “women.”

[@REdds-ws4ll]

43% of Women are anti abortion (pro life ), and 64% of women would like restrictions on abortions. And yet; abortion is always presented in the mainstream as a 'women's issue'; as if those women referenced above do not exist or count.

[@K1forMVP]

A trans women will never need to worry about getting or needing an abortion anyways because last time I checked men cannot get pregnant. And I dont care what hormones, injections etc anyone trans women is on they aren't growing ovaries and eggs AKA female reproductive organs in their lifetime.

[@ncorp2668]

Exactly. Gender ideology, by design, is predicated on removing sex from any conversation or space, so this is exactly why the T community acts as if "woman" needs to be erased from any dialogue about women's issues.

[@ncorp2668]

@@REdds-ws4ll It is a woman's issue, as only women require abortions. Just because some women don't agree doesn't make it not a women's rights issue.

[@REdds-ws4ll]

@@ncorp2668 That is a very disingenuous interpretation of the "women's rights" when it comes to abortion. When nearly half all women oppose it and about 2 in 3 would like to see abortions restricted. Your argument, would be akin to somebody 50 plus years ago saying 'war is a men's issue' as only men fight it. It would be absurd; just as your reasoning here.

[@jaimhaas5170]

This whole segment reminds me that rhetoric can be used to sound so smart but in reality is just word salad.

[@alop9535]

Kinda like an anus

[@noahpaulog7617]

That was Obama's whole schtick.

[@mrjay1268]

💯💯

[@Bob-zd4od]

Well said word salad exactly how Marxism works I call BS

[@k.h.a.l.i.l.]

@@noahpaulog7617 Obama is very plain spoken. you're confessing your stupidity.

[@DaleCarterDrives]

The idiocy at the root of this entire conversation is just mind boggling.

[@Nico_Conradie]

Defying the laws of physics and nature lol, the power of make believe is magical

[@marthacanady9441]

Right. With all the legitimate problems out there in the world today, they are wasting time and brainpower discussing THIS? ABSURD. The only people in the WORLD talking about these issues are media types. Real people talk about real issues.

[@mikitz]

Just so that you know, from now on I want you all to call me Loretta.

[@skyearl1816]

Why are you guys commenting on this issue if it is a waste of time tho

[@marthacanady9441]

@@skyearl1816 Pulled it up to see what was on offer and saw that ridiculous subject. That’s why. I certainly didn’t listen to the whole thing after I heard the first moronic comments. It’s akin to listening to a serious discussion on whether or not aliens have abducted Biden’s brain. Oh, wait a minute maybe that is he only explanation.

[@MrLewyboy]

I cannot believe grown adults are having this conversation.

[@ellenbienenfeld8430]

Right??

[@paulw3747]

Lol... God help us all.

[@user-microburst]

True!!!! It goes without saying that the baby is the one that matters

[@daddynanners3944]

Because they aren't adults. They are adult-sized children.

[@ANTIStraussian]

@@user-microburst Not if the baby is going to kill my wife, by bleeding to death.

[@patmyles4776]

We nearly always talk about Native Americans as if they were all one tribe. There were hundreds of tribes with diverse cultures.

[@xaspirate8060]

Right. And many of them did not get along with the other tribes. That is something that will not be brought up in History class for a long , long time.

[@tafike22]

Just like there are countless white cultures, black culture, Latino cultures, etc. White doesn't mean white. Black doesn't mean black. We may have differences, but we are all children of a greater power. We are all special in our own way, but that uniqueness does not mean we get to control others. Stand up. Show all that we accept everyone. But no one deservers to control us all. We all have a voice, but we must be willing to speak honestly. Even if is in despite of what we believe. Only when we let go of being selfish can we stand together. My beliefs see us all as children of GOD. Your beliefs may differ. That is ok, but we can agree that we all came from somewhere, and that somewhere is greater than ourselves. Let go of your own self interest, and let us find and become what we are supposed to be.

[@TheColdplay200]

@@xaspirate8060 And an even longer for when we talk about how many tribes had slavery. It's almost as if human beings aren't perfect on every fucking spectrum. Regardless, history isn't looking for friends. Usually at the bowling alley with its pal logic. Those guys and their routine.

[@jhitchcock5503]

Same thing with Africa. We act like it's just a country but it's three times the size of the United States with a vast array of cultures that speak hundreds of different languages.

[@josh18230]

They also owned slaves, wiped out entire tribes, and killed animals. The entire narrative of the noble savage perpetuated by the left wing is a false idea, as well as the entire history of the colonists versus the natives to begin with

[@Dan_Capone]

If "Two Spirit" is a Native American concept, wouldn't it be cultural appropriation if the white man starts using it? According to the woke narrative it should be. And also, it perpetuates the idea that women and men are fundamentally different (they have different spirits), instead of being just a learned and cultural convention, like the trans community says. When you try to warp the reality you fall into so many contradictions it's astounding.

[@malcolmshane3039]

Well said.

[@awesomewxyz7083]

Woke is their religion. It's bad one with little consistency.

[@kamicam2988]

dope comment. I was thinking the same

[@starobservers9862]

Every man was once a female in another life as female is the dominate common generic form of man. Feminine is nature and why we say mother. A man lives several lives and different states. The seman a powerful tool is utilized to raise the holy spirit up the spine or Kundalini. By not allowing a physical discharge then the energy is transferred and transmuted up the spine unlocking the tomb in the skull. Awaking God consciousness in himself. The woman is there to assist the man in his awaking from his deep sleep. He rests in Sabbath. Meaning is deep. Search law of one if you wish to understand more esoteric knowledge like this. For woman are like men and do this naturally without effort and gives life abundantly but man must transmute his energy and use it wisely or suffer pain and death. This common knowledge of two spirit preceded native Americans and were taught to them by the survivors of Atlantis who where white Caucasians. They brought agriculture and civilization to the uncivilized and guess what! They did not condemn any form of love for woman were the great teacher and holy spirit incarcerated as are men. We all are from an androgynous single sex spirit that has both polarities of male and female and we return to that spirit form after death. Only here are we divided by polarity and sex. All bodies will come together into one body including the gay and trans. They are part of you father

[@kevindwelle1625]

Basically If all parents would just teach their children empathy decency and respect for all people we wouldn't have these serious problems or issues in America...

[@alienkid]

I literally just heard Two Spirit for the first time on this very youtube clip

[@taycarroll1124]

It originated from from Native American tribes to describe lgbt people. The more you know.

[@SunDown.]

That means you're ignorant on the subject.

[@ncorp2668]

It's a worthless, homophobic idea. No need to know about it. Two spirit was mostly in reference to gay men, and it implied they were less of men because of it. It's pro-gender roles.

[@peepeepoopyhead510]

Lucky you

[@disciplewill7696]

Same, I've heard of three Spirit before though.

[@lindalance2532]

I am Native American. I am appalled. Two spirit? That’s just plain nuts!

[@retalittlegeorge3067]

I am native American. Twisted.

[@AbcAbc-sp1od]

@Linda Lance , But are you as native American as Elizabeth Warren?

[@Sigueme1]

Yes. The soul and the demon in the person . Two spirit 😂😂

[@lizsalazar8808]

Is two spirit a legitimately Native American concept? I’ve only heard it used by non Native Americans which makes me skeptical of the claim that two spirit some how represents transgenderism in Native American culture.

[@zane62135]

@@lizsalazar8808 Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but based on what I've read, sometimes men were born who turned out to be a bit "feminine" - or "gay", as we call it it English. In some tribes, these people were called "two-spirited" and made to work with the women of the tribe. It's really not that radical or surprising.

[@TornSoul062473]

When I was a kid in school, they used to say: "We're all different, and have different ideologies and beliefs, but we set them aside for the common good." The common good. People don't talk like that any more. We sure could use that right now. It's almost as if we're going to need an extinction-level event to get us to stop arguing and work towards something together without taking sides.

[@subodhsarin9098]

Bad times make strong people, strong people make good times, axxholes like Dan Savage and Gillian Tett emerge during good times, guess where we are headed next?

[@birdtower2801]

That's exactly the one non-negotiable value: common good.

[@Krndancedance]

Common good? Isn't 'common' the root word for COMMUNISM?! But seriously, the mentality in America has no use for the 'common good' because unfortunately for too many people it boils down to 'screw you, I've got mine."

[@TubesForNoobs]

The common good? Lol I always love when people say common good and what that really means is the good of their own group, often times at the expense of others, separation is the only way to have unity. There are some values that will never be compromised and the sooner people realize that and voluntarily separate the better it will be.

[@shcoky]

The out is the ego

[@Athelite666]

This whole conversation is ludicrous

[@breadmoth6443]

yep , we could be discussing how we could be further exploring space or something, but instead we are talking about nonsensical mental gymnastics about gender.

[@advancedsettings9699]

Agreed

[@frederf3227]

It's not ridiculous for the albeit small fraction of people this pertains to. It's a big deal for them. The shit they put up with on this front is not trivial, it's just rare. Like if they were ripping the arms off heterochromic siamese twins born on the third tuesday of every month... not a wide ranging issue but still an injustice.

[@advancedsettings9699]

@@frederf3227 I agree fully, but what we are witnessing is not the same

[@Arthog627]

@@frederf3227 you missed the point.

[@Karmingiry]

I live in a third world country and we all have ID for voting. How can a developed nation like the US not want voter ID? The rest of the convo had me lost 😅

[@JonathanGarza16]

Mee too, I could not believe it when I found out they don't have voter ID in every state

[@lastarrmorris3123]

The problem with voter ID is if you recently moved to a new state because of work, school or decided to relocate it takes a while for a state recognize that you live there. So if you moved to a new state in June and elections are in November you may not be able to vote because the state might not recognize you by then. This happens often to black Americans who move to another state let alone another county in that state

[@Karmingiry]

@@lastarrmorris3123 and it doesn't happen to white Americans? Anyway I'm just perplexed that America as a first world country can't solve such a simple problem. Is it very hard to have a national ID? Or why can't they use social security number?

[@lastarrmorris3123]

@@Karmingiry it is a a messed up system we do have a national ID but because of the fear of over voting they prefer that people vote in there own state, city and county. That way they can make sure people don't vote twice. Not to mention people don't even get a chance to vote due to voting hours, not enough voting machines voting machines breaking down. Our whole election system and it's process is messed up

[@RollingCalf]

@@lastarrmorris3123 isn't that what absentee ballots are for?

[@trayvonparker4772]

Dan is the type of man to make coffee for his wife’s boyfriend.

[@mlondon1157]

That has to win comment of the day 😂

[@ashmoe_bangs7986]

If you were trying to say Dan looks and sounds Gay, that’s because he is Gay. So he wouldn’t have a wife.

[@gstar3569]

He is what we on the right call a "beta orbiting soy boy".

[@christinegreene1986]

😆

[@SupremeInvigilator]

What is "make coffee" a gay euphemism for?

[@zachary_attackery]

The party that "believes in science" also thinks men can menstruate

[@frederf3227]

They can, at least the tiny proportion that are biologically female but social-gender male. You understand how that works or you don't. Calling those that understand it unscientific is demonstrating your ignorance.

[@zachary_attackery]

@@frederf3227 There is no science that says men can menstruate.

[@jenwalls7974]

@@frederf3227 if born female then you are a female science

[@kianis1206]

@@frederf3227 smh your argument is purely semantics a play on words..We call people with vaginas women the sam sway we call animals with feathers and beak a bird..we use word to describe things we see hear In our reality..

[@chrisbaker3066]

@@zachary_attackery Your ignorance screams here old mate! You wouldn't dislike trans people at all would you???

[@WBKimmons]

This whole discussion is just ridiculous

[@anthonybrett]

Yep!

[@Potterhead50]

As a woman who had an awful pregnancy and who is currently breastfeeding my 10 month old baby, I find it offensive that the words breast or women are being taken out of certain titles to appease transgendered people.

[@ultimatebailer]

Grow up then?

[@alexbeardsley751]

@@ultimatebailer I'd say the same thing to you. Its not right for women to be subjected to a small percentage of people who constantly have their feelings hurt. This is ass backwards

[@ultimatebailer]

@@alexbeardsley751 subjektets to what?

[@imam14ma3soom1994]

@@ultimatebailer How about erasing of their identity? Are you only capable of speaking in three word sentences?

[@martinwashington6543]

Anne we agree with you. Democrats manufactured the totally fake Republican "war on women" to distract from their actual erasure of women.

[@casinoman7704]

Im not a liberal(thank God) but Bill Maher is the type of liberal I find myself agreeing with about 75% of the time. He has common sense and he isn't a nut case like the guy next to him. Keep pushing the trans stuff at us at the level you are now doing and Trump will be President again or someone just like him..

[@AlexM-ht9ff]

grow up and get over yourself

[@karienrothmann9395]

A nutcase? Whose nuts are u smoking?

[@IsraelCountryCube]

@@karienrothmann9395 degenerates can also females who knew? I always have good support for my evidence here.

[@IsraelCountryCube]

Hey I don’t care that you are atheist I only want you to have morals and values. There’s only morals and values no such thing as evil morals and values because I don’t have to say good along with morals and values those who are empathic truly and have suffered tremendously have morals and values along with ethical standards. That’s those three words are inherently good.

[@gw593]

Bill is what you call a “classic liberal” What you don’t like is the “radical left” the fringe. It’s not the majority. It’s a minority with a loud voice. Most people are actually in the middle. It’s called being reasonable.

[@m.lhenderson5885]

Someone started a lone clap during bill’s disagreement, you can just tell they looked around nervously and stopped

[@terronisaac2098]

I just caught that 😂 so awkward

[@Be_reasonable101]

This happens every show now. Everyone is afraid of cancel culture.

[@Nathan-gd7xq]

@@Be_reasonable101 what do you mean the person in the audience is afraid of cancel culture? Do you think they were worried about being escorted from the building and permanently banned?

[@boblazer9220]

He seems less and less connected to his crowd

[@josiplilic3384]

But that panel,was so "inspiring",that I had to go to bathroom.I remember people like Cornel West,late George Carlin,Tarantino ect,were coming to his show.Oh Bill🤕🤕🤕R.I.P. Norm MacDonald,with Leonard Cohen greatest Canadian ever(to me)

[@CamBlow]

Dennis Prager talked about this (men menstruating) and Bill Mahr called him crazy. It was around a year ago.

[@dannyarcher6370]

@jon pork I don't understand. How can he be crazy if he predicted it? That would usually imply high levels of reason and rationality.

[@boomerang8909]

If that's the case, shouldn't Bill call Arnie's 1994 film Junior crazy?

[@rohanjoshi379]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/fIfSmmCBi5t3b5I

[@boomerang8909]

KZbin.com/watch?v=FVoi-KV6D90&t=309s Firstly, there was a small population of trans-women in which Bill answered and has grown exponentially. Secondly, Prager quoted 'men can menstruate' as if more than 50% of men do. Thirdly, Prager still calls those who transition to women as men. Buddy Valastro was in trouble calling that and had to be educated by LGBTQ.

[@boomerang8909]

Fourthly, I may have missed it, but in this video, Dan initially talked about women transitioning to men, hence trans-men. The video with Prager was about the opposite direction.

[@ogbuzzy1974]

I'm a life long conservative, and Bill hit this one on the head. The tone of this is what pisses people are.

[@xaspirate8060]

And it has never been so distinct as it is right now with these hard Left pols plus Squad Gals and a Dem party that is way too far left. So condescending so often = sickening. That being said, in many ways so many of the basic Alt-Right types had it coming.

[@jleisner1974]

Just because Bill SAYS there's a tone, that doesn't make it true, and complaints about tone can fuck off and to the left- especially from Conservatives. Bill showed us that fear of learning something new LOOKS as ignorant as it sounds. "I'm open to learning new things, but it has to be done in a tone that's pleasing to me" is about as Boomer as it gets.

[@stevenp2309]

It is sad though that ppl are willing to vote against their own self interests just because they don't like the tone of a message.

[@josh18230]

It's not the tone, it's a lack of reality and insanity, as well as the fact that it completely breaks society that bothers conservatives. I'm not going to go around checking people's pro nouns, I'm not going to call a woman a man or vice versa if I know who they are, it's just not going to happen. I don't care what tone you use to try to get me to change my mind, you'll get the same response.

[@candyjohnson3302]

What pisses rethugliKKKons off is that they can’t control EVERYONE.

[@rachelobrien9660]

0 seconds ago It’s incorrect to generalize the belief of two-spirited to all Native Americans. Some tribes do believe this and have for generations. Many tribes DO NOT incorporate two-spirited people into their beliefs, and have strong ideals about the roles of men and women. It’s a part of their culture and they recognize that men and women are created by God differently to serve an equally important role. I feel many people use natives as a way to push their own political and personal agendas, particularly in this area, without really understanding the native people and their beliefs. What he is stating is misleading and fundamentally false.

[@low_vibration]

They're racist so all tribes are the same to them

[@Jaserocks2]

It's a perversion of what two spirit means. Just like the greek concept of anima and animus.

[@martinacosta3821]

But still, regarless if it is just part that incorparate that word, it is a native word, isnt? So they are still right

[@rachelobrien9660]

@@martinacosta3821 It is a generalization of Native Americans. So it is incorrect.

[@martinacosta3821]

@@rachelobrien9660 yes and no, regarless of generalization it is still a native saying, what else were they gonna say?

[@marthacanady9441]

This whole ludicrous discussion makes me realize that they are living in a parallel universe. theater of the absurd. Just think there are people taking all this in as serious. Scary.

[@Nico_Conradie]

Many of them. Many like Maher just pretend to for the money.

[@samcharlie7724]

I rewatched 3x and still don't get it. I studied biology and chemistry, and I'm still confused. Or is my brain blocking out information due to overload. Too much change!?

[@therebellion6911]

@@samcharlie7724 Your not the one that's confused. Dont worry about it.

[@bobjames1992]

This level of inclucivity in language is getting out of hand. The group's we all have to account for are getting more and more with fewer and fewer members. One day this will reduce down to groups the size of one and we shall all start to treat everyone as an individual. What a novel idea.

[@gavinm4466]

You’re spot on💯

[@markdouglas1601]

Jordan Peterson makes this point. The logical conclusion of intersectionality is the individual.

[@alienkid]

It's gonna a evolve into everyone just calling each other by their name🤣

[@Ameborl]

Hahahaha true

[@vaibhavmukherjee9830]

@Mahi Bhai thats kinda dumb. Thats how it was before the periodic table, but separating them into more classes is better for society. It doesn't hurt anyone really. And I'm not saying that unknowingly misgendering someone is an issue but if someone tells you what they want you to call them, just listen to them.

[@NaNa-lt1po]

Abortion law.. and we end up arguing about spirits ?? Focus.. if you want to win this ..

[@someperson9999]

A part of me thinks it's too late because of the way all this crap is framed. Identity politics has made the progressive movement radioactive to the moderates that are needed to be won over.

[@michalsiporski8967]

Haha actually really good point xD

[@josh18230]

Unfortunately the communist wing of your party is going to break up Democrats long before Republicans ever see that type of rift.

[@claiminglight]

@@someperson9999 Count me in on that. I was punk in high school. I still am. But a chunk of the world went total psycho, redrew the whole spectrum, and now 'not-crazy' is moderate by default.

[@LazarheaD]

Bill should call out this. WTF is with the spirits talk? Is the left now more religious and anti-science than the right?

[@AmasaTony81947]

I just heard about “two spirit” for the first time also. However Dan Savage and his unnamed colleague administered a very effective correction. I agree completely with the notion that some liberals are condescending, scolding, self-righteous and too eager to identify with the latest “in” phraseology that would have us decontaminate everything we say lest they’re be a “microagression” (god I hate that word and others of the same ilk). But I, like Dan, don’t use that vocabulary and have no desire to scold over “right speech”. I don’t think I’m the only liberal who feels that way.

[@correypeta]

Well, you've probably never heard of "Two Spirit" because it is a term that only Natives should be using. It does not apply to non-Natives and so for Dan Savage to be using it in his argument is appropriation at its finest.

[@sofrshsocln4]

microaggression is actuality appropriate bc it takes under the racism umbrella. the cluelessness of some ignorant ppl and how they continue such harmful or ridiculous notions and then act offended or get defensive when called out. No it'snot OK in a professional setting to simply claim you're a dark as a BP bc you have a tan. Imagine the death by 1000 cuts idea. that's why they have the "micro" part. Bc over time that ish builds up and is the WORST of your in the receiving end of it, hearing it in your daily life activities, and now in studiously songs you're supposed to continue to take it? nope

[@ikeikeforty]

"two-spirit" was a term invented in the 1990's, and does not accurately describe pre-columbian native societies.

[@theplaylister]

And to think that menopausal women never ever even thought of demanding that people say "SOME women menstruate, not all". Since the dawn of time, they would hear about menstruation and just knew it doesn't apply to them without being offended.

[@umwha]

Bump

[@carlyav00]

Iconic point

[@MerryClark]

exactly. I don’t see postmenopausal women going out and starting their own identity group but I’m sure there is one they’re just not yelling that loud

[@Nofurtherquestions]

because post menopausal women are still women. only men get offended as they feel threatened

[@criswebb7470]

SWISH. It's because they're not self-obsessed dudes.

[@casbot71]

A better argument for AOC would be it also affects men in that _men (and teenage boys) are forced to become fathers due to contraceptive failure._

[@drsnova7313]

I would say it's good to point out that it also affects trans men, because that's rarely in the conversation of it, but yes, you are right, that is also a good point.

[@si91]

An important corollary to this is that abortion denies men and teenage boys who want to become fathers the opportunity to do so, because they get no choice in the matter of the abortion. Conversely, men who don't want to become fathers are still forced to pay child support whether they wanted the pregnancy or not. Thus women's "reproductive rights" are actually a male issue, because women get all the choice, and men get none, but they do get obligation.

[@MikeyDiL]

@@si91 wow...lots of male toxicity in this comment 🙄

[@MikeyDiL]

@@si91 😉 well done sir or ma'am (wouldn't want to assume your gender). But do note, the left will not do well with your logic. They will shift the argument to women's rights. But conveniently leave out 2/3 of the story. The child's right and the father's rights.

[@MrRecrute]

@@MikeyDiL, an embryo or a foetus is not a child, it’s forming into a child. Get educated.

[@oneirishpoet]

One of the few times I agree with Bill Maher, Democrats should not make a huge deal of these trans issues when there are much more important things to be focused on

[@brianloper6669]

What? Why not? Why not direct this ay Republicans who have introduced hundreds of bills restricting trans rights in this country just this year?

[@jcolinmizia9161]

There’s an old phrase: don’t let the perfect be the enemy of the good. Yes, trans people should be included in the issues, but don’t let being completely inclusive derail the abortion debate.

[@itbizint611]

I've never seen a minority so small hijack every issue with such ease as trans people do. Maybe billionaires...

[@patriciamartine5410]

The democrats are likely to lose the election to a MAGA maggot over this trans nonsense. They need to fight to win with issues that are actually important.

[@criswebb7470]

Trans issues affect SUCH a tiny minority of people ... but they get a ridiculous amount of play from Dems using them as, like ... idk, virtue signaling? It's annoying. I feel like it's very alienating to people too because if you're not 100% Woke about every little thing they act like you're a troglodyte that needs to stay in your cave come voting time. No wonder Roe got overturned.

[@Anythingelse125]

I love how only the elites on tv (on both sides) talk about how “divided” we are, yet almost every average person I know has multiple friends with lots of different political opinions and they get along just fine. At this point I’m convinced every celebrity and tv personality is just rooting for this “divide” by talking about it constantly

[@alejandrorivera6122]

it could be, but we also have to consider that talking in a friendly environment is radically distinct to conduct an idea into the political sphere.

[@iamkatdali1961]

Omg yes I said this too when I deleted social media I noticed how no body ever is triggered in real life and acts pretty rational it seems to only be on social media

[@5amiann]

Lucky you. Millions are tribalized.

[@Raptor302]

Yes, because that's how they make their money.

[@BryonLetterman]

You're exactly right. I voted for Trump twice and my girlfriend didn't vote for him. She voted for Hillary and then Biden. But we're still great

[@dfwherbie8814]

There’s so few transmen and even fewer who want to get pregnant. Including them when talking about a mostly woman issue reminds me of the “all lives matter” response to BLM

[@nicolecorry2418]

That's exactly how I thought of it when listening.

[@DrakonR]

All lives do matter.

[@zeffey212]

@@DrakonR Except yours.

[@DrakonR]

@@zeffey212 We know. No room for white lives for today's progressives. Lol.

[@LoneWulf278]

Good point. 🤔

[@TheOldWeigh]

Love my Two Spirited friends. Brandy and Whiskey.

[@mahikiya0663]

Lol

[@SparkyKev]

The audience feeling too scared to laugh… I felt that.

[@xaspirate8060]

I think Dan had a lot of his people in the crowd tonight.

[@itsmeprasad1987]

It’s almost a taboo… to talk about

[@CorneliusCody]

Or the audience realizes that it’s not something you claro about? It’s a deep, complex issue. Sometimes, listening and supporting is the appropriate response.

[@itsmeprasad1987]

@Cornelius Cody yep… you are right

[@jamesmccallum6770]

Bill always makes his audience scarred that they won't laugh at the right time, or whether they should be clapping instead of laughing. You can see it in all his shows now and it's become very distracting.

[@sianais]

Anybody else scared about the sort of conversations we'll be seeing in ten years when this is the new baseline for normal?

[@elirivera3880]

2 late in some places it already is

[@KRashad]

THAT PART

[@bluehand9631]

Oh for joy, I just learned the meaning of a new politically mandatory correct term.

[@frederf3227]

It's treating people with respect gone mad!

[@zeffey212]

@@frederf3227 Nah, not everyone deserves my total respect just for existing. It's not my responsibility to be walking on eggshells every time I interact with a member of a "victimized class".

[@kigen6400]

@@zeffey212 I'm proud of you for saying this.

[@TagSpamCop]

Delete. Delete, delete, delete.

[@mcsinnin6473]

This sounds like I'm watching a game of Dungen and Dragons. "My Trans-elf uses Two-spirt!" "My lesbian-cis-Ork defends the attack using Rachel-Maddow genderless-bathroom pass!"

[@veddiinspires]

😂😂😂😂. You and me, both. Dude.

[@DT-bp2om]

Lololol

[@Grande79]

They themselves pretend not to be confused.

[@rogerrogerson1232]

What a joke segment that was

[@Nico_Conradie]

Feels like a Monty Python skit. or something out of South Park

[@estill273]

I’m sure Mr. Savage levitated off of the stage when the show was over. Neanderthal actions like walking have to be beneath his enlightened sensibilities.

[@Deathdemort]

Its worth mentioning that the term “two-spirit” is actually not non-controversial amongst the Indigenous either. People keep saying the idea of the gender spectrum and fluidity has always been with humanity and that we should get over it, but the truth is a LOT more complicated than that. Its not that easy to willy nilly compare cultural phenomena from very different cultures who hold differing axioms. Talk about freaking cultural appropriation. This is just using Indigenous cultures (for there are many) for the political stock of a nasty section of the far-left.

[@melsop54]

They don't expect their base to do an ounce of research like this tho. They simply say the sky is green, and it is unquestionably green from that point on. They say the ground doesn't exist, and the ground just ceases to exist at that moment for them. That's the mindset of the "vote blue no matter who". There's no thinking, no growing, no individual ideas. You vote one color, forever. Quite creepy and definitionally cult like.

[@tharveytucker1]

What are you talking about? Two spirit people have been around for ages. That’s just fact. It’s non controversial because it’s a thing, whether you or some natives like it or not. There are many other cultures who have similar non binary genders. There’s no appropriation here. I don’t see anyone claiming to be two spirited who isn’t native. The whole reason it’s pointed out is two fold. One, it’s been a thing here in the americas since the beginning- so it’s not new. Which many are freaking out over trans people as though it’s some new thing. Two, nearly all cultures have a form of non binary gender(s) in their culture. Some may not be welcoming to it, but it’s still a thing.

[@noktilux4052]

@@tharveytucker1 Can you give me some statistics and be precise about which native people? My people in my part of what is now called Canada don't have this tradition. Which tribe are you part of?

[@imam14ma3soom1994]

@@tharveytucker1 We all know that. Even without the native American culture, we already knew that some women had male characteristics (tomboy) and the other way around (metrosexual). These terms have been around in our culture as well. What IS new however, is that having these qualities suddenly affect which gender you are. Or there being a third gender. Scientifically, there is no basis for non-binarity. There's intersex, but those people (and their genitals) usually lean either towards one sex or the other. There's also trans, but here you identify as a person with the opposite sex. Other cultures might have different conceptions in how they perceive genders but most people are not familiar with them. Which is normal.

[@yukisuperstylish]

@@noktilux4052 the guy in the video didn’t even give Bill his resources nor the tribe lol

[@DrStrangeBrew]

When Dan Savage was explaining the rules. I felt like I was listening to a dungeon master making up arbitrary rules that we're going to change as the journey went on.

[@noktilux4052]

In trying to come up with a good analogy a little earlier, that is pretty much exactly what came to mind.

[@benp4877]

Yep

[@charlenejohnson309]

@@benp4877 Ignorance about politics and failure to understand the negative ramifications of laws that affect one segment of society significantly that are being introduced and passed by groups that represent self-interest seem to be connected. Wait til these unwanted, forced pregnancies begin to impact your small world due to death of pregnant women, issues of bleeding or death due to nontreatment of incomplete spontaneous abortions, death/neglect of unwanted children and criminalization of those who support women who want to terminate pregnancy. Gloat now. If this isn't turned around, you won't be prepared when even more rights are erased overnight and sanctioned by a less than stellar Supreme Court. You are not safe from unfettered political power.

[@user-co9jn6ec8n]

@@charlenejohnson309 Just take a red pill and you don’t have to worry about all the mental illness on the left

[@charlenejohnson309]

@@user-co9jn6ec8n Your chosen KZbin name says it all. You can't get pregnant, you have no right forcing strangers to have babies.

[@marklewen9384]

" its getting to the point where you cant call them chicks with dix anymore....you have to call them GUYS, who talk too much"- a jeselnik

[@olipop84]

These guys are ridiculous. Props to Bill Maher, who is trying to shine light on it.

[@sterlingforbes3872]

You know the left has gone extreme, when Bill himself is like WTF???

[@rp7773]

Overton windows shift over time - by nowadays' standards, Bill is comfortably centre-left (if not centrist) tbh

[@o77eh]

@@rp7773 He is pro-DNC, so center is as left as he can go. No liberals exist in either Right wing party.

[@dangerousdiscourse]

@@o77eh I'd say 30-40% of the right wing, would have been considered liberal 10 years ago..

[@o77eh]

@@dangerousdiscourse Who? The DNC stopped being a liberal party in 1976. Bernie Sanders and AoC sure, but they then betrayed their constituents. I can't think of anyone else I would describe as Liberal.

[@dangerousdiscourse]

@@o77eh .. u said there are no liberals in the right wing, i said there is. Then you said the left have no liberals, arnt u agreeing with me?

[@clootscalhoun9481]

As someone who is very pro-choice, I totally agree that the main issue is that women’s access to abortions is being threatened. I think this whole issue with preposterous wording takes away from the main issue to satisfy a small number of social justice warriors who are more interested in getting the exact intersectional adjectives right.

[@cobes11]

Very pro-choice? Does that mean that you are also on-board with the growing support for a woman to be able to choose “post-birth abortion”?

[@MMAGamblingTips]

@@cobes11 Lol there is no such thing. You can’t murder a child after giving birth to it. I mean, where do you come up with these things? No doctor is going to perform such an act.

[@aarons.2180]

Exactly. And now trying to make it look like abortion is a topic about transsexuality… to everyone who might have an on the fence position about it, it‘s going to be so much more relatable now, of course.

[@christinebenson518]

@INevaFreeze That's untrue, half of women who get abortions were using other forms of contraception that failed. Fun fact: most abortions are natural aka miscarriages that happen before a woman knows she's pregnant.

[@jeffreysytsma6541]

@@christinebenson518 Unless the woman purposely miscarried, I don't see how you can equate that to aborting the baby, as aborting is an action one purposely takes.

[@Notalloldpeople]

Why frame an argument about a law which adversely affects 1000 of pregnant women about a very small percentage of people who don’t identify as women but could get pregnant? You will turn off more much needed support than you gain in the pursuit of purity politics. A better argument would be about the impact it has i men as well as the carriers of the pregnancy

[@a526003b]

Bingo! Been saying this for YEARS

[@TheFeldhamster]

This should be emphasized more. Eg. the husband or boyfriend who loses his wife / girlfriend because doctors needed to wait with abortion in health related cases. Because look at that law, if it's "only" really high risk, that's not enough to allow the abortion. The woman needs to be basically croaking right now. And these cases end up often enough like the case in Ireland which then started their shift towards allowing abortions. I'm European, I've actually known what two spirit is since the early 90s because I have LGBTQ people in my family and they were pretty activist, so they knew a lot about other culture's concepts of being trans etc. But I think framing it this way was a tactical mistake by AOC. Those that still need convincing that this law is bad need to identify with the people it will hurt. They need to think "uh, this could happen to myself / my family". These folks typically pretend trans or enby people don't exist or are mentally ill. You don't win them over this way, you scare them off. It's bad advertising and a bad argument. It's a tactical mistake, even though what she said is totally factually correct. And even though how Bill reacted to it was just stupid. He should have ripped her for making the argument badly, not played pretend dumb about not knowing how trans men can still have a uterus and uuuh, he's such an ally but "what is this silly two spirit stuff". Like he doesn't have the resources to have someone research it for him for the show. Not a good look, Bill.

[@hopedamon7116]

I, for one, am tired of coddling men and Bible thumpers. I'm not here to educate you. I'm here for my constitutional rights, Dammit! Bible thumpers don't want these things taught in school. They don't want to be educated on sex and different lifestyles. They don't want real history to be taught. So I say, stay ignorant. But don't fuck with others people's right.

[@a526003b]

@@hopedamon7116 what constitutional rights are you speaking of? I’m an atheist however I’m not interested in being “educated” about “menstruating people” and child birth. Let’s start at the beginning… are gender and sex independent of each other? If so then I couldn’t care less about your gender. This entire subject is where “the party of science” goes full anti-biology.

[@Illlium]

You boys ever heard a magical thing called contraception? Abortion should be legal only if paternity surrender is also legal.

[@smisanko]

"The founding fathers would be canceled for good reasons? Dude, they put forth the best effort for individual liberty and justice that They could at the time with the norms of the era. Perfect by their own or even our standards? No. But sure as shit better than anything you could ever achieve. They fought and defeated the greatest military of the time and developed a thriving nation for generations to come. If you win this culture war, congrats. You'll be noted in history as one of the rare humans who achieves much by moving us backwards.

[@ivanvoronov3871]

Exactly, the fact that as a gay man his rights are protected by law is because of the founding father's

[@deerobinson557]

@@ivanvoronov3871 You two are a perfect examples of how bad schools are in America. The founding fathers were not trying to give anyone freedom, unless you were a white guy who owned land. They didn't even give white woman freedom to have a voice in this country.

[@deerobinson557]

Stefan Paul Misanko, how did the founding fathers do their best for individual liberty, when they excluded everyone who wasn't a white man. Almost all Native tribes gave their women every right that a man had. Women were the head of the household in most tribes, they had a voice in government, and no one in the tribe tried to tell their women how to think or act period. Oh and the founding father's stole the way our government was set up, from the Iroquois Nation.

[@deerobinson557]

@@ivanvoronov3871 the founding fathers would have put to death anyone they thought was gay.

[@DominicNJ73]

@@deerobinson557 You should stop learning history from Twitter and Tumblr, you're embarrassing yourself with your complete lack of understanding of the issues and hurdles the founding father's went through to achieve what they did. For instance, the majority of them wanted to disallow slavery in the Declaration of Independence and Constitution but they were blocked by the southern colonies, so they had to negotiate and agreed to visit the issue of slavery after the Revolutionary War and the ratifying of the Constitution.

[@OceanluvOC]

Never heard of two spirit until now 🤷🏼‍♀️

[@hustler3of4culture3]

@@stepfaniehawkins205 but it was like a third gender, no?

[@twiztedsynz]

@@hustler3of4culture3 Some tribes consider Two Spirit a 'third gender', yeah. It's basically one body but both male/female spirits in that one body. IMO it could blanket term not just Trans people but Gender Fluid people as well since the only difference between the two is Gender Fluid don't normally have the horrible dysphoria that Trans people sometimes have. We acknowledge we're a "base" gender, but we've also feelings and sensations of the other as well.

[@hustler3of4culture3]

@@twiztedsynz yeah that was essentially my understanding. Thank you for clarifying.

[@hustler3of4culture3]

@@twiztedsynz did two spirit people usually take the role of shaman? That's another thing I heard long ago, but I'm no longer sure if that's true.

[@josh18230]

Congratulations for never looking at Twitter, reddit, or Tumblr then.

[@politicalorphan]

"Don't talk politics with me, just talk." Awesome

[@josh18230]

Yeah, that is one thing people have forgotten how to do if they have gotten into that rabbit hole, I'm guilty of it as well.

[@pro-choicemom]

You're asking people to reason with bigots, racist, religious lunatics& misogynists. I live among them...they're irredeemable. You try talking to my moron neighbors.

[@politicalorphan]

@@pro-choicemom no, we suggest you talk to them. If you truly believe that you're surrounded by people who think the way you've described, then maybe you're the problem, and not so much them

[@pro-choicemom]

@@politicalorphan Of course, people who want to take away civil rights from my gay friends & family- oh they're such sweethearts. People who think the gov't should force women & girls to remain pregnant against their will are wonderful. Gtfoh. These morons think evolution shouldn't be taught in schools. Bill Maher & the other idiots going around claiming we have to be nice to bigots really aren't talking to the Trump cultists who have shoot to kill signs on their front yards. They talk to rich conservatives or people who just want tax cuts. He doesn't talk to the scum people that live in red states.

[@pro-choicemom]

@@politicalorphan It's amazing bigots must be listened to but those fighting against them are the problem. You're a real POS.

[@dtchinacat3973]

I agree with Bill: it's "Mainly" a Women's issue. The percentage of Trans that this would effect is "SO LOW" it's a "Biological Women's" issue!

[@hustler3of4culture3]

Trans men are biological women

[@BenDover-ij7yp]

I don't think it's a women's issue at it's core, because the question at it's core is, up to what point development and under what circumstances, is it ok, to end the life of the fetus? Almost no one believes in abortions up to childbirth.

[@collydub1987]

@@hustler3of4culture3 so you see absolutely no difference between a female who was born with a uterus, and a pre op trans person who was born male?

[@thelaughingfoxx]

Saying that it’s a women’s issue is still true! Doesn’t that include trans men?? Why the fuck are we offended by this?

[@hustler3of4culture3]

@@collydub1987 that's not what this is about.

[@ippolit23]

It’s dawning on Bill he’s been on the wrong side of the fence for most of the time.

[@reznof2011]

You can see how worried he is about saying something they won’t like.

[@praketak47]

@@reznof2011 It's empathy, sensitivity. He wants to be more informed. He is not afraid to be 100% strong worded when needed.

[@mtkoslowski]

Oh, FFS. Enough with all the politically correct *DOUBLESPEAK.* Will every normal person stand with me please?

[@ridetillidie8090]

Can you define 'normal' for us?

[@jonathanmol4489]

I thought normal was just a cycle on my washing machine?

[@Rayzersword]

If you think there's such a thing as a normal person, you are severely undereducated. You clearly don't understand anything about Orwell, so please stop using words coined by him incorrectly.

[@974724]

Yes

[@Rayzersword]

Just so you know, the bad guys of 1984, I.e. the ones who used "doublespeak", outlawed homosexuality. If they existed, they would be on your side.

[@jeremygibson565]

Dan savage thinks he’s brilliant. At least someone does.

[@cooldrop02]

Smarter than you. And I didn't even agree with everything he said here. ;p

[@BarbaPamino]

@@cooldrop02 do you know this Jeremy fella from somewhere else or are you basing it on one comment on KZbin? Even still. It's not a prerequisite to be brilliant yourself in order to recognize someone else isn't. Any more than it is a pretty be a phenomenal athlete in order to gauge that a professional athlete isn't all that exceptional compared to his or her peers. Dan Savage is a professional opinion giver and in that realm of opinion givers he's pretty low on the list. He'll be easily forgotten about by future generations and nothing he ever said or wrote will matter. Thus, he's not brilliant.

[@cooldrop02]

@@BarbaPamino Well, based on the comment itself, he seems pretty simple. To comment on someone else's intelligence when they are the ones speaking eloquently, and also not conveying any ill will towards anyone as they do so, wow simultaneously giving concise information that is true in fact checkable, is indicative of someone with a low IQ. Because I know this gentleman does not know Dan in person. He doesn't know that person.

[@cooldrop02]

@@BarbaPamino They also made an assumption that he, the person speaking, thinks that he is something. That goes far beyond reading someone's comment, which is an action, and goes into the realm of being a mind reader. Which is something no human is capable of. Which, again, is indicative of someone with a low IQ. Also someone with an inability to self-reflect. Thank you for your candor homie.

[@cooldrop02]

@@BarbaPamino because if we're talking about the topic at hand. He didn't give an opinion. He gave an undeniable fact of the reality that is what the tweet itself referenced. If you can't comprehend that then, that's on you. If you think he is not brilliant cool. However I said that he is smarter than him. So you can argue against a strong man that both of you seem to want to hump, together.

[@erikt1713]

When it comes to reproductive rights, the term "women" has always included a large number of female children as well, which is a group of particular concern for abortion. So we would have had to say "women and girls" to be very accurate. If some trans men are still covered within their original sex in regards to reproductive rights it is also just a simplification, but for a far smaller number of people.

[@72marshflower15]

Sexual predation is self obsessive ie individualistic and individualism sources conservatism. Thing is, no one is conservative or liberal per se, but rather we tend to embody characteristics of either or at any given time. Which one reigns depends on which is fed the most. In individualistic culture, sexual predation will run rampant. When a man doesn’t care for his parter so much as he cares for his nut..

[@brettcrook9362]

@@72marshflower15 sexual predation is rampart in extreme leftists groups. Predators target these groups as the members are reluctant to report such crimes to “the enemy” they are trying to overthrow. Predators go where they have access to victims. In the past that has been church institutions, boarding schools, scout and guide troops. Now those hunting grounds are on “high alert” so are no longer as favourable. However with the rise of “Safe Schools Programs”, Critical Gender Theory promotion and exploration of sexuality encouraged the predators will be increasingly attracted to schools. Having said all that. Most sexual attacks occur within an extended family setting. The victim and predator are known to each other. 1 in 3 girls and 1 in 6 boys are victims. So 25% of the population. If 1% of those kids are traumatised that’s 0.25% of the population. Maybe this goes a long way to explaining the origins of a large portion of the LGBTIQP population. I can’t see how you make the claim it is rampart in individualistic conservative culture. Gay pride and North American Man Boy Love Association (NAMBLA) are very left and liberal and had their origins in the 1960 s sexual revolution. So I’m call bs on your comment.

[@72marshflower15]

1) “sexual predation is rampant in extreme leftist groups” Response) ~ for starters, extremism is to conservatism as radical is to liberal. It means you’re not even pairing sources to their proxies correctly. Secondly, you’re so desperate to defend your id/ego that you’ll defend anything that challenges the premise that you build your id/ego on. Technically, harming others for individual gain/likeness is individualistic ie conservative as caring for others is collective ie liberal. It means that, objectively speaking, all theft, sexual predation and killing is self obsessive ie individualistic and (again) individualism sources conservatism.. I was actually trafficked as child. You’ve no right to speak to this end. The reason that there are dozens of genders is due to individualism, ie self obsession.. “What am I?” Tell you what.. you’re more than an individual..

[@somethingclever8916]

They need to drop women issue label altogether to be more inclusive and just say its about personal freedom and right to health care and leave it at that.

[@erikt1713]

@@somethingclever8916 - If you include girls as women (to be), then women still make up 100% of pregnant people. I rounded it to full percentage points there without decimals. It must be permitted to refer to the total by its almost exclusive majority. In addition, pregnancy is not an illness, so abortion is not literally health care. It is important for personal freedom, though, I agree with you there.

[@bath_neon_classical]

abortion is an issue that affects men, but it's a lot harder for women

[@bentalaska4920]

The irony of this segment is that Dennis Prager was laughed off when he brought up ‘men can menstruate’ 2 years ago. And now they’re having a serious discussion about it.

[@ncorp2668]

Yes, that is unfortunate. And Ronan Farrow laughed it off too (in the segment you're talking about), only to imply soon after that JK Rowling was transphobic for saying women menstruate

[@rogerrogerson1232]

I know. What a crazy nut bag, tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theorist. (maybe Dennis Prager and Niki Minaj should get a room together the right wing white supremasits) /s

[@almuhaarib]

Fucking this.

[@greglinsmythe3375]

Women menstruate, men don’t.

[@a526003b]

Absolutely hilarious! So true!

[@tonyrock5313]

it's also a family issue. An extra child or fetus that will be disabled will be a burden on some families.

[@ridetillidie8090]

That's why I've been advocating physical, genetic, mental and monetary screening prior to being GRANTED a license to breed, since the 70s. Makes me the bad guy but just think if we started ignoring the idiot religious and made sure people were capable of having and raising children?

[@GiarkReleos]

@@ridetillidie8090 your Fascism is not welcome here, that is why conservatives are going the way of the Dodo bird. Facts Matter !!

[@tonyrock5313]

@@ridetillidie8090 What are you a damn Nazi!?You are one step from the practice of killing the ,what you call, the undesirable.

[@breadmoth6443]

@@ridetillidie8090 so.... you are pro - eugenics - since that is essentially what eugenics is.

[@ridetillidie8090]

@@breadmoth6443 Wow. Thanks for proving my point. NO, I am not. I am pro-responsible breeding instead of random irresponsible breeding, as is anyone with the ability to critically use logic and reason. In other words, pretty much nobody in this thread. I can tell you are unable to wrap your head around the idea and come to logical, reasoned conclusions, so, I'll just stop here and let you wriggle around in your cheetos thinking you're clever.

[@HorrorBorealis]

Love how the trans are trying to erase women and female experiences. so inclusive and feminist!

[@v-town1980]

Love how feminists and females ignore the misandristic agenda most of their so-called justices include. What a bunch of entitled, unhappy schmucks.

[@HorrorBorealis]

@@v-town1980 say it again in english this time.

[@stephenvierling2287]

The fact that this conversation is taking place makes me have less hope for society. The fact that there are people that think men can be women and vice versa is scary.

[@AlexM-ht9ff]

learn science, bigot

[@IsraelCountryCube]

Time to kill some!

[@stephenvierling2287]

@@AlexM-ht9ff I would say everyone on this panel needs to learn science.

[@lucasharvey8990]

@@stephenvierling2287 Well I would say that you need to face the facts, since your science is wrong. What you've got under your pants isn't the only thing that determine gender. Imagine the manliest guy you can, like Arnold Schwartzeneggar or whatever, then imagine they had a vagina. They'd then fall in the murky waters of somewhere in between male and female - where they have all the characteristics of being a man, but they don't have the male sex organ. So what do you call them then? Man? Woman? It's a really unnerving question for those who do face these sorts of problems. These people often force themselves to pick a side and if they have money they can go through surgery to make it a little more "official." Others don't pick a side, and just decide to stay in-between. This is happening to millions of people throughout the Western World, and it is woefully irresponsible and childish to pretend they are all nutcases or whatever. You should take them seriously instead of belittling them. If you woke up tomorrow and what you've got under your pants magically got switched to the opposite, then how would you handle it? Would you still be guy, or would you be a woman then?

[@azspotfree]

Ms Tett is wildly obsessed with the word tribe

[@Jamakaya1]

You're missing the forest for the trees. Her comments at the end were very incisive and compassionate.

[@alkismavridis1]

1:12 How on earth can transition to male? I thought that gender is the social aspect and sex was the immutable biological one. Aren't trans men females? How about abortion is a female issue? The more I look at the trans issue, the more the looks like semantic games. And semantic games are fine. What it not fine is claiming that people who play different semantic games are "biggots". Even more uncool is to keep changing your semantic games every 5 years, and call biggots the ones who still play the previous one.

[@fromireland8663]

Well, because of hormonal treatment, surgery and because they feel that they are male. That is how I understand it. Correct me if I am wrong? However, good point about it changing every 5 years and people being unfairly called out for not keeping up. I believe that, in the UK, there are now over 100 gender identities recognised. I still feel that gender at birth should be distinguished from gender identity, primarily for medical reasons.

[@alkismavridis1]

@@fromireland8663 the way I see it is still a semantic question. Instead of saying that people changed their sex, we could be more flexible about what sex identifications are. We could say that is, that the genitalia and hormonal interventions simply proove that "some males have vaginas" and "some males have different hormonal makeup". Of course these are outliers to the majority, but this is the case anyways, no matter what semantcs you choose. Same thing, different semantics. We could even use the same terms for gender for goodness shake. Instead of calling them trans men, we could be more flexible about what womanhood is. Some women dress like this, talk like this and even modify their bodies in this way. And they are still women. Same phenomenon, different wording. Of course, self identification would also follow the same semantics because hey, these people also use language to think about themselves. To me all of the above are equally right, (or equally wrong) ways to speak about the phenomenon. This way I find it to be overwhelmingly a semantic game. Which is fine, until the point where people weaponize it.

[@fromireland8663]

@@alkismavridis1 Do you think that the current state of affairs has arisen because society is too rigid in it's expectation of how make/female should be or behave?

[@alkismavridis1]

@@fromireland8663 yes, I think this is correct. And maybe (just maybe) the semantics that we ended up following reinforces this rigidity.

[@PassportToPimlico]

@@fromireland8663 I'm sure that a great many people can feel that they are a great many things but that doesn't necessarily make it true.

[@bernadettebockis4120]

'Two spirit' is a term used by Native Americans. They don't prefer it's use as trans. It is to distinguish First Nations people from Non-Native people.

[@paulmicheldenverco1]

I'm not saying "I told you so", I just thought I'd share this in the spirit of helping us know facts about things we didn't know about five minutes ago. Two-Spirit is a modern, pan-Indian, umbrella term used by some Indigenous North Americans to describe Native people in their communities who fulfill a traditional third-gender ceremonial and social role in their cultures. Wikipedia

[@otcourtruecitizenshipphil.8386]

So is this two-Spirit, sybil style or Exorcist Style just asking?

[@ethercept]

Just try to listen to this conversation without imagining that Earnest Hemingway was a time traveler and this was the last thing he heard before he pulled the trigger.

[@dwknick33]

Hahaha

[@hggtg]

I truly believe this man is mentally deranged!

[@shadbakht]

What about women who are over 50? They’re not “menstruating people”.

[@jennifersadler4870]

If a person is not menstruating, they will not need an abortion because they cannot get pregnant.

[@jhitchcock5503]

@@jennifersadler4870 and yet we're still women. I don't care who AOC is I don't want her degrading me or my daughters by calling them menstruating people. They are women and so am I, even without my uterus, because I have two X chromosomes.

[@michalsiporski8967]

@@jhitchcock5503 Exactly. This is ridiculous what is going on. If being male or female is determinated by gender (i.e. some stereotypes associated with male or female) then you can say everything is a social construct. We have stereotypes about race or age. Already some people identify with different race like Oli London.

[@hazmat1978]

I love women who are 50+! They don't play games and I don't have to worry about paying Child support! :-)

[@Oxbloodmage]

@@jennifersadler4870 thus the term makes sense even if you aren't talking about trans men. But anytime they are even referenced someone complains about it. 🤷 I just think bill is full of shit for attacking aoc for doing something he would do every other day of the week on a different issue, like religion, does bill think am I alienating Christians to the democrats by antagonizing them no. 🙄

[@bartstarr100]

That lady decried tribalism while decrying “those people”

[@OmegaMouse]

@jon pork Thanks Joh, you just showed that "you people" cannot detect hypocrisy.

[@stevem2323]

@@OmegaMouse You people?

[@ashtonwalker3881]

Congrats Bill, this is your audience now

[@brezhou29]

Amazing isn't it? This bit about the Texas law moves straight away to "what's 2 spirits anyway?". And then the new rules bit is about the Texas law, but mostly... about how snitching on desperate women is exactly like the Jeopardy producer didn't get to also be the host because of something he said in the past. Lots of time spent on the kind of important topic of the Texas law, only at no point it was about this law and its consequences, but about how "things are weird nowadays, aren't they?". This show could easily move to Fox now. Booohoohooo the woke left, boohooo weird gender stuff, booohoohhoo I don't like lockdowns.

[@ryanshinermusic]

@@brezhou29 If you really think this is conservative, you probably haven't interacted with anyone outside of one far-left bubble for awhile.

[@brezhou29]

@@ryanshinermusic no, not conservative! Libertarian, i.e. conservatives... but with weed and gays!

[@ashtonwalker3881]

@@brezhou29 Yeah I'm confused with your point. This kind of bs debate is what takes place on CNN, MSNBC etc.. not even close to Fox news

[@brezhou29]

@@ashtonwalker3881 this bit starts about the Texas abortion ban, but quickly devolves into "ewww people with weird gender". When the Texas law passed, Fox hardly mentioned it. Just like on this Real Time episode. Sort of reference it in passing but really talks about something else. That's what I'm talking about. The Texas law will lead women to get back alley abortions, like in the good old time. Women will suffer, many will die from the consequences of having an abortion not done in clinic. Seems important? Well... Not to Bill, who's focus is "WHAT THE FUCK IS TWO SPIRITS ANYWAY I NEVER HEARD OF IT" and "AOC said something weird" and in the new rules bit "Snitching on women who needs an abortion is like cancelling a producer hosting a game show". False equivalents, moaning about the woke mob, weird genders and "cancel culture", whilst barely mentioning the actual madness of banning abortions even in case of rape... is what Fox does.

[@JoyTb12345]

I really have found that I agree with Bill on a lot and it shocks me.

[@JoyTb12345]

@@stepfaniehawkins205 hahha thank you🥰

[@Oxbloodmage]

If this was about religion bill wouldn't agree with himself.

[@GiarkReleos]

that's because common sense is a trait not found in the lunatic fringe of conservatism. Facts Matter !!

[@awesomewxyz7083]

@@GiarkReleos Yeah those damn conservatives... Why can't they understand that it's okay for men to crack women's skull in MMA? Man I'm glad I'm not a liberal anymore...

[@freeindeed8416]

Yeah because these people are out it

[@kellywalsh9373]

Two Spirit….meaning that they accepted the duality that exists within themselves rather than fight it and try and modify their body into one gender or the other.

[@vitaliys]

it's called "gender dysphoria". I don't know whether it's treatable or not, but apparently some people suffer it

[@whoopshey826]

i understood it instantly, its not complicated. I've seriously never heard it until this clip.

[@rogerrogerson1232]

@@vitaliys Perfect Joe will mandate the vaccine now.

[@nicksherreard1215]

@@vitaliys it’s not gender disphoria if you’re using the organ you’re supposedly disphoric about

[@TheFeldhamster]

I think two spirit is more like what we call genderfluid now, not trans. It was equated with being trans back when we didn't have a word for genderfluid. Or probably the native people used it for both because they just didn't have the means to do that kind of surgery. But "accepting ones duality" sounds a lot more like genderfluid / non binary. The trans people I know don't feel "in the middle" kind of dual, they're more likely "I knew from when I was 5 years old that I was in the wrong body". At least that's what they told me and seeing how difficult it is to transition in my country and they still took it upon them I have no reason to disbelieve them. They meant it.

[@iamtheowl9631]

The fact that this conversation just happened is exactly why I'm voting Republican for the first time in my life next election. I just can't anymore.

[@Dialogos1989]

I think all this confusion could be resolved by separating sex from gender. Just say male or female, nothing to do with identity

[@micl6562]

Its meant to be confusing

[@ncorp2668]

The whole gender identity movement is predicated on removing and obfuscating sex, particularly anything to do with women's rights. It's highly misogynistic.

[@vitaliys]

you can't separate sex from gender as of today. One word : DNA, everything else is in your imagination

[@hyacinthlynch843]

Sex and gender are not disconnected.

[@vitaliys]

@@hyacinthlynch843 , and till recently it meant the same :))) I have a feeling it's still the same. One can mingle the words anyway they want it doesn't change the scientific facts

[@low_vibration]

lmao i love how "native americans" is just one homogenous blob as if they werent separated into myriad cultures and tribes

[@Willcaballero]

I thought the same thing. I've heard two-spirit being tossed around for years now, but still am unsure which exact tribe(s) used this term. Like, did my Taino ancestors down in what's now called Puerto Rico use this term, just like a hypothetical Lakota Native American? Super doubtful...

[@shawnnewell4541]

Not all men who are married want their kids. My former parish priest told us in a sermon once that he'd heard women in tears, during confession, because they were told to abort the baby or they wouldn't be allowed back in the house. I for one was stunned. It really drove home what I'd realized a long time ago it's not just women who want abortion it's men too. I fear more deaths and homelessness will happen as a result of Texas' abortion laws.

[@thagodwecreate5179]

I am personally against abortion. And 2 years ago I met a girl and accidentally got her pregnant in 1 month. I never wanted kids and neither did she so she left the decision to me...I now have a 1 year old daughter i love so so much so my money's where my mouth is. Though this is my personal choice, I don't feel I have the right to take that decision from others. I support first trimester, there should be limits and restrictions but obviously taking it from the black market, back alley route is safer for everyone. Fun Fact: I am still with my daughter's mother in a very happy home and i love being a dad...so ya never know where life will take you. I wouldn't have believed it 3 years ago. I'm still def never getting married though. One Love

[@xaspirate8060]

@@thagodwecreate5179 Great post.

[@tjhodge201]

Shawn I find it difficult to see a priest approve of abortion and that more than likely the women speaking to said priest would receive care for them and the baby...my question is everyone in my church us against abortion cause the death of a defenceless baby...I think you don't go church and your story kinda B.S.

[@ViFabulous]

@@thagodwecreate5179 1. If you don't want kids, get a vasectomy. Glad you're a content dad now. 2. Most abortions are done in the first trimester or 12 weeks. The TX law defies medical logic and, once again, shows lawmakers don't understand human biology or reproduction. 3. second trimester abortions are often for medical reasons. Either the fetus has issues of viability issue or the mother's health is at stake. The pro-birth movement perpetuates the lies of "Late term abortion." If they really GAF about humans the GOP could go to the Texas border with Mexico, any detention center, any orphanage or foster care system and show they care about humans post birth. However; they choose to sit in judgment of others and say, "You shouldn't have children you can't afford." The GOP has been anti-life by example for over 40 years.

[@fromireland8663]

@@tjhodge201 You misunderstood Shawn's post. You should read it again.

[@tigrouthetraveler]

This is insane! A transman is not a man, she's a woman who feels like a man. A transwoman is not a woman, he's a man who feels like a woman. Everyone has the right to feel what they want, but pretending that those feelings allows them to really become what they feel is absolutely insane!

[@maskedmarvyl4774]

"Trans two-spirit nonbinary". Do you want that as a soy latte?

[@starwarsstuff8098]

You can tell Bill really wants to smack that guy lol

[@raminMTL]

What

[@Killswitch1411]

Who wouldn't?? Guy is unbearable.

[@Oxbloodmage]

What that guy should point out is that bill does what aoc is doing all the time on other issues. He's constantly scolding and intentionally alienating people. 🤷

[@Nigerian_Papi]

@@Killswitch1411 nah he’s chill, I think bill was just kinda frustrated cause he wasn’t addressing his point

[@hyacinthlynch843]

@@Killswitch1411 So was the audience.

[@Boobalopbop]

I am a liberal who loves AOC but what she said really cause me to roll my eyes. Maher is correct. Keep the messaging simple.

[@Seasonalable]

I wasn't sure these people exist, but here is one. Extraordinary

[@musashi.miyamoyo]

Do women that have a fetus have two heads, 20 fingers, and 20 toes? Is it really about the women?

[@jamesjack7074]

Bill keeps trying to say things need to be framed in appealing ways for the Right, but a majority of them aren't interested in changing positions on issues like this.

[@awesomewxyz7083]

Yeah cuz when men are being allowed to fight women in MMA, it's not okay. Also if men and women are the same, then what's the point of trans?

[@freeindeed8416]

Men are men

[@cobes11]

You can take a picture of a dog turd from 100 different angles. At the end of the day, it is still shit.

[@thirstfen]

This was the most confusing conversation I've ever heard 😂😂.

[@jacobrivera7302]

Welcome to American politics...

[@johnames6430]

and absurd as well ridiculous

[@maxmustermann9587]

I found it quite enlightening.

[@johnames6430]

@GAY RIGHTS ARE HUMAN RIGHTS exactly, there's plenty of gay people who aren't full woke idiots, they just like other men and that's it.

[@BM-wh5qk]

All they wanted was marriage they said... Now we have to say "two spirit" and not laugh.

[@jpkclutch7780]

I realization I made about 3 months ago is that supporting the legalization of gay marriage was just opening the gates for this crazy radical distorting of reality. Most conservatives won’t admit this, but it was a mistake bc the radical lgbtq activists were never going to settle for just 1 thing. It’s human nature to want more power after you get a taste of it. Power can corrupt anyone and the people who think they otherwise become even more authoritarian.

[@kigen6400]

As an LGBTQ Conservative....both of you said the very thing I always used to fear about Gays having the right to marry. Not out of homophobia or hatred towards my own but, because I know the next generation will cause social mayhem. Because they don't care about basic rights, they want to control people and guilt them for not agreeing with them. It was never about rights.

[@strongwolf8534]

I'm a left leaning centrist. I support gay marriage and the right to be just as miserable as any straight couple because of all the legal crap attatched to the ancient tradition of selling your sexuality in exchange for lifelong social/economic support. But I agree, the social justice croud took this and ran, now they are just as anti-science as anyone on the far right. It's ridiculous.

[@reliancepropertyservices8288]

I thought transgender was somebody who was trapped in the wrong body. 1 soul in the wrong body, the fact the definitions change all the time on this subject is enough for me to call bullshit.

[@Undertak2000]

anyone remember when they laughed at Dennis Prager for suggesting that the left say men menstruate as totally ridiculous? oof.

[@Deuteromis]

Who

[@burdonwilliams]

You are correct.

[@josh18230]

@@Deuteromis Shut up and cope.

[@iannonya5282]

Because prager was coming at it from a place of hatred, he deserves to be laughed off of every stage he enters

[@breadmoth6443]

@@iannonya5282 but he was still correct so..........

[@breadmoth6443]

1950s: "Wow I bet in 60 years or so, we will be colonizing the moon!" 2020s: "I don't know what gender I am, and I am non-conforming 2 spirit, non-binary person of color, transracial - unicorn..."

[@SilentMott]

Sad truth, we used to look at the stars, now all we do is stare at the mirror.

[@breadmoth6443]

@@SilentMott what you are describing is decadence and self-importance - every period in history has had it, but it hasn't been so pronounced as today I suppose. We have all this potential, instead - we are listening to a segment of population that is literally 1% or less, and indulging in their stupidity/fantasies. There is a reason why I agree with the addage: "lunatics running the asylum."

[@sevenidols607]

I just learned what two spirit is. I learn things on Bill Maher.

[@ncorp2668]

It's also deeply homophobic. It was mostly used to reference towards gay men to imply they weren't man enough...in other words, rigid gender roles.

[@JohnWhiteHere]

What does it mean? I couldn’t force myself to sit through this nonsense

[@landonkare670]

Its kinda scary how these new identities(very different from being gay or trans) are getting no push back.

[@ncorp2668]

@@zachhayes9512 The ONLY reason any of them bring up 2 spirit is merely the fact that it's an aspect of non-European culture, and if they can somehow connect their completely different ideology to race, then they can utilize it as a shield for anything. The strict adherence expected for gender ideology within Western culture juxtaposed with the extreme cultural relativism they apply to any non-Western culture is an amazing feat of mental gymnastics...at the highest levels. Nevermind the fact that Iran subsidizes SRS as a means of conversion therapy for gay men who would otherwise be killed there. Nevermind the fact that the main people pushing this ideology are white rich lobbyists. Nevermind the fact that most POC do not support this ideology. So they have to resort to a non-universal idea held by some Native Americans....because no one else believes in it.

[@hyacinthlynch843]

@@ncorp2668 Spot on. 👍

[@tippy195]

Having the choice to have an abortion is a FREEDOM

[@feralearthworm3044]

I took off my earbuds before he could explain two spirited, just so I don't have whatever BS that is running around in my head. This crap is getting old.

[@ncorp2668]

Something tells me Dan Savage, a gay man, would not live up to what he says in terms of "transmen" (i.e. females) dating him. It's OK to de-center women out of their own issues, as long as it doesn't effect him personally, right Dan?

[@jt7638]

What is your point? Aesthetic preferences do happen. I do not think he would date certain bears either.

[@EastSide-qc5oy]

What are you talking about? Are you saying in order for Dan (or any gay man) to be consistent in a belief system that supports trans people, he would have to be open to dating a woman who transitions? Otherwise he’s a hypocrite? If that’s what you are saying, it’s an utterly preposterous statement.

[@ncorp2668]

@@jt7638 Same SEX attraction isn't "aesthetics". You're demonstrating exactly my point about gender identity ideologues and their conflict with gay people.

[@jt7638]

@@ncorp2668 dude. I am not getting into a semantics banter with you. Who you want to date or not is up to you. If you like men and want certain parts you may or may not want to date trans people. If you expect to police that - oh boy! Are you going to really be wasting your time! 😂

[@ncorp2668]

@@EastSide-qc5oy How's it preposterous that i expect Dan Savage to be consistent in his logic? Either they're men or they aren't. But of course, Dan knows they're not actually men...in terms of what effects HIM. But if it's de-centering women out of their own issues...then all of a sudden it's "mEn gEt pReGnAnT 2!!!" It's absurd. Dan Savage is an absurd man, and he can take his metaphysical gender theism with him.

[@MsKim14]

I've got to agree with Bill Maher here. I respect that people have differing views on abortion, but I don't think that it should be illegal. I think that Texas law is scary, with no exception even for rape. I thought that when AOC was on Anderson Cooper's show she did a good job of explaining how "six weeks pregnant" means that a woman is only two weeks late on her period, so most often the six weeks would have elapsed before a woman even knows she's pregnant. But AOC lost me when she said "pregnant people," etc. Personally, I always thought that the pro-choice argument when I was growing up that "only women can get pregnant" was a powerful one. I do feel that men can never truly understand because it will never happen to them. So unfortunately, feminists are undermining what was a good argument with all of this talk that "not only women can get pregnant." I know that the right is having a field day with it, and it does make people on the pro-choice side look ridiculously out of touch with reality if they are saying that men can get pregnant, too.

[@twells138]

"And ladies, to be fair to us, I also believe that if you decide to have the baby, a man should not have to pay. That’s fair. If you can kill this motherf---er, I can at least abandon them." - Dave Chappelle

[@72marshflower15]

Ironically, right wing linguistic eugenics has everyone speaking to a vernacular that’s utterly opposite of what’s occurring. I know it’s odd, and I’m still working out the variables on this particular segment of objective political theory, but abortion isn’t pro-liberal/collectivist, but is individualistic in nature, ie to take priority of the individual self. Caring for others, ie the unborn, would then be collective ie liberal.. I don’t want you to freak out on the implications that you think may be there. It’s something I noticed some years ago and it needs to be sorted before the fight ahead if we are ensure women’s/human rights. The right wing isn’t “prolife”, just probreeding. Actual prolife means ALL LIFE, not just human life..

[@72marshflower15]

@@twells138 ironic, but still on the map

[@AbcAbc-sp1od]

@@72marshflower15 "...right wing linguistic eugenics..." Lol, wth are you talking about?

[@nanszoo3092]

@@72marshflower15 exactly. I am pro-choice collectively, anti-abortion personally. I don't want to tell someone else how to live their life, but I personally chose to carry all my children who were "unplanned" and not exactly convenient. Making the choice for myself allowed me to hang in during the really tough times better (I believe) than if I had been forced to have them. I would counsel anyone close to me to work it out and carry the baby to term if possible while supporting them any way I could. But I have never dropped any of my friends or acquaintances because they chose abortion and tried to help them deal with that choice as well. I get the sanctity of life argument, but the bigger travesty IMO is all the children living in poverty and/or homeless, all the children living with people who are so addicted or downtrodden that the child becomes a source of income or free labor to them or worse, all the children living with abuse of any kind, and all the other unwanted or orphaned children currently in our foster and care systems. We need to take care of the children we already have before we try to tell people how to handle their unplanned pregnancies. All I see republicans doing is making it harder for the families who are in the worst situations while standing on a supposedly higher moral ground that is so far from the reality of life in our country. Children die every day. If we believe in God, do we really believe that aborted children are any less in God's hand than children who died at 2 years old?

[@cwkay6847]

The abortion issue is not about controlling woman, it’s about protecting human life

[@thaddeust.thirdiii736]

This was the most disgusting and confusing dialogue I’ve ever heard

[@realgena1]

Dan Savage was the best part of this.

[@jonasabry9099]

I agree with Bill Maher, all of this identity politics is taking away from common sense. And I'm not surprised at Dan Savage having a bad take as usual.

[@CDREtrev]

There’s nothing wrong with Dan’s take on this. He’s actually quite diplomatic and spot-on. Bill has a smartphone in his pocket. Why is he sitting there waiting for someone to explain to him what a trans man is or how their bodies work?

[@anna_L_N]

Aboriginal people believe that being photographed steals your sole. Is this another important point we’re missing?

[@johnblain1474]

I knew 2021 was gonna be absurd but I didn’t have “actually, abortion isn’t a woman’s issue” on my list of new horse shit I would have to listen to.

[@elmarko9051]

Or you could try educating yourself...I hear people do it all the time.

[@bjensen]

I'd love to know when Dan first learned two-spirit. The SJWs (I don't think Dan is a SJW, but he travels in those circles). act like something they learned about 5 minutes ago should now be known by everyone, and if you don't go by the new rules, you are a terrible person. All the while forgetting that they used to think/speak the same way moments ago.

[@AbcAbc-sp1od]

Also, they constantly move the goal posts too. It's really a form of controlling the conversation.

[@CactusThorn]

Weren’t women chattel in most Native American tribes? And wasn’t Sacajawea won in a card game? Maybe two spirits wasn’t a such a complement back in the day. Maybe it’s just being reinvented for some pretend kumbaya new age malarkey.

[@ncorp2668]

It was invented in the 90s and it was highly homophobic and upheld rigid gender roles... so yes, you're on point.

[@CactusThorn]

@@ncorp2668 1990s? I was thinking more like 1890s or even 1790s! Too funny.

[@kittykatz8837]

The guest literally just said that the Founding Fathers had good reasons to be cancelled. Wow.

[@maxmustermann9587]

One of humans greatest ability is to abstract. It helps to see the general picture. But using abstractions when looking into the detail will never work.

[@Illlium]

It's like the left is living in upside-down land. They seem to think that finding five people that don't fit a standard is somehow proof that a standard is bad. I guess they never heard the expression "an exception proves the rule".

[@maxmustermann9587]

@@Illlium _"It's like the left is living in upside-down land."_ - This has nothing to do with _left_ or _right._ It is common practice to look for exceptions to find the flaws in ones assumption, rule or law.

[@Illlium]

@@maxmustermann9587 This video is about democrats throwing a shit-fit over something. How is this not a characteristic of the left? The right is not doing that, unless you can prove me wrong with some examples. Republicans are actually the ones abstracting - extrapolating a living person to the fetus. Looking into the details in this issue is what democrats are doing. I hate both camps equally, just so we're on the same page.

[@xaspirate8060]

@@Illlium Nope. It no longer exists. To listen to SJWs pontificate on all of these non-Hetero classifications carrying equal weight within society is a prime example. the five people that you mentioned are now the equal of approx. 2.5 million hetros...just as an example. Actual ratios may vary in your neck of the woods. haha

[@Illlium]

@@xaspirate8060 These people exist and they have issues, but bringing them to a dogfight that's happening since decades and has basically nothing to do with them is so fucking stupid it puts Donald Trump to shame.

[@cassiemontgomery45]

"If men could get pregnant, then abortion would be a sacrament". I read this quote in a book years ago and wish I could give credit to it's author!

[@atrailerinthewoods]

DERRRRR

[@LoneYote1]

It’s oft used and totally unhelpful. That is exactly why I believe this is such a divisive topic that leads to rigid tribalism.

[@OmegaMouse]

@@LoneYote1 Who would have thought that making up some insane bullshit about how men are women would be unhelpful? Captain obvious over here.

[@LoneYote1]

@@OmegaMouse that isn’t even the topic of discussion.

[@danbarrett1789]

You vastly underestimate the amount of losers that exist

[@benjaminlackey8765]

I never seen abortion as trying to control a woman's body. I have always seen it as murdering a defenseless child. I understand that my viewpoints appear limited, and understand there are extremely rare circumstances that would prompt an individual to want an abortion such as rape and incest. What I don't understand is people killing a defenseless child because it is an inconvenience for themselves. That just seems evil to me. Again only my viewpoints, I can respect others viewpoints on the matter but I find them hard to understand.

[@cee119]

I respect your opinion and perspective. However, I think it is a bit limited because you stop yourself for going deeper. It is control its not what the person wants in their life (sort of like a Vax mandate). All children (born and unborn) are defenseless, but nobody is up in arms daily about poverty and lack of food or education or welfare after the child is born... not saying you in particular... but the same people that are against abortion are the same people who complain about the parents using government assistance to care for the child. So once the baby is born, it's no longer your problem, but when the baby is in the womb, you have an opinion? Does that make sense?

[@benjaminlackey8765]

@@cee119 Yes it makes total sense. I see from your perspective but it begs the question. Why is the system set up this way? I see myself as more of a conservative (close to center not the crazy far out ones) on the matter. I think that programs like living assistance is great to a degree as long as they are not abused. I myself am a single working Father of three and my wife takes care of the kids as 1/3 is special needs. We are on government assistance and couldn't make it without. The system itself needs to be re-worked all together so that something as beautiful as life doesn't have to be weighed by the inconvenience (for a lack of a better word) of poverty.

[@cee119]

@@benjaminlackey8765 The system is set up this way because of Capitalism is not what it appears to be. It preaches independence but it order for it to be successful it also needs poor people to stay poor and for the middle class to continue to be worker Bees. So certain things are put in place for survival, not upward mobility is only for a small percentage. The system isn't broken, it's working exactly how it's designed.

[@chibuezeunachukwu1162]

Plus how is having voter ID racist in intent?

[@Mdrnsamurai]

Dan Savage is such a coward... Sorry that everything hurts your feelings and everyone before you wasn't absolutely perfect.

[@ElisonJackson]

he was being mature, i thought. he disagreed with AOC largely

[@Mdrnsamurai]

@@ElisonJackson Sure but, the victimization of absolutely everything since the beginning of time is beyond ridiculous and completely unfair to view from a lens of today.