Against the Odds | Can Biovisionary Beat the Best Deck in Pioneer?

[@CardmarketMagic]

👽👹 Decklists: bit.ly/3rmHOqP

[@KapalaMTG]

Is there going to be a 100k special, when the silver playbutton arrives?

[@yotamfrenkel9445]

Can you please tell me what does the music that starts in 2:16 is repeating because I can't understand the voices with them talking, because I know that you don't know tha name of the music but I'm still searching for it

[@CardmarketMagic]

@@KapalaMTG I'm already working on the 100k behind the scenes video :) it'll be out on Tuesday

[@KapalaMTG]

@@CardmarketMagic yippey 🥳🥳

[@CardmarketMagic]

@@yotamfrenkel9445 I found it! :) kzbin.info/www/bejne/bXnTe4Vjed-pj7c

[@ammonaustin9081]

These Goldfish + Card market collabs have been S tier content

[@thelegend-sb6jt]

True

[@pandanometa]

Yes!

[@xipher5896]

yes

[@IHaveTearoutProblems-pc8sv]

Fr

[@spinakker14]

You've got to appreciate Carl's puns and humor. His best one in the video was when he retorted to Crim by saying "you talk a lot of smack for someone who's wearing a peepeepoopoo shirt"

[@ShakeItLittleTina]

The fact that he hit the Gene Wilder Willy Wonka pose too

[@healqq]

Carl's King impression is so natural, like they've born with it

[@pablodiaz2278]

Just one issue, clones cannot copy a friend they are entering with CoCo, they have to "see" the creature previously. Still had a exiler on the pool so could not even mattered or even been a worse line than the possible one, good job with the oods!

[@juanmanuelguevara1790]

Ramunap Ruins: Sacrifece a desert: Rammunap Ruins deals 2 damage to each opponent. So doesnt Target.

[@nitramreniar]

@@juanmanuelguevara1790 Yeah, there were quite a few mistakes in this video. Carl took the 2 damage off of the thoughtseize even though it fizzled due to Crim being hexproof (and as such becoming an invalid target); Crim didn't take some combat damage after leaving unblocked attackers when he had played the Surge of Salvation, even though it only prevents damage to creatures, not to the player; etc. Still probably lead to a far more interesting video, so whatever.

[@christopherreed8996]

Graveyard trespasser doesn't damage or target a permanent and could have pushed through the last damage.

[@stephanjuvik6266]

@@christopherreed8996 I didn't count the graveyards, but, yes, if there was a creature there to exile Carl would have had the game.

[@XenithShadow]

@@stephanjuvik6266 Carl had already one the game as someone said earlier the ruins deall damage to all opponents it doesnt target.

[@MRJazzygameplay27]

One of the main reasons I skip some Against the odds episodes is because I don't enjoy seeing MOL videos, but you guys are doing the lords work by bringing them into paper, as always one of the best MTG channels around!

[@JonnMcDude]

Agreed, unfortunately I can't get into the UI and low framerate animations of MTGO. I tried but I just can't, it is unfortunate because I'm sure many of Seth decks looks fun to watch.

[@andrewc_411]

I agree for the opposite reason. I don't like watching Standard or Historic on Arena, so I only tune into the MTGO Against the Odds 😅. Luckily paper content is better than both!

[@olafthemoose9413]

​@@andrewc_411*good well produced paper content

[@Lightning_Lance]

@@JonnMcDude I don't mind playing Magic Online, but it's honestly just ass for video content imo

[@thoticcusprime9309]

The UI is fine, you know you can use 720p or 1080, and full screen.

[@pedrojardim5773]

i'm sorry to be that guy, but ramunap ruins dont target, so surge dont work here (also if Carl attacked with the Trespasser, the trigger would win the game)

[@KaceTM]

lands aren't a color so damage isn't prevented. (excluding Dryad Arbor) Rakdos wins here unless their is some rule against misleading gameplay info.

[@pleravens]

It is a case of Each versus Target. The surge is powerless for both. End engagement.

[@tkalle1299]

@@KaceTMcolor doesn’t matter. Surge just protects creatures from damage, they kept forgetting that

[@elaguitas409]

Yeah crim was dead lol

[@GG-dt5hh]

Yeah, there were a lot of mistakes this episode. The fizzled Thoughtseize hitting Carl for 2, the misunderstanding of how Surge works, and a couple of visual ones, like the CoCo at 34:20 not having a Rise Reef in it.

[@lelandbatey]

I love Seth as a kind of "Q" giving an overview of the "equipment" (deck) that our protagonist is up against!

[@animationtime7265]

They took it down but it's back! I'm still very glad mtg goldfish and cardmarket are collaborating.

[@CardmarketMagic]

We uploaded the wrong version the first time 😅 and at the wrong time

[@animationtime7265]

​@@CardmarketMagicit's good that it's up at all.

[@JonnMcDude]

​@@CardmarketMagicehm, since I watched the wrong one any tip on what is different?

[@CardmarketMagic]

@@JonnMcDude the triggers at the side, like every time Sheoldred triggers, or when skyclave apparition exiles the chainwhirler. And then many other small things

[@MrDarkxenmo]

Surge of salvation only prevents damage to creatures at 31:10 only 2 creatures are blocked he could have blocked whit Elves but there would still be 3 damage to his life!

[@poiri]

19:24 Carl shouldn’t have taken 2 since thoughtseize never resolved

[@ergon1798]

No, Carl should have made himself reveal his hand and discard a nonland card, since thoughtseize says target player not target opponent. Edit: I am dumb

[@poiri]

@@ergon1798 sure, if Crim had cast Surge before Thoughtseize somehow, but that didn’t happen. Crim responded with the Surge and so Thoughtseize fizzled due to having an illegal target.

[@maximiliangunther9597]

​@@ergon1798thoughtsieze has an invalid target and fizzles

[@majordude83]

​@@ergon1798To​​ clarify why Carl didn't have to Thoughtseize himself: you choose the target player when you cast the spell, and the target can't change, so the spell fizzles after Surge makes the target become invalid. If you somehow cast Thoughtseize _after_ your opponent has Hexproof (or, for example, during a turn when The One Ring has given them "protection from everything"), you would have to choose yourself as the target.

[@JacoDeltaco]

true I did miss it ( I am more use to see that happen with veil of summer)

[@Jay-zt1pq]

I love how much chemistry Crim has with you guys, just an absolute delight to watch.

[@jozefkeresturi2139]

35:53 Couldnt you attack with Trespasser and kill Crim? It's loss of life not damage. ANd its not targeted.

[@Oceanz08]

thats what i was thinking! because its not Damage its life loss

[@11macedonian]

Crim wouldve blocked and his creatures had protection from red and black so he wouldn't have lost any

[@aeolus7762]

​@@11macedonianTrespasser triggers on attack, not on damage and there was a creature in a graveyard, he had Crim dead to rights without seeing the line.

[@jacobsweetser1878]

@@11macedonian No, Crim would still have lost since Trespasser is an attack trigger and doesn't really care about blockers

[@daikyy6789]

yea he could

[@Nathanael_Forlorn]

This was really good! The friendly banter, the little extra mile in the king outfit - and it being thrown out immediately, the jank vs meta deck rivalry and the really well implemented trigger reminders! High production, top personalities, would watch again.

[@CardmarketMagic]

That's really high praise :) thank you!

[@InquisitorSinCross]

Carl was so confused by Crim's deck that Sheoldreds morphed into Ashioks 😂

[@thesugareater8607]

Sheoldred of the Apocolypse -> Shotapoc -> Shaoc -> Ashiok

[@jackfrager2542]

Surge of Salvation doesn’t prevent damage to the player which would have been relevant. Additionally in game 3, even under surge, graveyard trespasser could have killed through the draining attack trigger

[@frix8773]

Even before that Ramunap Ruins both doesn't target, nor is it a red source (lands are colourless). Rakdos won this three different times in a row, but they kept misplaying.

[@CardmarketMagic]

Yeah I should have given a read to Surge of Salvation 😅 I just played it as The One Ring's etb but for everything

[@JacoDeltaco]

hey magic is hard and punt are part of the game🤷

[@zackestin1368]

@@frix8773 it being red or not doesnt matter bc the hexproof is what they thought it mattered about, but yea ramunap doesnt target.

[@DaveTheNoob]

This is some of the best produced gameplay content ive seen. so impressed. Entertained with great pacing but also its got visual clarity! Keep it up!

[@CardmarketMagic]

Thank you :) that's really kind of you to say!

[@untitled6087]

@@CardmarketMagic love you all.

[@lorenzobassi3082]

34:20 WILD RISEN REEF APPEARS OUT OF NOWHERE and that's so unintentional and yet so hilarious

[@theyonlycomeoutwhenitsquiet]

Thing is, despite misplays and miscommunications, this is a fantastic example of competitive versus brews gameplay. Also, I submit that the errors make it more relatable.

[@DerringerHK]

This was great. Crim fits so well with the crew, would love to see him come back for another visit to Berlin at some point :)

[@CardmarketMagic]

It's in the plans :)

[@MetalasOrc]

Every time Crim not picking the Elementals with CoCo when he has 2 RISEN REEFS hurt me 😂

[@Awsomeman328]

29:20 Glasspool Mimic would not be able to copy Risen Reef as it can only clone creatures that are already on the battlefield. Since they are both entering at the same time, Mimic can't see Reef as an option b/c Reef is not on the field yet at the time you would choose which creature to copy.

[@JacoDeltaco]

nope they see etch other when they enter. it a layer thing the copying happen before the trigger it a newbie traps it a hard rule to get your head around.

[@jeffdai269]

Ya this is a mistake, glasspool mimic ENTERS as a creature, and risen reef was not on the battlefield when the clone is entering. You can search up the rules. 7/1/2012: If Clone somehow enters the battlefield at the same time as another creature, Clone can’t become a copy of that creature. You may only choose a creature that’s already on the battlefield.

[@Reach_W]

​@@JacoDeltaco Unfortunately, you're wrong, or I guess actually right, but about the wrong thing. Clone effects like Glasspool Mimic's are replacement effects, which modify events as they occur. In this case, we're being asked to select a creature for Glasspool Mimic to enter as a copy of as it enters, and the only creature Crim controls is a Tangled Florahedron, as neither creature from Collected Company has entered the battlefield yet. Edit to add: To be clear, they do see each other enter, and so Risen Reef would see a Tangled Florahedron (another Elemental) enter and trigger appropriately. It's just that Risen Reef isn't a valid choice for the copy effect.

[@JacoDeltaco]

@@Reach_W oh yes it 'as it enter' not 'when it enter' I did miss read it does not come up often

[@SeleenShadowpaw]

i absoultely adore that the AKA text for seath actually writes out 'probably better known as saffron olive', as if the whole entire sentence is his actual nickname. I even read it in my head in the proper cadence and intonation. Wonderful video as always

[@lucaslopera8983]

Loving the amount of content you guys were able to put out with MTGGoldfish! Must've been all work and no play when Crim was over :D

[@aandylane]

One of the tensest but funniest matches I've ever seen. Thanks for the great content as always!

[@DayOfCasual]

Only tense because Crim for some freaking reason just ignores his Apparitions and Deputies of Detention that could wipe Carl's board.

[@r4g1ngph03n1x]

17:50 "Ashiok" lol 19:25 Thoughtseize fails to resolve, so no life will be lost. 23:15 Surge of Salvation doesn't prevent the damage that Chainwhirler would deal to the player. Pretty much all of game 3. A clone entering at the same time as another thing can't copy the thing that it entered with. Surge again doesn't prevent damage to players.

[@spliffi869]

Super entertaining video once again..! Love the double feature of Crim and Seth. Gives me life to see my 2 favorite Magic channels collab and harmonize so well.

[@jeffe2267]

"Bio break" lol love it 19:55

[@CDeVries]

That was a fantastic video! What fun! Please do more of these.

[@tsmangin]

One of the best videos yet from Cardmarket. My favorite channel for entertaining Magic gameplay. Collabing with Goldfish has been awesome!

[@CardmarketMagic]

I'm happy you enjoyed! :) is there anyone specific you'd like to see us collaborate with next?

[@tsmangin]

@@CardmarketMagic Limited Resources. Mystical Dispute. Deathsie. The Professor. Lords of Limited. Would love to see draft related content

[@kyleellis1825]

Would love to see a video of you guys doing a cube draft of community submitted cards. You could even tailor it to certain themes. - "Submit Alara /Ravnica/Theros/Homelands/Alpha/Unset cards" So you can get keywords focused on certain themes. Or doing Jumpstart of community packs. Get people to submit a 20card theme pack and mix and match them for some quick games.

[@AnonYmous-et4mz]

This was effing delicious. Thanks a lot to Carl and Crim, the Goldfish community and everyone who made this collab as it was. Everything was aweseome and I have my fingers crossed (or maybe am pressing my thumbs;)) to see at least one of you guys on Shuffle Up and Play this year

[@CardmarketMagic]

Haha we'd love to see an invitation for shuffle up and play 😅 I'm happy you enjoyed these videos. Is there anyone specific you'd like us to collaborate with next? :)

[@TheDehelle]

the mtggoldfish crossover is amongst the best content you ever created. make this a continuous series, please!

[@mrpoparq]

at 23:10 Crim still would have taken 1 damage from chainwhirler since it doesn't target Crim and surge of salvation only prevents damage to creatures. Not really relevant, but I think its fun to point it out. and at 35:00 Ramunap does not target so Crim should have died then, changing the outcome of the entire game. oops. Not trying to disparage your content, I love it! I just hope that pointing these things out will help prevent future mistakes. (:

[@Oceanz08]

it prevents damage from red and black sources.

[@Neo_Life]

@@Oceanz08 Only to creatures you control.

[@mrpoparq]

@@Neo_Life exactly what I was about to say.

[@tylerduncanson2661]

You took down the video when Karl said "you can give up now", and it took me a good 10 seconds to realize that the "This video is unavailable" message wasn't a gag for the video.

[@brianontiveros-kersch2412]

You can't put a clone and creature in from CoCo and have the clone copy the other creature

[@Jakerunio]

That rakdos list is fire. Feels like old Dominaria standard rakdos midrange with sheoldreds replacing the planeswalkers and some fables and thoughtseizes to beef it up.

[@ReederMG]

Crim's draws in that last game were real heart of the cards moments

[@Takasuart]

Ramunap Ruins doesn't target, it goes to each opponent, wouldn't it bypass hexproof? Btw all videos are complete fire, I'm loving the channel direction

[@CardmarketMagic]

Yeah I should have read surge of salvation 😅 Crim was so confident that it saved him there that I just took it for granted

[@OtherSideLLC]

Seriously Carl you've been crushing the thumbnails, the recent ones have been absolute 🔥🔥🔥

[@CardmarketMagic]

Thank you :D I've been really proud of them recently

[@OtherSideLLC]

@@CardmarketMagic the 40 Bolts one has been living in my head rent free

[@DrSiddha]

Feel so much affection for Seth, he is such a fun personality :)

[@CardmarketMagic]

He is :)

[@feastuponthecat]

I love this because it reminds me that I used to have a standard bio visionary deck back in the day. It was terrible, but I got 1 win with it and it was worth it. I was then dubbed the crazy deck guy a my lgs.

[@betabrett0223]

Crim looks like he been working construction for 8 hours after this match with all that sweat

[@midwesternviking_ttv2986]

Man that picture perfect finish was awesome. That was so much fun

[@lutz4820]

It was sooooo much fun watching you play. Thanks for the video!

[@CardmarketMagic]

I'm happy you enjoyed it :)

[@shieldgenerator7]

30:54 carl's reaction to another surge of salvation was hilarious

[@RoRoRoRonan]

Congrats on 100k, guys!! You really deserve it :D

[@CardmarketMagic]

Thank you for noticing :)

[@bobbyfortanely]

Rakdos Midrange is the best deck in the Pioneer format, eh? The true king of Pioneer is Mono-Green Devotion 👑

[@lorenzklug3354]

the frequency of good content is great. Every video is great content and you pull it off that there is just more coming. Great work!

[@CardmarketMagic]

Thank you :) that's nice of you to say

[@Gabriel64468]

35:50 Graveyard Trespasser gets around Surge of Salvation doesn't it? Cards in Graveyards aren't permanents, so they don't have hexproof, it deals the damage to each opponent instead of targetting one and Surge only prevents damage that is dealt to creatures, not damage that is dealt to the player.

[@chadjehebej2258]

Really nice meeting you Thoralf, thanks for the advice on modern and i really liked your Avatar Shirt 😍

[@toffel1612]

:) nice to meet you too! i hope you crush the modern tournament

[@empil98]

love the vid. but i might be wrong 29.30 he plays coco and hits a clone and risen reef. he cant copy risen reef with the clone

[@noahwarren8020]

Yeah because of coco having both creatures enter at the same time you aren’t allowed to clone a creature that is entering at the same time since you don’t control it yet.

[@fma0420]

You are correct. Because a clone effect is not an etb trigger, but rather one that causes it to enter the battlefield as something else, that something else must be on the battlefield by the time whatever is making the clone (in this case CoCo) resolves.

[@simonisphording]

Judge!

[@shervinnaimi3028]

At 21:19, Scrim should have put the Florahedron in play since it is an Elemental to get 2 potential draws, he may have been able to win that turn.

[@zurreal8087]

That final game was really something LOL These are fantastic! I’m so glad we got another!

[@shapied]

18:00 nice ashiok

[@CardmarketMagic]

Thank you!

[@Erik_Sjostrom]

I love these paper against the odds videos

[@jamespeake2606]

That opening track is one of my favourites, I always love the music but damn. I just want to listen to it.

[@naimyguy1622]

ain’t no way i’ve been brewing and changing this deck since 2018 this is truly a happy day

[@jerome8303]

Amazing collab, epic games. Against the Odds in paper rules. Moooooooore!

[@cameton_youtube]

Wooow, that was such a cool match up. Congrats Surge of Salvation! (and Seth and Crim I guess) :D

[@scottishcedar4750]

I didn't find any comment mentioning it, so I'll do it myself. Crim should've lost third game cause Chainwirler on 27:40 deals one damage to him. Surge only prevents damage to creatures while Chainwirler also doesn't target him. it says "each oponent"

[@Nr4747]

17:56: "My hand is 2 Ashioks." Are you sure, Carl, they look more like 2 Sheoldreds to me - but you're the person who does Magic-related things for a living, so I'll take your word for it ;-)

[@jacksonlittle5993]

40 minutes that flew by! Fun video! Holy cow, surge of salvation pulled some massive weight.

[@bricelory9534]

Loved this video! Keep the fun of paper Magic alive ❤

[@CardmarketMagic]

I'm happy you enjoyed it :)

[@ylktr]

So cool to see Biovisionary! I made a deck for that years ago, but it wasn't quite as good as this one. Mirrorweave definitely helped though.

[@marvingreat2826]

NEVER HAVE I BEEN SO ERALY ON MY FAVOURITE SHOW!!

[@CardmarketMagic]

Hello 👋

[@joshuabornschein466]

You guys should do a video where you guys take the best deck in a meta-i.e. commander, modern, standard pioneer any meta. And put it up against the deck that is of an opposite meta. For example, a top-tier, modern deck versus a top-tier pioneer deck. I think it would be interesting to see how the two stack up against each other.

[@arvidpersson9582]

That ending was amazing!

[@nidunha14]

Would love more pioneer gameplay content! I think pioneer is in a really interesting spot. Maybe with the Boros convoke deck?

[@corebinik243]

That king outfit reminds me of the burger king mascot.... But if he was on vacation and played mtg.

[@Donmegamuffin]

so many of those cocos Id have taken a tangled florahedron because its an elemental to trigger the risen reefs!

[@rinan5317]

At 29:20 Glasspool Mimic will not be able to copy Risen Reef since it's not yet on the battlefield. It will only see the dork. Also, the Surge will not prevent the damage to Crim.

[@abefaerber7994]

I love the hissing sound during the title card. It makes me feel like there's a gas leak 😊

[@TenPace]

A few mistakes in the rules but the video was so much fun that idc

[@tylerdibenedetto2641]

35:03 Ruins ends the game. you guys are good actors tho, and it made for a more dramatic finish.

[@Theyflower]

it's amazing seeing crim just thrown into the room while swag king carl is bing chilling. please get him a proper throne for next time ;)

[@kurtgrgelwrx8376]

omg Karl just sitting there dressed up and looking high and mighty is glorious

[@obsidiansiriusblackheart]

That Surge of Salvation was crazy!

[@keckerstrom]

This was a phenomenal video to watch! Well done fellas!

[@CardmarketMagic]

Thank you :)

[@ahuman7027]

OMG, love so much seing you guys playing :P What a nice collab!

[@ReyosBlackwood]

19:25 Judge here. Because Crim was hexproof, the thoughtseize had no legal target, when a spell that targets has no legal targets it is removed from the stack instead of resolving, meaning you would NOT lose 2 life from it.

[@jysonberrington3131]

Great fun to watch but there were a few things that should have been double checked. The 1st is that the clone could not copy the risen reef as they both entre at the same time and a clone has to choose before it hits hte battle field (29:19). The other thing was that Surge of Salvation only prevents damage to creatures, not to players (31:10) Should have lost 6 life here. Also goblin chainweirler does not taget so should have still taken 1 for the etb here after surge of salvation (27:43)

[@bluexco]

This video was amazing! I love it!

[@ReyosBlackwood]

29:19 Judge here. Glasspool Mimic can only enter as a copy of something already on the battlefield, not as a copy of something entering the battlefield with him. The only legal thing to copy at that point is Tangled Floralhedron.

[@ReyosBlackwood]

23:13 Judge here. Crim would still take 1 damage from Goblin Chainwhirler. It's not a targeting effect so it gets through the hexproof, and Surge of Salvation only prevents damage to Crim's Creatures.

[@chimpmasterflex]

Truly a rollercoaster of emotions.

[@drdumpling8898]

I love all the crossovers with mtg goldfish :D

[@user-fu7no1xu5b]

I'd love to see a crossover between cardmarket and Rarran, a hearthstone content creator who's been getting into MtG. I think it would bring a lot of new viewers to your channel too!

[@CardmarketMagic]

Rarran is actually who we are planning to contact next!

[@nedcurfman3486]

OH MY GOD! *JAMIN COMES IN FROM BEHIND WITH THE FOLDING CHAIR!!*

[@CardmarketMagic]

Don't spoil the twist for everyone 🤫

[@user-fu7no1xu5b]

I love how Carl is just permanently in his King outfit now

[@CardmarketMagic]

If I could wear it in the game store, I would 😅

[@KnicKnac]

That was a great game. Good stuff. Crim fits with you all too great video

[@Michael.032]

29:37 - Risen Reef isn't already on the battlefield when Glasspool Mimic looks for a creature to copy, so Glasspool wouldn't be able to copy Risen Reef here. Edit: Same thing at 32:04

[@MartinJohns]

Yes, please more Cardmarket/Goldfish crossover please :)

[@piotrkraska6144]

Love this collab, both cardmarket and mtgoldfish make great videos. And as always instalike for Jamins face( even if it was just a peek-a-Jamin xd) ^^

[@Dwaggiemorph]

Wow, that was a sweaty game! (pun intended) :P

[@zealcrux]

How do these thumbnails keep getting better!? 🔥

[@zealcrux]

35:25 we need this as a reaction gif

[@benistoneman9737]

This is so awesome I love playing biovisionary. It is crap but so so much fun when it randomly works

[@Modest7787]

17:55 he sure has a lot of” ashiok” lol

[@shieldgenerator7]

36:04 that was an intense third game wow

[@Crunchatize_Me_Senpai]

I always thought, in these shows that have the intermittent interviews, everyone played the whole game first, and then watched it after and commented what they were thinking at the time. But this is the second time on here someone has said, during the game, “in the interview I just said this!” Do y’all actually step away from the table, record these in real time, and then go back to the game? That sounds very awkward lol.

[@CardmarketMagic]

We're currently working on a behind the scenes that we'll release next Tuesday:)