Aircraft Turn Performance and Flaps

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Hope you like the educational video! Feel free to suggest topics below! Follow me on Twitch: www.twitch.tv/adamtheenginerd

[@J7Handle]

Had a duel once between my Yak-9UT and a 190 Anton (I think it was an A-5 of some sort). We got into a flat turning engagement, and both of us popped our landing flaps out. To my surprise, he began outturning me, classic Anton flaps, and Yak flaps are pretty useless for turn radius. So I actually raised my flaps, and used the increase in acceleration to climb. The 190 was still catching me in the turn, but by the time he was coming around to my 6, I had already gained a sizeable altitude advantage over him, and after a series of stall maneuvers, I was able to start booming and zooming him. It's not often you gain the energy advantage in a flat turn engagement, lol.

[@J7Handle]

Btw, when you calculated the turn radius, you forgot to subtract the vertical component of lift. At speeds near the stall speed, the increase in turn radius is quite substantial.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

@@J7Handle I did, I said it in the video. It's a 5% increase at sustained turn speed without flaps for the P51D30.

[@bubbleboi3422]

Stock plane vs spaded plane

[@keelhauling]

Fantastic stuff, thanks so much! Topic wish list: 1) best practices re: conservation/conversion/generation of energy, especially variations in planes. [How to get the most out of an airspawn, common ways people are sloppy with energy, vert/horizontal energy retention, etc] 2) how on earth mixture is modeled in game. 3) niche, but ideal climb profiles for the 163/ki200, since I’d imagine getting into thinner air faster might be worth climbing while still sub-Vy early on?

[@DEFYN]

Turning circles in peace Cassidy: I am about to end this man's whole career

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Lmao! Had to extend away.

[@Dunsay]

Much appreciated! o7

[@DEFYN]

@@Dunsay bet you came running after you saw that

[@Dunsay]

@@DEFYN Wait. Is running _towards_ things an option?

[@DEFYN]

You have to run from something to run towards the other :^)

[@doch.8039]

Fowler flaps are love, Fowler flaps are life

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I agree!

[@mr.abrams9885]

Yes. I have acquired more *KNOWLEDGE*

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Most important thing!

[@penclaw]

Just like dat dude once said: kzbin.info/www/bejne/rJrZpGaZZ8qHjpY

[@JonManProductions]

(Inhales) NEERRRRDDDD!!! No seriously though I've been watching these to help out with concepts for my stuff, loving these videos dude.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Nerd indeed haha. Glad you love them!

[@GregsAirplanesandAutomobiles]

Thanks Adam, nice job.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Thanks Greg!

[@huntermurphy2148]

As someone in love with the P47D-28 and 47M. I am also in love with its flaps. Pull into a turn above 500kph, bleed some speed in that turn, pop combat flaps and bam you just made a 109 pilot shit himself.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Yeah they do seem quite effective.

[@stalinium4769]

I love dogfighting 109s in my p47 . Unless they do that spiral bs ahahaha

[@huntermurphy2148]

@@stalinium4769 Plenty of people wondering how a P47 was mixing it up with 109s

[@stalinium4769]

Hunter Murphy i only do it in ground rb

[@huntermurphy2148]

@@stalinium4769 I do it in Air RB if i feel confident enough. Theres plenty of Kurfurst drivers that panic when they cant turn inside you

[@dasflieger3103]

"stay useful", nice quote m8

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I agree!

[@rasec017g2]

Perhaps this is the kind of content that KZbin needs to Support. What a fucking master. Greetings from México.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Hahaha thanks for the praise! Hopefully I'm diverse enough.

[@major_kukri2430]

I love these engineering videos. I study physics and watching these concepts get put to use is so cool. I hope you have more lined up.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Same! I do! You can suggest topics as well.

[@mariopopovici6948]

Hi Adam, can you make a video on how to manually control the engine corectly. Thx, awsome video!!👌

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I'll make one one day.

[@mariopopovici6948]

AdamTheEnginerd ok thx, and that was a quick response😂

[@soyderiverdeliverybeaver8941]

@@AdamTheEnginerd please explain mahneto and mixer

[@martijn9568]

@@soyderiverdeliverybeaver8941 I'm not Adam, but magnetos ignite the fuel in the cylinders of the engines. Most aero engines have 2 magnetos per cylinder, mostly there for redundancy. In the real world pilots test the magnetos before flight, by first only using the first group in a run up and then the second and always fly with both on at the same time in a normal situation. These are things you don't have to worry about, as War Thunder doesn't really model magnetos. Mixture is what you use to keep the engine running at the optimum air fuel ratio (mixture). This is something you don't really have to worry about as most aircraft in War Thunder have an supercharger, delivering a consistent air pressure to the engine. War Thunder doesn't model mixture for most aircraft in the game, but there are some in which it's modelled

[@soyderiverdeliverybeaver8941]

@@martijn9568 thanks, i wonder why is the a6m2 unflyable with manua engine controls

[@gareginnzhdehhimself]

This video will help me study for my aerospace engineering finals! Thanks!

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

My pleasure!

[@LastWish90]

6:39 and the P-51 D-30 is the ideal test subject because of it's high flap rip speed Ta-152, hold my Führer

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Haha that would work too.

[@zrspangle]

*Laughs in F8F Take Off Flaps*

[@clankplusm]

*Coughs in Starfighter*

[@Lukos0036]

Adam: "A five yearold can do this!" Me with dyscalculia: *sweats nervously*

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Haha!

[@iAmGhostly313]

I was actually surprised to find out that flaps don’t always help. I always just assumed that flaps=better turn time.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Always good to know more!

[@koshersalt3414]

I watch these videos right as I'm about to sleep since they're so relaxing lol

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Haha don't they require a big brain to understand?

[@samuellatta6774]

This is the first time i heard your voice instead of having to read the titles. In my opinion it is much better this way.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

You've missed a big amount of good videos then.

[@samuellatta6774]

@@AdamTheEnginerd quite possible, im new to your channel

[@appa609]

That R_min expression is simplified because you're assuming all the lift goes to turning. Of course a horizontal turn requires you maintain altitude as well, so you also have to satisfy: def k = 1/2 C_L A rho k v^2 cos(theta) = mg k v^2 sin(theta) = mv^2/R k^2 v^4 = m^2g^2 + m^2v^4/R^2 You get R = mv^2/sqrt(k^2 v^2 - g^2m^2) If we call your solution R0 = m/k then the full solution is R = R0/sqrt(1-(gm/kv^2)^2) The correction factor 1/sqrt(1-(gm/kv^2)^2) is about 1.038 for your P-51 turn test (sustained 3.7 g's means kv^2/gm = 3.7). This is almost precisely the observed difference between the "theoretical" and "experimental" values. I don't think War Thunder actually models tail surface downforce explicitly. I expect if you went back and tried it with a canard you'll find the same thing.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

3:10 I manually corrected the data to put the theory and the experimental on even ground by assuming a 72 degree bank angle. I'm 95% sure WT has downforce modeled for its sum of forces on the aircraft. A canard aircraft should turn better than what just the wings would predict, and a conventional aircraft should turn worse than what just the wings would predict. Might do a canard related video one day.

[@appa609]

@@AdamTheEnginerd Ah I didn't catch that. Then you're probably right that the downforce is modeled. Would be cool to see the canard.

[@DoubleA44]

Very instructive, even for a fellow aeronautical engineering student (I never bothered to do the math to check if turn radius was actually a function of speed). Keep up the good vids.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Thanks, I will!

[@jasonkitten5961]

Thanks for all your vids; I enjoy them. In detailed interview on 109 lair with German 109 ace Franz Stigler (pg 6) on 109 lair ( should be required reading of all WT fans) he said he never ever used flaps in combat only takeoff and landing. So in real life using flaps wasn't the case except with maybe a couple of Japanese fighters. Yes it does make a difference in game though.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

My pleasure! Yeah flaps weren't used very often in combat. In game they are used very often.

[@patriot4048]

Top ten things to watch while in quarantine, also Adam FW 190A video when pls: from your friendly neighborhood wehraboo

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I agree! It's on my list!

[@eldo5023]

Damn the red tails manouver again! 7:37

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Nah that's just a rudder flip, Red Tails was another universe altogether.

[@skeetless]

you have replied to all of the comments i've seen, impressive..

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Indeed ;).

[@soyderiverdeliverybeaver8941]

Amazing video. I didnt know doferent flaps mattered this much

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Thanks! Indeed!

[@hdl897]

I was asking on WT's forums how do flaps affect the turn speed when you uploaded this video 😄. Perfect timing ! But there's one thing I didn't understand, it's the last thing you wanted to demonstrate with your two last graphs. What do we have to understand ? (I heard that you were Canadian so if you can explain me in french it would be perfect 😀)

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Nice! Ce que je dis c'est que les flaps améliorent le turn time dans le court terme, mais fait perdre plus de vitesse plus rapidement. À long terme, sans flaps le P51 tourne mieux qu'avec flaps. C'est ça que montrent les graphes à gauche et à droite.

[@hdl897]

@@AdamTheEnginerd euh mais tu avais démontré dans ta vidéo au début que le p51 tournait plus vite sans flaps qu'avec de toutes façons non ? Alors ce n'est que pour les grandes vitesses qu'il tourne mieux avec flaps du coup ? C'est valable pour tous les avions ? (=à grande vitesse, on tourne plus vite avec flaps que sans ?)

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

@@hdl897 À une même vitesse, flaps fait tourner toujours mieux. Cependant, flaps fait perdre la vitesse plus rapidement, donc à long terme pas avoir utilisé des flaps aurait été mieux.

[@wendywalsh5220]

@@AdamTheEnginerd Je suis en retard dans la discussion, mais merci de l'explication en français (BTW tu viens de quelle province ?)

[@CountArtha]

AdamTheEnginerd has a _VOICE_ ???

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Been years since I've had a voice yes.

[@RiseofEnder]

AdamTheEnginerd good response lol

[@creomercurief208]

Yooo, thats so cool. Im learning physic and playing WT, but never had idea how to right use flaps. That little bit hard to understand cuz im from Russia, where we have not good eng teachers, but it is still understandable for me

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Glad you understood!

[@andreviana5115]

Hey Adam, could you do a tutorial on the other kinds of flaps? and perhaps in jets too?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

What do you mean by that?

[@andreviana5115]

@@AdamTheEnginerd in this video you showd us 2 types of flaps, the ones on the P38 and the ones on the P51, i was asking if you could show us the same thing on the other 2 types of flaps with 2 other different planes, like for examples the fw190s and the yaks, on the second question i was asking for how it works in jets because they also have different flaps from each others of course but that means that some jets benefit a lot from flaps while others do not and i want to know wich ones do As of now i know the P38 benefits a lot from flap usage while the P51 doesn t that much, it was just if you could show us on different planes

[@tolgapamukcu6442]

ı was following a bomber to end of map then ı did hear a voice "stay useful"

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

And you changed your course?

[@tolgapamukcu6442]

@@AdamTheEnginerd it was too late

[@firmaneffendi2801]

Imagine yourself playing SB in 109E and you need put landing flaps do deflect your shot to hit 2 bandits under your nose in 1 cicle fight. Thats the reason I love SB

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I find the concept of SB nice, but I don't think my eyes could handle looking for dots continuously.

[@firmaneffendi2801]

@@AdamTheEnginerd I only restrict 4h gameplay a day, because when I spend more than that, I ended up flying reckless and lost my situational awarness. A big respect to real ww2 pilots. My stamina can't even endure that even the fact that I sit comfy without G-force. At the end of the day, I go to play 1 match in RB or AB to refreshed and then go to sleep ;)

[@TheDorac1]

Very insightful! Thanks Adam!

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Thanks, my pleasure!

[@mathieulouis8283]

Hi can you make a video on manual engine control?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I will one day.

[@diegomgamer4604]

like is being smashed, congratulations again, keep it up!!

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Thanks, I will!

[@lynizie-8489]

now i can say to my teacher that playing game makes me good at physic

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Yes you can.

[@Cthight]

Yes and physics helps you getting better at a game. So its win win.

[@SynapticTransmission]

Thank you very much for this, Adam! Terrific stuff - even if you're not a WT player.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Thanks mate!

[@StealthySparky]

Cool. Cela m'a fait revoir plein de truc que j'avais oublié ... j'ai du mal avec les équations (-_-) Mais du coup si l'angle d'inclinaison est inférieur à 90° (et qu'on grimpe ou plonge en tournant) est-ce que la vitesse reste sans effet sur le rayon et sur le temps au tour (à part son effet sur la gouverne de profondeur) ? Tu l'as déjà dit je crois mais je m'en rappelle plus, l'overlay affiche bien les données du jeu en temps réel (localhost), c'est ça ? Les flight model datafiles sont localisés dans les dossiers du jeu et lisible en simple texte avec notepad etc. ou il faut faire quelque chose pour les rendre lisibles ? J'aimerais utiliser les équations de la vidéo pour calculer le rayon et le temps au tour de certains avions (notamment les P-47 et FW 190 Anton et Dora) mais sans les valeurs utilisées par le jeu ... Juste pour être sûr : lors d'un virage vu que les ailes de l'avion ne sont plus à plat, la gravité revient en jeu et c'est pour cela que l'avion perd un peu d'altitude (dans un virage à plat), c'est ça ? Et aussi, dans le cas d'un avion est-ce que l'inertie de l'objet/force centrifuge on un effet ? Et si non, est-ce que c'est tout simplement dû au la portance produite par les ailes de l'avion ? (beaucoup de question, désolé ^^)

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

La vitesse va juste avoir un effet si tu dois contrer ton poids avec une partie de la portance. La vitesse a toujours un effet sur le temps de tour, ton turn time va diminuer si la vitesse augmente jusqu'à ce que t'arrives à ton control stiffening speed. Ouais temps réel du local host. Il faut faire quelque chose pour les rendre lisibles, tu peux suivre ces instructions: www.reddit.com/r/Warthunder/comments/8nq70p/tutorial_how_to_datamine_or_how_i_learned_to_stop/ Dans un virage à plat, les ailes ne sont pas parfaitement à 90 degrés. Dans l'exemple du P51, je dis que les ailes sont à 72 degrés pour contrer la gravité, ce qui augmente le rayon de 5%. C'est pour ne pas perdre d'altitude pendant le tour. C'est juste la portance qui fait tourner.

[@StealthySparky]

​@@AdamTheEnginerd Ok merci. J'avais jamais fait gaffe mais l'overlay/localhost indique le taux de monté en temps réel, du coup c'est assez simple de trouver la vitesse optimale de climb ! Dommage que je n'ai pas de deuxième écran -_- Cela m'aurait été utile en ce moment en jouant mes P-47s et P-38s. Au niveau de ma dernière question, si j'ai bien compris l''inertie de l'avion/force centrifuge lors d'un virage est contrée par sa portance (pour pouvoir tourner) ? Je n'ai pas trouvé de Data Sheets sur le forum du jeu pour le P-38L-1 chinois du coup je me demandais, ses performances sont-elles similaires au L-5 américains ? Sur le wiki du jeu (aux infos discutables), il lui mette un setting du compresseur différent à haute altitude, mais à part ça il à l'air d'être pareil.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

@@StealthySparky Ah dans ce sens là, ouais la force centrifuge est contrée par la portance. Je crois qu'ils sont identiques, bien que je sente une légère différence mais bon.

[@danielegerussi7453]

I love this kind of videos

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Same!

[@noahmorgan6773]

Keep these up! Very entertaining and educational!

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Thanks, I will!

[@pranavarvind4281]

So turn performance depending on ER is why a Ta can outturn a Spitfire at altitude. Now I get it.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

LF perhaps, Griffon Spitfires would require like 9km of alt, or appropriate flap use.

[@sinani210]

Surely you have an NDA that prevents you from revealing these kinds of industry secrets. With every video, my competitive advantage diminishes :P.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I haven't signed anything of that nature ;). You'll only notice a difference if many people watch my videos. It's a bit like herd immunity, it won't make a noticeable difference if only 1% of the population is immune.

[@SirEpifire]

Smarter folks in RB but I doubt you'll see anyone quoting from, "The Book of Adam" in AB. 👌

[@wanoumars]

Excellent stuff, thank you!

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

You're very welcome!

[@chris_hisss]

Let's flap right into the comment section for some appreciation time! Well done!

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Haha thanks Chris! You're binging em!

[@chris_hisss]

@@AdamTheEnginerd I just went on this huge tangent, I searched up fowler flaps, had no idea that had been around since the 20s, I was under the impression that maybe the creator of the KI-43 was the inventor, as it used a "butterfly" type I guess, but it wasn't learned about fowler, learned about the ki 43. Tested it in game, and did you know they aren't on the ki-43-3? Kind of a bummer but I guess it's value wasn't as needed compared to production costs at that point. Found out the leading edge flaps were invented by Handley page in the 20's too! I always thought that was a Messerschmidt thing from the 109. Also since I watched Greg's recent video about the P-38 I understand what made the K the K and have been test flighting it to get a better handle on what it can and can't do. Considering a few of your videos focus on it and especially the reversal video just blew my mind on what it could do!

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

@@chris_hisss Oh yeah flaps and slats are old stuff. The "automatic" slats of the Bf109 are a Messerschmidt thing though.

[@joseemiliorangeltrejo2327]

Adam, can you help me on how to put on my landing flaps without lowering the gear,

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Increase flap key bind.

[@Agent-ic1pe]

What do you think about popping flaps only at the top of loops and then retracting them during the bottom of the loops, or vice versa?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Hard to say. Sounds good in theory.

[@ferrarisuper]

Hi, why radial engines performance is usually lacking at high altitude than liquid cooled engines? Why p47s engine is an exception?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Hmm that's not really a rule. In fact, I'd say there's no relation between inline/radial and altitude performance. Look at all the Russians.

[@ferrarisuper]

AdamTheEnginerd well, the yaks outperforms at altitude the la5s/la7s, and, even if altitude performance of their liquid cooled engines is below average, a yak9u still outperforms a fw190 at 6000m

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

@@ferrarisuper Yeah, but too general a statement.

[@ferrarisuper]

AdamTheEnginerd what determines high altitude performance loss difference on 2 aircrafts? Only the supercharger set up?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

@@ferrarisuper Mostly yeah.

[@Sunshrine2]

Pretty please, would you do some more testing on more say... popular planes? Spitfires? P-47? Tu-152? Fw-190? It would be awesome! I would gladly help with that!

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Don't need to test when you have the files ;).

[@alihammad6318]

Ta-152H meme flaps are best flaps. Nothing like combat flaps at 700 km/h. Though they reduce pitch down performance a good amount!

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Haha and a very high lift increase!

[@alihammad6318]

@@AdamTheEnginerd it's fun seeing griffon spit pilots mad at me for outturning them as they were doing a 1 circle fight for solid 5 minutes and then I minengeschoss'ed their plane out of existence

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

@@alihammad6318 Lol yup.

[@wolfhussar1190]

Hello! I was the one who asked on Twitter about the little chart thingie with all the different bits of info you have in the upper left-hand corner in most of your videos. I was wondering what it was and how I could pull it up

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

It's called the "local host". How to access the "local host": You need to be running War Thunder or it won't work! Option 1: on the same computer that is running WT: -Type localhost:8111/ in the address bar and press enter and voila. Option 2 (which also works on the computer that runs WT): -Type Your_IP_Address:8111/ where you replace "Your_IP_Address" by your IP Address (192.168.X.XXX) in the address bar and press enter and voila, you can look at the characteristics on another device while flying. But, I use this now and it's better: forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/483838-warthunder-real-time-information/

[@wolfhussar1190]

@@AdamTheEnginerd Thanks a bunch! That's gonna make fleshing out climb angles and speeds so much easier with new planes. Also, I know this doesn't apply so much to this video, but I'm honestly surprised how captivating you can make gameplay videos without even any commentary. Love your videos

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

@@wolfhussar1190 Thanks!

[@gunngin3586]

great video. I would like to ask if you know any twin-engine fighters (heavy/medium) that have good turning performance. I trying to design a twin-engine plane that has good dogfighting capabilities by using parts from other planes.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Thanks! P38s are up there in maneuverability for a twin-engine, helped a lot by its good flaps. For any plane, if you want a good turn you need a low wing loading (mass/wing area).

[@Azizalg]

Please can you play the la 5fn

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

It's on my list!

[@twister300000]

The only thing im getting are school flashbacks

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Haha! PTSD?

[@Derpy-qg9hn]

Holy SHIT, I did not think the P-38 had such ridiculous rate+radius in its heart. I wonder if it performs similarly in 1946 or Great Battles..

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Fowler flaps FTW!

[@BromanP47]

Very well done, my guy!

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Thanks Broman!

[@I_am_not_a_dog]

Do things any other features of the aircraft (aside from power, weight, etc) impact the TT/TR? For instance, open radiators? I could see certain types of radiators acting as ‘mini-flaps’ and providing some improvement to TR?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

IRL, radiator flaps would barely change lift. In WT, they only add drag, so they'd slightly worse TT.

[@I_am_not_a_dog]

@@AdamTheEnginerd Gotchya, wasn't sure if it was modeled. Thanks a bunch for your response and your content! Second reminder: I highly recommend you start a Patreon!

[@Alpakinator]

Interesting vid as always for some reason split flaps on some planes are very efficient in giving extra lift (Ta 152H, P39) I feel like flap type isn't 100% directly correlating to the efficiency at giving extra extra lift, and it's individual for every plane It hurts me a bit that you didn't measre turn time using simplified controls with mouse joystick. Instructor works the same but you can turn more smoothly making turn time shorter by 0,1-0,4 sec or smth.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Thanks! They might be using simplified equations to estimate flap extra lift, which make split flaps with high deflection angles more effective than they would be in reality. I used keyboard to turn, that's representative of how people turn in WT too. I don't think you'd get more than 0.1s better turn time with mouse joystick.

[@DelinaSilence]

Could you test the physics of propeller pitching? I'm confused on why engines dont overrev in manual engine controls when it should

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Prop pitch in WT is actually RPM, so 100% prop pitch is maximum RPM (for any plane except Germans). So by definition, they can't overrev.

[@prestonang8216]

You telling me that I could out-turn a mustang in a lightning? Holy fuck time to use the lightning as a turn fighter, fowler flaps are life damn

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Praise Fowler flaps!

[@alienoftt4665]

Is it sure for all propellers to reach their best turn rate at full elevators? Are there any props obtaining shorter turn time at higher speed, which means you don’t pull full stick on your mouse?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I highly doubt any prop would have a better turn rate than when close to CLmax.

[@jotbabwarthunder7404]

Hi Adam. I got one question recently. t1.daumcdn.net/cfile/tistory/99B987475B28F2412E The GIF shows the ball of the cycloid curve is falling earlier than any other line when the ball falls at the same height and same time. I want to find out if this applies to dive aircraft. I wonder what it is faster to descend in a straight line or to descend in a cycloidal curve. Because the ball is not affected by drag, thrust, and lift. But aircraft does. :DDD

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Ah yes! I have thought of that. The answer should be between cycloidal curve and straight line because of thrust and drag and air density changes (actually matters in 2km+ dives).

[@ferrarisuper]

1:02 wait, but in 90 degrees turns what produces vertical lift? Maybe i missed something as I don’t understand English extremely well

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

My initial assumption just to make it more simple is that it's a 90 degree bank angle. Later in the video I assume a 72 degree bank which increases turn radius by 5%.

[@ferrarisuper]

AdamTheEnginerd ah ok, i missed when you said that, i am sorry

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

@@ferrarisuper All good, no worries.

[@theraindog9141]

What's going on with the Swift F7's flaps? Last time I really flew it (at least 3 months ago), they were significantly hurting turns and even pitching the nose down. I'd heard they can be used as the air-brake, but on some hairy dive's I've tried using them to help pull out, and what would have been a clean pull just above tree tops somehow becomes a dirt nap if you tap the flaps.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Some flaps pitch the nose down depending on the aircraft. At high speed especially, the elevator is stiffening and can't pitch the aircraft enough to take advantage of the extra lift from the flaps.

[@theraindog9141]

@@AdamTheEnginerd That actually makes sense now that you put it that way, and my chimp brain isn't just going 'why mor lift not = mor up?' Is it a pitch stability problem for a nose heavy plane with a stubby lil tail?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

It does have to do with stability, flaps only increase effective lift if the elevator is capable of going to the new higher CLmax. At high speed, it's not possible for some aircraft.

[@theraindog9141]

Would you ever consider doing a video around how WT handles static stability? Even if most of us are playing RB with mouse and instructors, I'm sure I'm not the only one who's intuition can easily be messed with, especially since the instructor gives no hint to the plane's natural tendencies. I think the most common problem I've had with it is trying to land without tail controls, using flaps to try pitch up, and lawn darting as a result.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

They seem to handle it the normal way, with CG and moment coefficients.

[@truehdgaming3007]

How do I know about my plane flaps? And what is he diffrence beetwen the flaps? Edit: and how do you shake the enemy off your six when you have a same energy advantage and same maneuverability like when your dogfighting your friend in a same plane

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

The bigger they are and the more complicated they look, the better ;). If he's squarely behind you, that's already in a bad position to be. You can try to reverse like i do in my videos, so bring him to high speed so that he turns a bit worse than you and make him overshoot.

[@truehdgaming3007]

Thanks

[@adonai4493]

How does turn time and turn radius differ? I get the smaller the turn radius the better but what happens if some one has a large turn radius but a really low turn time? Like what’s the relationship between the two? Does it really matter? Etc

[@OneMoreDesu]

What is the most time and energy efficient way to completely reverse bearing? Is it as simple as turn dive and pitch up? Would the manoeuvre be the same in aircraft that tend to pitch up or down while yawing?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

If you're going fast, it's a loop then a roll. If you're going slow, it's a split S. Time efficient is higher speed near CLmax, energy efficient is a gentle loop.

[@dogeness]

I think you may have answered this before but can extending flaps change the overall Cl vs AoA curve of an airfoil? Like, aside from the obvious higher Clmax, can the overall shape of the curve also change?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Yeah, so it pushes it up and to the left a bit (stalls earlier).

[@Blitzcreeper239]

Nice video, and always gotta have that "Let's (aircraft related verb) right into it!" What gives the Firefly such a small turn circle? It's overweight and powered with a Griffon engine, but its wings and drag coefficient seem to let it pull a surprisingly tight turn. Could be attributed to the butterfly(?) flaps?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Thanks! Never flown the Firefly, but typically attack aircraft have relatively low wingloading so that they can load ordnance and still be flyable. Complicated flaps would help too of course.

[@Blitzcreeper239]

@@AdamTheEnginerd Not sure if you'd enjoy flying it, the Mk I is slow but that also gives it the good turn radius, the Mk V has a better roll and speed although not by much. You pretty much capitalise on its rarity(people who don't know what it can do) and people who make the mistake of turnfighting with you, unless of course you meet a Zero or Ki-43. It's pretty much an opportunistic aircraft, fantastic firepower for its BR and easily forcing overshoots, but above average pilots should never struggle with it, so it's definitely not competitive for carrying matches.

[@hankyukim59]

isn't the denominator 1/2pv^2 x CLmax x area if it is the total lift force made by the wing?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

V^2 cancels out with centripetal force, and 1/2 in denominator gives 2 in the numerator.

[@dsdy1205]

I feel like the CL term in the equation contains a lot of unexplained complexity about corner speed and the like that could be worth going into for a second video!

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Definitely all the complexity in the lift equation is in the CL. Maybe!

[@bennet2137]

Im thinking about goin to a flight-aero kinda university. What are things to consider when joining that? Any dos or donts that come to your mind?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Make sure you truly like the subject, that's the most important thing imo.

[@teariom456]

Hey adam i have a question, is it worth buying the ho229? because i got tired of my f4e because it almost doesnt take skill for you to get a kill so im thinking of grinding a new nation

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Certainly. Top tier jets are boring in my opinion too.

[@guilhermefigueiredo4991]

How do I get these informations like the turn time, weight, power, etc?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Tests, flight model files.

[@محمدرضاخدامی]

hey adam, hello and thanx for ur videos, I had a question, what's the most efficient way of take-off? I usually stay on the ground till I reach my climb speed (300 km/h IAS on k-4 for ex)

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

My pleasure! Most efficient way is to not use flaps, and takeoff 5-10% slower than your optimal climb speed (props).

[@Fuzeha]

how do you find the flight model data files???

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

You can follow these instructions to get them, but they won't do you much good if you don't know what the coefficients mean: www.reddit.com/r/Warthunder/comments/8nq70p/tutorial_how_to_datamine_or_how_i_learned_to_stop/

[@Fuzeha]

Thanks for the link Adam. I do know what most of the coefficients mean, I have looked into the physics of these a little bit, however a video on them would be nice. Love the vids, you should fly out a yak (try the 3U) sometime (youll have to cope with the awful 20mms tho)

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I did make a video on the Yak3U, it was good!

[@Fuzeha]

@@AdamTheEnginerd Ill check it out :)

[@141Zero]

Damn, Fowler flaps are really good. Why weren't they use in more planes? Too complicated?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

More complicated, heavier, requires more space in the wing. Flaps weren't used too often in combat either.

[@mikeflagger7723]

You can use voidmei to see propeller efficiency in real time

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I know, you can also see it on WTRTI like in the video.

[@morbidlyobese2944]

I think you’d find atpl theory pretty enjoyable

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Pilot theory?

[@morbidlyobese2944]

AdamTheEnginerd yes it’s the license you need to be able to fly more than 9 passengers on an aircraft, or an aircraft over a certain weight, which has many equations such as the ones you’ve mentioned in this video. You should give it a go man, especially if you love aviation!

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

@@morbidlyobese2944 I already have a Bachelors of Aerospace Engineering ;).

[@morbidlyobese2944]

AdamTheEnginerd well there you go man, you already have well over the required mathematical skill, plus, being an engineer is great and all, but you don’t get to feel the power of those jet engines spooling up on a daily basis. There’s just nothing that beats that feeling!

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I do suffer from motion sickness haha, so wouldn't be a good fit for me.

[@ScaleMilitaryModels]

Do you have any tips for a newish console player with the f6f 5n? Nice video btw

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Don't fly F6Fs haha. Fly the early F4Us instead. Thanks!

[@RedAssassin274]

Hey Adam! Just wanted to say I used to be a pure GF player, but watching your videos gave me some inspiration to play some AF! I'm currently at the F6F-5 in the US tree, and I have the P51 with the 20 mils unlocked, buy I haven't gotten the spirit to buy it yet, but I love the Hellcat! I was wondering, is the F6F-5N with the radar worth the up BR? Thanks for the vids!

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Nice! All the F6Fs are generally considered to be overtiered haha, you'd do better in other planes! I'd suggest the 3.3 and below F4Us. F6F-5N is not worth 4.3. My pleasure!

[@武田信玄-n8s]

I tried both F6F-5N and -5. F6F-5N is very bad. F6F-5 feels a bit better

[@truehdgaming3007]

Although if you are above the enemy F6F-5N it is good. Because when you dive them, the 20mm cannon in F6F-5N is really good

[@fishbucket8607]

Spitfire mk Vc please. It is the first 4 cannon spitfire i think

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

It's on my list!

[@fishbucket8607]

@@AdamTheEnginerd thanks, I always have troubles with that plane. Bf 109 can appear behind me when I am climbing, and do335 is also a pain

[@S4LeagueTBKing]

I know you using it for RB logic but now I think about it. Does this mean the turn time in AB is technically would be slightly the same? Since in AB when you punch flaps in turns can make your circles smaller.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Hmm not sure I follow. The same trend you see here in RB should repeat itself in AB.

[@S4LeagueTBKing]

@@AdamTheEnginerd Mostly in AB we hold on the elevator while flat so I wonder if you can try test that as well and compare it to the angles

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

@@S4LeagueTBKing Bank angle? That's probably because the rudder has much more authority in AB so that keeps the plane up.

[@mattiapozzi8979]

Doesn't wing design also affect high altitude turn rate?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Wing design affects turn at any altitude, it gives the wing area and the Lift Coefficient (CL).

[@robertmuffin3202]

Adam, what's the best belt for Hispano Mk V?

[@robertmuffin3202]

omg i just discovered that stealth is insane guess thats the best belt

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I use Stealth yeah.

[@berkan5043]

If i studied my math exam like that,maybe i would be more succesful today lol

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Haha!

[@volatile5460]

Do you reach minimum turn time at the highest possible soeed you can get max elevator deflection?

[@svenherrmann7881]

Hey Adam where can I find the flight modell datafiles with the aircraft characteristics like CL max... etc. And can I just open them with the Windows Editor or do I need another program for that?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Follow the instructions here: www.reddit.com/r/Warthunder/comments/8nq70p/tutorial_how_to_datamine_or_how_i_learned_to_stop/

[@svenherrmann7881]

@@AdamTheEnginerd Wow nice thx. I was trying to google an answer but never found something. Saved my day :D

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

My pleasure!

[@shashlik7959]

Kinda wanted a roll video more

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Would be kinda weird to do roll before turn though.

[@shashlik7959]

@@AdamTheEnginerd people know more about turn than roll and I am the same so I wanted roll video more As to why it would be weird I don't understand:D

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Turning is more important than rolling for aircraft, sounds more basic. Turn confuses quite a lot of people too, but I agree roll is more complicated.

[@Bennyy85]

What is the best ammo for German 13mm? I feel like they perform the worst out of all aircraft machine guns, even worse than the germy 8mm that is replaced.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I just use Stealth so that it doesn't interfere with my MG151 aim.

[@DEFYN]

IAI is best if you want utility, but it might get in the way as sad above

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

"sad" indeed.

[@DEFYN]

._.

[@johnsanvictores6639]

stealth, and pretend they dont exist. Rely solely on the mg151s

[@onyourkilllist6880]

*_Love it!_*

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I agree!

[@cyan2925]

How decide- should i turn vertical, horizontal or "oblique loops"? Thrust to weight ratio? Ingame card, or i should test it by myself?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Depends on the situation, your plane and what you're fighting. You should go vertical when you want to prevent overshooting or to slow down when you're very fast.

[@pedrosabino8751]

@@AdamTheEnginerd if a faster enemy is pursuing you in a low alt, you should do what kind of loop? Or better don't do loops?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Sounds like you should attempt to reverse the enemy.

[@pedrosabino8751]

@@AdamTheEnginerd yeah

[@pedrosabino8751]

@@AdamTheEnginerd Once time i was trying to reverse a dora and it hit kill my pilot. I don't know how to do this right.

[@anneallison6402]

I wonder how this works for ta 152

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Probably combat is the best setting for turn time.

[@anneallison6402]

@@AdamTheEnginerd i suppose they are supposed to increase lift

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Yup.

[@EdgeR2]

Can you try the flaps on the A-4B? The combat flaps don't seem to ever rip for me lol

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

I can take a look if you think they are odd.

[@EdgeR2]

@@AdamTheEnginerd Ah, never mind, apparently the flaps can be "deployed" at any speed but wont actually come out at a pre-set speed

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

@@EdgeR2 Yeah some planes are like that.

[@_ace_defective_]

how do you feel about the P-51D-30 as an aircraft. Do you think it's pretty good as is or were the rudder nerfs too much for it?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Yeah the rudder nerf makes it tough to fly. It's still decent, but I don't really have fun flying it.

[@asiftalpur3758]

*gives heatpats* Nerd :3

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

[3.

[@Lens15]

World of aircraft Players: Doing something randomly War Thunder Players:

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Lmao nice.

[@onurerdincler3107]

Your derivation is wrong if you assume L = Fc then there wont be any force to balance the weight of the aircraft. In reality Fc = sqrt(L^2 - W^2) and then you will see that both turn rate and turn radius is maximized and minimised respectively when you are pulling the maximum possible gs, indicated by load factor n = L / W, at the lowest possible velocity. R = V^2 / (g*sqrt(n^2 - 1)) \omega = g* sqrt(n^2 - 1) / V

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

My derivation with that assumption is right*. I talk about the assumption and even include the extra 5% turn radius due to bank angle later.

[@simhendra2377]

big if true

[@Ricardo-ck7zd]

The end of the video left me a little confused, you're saying that i shouldn't use my flaps in a sustained turn fight?

[@huntermurphy2148]

Over time they just slow you down to where you lose your energy/ you have to deploy bigger flaps to turn tighter which makes your slower, and the cycle continues until you run out of energy, win or die

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

It's as Hunter says. Flaps are good for the short term, clean is better for the long term.

[@Ricardo-ck7zd]

@@AdamTheEnginerd thanks guys for the explanation, this is mind blowing for me because a have been turn fighting with flaps for so much time thinking it was more optimal

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

@@Ricardo-ck7zd My pleasure!

[@kasetoast1012]

I'd like to cry after the p38 scene :(

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Why?

[@kasetoast1012]

@@AdamTheEnginerd becasue you know how to use engine control and flaps and so many things more I am just flying behidn the enemys and spray and hope that I get a kill or an assist

[@nateberry9393]

How to you get those extra readouts underneath the normal ones?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Get this: forum.warthunder.ru/index.php?/topic/279736-wtrti-otobrazhenie-informatsii-o-samolete-cherez-rtss/

[@rolandhunter]

How many is the ClMax for 109 in WT? :D How did u opened the P51 stats in text file?

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Follow these instructions: www.reddit.com/r/Warthunder/comments/8nq70p/tutorial_how_to_datamine_or_how_i_learned_to_stop/ CLmax is 1.43 clean and 1.7 with full flaps for late Bf109s.

[@rolandhunter]

@@AdamTheEnginerd Thank your very much! LoL War thunder not calculating with slats either? With slats the CL max should be around 1.9-2.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Slats are on a small portion of the wing. They are more for roll control and prevent wingtip stalling first than anything else.

[@rolandhunter]

@@AdamTheEnginerd And let you fly with higher AoA which mean you can have higher CLmax.

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

A bit higher, but not 1.9-2 without flaps for sure.

[@martijn9568]

5:43 Have you taken into account to lowwr compression on the elevator, when a lower speed is reached when using flaps? Because elevator compression on the P-38 starts quite early. Also, FW 190A's best turn fighter of ww2 at comvat speed :P

[@AdamTheEnginerd]

Sustained turn speeds are too low for control stiffening to have an effect.

[@martijn9568]

@@AdamTheEnginerd You might be correct, but my experience in game tells me that the stiffening becomes noticeable between 400 and 450 km/h