Angry Rant About WRC 2023 Codemasters Game!!!

What I waqnt to see and what I DONT!!!

[@rickied.4724]

@Jon Armstrong !!!!! Listen to this. I know you know what a good rally sim looks/feels like (not to mention that you know how real rally feels like) and you working in that development team have the ability to realize it for us.

[@DouglasThompson]

THANK YOU! I might do a part 2 of this video if there is enough response. I have some other big topics to cover.

[@wazzup102]

This comment ^ deserves all the attention

[@rallybusted2356]

yeh i hope jon does better or more specific pacenotes and god i hope its not a letdown im sooo excited toi..but dirt 4 n 5 get worse and worse just like wrc and grw to breakpoint and ntm EAsports is on it so its gonna suck guarantee. but got my fingers crossed

[@jns08d]

New to sim racing but hella excited for a 2023 game that I can run, I love dirt rally 2 but it def can be better

[@p.a.16motorsport27]

I only want a 2023 WRC version of RBR! Asked too much😂

[@DouglasThompson]

Lol that's something!

[@labelfilms6838]

Unfortunately, as you said at end, most of the things mentioned (almost all are necessary) won’t be included. To legitimately dethrone RBR it will need state of the art graphics, 1:1 feeling physics compared to real life, an enormous list of stages, perfect audio and the ability to seamlessly create your own events and share them. I don’t believe even the best, most dedicated and passionate developers can deliver an experience like that. It’s sad but the simulation behemoth that RBR is today can only be done by thousands of fans who are doing it because they love the sport

[@DouglasThompson]

And that's why it would be so great if Codemasters opened the gates up so the community could help fill in all the gaps. Even if someone cracked the code on dirt rally 2.0 we could start seeing some amazing things physics-wise and stage wise. Imagine that engine in the hands of tons of some talented modders.

[@alvar891]

@@DouglasThompson Us rally sim enthusiasts are just a small spec in the pool and sadly i don't believe we will be catered to this time. EA will force codemasters into making a arcade game for all ppl. It's all for maximum profit and what we want is not going to make them money. Dirt rally games were a gift to us between the mainstream games when codemasters wwas still in charge.

[@DouglasThompson]

@@alvar891 fingers crossed...we will know soon.

[@mg-by7uu]

As a dev I promise you that's very possible. The problem is the executives want sales, and they will force their managers to make the game accessible to casuals. This type of game doesn't have a large enough market to justify the resources needed to make it realistic

[@DouglasThompson]

@mg-by7uu yep..sounds about right.

[@elitesennabubble]

I also think a stage creator tool or easy mod support for tracks and cars like assetto has would be incredible because then we have theoretically infinite amount of new stages that the community can contribute

[@DouglasThompson]

Yes, even if they were just generic looking, we could do online tournaments where there is a good chance that one person doesn't know the course like the back of his/her hand. Lol

[@elitesennabubble]

@Douglas Thompson yeah, like rally is supposed to be. memorizing layouts and lines and flats and lifts and cautions is what circuit racing is for

[@DouglasThompson]

@@elitesennabubble I mean it's one thing to know a course that you have done before but it's another when you know every course and every time you play the game it's the same few courses. But again, I think that's what they want so you itch for the next one...like what we are doing now...lol ;)

[@JurekBogdanowicz]

get blender, get tom's addon, and go work on stages. tools are there for everyone

[@FortySeventhGear]

I believe Dirt Rally 2.0 has some wildlife... I have seen some suicidal animals in Germany. All that we would need codemasters to do is to let modders feast on it, but that is not going to happen because the modders would make them look bAd.

[@DouglasThompson]

Lol ya I have definitely seen a deer in dirt rally but I want to know that deers backstory! ;)

[@bromio9216]

Deer and fox's

[@avflashback8913]

All your suggestions are great but the WRC 2023 game will be an EA game. Even if it has Codemasters name on the box. You would have go back to the early 90's to find the last EA "sim" game. Even the old EA SBK Superbike games were developed by Milestone. If look at the history of Racing sims it's a European business. Simbin & DICE are Swedish, Kunos & Milestone are Italian. Codemasters, Warthog & Bizzare Creations are British. Other than the ISI engine & Papyrus, US game studios generally don't go deep into racing simulations. Their strength is First-Person Shooters. They talk a good game like Turn10 do with Forza but they always come up short. EA think "What minimum amount of effort we can put into a game to get maximum profit?" In the WRC 2023 game I expect to see a lot of carry over from Dirt Rally 2.0 in terms of physics & audio. The stages will be a lot shorter than WRC Genarations and there will be less of them, and there will be a ton of expensive DLC. Also I bet all the recent WRC games will be removed from Steam to encourage gamers to buy the new EA WRC game. I think you're asking for a lot Douglas. RBR only got to where it is now because of passionate Hardcore rally modders. And that's a miracle in it's self because rally is such a niche sport and I'm British I grew up with it.

[@DouglasThompson]

What's funny is its honestly one of the more approachable forms of motorsport but it seems in terms of games it gets neglected. I hope you are not right, and as I said in the vid, I'm pretty sure most of this won't happen but I so want it to.

[@vsdfsdfsdfwew]

They did not even bothered to add VR support to WRC! The accountants are creating those games now and they does not give a f**ck what real passionates want cause they are few :(

[@DouglasThompson]

Well as long as Codemasters remembers that the vr community is a growing market I would hope they would be smart enough to include it.

[@Da_Osta]

I would want WRC 2023 to be like you described it. Problem is that EA and also the WRC Promoter don't want it to be like that. They want it to be playable on consoles with a controller and by as much people as possible with as little frustration as possible. On the arcade to sim spectrum it will probably be like the f1 games. And from their point of view this is the best way.

[@DouglasThompson]

Agreed it will most likely be that way...but the head of the project also has rallied in real life and maybe wants to paint an accurate picture for future potential drivers. ;)

[@jasonaschan1723]

ah man, first time I've heard it's going to be a yearly release. that almost guarantees its going to suck as a simulator. it'll be a rally version of their F1 games. Jank physics and the career mode will include a home design aspect for unexplainable reasons.

[@DouglasThompson]

Well hopefully they've got the physics right already in the 5 year development cycle that they already had. And then each year following, it will just get a little bit better each time. That would be fine and I would pay for each and every game if that were the case . But again, if it's gonna be a yearly release, every bit of content should be in this game and we shouldn't have to wait for any content. If we do have to wait, it should be free because they already know next year all of the userbase is going to buy the new game and that's a significant chunk of money there. So they shouldn't have to nickle and dime people, in theory.

[@jasonaschan1723]

@@DouglasThompson I hope you’re optimism pays off. I really do. I just don’t have much faith in yearly releases. Seems to me their target would be casual players playing on controller. Hopefully they saw what happened with project cars 3 and learned something. The sim racing community is small comparatively to casual players. But they are a dedicated base who like you say will buy the product year after year if it’s good.

[@DouglasThompson]

That's a great example. Yes, I will definitely go out of my way to play a quality sim.

[@W1interWolf]

I'll do my own List. 1. more stages and longer stages if there was one thing that the WRC games got right it was the stages. 2.Let us control the total allocated tire amount and type per event. 3. Increase maximum amount stages per rally. 4. Allow us to save the multiplayer event where it left of so we could continue another day if for example some1 has to leave or something ( I'm talking about live multiplayer here). 5. Let us set up our own time penalties for crashing out and even for tire change. And rally 2 system and its setup. Let's say one of you has a fatal crash or runs out of tires and retires. He gets his car repaired and gets to drive on in the next stages but gets a penalty we can set ourselves per those stages And can start driving for stages times in the next rally 2 restart point that was set in the event. 6. Let us change certain car setup elements between stages that can be changed between stages in real rallying like damper clicks and so on but not the whole setup. Also cross fitting tires. 7. Idk if the real cars can do it on the the stages these days but controls for changing engine maps and brake bias and such on the fly. and if it has previous gen cars then diff maping on the fly as well. I do know they have the knobs for that on their wheels but idk if they can change those during a stage. 8. Separate co-driver calls and other audio like it has been done in F1 games for ages already. 9. This might be a wee bit of a gimmick but me and my friends all wish the staggered starts could be brought back from dirt 3 and also a fair amount of control for the times we can set between drivers lets say from 15 seconds for those fun events to a minute or 2 for the more serious deal. 10. Also tying into the previous one give us more control over the stage end timer meaning longer times or let us disable it completely if we so wish. 11. More UDP telemetry options. The car side itself is pretty good but I would also like to get the positions and times of other players doing the event at the same time to create a nice live leaderboard and maybe a live map showing drivers. 11. Improved night lighting. 12. Improved sounds. I'm looking at you Kiloton. But I also have a bone to pick with previous dirt games. Where are my sharp pops and bangs of the ALS. In every game they are there but they are but a watered down rumbling at best. 13. I'm not that bothered about graphics but ye upgrades are always nice. 14. I don't use VR myself but many will get mad if its missing so better add it in. 15. Option for more complex tuning options. Like creating your own diff maps if we have older cars that have active diffs and hybrid maps for this gen and so on.

[@DouglasThompson]

GREAT list, I really like the idea of being able to change some more realistic stuff in between stages. Seems it would be very easy to implement. Modern wrc do have certain controls for I think brake bias and others if memory serves. Also the new function for the electric boost that accumulates I think is on the wheel of the newer cars. Being able to continue multi-player rallies would be awesome and bring more people online. They do sort of have that function already but you mean in the actual multiplayer lobbies, I gather. #8 I don't fully understand, do you mean like talking to the crew? I don't believe that is something that happens in the driver headset. I could very well be wrong but imagine if the crew talked over a very important pacenote and they went off a cliff because the driver couldn't hear a note. I'm sure they are able to communicate but nor while driving I wouldn't think. And yes, the KT WRC games have the best courses I've ever driven on in a virtual setting. I so hope Codemasters takes a page from that book.

[@W1interWolf]

​@@DouglasThompson They do have the knobs on the wheels but I am not entirely sure if they are allowed to change them mid stage. I have never once seen some1 adjust them mid stage and I have never researched that. So that's why I wasn't entirely sure and said idk if they are allowed. Yes I meant live lobbies as we prefer to get together on discord with our friends talk some smack and then its pedal to the metal. But since we all are nearing our 30s now finding this time is becoming more and more challenging so continuing where we left off would be very a welcome feature. For the #8 I mean separate the car sound and co-driver sound. Let me blast my car sound from my speakers so that the floor rumbles and have my co-driver calls go to my head set. What I meant with F1 games is that a similar system already exists in that game. There you can have all the other sounds and race engineer sounds separated if you so wish. TBH I didn't watch the whole video and the starting the engine with my gas pedal also grinds my gears. XD As for wipers I used a macro in my wheel software so there is a button for turning it on and off and there is also a button for one time use if I want to. But for sure it would be nice to have button for each of them.

[@W1interWolf]

But I doubt we will get a full simulation that destroys your car they want to make money and want to appeal to the general audience. Take the F1 games for example. They are full blown simcades and I doubt it will be any different unfortunately.

[@DouglasThompson]

@@W1interWolf I have the same fear...but who knows...nothing major had been revealed just yet. Fingers crossed.

[@DouglasThompson]

@Rando93H ah, yes I see, that would be cool for sound separation. And yes I haven't seen any mid stage adjustments either.

[@tunaphis1362]

Takes me back to when Dirt Rally was finished and players were posting their whish list for 2.0 which included alot of what you want now.

[@DouglasThompson]

Really...that's discouraging lol

[@martinjulecki2728]

transit to the next stage would be sick

[@DouglasThompson]

I know!!!! I didn't want to even mention that because I know for a fact they won't make that a feature. We can only rely on games like beam ng to provide something like that. I think driving back to your repair tent would be possible or from the tent to the stage beginning.

[@martinjulecki2728]

@@DouglasThompson yeah I like the idea of that, I've been to many rally's in real life and seeing ken pull into the pits as well, it's an awesome experience

[@DouglasThompson]

I think that would be reasonable.

[@caiusbaro3188]

The ideal game would be a modern rbr physics like, with assistances you can activate (like the f1 games with brakes / spin assists), it would let the players choose if they want a sim sweaty game or an arcade fun game

[@DouglasThompson]

Indeed!!! Please everyone but have some hardcore servers!!!

[@jasonbegaming244]

Dude! You just hit the nail on the head with this one. You spoke my mind. Everything I've been thinking this whole time playing rally sims for years. You are right that DR2.0 is not bad but this is 2023. The technology to do all the things you mentioned is there... the devs are only limited by the motivation they have to make a great sim. At the very least let us make our own stages.. for the love of God please. It's cool codemasters has been talking about letting you build your own cars.. but I could care less if I have to drive on the same stages for the next 5 years... better spectators, better cars, repairing your car on stage, and letting us make stages and share them with the community. Also I hate how the past WRC games just automatically teleport you when you drive 5 feet off of the stage, something that could easily be recovered by the driver.

[@DouglasThompson]

My deal is l, if you get stuck and can't get back up on the stage, it should be over. Lol They mentioned you will be able to buy used car parts in the upcoming game. I wonder if we will be able to sell our parts on a virtual store to other users on some online marketplace.

[@NakedSnake-4ofClubs]

i remember playing rbr when it came out with my brand new momo force. unbelievable how realistic it looks and sounds 20 years later with mods. almost makes me want to go back in time and forget about modern games

[@DouglasThompson]

Well rbr modded is free so you can still do that. ;)

[@t2sugars393]

Jackin defo take you out of the moment lol. Love RBR, the main reason i sim race. Yeah bring the ant hills!:-)

[@DouglasThompson]

Lol I was debating if I should keep that in or not. I'm glad you liked it. There are some other things I wanted to mention but I figured I'd cut it since the video was so long already.

[@dubtube6691]

9:50 this stage looks absolutely awesome realistic 😍 this is what I would like to see from Codemasters. But they always have this weird color grading, atmosphere, desaturated, shifted colors. When this is supposed to be there style it does not look good

[@DouglasThompson]

Yes, although the game can look really good at certain points, it never reaches a point where I'm blown away by how real things look.

[@watanen1]

The one main thing you missed, it the more changing conditions weather and roadwise. Not degradition on three levels, realistic based on road position etc. Weather, we need truly changhing conditions with part dry part wet and so on.

[@DouglasThompson]

Yes, you are right, weather needs improved as well. I hope Unreal engine 5 will allow for better surface degradation.

[@drumbri]

My biggest gripe with WRC 10 was that it wasn’t in VR. If the next dirt rally isn’t in VR, I won’t buy it. How can we get this version of Richard Burns rally???

[@DouglasThompson]

Search Richard burns rally pro in Google and go to the rbrpro.org result. Go to downloads and in the top left of that page should be the manager/launcher download. You can also download rsf, they have some great stages that rbrpro doesn't have but rbr pro is a bit less hassle free for updates and new stages ime.

[@drumbri]

@@DouglasThompson You rock Doug TY. Hey man it’s time to get your RaceNet club going again!

[@kilh__22]

Very good... I'm happy there's good ideas for this new Dirt/WRC game. I still play 2.0 and still love it but definitely can be improved on so much. Adding all the WRC cars, drivers, locations (especially Kenya) is a must and also some more obscure cars like the Toyota Celica TCT (Group B), Nissan 240RS (Group B), Audi 200 quattro (Group A), Mitsubishi Galant VR-4 (Group A) etc. would make it a must have for me

[@DouglasThompson]

Unfortunately I think it will only be whatever events the 2023 season has. But if they do include others, ya Kenya would be awesome!

[@jacbelgrave6163]

Like you said", some of these thing might not be in wrc 23 but i hope atleast some of them do.

[@DouglasThompson]

Yes, as we both know, we would be happy with just greatly improved physics on par with RBR and new stages. Let's hope at least that comes true.

[@ktownshizzle]

unfortunately I'm not optimistic we will get our hardcore rally sim. EA wants to cater to the masses for sales, and a true unforgiving rally sim wont sell.

[@DouglasThompson]

Ala Richard burns rally. I have read that it wasn't well received back in the day it released so it didn't sell well...but I think we are at a turning point (you like that Lil pun?) In racing simulation where I think they could get away with it nowadays. Enough people want or have a way to steer with a wheel in games now that the market is large enough for at least a special mode you can toggle...I hope.

[@ktownshizzle]

My hopes are there too

[@wazzup102]

I REALLY need to update my rig. I've been thinking about how to do my own version of your T-slot stuff, but something collapsible I can store on the wall while not in use. Also to attach to my lil chair or others in a modular fashion.

[@DouglasThompson]

I have some ideas about how to make a foldable rig but I can't justify buying another rig that I don't need. :(

[@wazzup102]

If you want, I can share plans I come up with, and if it works I'll let you borrow and build it on camera if you want. I had spoken to a local metal dealer who would custom cut and help me develop stuff on a visit. You still have my email?

[@nevenpavlovic4448]

I once again beg people to use reference images/videos when trying to tweak visuals in games. Hard shadows near vegetation imply sunny or at least partially sunny weather conditions and time close to noon. If that's the case then you can't have fog and it's very unlikely that sky is white. Another thing - if weather is sunny and sky is blue, brightness of the road should be similar to that of the sky. Tarmac is quickly UV damaged and game roads are often way too new and dark. Third - use your monitor's dynamic range. If your monitor maxes at 300 nits, make sure bright areas of your stage are near that without clipping (290 nits, for example). You mentioned grittiness. The correct way to achieve that is with vegetation and weather and definitely not by artificially slapping a filter or decreasing brightness. That takes people out of the experience.

[@DouglasThompson]

Keep in mind these graphics settings in the video are built into the mod i use. I used rbr as an example for what the next rally game should be like for many reasons. Physics quality, a non-hand-holding experience, impressive graphics from an old game engine (which could be so much better with a new release) and various other reasons. I think it's hard to argue that this game with mods can be very beautiful and I am aware there are many lighting issues and colors that are off but having so many people confuse this game for real life until they look closely is a testament to the community dedication and the sacrifice to have a decent rally game. We need a big company to lay the foundation for the next "rbr".

[@jakubpetr2142]

Do somebody know release date? And also did you find some info from Codemasters or somebody else? I’ve alredy looked at various websites and found nothing.

[@DouglasThompson]

Nothing besides creating your own car info has been released. I'm sure you have seen articles on that already. If not basically they will let you choose to build your rally car from the ground up and make your own livery when it's all built and you will race in that for I'm assuming the career mode and possibly some online modes. I'm sure the Rally 1 cars will be present and other popular classes as well. No release date but the news is that the person in charge is staying till the games release and he announced he will be moving to something else in spring which is basically saying the game will be complete in spring.

[@runnair]

It would be a good idea to place a skill- gap between players by puting a minigame- repair into it. So one guy would change spare tyre in 1 minute the other is in 24 seconds.

[@DouglasThompson]

I'd say that would be good for game balancing online for the all inclusive multiplayer.

[@coyoterangersmedia5263]

Imagine how great it would be if none of those things happen, and the rally community gets into a group agreement of simply not buying the game. And just sticking to RBR, absolutely mocking EA with a game from 2004 built by bloody modders !!! Not even full time devs, MODDERS ! Now if that happened, only then will EA learn to listen to their player base.

[@DouglasThompson]

That would surely be a very interesting thing but I honestly feel codemasters could very well knock it out of the park.

[@snail3]

If the games are gonna be released yearly, then there's probably not gonna be any DLC. They will just put a new label on the game next year, add a thing or two and call it a brand new game. I hope not tho.

[@DouglasThompson]

We shall find out the hard way...

[@viatrufka]

But have Codemasters ever created a game that's sim-racing realistic? I've always associated Codemasters with arcade GRID series.

[@DouglasThompson]

You have a point but with acquiring the wrc license and the new sim racing standards changing to edge more and more towards reality, it would make sense for them to take this a bit more seriously. They have a really talented team and I know they can achieve great things.

[@MrGulyo]

Yah. Codemasters wrc gonna be 10x better than kylotonn crap ( i have 3 of them ). I know what im talking about. Sounds are simply unacceptable 🤦🏼 handling is VERY average.

[@DouglasThompson]

@MrGulyo yes I kept giving kt chances. Bought 8, 9 twice (when I switched to pc from console) and 10. All disappointed me severely. From lack of features to just plain broken things in the game.

[@fuk17]

I agree with your idea. And add that if WRC use the UEngine, it will be a disaster in VR, if they cant find the Columbo's Egg (solution) that change the history.

[@DouglasThompson]

I heard UE5 does vr well but not sure about UE4...

[@TommiTM]

All this is sad. I am huge rally a fan, and i have to play ACC to get that good feel. Everytime when i go back to dirt 2.0 it feels shit.. even i got WR stage times.

[@DouglasThompson]

Ya I was at the tippy top of a lot of the leaderboards in group b and some others for some stages too. Its not that the game isn't challenging, because you can still make one small mistake and it ends everything it's that the game just doesn't feel right. Many times I have felt and others agree that the car seems to rotate too easily and recover too easily. And it feels like the car turns from the center of the car instead of the front wheels.

[@massolaracing7482]

I hope someday I will have the time to develop a pc/console rally sim, I guess with unreal Engine 5! Insted of mobile development...

[@DouglasThompson]

I think pc is the way to go, since with console you have to jump through hoops to get everything approved.

[@rudomeister]

I started with CarX Drift Racing, and ignited the kick out of the drfting, and headed on with Asetto Corsa, and to Dirt Rally 2.0. It stopped with Dirt Rally 2.0, since every other racing game after that just sucked. Realized how terrible the engine sounds sound like in WRC 10 and Generations? Or how lousy the graphics are, even it demands whatever for nothing it wants out of the GPU? I've been trying to figure out what Codemasters have done right what WRC, Asetto, CarX, and those I haven't even tried yet have done wrong, and its about everything. For those interested in gameplay other than getting the kick of adrenaline driving thru Finland sideways into a corner, consider Football Manager or any other strategy game.

[@DouglasThompson]

Dirt Rally 2.0 is a great game, very polished. I want the upcoming game to be that level of polish and even better physics and we got a winner!

[@rudomeister]

@@DouglasThompson What I've seen so far from rumours on the web, is that they are gonna implement a feature for people to build their own cars, what means there must be branded parts at least. The other rumour is that they are gonna use Unreal Engine 5 as engine for this game, what means the graphics will be stunning and demanding. But all of this ofc, are just rumours, so its not to put into the features list. It feels so distant and so remote since there aren't much announcements about this upcoming WRC Dirt Rally 3.0 version, but that may be caused of missing license they also are waiting for.

[@chriswilson9251]

I agree with ur opinion But is EA going to do this? or are they going to the bare minimum?. Create initial hype, then after a few months the game is dead and boring (not a sim).... everyone goes back to RBR . Giving you (US).. NOT anything you asked for......?

[@DouglasThompson]

Yes, thus seems very possible but I have heard that ea will not interfere with this games production. I hope that is true. Just give the game the big funding! ;)

[@joseppc6802]

Dreaming is for free, but as a dream is spot on

[@DouglasThompson]

I suppose if none of this comes to fruition RBR is still free and awesome. ;)

[@joseppc6802]

@@DouglasThompson sometimes a dream takes a few years to become true…

[@massolaracing7482]

I know what you mean, it super satisfing just completing an event without damaging the car with final damage on :D

[@DouglasThompson]

Yes exactly!

[@mrbeckham666]

I have a question, maybe you'll know what's going on because you probably played RBR after mods. I have this Hungarian mod in the latest version and I don't know why the game doesn't see fantec csll DD at all. Have you played on this base, have you had any problems?

[@DouglasThompson]

You need to delete all controller mappings first then set your base to 90 degrees or so max wheel rotation then when you go to calibrate it go back and forth super quick. After that, set you base back to your normal wheel rotation.

[@bakayarou023]

You will never see a game with licenced cars and realistic damage. The manufacturers don't want seeing their cars destroyed in games.

[@DouglasThompson]

This has always been the case but to me it's never made any sense, not only are there videos of crash testing for so many cars but a crushed car in no way represents an undamaged factory vehicle. If you have crashed the car to the point it is unrecognizable that's not the manufacturers fault lol To be clear, I'm not disagreeing with you about this, just trying to figure out why it's a thing.

[@bakayarou023]

@@DouglasThompson I couldn't agree more with you. I would love midnight club la for example have the damage model from GTA IV, since they run on the same engine. But unfortunately this is how it is. We can only hope that some day an indie developer will make a racing game with unlicensed cars that look almost exactly like the real counterparts, and have a good/realistic damage model.

[@DouglasThompson]

Lol is that a beam reference?

[@bakayarou023]

@@DouglasThompson could be

[@thehwguy4293]

The fact a game from 2005 (WRC: Rally Evolved) has done it (5:42) leaves no excuse for Codemasters not to. (Though, you will still get reset sometimes due to being in a situation where the spectator/s can't get out of the car's way.)

[@DouglasThompson]

Yes!!!!

[@MikeThePikeOnAHikeOverTheDike]

I really wish some proper Sim Studio would chime in and crank out a proper Rally Sim. Unfortunately those studios are often too small to concenteate on a road racing and on a rally simulation at the same time. Funding will also not be there. Licenses shouodn't be a problem since you don't need the WRC badge to have a simulation. Imo it will be like the F1 games. A more arcady sim. But yeah. Everything you said would be a dream come true. As for modding support. Forget it. If EA is on top it will be 100% a yearly release with DLC level of improvements for the low price of 70€. I hope I'm wrong but I don't feel like it will be a new RBR. But I hope it will at least be a Dirt Rally 3. Which irons out at least the tarmac physics and has a nicer look/gives you more choice for realism. Like you said. The money is there.

[@DouglasThompson]

Luckily we always have rbr modded but it will be a damn shame if yet another game goes by ignoring what makes rally great. I want a raw experience, it's expensive to do in real life and Sims are one of the only ways most people can experience rally.

[@malcolmsampson4142]

oh god how much i agree on every single thing you said. if they make it like you just described it, the game would be complete!!!

[@DouglasThompson]

I left out some topics due to how long the video was getting if I had included everything I want it would have easily been 30 mins. Lol thank you so much though!

[@stevenwoodward4333]

Agreed on 105 percent of what you said…also we want mods on consoles too…this way if you have it on both you can use it on consoles if you just feel like being lazy that day and playing on controller…or if you want to remote play it to learn the courses when we aren’t in our rigs. Mods on consoles are possible and serve a good purpose. We want dirt rally 3.0:Richard Burns homage.

[@DouglasThompson]

Yes, there are multiple games that prove mods are possible on console. That's a cool thought.

[@ZedNinetySix_]

All of this would be fantastic. But dont expect all of that to be released in some months this year. The biggest thing which kills any potential in games are deadlines, fixed release dates, and annual releases. The best things take time to curate.

[@DouglasThompson]

You'd think after 2019-2023 development thed have something big worked out. But maybe I just am too hopeful.

[@ZedNinetySix_]

@@DouglasThompson Something contemporary at best I assume, judging by the way things are going...

[@jns08d]

The change of notes from the Codriver sounds absolutely amazing

[@DouglasThompson]

Agreed a

[@cheukyinho1204]

I absolutely agree with ur opinion especially on that stage building thingy

[@DouglasThompson]

I REALLY hope this is not an online only game. Rally games don't need to be online all the time. And ya I almost guarantee it won't have options like that but hat doesn't change the fact that still, we want it!

[@dubstepandvideogames]

Honestly rally games are so stuck in the past we really do need something fresh and new

[@DouglasThompson]

What do you mean exactly?

[@jacbelgrave6163]

Another cool detail they can add is when your heavy braking on a long stage your brakes can catch on fire, that would be awesome.

[@DouglasThompson]

lol that sounds am,azing

[@jacbelgrave6163]

I would love the see some small little detail like for example; make the car exhaust the glowing bright red overtime when your driving and make it bright enough that you can see it in the day and exspecally in the night. Can't be that hard to do can it.

[@DouglasThompson]

There are so many small details like if you notice if you drive behind a car in the winter time there is a small vortex that the exhaust creates too. That would be awesome to see on really cold humid or snowy stages.

[@jacbelgrave6163]

@@DouglasThompson or the heat wave from the exhaust. If you look at a rally car exhaust from and a side you can see the heat wave just like fire you can see the wave obove the fire to sjow you how hot it is.

[@jacbelgrave6163]

On dirt rally 1 you can clearly see the heat waves from the exhaust.

[@DouglasThompson]

@jacbelgrave6163 yes, I hope all the little details are present. Even though it is mostly subconscious, our brains look look for things like that to authenticate what we are seeing.

[@DouglasThompson]

@@jacbelgrave6163 I don't recall in DR2.0 what is visible.

[@harbushy]

Hi! I totaly agree with your points, I hope this game will be memorable, better than expected. People should be more inclined to fulfill potential a game can have rather than do the minimum and recieve the max in return.

[@DouglasThompson]

agree! make this one go down in history!!!

[@picure]

I want an open world rally game where you have to drive the liaison sections too

[@DouglasThompson]

If someone can put in the work, beam ng would be the best bet for that. I have spoken about that as a possibility on the channel before. It's a great idea

[@vedadtursum6341]

I love rbr, but i have fanatec gt dd, bmw rim, fanateg handbrake/shifter, full sim rig, curved samsung 144hz 32inch monitor, rtx 3060ti,...etc. All that money investment all that power and.... I play old old rbr 🤔😅

[@SleepyPantsSimRacing]

Exactly! We need a modern representation of this sport!

[@maninbots2601]

Don’t want a 3.0 now that EA controls codemasters and you can see the shitshow they did to f1 22….

[@DouglasThompson]

I don't play F1 games but I have heard some bad things. I'm hoping "dr3.0" will blow us away!

[@jacbelgrave6163]

Another feature they should add is lauch control system for some cars like for example the skoda fabia 2005 or ths subaru s12 2007.

[@DouglasThompson]

Thank would be cool!

[@iyadkamhiyeh527]

I agree with everything you said, but maybe you forgot a very important one, we need PROPER tyre model and tyre strategy! We need the ability to put different types of tyres as in real life, they mix SOFTS/HARDS! We need longer stages, we need better cockpit camera with full adjustablity! In some cars in DR2 the camera is way too high! sadly I doubt that the next title will be a real rally sim!

[@DouglasThompson]

Yes! I kinda touched upon it in a joking way with the whole "you can see tire chunks missing thing" but yes, ture strategy is a huge part of rally and its said these games don't really let tire strategy play the important role it does in real life.

[@alvar891]

Mixing tyres either crossing or adding just one type in a corner because you have just a limited amount to use for 1 rally now that would be awesome. That would be a good option to turn on. Otherwise many ppl would not play the game if its too complicated.

[@DouglasThompson]

@@alvar891 for the hardcore mode only! ;)

[@n9ne]

i just want an open world rally game with rbr physics, good graphics, and native vr support, and be able to challenge people.. and whatever other game mode like time trial obviously, but disconnected from the open world through phasing so people don't mess up your sprint.

[@DouglasThompson]

I would love that too. Beam ng might be our best bet for that. Honestly I just want better physics and better stages if we boil it down to the absolute minimum but we shall see.

[@PS3DEADMAN69]

WRC, F1 edition. coming sooooooooon

[@DouglasThompson]

Lol...I hole not.

[@GabenHood]

I just hope there's a way to extract the tracks if the physics are trash.

[@DouglasThompson]

Lol true!

[@DouglasThompson]

Hey man, can you email me when you get an opportunity? [e-mail]

[@markeschen6272]

If the next big rally title had a built in stage builder I would literally never drive except to test my stages

[@DouglasThompson]

Lol there sre those who drive and those who build! We need both!

[@jdmbren13]

a full pn physical rally simulator would be so cool, if u had a physical character who actually got out of the car, and if you could get out after flying off cliff, I want crazy rally fans!!! too , so many good ideas!

[@DouglasThompson]

I got a ton more. These were just my "reasonable" ones lol

[@rallybusted2356]

yo do u play rbr on ps4 ? if so cam u help me find and how to jailbreak it to play it on ps4

[@DouglasThompson]

Im on PC sorry :(

[@jacbelgrave6163]

Yo if you got time, you should do a video on what vehicles or vehicle classes they should add, if you want to im not trying force you to do but it would be cool.

[@DouglasThompson]

I think they will do all the big classes and then offer a bunch of popular starter cars like the fiesta, wrx, etc. That you can fix up and slowly upgrade into monsters.

[@jacbelgrave6163]

Gotta give some of the cars some loud ass backfires an flames like the renault clio 3 r3 if they bring it in the game.

[@DouglasThompson]

YES!

[@jacbelgrave6163]

I want to see the ai cars actually in front of me driving or starting behind base upon the position im starting in. This was a thing in their past dirt 3 game. If a ai crash i should catch up to them and over take them depending on the condition of their cars. If the have very bad damage to their cars they will park at the side on the road but if they spin, let them continue so i can catch up to the and overtake them...that would be sickkkkkk.

[@DouglasThompson]

YESSSSSS!!!

[@jacbelgrave6163]

Hey you ever heard the porshe 997 gt3 rally? Man if they can get that idle and engine sound right yo...that would be freaky awsome. Type in porshe 997 gt3 rally if you have not seen the car yet and listen to those engine sounds.

[@DouglasThompson]

She sounds mean!

[@SleepyPantsSimRacing]

I agree with everything! ;)

[@DouglasThompson]

I KNOW YOU!

[@holseng]

I want it so be super optimized for VR!

[@DouglasThompson]

Yes!!! The new age of VR is here with the quest 3 and psvr2. It NEEDS VR

[@notquiteright45014]

Been waiting for an "Audit" from you!

[@SleepyPantsSimRacing]

I might make a part 2...lol there are some other things I wanted to talk about but the video was getting long and I doubt most will even get through half way on this one..lol

[@seebarry4068]

Oh bless. You know EA are making this? 😂. You’ll get some cars (not all of them), some tracks (not all of them) and some drivers (not all of them). You’ll also get more bugs on sticks than an Asian open air market.

[@DouglasThompson]

Well...You're probably right. I will say, it never made sense to me to put different drivers in these games. What's the point? Lol in a basketball game it males sense cause the different stats change the team and the person you are controlling but when you change your driver...does it make you a more skilled driver yourself? Lol

[@seebarry4068]

@@DouglasThompson no, I wouldn’t see the point of drivers either. You won’t be stunned if they do though I’ll wager. Bruce Lee yellow stripe skin incoming.

[@radoczgyorgy3322]

Ea making paying content 1000$ per year. Or coming nothing out:(((

[@Cereal_Killr]

Is'nt it true that EA bourght Codemasters? ...that scares me if it's true

[@DouglasThompson]

Very true.

[@jacbelgrave6163]

Cars i want to see is from early to mid to late 2000s cars like for example the loeb 07 citroen c4 from that class.

[@DouglasThompson]

I'm not sure older cars will be focused on but if they are, best believe those classics will be seen.

[@Motod94]

For me if they can make a small step with gravel and snow, and a big step with tarmac physics i will be happy. Tarmac physics are a big let down for me, becouse i am a big fan of Montecarlo rally, but on dirt rally 1 and 2.0 i just cant enjoy it.

[@SleepyPantsSimRacing]

Yes. If physics is the only thing they improved with new stages, I would be happy as well.

[@paulsumner8797]

Is this going to be on PS4 as well?

[@DouglasThompson]

For the games sake...I hope not. For many users that can't afford a pc or ps5 I hope so.

[@sussolus]

We are going to get a project cars 3 again. Creative heads are dropping like flies. Dr 2.0 may be the the last hurrah unfortunately.

[@DouglasThompson]

Well in that case I hope someone can crack that dr2 game open and mod it.

[@krishall4621]

Rally games are stuck in a time warp since RBR How in 2023 you can’t edit pace notes is bonkers to me. It’s such an important personal part of rally that can be taking into real world rallying. Instead we just smash it up on the same dodge massively inconsistent notes. I mean how hard can it be.

[@DouglasThompson]

Ya...it really is sad how ignored the authenticity is. No game has truly captured the feel for me at least. I so want this upcoming game to blow me away

[@neandertalac]

EA buying a studio means we're getting a Project Cars 3 - mobile game.

[@DouglasThompson]

Lol

[@Vakiwey]

Yeah we want that📢 cool video. Although is gonna be difficult. Everyone have different sensations with each rally game. But there are more chances modders start modding the great DR2 and stop modding what they are now, than having the rally sim we all want. Oh btw, maybe I miss understood but in DR2 you can use your wheel to drive and game pad to move around menus.

[@DouglasThompson]

I'm talking about on PC in VR with that statement, sorry for the lack of clarity I was kinda just ranting lol. Dr2.0 still hasn't been cracked, the developers locked it down tight. Games like assetto corsa and Richard Burns rally were designed to be more easily altered in the files but I do agree, we are more likely to be able to mod dr2.0 (which I would love) than to have this next game be able to do those things.

[@Vakiwey]

@@DouglasThompson Yeah me too. I play in VR PC, wheel for driving and gamepad for menus.

[@DouglasThompson]

@vakiwey873 oh, I'm sure I could hook up controllers but in that case I could just use the vr controllers but then you're blindly reaching around for those lol. The mouse is a bit more intuitive I feel.

[@Vakiwey]

@@DouglasThompson I don’t use Quest controllers anymore. For Quest menu, hand traking and for Rift menu, gamepad

[@jacbelgrave6163]

I would like them to bring back the option to create championships. I like to recreate real world rally seasons championships.

[@DouglasThompson]

Like In dr2.0? I'm sure that feature will return.

[@dinaqobe4238]

It should be possible to do a simulation Rally Game with max driving aids for me 😁😜

[@DouglasThompson]

I'm sure they will add features galore! :) I just want the ability to have the raw experience as well!

[@Themisterdee]

All that wishlist from a yearly released console port ? . Wrc 23 UE4/5 based if rumors are true. which doesnt bode well for ' physics.' thats why Kunos walked away from that engine for ac2 will look pretty and be different. and thats about it. No company has the guts or finances to release a PC only rally game . which is a shame.

[@DouglasThompson]

I wasn't positive they went with that engine though I heard talk about it. Isn't acc on unreal engine? Is U5 not a very physics based engine? May e codemasters squeezed more out of it than the ac team?

[@Themisterdee]

Yes acc uses ue4 .Kunos 's Massarutto said for AC 2 they needed "greater flexibility" (04/22). Sort of implying that there are limits to what can be achieved inside the UE box. As it wont be graphics or netcode, it leaves just the physics .. I know im hoping for the best but wont be surprised if its more aimed at the"mass market' .

[@DouglasThompson]

@@Themisterdee perhaps u5 is improved on the physics front.

[@dubtube6691]

Today I started dirty rally 2.0 in VR again. First I thought the performance graph is wrong of steam VR. But no it's not. 40% GPU and 25% CPU with high settings. The only thing that doesn't look good is my valve index. But what a difference in performance! What the heck is Codemasters doing with EA WRC ! Everything is getting worse. Thank God I only paid twenty Bugs for this stupid experience and not the original price

[@DouglasThompson]

Ya...it's pretty bad in VR. They need some serious help from the community.

[@WRCSeb]

I hope its like rbr (modded) and with a graphics upgrade

[@DouglasThompson]

Agree

[@atzufuki]

Even tho RBR is originally a proprietary game, the modding community has turned it into a community driven game. That is the only reason RBR is so great. Of course modding RBR has it's limits, you can't update it to today's standards in areas like UX, graphics, etc. But the next WRC game is going to be even more proprietary, modding or community development is not a thing. You can't do anything for the physics, if they are poor. My point is that we don't need another rally game based on sells nor a sequel in the following years. We need an agile open source development community to build a game which get's better over time. The tactical shooter called Operation: Harsh doorstop is a great example of this.

[@DouglasThompson]

Beam NG and Assetto Corsa can step in on RBR territory very quickly once a dedicated team really cracks down on making a competent rally focused package but until that happens rbr still remains on top.

[@atzufuki]

@@DouglasThompson Assetto Corsa was so close, but they won't implement gravel physics so we are back at the start. BeamNG has a good base, but I don't see the development going to right direction just yet.

[@vedadtursum6341]

what is this track callled in rbr?

[@SleepyPantsSimRacing]

Which one?

[@SleepyPantsSimRacing]

The first one is helfstyn, then rz kamenuk, then biskupice 2004, then the last one is nachin presin or something I can't remember.

[@vedadtursum6341]

@@SleepyPantsSimRacing all of them, im going to try them rn

[@Sofieishere]

I want wrc 23 as a version of dirt rally 2

[@DouglasThompson]

what do you mean?

[@CsanadCzToth]

>Playstation 2 NPCs This guy never played WRC: Rally Evolved. Btw I think it would be cool if rarely you could catch up to others and overtake them.

[@DouglasThompson]

Yes, I have. :) that's what I started on.

[@AutySim]

Some nice wishlist items in there.

[@DouglasThompson]

Hope a few of them come true!!!

[@jacbelgrave6163]

They gotta nailed the engine sound of the c4.

[@DouglasThompson]

:)

[@mrbeckham666]

in general, the reason is one EA is money. there are too few of us EA sees money in children it must be average to sell. Kind of like that whole fifa shit :) I also like football but this game is a tragedy.

[@nindschaYT]

1:20 Why is this a point? DiRT Rally nails it completely, unless you're comparing WRC 23 vs WRC Generations?

[@DouglasThompson]

Ya that was a wrc generations jab lol

[@Tycy2014]

Next your gonna say if I flip I wanna feel the filp, I want my arm broken... come on code masters.... Jk jk, I agree with you 100% on what you want I am just tampering my expectations because code masters did not deliver on solid upgrade form 1.0 to 2.0... 2.0 is a "new" game but it really feels like a 2.0; an update

[@DouglasThompson]

I so hope it's not structured like dr2.0. I'm disappointed by how hollow the game felt. It was fun online though.

[@iandouglas-gq2nd]

How about in career mode your first co driver is ameture and makes mistakes but not enough to send you over a cliff but they get better as you progress

[@DouglasThompson]

Interesting idea...never heard that one before. Would be frustrating but add realism. So maybe just forgetting to add a modifier here and there?

[@godofdestructiondiecast6756]

Dirt 3.0 I wish they had more cars up there I want to Drive the 206 and 307 and xsara wrc and I forgot about skoda

[@DouglasThompson]

They had the 206 in dr2.0 didn't they? I really only drove the Subarus and Fiestas lol so you're probably right.

[@RVRCloset]

A whole lot of great points mate! 😃👍

[@DouglasThompson]

Well hello!!! Welcome RVR! How are things?

[@RVRCloset]

@@DouglasThompson Only a month or so till spring, so pretty good.😁 All well with you?

[@DouglasThompson]

@@RVRCloset as in a month or two before we might see the new wrc game? Or do you mean for weather reasons? :)

[@RVRCloset]

@@DouglasThompson Hehehe, weather, but looking forward to hear your view on WRC 23 as well of course!✌️😁👍

[@DouglasThompson]

@@RVRCloset same for you, you gonna pick it up?

[@amID0n]

3:13 actually sometimes my body looks like a tripod…

[@DouglasThompson]

You are an impressive human representation!

[@amID0n]

@@DouglasThompson I’m pretty sure you are also a walking tripod 😂

[@DouglasThompson]

I haven't heard a complaint yet...besides it hurts. Lol

[@Catty1985]

That’s it! No more no less !

[@DouglasThompson]

Lol thank you.

[@qwq872]

in the end its all about the money they don´t do it for free, they want they're money back or eaven more, if you make a game for only simracers then you reach out only little amount of people, business wise its not smart move from ea or codmasters also dlc´s is smart move to sell same game twice or more to make extra money and with only 5 years development i don't believe they can reach your expectations

[@DouglasThompson]

That's why I'm hoping they include a "hardcore" mode in conjunction with a normal mode, so they can appeal to both.

[@PlateformeHorizon25]

Dirt rally can never close the gap with RBR (RSF).

[@DouglasThompson]

We shall see...but I'm in the same camp you are. Rbr will be nearly impossible to beat in many aspects but if they can nail the physics...I will be happy.

[@PlateformeHorizon25]

@@DouglasThompson Codemasters has plenty of possibilities to develop a good FFB, but they will never do it because it is above all a commercial decision. The 1st or 2nd update they did to dirt rally 2 killed the FFB (very noticeable on the tarmac which was great at the start, who remembers?). For what reason? For a commercial reason because many players (certainly not simulation fans) had complained about the difficulty of driving on this surface. I waited like you for them to reconsider their decision, they never did. Anyway, keep good work budy !

[@stephenglennon9584]

You'd like WRC Rally Evolved if you want lived-in locales

[@DouglasThompson]

From ps2?

[@stephenglennon9584]

@@DouglasThompson Yeah, it has moving spectators and environmental hazzards

[@filefilip4117]

Oh yeah dirt 2.0 I started the career and lost interest, came back after some time, seen a bunch of cars and did not know where they came from. Alt F4

[@DouglasThompson]

Lol I got to masters in rallycross I can't Remember what I got to in rally but it was purely grindy feeling to me the only thing I liked about it was I didn't know what course I was going to have to do next I think.

[@cat-yi9cg]

I personally think wrc should only make a game every other year so they have more time on each game. The every year stlye has all the games feeling the same with a new feature each year but really no huge improvements.

[@DouglasThompson]

The reveal is out. I also made a video about my thoughts...

[@cat-yi9cg]

@DouglasThompson well I have not seen it yet and I hope it's more positive then negative and u will never ever get a true Sim from codemasters and EA so with that in mind I have learned to appreciate what I get and that makes the experience of the game better instead of focusing on things I can do nothing about