The Suffering 1 and 2: Starting Right and Ending Wrong

Buy The First Suffering - af.gog.com/game/the_suffering...
Buy The Second Suffering - af.gog.com/game/the_suffering...
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[Twitter] - / avalanchejared
This is a collection of my reviews of the Suffering series. They were released individually several weeks apart, but now I'm putting them together so people have something long to watch while they do homework or whatever.
The Suffering widescreen patch -
community.pcgamingwiki.com/fi...
00:00 Intro
02:08 S1 Development
03:56 S1 Story
15:09 S1 Spoilers
19:11 S1 Story Cont
21:32 S1 Gameplay
28:39 S1 PS2 Port Gameplay
30:36 S1 Xbox Port Gameplay
33:10 S1 PC Port Gameplay
35:43 S1 Gameplay Conclusion
37:46 S1 Presentation
42:36 S1 PS2 Port Presentation
46:11 Xbox port Presentation
51:08 S1 PC Port Presentation
53:54 S1 All Ports Compared
54:38 S1 Conclusion
56:42 S2 Intro
57:49 S2 Development
59:51 Ad
01:03:06 S2 Story
01:09:38 S2 Spoilers
01:13:12 S2 Story Cont
01:23:46 S2 Gameplay
01:41:06 S2 Presentation
01:46:31 S2 PS2 Port Presentation
01:50:31 S2 Xbox Port Presentation
01:52:28 S2 PC Port Presentation
01:56:07 S2 All Ports Compared
01:56:55 S2 Conclusion
01:69:49 End

[@jplayer073]

Video is too short, but I'll give it a chance

[@reiddutchess9955]

Way too short.

[@AvalancheReviews]

I've failed you all

[@reiddutchess9955]

@@AvalancheReviews not even close 😂 I just plugged you the other day when Sphere Hunter was on SkillUp’s new podcast discussing resident evil. I said that you and Suzi are the authorities on Resident Evil on KZbin. Clearly you are also knowledgeable about many other games though!

[@videoplayback_]

@@AvalancheReviews you knwo the video is good when the intro is good

[@sc7696]

Rough

[@kyledodson2992]

This is my fav KZbin channel. Not to make you uncomfortable but your channel was key in my sobriety. Thank you for comforting me in my withdrawals. My first 2 weeks of no alcohol weren’t that bad but your channel helped me lay in bed and smile. I’ve been clean 11 months

[@karenamyx2205]

Happy 1 year broskie.

[@ab-gail]

Congrats, man!

[@GenericLoser12]

you go king, here's to many more

[@HellAintHalfFull]

This is so cool to read. I also got sober (it's been 2 and a half years since I've drank) and was watching these videos to help keep my mind off of it. Keep fighting!

[@kyledodson2992]

@@HellAintHalfFull always lol I’m well beyond the cravings. Dated a gal for about 8 months who drank. I’m good now lmao

[@12ealDealOfficial]

For those wondering (even after the introduction), this a combo of Jared's previously uploaded Suffering videos.

[@uberwarlocker]

I think what The suffering did well was sparking interest with the city i grew up in and it's less than peaceful past. I learnt a lot about the atrocities and it's perpetrators, yes it's somewhat romanticized, but very faithful to actual happenings. Most if not all of the games antagonists were actual depraved humans.

[@WolfHreda]

Oh, man. There's been a good amount of videos about The Suffering the last couple weeks. I love it.

[@TurbulentEitri]

Holy cow this is a long one. I remember playing the early section of the first Suffering and having it leave such a strong impression.

[@igodreamer7096]

Very short lived series, but worth to check it out. From that time the Midway was trying everything. Psi-Ops: The Mindgate Conspiracy, another good one to give a shot!

[@DREADEDuuubGAMING]

I absolutely loved that game. My neighbor had it and jet set radio two of the first actual games I played that wasn’t Mario or crash bandicoot

[@boccia2409]

Ah this is all bringing back memories! This era of gaming sucks

[@eternalgaming5300]

@@boccia2409 What no more originality and monopolies do to a mf

[@davewilder3979]

Area 51 on PS2 and Xbox was also an excellent Midway shooter from that era.

[@eternalgaming5300]

@@davewilder3979 The game cover still gives me the chills, and the core memory of seeing your squad get brutally killed.

[@yorchito0808]

I enjoyed both ganes back in the day, they really had their moments.

[@mikedrop4421]

Thank you Jared. I needed this today. I didn't even sleep 3 hours total last night and I now have this to listen to as I drift off to dreamland. Thanks for looking out for the homies

[@orwellianson]

I wish a company like Night Dive Studios would remaster this game and bring it to modern consoles.

[@thegamingprozone1941]

Omg that would be awesome

[@orwellianson]

Aww yee

[@thegamingprozone1941]

@@orwellianson yeahhhh!

[@Phantasm57]

I had this game on PS2 and I absolutely enjoyed it. In retrospect to me it was like you have Resident evil and Silent Hill then you have this, to me this was like the Arkham Asylum of the survival type games. The prison aesthetic was really unique to me. I liked how all the monsters were themed after execution methods. Something to note as well was that in the PS2 version there is a behind the scenes Documentary about Eastern State Penitentiary. The Prison was where the production team got its influence,ideas and inspiration for the game

[@HeroEmiya]

Condemned Criminal Origins review would be sick!

[@SpecterVonBaren]

You going to tackle another grungy style game series that came out around the same time and had a surprisingly similar pattern of good first game followed by bad second game (Heck, they both even have the Fight Club plot twist in it), Manhunt? Man the first Manhunt is good at setting an atmosphere, a criminally forgotten horror classic.

[@psicogames5509]

Ok... 2 hours, it's 8:20 am and I just got back from work, in going to bed watching this, thanks.

[@indigopotatomusic7471]

Another great video, loved it! I enjoyed both of these games back on the PS2 when they came out. Never had them for my Xbox, but I loved them both for what they were.

[@bobmclovinelectricboogaloo]

I find myself thinking horror video games more often than not are superior to horror movies 1. Typically better characters, character writing 2. Typically a better story and at times world building 3. The nature of being a video game allowing it to be more immersive and it allows you to explore the world and interact with it.

[@Gamentropy]

Writing this before I start watching. Never played these titles, but I've worked in games retail for years and the back of the box description for the Suffering 2--comparing the city to a prison in an effort to repeat the gimmick--always cracks me up.

[@SiliconSlyWolf]

I never found non-video game horror particularly scary. Especially not in comparison to video game horror. Even in third person view, you're far more immersed into the setting.

[@Nate_the_Nobody]

One thing I noticed when comparing the PS2 to the Xbox is that the Xbox actually has anti-aliasing while the PS2 doesn't, that makes a big difference in quality

[@adamfrazer5150]

As much as I'll always love a dozen classic slasher movies.....The films that truly frightened me ended up being those that did so much more by showing me less - films that show you the scene, leaving you to decide whether or not one of the shadows just moved.

[@andrewzvara6102]

Damn dude, you put in so much work and imo you don't get enough views. I love the passion

[@nonprofitpsycho3122]

I played these games years ago and it took me till just now to realize there's Evil in Carnate. Get it? As in Evil incarnate? I'll see myself out now.

[@adamfrazer5150]

Sidebar : anyone interested in an amazing prison-themed show, proceed immediately to 'The Night Of' 👍

[@revlouder5865]

I usually use these longer vids to help me sleep so thank you for this

[@ThePokkeli]

Using these for same purpose. Like a podcast

[@ziplockcreations2313]

I've got one of those Logitech mice with the numpad on the side of it. Pretty handy for inventory selections using 1-0.

[@listener709]

Think I can fix 2 The island is experimenting with inmates with research killjoy left behind to transfer souls and revive blackthorn torque was a failed experiment that while failed left him with the beast the new protagonist also an inmate is more successful but blackthorn doesn't have total control so the foundation wants to kill them so they can free blackthorn soul and try again the monsters come from a paradox where someone who belongs to hell isnt there All these while blackthorn himself is trying to take over your mc body Good ending would be killing blackthorn similar to the other kingpins boss fights bad ending would end with blackthorn taking over and sending mc to hell in his place

[@maruraba1478]

6:35 that dude is my hero. I’ve said I would find a save room immediately and hold up for the long haul lol

[@InferisDCB]

At first i was like "2 hours! How? It's a short game" Forgot about how much history telling there is about the location in the first game. I also realized we are a guest and the location and it's history are the main character. Played through it multiple times to get the different endings. I loved the idea of changing monsters in the TTB, but also didn't like the change in health and ammo use. Didn't like that game so much, only playing it once. And started the bad run, but Quake4 and Most Wanted got priority. Seeing this vid, kames me want to play the original again - thanks

[@dayofthedan]

Love this long form stuff

[@jake1988h]

Another great video made by a great content creator! Thanks!

[@AvalancheReviews]

Great? I'd settle for OK. Ha! Thanks man!

[@jake1988h]

@@AvalancheReviews in my opinion it was great.

[@Skreezilla]

the Thompson was used by the US upto the late 70's if i remember right, i know they were still being used in Ireland in the late 90s as a common weapon for the IRA. They had a pretty long service life. I am not sure when the game is set? but it looks like maybe the early 70s? so if that is the case then prisons would still be using the Thompson, possibly with drums too for riot control. I have a strong feeling that Alcatraz guards had a drum fed tommy gun, but that is mainly from movie watching and the odd documentary. The FBI retired the Tommy gun in like 1980 i think? not sure on the US prison system, but seeing this prison seems pretty crap i imagine they would have out dated guns too. As always

[@WolfHreda]

The Suffering takes place in pretty modern times, this prison is just old, poorly funded, and basically in the middle of nowhere.

[@Skreezilla]

@@WolfHreda would not have gussed modern times tbh, even the 2nd one has that 70s vibe and look to it. thanks for letting me know! :D Honestly by 2000 though even the most underfunded backwater nowhere prison would have phased out the Thompson though i imagine.

[@torshec8634]

"The Suffering to End This Suffering Review!" The suffering never ends!

[@MitchManix]

Another banger mate

[@AFoxInFlames]

I remember playing this, and kinda not remember lol. Couldn't really remember the story but I just remember loving the monster design. God I'm old.😂❤

[@Gr1fter001]

You should cover the Syphon Filter games! (the ps1 titles) I've been replaying them on my emulator and I've had a blast, particularly with how good Syphon Filter 2 is, and I really would love to see your opinion on the Stealth Genre. Personally I've always thought Survival Horror and Stealth Action are relatively similar, both are more puzzle like and planning oriented rather than relying on reflexes. And both Genres have kinda lost themselves in the modern gaming trends. Sure every game has a form of stealth in it now, but Stealth Action made the stealth nessecary because your enemies were stronger, more numerous, better equipped than you and easily beat you in a straight fight. But many modern stealth games make it so easy to just murder everyone if you get spotted - making the stealth practically pointless other than set dressing to have fun. An example is that I love how MGSV plays, but if I get spotted I just have to be good enough at the game and call in a chopper and pretty soon I've wiped out every Soviet Soldier in the central base camp. There's no punishment for sounding the alarm other than the idea that I've failed at being stealthy.

[@supersunpass3000]

That would be awesome!

[@TheLukeylala]

You should try the Styx games if you haven't yet. You're weak in those so staying stealthy is a must, you can also alert guards by landing on solid floor instead of carpet or knocking into loose bits of furniture etc. As a stealth game fan I loved them.

[@warlord1873]

I loved ties that bind and the fat dude that appears with the hellish dogs used to freak me out man

[@current9300]

I really like how The Suffering takes various concepts of institutional evil and turns it into literal monsters. The sequel moved a bit onto making monsters out of societal evil (like the serial killer representing violent misogyny) and it was still a great idea. It would be neat to see similar takes on more abstract but real evil manifesting as concrete monstrosities from some other developers too.

[@scientificbrony]

A suffering with a world like the evil within 2 would be a dream sequel

[@michaelallain7706]

Merciful fuck, you have taken the edge of two hours of making a special pasta sauce. Thank you for that.

[@robertotubil6896]

As far as I can remember, Torque only spoke once in the entire franchise. And that was in the intro scene of Ties that bind.

[@tottenham2294]

Funny enough he only speaks at the start if you start the game as “good”

[@robertotubil6896]

@@tottenham2294 what do you mean? He speaks in neutral too. Havent played the game in bad morality but I think that prison intro scene doesn’t change no matter the morality.

[@Ausf.D.A.K.]

These two games are AMAZING !

[@Texelion3Dprints]

Took me an hour to notice I've seen this already, I thought I was going crazy... guess I'm the next one on the list for Alzheimer in the family...

[@CruelestChris]

Suffering 3: "Torque! You have a third extra personality, and it's _the President!_ "

[@Thisisnotadreamhaha]

I'll head over now and give hom a shot

[@shazmanbound1496]

Midway didn't go out of businesses. They were purchased by WB and renamed to NetherRealm Studios

[@andreworders7305]

50:31 the more echoey PS1 version sounds more appealing to me for some reason. Also, nice voice acting.

[@bobmclovinelectricboogaloo]

I'm going to be honest with you here whenever I hear or see the words get good I think well now here's a person that smells their own farts. Lol

[@kingfreedom160]

That Baltimore meme is pretty on point, lmao

[@johnynoway9127]

Torque is a silent protagonist so it wouldnt make sense for him to reveal his life to anyone. Its always weird to me when npc's talk to you and you just kinda stand there. Feels so awkward... Why does Alex from Half Life love Gordon when he never opens his mouth or changes expressions for example.

[@Tinblitz]

I feel like maybe the writer for the game had a great idea and a lot of potential, but didn't have the experience to make it work for the second game (The ending options for the first game didn't leave a huge amount of options for continuing the story that took both endings into account), and would have benefitted hugely from a more seasoned writer helping to co-write. It could have easily flowed into bad-ending Torque forgetting a lot of his actions on Carnate island. The majority of the negative choices could have been blackouts for him, and would have given an option for a Bad-ending first game leading to a Good(ish)-Ending sequel where he has to confront who he is and what he has done in the past. He could even have ended up a conduit for anthropomorphising the things that caused the Suffering to leave Carnate and manifest itself wherever he goes, leading to a search for some way to stop that from continuing (Whether by sacrificing himself, finding a way to seal whatever Carnate Island is, or choosing to ignore it, and to just keep moving on from place to place, leaving once the Suffering catches up and tears his new home apart). Honestly, I think the first game deserves a remaster so more people can enjoy it on PC/modern consoles without having to jump through hoops. The sequel, though looking to be an improvement in regards to the use of the engine, definitely has more of a sour taste when it comes to gameplay changes and writing ("Blood makes the best lube" is such an bad, edge-lord line I wish I could unhear it). I wish I was talented enough to be a modder so I could try and fix some of the glaring issues with gameplay design too. Some sort of health replenishment when in that berserk mode that was so popular at the time. Perhaps even a way to build that berserk meter back up while in that mode to give more incentive to use it. And being able to have a supply of health again. I guess what this game could really benefit from would maybe be a series reboot, like Resident Evil 2 got. Goodness knows we're not exactly inundated with horror shooters that have black protagonists and don't shy away from the darker parts of America's past. Though if this game came out now I imagine the Steam forums would be complaining about how "woke" it is. Maybe that British guy who looks like a thumb will have a meltdown over it...

[@NickAndWolf]

Grim’s mah boy! Love that guy.

[@attackofthecopyrightbots]

Two whole big videos on the suffering damn

[@drewjames2237]

Benoit had CTE, half a bottle of wine drank,mad depression from multiple close friends dying not just eddie, and 3x the normal level of testosterone while arguing with his wife who's known to defend herself from anyone's bs then the kid walks in on the grousome mess of benoit strangling her with a phone cord so benoit gives Daniel Xanax and his position in the bed caused him to suffocate when he leaned into his pillow. Mental health is serious and that crime scene was something else RIP Benoit family

[@andreworders7305]

Sucks that you can’t bring anyone you save all the way to the end

[@jimcurtis9052]

I think we all need to hear more of Roofus’s opinion. 😸🤘

[@jamesriver3745]

This game needs a remake.....a good remake. A remake that can take advantage of the graphics. A sequel wouldn't work well I feel, since they mutilated Torque in TTB, unless they explored the past on carnate with maybe a new lead....or just do a complete new game....clean slate. I really love the first game. Imagine what they could do today! I think a TV show would be awesome too if done right.

[@ShanaynayGosby]

This was always a game I enjoyed playing on the ps2 in the 2000s and I ended up getting it on gog after seeing this video when it got dropped I forgot all about the game 😭

[@MikeySpikeyyz]

So I forget the exact details, but for a while the first suffering was free through the US Airforce. I don't know when that stopped but it was pretty neat nonetheless!

[@Fire-kid20]

Greet video bro 😎 , I’d love a third game in series if they would ever make one , I’ve always felt like if they made a third game , it would evolve around torgue making peace with his past and finally overcoming that demon that’s inside of him . I’d wish they put these two games back on the Xbox store though .

[@andreworders7305]

32:17 what’s the difference between an Internal Hardrive XBOX and one without?

[@visassess8607]

That Chris Benoit joke was great lmao

[@revlouder5865]

Oh thank god a long vid

[@pbjandahighfive]

@1:53:20 If you ever have an issue like this again you should look into learning how to use AutoHotKey. 100% the most effective tool out there for remapping, customizing, macroing and scripting for anything that you could possibly do with a keyboard. In order to use the Numpad 4&6 in this situation all you'd need to do is create a regular text file, within it type "4::Numpad4" on the first line and "6::Numpad6" on the second line and then save the file changing the end .txt to .ahk and then run the .ahk file. Now pressing 4 or 6 would activate Numpad 4 or 6. You could also map the Numpad 4&6 to any other buttons on the keyboard as well, but I'm just giving an example of how easy the fix is. To turn everything back to normal after that all you need to do is stop the script from running by ending it from the AHK icon on the taskbar.

[@lancelindqvist8848]

Awesome

[@andreworders7305]

33:11 if the first version you played for the video wasn’t the Windows version then what was it?

[@sicilianmammalian]

Finally finished roadside picnic pretty good read

[@AvalancheReviews]

Hell yeah!

[@andreworders7305]

How are all three versions ports? Isn't the PS2 version native?

[@JohnSon-vk1nz]

this is a feature movie damn :D

[@attackofthecopyrightbots]

I’m pretty sure I only have the sequel so that’s the one I’ve played the most

[@Cyclon32289]

Multi platform games of that era rarely looks good on high resolutions of today PCs, so I would go with Consoles or an emulator with a great looking shader.

[@sgt.zombie]

Do you have any plans to cover the manhunt games?

[@AvalancheReviews]

Absolutely. As soon as I’m able to ship my consoles here to Japan, I will.

[@sgt.zombie]

@@AvalancheReviews have you heard of the games called D I think they were two of them I have never seen much on them I believe they were survival horror games.

[@dr_nick1992]

I played the suffering multiple times and it's probably in one of my top games but I couldn't make it through the 2nd one.

[@AvalancheReviews]

You are not alone in that

[@Glaugan]

Are you also gonna make an Onimusha compilation video?

[@BananafiedBread]

reupload? gonna watch regardless

[@andreworders7305]

46:47 what's MS? WIndows?

[@QuickQuips]

The title also applies to the Fear franchise.

[@NotOrdinaryInGames]

Oh hey, Drakan 2!

[@vicejoy9392]

Dude is Evil in Carnate

[@theclipman9283]

I just got my Xbox copy yesterday and 2 today

[@juancarlosmorales548]

If only we have a remastered.

[@Juggalo42240]

Dude, 2 great games

[@evil_cupcake2386]

It is a shorter video than usual, but I toss a few extra points for the cat :)

[@andreworders7305]

Silent Hill 5 may have ribbed some stuff from the setting

[@blitzkrieg2928]

2 hours ? is this Christmas ?

[@Axel_Xirics_Music]

I have a strong suspicion over the fact that the story of the second game was waiting for a resolution in a third game, but given Midway had their own financial issues, that didn't really allow for that even though, the devs more than likely had stuff on the table just ready to brainstorm for a third game and start rolling it off. Who knows, maybe the modern day Netherrealm, which is basically Midway reborn, might somehow, through the absurd, bring the franchise back like they did with Mortal Kombat 9 ( 2011 ).

[@andreworders7305]

51:41 the US Air Force!? What the...?

[@warlord1873]

Torques first game monster form looks more evil than the second game

[@kinggroguswrojas8530]

Very scary stuff but I support clan brother! Give him lots of views goodie people and boku boxes cause they are nice to give for him doing scary stuff.

[@DangerIncFilms]

The Suffering on PC is finicky as hell to get started. I feel like the game chooses when it’s time to play it.

[@punisha4032]

How are they all ports, the PS2 and Xbox versions are native and lead versions

[@AvalancheReviews]

Well, I guess they all aren't ports, but it would be hard to compare ports if we didn't also cover the original releases. Also, "46 ports and 7 native versions compared" doesn't sound as nice as a title.

[@warlord1873]

I honestly don't think they would make these games in this day and age

[@MisfitOutfit]

Chris Benoit joke was chefs kiss.

[@knightofnut1927]

Are ps3 and 360 not retro now?

[@andreworders7305]

What’s the difference between 480i and 480p

[@shazmanbound1496]

You failed to mentioned that the creatures were designed by Stan Winston.

[@zombieclone98]

Me and all my homies love Grimbeard

[@Xegethra]

Just finished the PS2 version of 1 today. It was O.K. cheesy but fun. It's not all that horror though, not scary. It's like Halloween, spooky themes but not actually scary. Of course in real life my opinion on these events would change, but in a video game, meh. It's cool.

[@14141313]

i bought it on sale :D

[@charlesdexterward7781]

What's up goth gamer nation?

[@dayman4152]

...thank you

[@TheBoxNasty]

Why hasn’t Avalanche covered the evil within games? I’m curious on what his take is on them

[@simplyshane6477]

He hates them. Lol

[@TheBoxNasty]

@@simplyshane6477 oh man has he said this in a video?

[@simplyshane6477]

@@TheBoxNasty I’m sure he has. My dudes a traditionalist with survival horror and evil within doesn’t really hit that mark. But if you see this Jared, you should maybe try evil within 2. It’s NOT survival horror per say, but it captures this scary locked in a haunted ghost town vibe.

[@AvalancheReviews]

He speaks the truth!

[@AvalancheReviews]

I will. I'm planning a video on both of em.