Debunking Doug Wilson's Christian Prince Arguments

Doug Wilson is arguing for a "Christian prince" in other words a government that is Christian enforcing "Christian ideals" on nations. Let's talk about how wrong he is, because he's really really wrong here.

[@mattwilly7959]

I've never been able to understand how people can listen to Doug without wanting to bang their head into a wall. His monotone, and pacing of speech drives me crazy...... And he's a master of using so many words, and yet saying nothing

[@LampWaters]

To hide that, he's not talking in the spirit just like Joel. I've never heard either of them talk with the spirit it's always just the man speaking and with a pompous mindset like they believe they are smarter than everyone else. The Holy Spirit doesn't talk like that.

[@Wren_Farthing]

I heard an interview with Wilson's old philosophy professor who said exactly what you're saying here, that he's a "master of sophistry." Apparently, this is his particular talent, using words and phrases that sound erudite, but strip it away and you see...not much, or, worse, really bad ideas.

[@LampWaters]

@SkAte-88 look up 3 forms of witchcraft, how about manipulation word manipulation. The training and education and sermons, videos they provide are all to teach this strategy not the gospel. The direct aim isn't the world, it's the church. They think that the church is in error and they won't ever be able to bring in their Kingdom or takeover institution if the church is the one standing in their way. They believe all their problems is the church's fault. It's not possible for their to be a Protestant church in their worldview, protest wouldn't be allowed under their kingdom and prince.

[@Mr2001ghost]

Doug Wilson is saying that the only way to know something is wrong in the political realm is through the scriptures and he defines ‘Christian Nationalism’ as applying the scriptures to the political realm. This is a very different argument than ‘trust me bro it’ll work this time’

[@Underdogtheology]

But that still is trust my application of the scriptures. It’s the same thing.

[@Mr2001ghost]

@@Underdogtheology not really. He’s admitted himself that within the ‘Christian nationalism’ movement there are a lot of differences in exegesis and application of the scriptures and he’s by no means being dogmatic about his particular vision for Christendom. This is why he calls it ‘Mere Christendom’. The difference between Doug and Stephen Wolfe for example is stark. What Doug is saying is that any application of the scriptures to the political realm is Christian Nationalism. Because it is using the Christian measuring rod (the bible) to determine, critique, or otherwise influence the national/political state of affairs. Obviously we’re not going to work this out in the KZbin comments section but I appreciate your response nonetheless.

[@leighalaughlin4056]

There is no way to apply it to scripture. It's 180 from scripture. There is verse after verse I could cite. The first is my kingdom is not of this world.

[@TheMaineSurveyor]

I don’t trust anyone who means to have authority over me for my own good, whether that person is Christian or otherwise.

[@Star-dj1kw]

True. but I see Doug as a false teacher and Heretic

[@finnthewise]

Hey guys, I know communism hasn't worked in the past, but we haven't tried MY version yet 😂

[@semiobeats]

Dude has no conscience. Thanks for dealing with this guy's nonsense.

[@brandonl.underwood6264]

I was watching up until the point he said "If you're a baptist, you can't be a theonomist"...

[@Underdogtheology]

Well part of being a baptist is separation of church and state it’s built into our dna. Sorry, but it’s true.

[@brandonl.underwood6264]

@@Underdogtheology What do you even mean by that? I don't pretend to be an expert on theonomy, but no one I know who is a theonomist (many of whom are baptist, btw) promotes state churches, they generally want to limit government to their proper sphere of sovereignty and expect them to uphold laws that honor Christ.

[@paulvoit5610]

​@@brandonl.underwood6264That doesn't sound anything like the theonomy that Doug Wilson or Joel Webbon are talking about.

[@amolinguas]

Between the 15:53 and 16:01 mark, you are absolutely correct! It's not about the gospel anymore with Christian nationalists.

[@Star-dj1kw]

So right!! This looks NOTHING like the book of Acts.

[@semiobeats]

Reminds me of the "Real Socialism has never been tried before!"

[@Star-dj1kw]

What does Doug mean “the restoration of Western civilization”? Does he mean going back to when women could not vote and minorities were segregated? 😳 BE SPECIFIC DOUG. I like freedom of choice. I am not a Calvinist. Jesus did not force people to follow Him. Preaching the good news and loving 🥰 people wins souls not dominionism.

[@dylansaurusrex21]

I don't think it's fair to say the main goal of all these guys is to convert organizations alone. The Christianization of institutions will be a logical by-product of individual souls being saved. So, my understanding of the great commission has room for both individuals coming to Christ and for Christian principles to be established on an organizational level because of the salvation of individuals. It's both-and, not one-or-the-other as this video frames it.

[@MATTHEWJOHNBELL]

I don’t think you actually dealt with any of his arguments. This video was mostly about how you don’t think Wilson has a compelling writing style, is proper up by good production, and you don’t like the way he promotes their books. Okay, fine. But what about his argument?

[@LampWaters]

There's a difference between thinking that you can intellectually understand the Bible or God versus actually believing and actually having faith. So many people these days actually think you have to be able to hold these very complex conversations and arguments and debates about the Bible. but really we're not asked to do that we are off to tell others about the hope that is in us and we are asked to share the gospel but when are we asked to debate intellectually the Bible itself. When oeech like this is used it pushes regular ppl away. Thats not spirit, that's man. Guess what the Bible can be hard to understand, but we have the Holy Spirit... Because you have the Holy Spirit I don't have to be some scholar intellectually to be able to receive something out of God's word. But to listen to any of these Christendom 2.0 whatever guys you can't get through it without a dictionary and a translator because there isn't a Holy Spirit. the Holy Spirit isn't guiding these men to speak the Holy Spirit isn't sitting here an translating their word because those are men's words. those are men speaking. The Holy Spirit isn't involved in this back-and-forth conversation here to help us to understand what Doug is staying. The difference between the Bible and Doug is the holy spirit interpret the Bible the Holy Spirit isn't doing any translation for Doug

[@johnswansen192]

You do have a tendency to go on And on. But I still like hearing what you say. What you said about the Great Commission is on the spot. Keep up the good work. 👍❤😊

[@LampWaters]

When so many ppl are misunderstanding lolololol. Oh no we understoood lolol. Maybe the flaw isnt in us misunderstanding but the flaw is in the argument.

[@Pruitt-Igoe]

DEAN - we want our Sonics back!!! I can’t wait to listen to this in totality.

[@jacobcarter5712]

This sounds like the argument for socialism😂