Don't Pulley Your Stock LT4

Today we discuss why adding upper pulley's to your LT4 without adding cooling mods is a bad idea.
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[@LMBC6Brian]

The knock you see from the stock tune even on 93 is programmed in the tune. It’s not actual knock but HPT VCM scanner picks it up as knock. This guy is amateur at best.

[@doubl33Ace]

Do you have a dyno? Did you use a more sophisticated software than hptuners, and what gm has? Or are you just pulling shyt out of your ahole? I'm just curious.

[@TBagr]

Any fueling changes to the LT4, without changing the cam also are wasted. The bigger fuel love on aftermarket cam is required for greater fueling that the stock cam can’t provide.

[@opmxopx]

Hope this e85/pully package comes out soon. Thank you for the explanation!

[@vincentcicchino794]

2016 z06/ thinking about e 85 and aftermarket lid is this a good progression in upgrades?

[@glennjames9152]

Boost 101: (and this goes for ANY roots blower), if you keep IAT's low, you can pulley a stock LT4 efficiently. Any ECU will start pulling timing when IAT's rise. Watch your logs and pull your plugs!

[@dohctorzc]

Great video and break down for consistent power and the average Vette owner.

[@K4gixxer1000]

Very informative. I have a turbo l83 and been struggling with fueling. I’ve replaced intank with dw400 intank pump and lt 4 hpfp and LT4 injectors and still can’t run full e85 but I am running 13 lbs of boost we haven’t denied since but made 509 at 7.9lbs of boost and 600ft lbs of torque. Had to add methanol to get to 13lbs. With full e85, basically I need a cam to make more fuel pressure on the hpfp

[@JLSpeed]

I have a zl1 and all i did was intake and headers. Kept stock pulleys and stock blower and tb. I added an aux pump and flex fuel and the car is able to run 10.0s at 135 at only e50. I rather keep the car as is and enjoy a flat 10 sec car thats basically stock lol

[@rvchipster]

JL, did you try the Flex sensor without the dx pump first? Or is the pump mandatory?

[@JLSpeed]

@@rvchipster I had the flex sensor without the pump first and most e I could do was around e37

[@Highlander1432]

Has the Aux pump been reliable ? I hear some leak or don't work well if gas is 1/4 tank full or less

[@JLSpeed]

@@Highlander1432 the pump worked well for the year I had the car. So far seemed reliable once you installed it properly.

[@Highlander1432]

@JLSpeed Thanks man I'm considering getting the AUX fueling with my LT1 fuel system to run E blend...I'm supercharged too

[@Turbo329]

Can you run a 2.3 upper pulley with an E40-E50 mix? This way you get the added boost with the benefit of cooling from the Ethanol....

[@g1rthbrooks016]

yes you can i’m running the set up rn 2019 A10

[@knjpollard]

What if you added the interchiller? I have just installed the DSX on my stock C7 Z06, but have not tuned it yet. Running 93 still and the car behaves as if nothing has changed at this point. I have an MPVi3 coming next week and I plan to turn on Flex Fuel in the ECU, create the base tune, and add E50. After that I will capture logs from a 10 minute drive with a few pulls and see where it needs refined. I have heard about O2 sensors going bad after E85 runs in the car, but its possible that is due to bad tunes. However, I have also read the angle of the bung for the sensor can foster condensation forming in the O2 sensor(s) which kills it. I guess I will find out soon.

[@dsmubz]

Yup made a big difference in my car, went from 60-130 mph in the 8s to the high 6s. 😳

[@hamemax23]

with a pulley upgrade?

[@dsmubz]

@@hamemax23 no pulley upgrade, just a $100 air filter, X pipe and E50 sensor and tune.

[@hamemax23]

@@dsmubz sick dude, what did it put down to the wheels if you dont mind me asking

[@dsmubz]

@@hamemax23 ask away it put down 546 rwhp on pump gas and 605 rwhp on E50% on a dynojet here at my shop in Livingston Ca. It's a 2016 z06 automatic.

[@hamemax23]

@@dsmubz thats a good time improvement, i hit a 8.1 60-130 and 6.4 100-200kmh in a stock M7. going in for fbo soon 6 second 60-130 is the goal and a 100-200 in the 5s

[@gpieschke]

Agree !00% !!! 50% E85 ...stock pulley !!! As a road racer .....who runs equally prepared ZL1 1 LE's ...and C7 Zo6's with friends ...my stock pulley car runs just as fast or faster on the straight aways as they're pulleyed cars , that are pulling timing from excessive intake temps !!!

[@gbass7328]

No E85 in the North East in general.

[@johnnieburge4997]

Can you do a video on the LT5? Can you run Flex fuel on the ZR1 with Direct injection & port injection? I’m certain that port injection keep everything cool as well

[@DriverJizzle]

What about adding an aux pump and then a pulley?

[@allantejada1528]

Does this advise still count for a 10 or 15% lower pulley?

[@JMGENTERPRISES]

I have a 9% lower pulley on my C7Z and haven't had any issues. I don't track the car. Just spirited driving on the freeway.

[@Zle_blacklightning]

I'm installing Lth, big gulp, rotofab with E60, and a auxiliary pump. How's that sound? Sounds easier jus doing the E 60 with tune dag.

[@mach183]

Buy the fuel system * and run e85

[@sergioduran3545]

@@mach183 Which fuel system you recommend for a 6 gen zl1?

[@FloridaFlyer2]

What about a 2.3" pulley just to compensate for density altitude? In Denver, for example. Blower is spinning more, but the cylinder pressure is no higher than it was a sea level due to altitude.

[@ClaytonYatescarenthusiast]

Still creating heat based on blower speed. Then you remove the denser air that was helping cool blower and creates even more heat. If you want more than ported blowers with a lower can work. With e50 you can run an upper and not have issues in a street or 1/4 situation. He's kinda going overboard in this video with no pulley information. Just doing a 2.3 on pump 91 or 93 can make more power but usually just creates heat that then pulls all the timing and makes less. Like 1 pull and then full cool off. That's not always the case but po8nt he's stressing.

[@ramadonscamaro]

How about i have a Stage 3 Custom Fuel System/E85/Lingenfelter Big Bore Direct Injection High Volume Fuel Pump/FIC GDI LT4 High Flow +30% Direct Injection/DSX Tuning Auxiliary Fuel Pump Kit Circle D Custom Torque Convertor / trans tune. AAD Performance Drag Pack Kit With (Nitto 275/30ZR20 NT555 G2 Weld Laguna 20" Front Wheels) (Weld Laguna 17x10 Mickey Thompson ET Street R Tire - P305/45R17 ). How much do you think i can do on a 1/4 mile with and without a Full DSS 9” and Upgraded Pulleys ? With and without Meth? Please be honest . I didnt take it to the track yet . But i was thinking of putting a upgraded upper pulley and a TOOPSI 10rib pulley tensioner upgrade with lower pulley

[@dgvette1]

What about using unleaded race gas? Like 104 octane

[@MrDanimal77]

We dont get e85 in north western canada where im at ..... so thats irrelevant

[@hotdude655]

Get a kong 2650 if you want to make some power.

[@sandersonjd776]

That 1.7 blower is so small in displacement that it's less efficient when spun hard. I'm not sure why GM went this route versus a 2.3 , 2.6, or 3.0.

[@mach183]

What about a ported 1.7 ??

[@darkskinz0617]

Well it was all about fitting tha with keeping everything packed with the vette I mean but then they did a bigger one for the zr1 they could of definitely do a 2.3 they raised the hood for a z06 they would of been fine

[@corvetteZ3r]

@@mach183 ported stock blowers are pretty good. They’re in the 8’s

[@kevincuthrell1176]

Thus dude is just trying to sell his new package. I have a Lingenfelter pulley kit in my ZL1 With kooks headers and Borla exhaust CAI Airbox and custom tune.773 at crank 648 wheel and 792 torgue on 93 octane .it is strong.

[@BuiltByLondonRacing]

Good Stuff Fellas

[@sleasy01]

Just upgrade the tiny blower. I've seen 80hp upgrade with a smaller pulley. I knew this was bull once he tried to sell us his product. A smaller pulley and a tune will in fact makes nearly 100 horses. Not sure if their lying or incapable.

[@knjpollard]

You missed the point which was that pulley only creates a lot of heat. The car will lose all 80 hp it gained after just one run.

[@sleasy01]

@@knjpollard no. I got the point. The point is their trying to sell you their product. Their telling you not to buy a product but to buy theirs. KZbin ZL1 pulley upgrade with Dyno. It's plenty of people making power with a pulley and intake and tune that have no issues. Ive been around too long kid to know when someone is trying to sell me a product by bashing other products.

[@lg740xx]

@@sleasy01 they’re, not their

[@sleasy01]

@@lg740xx text to talk my friend

[@Highlander1432]

@sleasy01 Dynos aren't real world conditions Upgrading just the pulley on 93 octane will create inconsistent performance. E50 mix intake/longtubes and trans tune are best unless you're upgrading Cam and fuel system

[@intensifyskillz9046]

I made 637 wheel with headers and e85 and intake

[@Boostisablast]

What headers? I’m looking at buying a set lol

[@intensifyskillz9046]

@@Boostisablast stainless works

[@1o1e12]

Great vid

[@raydelfa1125]

Ho much for this flex fuel kit for my 19 Z06?

[@dgvette1]

Cost for E-85 flex sensor and tune? 50 RWHP?

[@knjpollard]

I think its realistically more like 30RWHP assuming stock LT4 and no other changes. Adding a 5" intake adds maybe 15 more on top of that. My goals are add 50 RWHP over stock, and I have 1 of those two mods done now.

[@mjc3502]

@@knjpollard bro, I recently switched from a roto fab to the foro fab big gulp. No other changes. My mods, magnuson 2650, no 103, cam, headers, off roads. I gained.... ready.... 2hp is all I gained. We tuned it to 12.2 a/f just Like the standard roto fab and no real gain at all. I boxed it up and sent it back. I make 842hp 800tq on pump and more on E. I was disappointed the big gulp didn't gain. So, to take away the disappointed, im going from 13 to 15lbs this years.

[@articcolds]

I struggle with this opinion as racing with with 20 plus boost isn't defeating the purpose by not changing pulleys. If racing and building high boost without pulley change actually was a thing the world in racing would look much different. It's maybe the way you are tuning is wrong .

[@JaegerWrenching]

I didn't hear where they said to make high boost without a pulley change in this video? They are simply saying it's better to maintain your current boost level and yield more power by increasing timing. How you ask? Quick and short answer, you increase thermal efficiency or total power output on the same boost number by increasing timing, up to MBT. Every engine has a MBT limit where it produces maximum brake torque. Well why don't the factory tunes take advantage of this MBT and make this extra power if it's there or achievable? Pump gas is the one and only limiting factor, hence why theses guys say to go to E85 or some blend of it in this video. Pump gas is 86-94 octane as stated on your pump, E85 106ish octane even though it's not stated on the pump. The higher the octane the more cylinder pressure aka timing it can withstand before detonating, and most boosted engines need about 100-106ish to achieve MBT. The number increases with boost, Hence why adding ethanol to the fuel to increase octane means you can increase timing and ultimately achieve MBT or total capable torque/hp output from your engine... Long answer, Increasing timing or increasing boost both have the potential to make more power, which is what everyone is after right? But increasing boost increase octane required to achieve MBT and it also requires more fuel to be injected in order to maintain the same AFR for combustion stability, aka to prevent knock. You're also making the engine work harder to produce the extra boost when you're not even taking full advantage of the current boost levels because it's riding the knock threshold. When you're on pump gas you're on the knock threshold from the factory, adding more boost by a pulley down simply means you HAVE to drop timing or it will knock. Pump gas is the limiting factor holding back MBT or the power potential end of story. This is where E85 comes into play, it lets you take advantage of what that engine is actually capable of producing power wise without running into knock. Adding timing increases cylinder pressure, cylinder pressure is the one and only force in an engine that produces torque. Torque x rpm/5252=HP. Meaning if you increase torque output you increase HP, or if you maintain torque being output but increase RPM you will increase HP. Addingin timing allows you to increase or maintain the torque output for longer and thus make more power. You cannot add more timing on pump gas and therefore adding boost will force you to decrease timing and thus the total achievable cylinder pressure and torque/hp output is reduced, you're farther away from MBT than before. This is why it's not the smartest thing to increase boost when on that knock limit. Can you make more power on more boost? Yes but you're better off increasing octane and making more power on the same boost number if possible. Also being on the pump gas limit like these cars are in stock form means you're engine is constantly on the knock threshold and any one wrong thing tune wise will making it detonate!! Potentially destroying itself. So why risk it when you can go e85-e20 and give yourself more power and some wiggle room safety wise? I know it's a long answer but i hope this helps people who care to know better understand engine operation and make better choices when it comes to making power.

[@LoneWolfSnowplowing]

derp

[@dsmubz]

@@JaegerWrenching perfect explanation 👌 👏 👍 thank you.

[@jonathanphillips6722]

@@JaegerWrenching thank you for that

[@LMBC6Brian]

This is a complete incorrect explanation.

[@redlinemotorcars2184]

What is your theory?

[@LMBC6Brian]

@@redlinemotorcars2184 the perceived knock in the stock tune is intended. It’s not actual knock. It’s just picked up as knock by HPT vcm scanner. In reality, the stock ZL1 tune is calling for a very rich condition and the fuel trims pull out 10-15% just trying to keep it on stoich. You could run e30 to lean out a stock tune zl1 or zo6 and make power.

[@YGisG]

​@LMBC6Brian I'm going to agree with you that its not "true" knock, yet perception by determining unit.Also, Does make sense that the ethanol variant would lean that thang on out🤔

[@ClaytonYatescarenthusiast]

​@YGisG it would only lean it out without tuning and or flex fuel.

[@ArcticZ1]

Solid info

[@bmere8282]

So big gulp and e50 blend on zl1 . What kind of hp gain ?

[@brcraceworksinc.77]

Generally 50-60+ wheel

[@bmere8282]

@@brcraceworksinc.77 OK after that what's in your opinion next best mod? Roll car

[@tylerp3053]

@@bmere8282 Cooling. Ex Boost Chiller

[@JANNETTYRACING]

100 Percent, been saying this since the first LT4.

[@Highlander1432]

Ted Would rotofab, longtubes and E60 blend be okay on stock LT4 fuel system ?

[@JANNETTYRACING]

@@Highlander1432 With the addition of a JMS fuel system voltage booster Yes.

[@normanhanna2037]

Not worth it you kill your motor 22more hp what a waste