How Far Can a 12 Gauge Down a Turkey? | TSS vs Lead

How far can you down a turkey with a 12 gauge? How far is too far of a shot? What makes this shot ethical? Today, were diving into these questions and more to test the extent of what Federal TSS can do.
Tom Roster: www.outdoorlife.com/hunting/t...
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Steve Gould

[@markkatona292]

I'm satisfied with copper plated lead shot in #5 or #4's out to 40 yds. If I'm unable to coax a gobbler in range at 40 yds then he wins. In my estimation it's more sporting and the Tom will likely eat and taste better than eating a bunch of tss or lead. It was a great video non the less. Thanks.

[@ianharper1189]

i agree 100%

[@robertrice7492]

Federals have been the worse patterning tss I have shot. Wonder what the results would have been with something like Apex

[@claysnwingsshotgunning]

To quote Harry Callahan "A man' has to know his limitations". So ethically we know that the Shell's performance can do it, but can the shooter and his/her gear be capable of doing their job. Great video, with data that's proven for the viewer to see.

[@codythompson6960]

I thought the objective of turkey hunting was to call the bird in close? 40 yards and in for me.

[@TerryAbbott-79]

Good answer 👍

[@charleywalker2982]

Thanks for sharing your reviews and keep them coming please.

[@savagereloader6699]

My thoughts mirror that of yours. Though terminal ballistics may still be effective at range, I treat shotguns just like bow hunting, the ability to make an ethical shot at range and without hit consistency I do not beleive an ethical shot can be made. In the case of a shotgun, is all pattern distribution at given range. Great video TFL!

[@user-pp2sz7uf9u]

I am old school I guess. I use 2 3/4 lead 7.5 in a muller decoy choke and dont pull the trigger outside of 25-30 yards. Works fine and doesnt cost $15 per shot.

[@cassidybronson6891]

Rob Dyrdek of shotguns.

[@brianrandolph5611]

They dropped the bag limit from 4 to 2 in Tennessee so honestly it’s not worth the 60 to 75 dollars for a box of tss considering theirs almost 2 months of season and longbeard XR does a pretty good job out to 50

[@Swingblade-_-]

I was thinking the same thing i live in Tennessee as well

[@chuckhansen5325]

I use the xr also with my Carlson choke and shoots awesome so no I'm not spending that kind of money on shot that is not needed

[@brianrandolph5611]

If the limit was higher then maybe yeah I’d think about it but doubtful if I can’t get a bird in within 50 or closer I’m not taking the shot anyway…….I’ve normally ran an extra full in a mossberg 500a but recently bought a SX4 so I’m excited to use it this year…..did well for me during dove season

[@coreytohme9861]

What does the bag limit have to do with how much the shells cost?

[@brianrandolph5611]

Why would I spend 60 to 80 dollars for 5 shells for 2 birds when I can take them just as good with others for 1/3 of the cost……….and the bag limit and season length has everything to do with the cost of the shell the season is 2 months long for 2 birds that’s PLENTY of time to get 2 birds within range of a cheaper shell now say if the season was 1 month and 3 birds or even still 2 then yes I’d opt for the more expensive longer distance shell …….so ya see limit to length has everything to do with shell cost

[@abowhand]

Tom Roster is the man! Thanks for this video!

[@christophersodowsky1292]

I love the content as always. I do wish you had shown the tube constriction just for sheer research purposes. I also wish you had done the comparison with a 670 constriction in that gun because the mossberg with that combo and 3.5” tss is gnarly. I do not know extensive amounts of the patterns of federal but I do know well about apex in 3.5” ninja #9 tss and it makes a really good off the shelf tss round that will definitely kill a turkey at 70 yards and I would love to see the same test with that gun with what I just described for people to see.

[@beforethehunt]

Thanks for sharing!

[@jeffweisner2923]

I killed my first at 58 yards using an 870 12 ga with federal tss 3 1/2 in. Killed it impressively well. Wouldn’t take that shot if I had to do it over again. Haven’t ever taken a shot over 35 yd since. Reasons for taking the shot at that distance 1) inexperience; 2)knew it it was far (thought it about 45 yds) but misjudged the distance; 3) truck driving down the field in my direction added tension to shot decision; 4) knew the ammo was capable at distance from patterning ammo pre-season at 10 yd intervals out 70.

[@Killada3pt]

Let's all just hope you truly learned your lesson. You're obviously new if your first bird was shot with TSS. Turkey hunting is not a long distance game. And turkeys don't magically replenish their numbers regardless of how many we kill. I understand what's legal is legal. But regulations have not caught up to all of the folks shooting long distance TSS rounds at birds yet. It ain't all about the kill...

[@codyashelton9634]

Why are we even remotely entertaining anything being ethical past 40 yards. Not to mention that close up shots are a big part of the hunt. It's the challenge that draws us to the turkey hunt.

[@johnconklin5180]

I’m at about 50 to 55 yards as my max. Not changing that.

[@mrsockeye]

From my observations, 60-65 yards is the absolute limit for a 3.5" 12 gauge load, a super full turkey choke tube, and Federal TSS. I would say 50 yards for a premium copper plated lead #5 load.

[@jeremyh6640]

The flitecontrol wad may work a little better out of a standard bore barrel, with the 835 being over bored to around 10ga size.

[@curtisking4197]

My objective is to get the Tom as close as possible. With that said, I put a lot of work and money into chokes and ammo. I currently use an 870 super mag with a .650 constriction choke. I shoot federal tss #7’s , 3.5” shells. I have patterned this beast and have no problem killing nearly instantly at 65 yards.

[@alanrobinson3549]

Hi great video. Reading the comments below its all about getting the turkey in range!!!!. As for the demo you did, it was a bit floored. Personally the pattern testing should have been done with a larger piece of paper to catch all the pellets and with the amount of pellets in the shell approx 500 you can work out the percent drop plus see where the pattern went. You don't need to do the test again what you need to do is show of your calling skills in how to get the Turkey in range. Regards Alan

[@working_to_hunt]

Great video. I wish you spent more time making sure the pattern aim point was correct before shooting gel. It hard, but pattern centers 60 yards and beyond definitely change.

[@franciscocortez2633]

I love it do more TSS videos please

[@kashtonbinkholder707]

Hey remember me from your show in Hermann, Mo i want to thank you for the ESS glasses you gave me oh and i remember you guns name you use Mossberg 940 Pro

[@thelastlatchkeykid8466]

Better off with a rifle that far out. Anything beyond 60yds and we’re talking about negligent sportsmanship.

[@dondgc2298]

I understand what you’re saying but the pattern testing on some of these new loads is pretty amazing. But yeah, 60+ is a LONG way out…

[@thelastlatchkeykid8466]

@@dondgc2298 you’re right about ammo/shot tech being upped seemingly every season. And I’m all for that small subset of methodical hunters who research and experiment with loads and patterns, then are deliberate in their approach. But those hunters are rare.

[@dondgc2298]

@@thelastlatchkeykid8466 agreed. I would have liked to have seen that test through some different chokes but what he showed clearly indicated 60 was the limit for a true ethical shot. For me it would probably be less than that.

[@billsmith8596]

Ya he says that in the video brains

[@dondgc2298]

@@billsmith8596 sorry didn’t realize discussing our thoughts on the topic was forbidden here. Brains.

[@WillyK51]

He. He, Depends on how well your shotgun paterns. I got my very old Browning Superposed 26" IC/Mod( my Mom gave me back in 1970) It was a superb upland gun to 15- 25 yds. Reloading/Handloading made it a 40yds gun for everything, Quail to Deer. Could still send it out to Briely to make it a 75 yds gun🤔

[@genelyda1102]

Thank you for the video . I think I would stay in the 40 to 70 yard range . I don’t think would push it pass 60 to yards 70 yards being the limit! I think knowing your limitations of your gun is very important that being said I think barrel lance and choke is what decides it and I’ve always liked two and three-quarter inch shells 12 gauge or pushing a 20 gauge up to 3 inches

[@JudahMaccabee_]

Very cool test and awesome video. My 2 cents: Turkey sniping ain't turkey hunting.

[@JoeyNocchi]

what do you think of the Benelli AI barrel?

[@mikegore6339]

I'd be curious to see if you had the hello son dialed in for the point of impact. That's a 75 yards and did three shots and see if it's patterns correctly or to the point of aim if you will. Sort of like sighting in a rifle. How does it actually group? Perhaps the slate adjustment on the hallow sun might offer a little higher concentration of pellets on the bird

[@charlesharrell3643]

As it turns out I’ve been turkey hunting for 3+ decades all wrong. I always thought the object of the hunt was to call the bird in close. I guess these days anything less than 100 yards is acceptable. These shells have blurred the line between turkey HUNTING and turkey KILLING. ☹

[@deej9367]

Yeah, this new group of hunters seem to just want to see how far they can kill an animal. Guaranteed there wounding tons of animals

[@TheDks300]

I think that is still the object of the hunt. I’m a new hunter and I shoot TSS because of pattern density, you increase the likelihood of a kill even at 40-50 yards. If you get them close every time you should only shoot lead right, no Longbeard XR, HS magnum blend, etc? Get real, technology changes but it doesn’t change the pursuit.

[@BenHoltenFilms]

90% of guys shooting TSS it hasn’t changed how they hunt. It is just a better load. It really only adds maybe 10 yards to an ethical shot. Pattern is the main factor to maintain that ethical shot. But 100% you are right 10% see it as a chance to make that 1/10 shot at 80 yards and are ok with it.

[@guycarlton201]

Use a strait load of #7s or #8s.

[@quackiller12]

mueller ufo choke and a full body turkey target would be interesting to see

[@ashrafmid1970]

Nice review..can u make review for this gun .

[@HappyMountainLake-ug8bl]

When is the video for the Weatherby sorex coming out?

[@officerfoxtrot3633]

So, I guess here’s my take. I’ve shot 3 1/2” 12 gauge #4’s out to 64 yards. Remington 870 Express Magnum goose gun with an Indian Creek Tube (unsure constriction, extra full turkey from 8-10 years ago). I’ve seen a ic/mod barrel bird gun sing 3” #4’s or #5’s drop a bird close to 60 (he misjudged yardage and it was his first bird). I think TSS has the capability for 100 yards, with the right conditions. You’d have to shoot 100 frequently to know the pattern, factor in wind drift and drop, and have an absolutely ridiculously tight choke tube. To have one that tight to hold the pattern, I’d say close up shots may be like shooting a slug. I’d say a 100 yard tss gun would be more special purpose built for long range shots. I’d say for a good all-round setup, 15-75 yards would be the best range you could hope for, with attempting to keep all shots within 30 yards.

[@charlesbray3118]

Need to get some TSS custom hand loads

[@tomgensel4134]

Shooting lead max 35yds 🦃

[@chadk3573]

Only comment from a real turkey hunter I've seen in this comment section

[@Misfit5W]

60 would be my limit with that ammo and set up. I haven't personally tested them but you should put federal against verdict. Verdict looks like it has some tight patterns

[@MSPubducks]

What holosun is that ? Looks like there’s a curve built into the housing.

[@jason6325]

I use 2&3/4" low brass#8's lead. My range it about 200 yards and closer.

[@kyleedwardwheat3908]

Anyone know what red dot sight is on his shotgun, didn’t see it in the description ??

[@TheNickademas1]

“How far can we “beg” a turkey” new title of the video

[@jakegercak]

Good video

[@benjaminpalazzolo5738]

Love this vid

[@shaneolsen9394]

I know your a bird guy but all this info and info similar to this but for buck shot would be awesome

[@davedixon4622]

It depends how well ur bows tuned. And size or broadhead. And how well u can. Hit a softball or a neck. ;).

[@mkeller8114]

Apex with Indian Creek choke would smoke that set up. Actually that 45 yard pattern was terrible compared to my Mossberg 835. Just saying that choke and shell combo needs some tweaking.

[@intellect1732]

Longbeard XR #5's for life

[@Allsznhunter]

Test out a few handloaded TSS such as apex, verdict, windy hill precision, and you'll truly be amazed how much better it performs, everybody I know tried federal heavyweight and I did to, highly let down, only putting 1 3/4oz of 9's in a 3", where as say apex 3" is giving you 2 1/4oz of 9's 814 pellets vs federals 634 pellets, ik your sponsored so you probably really can't talk bad about federal, now I love most of federals products but there tss I wouldn't use past 25 yards from my guns, turkey chokes, but to each there own, but it's way to open of a pattern for my liking, 40 yards I had 54 pellets in a 10" circle on a turkey target, vs apex having 289 pellets @40 in the 10" circle , but I get it, it's a mass produced TSS vs the company's that hand load there's

[@Drblood6721]

Agreed. After a few years of longbeard XR, I switched to federal tss #9 and found it amazing... two years later I changed to apex #9s and the patterns blew my mind. Not going back to federal any time soon

[@raybrenneman7240]

I appreciate you doing this video. Couple of variables that you don’t consider is your tss load and choke combo while decent is far from performance what can be done. You can get patterns with straight #9 that put 900 pellets in a 24” circle at 60yd . If you use straight 7’s with 462pellets or straight 8’s 505 pellets you can have enough pattern density to have over 100 pellets in a 10” circle at 70yd thus the head and neck are toast plus both 8 and 7’s have enough energy to penetrate deep into the body organs and at least 15-20 pellets take out the organs even without a head kill. . Bottom line proper load choke combo of 8’s or 7’s definitely kills birds to 70 yds. 9’s will kill definitely to 60yd.

[@corkdoubloon]

Citori cxt review?

[@grantloucks8265]

I appreciate the video. I understand it. Technology has come a long way. I think when we consider ethically killing game, we need to be as sure as possible that we're going to consistently place effective shots downrange regardless of the tool. Shotgun rifle bow, doesn't matter. The next thing is you do not have enough data personally to make those assumptions. The NRA used to have a standard for a rifle or a pistol. 5. 5. Shot groups bare minimum should be seven shells fired at each target. The data is lacking to be effective.

[@BLOWN287]

Try the Apex loads with a Patternmaster Code Black or Jelly head TSS choke. I switched to Apex after testing it against Federal TSS.

[@driftlesshunter9200]

Apex puts turkey on the table for you, but Federal puts everything else on the table for him. Telling someone sponsored by Federal to shoot something else is probably not going very far!

[@BenHoltenFilms]

I agree they are a good load. I just don’t think it’s going to be an extreme difference. My guess would your top performing shell will give you another 5 yards. Just a note I am shooting apex and code black.

[@brazzy1467]

I use my bolt action 300wm and I'm comfortable out to 500 yds.

[@mikeskidmore6754]

At 25-30 yards I had better kill shots with #7.5 shot over #5 shot ..This surprised me.. so many more bb's with the #7.5 shot ..

[@mattpie595]

Might also try a 10 gauge. Patterns much better than a 3 1/2 “ 12ga.

[@dustybowhunter]

Maybe try 3” vs 3 1/2” loads

[@crossbowhunter9118]

1:55 I found a box of that shotgun shell it is 5 rounds for 80$

[@robertobrutto9650]

What the video fails to tell us, is how much does the pattern drops at 60 to 100 yards, im sure with tss majority of the pellets are dropping at those further distances

[@mikejoyner3051]

From 20 to 100 yards you are looking at 100+ inch drop #9's about 60" for #7's

[@SirAlford]

Past 50 yards is 22 Mag work!

[@BRoweeman707]

Both

[@troydecilles8693]

There is far better TSS shells out there than federals. If you really wanna see how far you can shoot with TSS get some Apex, Nitro Company Ammo, Rocky Ridge, etc.

[@BenHoltenFilms]

I have got into this argument with many guys and I have kept my same thought. And this video basically backs up my thoughts. For me, my gun, 3 1/2” apex #9, red dot I am good to 55. That’s me. I could possibly stretch to 60 but for me 55 is the number, which is rare to even have a chance that far in the timber. With Winchester LB it was about 45-47. These idiots shooting 80 yard turkeys are mearly getting lucky.

[@lfcox5660]

It takes almost "3" TSS number nine pellets to weigh as much as "1" number 4 copperplated lead pellet...energy is based on weight and velosity. Id rather take my chances with a #4 at any yardage....the TSS pellets are extremely hard to find if they get in the meat. You bite down on one and youll likely crack a tooth.

[@timeverett7828]

Kent diamond shot #4 lead 60 yards... dead right there. No troubles with jellyhead choke. I'm not taking the shot past 70 yards.

[@davidb13]

I killed one at 78yds last year with TSS

[@metinkrk3652]

Bu tüfeğin markası nedir

[@jerryhess5564]

50 yards was always my max with TSS, now I might try 60 after watching this. I typically carry #5 lead for more and switch to TSS for longer shots (over 20yds).

[@user-nr2lh5vd3v]

In my opinion shot density and shot placement are more important than retained energy at distance. Besides bragging rights, there is no point in forcing those long shots. Tungsten and lead get hard on them teeth.

[@fessenden3337]

Hey does anyone know what chokes an affinity 3 compact 20 gage would take for turkey I don’t see any made for it, does it take beneli chokes??? I’m trying to find and get a turkey choke for it before April 20th if anyone can help me with what brand fits it or a good choke plz let me know

[@sk8brder67]

My sons shoots that same shot gun. Got him the Carlson heavyweight TSS (0.555) turkey come. He dropped his first turkey, it didn’t even flop. It’s a stone cold killer combo. Paired it with the federal heavyweight TSS loads.

[@fessenden3337]

@@sk8brder67 I ordered the exact same choke a few days ago already got it on my gun to, I got federal tss aswell, my season opens the 20tg

[@sk8brder67]

@@chadengels2625 when it patterned well. it had a very tight group, i'd say 10" to 15" out to about 30 yrs. So tight that I thought we might need to get a .575. He has a red dot on his shotgun also so having a tight pattern and able to visually keep him aiming on the bird was the trick. We were confident that he can down a bird easily out to 50yrs. We wouldn't take a shot any further.

[@66branch]

I'm handloading my own tss my 60 yard pattern is much better than your 40 yd. The choke selection is key to long range patterns. You need to find the absolute tightest 60 yard pattern to perform at 80. My loads with a Indian creek choke will put 25-35 in a head at 80 yards. That's max I don't think any load holds consistency at 100 yards. If you shoot 5 times at 100 yards you wont have 2 patterns with similiar yields.

[@bourbonafterbucks]

65-70 yards max using TSS with #7/9 blend and a SBE 3 with a Jebs Turkey Choke with .660 choke tube restriction

[@keithrogers5832]

Now if you're considering the 100 yds shot why didn't you fing a 3 1/2" load 🤔

[@oafee]

30 to 40

[@decoysinker]

You really missed the ball with this one. Everyone knows the duplex loads of tss don’t patten anywhere near as dense as straight 9s I’d REALLY like to see this re done .

[@scarletbegonia5150]

The entire point of turkey hunting is to call them into 30-40 yards. If you need to put a scope on your birdgun then yall are missing the point.

[@Mike-vk6mo]

Where is the Tom Roster study?

[@TargetFocusedLife]

Description!

[@jarrettcrysell1111]

20 guage 1187 with the Indian creek choke with #8 Apex Nigia flip him over backwards at 70 yards. Let her eat

[@pedrojsanchezalvarado5569]

Muy excelentes lances de cazerias amigos muy buena arma

[@Tughill1699]

you need a 10ga than you can talk about 75 or a 100yards maybe ,i personall dont care to shoot them that far or even close to that but do own few 10ga guns and no 12ga cant touch them with any loads . mossberg 835 comes closest to the 10ga but all others are far behind -its just the way the 835 barrel is built to copy the 10ga size. regular 12ga guns but the time they reach 80-100yards have like 20yards shot string,that tom better be frozen in time !!

[@davidbilbrough3726]

It all boils down to what range you are happy with- AND just because it says for turkey on a choke tube, DO NOT believe all the hype; test EVERY choke you have got; BEFORE buying one.

[@ianharper1189]

i draw the line at 40 yards. Most of my shots average 20 yards. There's no way i can afford tss. Winchester long beards 3'' #5s is my budget. if you cant call them within 20-40 yards your probably doing something wrong. I have definitely had them hang up at 50 or 60 and let them walk.

[@shaunwebb3248]

If I can't get a gobbler within 40 with #5 or #6 I'm not taking it.

[@general-Lee-700]

Ithaca mag 10 10 gauge Magnum ever since the day that I got it on purposely had someone make me a 6 1/2 inch choke to put at the end of the 32inch barrel and like I say is with 3 1/2 inch iron shot at 40 yards that patter is as tight as a ping pong ball and I never missed a turkey for the last 20 some years never missed

[@user-cd4zo5tm1x]

Love it!

[@genelyda1102]

I am glad that you love a 10 gauge , but I would not want a 3 and a half inch 10 gauge on my shoulder 😮 I will stay with a 12 gauge with 2 3/4 shell. I think it has a lot to do with the barrel length and choke . Just me

[@general-Lee-700]

The recoil never really bothers me because I had that hog since I was 15 years old and it never really me now I'm older i got used to it after 25 years

[@guycarlton201]

Im 38, just bought a 10ga last year. I love the dang thing. Kicks less than my 12ga 3.5". Nothing practical about it, but life isnt about being practical. Salt creek has a 3oz load i want to try. He loads me Tss buckshot and it is impressive.

[@general-Lee-700]

I cut up and met cast iron skillets and make BBB+B shot over kill at 40 to 60 with a pattern the size of a ping pong ball but at 80 the pattern is a big as a baseball at that range what's the funny part is the guy who made that joke for me he lasered a pterodactyl on it which makes it even funnier

[@Macdaddy22713]

IMO Federal makes the worst TSS turkey load on the market. Apex, Salt creek, even herters all way out perform it. TSS in general is kind of just a waste of money. If you cant call a bird into 30-40 yards just dont shoot.......

[@driftlesshunter9200]

Apparently, you're not sponsored by Federal. LOL!

[@marcodevecchis8145]

60 yards and closer = best for TSS

[@JeffKavanagh]

Under 20 yards for me, otherwise it's way too easy. Hunter's don't seem to want to learn to hunt anymore.

[@user-TherealBFM]

I know lead 5s will absolutely fold a turkey at 73yards, I thought he was closer and excited but it did definitely work lol

[@By_The_Blood]

I must say, you used probably one of the worst patterning tss loads on the market. I would like to see this same study with much more attention to getting the tightest pattern possible out of the shotgun and ensuring that the bulk of the pattern is hitting where you want. Trying different loads, different shotguns and different chokes.

[@dustinshaw2419]

Terrible pattern to start with at 45. That gun/choke combo doesn't jive if you're looking to kill at range.

[@tracyclaystowell6431]

Wow $7.00 per round. HS. Clay

[@millatime62401]

45 lead 55 tss

[@connermay8623]

IMO, ( I know nobody asked), a person should never need to take a shot at a Turkey past 60 yards. You should be able to call them closer. However, it is nice to know the possibilities and limitations of your equipment. Still, anything beyond 60 is a low probability shot, and unethical

[@TargetFocusedLife]

The closer the better in IMO, but it good to know the limits of our equipment and skill.

[@stevenwalker7928]

I actually have killed at 86 yards and I tested at 90 3 targets with my gun I had 7,8 and last one was 4 in the scull and spine but there were 20 plus in the neck and head, some will call me unethical but the bird dropped like a rock the penetration in the back and breast was impressive, now I know that under 80 yards it’s a dead bird, don’t get me wrong I like them at the end of my gun barrel but missing at 10 yards is a real possibility with a 4” pattern, thanks for the info hopefully ppl will use this information!!!

[@ryanhodge3072]

Number 4 buck aim center mass 😂

[@wagner24314]

i''ve killed snows with tss 8 at 140 yards

[@nickpenque7321]

Too many variables to shoot birds at distancing beyond your setup, this obsession with distance is destroying the sport in my opinion,I can't even afford this tss stuff anyway!

[@kdjbeenken7931]

shooting a turkey at 100 yards is not what its about

[@tannerking4130]

I’d keep my shots within 50 yards

[@dgriffith19]

If you can't call a turkey into 35 yards then you suck at calling

[@lesharp5748]

Know more than 50yds.