How form obsession RUINS your calisthenics progress | REVERSE EGO LIFTING

[@agadmag1989]

Describing this video with one word? Quality.

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Love it. Thanks man

[@dmolinaro]

Your best vid so far. Especially the conclusion was spot on: you can't stay in your confort zone or just randomly attempt things that are clearly over your current capacity if you mean to get real strong.

[@FrinksmovementTV]

I couldnt hear more satisfying comment. Made my evening. Thank you Davide and thank you for your engagement, highly, highly appreciated

[@calisthenicsindia8498]

@@FrinksmovementTV love you bro would like to be a friend and train with you

[@x.dement]

I agree 100%. This is the biggest issue I see with calisthenics athletes. Especially the Intermediate ones, because they don't want to ruin their image with "bad form". SOmetimes we forget how ugly our muscle ups used to be, but they still helped us gain strength for the proper ones.

[@FrinksmovementTV]

You understand the concept 100% man. Exactly what i wanted to put the light on

[@victorvictor9662]

The concept of reverse ego lifting is genius mate. That logic is missing in the calisthenics game

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Thank you brother. Appreciate it so much. Thats my goal, lets make the community of cali - thinkers haha.

[@emiki6]

Check out Deuanuis, he trains most of the time with ugly form ("training form"), and it's efficient as hell in strength gains. The "truth about training" series is very eye opening.

[@vinzchannel01]

Imma keep this channel to myself as secret to my success. So glad I found gold like this. Tired of all the mainstream bullshit like Chris Heria.

[@Yohan421-e5g]

M8, also try bioneer, you're going to like his content. Stay healthy bro💪

[@ainbrisk545]

Chris Heria has some pretty good content, but a lot of his stuff is low effort and even a little false. I wouldn't go so far to call him bs though.

[@emiki6]

@@ainbrisk545 Not bs, just not that useful, most of the time counterproductive, like most channels. They don't help you in finding your goals and stick to it, thus working against you most of the time.

[@ainbrisk545]

@@emiki6 I've learned some stuff though, I remember when I first started calisthenics he had a pretty good video that introduced me to all the progressions of different stuff.

[@nekotajni394]

Fantastic video bro. I think you're very right that we like doing what we're strongest at, which progressively makes us even weaker in the aspects that we're already weak at. Either because we don't focus on it as much as we should or avoid it alltogether. I know from personal experience pulling has always been my strong suite, pulling very heavy weight pull ups while I could barely do light weight dips. I just really dreaded doing dips because I was so weak at them, instead of taking more time to address my weaknesses. We're only as strong as our weakest link.

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Thats EXACTLY what im talking about. But its great that you actually identified it. Like i said its a first step. My example is the front lever. I just suck at this move. And im a begginer in comparison with all the other stuff. How many times i had to slap myself to do the work despite the urge to skip that part, do it "next day" or something. Thank you bro for the reply, very good points!

[@krystianpikon]

zajebisty kontent masz na kanale. ja nigdzie nie widzialem filmow z takimi tematami jakie poruszasz Ty a do tej pory a ogladalem wiele filmow o kalistenice i streetcie, propsy

[@andreyt96]

Recently discovered your channel and it's awesome! I like the format, the music, the transitions, the overall structure: this content is great quality. Hope it will grow a lot because it really deserves it.

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Thank you so much! Working on the best project on this channel so far currently ;)

[@FrinksmovementTV]

What is your stance on chasing perfect form? Do you agree? Feel free to share your opinion frinksmovement.com/coaching/ - book consultation / apply for coaching / programming frinksmovement.com/contact/ - questions regarding coaching, cooperation/business, videos www.gornation.com - 10% Discount on Calisthenics Clothing & Equipment with the code "frinks"

[@wandererstraining]

Great video, man. I think exactly the same. I keep telling people, as long as you're safe and do reasonable quality work, you don't need perfect form. Perfect form is a choice that can be made when you are strong and skilled enough, mostly when performing or demonstrating. Before that, well, focus on strength. Edit: something to add is that "perfect form" can mean a lot of things. It can be a question of health and safety, and that kind of form should not be compromised. It could be a question of optimizing performance in a movement. That one is not absolutely essential, but should be seeked out based on one's goals and what they want to emphasize with the exercise. Another type of form is aesthetic, and is completely optional. Most form checks are based on multiple components at once, and it's good practice to clarify why things are done the way they are.

[@artful3488]

@@wandererstraining " Perfect form is a choice that can be made when you are strong and skilled enough" well said

[@TheOptimisticOG]

I didn't think I would find a video on this topic, but you've surprised me again! I got stuck on my front lever and planche training because I was too worried on doing everything with perfect form, and that prevented me from getting stronger 🤦‍♂️ Now, I'm 4 months into my planned training, seeing excellent results from pushing myself more into progressions and sets that are harder for me. You're right, it's good to see that grind in your workouts! 🦾

[@ealamtaher6050]

Yes please go to in depth of calisthenics programming

[@DanielCosta-zi4eb]

this channel is one of the most interesting out there. Cheers

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Thank you! More to come ;)

[@petrosmarkantonakis6882]

I am getting psychology and scientist vibes from this channel, reverse ego lifting blew my mind!

[@ellednilvillorente1297]

Nice work bro. Saw your post on fb group., bodyweight warrior. I clicked fast coz of the thumbnail. I can relate to this vid. Right now i am struggling on perfecting my pike push up. During workout, i would set my camera to see my form only to get disappointed and discourage after training it for a while. It felt better when. Ohh fuck this camera and perfect form.., i put on my best effort., did reps and sets without the recording part. And i felt great and the satisfaction of pump on my workouts. But still, i am obliged to check my form from time to time.

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Thank you brother! I really appreciate it! Checking form is really valuable tool, I do record myself very often as well. The thing is to distinguish between doing it for progress and just checking it for ego, to see if the set is worth posting on instagram haha

[@vinzchannel01]

You freaking smoke Chris Heria all the time in content

[@alxnd_r6345]

Chris is milking his popularity with: DO THIS WORKOUT IN THE MORNING or DO THIS BEFORE SLEEP TO GET SHREDDED

[@emiki6]

@@alxnd_r6345 Most channels profit from our program hopping. We have to ignore them.

[@priyankabhardwaj4590]

@@emiki6 yeah bro, you're right. But its hard to do on our part.

[@Delta3angle]

I absolutely love this video! Especially your comments on the role of social media and how it promotes perfectionism in technical pursuits like calisthenics.

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Appreciate it! Yeah i really believe it is a negative practise, of course it goes beyond just a minor exercise form thing, but thats what the video is about and you described it perfectly. thank you.

[@alfamingo2520]

Love the Eric Bugenhagen Clip, fucking love that guys energy

[@alopezdrums]

Such high quality content time and time again! Keep up the great work.

[@enzoconstantinoromo364]

Thank you so much, excelent video, just what i needed right now.

[@bunny.bunbob]

best sports thinker atm

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Thank you SO much. Means a lot to me

[@priyankabhardwaj4590]

Man I used to do half reps of chinups -7 reps. I was very happy but knew that I had to do them full. But doing half reps helped me achieve full pullup. So , bad form isn't that bad after all.

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Yes bad form is not AS bad as people think. And SOMETIMES it may have its place to not focus on it so much

[@健爸]

Very good point 👍

[@kaimuller934]

Bro I didn't know that this video describes my in some points pretty accurately👀

[@Wilsthenics]

Great video man

[@abd-yq2up]

thanks man I really appreciate your work

[@julienmttq8125]

Super interesting video! Btw, I would love to see a vid about proper calisthenics programming;)

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Haha nooo way. I just make the whole 6 episodes series. Your just on time ;) Next video is the Ep.1... Or maybe you came from my IG where i actually advertised it? Doesnt matter, thank you and stay tuned ;)

[@julienmttq8125]

@@FrinksmovementTV Ohhhh that coincidence! I just came across your channel (thanks to reddit) and I wasn't following you on ig yet (I'm going to do it right now). I'm looking forward to this series anyway:)

[@FrinksmovementTV]

@@julienmttq8125 Awesome. I just saw that post on reddit. I never really contributed to the group and didnt know how it works. Now im gonna start after seeing all those inteligent and smart comments under. You guys just rock! Have a nice day ;)

[@weshallneversurrender]

Fantastic video bro - I find so much truth in this! I've been working on powerlifting and calisthenics together in my training, sorta as a need to get the best of both worlds. Powerlifting has helped me to understand that form is key (indeed critical) but strength still remains the primary goal, and then on the other end of the spectrum, with calisthenics I have realised that strength is key (and again, without it one cannot progress), but form remains the primary goal. I guess the combo of these two disciplines has helped me solve the "reverse ego lifting" phenomena in my own training xD

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Haha really well put! Someone below (or above) mentioned how it is really related to posting training on instagram and the pressure it creates. Generally "flexing" and showing off. Also how that can mess up the training - if its well scheduled.

[@darkobojovski8715]

Amazing video, would be a great idea to do a video on proper calisthenics programming

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Full series on my channel! Episode 5 coming soon 👍

[@marcusson1983]

Excellent video man.

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Thank you so much brother

[@marcusson1983]

@@FrinksmovementTV I am really glad found your channel. Amazing content. Do you have some video on - tempo? I have recently bought a program, where dis was introduced to me. For example 5 x6 pull ups, but when you do it in tempo 3101 with perfect form, it becomes like 4x harder. Imma definitely getting stronger, but my exposive power is slowly deminishing. Then periodisation should come right..?

[@FrinksmovementTV]

@@marcusson1983 Exactly man. I dont have a video yet. I only mentioned that from strength perspective fast concentric seem to be most efficient, but to be completely honest been not fresh with the science on the "nuances" lately. Tempo is a great tool for increasing intensity in for instance bodyweight training, you can make things so much harder - but you also need to be using it with the purpose. I def might do some larger video on this ;)

[@slowfall8957]

well, fuck :D yeah I might have done something like that(or still doing it) lets change it for the better, subbed+liked

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Haha you see! I definitelly did and so wanted to share ;) I highly appreciate it, more content coming soon ;)

[@ElijahZaporteza]

I think Eric Bugenhagen has also said in a Q&A or something that chasing perfect form for every single rep is ego lifting

[@2beCuil]

I really enjoyed the vid. Thanks for the insights. I agree that’s very nice to be good at one thing but you have to question yourself if you want to be a one trick pony or an more all round athlete.

[@SmileyDAce]

i don't know if this applies to me or not? i was doing 3x6 pull-ups, but my scapular depression was not good, so i focused on depressing the scapula consciously before each Rep, and this brought me down to 3x5. and i really like to focus on perfect Form. as good as i can

[@FrinksmovementTV]

It does not. I think this video can be interpreted in different ways because i could not express as well back then. What i mostly meant by reverse ego lifting is testing strength and not building it. Meaning - the obsession over our perfect form doesn't let us do the honest required work - and we constantly stay in one place by doing skills we feel comfortable with - example - me doing singles of handstand pushup and always not being satisfied with form - so not increasing workload. Form can be progressive overload as well, and so while we should strive for making it as close to perfect - we should not expect ourselves to be there all the time.

[@AnnuTekky]

spot on 📍

[@nobro6824]

Amazing video, thank you, brother! I have a great plan for weightlifting 3 day full body I created along with two personal trainers, but I want to get more into Weighted calisthenics and attain HSPU (and planche in the future). I kind of manage to do a short front lever (and a slightly longer straddle front lever) like 2/3 weeks after I started Weighted pullups/dips. Overall, I don't know how to alter my current lifting programme along with calisthenics and also how to incorporate the various forms of periodisation and progressions I have implemented in my lifting programme. Not expecting you to answer it all or perhaps at all, but any help or any guidance from anyone would be appreciated. Keep up the amazing work!

[@alexjulius69]

This is why Matteo Spinazzola is the strongest calisthenics athlete and why not a lot of people can even come close to him. Because he focuses on building strength, and not on being pretty -- clean formly-like.

[@bastien8418]

True and so many people look down on him because of his "form" but they don't realise it's clearly thanks to that, that he's the strongest

[@projectiles2556]

good stuff

[@sfidatestesso]

From a social-psychological perspective, we tend to avoid exercise we aren’t comfortable about and show our strength points in social situations, this has been proved. Probably we are interested to 1) preserve our status 2) maintain our self image. Of course, it’s an ego trap and it prevents us to improve more!

[@FrinksmovementTV]

I love it! Do you maybe have some links to actual data/articles? Would love to upgrage the knowledge over that in the future as I find it extremely fascinating.

[@sfidatestesso]

@@FrinksmovementTV hey I found this in my italian notes from social psychology (translation won't be perfect). *Presence of others and excitement - Zajonc (1965)* In all animal species, the presence of other members of the species, both in the role of spectators (co-presence) and co-actors, leads to an increase in physiological activation (arousal), triggering a state of alert. Two answers: 1) Automated dominant response (behavior we are good at) 2) Inhibition of new responses or behaviors with which we have little confidence

[@FrinksmovementTV]

@@sfidatestesso Thank you so much!!

[@ray-cg6wu]

Sorry is there a book you would advice reading about periodization and programming?

[@nadyamikhailova7527]

Wise

[@jasoncleaver233]

I'm definitely stuck in this stage, cant seem to do anything other than what I'm comfortable with, I need a programme, can anyone direct me to a cali program where i can practice the main skills and improve

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Firstly, congratulations, that you identified it. Thats a first step. So im going to release a series soon about in deph calisthenics programming guideline. Well i dont know really if there are good freecalisthenics program outthere, of course you have blueprints of Daniels fitnessfaqs and Littlebeastms that i can definitelly recommend. But can you tell me what are your goals and what specific problem do you have? I think i may give you some advice, thats gonna put you in a better mental position to work on them goals ;)

[@jasoncleaver233]

Yes of course any help would be greatly appreciated, I am currently looking to be able to free handstand press, planche and front leaver I am able to hold handstand sometimes but not often, planche is my weakest unable to do basic stuff and front leaver is ok can hold for couple of seconds but not great.

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Alright so in your case what i would focus on is working on handstand daily - meaning doing not as long sessions, but more of a practise type of work. And for now stick to it, once you will have a decent handstand you can start doing more exercises for the handstand press. When it comes to planche and front lever, choose the position that you can hold for at least 6 seconds and train it in multiple sets. Feel free to add things like lean pushups and front lever rows (in a tuck position for example) and again do that for sets and reps. Dont do stuff you can just barely hold, and dont do too easy progression. Choose a challenging, but managable one (like i said 6-10 seconds is fine) Also i really suggest to add some general work like weighted pullups, weighted dips and overhead press, these will definitelly help you to develop strength while working on specific skills. Good luck and if you have any questions feel free to ask ;)

[@Gal-by]

It will be cool if you can go more in depth on the calisthenics programming

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Full series on my channel! Episode 5 coming soon ;)

[@UsernameTaken.]

This was a really great video , but unfortunatley for me it was difficult to get the point of it and I really want to get it. The message of this video was : to work on your weak links in the kinetic chain , to even break the form of an exercise for more volume , or for other reasons? Would really appreciate if you would reply and answer this once again. While I am gonna watch the video one more time

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Of course yeah. It is one of my oplder videos and I really struggled to get to the point i feel. Sorry for that. Let me explain it quickly - BUILD YOUR STRENGTH DONT TEST IT/SHOW IT OFF. Problem is that while in weight training ego is being boosted by lots of weight - here its done by perfect form, which often correlates with lack of hard work. Hope I explained to you ;) Let me know

[@UsernameTaken.]

@@FrinksmovementTV So you're saying that we should use a bad form , which is bad enough to make other critique us but not bad enough to get an injury? I mean like going for a little back arch in hspu will make others judge us , but it will not be a source of injury. And what we should do is to train with a little(not injury friendly) bad form in our training for higher volume and for higher RPE ? Is that what you mean if I got the point? And if we see back in older videos , Osvaldo Lugones,Andrea Larosa,Eryc Ortiz etc... all of this athletes had a banana planche , but maybe the secret of their great achievement in strength that we see today is that this bad form they were using was just a "progression" to the "perfect" form, so it really makes sense to me that bad form might be the key to strength sucess.

[@UsernameTaken.]

@@FrinksmovementTV Question 1 ,,And do you think that going in "2 phases" for learning skills is a faster method than going for 1 phase , but the end result being the same ("perfect form skill") by 2 phases i mean incorporating even "bad form" and good form , while by 1 phase i mean going only for this "perfect form" Question 2,,, Also I think breaking form is not only about an arch in the back or smth like this but also about RANGE OF MOTION, not full range of motion is maybe a great tool to progress further , since there are athletes like Saibov considered as "endurance legend" that got 60+ pull ups with full range of motion . How? By doing pull up for shorter range of motion. This can also apply to strength training,not full range of motion in a movement that you can not perform with full range of motion might be very very helpful for gaining strength in this movement . What do you think? Question 3 : Do you prefer/are you a fan of going to an easier progression to do perfect form but also more volume ,or to do the same progression with bad form to encourage higher volume ? The point of this video was to do the first one or the second one ? THANK YOU SOOOO SOOOO SOOOO SOOOO MUCH for giving this GREAT topics on youtoube with a GREAT QUALITY VIDEO , this topic&my questions can go further and further about this , as you see this 3 questions are too long so you can take your time to reply them tomorrow/later. Again thanks . A strongly deserved like was just given to this video,again THANKS !

[@FrinksmovementTV]

@@UsernameTaken. Okay brother so. My stance is: I dont think you should ever use bad form, its not productive from any standpoint. What i say is you should keep decent form, but not be obsessed with perfection during training. During performance its different ballgame. There are certain standards that should always be met - for instance - during handstand pushups if you a total complete banana form it wont translate to the proper one. But if you got protracted scapulas and your back is arching a little bit - but your able to accumulate volume with it - its much better training stimulus than perfect form 4x1. Okay so why not to reduce difficulty and go for perfect pike pushups? First of all - its not as specific, and in handstand skills it actually matters. Secondly - your form will eventually break anyways (like just a bit even) and its important not to panic because of that. Q1 I have seen both says - some start with bad form and progress to perfect form, some progress all way from perfect form, Dont have enough data to say whats more effective unfortunatelly. But i would never go to extremes (bent arms, retracted scapulas in planche etc). Q2 there is progressive range of motion method out there. I dont consider it to be bad form - I like to use it for athletes I train, but we always make sure to use it as a specific exercise and rest keep full ROM Q3 Actually now I am the fan of keeping training not the most intense most of the times - its easier to accumulate volume with the easier progression - so it may be more beneficial - but also dependent on a phase of training. In general yes - now im a fan of lower intensity which allows for good form. Remember Reverse ego lifting reffers to hiding behind perfection. Not Striving for it ;) Thank you for your words its appreciated!

[@UsernameTaken.]

@@FrinksmovementTV wow thank you for that great answer , manwhile i watched 2 other video of yours (Lol , new subscriber) and I am getting a knowledge that I never thought I would get for free on youtoube.And this reply really cleared my mind ,because I was totally misunderstooding the point of the video. Thanks

[@SA-ux7xb]

You should have more subscribers

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Thank you so much! Its nice to know you think this way 🙏🏻

[@domantas9020]

i dissagree with powelifting part 2:35 . powerlifters have to get 3 white lights to make their lifts valid, so execution is still important, otherwise your lifts will not count :)

[@JakubKowalski93]

While watching I was thinking about four athletes that "suffer" from reverse ego lifting and it does not seem to hurt them at all: Calimnastic, Mike Israetel, Steve Hall from Revive Stronger & Jeff Alberts from Team 3DMJ. I think that reverse ego lifting is the most dangerous for powerlifters because it only matters how much you lift within rules and not how pretty you lift. When it comes to calisthenics & bodybuilding the details become much more important. In bodybuilding you want as much tension on the target muscles as possible and in calisthenics if your goal is to achieve certain skills then why not do them "perfect" & pretty? Why not train in this way from the start so you can avoid bad habits and to work the right leverages. Of course If you just want to do "sets & reps" for the sake of it then yes, do whatever the form you want but If you want to get good at HSPU for example then why not strive for hardest and most "perfect" form? I get your arguments that you can accumulate more volume when you allow some form breakdown but you can also do it in "perfect" way: when you can't do more reps with right form then do negatives only or easier progression or iso holds or increase the frequency etc. It is very nuanced discussion and it's not like I completely disagree with you.

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Fair points, Sure we could discuss it all day, and its not like I disagree. Now im just gonna give you my points that made me think about this topic and make this video. I understand that this term may be misunderstood cause I just wanted to come up with some catchy name its not any well analised concept. And its MOSTLY about staying in comfort zone. Its using the form as an excuse not to push for improvement. My experience is that i was stuck at doing handstand pushup singles and for couple of months ive been telling myself that im gonna increase reps once my form will be good. But the reality was in my mind it was never perfect. Once i put pressure on myself and started increasing reps sure my form got a bit disrupted but with this approach in a year time i got to 5x5 handstand pushups. Would i be here if i scaled down and did pike pushups for higher reps? Of course i could, who says that not. But it still would be going out of comfort zone. It would be pushing for more reps and doing more each time i can. So quickly about people that you've mentioned. While I know mainly Mike Israetel and Calimnastic and their approach thats why im gonna stick with them. So when it comes to Dr. Mike i wont make my opinion, at least ive never seen him doing anything close to what ive described here, he is very strict on exercise form and stuff but its totally different purpose and surely not masking or staying in comfort zone in any way. On top of that his training consists of fair amount of machinec and isolation work - and obviously this are different circumstances - not my area of expertise. Calimnsatic... not gonna lie good example and i thought about it. But when thinking about it i reminded myself that in this world there are many talented athletes that do things that in theory shouldnt be optimal and despite that they make better results then 99% of us, and actually i know many more examples of people from my circles who just as me unlocked their potential by implementing things i talked about in this video and also people who are also on a very high level in calisthenics that seem not to pay attention to form at all - look at some street workout competitors. We can always find exeptions to the rule. And while calimnastics is a huge inspiration to me and im sure he is a very inteligent experienced guy who know what he is doing. Things like height, weight and leverages are things not everyone will overcome in pursuit of bodyweight mastery. Thank you for the opinion Jakub, good points and definitely worth discussion.

[@vasilikik8609]

So it's better to choose a higher intensity progression/exercise (for ex: Hspu) and do it with sloppy (ex. banana) form and try to fix the form as you go or choose a "lighter" intensity progression, do it with perfect form? (To gain strength)

[@FrinksmovementTV]

I would say - do both. Pike pushup alone wont get you real handstand pushup. Military press or banana form wont as well. If you combine them all thats when you get good results.

[@FrinksmovementTV]

The most important take away from this video is not to get comfortable with training

[@vasilikik8609]

@@FrinksmovementTV I currently train both! Your videos are very high in quality and informative.

[@cubanking7036]

Did anyone else realize that his hair changed after almost every cut? 😂😂😂

[@shivamchauhan4481]

I was in this phase for a year and half almost. Perfect form all the time is not a great idea imo.

[@beyondmeaning]

Reverse ego lifting is just ego lifting

[@FrinksmovementTV]

Pretty much - just we feed our ego not with intensity at form's cost but with form at intensity cost