I Don't Want To FORCE My Children To Go To Church Every Sunday r/Relationships

[@anikanele7958]

In Germany we have a common saying that translates to "I believe in god, I just dont like his ground staff"

[@Feynix4]

that is an excellent saying

[@TheLastHylianTitan]

Me. Literally me. Jesus is chill, his fanbase is not.

[@salomerodriguez5145]

​@@TheLastHylianTitan that's the thing about rabid fans 😂

[@lyangray452]

"I believe in God, but I do not believe in the Church."

[@SnowWolfAlpha]

I say something similar. "I'm fine with God, I just don't like his fanclub and the people he gets to write his books."

[@QueenOfTheZombieApocalypse]

Story 2: I hate when I hear women fool themselves like this- if he is horrible to you, the mother of his children, he IS NOT a good father.

[@PrincessQ-fj9ly]

A lot of people seem to think that cheating and abuse only affects women, but it affects the children as well because the cheating/abusive partner when caught has just showed them that he's not the heroic figure they thought he was. He don't care about their mother and in some cases doesn't care about them if he plans to abandon her and them for his affair partner. And children will more than likely resent their father for hurting their mother. And vice versa if the woman cheated or is abusive. The cheating partner stopped being a good parent the moment they started cheating or being abusive, because they were being selfish, mean and cruel to their betrayed partner and their children by association.

[@QueenOfTheZombieApocalypse]

@@PrincessQ-fj9ly yes exactly. Someone can’t be cruel and selfish in one part of their life and great in another - it just doesn’t work that way.

[@mortisrat]

He taught a couple of little girls that a man will leave them for the natural changes to their bodies from bearing THEIR children. Not a good father...

[@michaelwoods3651]

The nerve of the mistress! The kids are, “ ungrateful “ because they don’t like the harpy who had an affair with their douche nozzle of a father?! Wow!

[@Feynix4]

I had to scroll pretty far to find this comment and THANK YOU! 100% agree.

[@emasters8619]

But you do see that she refused to have children for him. What she said doesn't jive with how she was living. She saw how he treated those girls ( and his ex wife) and did nothing. Maybe this is her way of covering her own ass now that she knows his comeuppance has arrived

[@mortisrat]

@@emasters8619 Of course she refused to have kids with him. He was very clear about leaving wifey 1 because she felt different to him after giving birth. She will have known that the second her body changed he'd be off after the new model. She probably hoped that now that the 'older, looser' wife was out of the house that she'd get to take her place (with the kids as well as the man) without losing her only advantage, and is now pissy that failed.

[@taylorslade961]

Story 2: As soon as the ex complained that OP "wasn't as tight" her moron detector should have been going wild.

[@erenssister.5535]

I am betting he has porn addiction.

[@nocause5395]

Exactly, she literally gave birth to HIS CHILDREN and that's how he acts.

[@recycledapathy7411]

And now he wants his new wife to have kids so she won't be as tight either. Because he wants a reason to dump her for the next college girl.

[@ShotgunsAndSalt]

that's not even how vaginas work, they do not become "loose" after birth unless there's some kind of complication.

[@kimberlyterasaki4843]

Story 2: The man is having cheaters' remorse. He can't stand that his ex is moving on and getting married so he decided to do whatever he could to ruin her day. It sucks but it might be a blessing in disguise if it means the kids can legally cut him out of their lives forever. Also the stepmom clearly had her own issues; sounds to me like OP's ex promised that the girls would accept her happily and when that didn't happen, she got mad. She doesn't sound mature enough to be a stepmom or a wife.

[@terramarini6880]

Yeah, she was supposed to twist in the wind pining for him.

[@rebeccaabram2312]

Massive remorse- He wanted her pining in loneliness, but she found somebody new who more or less worships her, is a wonderful step-parent to his daughters, whom his daughters adore (while they don't seem to like his new wife) and icing on the cake she gave birth to a son to the new guy. Little wonder he escalated once the wedding was underway.

[@jmjedi923]

She was a college freshman and he was in his 30s, yeah no duh she's not mature

[@erenssister.5535]

@@rebeccaabram2312 Yeah, and did you see how the ex was pushing his wife to have kids? I bet he is trying to one up OP

[@kimberlyterasaki4843]

@@jmjedi923 Yeah it's a bad situation. The age difference immediately sends alarm bells ringing in my head, but she still had an affair with a married man and proceeded to verbally abuse his children when they refused to accept her. I hope she learns and grows and wasn't traumatized by the experience but she also made mistakes along the way.

[@carolsh1983]

These men who act this way (cheating, verbally abusing, then becoming insanely jealous) are telling on themselves. They view women as property.

[@PrincessQ-fj9ly]

Yep. Those are the kind of men who don't deserve to be around ANYONE! Not just women.

[@frozezone2947]

That's because women are property, that's the whole point of marriage

[@owl7072]

Story 1: "Attend anyway so you can prove your worth" Op shouldn't have had to. Why should she prove her worth to people who decided they hated her just for when/how she was born? Op wasn't even _in_ the world yet before they wanted to take her _out_ of it. Why are _they_ the people she had to suck up to? They were literally never going to like her, so why put your kid through that? My mom went through hell with her church, she stopped going and decided she wouldn't put my sibling and I through that and never brought us there, _that's_ what should have been done. Not that shit of forcing your kid to be in a place where literally everyone hates them and makes it known to the kid on a regular basis. Honestly, if that's how Op was treated, why would you want those same people interacting with your kids and influencing them?

[@mindyschocolate]

Right? They’re pro-life right? Imagine hating a kid they didn’t want the mom to abort. Weird.

[@PrincessQ-fj9ly]

​@@mindyschocolate I know right? If being born out of wedlock is so sinful, they shouldn't allowed OP's mom to terminate her pregnancy. Unless, they wanted to punish OP and her mother, which I think is downright cruel.

[@joaolima7131]

Religious people are most of the time very self righteous and hypocrites, it pisses me off, I know some people that aren't, but they are very few

[@kimsvisualdiary]

@@PrincessQ-fj9ly that’s exactly why they do it. They want to punish and shame women who get pregnant out of wedlock thinking it will be a deterrent for other “whores”.

[@asmith8692]

My cousin's hubby is Catholic. His priest insisted on a religious ceremony around the christening of #3. He considered the babies born with only a civil ceremony were illegitimate and he had a limited number of illegitimate children per family he was willing christen.

[@tysonscott5249]

Don't force your religion on anybody. My family members did it to me. And I hate their religion for it. It will never end well.

[@bloonh8tr619]

You can't shove ideals down peoples throats, it only leads to resentment. Hope you're living a happy life

[@j.j.juggernaut9709]

While I still consider myself Christian to a degree, I will never be caught anywhere within a mile of any church XD Sick of childhood days spent trying to "repent" or any of that bs. The whole experience has tainted my memories

[@bloonh8tr619]

@@j.j.juggernaut9709 I hope you will live your happiest life

[@colleens1107]

Aaand that’s why I’m not raising my child in the church. I was forced to go every week until I was 18 and I have only gone back for baptisms, weddings, and funerals.

[@herewego8686]

​@J.J.Juggernaut you sound like me lol. My mom gets it, it's my aunts and grandmother who were extreme

[@sadraccoonboy]

Ah yes. “Start having kids, wife.” What a gross dude.

[@mortisrat]

Start having kids, wife - and just pretend I didn't leave the last wife FOR having my kids. Even grosser dude. Not that she's much better, just has some self preservation.

[@smellyolegoat150]

In story 2, that ex husband is just plain evil. The very intentional pain he inflicts is unforgivable.

[@NoMoreHeroesAnymore1334]

And yet they somehow keep getting away with it, don't they? (sigh)

[@mina-tarahelena2478]

Who, in the right mind, would "violently shake" their 8yo kid? Hell, who in the right mind would violently shake their kid?

[@Zurround]

I am confused about something? Why was he so upset that his ex wife remarried and is having another child? He cheated on her AND married his affair partner and divorced her. Was he expecting her to be single and live like a nun the rest of her life? Does he see this as her cheating on him in some way? This does not make any sense to me. If he is DONE with her then why does he care if she remarries? His ex wife hates him, both of his children hate him, and his current marriage is a sham that won't last much longer in all likelihood. At some point when his young wife leaves him and he is all alone and everyone who once loved him won't even speak to him I wonder if he will feel regret? I get that some people are A holes and maybe he wanted a younger sexier wife but he GOT what he wanted so why was he upset that his ex wife remarried? I cannot figure that out?

[@WobblesandBean]

​​@@Zurround Because that's what cheaters and abusers like him do. It's all about control. He cheated on and discarded his ex, but hearing she'd moved on hurt his fragile little ego. He expects her to pine for him, heartbroken and lost, like he's such an Adonis she couldn't possibly get over him. 🙄 Also, it's a little creepy the way you talk about some men "just wanting a younger sexier wife" as if it's expected that men will always choose to be a creep who preys on barely legal women. Just sayin'.

[@Zurround]

@@WobblesandBean I was making a point, looking at it from HIS angle. My point was that he GOT WHAT HE WANTED and I do not get why he is focused on ruining his ex wife's life and the lives of his children. I am a former competitive kick boxer and I have a much younger sister and if her husband or ex husband were to do something like this he would be given a free kick boxing lesson from me.

[@samvoss6697]

ex FIL is amazing for knowing what a demon his son truly is. At least someone in that family has some intelligence

[@thematrix2661]

I think he should do a dna test that son might not be his lol the Mother should be able to put herself in to her ex daughter in law shoes.

[@Mama_Bear_of_3]

My family are devout Catholics. We were members of our church for generations (back to great grandparents). Up until I was 12 I wanted to be a nun. Then my eldest sister had a baby at 18 and out of wedlock. My niece was born very sick, and docs were unsure if she would live. My sister ask the priest of our congregation (he had been there more than 20 years) to please come to the hospital to baptize the baby. To this day (40 years later).the words he spoke are crisp and clear in my mind . He said, "I cannot baptize a bastard into the church. Once you and the father get married, I will be happy to do it." Mind you my niece was a day old and not expected to live, and the priest wanted to wait until my sister got married?!? Thankfully my niece did survive and grew to be perfect and healthy. But, that day when my priest refused, all the respect I had for organized religion and the Catholic church went straight out the window. I couldn't comprehend how an innocent child would be made to suffer for the sins of the parents. I am 51 now, I have my own personal relationship with my God. When my husband and I started dating, he introduced me to Uniterian Universalism, and I absolutely fell in love with the church. They are an open and accepting church, and guide you in your spiritual path, they DO NOT tell you what your spiritual path is supposed to be. I have not stepped foot in a Catholic church in over 25years, and I don't miss it.

[@AngryReptileKeeper]

What gets me is that Catholics believe that if a child dies before it's baptized, it won't go to heaven, but will instead spend eternity in purgatory (or so it was explained to me by several Catholics). So by their own belief system, they would knowingly risk the eternal soul of an innocent child simply because of the actions of its parents. I don't understand why anyone would even want to follow a religion that espouses that, let alone believes that anyone who doesn't follow their religion will be tortured for eternity. It's sick.

[@vanillablossom]

Yeah, even if the catholic faith itself doesn't have to be wrong (or any other faith for that matter), the people in that church tend to be so, so nasty, judgmental and focused on how something looks like rather than how it is, the appearances are crucial for them. Cannot speak of other types of christians nor other religions (protestants / evangelics / lutherans seem to be more chill, though) much, but this certain type, ugh. And let me not begin to write what we were taught at school (basically catholic country, so religion lesson at school are very in favour of catholics), how the other religion and groups of people were described to us during religion lessons. I guess I'll remember it for years to come.

[@InevitableSecrets]

My MIL’s family has a similar story. When her father was a young Jewish boy in New York (about 9-11ish) his father, a rabbi, died. He wanted his father to receive a certain ritual at his burial but his family couldn’t afford it, it was the depression, so the Jewish elders refused it. This young kid pleaded on his father’s behalf but they just wouldn’t do it. Even for a rabbi. 100 years later and this bad experience with the religion still echos in some regards.

[@josephedward7534]

@@AngryReptileKeeper Catholic here. Those people are so wrong about purgatory. Purgatory is not for eternity. Purgatory is a temporary state where the soul is purified before going to heaven. They are wrong about unbaptized babies not being able to go to heaven. Unfortunately so many Catholics, including some priests, don't even know what the Catholic faith teaches.

[@josephedward7534]

Your sister should have ask another priest. If your story is true, the priest you described violated Canon 843: "Sacred ministers cannot refuse the sacraments to those who ask for them at appropriate times, are properly disposed and are not prohibited by law from receiving them."

[@tamsel814]

I wish people would stop calling single parents households as broken family. Broken just has so many negative connotations

[@mindyschocolate]

Exactly. A kid and a happy single parent is a complete household. A kid growing up with two parents who hate each other…that’s broken.

[@peachesnsht]

I don't think OP meant her family was broken because she was raised by a single mom but because of how her mom treated her.

[@herewego8686]

I've been to so many households with 2 parents that was just filled with loathing. The parent never truly hide it as well as they think, and the kids end up spoiled or fucked up from over compensating. Goes both ways

[@awdrifter3394]

But they are. Divorce is a breaking up of the family. So after the divorce it's a broken family.

[@cynthiaholland13]

It means the relationship between the parents is broken

[@ScooterBond1970]

That's like the 2nd story in the past week or so where someone got mad/jealous their EX partner moved on to a new relationship, after they themselves had moved on. Big "I gotta win the break up!" vibes.

[@SailorMya]

Story 2 - I think the reason cheaters get upset at their exes for moving on after them is because they see them as "damaged goods" especially when kids are involved so in their twisted cheater mentality they think their exes wont be able to "do better" then them so wont move on. It is like they feel entitled still to that previous relationship but when they do move on it is a big blow to their ego and that is why they flip their shit... Also, did anyone else think it super tacky that he married his mistress on the same day as his ex like he can't even be bothered to remember a new date for his new wife or he wanted to hurt his ex so much he didn't care if his wife wanted to make it about just them and not his failed marriage.

[@stirrednotshaken4823]

Haha…I just said the same thing about both weddings being the same day!

[@susankaempfer8427]

It’s an ego thing. Like these people who lead people on endlessly because it makes them feel shiny and powerful to have people running after them or waiting around for them. Sick.

[@lauraanderson8785]

As a Christian, it seems to me like OP's husband is more concerned about appearances than actual faith. He wants to *look* like the picture perfect family and is focused on that. It's better to try to be the perfect family - and in a perfect family everyone is listened to, things are negotiated calmly, and children aren't ever forced to perform faith. I think that it's okay to introduce kids to religion but let them choose for themselves what they want. Also partners shouldn't either be forced to attend church if they don't want to. I'm like OP, I'm not into organised religion too much. I'm a left-leaning, LGBT Christian, so I understand completely wanting to practice faith by yourself. Some churches are downright toxic.

[@GhostBear3067]

At my church a while back an unknown party left anti-LGBT flyers around the campus and our pastor absolutely lost his shit. He was furiously gathering them up to throw away screaming about his congregation not abiding bigotry. He did not seem particularly interested in finding out who left the flyers and we never did learn the culprits' identity but nothing like that ever happened again.

[@threeducks157]

Some years ago i had a conversation with a gentleman at a prk outside a large church. At one point he asked me if i was catholic, because of my virgin Mary necklace. I answered in the positive but also mentioned that i dont go to church much as i dont care about some of the people. He then told me something that i will always remember "god is here" while pointing at my heart, he will always hear your prayers regardless of where you are. I kind of knew he was somehow related to the church for the way he was dressed, also our conversation was in English while in Mexico so i knew he wasn't from the area. Turns out he was part of the popal envoy group looking over the areas security for pope Francis.

[@lovelysakurapetalsyt]

Yeah, if I wasn't forced into religion like I was at a young age, I might still believe. The actual way people should think is it's totally fine to practice their own way, or it'll lead to religious trauma

[@threeducks157]

@GemsOfLilyheart-WSP yup, at a young age i actually enjoyed going to mass. I liked the serenity the ambient, even i didn't understand half of it. But as i grew older i started to notice the ugly side of it, mainly people.

[@sophdog2564]

Just from the title I say nta. I also think it's relevant that OP, a woman, had a vastly different experience than her husband, a man, even ignoring the out of wedlock situation

[@leaflet1686]

What has that to do with anything O.o If OP would be a man she would had the same experience and vice versa!

[@starbird3939]

@@leaflet1686 the Catholic church is very male-leaning. Women are often shamed for not being obedient housewives. And gods help if the woman is divorced.

[@Emi_TheWinged]

@@starbird3939 yup, its very different.

[@j.j.juggernaut9709]

@@leaflet1686 Because most often religion tends to have very misogynistic views. How strange that you don't realize that

[@leaflet1686]

@@starbird3939 Well she already had the issues before she even became a woman so... Eh...

[@yoyopron]

Story 2: OP's ex is a misogynist. After hearing what he said during their divorce, I was extremely skeptical about her claim he was a good father. A man who would say those things about a woman is not likely to be kind to the girls in his life. In his mind, they're all possessions.

[@susankaempfer8427]

True. How much damage would he have done to the daughters?

[@AryonaSamoto]

Story 1: It's good they communicated and found some common ground that works for them. Story 2: I'm glad OP found out about what her ex was doing before it was too late. She's a wonderful mom and she has such a wonderful partner by her side. Hopefully her daughters heal quickly.

[@owl7072]

Story 2: "I only get to see her 3 days a week" and who's fault is that

[@starbird3939]

Story 1 I find that the problem with religions just so happen to be the establishments running them, not the religion. For religious folk, I think the important thing is finding a community that is safe and accepting. Do not support churches that degrade and harm others. OP and husband need to have a discussion about this to find a solution that makes everyone happy. Also… the husband needs to be understanding-he experienced the “perfect” treatment of the church because he was priviledged. Meanwhile OP was given the hateful experience. There is no readon to retraumatize OP and the kids.

[@Himitssu]

Story 2: "I have no idea why he was acting like it" Because he''s a narcissist, he cheated on her, had no remorse, got married in their anniversary with his mistress to hurt her, and thought that OP could never be happy without him and was happy seeing her suffer.The moment she get in a relationship, starts to move on and to learn to be happy, he couldn't stand it, he felt personally offended by it "How dare she be happy without me?All she can should do it's suffer because she doesn't have me'" And of course, willing to hurt his kid and lie to her, just to use her as a pawn to hurt OP, he's just a evil AH, and the fact the mommy came to try to talk OP out of trying to get full custody, even knowing how he hurt his kids, makes me think she usually enables this behavior.

[@randomusername3873]

So like, I'm not religious nor I even like religions in general BUT Teaching your children about religion and being worried about their eventual salvation is one thing, being worried about the "picture perfect christian family" is completely different and incredibly superficial Is not even about the children 😂

[@DemonAngel]

My father's dad died when he was very young. Because my father's mom was a sudden "single mom" my father became a "bastard" and was tested and bullied not just by kids but adults. His mother, my Gram, told him at 11 (?) He didn't have to go anymore if he didn't want to. My dad years later (he's 58 now) hates the word bastard

[@GoldenLeafsMovies]

Story 1: It's hard to have these conversations but I'm glad they did and seem to sort it out. There are many different churches with different beliefs and expectations of what a Christian should be so it's tricky to find the right one that feels welcoming while also helpful.

[@AndyyWithAY]

You need to get to court immediately and protect your child 🤦🏾‍♀️🤦🏾‍♀️ At this point IDGAF about your wedding. I care about your child's safety. You saw him shake your child, you've heard about him verbally abusing her. That's what's important. Your child's safety.

[@erenssister.5535]

She did get emergency custody

[@cynthiaholland13]

Spirituality and faith is so incredibly important to so many people. That needs to be discussed before marriage and agreed upon. You can't push that after marriage. For my husband and I, it is our biggest blessing, how we met and what keeps us together. This was not the case for OP, so her husband can't expect this massive change. I pray for them

[@lina9535]

Story 2: Back to court and have the older daughter speak as a witness to the dads behaviour and show the video.

[@LaineyBug2020]

Story 2- I like how the adulterer was too good to be a step mom but not to good to sleep with a married man with children. Sum'n 'bout that math ain't mathin'!

[@srkh8966]

Who knows what OP’s ex said to an 18 yr old?

[@BruinPhD2009]

Story 2: I’m currently teaching at a university and stories of professors sleeping with their students, especially FRESHMEN, really turn my stomach; I think these relationships are more about power than anything else. I understand that there can always be a physical attraction (one of my students told me I had drip. Flattering, but no. 😂). However, the chances of making a deep emotional and intellectual connection with someone 20 years younger than you are slim to none, especially if you already hold some power over them (i.e., you’re responsible for their learning and grades). When the thrill of an illicit relationship wears off, what’s left? In this case, the second wife clearly wasn’t prepared to deal with stepchildren and an ex-wife. She, of all people, should have been the most horrified when her husband was shaking his daughter because that could be her future. Ex-husband? Well, he’s clearly nuts. I hope OP’s ex FIL continues to be in her corner. This story is hardly over.

[@plasmocat1863]

💯 There's a reason why Title IX is such a big deal in the workplace. I also work in academia, so I'm a little surprised the dude was able to keep his job. I can only assume she was never actually in one of his classes. Still, OP#2 could have 'effed with his career in a big way if she had wanted to (assuming she knew how big of a deal it's considered). I mean, I do know it still happens ofc, but I literally witnessed a man fired and walked out of the building the moment it was discovered he was messing with a student. Didn't wait for verification, didn't matter that the allegation admitted it was consensual. I don't know if that was the best way to handle the allegations, but nobody asked my opinion. Made an impression on me.

[@lovelywolv]

Story 1: NTA a 2yo don't even know what's going on in school. You shouldn't be forcing your kids into a religion just because you are a part of it. Let them choose for themselves instead of being indoctrinated and traumatized.

[@josephedward7534]

What would you consider the difference between indoctrinating and teaching.

[@lovelysakurapetalsyt]

​@@josephedward7534 Its indoctrination when you give them no choice of what they believe. That's what usually happens with most churches, they're forced to stay or their family will shun them for life

[@kateworkman921]

@@josephedward7534 I think teaching would be "hey, here's one school of thought on rules to live by, what some people think happens after you die, etc. There's also thousands more. Let's learn about a handful of them." Indoctrination is, "This is the only TRUE thing to believe and if you don't follow what this says, god will PUNISH you FOREVER!"

[@AndyyWithAY]

Story 2 this is nothing but spite. He wanted out of the marriage. OP is moving on and he won't change days. OP is offering more days. No valid reason. Just spite. OP was wrong in the first part. You can't be a good father and treat your spouse like 💩

[@PinkMarshmallows]

OP is not the angel she pretends to be. Why have a wedding on a weekday and not on the weekend, like most weddings are? Why have the wedding on the ex's day instead of her days? This WHOLE thing could have been avoided if OP was trying to get youngest to hate the father.

[@randomusername3873]

​@@PinkMarshmallows the reason is quite simple actually, Op was acting under the impression (and she was really dumb for that, many people thinks that, I don't know why) that the ex is a good father. Therefore she thought he would be reasonable

[@PinkMarshmallows]

@@randomusername3873 And as I said in my other comment to you, he is allowed to back on his word, as (us) women do it all the time.

[@n3rdv10l3nc3]

​@@PinkMarshmallows Super weird & creepy pick-me vibes you got going on. Defending a guy who VIOLENTLY SHOOK HIS PRESCHOOL AGED DAUGHTER while painting some weird misogynistic stereotype of the mercurial woman. Sincerely, that's disconcerting.

[@erenssister.5535]

@@PinkMarshmallows She literally said that was the only day the venue was available. Depending on your area some venues have a 2 year waiting list.

[@ladynoir8243]

Story one Is kinda my my life. I was born out of wedlock and my mom was shunned from the church but I was allowed to go to church. I hated that my mom couldn't go with me and I recent the church for it but I am trying to let go.

[@MuDkipzCHancelLOr]

Same but we just went to a new church. Easy fix.

[@MemristerBoogieDown]

I guess they forgot that whole judge not lest ye be judged part…

[@Nevertoleave]

@@MuDkipzCHancelLOr small communities don’t have a lot of choices

[@AppleStrawberryLove]

@@MuDkipzCHancelLOr What about when you went through so much that just walking into any church leaves you hyperventilating and having a panic attack? When even my not the greatest dad could see after he strong-armed me into going that I was not okay after a service? What do I do then, oh wise one? Should I just... go to a different church and "easy fix" I'll be fine suddenly in that church? Full offense, but this comment reeks of your privilege when it comes to both options for churches and how much damage you have been left to deal with. I'm not saying you didn't experience stuff, but I am saying that this response assumes everyone has it only as bad as you and no one ever could have actual trauma where a new church is not a fix. Some people have enough trauma that, even with therapy, going to any church is not an option without severe repercussions. Some people don't have other options for churches.

[@dreamart3395]

Story One ... OMG. Why oh why is it that people who find religion or have been indoctrinated in it from birth CANNOT cope/tolerate/allow those who don't to live their lives as they do?????? I was born, baptized, confirmed, married in the Catholic Church. Except for funerals, I never set foot in the Catholic Church again after the ink dried on my marriage certificate. As a teen my continued questioning the Church's doctrine and, those who were teaching it did not make me popular. Some of my challenging questions during catechism resulted in my parents being called in for a conference. Why I felt so attached to the Church that six years after I was married I went back and asked that my son be baptized. The priest told me no ... as a fallen away Catholic I needed to redeem myself. I said no ... and, never looked back. Here's the kicker ... my sister (19 years older than me) was having an affair with the very priest that wouldn't baptize my child.

[@GhostBear3067]

LOL in Brazilian folklore that means every Thursday night your sister would turn into a headless mule with fire shooting from the neck stump terrorizing the countryside stealing people's finger and toe nails. I am not being serious, I mean this purely in jest.

[@PrincessQ-fj9ly]

This story reminds me of why my parents didn't want me and my siblings to go to Church if we didn't want to. One of my grandma said she loves her community and I actually went to Church once. It was a pretty good experience. Still, my parents, my daddy in particular was adamant about not exposing us to religious hypocrisy. That being said, I'm glad OP's husband realized that he shouldn't be forcing religion on his family, took off his rose colored glasses about church communities and even going to therapy to unpack everything. I hope things get better now that OP and her husband and children are out of that toxic church. ❤ Seriously, I can't stand religious hypocrisy. The way that church treated OP was awful! ಠ⁠︵⁠ಠ If being born out of wedlock is so sinful, they shouldn't allowed OP's mom to terminate her pregnancy. Unless, they wanted to punish OP and her mother, which I think is downright cruel. 😢

[@ivorynk752]

What a nice ending to story1, I was expecting it to blow up into a bigger issue

[@maurer3d]

Story 2 (before update): NTA, your ex-husband is being a total tool, he is just trying to hurt you, and by extension your daughter. He agreed to switch days to allow your children to attend the wedding, he can just take back that approval. If he acts like this alot it is definitely time to go back to court for full custody. Story 2 (update 1): Yup, he's just an abusive AH. LOL and he is mad because you are happy and moved on and he sees how much of a toolbag he is. Story 2 (update 2): Don't blame yourself for not noticing, kids have a habit of hiding abuse very well, Either out of fear that you will start abusing them, you won't believe them, or that the abuse may ramp up if they talk.

[@CircusoftheMoon]

I’m happy I grew up in a “broken” home. My parents were miserable together and it was insufferable.

[@maggpiprime954]

Feeling droopy today. Lots of love to you all. I hope you all had a lovely Passover, Ramadan, Easter. (How cool is that, that these three coincided this year?) 💖

[@ChrisAndCats]

*sends you a clothes prop* 🙂

[@maggpiprime954]

@@ChrisAndCats Lmao! Thanks! 🤣

[@ACCER]

I'm Catholic and while I never had negative experiences, the insular small town I had moved to was NOT welcoming. Years later, I moved to a new town and decided on a whim to pop into the local Catholic Church. I met the new priest and immediately adored him. He was young, about 30, and fun. His parents attended Mass now and then (they lived about 2 hours away.) And I used to watch him with the kids during the Friday school Mass or after Mass playing basketball and thought what a great father he would make. He and I became good friends and bonded over our shared love of music and video games. He was transferred 3 years later. About 2 years after that, one weekend during both masses, he stood up and announced he was leaving the priesthood to explore a relationship with a woman he had met. He and I were still in touch and the news of what he did (his transfer was only about 2 hours away) spread like wildfire. I let him know I was still on his side and still his friend. He lost a LOT of friends over that. I was eventually invited to his wedding and am the Godmother to his oldest daughter. He's now an Anglican priest and works in a hospital as well as a local parish about an hour from me. That was 15 years ago. He and his wife are very happily married, they have 3 kids and life is great for them. I'm still Catholic.

[@recycledapathy7411]

Honestly in story 2, I probably would have waited until after the court case to block the ex so that he could give them even more evidence of his instability. His wife gave them some nice evidence with the email about being too good to be a step-mom, showing that she doesn't have any interest in the girls, which will also play well in court. By the time they get to court, there might be enough to have a full restraining order, depending on how unhinged the texts and emails get. And 100% child support too, while OP is at it.

[@Phrancieee]

OOOOOF the religion story 😢"No, you cannot sleep over at your friend's house on Saturday, because we have church on Sunday and you cannot miss it," was how I was raised. Guess who hasn't set foot in a church in years and harbors a lot of resentment for religion? 🤡🙌

[@helstok178]

Story 2: I think he flipped 2 weeks before the wedding because it genuinely hit him that she has moved on and won't be spending her life missing him and wishing he would take her back, etc. He is a horrible person

[@MsStrangeEmilie]

Story 2: the ex is jealous, he is mad that OP is living her best life . That she is happier than him. That's it. He is a bitter man that will die unloved.

[@Cael_Dereck]

"I have no idea why he was acting like it" I can tell you. He was hoping to ruin your day. Maybe even planning to poison your relationship with your youngest daughter by telling her "You see? Mommy is happier without you and doesn't need you on her big day."

[@yamiarisu49]

Story 1: I felt this personality as someone that grew up and went to Catholic School; you can tell which ones learn the faith vs. they go to church to show off. The show-off was that the father was the head of the family, the mother was obedient and made sure the family was in their Sunday best, and the children could recite the bible better than I could and never questioned their parents. The irony was that the families would get angry at me for going to a Catholic School and trying to learn it. Sometimes it is better to know independently when the person gets older. A true Catholic would not care about the circumstances of a person's birth or the parent's sins.

[@Russman67]

Story 2: Dad is being a dick because OP didn't stay broken after their relationship ended (Who worries about if their ex up/down grades?) 🤦‍♂️. Now he's turning his kids against him with his bullshit.

[@paden1865able]

He assaulted the child. Cops should have been called immediately and the child's statement made. Ex husband wants to control her for the rest of her life. Shut that shit down.

[@WatchTheWorldBurn63]

I'm not gonna say crap about anyone's religion, but if attendance is more important than teachings, then there are a lot of questions that need asking. Like in the case of op, if you follow the Catholic teachings, I doubt jesusor g-d (I dont really know who it would be), would be pissed off if you don't go to a certain place.

[@Suilimani]

My parents forced us all to to go to church every week and now wonders why not one of us go anymore

[@CreepyBlueAnimals84]

Kids At Church: Amy Farrah Fowler got a shout out!! "I don't object to the concept of a diety but I'm baffled by the notion of one that takes attendance." Also, any living being under the age of 12 sitting in Church!! Crikey!!! Story 2: Show every single text to the lawyer/Judge EVERYONE involved in the case!! A judge would have to be evil to make those kids go back there!!

[@colleens1107]

Their kids are 2 and under. They would only be disruptive during mass ANYWAY. And knowing how OP was treated, it’s seriously messed up to try to force her to go to mass.

[@colleens1107]

I’m sooo glad hubby realized that the church was toxic to her and will just pursue religion on his own. Great update

[@genevievemarie1418]

I moved to the south Bible belt area and it was quite the shock..I grew up with 0 religion so when my kids came home crying one day being told they were going to hell I had to have a chat with my neighbors..The knocking on my doors the texts i could handle butmaking my kids cry crossed the line.All that did was push me away from converting ....Very negative and judgemental .

[@yamairad1]

I'm afraid that he's going to become like his parents and use obedience to God to destroy his family.

[@Sammvoy]

I relate to op so much. I was raised in a (catholic) religious town and picked on sooo badly for being a bastard child, my parents not being married, not being involved in the faith etc. I would never want to expose my kids to that, it definitely led to me being soured on organized religion as a whole

[@SP-io7lj]

The ex is a piece of work! He got married to his second wife on his anniversary with the first wife! How absolutely insane! Dating a girl so much younger than him? That's the sign of a man who likes control. Calling her ugly? Nothing but a ploy to damage her self esteem! Of course he was losing his mind when someone else gets what he threw away. Controlling and abusive people are like that. How sad for those kids to have a father like that.

[@bloxnirogaming5269]

Story 2: as soon as That ex husband started thrashing Gaby, all bets were off. If that was my kid he'd at least have a black eye.

[@roserocks1979]

Second story he didn't want her anymore, but he didn't want her to be with anyone else either. What a ahole!

[@dillongage]

Story 2: All I have to say is, he can't be a "good father" if he cheated and destroyed your family, but whatever. Beyond that you handled it well. Also, why cheaters get upset when their Ex-partner moves on, I will never understand. You left as$hole, not them. Edit: Exactly what I thought! Well said Mark.

[@4-2222]

Story 1: Did this woman really come to Reddit to ask if she should go to church? The children are gonna end up using tiny adorable fedoras.

[@gregjayonnaise8314]

S1: A clear demonstration of religious hypocrisy. A church sees the picture perfect family with no visible flaws and holds them higher than everyone else, while the child from a more complicated upbringing is shunned and pushed away despite bearing no fault. Classy.

[@dawnstone4424]

Thank you for the time and care you put into these uploads ❤️They make me smile

[@WobblesandBean]

OP 2: You need to file for sole custody. *_NOW._*

[@alicewilloughby4318]

Story 1 - The fact that the husband uses the phrase "picture perfect" makes it pretty clear that he's more concerned with how the family looks from the outside than what's really best for the kids. OP has pretty much told us that his family was the same way when he was growing up. Also, I can't help wondering if Hubs feels he has something to prove, since he married the illegitimate girl that everyone at church looked down on/was suspicious of?

[@alexderby6088]

My mom's side of the family no longer really associates with the Catholic church. I had two aunts pass away, one by a drunk driver and one from breast cancer, and the church turned their backs on my family when they needed help with the funerals and everything else

[@jesterbrown90]

Story 2: Yikes. OP, please get security cameras for your house and maybe even a gun. That psycho ex isn't done yet, and there's no limit on crazy.

[@sequoyasierra5671]

I have never understood why someone throws a spouse away, then becomes totally incensed when the discarded spouse gets remarried or gets pregnant (or gets their new SO pregnant). Like what??? Did they think that person was going to sit around crying in their beer, pining away for the ex for the rest of their life? I also wonder what these people's new spouses think when they see their wife or husband getting angrier and angrier their ex has gotten happy and moved on. It would make me think they aren't really over that original relationship.

[@alissaroberts2545]

For story one, I would recommend they check out the Unitarian Universalist church.

[@lellepad]

For Story 2 I think the husband had access to his new wife’s email and decided to try yet again to mess with OP. Who moves out of a house with no kids because the kids that ARENT there are brats? Makes no sense 😆

[@paulastiles5507]

Story #2: OP needs to be very, very careful. The grass on the cheating side did not turn out to be greener and the ex is bitter that being a selfish douchecanoe didn't work out for him. He's going to do everything he can to ruin her life.

[@hodgeelmwood8677]

Sitting in church doesn't make you a Christian (Catholic or otherwise) any more than sitting in a garage makes you a car. I hope OP finds a way to express her faith that feels right to her, and that her husband understands that each person's faith is a personal thing, and can't be forced into existence.

[@SappyDuder]

Story 1: my grandparents went every Sunday at their old church and would bring my mom, aunt, and uncle with them. They never missed a day unless someone was sick. After moving a half hour away from their old church, they went to another one (same denomination) every Saturday. Sometimes, they'd take my brother and I if we were staying with them for the night. About a decade ago, my pop had a stroke and stopped going because of his health, but my nan would go and bring his communion back home. About 8 years ago, she stopped going in person and they started watching mass on TV on Sundays. I remember asking her if she missed the church and she said "I miss going, but you can worship God anywhere. You don't need to be in a church for him to hear your prayers" Although, they were always a little different from most religious people of their time (pop's mother was Jewish before marrying a Protestant man, and my pop himself went from Protestant to Catholic after marrying my Catholic nan. The mixing of religions was a HUGE no-go in the early 1900's but they didn't care) My pop passed not too long after that, and she kept watching mass on TV because it didn't feel right going without him. Now that her health is on the decline, I'm glad she has stayed home to watch her mass for all these years. But yeah, you don't need to be in a specific building to worship your God(s) if you don't want to.

[@TheMimiSard]

Story 1 - I will be honest and say I grew up with a pretty good religious experience being raised in a church. I feel like a lot of that was because my mother was not overly controlling and as we got up in my teens, she was not forceful in making us attend. Mum was also moderately liberal in our entertainment choices, and we got a VCR when I was around 7-8, and even before that we watched child-friendly movies reasonably frequently (and we are a Star Wars and Indiana Jones house, with my brothers and I being young children when the movies (original trilogy SW) came out in the cinemas (I am an end-of-Gen-Xer, close enough to be very sympathetic to Millennials)), so video hire and taping movies off TV was a common feature of my whole childhood (the first movie we watched on tape was Star Wars (ANH)). I have a story I am not shy to relate about how my cousin, his friends, his sister, her friends, and a handful of siblings there-of landed at our house circa 1989, with a couple of hired movies for a watch night. Mum allowed it, and as she told a parent at church later, better they were at our place where Mum could vet the movies instead of being off who knows where getting into trouble. It was not long after she said that, that VCRs started being bought into church households a lot more. I also never really heard much of anything about the "Satanic Panic" reaction to D&D in a time where I watched the cartoon, and later "borrowed my brother's Avatar Trilogy novels to read (if you don't know Forgotten Realms in-universe history, big event in the changeover between 2nd Edition and 3rd Edition where the gods were thrown out of the divine planes and had to assume avatars on Faerûn - the trilogy is about a team of four adventurers who end up in the centre of events, Midnight, Kelemvor, Adon, Cyric - and if two of those names are familiar, then three out of four of them became gods, with Adon becoming a priest of Midnight's when she took over as Mystra). I always read a lot of Fantasy and Sci-Fi, with my first serious novel being "The Diamond Throne" by David Eddings, solidly fantasy, second world setting. The worst I had was a teacher taking a book from me, but me stealing it out of his desk drawer later. I never heard anything about fantasy novels being "devilish" until Harry Potter leapt to international fame, and by then I was over 20 and my opinions were set. I did have a church minister who seemed to drag his feet on my baptism classes because I wore modest jewellery (one earring and an 18th b'day ring), but I later approached a junior minister sent to our church and he was not so stuffy. This is all to say, I had a fine run, but I am realist and cynical enough to know others don't have my fortune. Hell, I don't attend church regularly now, but I have my faith, so I can conduct my relationship with God my way, and listen to Weird Bible podcast episodes when they come out. I understand people hurt by a church have to leave, I just feel sad if it also destroys their faith, as I view it as human fault, and believe God disapproves of the mistreatment they suffered.

[@HobieInTheBox]

Story 1: As someone who was raised religious and got religious trauma, I absolutely disagree with people raising children religiously. Kids don't understand the concept of faith or deities. They should not be forced to go to church or subjected to such indoctrination. They should be able to choose for themselves if they even want to be religious, when they're old enough to understand it. Story 2: 16:07 "why"?? WHY?? You just experienced why, jesus OP what kind of question is that

[@jennilynne1977]

I hope everyone is having a great day/afternoon/night! Peace ☮️, hugs 🤗 and love 😘!

[@13thMaiden]

Sometimes you can come from happily married parents (and born in wedlock) and still treated hatefully by the church. Either cause you don't do enough for the church and the community wants to shame you into paying/doing more; OR there's just something "wrong" with you. Despite Jesus' teachings, communities like that can be extremely judgemental, and if you are born with any kind of mental issue they look down on you and clutch at their children like your issue is contagious. I have long forgone the church and just practice my religion at home. Story 2) "I'm too good to be a stepmom to ungrateful brats!" Uh-huh, but not good enough to keep from boinking a married man. She's clearly tired of him (especially if he keeps pressuring her to get pregnant) and just using the kids as scapegoats to get out of the marriage.

[@willSugar]

My spouse is Hindu. I am an atheist from a Buddhist family. We talked extensively on the role religion would play in our child's life. We basically agreed that our child will have an opportunity to be included in Hinduism but when he is old enough to verbalize his wishes our child will decide if he wishes to worship. Differences in religion can work but you have to have several conversations about it when it comes to your children and ultimately you need to respect your child may choose to worship differently.

[@thematrix2661]

HAHAHA he divorce her and now still trying to belittle her haha

[@hibiscusrose6074]

What is wrong with ex's even when they have married other new partners, they get so jealous of the ex partners? Story 2

[@Tokuijin]

Story 1) NTA, tbh. Faith is a relationship betwixt one and one's deity/deities, places of worship notwithstanding.

[@myawilliams9682]

Story 1: The solution is literally so simple. If kids wanna go to church take them to church if they don't wanna go then let them stay home.

[@GMAMEC]

Lol, most kids will opt out. They have to get up early, dress up, and sit quietly. This also goes for school too. It’s really complicated. Perhaps they can be introduced to the church, but not forced or “shamed”.

[@twiggytofu]

This! Forcing religion on anyone is wrong. Children are their own persons and can decide for themselves if and what they wanna believe in.

[@myawilliams9682]

​​​@@GMAMECIf they opt out then they opt out, that's kinda how freedom of religion works. You are free to choose not to participate and that choice should be respected.🤷🏾‍♀️ You can introduce your kid to stuff of course but when they start being forced to go or shamed when they don't that's a different story. School is a different thing all together, education is vital being apart of a religion not so much.

[@kateworkman921]

To story one, all I can say is something I've found is truer and truer as years go by. There's no better definition of unbridled hatred than "Christian love."

[@mariecherrytree]

Catholic school and church were some of the worst darkest times of my life. Bullied in school and nothing was done to stop it, the nuns seemed to hate children, and the monsignor was cold and taught guilt fire and brimstone.

[@MrAnthon2]

i had the same issue in the past with my priest and being forced.

[@3ftsteamrwy12]

A church is simply a building...you can be "devout" or a "good citizen/churchgoer" simply by keeping God in your mind and thoughts daily. Some of the worst sinners/evil people I ever met broke most of the commandments on Sunday afternoon after coming home from church.

[@samiballew4609]

I grew up pentacostal/Baptist and was told by the church from a young age that I will also go to hell for being born out of wedlock. The word bastard still triggers me

[@lina9535]

You know your kid is f'ed up when even the dad calls him "pathetic son" 😂

[@shydog7276]

First story it's really amazing to see there are Catholics out there who aren't fanatical about their church and religion while still being deeply religious. I'm baptized Catholic and it was the church that basically had me renounce religion as a whole for a very long time. I'm spiritual at best now and refuse to go into any kind of church due to how toxic my experiences were. I hope the OP and her family are doing well.

[@joeschmo622]

_"The Kingdom of God is inside you and all around you, / Not in a mansion of wood and stone. / Split a piece of wood and you will find me, / Lift a stone and I am there."_ -- St Thomas

[@2GMen]

Story 2: As soon as her ex made the “not tight” comment, that night OP should have imitated Lorena Bobbitt and solved his “little” problem.

[@courtneypuzzo2502]

in that age group no the kids shouldn't be forced to attend church every Sunday its different when they're older and can choose say age 7 or 8 when its time to start CCD for first Communion

[@Akz2Reckless]

It always amazes me how many Christians don't know that jesus used to pray in isolated place on top of mountains etc. you dont need to pray in church to connect with God

[@whitneylivingston5706]

Faith should be taught at home with the example the parents set. Church is a place to fellowship with other believers. I am a firm believer that faith and church needs to be discussed and decided before children are even a thought.

[@NoMoreHeroesAnymore1334]

Just to the title: GOOD. FOR. YOU. AND. YOUR. KIDS.

[@shells500tutubo]

Op says she likes the Catholic religion but not the Church. The Church IS the religion. And the reason her husband has the rose-colored glasses on is because he was a child when he went to church. He never went as an adult. All of the negative stuff was all around him, but as a child you don't see it.

[@damien678]

My partner that's ex-Catholic has talked about how the church is the religion, it was so wild to hear about. She probably likes Jesus but still identifies as Catholic because that's all she's known, despite her statement being quite silly

[@Sarah-lb2rf]

Story 1: op is WAY more patient than I am The second my partner started saying those things i would be looking for divorce attorneys cause from my experience the deeper you get into religion the more detached you become I wasn't raised going to a church and with everything I've learned about church practices i don't want to My family has been trying to pursade me to go but I gave them a firm no I don't want to get involved in organized religion And I'm not one of those people who have to broadcast their beliefs every single minute My way of thinking about those things is that as long as you're not hurting yourself or others you do you

[@astronautviolet153]

Story 1 NTA if the kids are old enough to say they don't want to, don't let them it's not genuine.

[@fangchick93]

My great grandmother was a devote Anglican but rarely went to church outside of weddings and funerals, because she believed that God could hear her no matter where she prayed. She often quoted Matthew 6:5 " And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward." I'm agnostic btw, but I'm big on "you do you" and that extends to religion. As long as it doesn't hurt anyone

[@sabinemetzger3219]

Our local church used to be fun until we got a new priest. He was not bad, but he could preach on and on for hours. The usually one maybe one and a half our sunday morning church we visited weekly turned into easily two hours or more sometimes 3 on christmas or easter. It was exhausting. Especially families left halfway through because the young kids got cranky, hungry or needed potty. Our church did not have an area for that, only a tiny public toilet without changing table so they had to leave. Then the wifes stayed home to prepare dinner because sunday was usually a more elaborate dinner and the long time spend at church left no time for proper cooking and everyone was really hungry after church. Within 5 years the church was noticably emptier. Before you had to come half an hour early to even find a seat or stand the whole time, now there were empty seats even if you arrived on time. We only went to church every sunday because our grandma was very religious, but after a time even she stayed home because so many of her friends did too and and her health declined and she could barely walk after spending so long on the hard wooden benches in church let alone cook a sunday roast after that. Then the scandal about the church hiding pedo priests came on top of that and our church never recovered and now we share a (different) priest with 5 neigbouring villages in the area. I wonder what happened to the priest who preached so long? (Ps: english is not my first language so i do not know if its priest. We say Pfarrer but i guess thats not exacly the same?)