MA. v Karen Read Trial Day 14 - Matt and Jen McCabe. Texts, Statements and Searches.

[@jillismyname100]

I don't understand why everyone sounds so condescending when they say "Karen was hysterical" like wouldn't you be if you found your partner frozen to death?!?!

[@marymary7269]

It’s so bizarre how they are acting like this is not totally normal behaviour for the situation. I cannot get my head around what they are thinking

[@Gabriel-hf1yy]

Maybe cause they are all calm and cold hearted and dont understand real emotions...

[@alia_sarai]

Exactly my thoughts.

[@Always_Thinking]

Maybe JM doesn't understand KR's reaction because she doesn't have any feelings for MM!

[@doeb23]

Yes, her being unbothered is what would be indicative of guilt

[@SonjaHamburg]

It's so scary to think how often cases like this might go to trial where the defendant can't afford a whole team of the best attorneys

[@cindz4618]

And they are forced to plead guilty to get a "lower" conviction...

[@cailinanne]

Yup!!!

[@gracie1598]

I have been saying exactly the same. Well, actually, I stated: Imagine what would happen to her if she could not afford a competent attorney. Samething. Listen, I hope Karen sues every one of them in Civil Court for the heartache and financial burden they have placed on her.

[@beverlyflores]

I know I feel bad for those ppl

[@acousticprojekt]

I feel they must be doing this free because of the publicity

[@foxsquad6992]

We always take our shoes off when we come in the house. It’s just a normal thing here in Canada. BUT I’m telling you right now that if we were rushing around trying to find someone, we’d absolutely run through the house with our shoes on! No one is gonna take the time to take their shoes off when you’re “distraught” looking for someone missing!!!

[@CharredinCharlie]

Exactly.

[@katejarman4598]

Jen thinks it makes Karen look bad but all it does is show who was in a rush to find John and who wasn’t

[@TN-rf7nt]

We take our shoes off inside the house too.

[@marymary7269]

It would literally be weird if someone did take off their shoes during such desperation.

[@leiliyahdecotta]

Exactly. And then she tries to say she and the other woman were frantically searching all the rooms (as if this is a toddler who could be getting into the medicine cabinet or something?) And try to imply Karen is doing something nefarious because she was in too much of a hurry to take off her shoes but then failed to run from room to room with adequate haste?

[@sunshi1583]

So frustrating that 40 witnesses, 3 weeks of testimony and the only FACT we’ve learned is that it was snowing 😕

[@daedalus6796]

Don't forget that John O'Keefe absolutely did not enter the house. And that a band was playing at the Waterfall bar.

[@mariapafflackduck3170]

And that no 1 can remember anything on cross exam.

[@jumbolumps666]

And what eeeeveryone's drink order was 🙄

[@marie-evegoulet3229]

I can’t believe that you all forgot that they lost the game that night. Hard facts of this case. 😅

[@carissacollier10]

And that three people remember the exact time of 12:10

[@9kat53]

I continue to think it is important that there was approx 6 inches of snow under John's body, yet there is general agreement it had just started to snow when Karen dropped him off.

[@Gabriel-hf1yy]

My thoughts too

[@MissChievousRN]

His body heat would have significantly melted most, if not all, of that before the corpse cooled- unless he wasn't killed right there. The ground would have been more saturated than the surrounding ground, IF they had done a thorough, professional, forensic investigation. Any snow under him would have been saturated and obviously melted. Such bullshish

[@stellaallbright4750]

🎯

[@Naveen-tx8be]

Wait, did we learn that there was ~6in of snow under him in this trial? Did I miss something? Also, we heard testimony that his body was moved around due to lifesaving measures-moving a large man through intense snow buildup requires intense physical strength. None of the EMTs have discussed needing to dig him out of the snow to transport him. So are we to expect Karen moved him while attempting cpr?? None of this adds up.

[@9kat53]

​​@@Naveen-tx8be It was during day 7, one of the paramedics said this. It stood out to me, bec of all the prior testimony abt the snow just beginning to fall as they were leaving the bar and migrating over to the Albert's house. I don't think paramedics wld have moved him much, if there was a possibility he had been hit by a car. They wld have been thinking abt possible spinal cord injuries and wld perhaps want to move him, especially his back, as little as possible. Of course, I am not a medical professional, and I may be wrong about this. If however the paramedics did move John around while treating him, and if he fell after being hit by Karen, then there should be a spot relatively empty of snow where his body had been. This spot, with its lack of 6 or so inches of newly fallen snow, wld still be visible even if snow had been moved off of John. There would still be a human adult male sized area bare of flat fallen snow. Iow, even if the paramedics moved him, and again, this is, I think unlikely with a patient possibly hit by a car bec they wld be worried abt potential spinal cord injuries, but even if they did for some reason move him, the snow knocked off of John wld 1) not be lying relatively flat like the rest of the newly fallen snow, it wld instead be in chunks and pieces, and 2) wld have grass underneath it, if the paramedics knocked it off onto the spot John had fallen into after Karen allegedly hit him. I have been waiting for this 6 inches underneath John to be addressed by someone ever since I first heard it mentioned, on day 7.

[@amylynn732]

It was so unreasonable that Jennifer McCabe and Carrie Roberts tell Karen to look around for JO'K then when she does and she sees him, they cluck their tongues and claim Karen knew where he was. If they didn't know where he was why were they telling Karen to look around for him outside?!?!? Why would they think he was outside? It would be reasonable to think he was inside someone's house.

[@LuvLight13]

Great point!!!!!!

[@MeganSpruce90]

Did I miss the part where they told her specifically to look around outside? You're absolutely right . They are super contradictory. They say one thing, and turn it around on her. It's all just so weird!

[@beverlyflores]

So agreed

[@rsnide1891]

@@MeganSpruce90they were driving around looking outside, they weren’t knocking on doors

[@hopeandhappiness777]

not to mention the obvious fact, there’s absolutely no empathy or support for Karen who cannot find her boyfriend John, whom she fears might be hurt. Not once did you hear from either of the other two ladies they were so upset for Karen. We just wanted make sure we could help her find John all they did was criticize Karen for being upset. also, well, Jen kept saying was how much Karen was screaming all the time but did you notice when they showed the ring camera video when they first went to John’s house? Karen wasn’t screaming at all. They made it sound like she was hysterical from the point to point like it never let up but yet she just looks like she’s worried about John. She doesn’t know where he is?🤷‍♀️

[@lisajustlisa2923]

In my opinion, After hearing some of Mr McCabe's group texts today, they DO know what happened to John. Those texts were disgusting and so disrespectful to what seemed to be a good man.

[@samfritz7954]

Yes , todays texts were it for me . They absolutely do know what happened .

[@JustSomeDude2161]

I stand here. I don’t know what Karen did that night. But judging by the evasiveness and demeanor of these witnesses, and how everything gets re-homed, SOMEONE at that house did SOMETHING to John O’Keefe.

[@robinlennon2580]

I so agree. I feel so bad for his parents and brother.

[@LazySusan.]

​@@robinlennon2580 His parents and brother aren't fans of Karen or what she's done to many of John's friends.

[@silikon2]

Does any Boston area person know if some of these things are just normal way of speaking there? I mean, calling a beloved pet "it" and a many years friend "the guy" sounds sus and distancing, but it could literally be just a local dialect thing.

[@BookishDark]

Gotta love that they’re all gaslighting the shit out of Karen for finding her boyfriend dying in the cold and freaking out. Like SHES insane. You’re all a bunch of sociopaths. She’s the only one who gave a shit about that man.

[@ancaci]

Exactly. With “friends” like these who needs enemies?

[@susanwhalls6230]

Lolol

[@MeganSpruce90]

I noticed her reaction to finding him was illogical, erratic and all over the place.. which is so often a sign of shock. Which, with her erratic thoughts and behavior being discussed makes me believe she truly was in shock. She was throwing out random thoughts from thinking she was on her period (odd?), to him cheating, to him being dead.. she wasn't making sense because she was panicked.

[@valiakloeppel7252]

😂

[@McQuizzical]

Amen

[@dramallama6811]

Thoroughly convinced after Jen McCabe’s testimony they framed Karen Read. No doubts about it.

[@katejarman4598]

Thank god people aren’t falling for the mcalberts smoke and mirrors bs

[@samfritz7954]

@@katejarman4598absolutely not falling for it . Jen McCabe was bone chilling it just seemed like all bullshit .

[@katejarman4598]

@@samfritz7954 yes I felt the same way! Yikes. And I think she thought she was really nailing it!

[@Liinnie]

I’m starting to think one of them had a affair with John at this point

[@katejarman4598]

@@Liinnie I actually started looking into this case and didn’t warm to Karen Read but still thought she was innocent based on the evidence and lack thereof. The more it goes on the more highly I think of Jen and realise she was in the wrong place and time with these meathead lowlifes

[@janebrown3587]

It was an EXTREMELY SMART, loving, compassionate, human thing for Karen to do - ❤ skin to skin contact for warmth!!!!! ❤ KAREN WAS BRILLIANT IN DOING THAT! Oh my god, Jen inadvertently made that powerful statement in favor of Karen Read!

[@sarcasticcatlady2036]

“The Guy” … I’m continually flabbergasted by the uncaring and cold commentary by these “friends” of John O’Keefe. WTAF, is wrong with them?

[@shaz_am07]

I agree. So sad for John’s family.

[@leannabedore]

Exactly! Rubs me so wrong. Then they call Karen the defendant like they don't know her name. They could say John Okeefe or officer John Okeefe out of respect.

[@SJ-km4db]

Wait until you hear the 911 that Jen made and called John " A man in the snow".

[@CatherineRachael]

@@SJ-km4dbplease no spoilers..

[@stellaallbright4750]

@CatherineRachael -- If you've been on LawTube long enough, you'll know not to read through the comments section if you don't want to see alleged spoilers. EDB doesn't want them in the Live Chat, but she can't control the comments. Same thing happens in every trial. 💜

[@missouricountrygirl8166]

Jenn also refers to Officer John O’keefe as “A man laying on the ground.” When she called 911. Not a Boston Police Officer and a friend, but a man.

[@soude85]

“The Guy” text was so vile!

[@missouricountrygirl8166]

@@soude85 yes, it was!

[@tibb814]

The distancing language they all employed is very suss. Karen was the only one who acted like she cared.

[@missouricountrygirl8166]

@@tibb814 while Karen was helping they couldn’t even go inside the house and get a trained first responder to help.

[@Jack-bc5xg]

Your reaching

[@nightowl8548]

Let's say it louder for those people in the back "HOW DID THIS CASE EVER MAKE IT TO TRIAL?!"

[@susanwhalls6230]

After Karen changed her story, at first she admitted it & then all of a sudden her lawyers came up with this stupid conspiracy and hired turtlehead to bully and harass the friends & families who actually cared about JO.

[@jessmarie8040]

I’m still trying to figure that out.

[@SJ-km4db]

Because the DA is so corrupt. The FBI have been investigating him for a while now. And he HAS to get the Albert's off. The judge went to school with the DA and her father represented Chris Albert years ago when he hit and run a guy on the highway, killing him. Served only 6 months in jail. The whole world now sees the absolute corruption going on in MA that starts from the top down.

[@DS-hd6rq]

😮😮😮

[@ellimpiador6559]

Morrissey, Lally, McCabe, Higgins, McLaughlin, Nagel, I'm detecting a pattern. That and a couple of Alberts who can crack skulls and have the number, literally and, apparently, figuratively, of the DA's office and this is what you get. Welcome to Boston-area blue collar, small town life circa 1950, I mean, 2024.

[@mr.e3123]

"Could you stfu your screaming is gonna wake up the whole neighborhood" is unhinged. those are seriously misplaced priorities. how often do you get people outside your house screaming for that to be your response to that

[@estrella5935]

It didn’t wake up the Albert’s apparently.

[@DyslecticAttack]

The vibes are all sorts of ice cold "Can you stop screaming already? Sure he might be dead or dying, but no need to make it other peoples problems. Just chill". "So my friend thought her boyfriend might be dying somewhere in the blizzard, but I needed some coffee first to deal with that. I can not deal with them hysterics without my morning cup." And don't forget the ol' "Can you believe her? Sure she might be in a hurry trying to find a possibly dying man, but how can she not take off her shoes?! Like, so rude."

[@estrella5935]

@@DyslecticAttack the shoes comments were just weird! Both of them actually 🤔

[@chicagodoll]

​@@DyslecticAttackim glad im.not the only one who picked up her casually making coffee before bothering with her hysterical friend.

[@spod414]

@@DyslecticAttack JM was in no rush to find OJO... She didn't want him found and medically attended to because he would have been able to identify the person/people responsible for his injuries 😒 It's sickening ! ... To think they knew he was out, lying on the ice cold ground in the blizzard and in medical trouble 😞... They allowed him to die instead of getting him medical help ! 😢 ... Those poor POOR children!! 😢😢

[@jillismyname100]

Not only is the lack of sympathy for John O'Keefe just insane. but even Karen's "friends" don't show a shred of empathy when they recount how "hysterical" she was the morning she found him. These people seem really cruel.

[@LazySusan.]

Jen was crying. I've never seen Karen show one ounce of emotion after reliving that morning over and over again.

[@kirks7143]

They weren't her friends!! They were Johns 'friends' and no doubt Karen made the effort to tolerate them ....they are a completely different class!! Listen to what Matt says when it comes to talking about the Private School that Kayleigh got into and John was so proud .....as soon as John died they put Kayleigh into Canton High .....the very place he didn't want her to go ...Jen took her for her first day!! The jealousy with these couples is inexplicable??

[@LazySusan.]

@kirks7143 Karen sure did show her contempt for them after enlisting the help of one of the most unscrupulous men I've seen. My thoughts are she'll be found NG here but charged with leaking impounded documents, etc.. Involving TB and leaking evidence was a bad move. And ruined their lives. I'm not going back and forth on it as it's difficult to bifurcate her behavior from one case to another.

[@xhepa.x]

If we are left with "more questions and no answers", that automatically makes the verdict 'not guilty'

[@MeganSpruce90]

That's what it is looking like so far... there is so much doubt about what actually happened... which you can't deem someone guilty, put them in jail on a "maybe"..

[@goodgolly4726]

Correct

[@SLO_6]

Wow....just wow!!!! The McCabes definitely have rehearsed what they were going to say on the stand!!! Damn....word for word!!

[@stellaallbright4750]

🎯💯🎯

[@mombythec]

that peanut butter jelly sandwich joke....even Juliana remembered that line!

[@gigis6790]

@@mombythec After all the "I don't remember" responses regarding vital information that PB & J recall really jumps out at you doesn't it? 😏

[@MathewMilutin]

I thought stories about the Mob were bad, but this extended family dynamic the Albert's have going on is unbelievable...

[@Sunshinejen]

Yes, unbelievable as in KR’s defense is a real reach.

[@stellaallbright4750]

@Sunshinestatejen -- WAIT... Karen Read is not allowed a defense?! You already made up your mind she was guilty before this trial ever started and have been vomiting your opinion to slander Ms. Read all over this trials comments section. Are you an Albert or somehow connected to this family?! Because half the garbage you're spewing is nonsense.

[@jenniferb8153]

@@Sunshinejenhow so?

[@Sunshinejen]

@@jenniferb8153 the idea that all the people in the house are lying about John never coming inside, the paramedics are lying, the cops are in on it, the lab workers are in on it. It’s just not reasonable.

[@bethmccrae2714]

They are a lovely family

[@jasl9987]

You know what amazes me.....not one of these people have shown genuine emotion for Officer John O'keefe..... its really dispicable

[@LazySusan.]

Jen McCabe was crying throughout her testimony as was Erin..... I'm not sure why you think that.

[@Fifi_Is_My_Name-O]

@@LazySusan. JM only cried when she talked about his kids situation now in relation to what happened to John

[@LazySusan.]

@@Fifi_Is_My_Name-O Yep. And? I'm sure that was a particularly upsetting memory. Put the whole thing together ❤️

[@Fifi_Is_My_Name-O]

@@LazySusan. And what??... JM does seem to care about the kids, but she showed no genuine emotion for John. She's mainly showed annoyance for how him dying has inconvenienced her. She's selling her story, not telling it. She cried more for herself than she did for anyone else. Her testimony has been a big pity party for poor Jen.

[@katejarman4598]

I like Karen Read more and more with every ‘witness’ that takes the stand

[@stunninglysouthern7287]

I wouldn’t be able to sleep all weekend knowing Alan Jackson was gonna hit me up with cross exam on Monday! 😅

[@YolyW66]

Tuesday, no court on Monday unfortunately.

[@nataliewinterbach-pridgeon]

She is just going to get her story straight with her family and the Alberts - you best know that there are going to be a lot of text messages happening this weekend 🤦🏼‍♀️

[@italiagirlie]

No, they’ll be all ysing snap chat with the auto delete on. Looking forward to the next trial when they’re sitting at the defendant’s table

[@laceyann738]

Could you imagine living with knowing u have to sit in front of Jackson 😬

[@krabbyphattie9833]

“Your honor, 2 more let it go’s and we’re calling you Elsa” Emilyyyyyy🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@kimhutchins70]

IF karen did this...why are they all lying? Times, new phones, everyone sees the car but not one text john asking whats up? Way to much reasonable doubt.

[@ravenzyblack]

The fact that Jen was texting with John, but he didn’t show up and she didn’t bother to go outside to check to see if they were in that car. Everybody saw the car, but nobody left the house to go talk to whoever was in the car when they knew that they were supposed to be riding around that time?! Hello! If you’re expecting someone to come over to your house and you know, they aren’t familiar with what your house looks like. Wouldn’t you be on the lookout for their car? It’s not like they didn’t know what kind of car Karen drove.

[@LaurenLakes]

If Jen is telling the truth & KR was screaming they needed to go to Fairview… but Jen said KR didn’t even remember being there, how did she know the the Albert’s lived on Fairview?🤔

[@theConquerersMama]

Right? And why call it Fairview not the Albert's? Fairview sounds more like what people who know multiple Albert's would say to make a difference between residences.

[@HopeForUs5]

Jen and Kari (sp?) sound like cold, heartless women that did not like Karen even before this night.

[@heartpaws519]

My theory - in addition to not being a "Canton-native", she was educated and a professional which would have threatened them more since they all apparently married home-town boys. PLUS Jen clearly has to be the "prettiest girl in the room" and Karen threatened her.

[@007nadineL]

But they link her arm and insist she go to Albert's house Do you hear yrself?

[@hnraj9441]

​@@007nadineL do you? They were awful to her by jen's admission before he was found. The were leading and manipulating her the whole way.

[@katejarman4598]

💯

[@Great_Kate]

@@007nadineL nobody is fooled by your pal, Jen McCabe. She thought she and the Canton coven got away with murder but now the entire world can see their big lie unfolding in court.

[@foxsquad6992]

WAIT A DANG MINUTE!!!! Jenn just caught herself up! She just said that when Karen got to the house, she was saying “we have to go to Fairview”. BUT, in her story Karen thought she left him at the bar. How the heck would Karen KNOW that the house was on Fairview when John was asking for directions?!??! Gawd I hope the jury picks up on that too!!!!

[@susanwhalls6230]

Just like Karen tripped up saying ‘I hit him, I hit him’

[@Bibba2727]

The Defence attorneys will have caught it and will surely challenge Jen on it. I can’t wait for Cross next week

[@JustSomeDude2161]

She also almost confessed to her Google search. When asked about being in bed that night, she started “I was researching” the stopped and started a new sentence.

[@antoinettebransky2610]

Yup and Jen herself says it was her husband Matt who said “we seen them outside your sisters house” and then she tells Karen “ we saw you outside of my sisters” so did Jenn even see the suv? Because if she did why would she think he might have went home walking from the waterfall with Chris

[@chelsie71012]

I picked up on this as well. Hope the jury does too!

[@jackeeB]

If a police officer's death is treated in such a sloppy, disrespectful manner, imagine how they handle a regular citizen's case.😒 I would move out of that district ASAP bc god help normal people that don't have the funds for high powered attorneys.

[@Vermontita]

Well said!!!

[@traceycolebrook1083]

💯 agreed

[@rachaelleann9847]

yes, but also if Karen didnt do it, then of course this was investigated and handled horribly cause the cops are the ones guilty, they always investigate themselves and never find any wrongdoing, that happens on a daily

[@ninnik]

Plus all the drinking and driving!

[@elizabethharper3181]

I really hope the feds are going to do something about all this...?

[@dandylioness78]

I can’t imagine experiencing this in real time and everyone you think is a friend turn against you..

[@jessirarara]

Everytime someone brings up... why didn't anyone go outside. I am reminded of the time my cat died. It was the middle of the day. I heard a weird noise on my porch. Open the door and my cat is on the front porch coughing up a clear yellow liquid. I am panicking. I have my cat in my lap desperately trying to save her. After like a minute tops... she convulsed in my lap... and passed away. I was SCREAMING. Wailing at the top of my lungs. Just as loud as Karen Read. My front door was open and I was sitting just inside my door. I have no idea if any of my neighbors came out. I do know... I sat with my cat for around 5 minutes screaming and crying. And cops showed up. At least one neighbor was concerned enough that they called police out to my house thinking something was wrong with me. Bless those cops they sat with me a bit while I grieved my cat before calling my husband. But everytime we talk about Karen screaming and crying into that snow. I think of my cat and of my neighbor being so concerned they called the cops. And I just can't imagine that if a woman was screaming like I was, louder than I was, in the middle of the night. That at least one of those neighbors wouldn't have called 911 or at least called the Albert's to say "Hey is everyone okay???" My neighbors don't even like me. But someone still called when they heard me screaming.

[@LKMNOP]

Especially considering that someone in the house was a policeman.

[@doeb23]

I am so sorry you had to go through that. That sounds so traumatic. I cannot imagine losing my pet in such a sudden manner, with them dying in my arms. Just thinking about it almost makes me cry. I wish all the healing for you ❤️😢

[@theConquerersMama]

How awful for you and your poor kitty. Good for your neighbors. My husband passed in his sleep. But the ambulance and police came at 6:30-7in the morning - lights on like this case. Most of my neighbors came out. They gathered in little groups trying to figure out what was going on. Offering to take our dogs or my son while I dealt with everything. I do not get this neighborhood or house of first responders.

[@sugarfree9921]

My downstairs neighbours are noisy and rude, and I absolutely do not like them. However, one night, they got into an argument (wasn't even a particularly loud one), at some point, we heard a bang like something heavy being knocked over, or someone shoved roughly into a wall followed by absolute silence. I instantly told my husband to call the cops because I assumed that they might have gotten too heated and hurt each other. The police came, and they were just fine. The abrupt silence was because they freaked themselves out with that bang. Again, I do not like these people at all, but I won't stand by while someone is potentially in danger. This whole neighbourhood in Canton seems weird AF.

[@ducciwucci]

yo genuinely this is unhinged to trauma dump about your dead cat and then compare yourself to karen read who lost an entire human being.

[@JS-csnjjip]

If I were a juror, I would be thrown off by the way this judge asks. They way she cuts the defense off is beyond frustrating. She did not act like this with Colin's text. She gets my blood boiling

[@LuvLight13]

Me too!

[@gracie1598]

To JS: You left out her attitude sends an inadvertent message to the Jury.

[@Seasheasells]

If we are all picking up on it makes you think the jurors must be too. I wonder if it helps the defense because the jurors can so clearly see the contrast between how the judge speaks to the jurors vs Lally, vs defense attorneys. The judge has complete disdain for the defense

[@moselleconger4156]

The only saving grace is that when the commonwealth was trying to explain away the “tell them he never went inside” text, the judge also cut him off during the only part of his question that could have helped (even though it didn’t). I can’t believe with that type of evidence any DA would bring this to trial.

[@TN-rf7nt]

This judge's frustration is completely unprofessional. She needs to do her damn job instead of punishing the defense for not rolling over and taking whatever the prosecution puts out.

[@cindiwindi]

None of these people liked John or Karen. This entire trial has been horrible from every perspective. Very, very hard to watch.

[@spod414]

Can definitely sense the contempt these ppl have for Karen!... & I don't believe that it's due to the fact that they think she is responsible for Officer O'Keefe's death.... Because I believe that they didn't like him either! ... Why?? ... I believe that these people are jealous of Officer O'Keefe and Karen! ... The fact that Officer O'Keefe was a respected member of the police force for 16 years... & had adopted his niece and nephew... Got the niece accepted into a prestigious school.. (believe me, from my personal experience, these things are extremely important to some kinds of people,... I picked up on the tone of Matt when he said the kids would do good whichever school they go. ... It seemed to me like he was defensive of this considering his kids hadn't been accepted into a prestigious school 🤔🧐 Karen was successful, professional and an actual lady ! ... Not to mention she's not exactly ugly either... & (I feel a little awkward mentioning this..) But I believe that because Karen has MS is another reason for the jealousy due to Jen having MS aswell... I don't think Jen liked that cus I think she wanted to be the only one in their group to have the sympathy etc, from people. Put simply... They were a happy, blended family and the people around them didn't like it 🤷🏽 this is my belief/opinion 😊

[@hogans323]

That first couple I believe cared for John and kids and liked Karen. The nurses and her husband that went to pick up Kaylee can’t think of his name but he went with him to the first bar and had to leave cuz his son got his tooth k kicked out at soccer.

[@Blackened30]

Yeah, I think its clear the majority didn't much like John or Karen, which is why I think its completely understandable why no one spent much time calling to see where he was or going out to the SUV to see if they were lost, or really caring about if they turned up at all. Every friend group has their fringe people who aren't really cared about but you're still cordial to them. I think that's what John and Karen were.

[@antonyreyn]

The McCabes knew JoK for 10 years and he trusted them with his kids, KR turned up at their house.

[@Armchairdetective189]

@@spod414a happy blended family? You haven’t heard the other side of John and Karen’s relationship as of yet. More to come.

[@spenny3091]

No need to message “tell them the guy never went into the house” if the guy never went into the house

[@katejarman4598]

Remember to tell them..wink wink 😉

[@KaitlynJaney]

And since Chris was at 34 Fairview the morning of 29th when John was found wouldn’t he have already known that? Like why would there be a need to text that if he was there the next morning and surely heard what had happened or that John never came in? Sounds like they told Chris the truth and needed to make sure he knew what they had decided to say

[@Journey188]

Exactly!!!!!!!

[@karine-v]

🎯🎯🎯

[@stellaallbright4750]

🎯🎯🎯 BINGO BANGO!! 🎯🎯🎯

[@kali.flowers]

The way Jen looks at the jury gives me flashbacks to Amber Heard

[@Jessicace]

Yeah, except I really feel for AH...

[@pearlosibu]

@@Jessicacewhy?

[@Silver_Girl178]

So Jen McCabe has Karen Read screaming, through all of this timeline, that they, "need to go to Fairview," and, at no point, even when they're on the way over there, does Jen McCabe think to call someone at that house to ask them to take a look outside for John?!?

[@theConquerersMama]

Or verify that he might be sleeping on their coach? After a late night of drinking?

[@steffievideo]

I’m beginning to think Karen Read has been gaslit by the Alberts, McCabes and Mass.PD

[@enigma_-_79]

Why?

[@KateAwakening]

Yes, because it totally makes sense that every single witness is lying but Karen is telling the truth.

[@stellaallbright4750]

@KateAwakening -- SIDE NOTE: I find people's chosen pseudonyms often don't match their presence, like yours, which always makes me giggle. You appear to have lived a very sheltered life, never experiencing any bullying or abuse by one or more people. Never any negative relationships. Lucky you! 😒

[@LazySusan.]

​@@KateAwakening I understand what you're saying...

[@DyslecticAttack]

​@@KateAwakening when the physical evidence doesn't line up with the witnesses recountings, then it does. But after 3 weeks of trial, we have 0 physical evidence, so who knows?

[@seangettler1917]

Let's say what Jen said was perfectly true.... so Karen is worried about her bf. Starts imagining the worst. Sees him in the snow, possibly dead. She freaks out. The only thing that makes sense to her (I'm guessing she thinks everyone else is human) and assumes she must have hit him because histaria always chooses the worst. And she asks for how long someone can be in the cold before they die cause she is seeking hope..... And Jen thinks she's horrible for this? She talks about Karen freaking out almost as if "God Karen, it's just a guy"

[@angiel186]

But (if we decide to believe Jen's testimony) Karen started saying that from the very 1st call to Jen. So, either Karen hit him knowingly and hours later decides to set her alibi? Or something and saying "I hit him" is part of it. Or Karen hits him unknowingly BUT why would she immediately assume she hit him, at that moment she only knows they were mad at each other when they departed from each other, that he did not arrive home and that she has a broken light- how does that lead to "I hit him". I've given up on believing people. I will believe what the data tells me.

[@queenbee1917]

Part of my brain wonders if she took the one time hearing "did I hit him" and is now placing every where she can.

[@amylynn732]

It was so unreasonable that JM and CR tell Karen to look around for JO'K then when she does and she sees him, they cluck their tongues and claim Karen knew where he was. If they didn't know where he was why were they telling Karen to look around for him outside?!?!? Why would they think he was outside? It would be reasonable to think he was inside someone's house.

[@SonjaHamburg]

Yes. So weird how Jen McCabe tells the story as if Karen had been hysterical for no reason. Karen seems tremendously caring from what I heard in the trial.

[@heattmg]

I don’t believe he ever went in the house , I believe Karen is lying .

[@gracie1598]

You honestly think Jen McCabe is telling the Truth? The woman keeps thinking if she repeats over and over Karen was hysterical it confirms she did it. She also deliberately mentioned Karen and John fighting for the same reason.

[@soude85]

She couldn’t wait for her little reenactment..! I don’t believe anything Jen McCabe or her husband said today. They didn’t care for “That Guy” or Karen. They should all pay for their involvement in John O’Keffe’s dead!

[@cherylj7460]

I agree. Also! Her telling us she had to have Lank back at Albert house- because she remembered Karen told the emt that she hit John- this was to cover this suspicious meeting, at the Albert house, after the whole crowd had discussed it and while they were still there !

[@odivarela9147]

Girl she lit 🔥 the match by stated to John past Bella’s street ! Can’t wait for the defense to question her on which story is her truth for she first says John’s driving and asking for directions, saw her parked at the house and moved spaces yet never went out to see them in, but ends with her saying that Karen left him at the restaurant and so Bs story that she’s gonna go to Tim’s house even after her husband pointed out that Karen’s car was at the house?! I also want to see the meta data of when she searched how long does it take for a body to die in the snow? she claims karen asked her to look it up SMH these mafioso had no shame nor can they keep their story consistent!

[@MeganSpruce90]

​@@odivarela9147possible reason for why her and John fought that night.. I didn't think of it until you mentioned it. Bella's mom and John dated at some point, we found out... I wonder if KR was naturally a jealous type, and she knew that mentioning it would p*ss her off... this whole thing is so odd. All of it.

[@McQuizzical]

​@MSpruce90 I don't think it happened, that's their narrative to suggest an argument.

[@carolineelsson8858]

After what has been presented so far, I just can’t shake the issue of why no one in the house came outside to help, or even to see what was happening.

[@thedognose7359]

Exactly this. I have never known or met a police officer who wasn’t a completely nosy person (often to quite intrusive levels) . Especially to anything happening around their home.

[@grey3414]

They are friends for 10 years and yet treated his death like this. Worst "friends" to be with during your last breath. They are all psychopaths.

[@jumbolumps666]

Well yeah they're cops 🤷‍♀️

[@Glawnerd664]

Nah. No. Nuh uh. No way. What utter nonsense about Bella’s mum. I do not buy a single word of it from Jen McCabe. Everything screams these are lies.

[@annamelvina216]

It makes no sense! We're talking about a relationship that ended, what, a decade or two ago? Why would Karen care? It sounds so flimsy to me as a reason for Karen to be jealous.

[@BmwLady]

Jen was just trying to lie and make Karen look bad

[@armandfence4514]

This is Jen gaslighting Karen to thinking John was having an affair and therefore Karen was jealous and ran him over. All nonsense.

[@joshn1678]

​@armandfence4514 the thing I don't get is Johns injuries cannot be caused by a car striking him, his face was beat in and eyes swollen, that's not what happens when you're hit by a car, he'd have damage done to his body. He lost 4.5 LITERS of blood, someone intentionally killed him.

[@karalattanze8324]

Also why would she kill him in front of a house full of people coming in and out, windows open, and cops and agents in the house

[@BookishDark]

5:10:00 this woman is full of shit. She literally JUST SAID that Karen was yelling “did I hit him?! Could I have hit him?!” Then changed stories two seconds later. Karen is the ONLY one who responded like a normal human finding someone she loved in a dire situation.

[@LuvLight13]

Agreed. One thousand perfect.

[@karine-v]

Exactly!

[@Stella-pq5bu]

Agreed. As a law nerd jurist my initial thought re KR straddling him and lifting his shirt etc would be that she instinctively needed to warm JO's body, yet JM impressed this act as a hindrance/irrational.

[@vashtimatthews6220]

The flipping back and forth from present tense to past tense is weird too.

[@hnraj9441]

​@@Stella-pq5bu i had the same thought. And, how did kari put a blanket under him with karen on top of him?

[@MathewMilutin]

We got here because Lally doubled down trying to get a plea deal from Karen and sought a superceding indictment of Murder. She dug in and called his bluff...

[@cherylj7460]

Hm. He’s downright painful to listen to, at times.

[@demi8890]

Damn, I had figured he was just forced to take the case and that's why he seems disinterested. Knowing he did that makes him seem way more invested than it comes across in court. How are we in a world where the prosecutor is playing games with defendants, judges can refuse to recuse themselves despite clear bias and cops and their friends can investigate crimes they're witness to - this whole thing is fucked and so depressing

[@gracie1598]

@cherylj7460 Also, Lally, it appears at times attempts to feed off the energy of the defense.

[@gracie1598]

@demi8890 Lally was forced to bring the case to trial ordered from the actual prosecutor.

[@gracie1598]

To user-id8jn3sx3s: Just think how convenient for all these corrupt inviduals if Karen could have been convinced she did it and accepted a plea. Best

[@dragons_flight]

This case has GOT to be made into a movie. This "Tell them the Guy never went into the house" line will be the peak of the trial. Wow. 😯😤🤬

[@jills9373]

It's. Either a movie or mini series. Not all of the cameras there are news cameras. Dateline has also been filming for months.

[@lisaann3063]

@@jills9373 so has Netflix

[@Melissa_131]

They all talk so matter-of-factly with no compassion or remorse about finding their friend dying/deceased and offer no support or comfort to his distraught girlfriend. What great friends.

[@Tammy_26Irwin]

Tuesday can’t get here fast enough! Jackson is going to eat her up! Hope she gets well rested and ready to be GRILLED

[@katejarman4598]

Arghhh I’m going to combust waiting!!

[@potatopirate5557]

Just have to say, thank you for the flash warning. It means the world to the ones who need it. 💛

[@elainejohnson6955]

I so-o-o appreciate it too!

[@jrockin9221]

You couldn’t pay me enough to be in this friend group !! The O’Keefe family have to be absolutely devastated to hear these awful people have no emotion or care about “HIM” , their son 😭!!! My heart breaks for the kids and John’s family 💔!! Sooo very glad the Feds have an investigation currently happening!

[@melissaiorio5888]

The O’Keefe family believes the Albert and McCabe family. It’s so sad. Can’t they see??

[@hnraj9441]

Absolutely. Awful people. Jen mccabe and Brian Albert seem to be the worst of the adults. I would hate to know these people. I am just disgusted by jen.

[@katejarman4598]

@@melissaiorio5888this part saddens and frustrates me SO much!!

[@debbysalmon2498]

I'm sure a lot of people can't wait till the Albert and McCabe kids are out of school so they don't have these people around anymore.

[@jrockin9221]

@@hnraj9441 I 100% agree with you on those two .

[@Karladudhoff]

Karen wouldn’t call the house “Fairview” only someone familiar with the house would scream “we have to go to Fairview”. Karen would have said something like “ we have to go back to the house where we went last night”

[@MShaiqable]

Good point!!

[@DS-hd6rq]

It's local speak. People use street names to identify homes or locations in colloquial speech.

[@speedofskaja]

orrrr...she just used this name just as other ppl had used it the night before

[@Karladudhoff]

@@speedofskaja one usually wouldn’t take that kind of familiarity with a thing like that not knowing the people or the place.

[@LaurenLakes]

@@DS-hd6rqJen said Karen didn’t even remember being there. Jen had to give directions to John, they didn’t even know where the Albert’s lived. They also got “lost” or mixed up on the way because the way they drive down the street, they came in from the wrong direction, so it’s obvious they even took a wrong turn. There’s no way she would reference that location as “Fairview”.

[@anamchara2024]

So Karen Read is worried sick about John, but she should stop and take her shoes off???

[@vee_grave]

I know. It was absolutely ridiculous to think she should take off her shoes when obviously she believes her boyfriend is missing. These people are so bizarre.

[@Always_Thinking]

And a cracked tail light! That would not be my focus!

[@sarawilliams9025]

Maybe there’s something wrong with my moral compass, but even if she did hit him, they have no reason to believe it’s anything but an accident at that time. If KR was my friend, I’d be holding her. Comforting her.

[@MShaiqable]

YEESS!!!

[@marymary7269]

Such a good point. To mock her fear and desperation is so mean. John actually died, Karen’s hysteria was 100% justified and Jen is acting like she’s being so OTT. Awful woman.

[@diverightin9243]

100% agree!! And to top it off jen doesn't run into the house to get help immediately from the trained EMT and to top that off, none of them, besides KR, are even wanting to help find him but.. they all show up at the house for a pow wow after he's taken from the yard. yes, the moral compasses are very broken with these people. And why would Jen be so disgusting to bring up the KR saw the blood on her hands and asked if she was on her period? WTF? I am truly baffled by how disgusting that was. Am I wrong about feeling this way? Even if KR did say that, why stoop so low as to tell the whole world she said that. It does nothing to prove her guilt. It was just plain mean! Moral compass not just broken but, completely dismantled.

[@Gabriel-hf1yy]

​@@diverightin9243agree this woman is as cold as ice

[@gianghuynh9570]

That’s why it begs the question why her charges were escalated to second degree murder. You’d think that if the state can prove she hit him, manslaughter would be the first choice. Because second degree murder would implies a level of intention. Not a long meditated first degree murder but the state still needs to prove intentions. I think I may have missed it but opening had none of the intentions.

[@elisebryant9938]

We’re nearly at the point of the defense proving beyond a reasonable doubt that the Albert/McCabe family were 100% culpable in this. AND they’ve managed to show more decency and respect to John that the prosecution has even attempted to show.

[@Lyraeza]

At this point it feels like the Prosecution is actually defending the Alberts/McCabes instead of trying to prove their case.

[@Sunshinejen]

Try watching without Emily in your ear. It’s a totally different trial. Emily, imo is being very pro defense, which she’s entitled. I wonder if Alan Jackson on Emily are friends. They were both prosecutors in LA. Both worked on similar cases.

[@elisebryant9938]

@sunshinestatejen I’m listening to a few people, not just Emily. But I don’t agree with any of their interpretations 100%. I still could never vote guilty on this case so far.

[@12makbe]

@Sunshinestatejen Laywer you Know, Natalie, Runkle ALL have the same agreement: the commonwealth is no where NEAR beyond reasonable doubt. They're so focused on defending Albert's family they aren't prosecuting

[@Taradise85]

@@LyraezaOF course that’s what he is doing. Because protecting them will protect him and the rest of the corrupt officials

[@agent_ninety9]

There's several things that I can't get past. Initially it's that nobody went out of 34 Fairview when ambulance, sirens, lights, commotion and screaming is going on. The reaction of her so-called friends to her "hysteria" (not a big fan of the word but can't think of another at this moment) and Matt McCabe's text messages. Couldn't even refer to him by name! I'm so sorry to John and his family. The niece calling in the early morning hours broke my heart. I really hope that if justice doesn't happen in this case, that it does in federal investigation. These are some very cold hearted people imo.😢 Emily, your haircut compliments the shape of your face.

[@ADZLOVE]

Right?!… and their dog did not bark at all the commotion??? And I feel for John O’Keefe’s niece and nephew; hoping they have the love, support and counseling to help them through and to somehow grow in strength from tragedy’s

[@hotmessmomtv4117]

There were no sirens

[@herroyalhighness5634]

The interesting thing about her “friends” reactions to her hysteria is that Cari Roberts sounds like she was the most abrasive with Karen in response to her hysteria, but she wasn’t there the night before so she definitely wasn’t in on it. I wonder if she had tried to be patient but KR was incessant and belligerent and it got too stressful/hard to deal with?

[@007nadineL]

Sirens weee not turned on in the deserted streets Emergency lights were taken as road plows

[@hnraj9441]

​@@hotmessmomtv4117 that doesn't really matter. It doesn't take sirens to alert a dog to a woman screaming in the yard or emergency lights lighting up the house

[@afrodeity1576]

When the McCabes go out of their way to imitate the way Karen was shouting (and looking mighty annoyed at that ) instead of just saying she was in a panic, or frantic.....I just get this gut feeling that they are lying so badly that I just literally want to throw up.

[@ViennaDarlingvd]

As someone who is very good at lying (so I know a lot of techniques and try not to use them anymore!) soooo many things about Jens testimony are just…feeling like someone who is not so good at lying trying really hard. The strange bursts of emotion over “promising Kaylee,” but no natural emotion over the death of JO (despite her supposedly being quite close to him), and then the overacting on the imitations - no one asked them to imitate, but they jumped right to it which is pretty unnatural. As someone who did not follow this case at all before EDB, I don’t believe Jen at all.

[@tanyaabram8336]

Oh my goodness, I can't get over Matt Mccabes over qualifying every answer on cross rather than just answering yes or no.

[@Lizzybee123]

Jen does a subtle diss to Karen during her O’keefe garage/house/ring doorbell testimony. Jen inserts herself into so many situations.

[@vebarnid]

Or not so subtle - pretty sure all of chat picked up on it

[@spod414]

Yep... And Lally had a dig at Karen when he asked JM what is in the left garage door and she said Johns old car... Lally slyly sneaked in... Oh, "the car Karen didn't like" I thought that was disgusting aswell... Casting aspersions, making Karen out to be disrespectful of "Officer" John O'Keefe 😡 Trying to make her look bad in front of the jury 😡

[@spod414]

Karen wouldn't have been thinking of removing her shoes at that moment... She was too occupied, worrying where Officer O'Keefe was ... Jen and Carrie were taking their time to slow the search down.... Also I wondered why, if Jen said Karen thought she'd left John at the Waterfall, would she be insistent on going to Fairview??? ... I wonder if Karen knew or had a bad feeling about the ppl at the house party that night and that's why she was so shook up?? She kinda knew something went wrong with someone at that house 🤷🏽🤔

[@hnraj9441]

​@@spod414i don't believe that she said she had left him at the waterfall at all

[@joakuz]

Jen seems to me like a person who LOOOOVES gossip!! And like she shows concern only to find out more tea. IDK just a feeling 🤷🏼‍♀️

[@ScienceisRadAF]

If Karen didn’t hit him, but these people jumped on her fearful concern as an opportunity to skirt accountability.. that’s disgusting!

[@cailinanne]

I’m convinced that they did. Nothing has been presented that has changed my mind of that as of yet. (Because I came in presuming she was innocent, jury style)

[@susanwhalls6230]

Wow! Genius. That had to be it.

[@gracie1598]

@susanwhalls6230 What AC -xq8me wrote was from their heart ❤️ and it was succinct, concise, and articulate. The question is, why are you so unhappy ? You're entitled to your opinion, but this is about more than participating in an exchange of ideas💡.

[@MostlyMom]

Honestly, if Karen DID hit him, the way these callous people have acted/reacted is also suuuch a huge disservice to John!!

[@Jack-bc5xg]

These people have been put thru hell.

[@lisaduggan691]

The ONLY Window Matt McCabe DIDN'T LOOK OUT was his own windshield as he Drove Past John's Body, with the wide area that headlights illuminate!

[@saradf4890]

Exactly. I can't get over that no one leaving that house at 1:45am didn't see anything in the yard and Matt didn't see anything driving past JO (if he was actually on the yard).

[@katejarman4598]

Even more respect for Karen now I know she didn’t swap phone numbers with Jen mcalbert 🙌🏼

[@TRACE317]

Yeah, seems KR wanted nothing to close but social when out.

[@thefactanonverba]

If an acquaintance of mine died on my lawn, I would RUN OUTSIDE. If an acquaintance of mine died at a party I had been at, I would never, days later, refer to him as “the guy”. I might be texting about the investigators being back at the house, because I would be desperate for them to work it out!!!

[@hnraj9441]

And if I found someone on a relatives lawn I would be running to get their help while calling 911.

[@MShaiqable]

EXACTLY!!

[@MShaiqable]

@@hnraj9441 Also EXACTLY! That's normal behaviour. They're failure to do that is so SUS

[@theConquerersMama]

💯 And I would admit that people talked about- because I am human. That I knew people in passing/as acquaintances but were not particularly close/had heart to hearts with some people because of proximity. Shoot, if you look at my phone records. I text or message a lot of my son's teammates parents multiple times a week during certain seasons, have pictures of us eating or drinking together, but are not close. These folks act like the jury wouldn't understand suburban life but this drinking & driving, ignoring weather conditions is common.

[@joyw101]

One of my issues with almost of the witnesses is that they had been drinking (heavily and some for 6-8 hours) then got 2 hours of sleep and still have clear recollection and a coherent timeline. I would not be a very reliable witness at that time. I will be very interested to see if Carrie Roberts confirms what Jen McCabe testified to today

[@gracie1598]

To jouw101: You can rest assured their two testimonies will match. Exactly what you wrote is how things got out of hand, and a man who got up that morning did not know this would be his last day died. Drinking.

[@catiepollack3427]

I don't understand how they aren't all suffering massive hangovers in any of their stories.

[@Jamama4]

Yes, these witnesses were drinking a lot! How can we trust their recollection.

[@annyfyreagle7973]

Thank you for sticking it out! As a juror, I tuned out. I left on Jen McCabe. 3 weeks of gaslighting is not a case. I want proof…something…!

[@JustSomeDude2161]

I stuck around for Jen’s testimony, but I didn’t get much out of it. Mainly because “Tell them the guy never came in the house” was replaying over and over in my head the whole time. That was powerful.

[@carolinaandbaby]

Great point!!

[@ew7025]

Jen M testifying makes me feel so sorry for Karen.

[@NottyAries]

Especially when she went from saying Karen was hysterical to taking a moment to put on a pot of coffee.

[@MustyPassenger]

So the prosecution wants me to believe Karen intentionally hit John with her car and went home. Then, she went to get his friend to look for him all while telling the friend she fought with him, was jealous about some woman, and that she mightve hit him with her car? Why would she be admitting all that if she purposely hit him? I'm confused.

[@chicagodoll]

Im still confused how it is we are supposed to take the hysterical confused ramblings of a woman, and believe one part, but not anything else? As opposed to questioning ALL of it...

[@carolynwilson7806]

Brian and his wife sleep with the phones in the bed in case they are needed. Yet, this night they missed multiple calls.

[@katejarman4598]

But not with the volume on 🙄 make it make sense!!

[@eileenneary999]

But his wife didnt because the record showed she did answer two calls from jenn. Fact. Cell phone records show. Answered. Not voice-mail. And she just straight up denied it. Nope. No. I didn't. You and him were only ones in the bedroom. The phone was answered. But it wasn't you. Nope. Oh okay then 🙄

[@chicagodoll]

​@@eileenneary999i wonder if when you actively hit the "end" button to not answer a call and get it to stop ringing, the phone record shows as being answered? Because that would mean shed have to see who was calling to deny it...

[@louhortonsculpture]

@@chicagodollgood point. I would think she would have said she sent the call to voicemail, because that’s what happens when you hit the red button to deny the call. And the call logs supposedly show that the call lasted a number of seconds.

[@screamqueen1946]

@@chicagodoll I'm not positive, but pretty sure it'll show as not answered in that case, bc when I do that it still shows up as a missed call after & the caller is able to leave voicemail. But, if that is what happened & they just ended the call, why not just say we were being intimate & sending phone calls to voicemail? I think that's what makes it seem more nefarious.

[@carolynwilson7806]

Why does Matt know what Procter was asking of other witnesses? I can’t believe he called a dead, beloved policeman that they all knew “the guy”.

[@Always_Thinking]

IMO lots of talking & coordination over the last 2+ years. Check opening statement by defense.

[@Dr.Kyle-Campbell]

I wish the prosecutors had “humanized “ John more. It feels like the whole focus has been on proving the Albert’s didn’t kill John, rather than Karen did. Too much focus on the bar, the after party, the underage and adult drinking etc. It’s so bizarre! Who invites people over for drinking after midnight with a blizzard forecast? I have questions?????

[@SisterHeavenly-fx1qw]

Yes. I’m actually quite curious to hear more about Karen’s and jO’s relationship. Was it volatile?

[@sunflower_stargirl]

@@SisterHeavenly-fx1qw As far as we’ve been told, they had a great relationship. They were all PDA lovey dovey at the Waterfall. They were planning to go on a trip together.

[@BlueSkyRemedyy]

That is the US justice system. The victim’s human side is talk about very little. We have a procecutory system. Not a system for the victim. We hope victims feel justice. But at the end of the day, a violating loss occurred.

[@gunnybunny4081]

🎯 Plus all their children drinking as if it’s a normal Friday or Saturday night occurrence & the parents or relatives are LE? LE or their spouses DUI instead of ubering! Collin was in a bar at 17/18 yrs old drinking alcohol too?!

[@zxy78267]

​@@gunnybunny4081I knew a family like that. They had a house in town, and a small property out of town. The parents stayed out in the country, but the teenagers lived in the house in town so they could walk or catch a ride to high school. The parents were really heavy drinkers, and they let their kids start drinking at maybe 13, 14 years old. The teens living in town were always throwing parties. The two I went to high school with are both dead. The dad and sister are dead. I think there's one son and the mom left out of the entire family of six or seven people.

[@bobbyroberts8523]

Idk, but I think I would be going into my sister's house telling them we need your help right now! Instead she is more concerned about what Karen is saying and doing.

[@joakuz]

ESPECIALLY if I knew that my sister’s husband is highly trained first responder!!!

[@ladybuglisa3925]

My thoughts exactly. Wouldn't most people be running in to get the cop brother-in-law to come outside to help?

[@karena5641]

Or at the least tell them their friend is dead on the front lawn

[@rachaelleann9847]

Yup

[@sithappens1]

My heart breaks for John O'Keefe and his family. And poor Karen Read. What an absolute mess.

[@estrella5935]

Jen claimed that when they got to John’s house, Karen pulled both women to the back of the car to show the taillight was cracked. 10 minutes later they show the video, and none of that happened at all! They literally all ran in the house!!! WTAF????

[@ashleymcclarren3951]

I think the family gaslit Karen when she was most vulnerable.

[@007nadineL]

Wrong

[@goodgolly4726]

​@@007nadineLcomments like these are so helpful. Thank you for sharing

[@enigma_-_79]

Understanding the process of “gaslighting” would tell you that fooling someone into believing that they have mental health problems occurs over a long period of time. It does not happen in an instant in a stressful situation. You find Karen to be vulnerable? Well, I suppose if she had killed her boyfriend and the police were being called, she might be in a vulnerable situation but I’m not sure that would make Ms Read herself vulnerable.

[@HelenM1994]

@@enigma_-_79 whilst gaslighting is that, I have experienced and also seen it in 'episodic' moments. Its someone saying 'you didn't see XYZ' when you know you saw XYZ. Long term, yes it takes long periods of time, but stressful situations are also good moments to take advantage of a person when they are confused and/or scared. A person in a vulnerable situation, is at that moment, vulnerable.

[@Insideyourbones]

This is gaslighting. Gaslighting is more complex than what your example was, so yes the initial comment is correct! This is form of gaslighting.

[@krysb77]

If everyone else was sober enough to recall, how is it Karen was drunk enough to not recall???

[@tibb814]

MS can cause short term memory issues, brain fog, and other neural effects.

[@spod414]

JM has MS too... So that would be relevant for her too then... But she apparently remembered everything 🤷🏽🧐

[@AM.000]

MS symptoms are not constant, they come in flare ups. Karen didn't go to the party because she wasn't feeling well.

[@Jack-bc5xg]

So can vodka

[@Jack-bc5xg]

If she wasn't feeling well why did she drive over there?

[@Im4GOD100]

I didn’t find Jen McCabe to be credible. I felt she was cold hearted and had a mean demeanor.

[@herroyalhighness5634]

I can see this both ways. If the Alberts/Mccabes did it, her cold and angry demeanor makes sense. But to me it does also make sense if Karen hit him, too. That would mean they had nothing to do with it and Karen and her defense have thrown them under the bus essentially trying to frame them for the death/murder and subjected them to years of harassment and scrutiny because she doesn’t want to take responsibility. Whichever side is telling the truth, the other side has been framed attempted to be framed in the public eye. I understand the demeanor and butting heads with the defense on cross-examination either way.

[@hnraj9441]

​@@herroyalhighness5634 that wouldn't excuse her own self described demeanor and attitude that morning though

[@venteuse]

I don't buy her or her husband talking about "continuous screaming" from Karen. It's all hearsay and hyperbole.

[@Karladudhoff]

She needs Brian Higgins for support, but her husband is there? Wonder how that lines up with hubby.

[@Always_Thinking]

I don't either! She was not Karen's friend. IMO she was very interested in OJO!🤷‍♀️🤷‍♀️

[@anamchara2024]

Jen McCabe does not feel credible to me. So did Karen Read leave the Waterfall and just go home and drink for hours there? Cause everyone else said she didn't seem drunk, but all of a sudden Karen is out of her mind wasted? Nah.

[@valentinat3250]

Jen McCabe’s lack of compassion toward John and toward Karen in her panic is striking. And just awful to see.

[@bobbyroberts8523]

Friends like that who needs enemies

[@rebeccaglasgow1324]

If Karen thought she left John at the Waterfall why would she think she hit John at Fairview?

[@tibb814]

Very good question @tebeccaglasgow.

[@SLO_6]

OMG VERY fabulous question!!!!

[@Artemis2317]

💯I just caught those two opposing statements today 🤔Thanks for voicing the question!

[@hnraj9441]

I don't believe she thought she left him at the waterfall at all.

[@melissaiorio5888]

Very good question!

[@anniemch2406]

The Waterfall Bar has gotten a lot of free publicity out of this!!!😂

[@danielnewman4472]

You mean the Waterfall BAH

[@steffievideo]

Wondering how they stay stocked with glasses when so many patrons seem to leave with them! I didn’t even know that was a thing.

[@anniemch2406]

@@danielnewman4472 🤣

[@literaturegeek1570]

​@@steffievideo It's maybe like the bar/cafe I had on my universitys campus. Bringing in new cheap ikea coffee mugs by the case more or less daily, because everyone walked off with "free mugs". 😂

[@marcopalazzo9349]

​@@steffievideo no the glass came from the previous bar. Karen was nursing a single drink the whole night.

[@RiverLouise]

Replay Crew here! Looks like Karen was right…. Jen McCabe is not a good friend. It’s the gaslighting for me.

[@Barba_Fett]

My first husband went missing and I knew something awful has happened when he didn't come home. So I can understand Karen's freak out before John was found. John never would have not came home without letting the kids know. Never.

[@julieyoung1706]

I'm watching this after the fact but I call BS for Jen McCabe I don't Believe a word coming out of her mouth.

[@frsmith5069]

@julieyoung1706 for Jen McCabe BS....I'm wondering if Alie McCabe is shocked or will be shocked by any of her parents' group texts that they likely have never shared with her or most of the children in this family/friend cohort.

[@Im_not_ratchett]

So much more will come out about her too. She’s not a good person.

[@Antdebby1]

Watching after the fact, too. Rehearsed to lie.

[@frsmith5069]

@@Im_not_ratchett That may or may not be true. I'm watching the case presented and not reading the backstories of anyone or anything. Interestingly what I've seen of this case is shady as 💩- for the case itself and the people associated where JOK's body was found - not her. This is a problem for the prosecution as this is their case presentation and it should be strongest right now. But I will take your comments under advisement as I watch the rest of the case unfold.

[@tinykitsune0387]

I feel like the judge is really making this messier than it needs to be

[@laurenhoopes6162]

I think we might never know what happened. Very sad.

[@brianlutz7813]

100% this

[@doeb23]

Maybe that feds will pull trough 🤞🏻

[@cheryla596]

I think one of the witnesses will snitch when Karen is acquitted and they may all get in trouble.

[@JustSomeDude2161]

As of right now, I think we can tell that whatever happened, happened in the house. But nothing further than that.

[@sharingsharoncreates5290]

Bursting into a bedroom of a cop of 30 years? And you didn't get a gun stuck in your face? Or a dog tearing into you?

[@ruprect8858]

It’s no wonder they are the only ones who believe that Jen was not level headed running into their bedroom like that.

[@vee_grave]

It’s because (likely) he knew she was coming in and the dog wasn’t there.

[@TN-rf7nt]

SERIOUSLY!!!

[@lizoliver6193]

And a cop who leaves his front door unlocked?? NO WAY

[@ona682]

If JOK never went in the house,… why would people have to be told to say he was never in the house. It makes no sense. 🤦🏼‍♀️

[@DyslecticAttack]

Honestly, there is an explanation. I don't really buy the explanation because I'm now convinced there is pigeon business afoot, so I'm cautioning on the disbelief side about basically every claim witnesses are making now (instead of the benefit of the doubt side I'm usually on in normal life circumstances). But if the context was that the media was starting to annoy them with questions that they didn't want to answer any of, and that the solution McCabe thought of was "just tell them the guy never went into the house", then it could be a logical and innocent message. But the prosecution didn't really make the context clear, and the witness said that the "them" was the media, but didn't really explain successfully why he thought it was necessary to steer what was said to the media if it was a given fact. So while there is an innocent explanation imo, I do think it's indicative of some corroboration to get the story straight.

[@Alabanzas159]

@@DyslecticAttackchannel 4 here in Boston denied everything. They didn't even know about them

[@DyslecticAttack]

@@Alabanzas159 Honestly, as shady as the Alberts are, I don't trust mainstream medias enough to take that at face value. If a mainstream media was annoying them, then that media company probably wouldn't admit it. And even if they would admit it, it's still a question of if the employee who would have pushed them for answers is still around, and if they would admit to it. "Nobody knew about them" is in essence the same as those swabs not having canine DNA, the absence of proof is not the proof of absence. And probably even more important, the prosecution didn't really get a context, and McCabe didn't succeed in conveying the context he wanted to insert. So all the jury has is their word.

[@ona682]

@@DyslecticAttack I have to go back and watch it again for their names, but there were at least to witnesses who stated that JO’K WAS in the house at some point.

[@DyslecticAttack]

@@ona682 not quite. The one who drove Colin home said "Colin wasn't there when John was at the house". Which could have the same meaning, but isn't quite a full admission that he was inside. It's hella sus especially in context, but it's still not quite the admission a lot of people want it to be.

[@Ziggy784]

Emily, I’m trying so hard to watch this as a juror with you but every day the confusion grows and the temptation of outside research gets stronger 😭

[@sarahc7409]

I’m not done watching all of Jen’s testimony but I can’t help but notice how she and John were so close yet there’s no emotion at all when she reads out the messages they exchanged. Edit: like 10 min after I wrote this Emily confirms my statement exactly lol glad we’re on the same page girl

[@justerinthings9686]

OMG I can't wait till Tuesday for Cross! Leave us on a cliff-hanger. How rude 😂

[@katejarman4598]

Oh no it’s not until Tuesday?! Just catching up on the feed today. Arghh I will have to stay on Tuesday night here in Australia to watch it 🍿

[@Quiz261Grl]

@@katejarman4598which will be Wednesday night Australian time.

[@JustSomeDude2161]

The cliffhanger is the only thing Lally’s good at.

[@justerinthings9686]

@@katejarman4598 I'm in Australia too!! Perth - so we're 12hrs ahead. 9pm start on Tuesday!

[@justerinthings9686]

@@Quiz261Grl It's actually Tuesday night. 9pm in Perth Western Australia is 9am in MA

[@hnraj9441]

Yes Emily! I need the experts. I need the autopsy and medical info. I need the phone data! I am done with the rest of this ish.

[@amylynn732]

Jennifer McCabe's testimony is sooooo weird! Refers to defendant as Karen but John O'keefe as Mr O'Keefe and Cari Roberts as Miss Roberts ... like ... what the?!?!? 👀

[@acovert8241]

It’s a shady was to disrespect her in front of the jury.

[@ThePugs-xv6zs]

Not entirely true. She mixes it up. Sometimes she says John or Mr O’keefe. Sometimes she says Karen or the defendant. She wasn’t consistent.

[@heartpaws519]

Good point!!

[@debbysalmon2498]

True.

[@Liinnie]

Cause I think Jen and Jon where having a thing and her husband didn’t like it cause they got to to close you gotta to no there are to many close friend here I bet you they all swing

[@exstock]

This is one of those cases where I really, really DO want to see frequent closeups of the defendant’s face! Karen (and her lawyers) were all smiles at the end there; THEY know what’s in store for Jen McCabe!

[@hnraj9441]

Not while these witnesses are testifying though. Seeing them makes it obvious they're lying

[@ji5gz5fu3g]

I think it will be quite interesting when KR refuses to take the stand to contest what they are all saying = she is lying and they are all telling the truth. What excuses will her fan club make up then 😂

[@dominaevillae28]

@user-ji5gz5fu3g Defendants shouldn’t take the stand as it almost never benefits them. Besides, the prosecution is not allowed to imply, and the jury is not allowed to infer, that the defendant not taking the stand means they are guilty.

[@lisaann3063]

@@ji5gz5fu3gwhy would she take the stand?

[@ji5gz5fu3g]

@@lisaann3063 Why would she not! I hope you understand the serious nature of her allegations against numerous people. She should and put her money where her mouth is….otherwise to me (and no doubt others)….she’s full of it!

[@lawnerddownunder3461]

As soon as Jen starts directing her testimony to the jury it sends up all the red flags

[@diverightin9243]

Gave me amber heard vibes. Just seemed weird to me too. Like she was performing. What really bothered me was, her statement about Karen pointing out the tailight in the driveway and discussed hitting John but the video not showing that, was it for me. What else is she lying about, because that was proven, on video, to not be true.

[@Camiken65]

But if you look at her eyes she's not really looking at them. Her eyes are all over the place.

[@Im_not_ratchett]

Master manipulator

[@TXN4JC]

Anyone else notice she looks at Karen a couple of times when discussing Bella’s mom to see if she’s making her angry?

[@kimhutchins70]

If "THE GUY" was never in the house, he wouldn't have had to tell anyone to say it..........BANG BANG

[@marymary7269]

I cannot wait to see the defense point out that the ring camera at John’s house doesn’t show (even a little bit) what Jen testified had happened. ~KR wasn’t screaming ~Nobody was trying to calm her down ~Karen did not even look at her tail light let alone make a big fuss over it being broken to the other two women. This is blatant lying from Jen and I’m shocked she said all of that knowing there is ring footage to disprove her so easily.

[@beteljuice6629]

Beyond reasonable doubt is insane at this point. I don't know what the prosecution would have to do to get me there but they're not doing it. At this point I just feel like this woman got it from all sides and people are protecting their own.😢

[@theelletrain4775]

Right?? Like she was gaslit in the early morning hours by Matt and Jen convincing her that she did something she didn’t! Jen and Matt were manipulating and managing everyone. Including that God awful group text.

[@carolinemorris7193]

Prosecution will need to show video of crime! That’s what they need to do.

[@Classic-Ov3rThinker]

I was about to say nothing could get me to reasonable doubt, but maybe a video? Even then I would think it was accidental and she didn’t realise and the other still covered it up??? And hid info etc. so maybe I go back to nothing 😂

[@marcopalazzo9349]

Unless they show a video of her hitting him getting out the car and pissing on him id be voting not guilty.

[@beteljuice6629]

@@marcopalazzo9349 yeah we're at that point

[@LuvLight13]

4:11:15 Great point Emily!!!!! Jennifer’s testimony was so rehearsed. At least it sounded like it to me.

[@Always_Thinking]

IMO she 'wrote the script". She also has MS & knows the vulnerabilities that commonly are associated with MS one of which is "fear of abandonment". It was cruel of JM to keep tossing out names of women OJO had dated in the past. None of this came up in any version of her statements to LE!

[@mamaheim]

This case is so unbelievably frustrating. We are almost 4 weeks in and all we have done is prove why humans are terrible.

[@myquest666420]

Especially humans from the Boston area lol

[@Jamlf]

What I don't get if Jen knew Brian Albert's door was unlocked to begin with why didn't she run into the house to get him. He is a veteran of the police force. Most likely knows first aid. Also, would have blankets and other stuff to help.

[@vee_grave]

Yes it seems like someone that would be easy to do while on the phone with 911. Wake up your law enforcement brother-in-law who has medical training to help with the injured person on his front lawn.

[@pauladossantos4460]

It does seem like the first thought you would have along with calling 911

[@theConquerersMama]

While also asking - OMG, what happened??? To the Alberts

[@tracysires2234]

TF???? "Tell them the guy never came in the house???" I am replay crew.... HOLY WTF!!!! I watched the testimony from Jen McCabe and am trying to figure out HOW NO ONE but Karen voiced or had ANY concern for John... and how Jen says Karen said she dropped John off at The Waterfall, but his body was found at Fairview ..... HOW can that happen????

[@itsme-os1jb]

I mean at this point even if she did hit him-why is it a crime vs an accident. People die in accidents all the time and it is not determined as a crime. The Bella’s mom theory sounds like something only some wound up married for 20 year bitties with boring husbands would make up.

[@annyfyreagle7973]

😂

[@debbysalmon2498]

Or if John counted on you for years to help out with the kids,and then along comes Karen, who takes care of the kids.

[@Stoshnut]

Honestly if the defense hadn't confirmed with the friends that they saw Karen's car I wouldn't have even KNOWN SHE WAS THERE THAT NIGHT. I don't believe aaaaaaaaaaannnnyyyy of Jen or Matt's testimony. Jen had a notable pause after mentioning johns room... I have feelings.

[@BookishDark]

5:25:26 wow. What a nasty woman. She was damn quick to throw Karen under the bus. WOW.