MA. v Karen Read Trial Day 19 Morning - Searches & Science. O'Hara, Hartnett

[@bonniegeppert3912]

This court reporter is so efficient I believe she could have performed the entire investigation in one day and have dinner on the table by 5pm

[@beepboop8374]

And it would have been a thorough and accurate investigation

[@jstellacc]

And we would have known who did it!

[@jenniferguisinger7034]

100

[@sk_princessS]

I agree with you all! 😂

[@shaz_am07]

Absolutely.

[@Leeta]

Speaking as a Speech Language Pathologist...it is REALLY hard to get soft speakers to simply "speak louder." There are literally entire treatment programs to help people "speak louder!!" This is especially true if a person has vocal nodules/polyps or breathing difficulties. I work with a 3rd grader who has vocal polyps and he cannot speak loudly no matter what he does. I would argue that the court needs to get better microphones or use an amplification system that allows the witnesses/lawyers to wear a mic around their necks. That way, they don't have to be stuck to the podium.

[@Diana-ch8cv]

it also just comes off as so rude especially with the judge threatening to turn off the fans/AC which is got to annoy the jury and the gallery. most witnesses are probably already nervous to testify , the judge scolding at them to speak up is not going to help. they need to set up a mike and speaker. just cuz the courtroom was built 300 years ago doesn't mean it has to have the same tech from 300 years ago...can you tell i'm annoyed with this judge lol 😅

[@gryffent]

@@Diana-ch8cvthis judge comes off as so unprofessional and arrogant and I’m totally over her. There is Zero excuse for Lally to be constantly off mic and lapel mic’s aren’t expensive nor intrusive.

[@baybabe95]

Thank you for this! This is so interesting. I imagine it must be really embarrassing and demoralizing for the witnesses struggling with this. I honestly didn’t realize how little control people had over it. Out of curiosity: do these same people struggle to yell? Also, do people who speak loudly struggle to speak more softly?

[@84rinne_moo]

Yea I don’t really understand this. Like she has said this to multiple witnesses at this point it’s more likely mic/sound issue then the person needing to speak up. You can’t tell me there’s THAT many quiet speakers coming to testify lol

[@lyndseyborseti8770]

I agree! It’s not the person’s fault. SLP here too! 🙋🏼‍♀️

[@Diana-ch8cv]

the way the judge is managing the courtroom is driving me nuts - she's exasperated by the length of time it takes to put in exhibits, which is entirely her fault since she had them re-number everything as it is entered! and why is the court reporter entering the exhibits? she's got 2 clerks up there why doesn't the judge ask them to do it when it's their job? the judge also comes off as rude when asking people to speak up. The judge knows that hearing is an issue why doesn't she order the court tech guys to install a mike at the podium?! the court isn't even in session for most of the week, there's plenty of time for the tech guys to install a mike and speaker. And don't even get me started with her approach to objections and rulings ("i'll let him have that" good lord just say overruled!), and then her rushing off as soon as court is done and not coming in until the jury does but then gets pissed when the lawyers have to approach for sidebar. if she got their 5 minutes earlier we wouldn't be wasting the jury's time!! ...i just can't with this judge 😩😩😩😩😫

[@DR.DisInfect]

Judges get to do it their way but she is a little off base at times. I like the I let em have it personally means the same thing but she's putting her own touch on it

[@JeniferMorris789]

Not to mention the fact that she doesn’t allow them to state the grounds of the objection!!!! Half of the time I’m like, okay but why?? Also, isn’t that horrible for the record? Like, “objection…” “I’ll let him have that” or “ask it differently” like what why though??? Sometimes it’s obvious and other times I can’t tell. She really chaps my ass.

[@Annie-yg6eg]

The, "I'll let him have that..." sounds like she's doing him a favor rather than him correctly asking a question he is allowed to ask.

[@DR.DisInfect]

@Annie-yg6eg she's the boss and doesn't like the defense so in her mind she is doing them a favor

[@justanotheryummymumm]

The judge is the cranky grandma who will not bake you cookies.

[@whoever6458]

Whatever that court reporter is making as a salary, they need to raise it significantly! She's working really hard!

[@bettycattk5298]

How in the world does she keep everything straight that’s she’s doing????!?!

[@lindajoyce2529]

@bettycatk5298. I would last all of 2 minutes in that job!🙃 Lol

[@celestehutchison709]

Court reporters typically make over $100,000, depending upon the state/town that they work in.

[@therealdeal3672]

She's got to be the hardest working most focused person in the whole courtroom! She's on from start to finish and she has so much to do! Bless her heart! ❤

[@sad.jackfr00t]

@@celestehutchison709She still deserves a raise for all her work-she’s essentially doing two jobs, court reporter and court clerk. She should be getting both salaries.

[@NerdyDogMom1]

I’ve never heard witnesses have to ask a prosecutor to repeat or rephrase a question this many times before because they don’t understand what they are being asked!!

[@kellyshannon5472]

How in Gods green earth did absolutely no one see a sneaker and a fairly large piece of red tail light when there was only a dusting of snow when the first responders were there???

[@DyslecticAttack]

That shoe would have been barely covered from the side, and it'd have been a weird bump on the curb if it was covered. How would 6 people looking for things out of place miss it?

[@TinasArtPage]

And not only that but the first responding officer had CLEARED THAT PART OF THE CURB!!!!!

[@theclemmo7493]

Hear ye hear ye, in from my bed in New Zealand with coffee, my knitting and the dog! Embarrassed at how I have been living for court being in session again… last week was a LONG one

[@SonicBlissings]

You are living my dream life. My dog won’t watch with me and I can’t be in bed because someone is working in that room. Otherwise, crochet on my desk in Canada. 🇨🇦

[@TracyB-dn7jy]

Same here, from Texas, no embarrassment necessary. 🐶 ☕ 😍

[@pinkpapayarusyse9903]

Same. Also in my bed in NZ 😂. I started listening to Lally droning on at midnight and fell asleep

[@AMGra-j6i]

Same here in Ireland at 9.30pm with a whiskey ginger and my cat 😂

[@annjanovsky8054]

Watching from my couch in Germany so...join the club🤭

[@mak327]

The court reporter is the MVP of this court room!

[@LaurenLakes]

I can’t handle how the judge scolds people who don’t talk loud enough & threatens to punish everybody if they don’t correct what they obviously aren’t doing on purpose. It’s inappropriate, unprofessional & belittling.😡

[@sk_princessS]

I’ve been over this obnoxious judge for a minute now!!

[@claudia5908]

I agree. The jury might take it out unwilling on these witness. Make it hard on the prosecution. These are their witnesses!

[@maycronin1188]

​@@claudia5908she doesn't tell Lally to speak up

[@SheaShea71]

​​@@maycronin1188yes she does. @ 2:45:50.

[@nomadpurple6154]

I'm sure between her salary and the two lawyers they could easily pay for a half decent mike and speakers.

[@Emilyrics508]

Replay: the car also drove from Canton to Dighton Ma before impound! How does a hair & glass remain on the car?

[@teresawarner689]

It doesn’t!

[@paigemelton]

I have been thinking this tooo!!!!!

[@Hopenothopeless]

There’s no way because even if it was trapped by the snow as the snow melts it would have pulled the hair off. I just can’t see it as being anyway possible.

[@melissagilby3959]

The way this case is being run is a mess! The judge seems disorganised, (and rude at times) the court room doesn’t seem an appropriate size, many problems with the aircon and having trouble hearing the witnesses, no speaking objections and sorting “side bars out” while leaving the jury waiting, the court reporter being the one to re-mark the exhibits, multiple days off. It’s painful! I’ve been following the Daybell case along side this one and it’s worlds apart! The actual footage of the Daybell case was pretty awful but way easier to watch and follow along. The prosecution in this case does not have a good flow!

[@catasrophieGrrl]

Right? I watched everyday of the Daybell case and it ran like a dream. One sad typo and a few days they got through witnesses early and didn't have enough for the day, and a few tech problems. The case itself was mortifying, but the court room itself ran like a dream. In this case I'm just confused, constantly at the evidence, at the courtroom, at what the crime is exactly, at the timeline, at the days off.... confusion.

[@red___shoes]

As someone who rough houses regularily with her large dogs, one being a German Shep, I can tell you, those as claw punctures in the jumper. The dog jumps, claws grab and as the dog drops, the claws drag (on the skin) and make a pull (hole) in the clothing. Generally the dog will realise their claw is caught up in something (this case clothing) and push away from themself, paw lifts slightly and they release the claw. My arms and my husbands are are regularily scratched up by the dogs jumping up on us (when we are playing, not aggression). The dog, during play, only really gets you if you arent quick enough to push them away. So if the dog is being aggressive, it's explain the multitude of holes and scratches.

[@007nadineL]

Lolzzzzz😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@zxy78267]

I wondered about that. We have a medium sized dog and her claws can cause scratches sometimes, but she goes to the groomers and gets them clipped so they are more blunt than sharp.

[@red___shoes]

​@@007nadineLwell it definitely isn't teeth/bite marks. If a dog wants to nip or bite you, it sure as hell doesn't look like that.

[@red___shoes]

​​@@zxy78267even filed, claws can mess you up real good. If the holes and scatches arent from dog claws, I'm struggling to think what exactly they're from. Jab and drag/scrape maybe? Seems redundant though.

[@curiouslytot1950]

Doesn’t even have to be a German shepherd. :| our chihuahua can claw through clothes especially after their nails are clipped if they aren’t ground to be dull

[@sleslie6395]

How convenient Canton police had them search a totally different area more than 12 hours later when they think it allegedly happened. They even told them exactly where the vehicle allegedly was 🤔🤔 Give me a break! If Canton police is saying John was hit by a vehicle, they 100% would have looked in the road and around the curb all the way to where the body was found. It didn't look like very much snow was on the ground when the Canton police were there in the morning. This trial is a bunch of BS.

[@Kellerlavon]

Right! And they had her car for how long when this search started? I find it hard to believe no one see the tail light pieces when by testimony there was maybe 3 or 4 inches of snow. If I remember right they called it a "light dusting"

[@ThatRedhedd]

My high school science classes taught me that it's highly unlikely Karen's tail light would've shattered or broken from hitting a person. Only a highly specialized accident reconstruction expert knows what it takes to break a polycarbonate tail light enclosure - however, the average citizen knows those are extremely durable & wouldn't shatter from hitting a soft, cushioned surface or from hitting a relatively lightweight, moveable object that essentially gets pushed away upon impact (as opposed to a brick wall, or a _4000 lb_ parked vehicle).

[@Seashea]

How does a taillight shatter into 20-30 pieces hitting a 6’ person who has injuries above his neck? Where is the common sense or the science? Make it make sense. What prosecutor thought they could prove this theory?

[@pattypeters2686]

And it wouldve shattered inwards not outwards ,🙄

[@bubbles0216]

This seriously makes zero sense. I feel like I need to go through and re-watch, taking notes. This is so confusing.

[@zxy78267]

​@@bubbles0216Same, but I'm behind already.

[@nomadpurple6154]

@@pattypeters2686 And then fallen out as the car accelerated forwards 🙄

[@karmaMatters123]

So they all started leaving the scene when the light was coming out, and they all started going back to the scene when it was getting dark. That’s not sketchy at all. 👀

[@BookishDark]

I’ve backed into both a trailer hitch and a cast iron radiator and STILL didn’t smash my taillight to this extent. And I drive a fucking 2010 Hyundai.

[@ACandRS]

The form and wording of Lally's questions is diabolical.

[@brennnabean]

I feel so bad for that court reporter 😩

[@DR.DisInfect]

What if anything is wrong with if anything the way he questions if anyone the witnesses

[@nachtsunterwegs]

Lally: And in regard to sort of, on the day you were, sort of, as for this photo, what if anything did you observe? Witness: I sort of observed snow. Seriously, there are courses out there for communication skills. How can he even interrogate people when they are never quite sure what he is even asking?

[@Amontillado72]

Lally is quite unprofessional

[@NottyAries]

Even to himself. 😒

[@AlliRMiller]

Wait?!? She doesn’t use red solo cups to collect and store evidence? Well now I don’t trust her findings

[@theConquerersMama]

This is Massachusetts. How on earth is he saying they dont typically search in the snow. Are not really trained for it. Do people not have auto accidents? Bar fights or assaults? Do crimes only hapoen in the summer here? Exactly what do these detectives detect? Youve got furst responders who sleep through a team of ambulances and flashing lights, who is so uncaring as not to even check what is hapoening on his own property. These cops dont have ring cameras or lock doors. It all stretchs credulity.

[@Cassiee102]

I think its because they're all clearly awful at their jobs

[@CharleysAquaticNook]

This trial is going to be 3 years long when they are only in trial 1 day a week and half days constantly. I’ve never heard of anything like this!

[@theConquerersMama]

We still haven't establish that a murder even occurred. Sheesh!

[@riannarodriguez9759]

Im losing interest in the commonwealth presenting their case. I can’t imagine how the jurors feel right now!!

[@nopenope2184]

GPS documentation when done properly should record location to within 1/10 of an inch. I don’t understand what the officer means by “they couldn’t mark all of the evidence locations because they were too close together.” 16’ of error is absolutely ludicrous. These people have no clue how to use the equipment.

[@ProfoundConversation]

Yeah, a fair weather degree of accuracy of 14ft makes the gps system useless for identifying anything within a crime-scene distance, it shouldn't even be part of their kit if it's that inaccurate, they should be using other means to identify location in context with other evidence.

[@BobLoblaw-cn5mv]

I used to pipeline survey and made no sense to me either. Using hand held Garmin from 1997?

[@DyslecticAttack]

​​@@BobLoblaw-cn5mv as someone who has followed university courses about GPS systems sounds like it. Sounds like the cheap hand held gps that "do the job decent enough but don't cost that much", and sounds like they didn't care much to try and mark with accuracy even then. If you had patience and tried a few times you could get that accuracy down even in such conditions. Hell, with repeat attempts with this type of scattering you should be able to get an average that'd have more precision. It's not like it's a double bounce that'd give a consistent error in one direction. And so long as you keep track of what waypoint(s) are what piece of evidence it's easy going. And if accuracy doesn't work, then you could still easily work in a physical grid so you can place retroactively where you found stuff. You have markings that you used for boundaries where you searched, and the area you searched was not more than a dozen by a dozen feet. You could easily establish an x-axis and work upward from there making a y-axis, especially when you sift through snow shovel by shovel this should be doable. And even if it's too much work to just roll out a messuring tape and mark out which cell you find stuff in. The least you can do is take pictures with recognisable markers to place it on the scene. But no, they did none of that. Instead it's "it was between 1 and 3 feet away from the curb, then 1 to 3 feet away from that was a second thing, and then 1 to 3 feet away from the second we found a third". So basically, we know the area of interest was somewhere between 3 to 10 feet away from the curb. Where on the curb? "Where the detective said the car had been". And where that was and what the source of that info was? No clue. To me this reeks of laziness and willful ignorance more than actual incompetence, which I find incredibly frustrating when it's pervasive in every aspect of the case.

[@annap5421]

I work in spatial data and we assume gps data could be inaccurate by a couple of meters, accuracy is at best 3m with perfect weather and that's with high accuracy equipment 😊 if you have more accurate stuff I'd love to know (non sass intended) as it'd be really useful information for my career & the future of spatial data

[@nopenope2184]

@@annap5421 - Hi Anna, We use RTK. Mostly Topcon. Minimum acceptable accuracy is 0.1” in the horizontal and 1.5” in the vertical. Even our drone LIDAR units are more precise than the tolerances that you listed.

[@bsummers1386]

Having court reporter marking exhibits is insane. Doing the job of multiple ppl

[@qlauraq912]

I could only imagine that that’s how mistakes happen

[@katrinkarlsdottir]

The courtroom supertar is a combination court clerk & court reporter and desrves an all encompasing title.

[@ravenzyblack]

@@katrinkarlsdottir- That doesn’t negate what was posted. She may be the best person for the job, but it should be a two person job. No matter how perfect you are mistakes will be made.

[@katrinkarlsdottir]

I agree. I just think she deserves praise for trying to be 3 people at once.

[@jcnickel2047]

I think the defense believes the shoes was not their at 8am but was deposited their before the 6pm search

[@hayleybell_author]

Anyone else totally love with Emily flirting with her husband? Best part of the stream!

[@stellaallbright4750]

💜😍💜

[@LovetheLed]

What is the timestamp for the flirting? Dr B is such a cutie 🥰💜

[@ChristopherMichael180]

@@LovetheLedit was like a little after 2:46:00

[@CharlieBrownthecat]

SASSY flirting. The best kind of flirting.

[@LovetheLed]

I just caught the Dr B moment 💜💜💜

[@kellyshannon5472]

Funny that they found exactly what they were asked to find and NOTHING else…??🤨 O’Hara looks defeated.

[@aimeerothwell3849]

As a side note, EMS scissors don’t leave any marks on the skin. They have little rubber nubs on the end. They’re meant to make direct contact with the skin. You can cut peoples dressings off wounds without any injury to the patient. That’s why we have special scissors for that.

[@Sleepingsparklegirl]

The states time line makes no sense. For one what was the temps at 12-7? How do you know when he was hit? Wouldn’t he have died of hyperthermia before 7 am based on what he was wearing, his alcohol level, the damage to his body, and etc. Why hasn’t there been an expert to the jury on this? Everyone for the state on this case should be fired. No one did their job and a victim’s family has no answers and a potential innocent woman has been through the hell of the court system because on the stupid whim of a corrupt police force. The tax payers should also demand justice for the money wasted on this.

[@sherryernst9901]

How the hell would a hair still be there after all the driving and being towed in a snow storm..? That makes no sense

[@suesanborts-bredall9914]

Let alone the snow melting off car

[@md9971]

And I bet if you went around the rest of the exterior of her vehicle you'd also find normal wear and tear scratches, etc

[@jennifersandahl4603]

@@md9971exactly. It’s reasonable to say he had access and ride in her vehicle. So his dna and biologicals would be there.

[@amypole2529]

The hair may have been elsewhere on the car and moved and froze to the spot where it end up when the ice melted. The glass may have been elsewhere and fell to the bumper when car was unloaded from the flat bed. 🤷🏻‍♀️

[@TheTaratee]

whats maddening is some of the microphones are so lacking we cant hear a witness but we CAN hear someone sigh and groan multiple times an hour...

[@Kellerlavon]

Since the pictures aren't where the tail light was found instead where they were dumped on the ground from the shovel I still have doubt that it wasn't planted. Even the shoe. From 8am to 5 pm no one protected the scene. So much doubt.

[@SweetStephee]

That's the flippin issue! The scence was never secured!🤬🙄

[@barbsilvey3276]

Emily and I said, at the exact same time, how is this the first time we’re hearing about a sneaker!!! ??

[@messygirlinaplannerworld8276]

I was a court reporter in the Marine Corps. We were responsible for marking exhibits. However, they were nearly always marked ahead of trial. Any objections to evidence happened in motions prior. I don’t recall any trials being this disjointed in terms of how often they need to send the jury back. Most of that would be addressed ahead of time. I was also a closed mask dictation reporter. It’s really interesting to see the differences and similarities to courts martial.

[@NerdyDogMom1]

“You have found the D” bahahahaha this is why I watch you!!! I love your humor and when we get to see you and Dr. B in sweet moments of light humor.

[@MimiDidi121]

She’s having to make payments of that vehicle which I believe they busted out her tail light and caused damage to her vehicle. I believe with all my heart that vehicle was not towed with that tail light in that condition. It’s obvious on the ring camera when she leaves John‘s house at five or so in the morning that that tail light was intact! It could’ve been cracked, but all that red was still there. And on top of all that, the state has conveniently lost any footage they collected from her driving back-and-forth between Fairview and Home. Also, there is no video in the Salleyport from the time they brought that vehicle in until after it was processed. We know the blood evidence was sitting in a bag and opened in the same sallyport, and that the clothing that supposedly had tail fragments in bedded in sat in Proctors car or trunk for 4-6 weeks before it was turned into evidence! oh the Fuckery that could have gone on when no one was looking.

[@tinacheri27]

no, she had his clothes on Feb 1

[@blastypowpow]

Here’s my theory since Karen supposedly mentioned her broken tail light to Jen and Kerry(tho, we don’t know how true it that is.) Some of the McAlberts and/or Higgins went to Karen’s vehicle while she was sleeping at John’s, and after they left him in the yard, they went and bashed her tail light out and took pieces back to the scene. Just a guess. Since the Ring footage was gone, and they had John’s phone at the McAlbert’s house, they could have deleted the footage so no one knew they bashed it out. Your theory could be correct as well since we don’t necessarily trust Jen and Kerry’s testimony 100%. There’s too much f*ckery for me to believe the tail light pieces got there because Karen hit him with her car. The McAlberts have soooooooo much suspicious behavior between them that I just can’t believe Karen did it. Alan and his team have given me so much reasonable doubt. I came into this only knowing what Karen was charged with. I just didn’t pay attention because I’m also following the Idaho4/Kohberger and Delphi/Rick Allen cases. I forgot, also the Mica Miller case, the Maddie Soto case, and the Sebastian Rogers case. I can’t follow them all, so this case would have been one too many. I haven’t seen all the testimony yet, but, right now, I believe Karen is innocent. That could change with other testimony. I’m kinda miffed at CBS because I read an article from last Thursday or Friday that said there was no court today(6/3) and that there was court tomorrow(6/4). It also said there was a half day on Wednesday, and a full day on Thursday. Now, I think they got it backwards. I’m so confused.

[@stephanietexas1325]

What about the ring doorbell footage? If they did it while she slept, it would be on the footage

[@dreamtrance9892]

No, she testified that she had all the evidence from the salleyport on Feb 1st. The clothes weren't given to her until March ​@tinacheri27

[@jacquelineburns2731]

So proud to say that Karen probably made enough ey to pay cash for her car. Go you girl!! I can only wish I had been so successful and smart.

[@evem8333]

Wow…glass and a hair managed to remain on the bumper while traveling to and from and towed but JO’s shoe and belt were knocked off of JO so hard that they’re not to be found? Belt missing is really sketchy. And how does a car puncture clothes when hitting someone?

[@sallycinnamon5370]

Devils advocate…do we know he wore a belt?

[@stellaallbright4750]

And... Where's his HAT!? 🎯

[@hillaryclinton1314]

After then sex, they dressed him and forgot the belt

[@Lexluth0rr_]

@@sallycinnamon5370 we know he had a belt because the same night there is video footage of them together at the bar, in the footage she lifts his shirt and a belt can be seen. It’s online go look

[@MommaSmith]

@@sallycinnamon5370You could see his belt on in the waterfall video.

[@swantron4335]

My Law Nerd University tumbler came in today! Perfect to watch on the replay crew 😍

[@NerdyDogMom1]

My Mom and I both watch EDB so I bought her one for Mother’s Day. It is one of the more thoughtful gifts I’ve given to her in a while because we both have gotten into true crime and she introduced me to EDB and the LYK. She also loves Tumblers. The Lawnerd University one is so cute!

[@SRM2025]

I’ve been wrapped up in the Chad Daybell trail these past months, I’ve missed you Emily! Get some self care soon. With ☮️💜 from Brisbane Australia 🇦🇺

[@bridgetlloyd2001]

I am still confused about the canton police. Why do they not know how to collect evidence.

[@jeanwinders9556]

I'm not making any excuses but I grew up next town over.Only 3 people in 45 years were murdered. Local yokels are just not very experienced. Honestly the CSI shows have been around for 20+ years 😮 and you'd think they'd be a little more professional.

[@JxArrieta]

Incompetents.

[@Cassiee102]

Inept people training newbies. We have the same problem in healthcare right now. Also, newbies training newbies. So the don't learn everything they need to learn. You don't know what you don't know

[@Florence31]

There is no way that much tail light was missing. In the video of her backing up at JOs house, the light was very much red. It would have been white if it was that cracked at that point in the am.

[@beffers68]

Good Ole' Dr. B, bringing the coffee and the "D"! It's going to be a good morning for EDB!

[@Fifi_Is_My_Name-O]

Question: Why not swab John's arm around the "bites" too to check for dog DNA?

[@MimiDidi121]

I guarantee that a lexis engineer would say that bumping into someone at low speed would absolutely not bust that tail light out like it is! That would take heavy impact of a immovable object at a higher speed. That polycarbonate plastic is so hard to break that they have to spray it with a solution to break it with a hammer! I don’t know how hitting a soft body would cause scratches all over the bumper and break out that tail light completely. If they’re going to say that it was just cracked, but with her driving around and them, hauling it around, caused all the pieces to fall out, then they can’t say that there was still a hair and a piece of glass on the bumper! You can’t have it both ways. I am terrified that there’s not gonna be enough come in that the jury knows what we know! I wish I had the Commonwealth’s witness list

[@BuffyLynn]

I wonder if she squished him between the electric box and the taillight? 🤷🏼‍♀️so many questions…no clear answers 🤦🏼‍♀️🤣

[@calliew311]

It's on the Internet, the witness list. Just Google it, that's what I did.

[@DyslecticAttack]

​@@BuffyLynn people said the electric box was on the opposite end of the yard iirc. So if I did remember that correctly, then the scene and location of the evidence would not line up with that theory.

[@Nandrea7627]

I’ve been following the trial as a jurist, much like many of the other Law Nerds. With the evidence already in play there isn’t proof of anything against KR. The defence asked us to wait for them and I think KR will walk out a free woman. Lally is the WORST prosecutor I’ve ever seen in trial! He’s all over the place, no time line and bloody awful questioning!!

[@jodagg3982]

Is it possible Lally doesn't believe in this case? It's like he has lost the will to do anything.

[@calliew311]

If that's so, then why would he keep calling witnesses, especially all the ones that aren't absolutely necessary, which is most of them?

[@gryffent]

I can’t believe Lally has a job as a prosecutor. He is awful and ineffective.

[@oldstuffbethtx8052]

There have been reports that he was assigned this case as a last hurrah because DA is running for re-election and wants to be able to distance himself from this case. Also, Lally is retiring ASAP.

[@literaturegeek1570]

I could also imagine he is really tired by now, as he seems to do all the work questioning on DA side. 😅 And I can't imagine he is having any fun with that.

[@emmy2417]

i mean honestly i think he’s mostly doing what he’s told. in his opening and his questioning, it doesn’t seem like his heart is really in it

[@bizzithegamermom]

"Law Nerds in the wild" -epic description by EBD!!

[@Nandrea7627]

Replay crew today. Currently watching the damage to JO’s hoodie and I’m sorry but those look like puncture and pull marks on the arm! Like from a dog, NOT a car or being dragged!

[@theConquerersMama]

Agreed. If cause by gravel on a road, then where is the gravel in the wounds, dirt on the clothes?

[@dawnf.1703]

Replay crew! Absolutely here for the hear ye’s!!

[@darkbeach72]

Lally and Bev need to be rehomed.

[@DrBWhoSaidWhaat]

The lab, state police and BPD have history of collaborating shall we say

[@whoever6458]

As someone with a BS in biology, I'm surprised that this forensic scientist with a Master's degree is not familiar with mitochondrial DNA and how to test for it! We did such tests in the lab when I went to school.

[@theConquerersMama]

I am not a forensic scientist but I have watched Law & Order/CSI. I would hope their boss has a word with them.

[@Amontillado72]

Correct, this so called expert was crap

[@francescawilliams8177]

I swear each time someone says anything about forensics I wonder why I watched so many series because now I don’t know if this is how it’s done or it wasn’t done properly.

[@mattsheehan7658]

She's not a DNA analyst and hence not allowed to testify to DNA...

[@zxy78267]

​@@theConquerersMamaI watch enough trials to know what it is. 🙂

[@sadiebeanz]

Who, if anyone, was Sally and what, if anything, does she have to do with, sort of, garages??

[@JeniferMorris789]

HAHA this got me 😂

[@Mitch3po]

Hhhhobjection

[@joycarter8479]

Picture of the cups, inside the bag, while it was on the floor, looked melted to me…

[@ericalexander5890]

When the guy talks about the search and using a grid so they don't miss anything ---- didn't they miss a lot, that was later found?

[@jennyjumpjump]

Those holes in the sweatshirt sleeve look very much like a dog grabbed the sleeve. To me

[@theConquerersMama]

Right? If it's cause in and auot accident then where is the debris that caused the puncture type wound . That were able to get through layers of clothes.

[@paular8783]

The number of days off they’re having is so annoying 😡 can they not do a full week for a change!

[@Emmaleesa4]

I said the same about the light interior!!! Looks very clean on the inside - despite the weather.

[@lynnbryant9606]

Uk Police Officer....Record/document every person entering and leaving a scene...Standard procedure

[@soude85]

They didn’t even mark/close off, where he was found-it was just an open walkway for 7 hours before evidence was collected…🙄 This investigation is insane!

[@jeanwinders9556]

It's mind blowing that the UK makes everyone suits up including booties. Tents are set up to protect the scene and even metal tiles are laid down to protect footsteps.

[@Jellybeanjeans]

I'm having a hard time trusting physical evidence in this case. Im getting more questions.

[@Hopenothopeless]

Same. I don’t trust the evidence because of what we heard at the beginning on the trial and the vehicle evidence doesn’t make logical sense that it’s on there but also that it could have been caused by a human body.

[@nannezeltd5148]

The dent above the light has rust in it that proves it has to be at least a few days old

[@thomasstone313]

You ever notice how the judge times the breaks right when when the defense is getting good

[@juliehinkel608]

I hope she is simply a stickler for her breaks, but I too have noticed the strange or unfortunate timing. I no longer trust anyone from this investigation because of the number of sloppy responses.

[@chels1993]

You know what’s interesting to me- John’s body had no snow under it. Which- might be understandable because a warm body would melt snow. However, the tail lights and other items were found inbetween layers of snow. There was not a thin layer below the taillights, there was quite a bit of snow. It’s also interesting that these items were not seen at a chaotic scene or kicked around or moved, or stepped on and broken while all the people were trudging around John’s body. It’s just interesting.

[@LovetheLed]

The photos of where he was found did not show any grass. There was no indication that he had been anywhere except on top of inches of snow. The pictures were terrible but the grass was definitely not visible AT ALL 🤷🏻‍♀️💜💜

[@Hopenothopeless]

@@LovetheLedyep on the snow blower video there was definitely crushed down snow under him but no grass. And Keri is the only one who I think said he was on the grass, which just further makes it look like her testimony was not completely accurate.

[@Meshellbelle]

Love your coverage of cases EDB! I'm not currently a member but am subscribed and follow your channel since Depp v Heard. Love your explanation of court thingies!

[@jonnyreb3032]

If someone was hit. And the car had been driven for miles and in the snow and then towed. How was glass still on the bumper?

[@rainbownerladybounce]

I may have missed it, but why don't the lawyers have mics all the time? Are they just wandering? Is it a consequence of the small courtroom? I do not understand why they can't get it together at this point in the trial!

[@Diana-ch8cv]

i don't understand why they don't just install a mike at the podium! the court isn't even in session for half of the week, you have the time to get the tech guys to install it

[@jeanwinders9556]

It's massachusetts we swear all the time, every third word is f*,ck in any conversation

[@lubeeluonline]

Surely the inspection of the car is useless without any photos at the crime scene to compare. My car is covered in dings & marks, so much that even I couldn’t tell you with any certainty where they came from. Did the tow vehicle dent or ding the car? All of this screams reasonable doubt. As does most of the CW’s evidence.

[@LovetheLed]

It looks like you have gained 15k subscribers since the KR trial began 🎉💜💜

[@LovetheLed]

That piece of glass is not “embedded” as has been claimed. It looks like it was deposited there in the Sally Port! The fuckery 2:45:44

[@claudia5908]

It still does not make sense. The shoe was found at ground level but the tail light wasn’t? There was still snow where it was found. It doesn’t appear they were found at ground level.

[@evem8333]

How can there be drips of blood if he was hit and then laying down after being hit?

[@alexisbaltazar8958]

I didn't interpret it as snark when the witness said "if you wanna call my patrol car a command post". I thought he was just trying to joke with Yanetti

[@anyone_but_me]

Same. And yanetti was certainly snarky when he got called out by the judge just prior.

[@alexisbaltazar8958]

@@anyone_but_me exactly! I felt the witness was overall very respectful.

[@deborablue2448]

If that is the victim's hair on her bumper I say no biggie because they lived together that hair could have landed on that bumper at any unknown time.

[@AM.000]

It snowed and the car was cleaned off multiple times.. There is zero chance that the hair would still be on the bumper unless it was on the snow brush itself.

[@Fido-vm9zi]

He was a passenger in the vehicle and was in & out.

[@AM.000]

@@Fido-vm9zi relevance?

[@AM.000]

@Fido-vm9zi lol are you trying to distance the fact the Jo'K was near the vehicle multiple times, inside his garage, and KR could have his hair on her since she sleeps over frequently? 😂 are you trying to say the only way that hair could be there is from being hit by the vehicle??? Yes please ignore all the water makes underneath the hair that's barely touching the vehicle from the many inches of snow that would have accumulated and fallen off the vehicle... especially when it was being driven and towed 60 miles. Lmao

[@md9971]

And the date on the taillight exam was March 2, 2023 so was the hair also found still hanging there a month+ after the alleged hit!

[@johns1625]

Puncture wounds through clothing in one place on one forearm from a car collision??? Give me a break... 🤮

[@Turtle-eg1lb]

Do you think the dog tried to drag or bite the man after the collision? Why can’t both be a possibility?

[@soude85]

@@Turtle-eg1lb Why tf would a dog bite the arm of a dead man-it’s not a wolf..🙄

[@nopenheimer]

Desperate or delusional, why can't both be a possibility?

[@WatchTashi]

Right?? For that to happen, she would have had to go in reverse, on very slick roads (they're always slickest after the snow first starts) at a very high rate of speed, his arm would've had to been bare, unless there was damage to his clothing. But that wouldn't be holes it would be like rips and tears. This is a sham!

[@hopeandhappiness777]

I watched another stream with a forensic interview and this Doctor Who does autopsies- these types of examinations did explain to the lawyer host it is definitely possible to obtain those types of scratches from a vehicle accident from being dragged or scratched? and being that the body was in cold for X amount of hours those types of wounds would look the way they do? So IDK?

[@blastypowpow]

31:13 Tail lights are made of polycarbonate. They don’t break in the manner that the pieces were supposedly found. Polycarbonate is hard. Like a brick hard. If it broke from hitting a man, it’d be in 2-3 pieces MAX, and, my guess is, it’d still be in the tail light slot, just cracked. Canton PD are absolutely, 100%, 💯, *_LYING_* about the tail light pieces. They placed those pieces there. I would bet my life on it. I was an EMT and I saw the results of many, many car accidents and even some car vs pedestrian incidents. Even if you could go 23 mph in reverse in 60 feet, you still wouldn’t see polycarbonate break into shards like that. And if she ran over him, and went forward again dragging him, John would have some pretty nasty road rash injuries. The state’s theory that Karen drove 60 feet(where one of the McAlberts said they saw Karen supposedly parked) going in reverse at 23 mph is patently ridiculous. You get out of control at 14-16mph. John would also have plenty of time to step out of the way if the car was coming from 60 feet away. Also, the street is curved in front of Brian Albert’s house and there were cars lining the street. Karen would have jumped the curb or hit another car. I saw a video where someone tried to drive in reverse at 23mph in 60 feet directly where Canton says JOK was hit. They hit the curb just doing 14 mph. They said that 16 or 17 mph was starting to feel very out of control. If you want to know what the FBI has to say, listen to Collier Landry interview former Manhattan prosecutor Mark Bederow. I thought he was there to chat about the testimony, but he gave out some juicy spoilers. Lally is going to have a hard time dismissing and negating the testimony of three particular defense witnesses. I can’t wait for Alan and his team to get their chance to call witnesses!! 😲🫨

[@LawNerd007]

Free the court reporter!!! She’s doing the job of many and doing it better!!!!

[@whoever6458]

Those obviously cut portions of the sweatshirt do look like the material was folded over when they used the trauma shears to cut it off because those cuts generally match the angle of the the cuts they made to remove the sweatshirt. That happens sometimes, especially when you're in a hurry to take the clothes off when someone is dying and you need to get to their bare chest to affix the electrodes for the defibrillator or even the electrodes for the ECG (electro cardio gram). A funny story: I had a patient who had initially thought he had a cold before realizing that it might be a heart attack and coming to the emergency department. He had put an entire tub of Vick's vapor rub on his chest and we had to use at least a good hundred of those little alcohol wipes to clean his chest off enough for the ECG machine to get a proper reading. lol Good thing he came in, though, because he was suffering from a heart problem. We even had to start a central pic line on him, which was cool to see.

[@whoever6458]

For the question about the trauma shears, they cut clothing extremely well and the cut always comes out very clean versus the frayed edges around the holes that were marked. When you see it in person, it's immediately obvious where it was cut versus torn.

[@Ibuddy66]

Thank you for the happy Pride wishes! It means the world during such a time where we are seeing the resurgence of the Lavender Scare nationwide. It means so much to me personally and so many others. Thank you a million times over.

[@stellaallbright4750]

Not seeing anything like that and I live in deep red USA. 🤷

[@CountessKitten]

I don't think that The Lavender Scare is seeing a resurgence. At all. I think all people in the United States are currently protected and not rejected based on their sexuality, their race or religion, their sex or their disabilities. I think that we live in a country with great regulations and policies in place in this day and age to protect members of our society who have previously been treated unfairly. Thank God.

[@theConquerersMama]

Our town passed an ordinance that Landlords can discriminate against gay people. Every other town in the county voted to over throw the old regs on the books. But Our town doubled down and passed an even stronger one. They did this within months of us throwing our first ever Pride event. I had no idea that pocket of this kind of bigotry really existed in educated suburbs until moving here. And yes, the law will get challenged and taken to the Supreme Court but until then it stands.

[@theConquerersMama]

​@Bluemoonofky I suggest you research project 2025 .

[@bubbles0216]

​@@theConquerersMama Holy shit, their little booklet is fucking horrifying and I only really started reading page 4 so far.

[@brainfreezone]

I’ve worked with repairing fabric holes and rips for years. The sweat shirt doesn’t look like 12 & 13 do look similar to cuts I’ve made in material when I’ve been lazy and not flattened fabric properly. But 1+ do look similar to puncture or something blunter than scissors being forced through the weave. The weave looks worn/stretched to make the hole, so glass making them seems unlikely.

[@justanotherjen127]

I love watching with you!! How are you so smart , beautiful and funny?? 💋 thank you for covering!!! ❤

[@brandikesson5416]

Wasn't the car towed ? How was glass still on the bumper after being loaded on to a tow truck and then being towed

[@hillaryclinton1314]

After being driven home and tiwed theough a blizzard and where are THOSE photos?

[@jonnyreb3032]

Canton police did dig out the "18 inch berm" (curb). The shoe was found right next to the berm.

[@joycarter8479]

I would think, that the weight of the melting snow, or tail wind, would carry the hair away in transit.

[@Leeta]

As a Speech Language Pathologist, I am actually wondering if Lally has an expressive language disorder. It has ZERO to do with intelligence by the way. People with expressive language disorders have trouble with SYNTAX (sentence structure), morphology (word structure) and sometimes their inflection doesn't match their questions either.

[@theConquerersMama]

Interesting

[@JxArrieta]

Interesting choice of carrer then

[@katrinkarlsdottir]

Thank you, somehow that thought make it easier to listen to him.

[@theConquerersMama]

@JxArrieta I would guess that lots of adults might not realize they have itor it's a disorder that might explain a lot of things for them. I have known I had ADHD since the 80s. However, until Tik Tok, I honestly did not realize just how much of my behaviors, habits and coping mechanisms were related. And how wrong so many professionals were. How much it would have helped if I knew more about say- ED & ADHD. Or the burn out/sensory stuff.

[@jamiwengler338]

He talks totally fine when jury isn't in room though I think it's him trying to be likeable to jury

[@chefcindybaanderson415]

Oh how I’ve missed you EDB!!!

[@foxymama9203]

Replay crew! “Keep your voice up” is the new “Your mic Elaine!” 😂

[@biffedya]

sheesh at this rate the movie will be out before the trial is over

[@janetburts8172]

But they did clear the curb as a marker with their boots. It’s in one of the pictures

[@shaz_am07]

Replay crew. I’ve missed you EDB and law nerds. IMO Those punctures on the sleeve of the hoodie look very consistent with some kind of dog bite.

[@LovetheLed]

And not consistent with being hit by a car 🤷🏻‍♀️💜

[@sleslie6395]

If we made a drinking game out of how often the prosecutor uses the term "sort of", we would all be hammered!

[@anyone_but_me]

The lady defense attorney does it a lot too, I noticed. Is she local? Maybe it’s a local tic.

[@literaturegeek1570]

Or really hydrated if you use water. 😂

[@AlliRMiller]

We would be more than hammered.. more in complete liver failure

[@Becca-r6c]

So because nobody preserved the crime seen what’s the chance that all was planted ?

[@barbaramay1866]

The chances are zero. Karen Read is guilty and she knows it.

[@DyslecticAttack]

Well, depending on what you believe, either 100% or 0%. It either was planted or it wasn't. But which of those you believe is entirely dependant on how you interpret it lines up with other evidence. And if you don't know what to believe, then you have reasonable doubt. So far for me, those holes in his sweater and scratches on his arm need to be resolved by the prosecution, since to me it's giving doubt on if he went into the house. And if he went into the house, then the witnesses I can trust are a whole lot less and the chances of them planting evidence outside that they had in their house (like the shoe) is a lot higher. I also need a timeline of when Proctor had access to the car, how far away that was, how long it'd take for him to get back to the scene, and if he could have planted it before the search team got there. I currently don't trust Proctor, but maybe even with the defenses timeline there wouldn't be enough time for him to get to the scene and plant evidence. And I currently don't believe a completely different team of people would help Proctor plant evidence. So either Proctor or someone close to him would have needed to have time to get the car, break the light, collect the shards, and to get to the scene and have a few minutes there. If they have a few minutes, then I don't doubt that people could have pushed shards of plastic into snow, and that that could have gone unnoticed by a team who wasn't that invested or precise (based on their evidence collection, which was pretty sloppy in terms of documentation and the attitude that I interpreted as "we wanted to get it over with and get out of ghe cold"). But so far, for me it's too muddy to say anything beyond a reasonable doubt.

[@barbaramay1866]

@@DyslecticAttack John never made it into the house. Karen and he had a huge fight. She was still angry about the non-incident that took place in Aruba. She sent him an email on the very day he died saying she hated him and calling him a pervert. Maybe it was "liquid courage," but she did hit him. She knows it and it was no accident. She and the turtle worked for many, many hours together concocting this preposterous defense.

[@DyslecticAttack]

@@barbaramay1866 and yet that email hasn't been tendered in the trial yet, nor has it even been mentioned at all. It's a statement against party interest, so there is no reason they can't get it in if it exists. So yeah, I'm gonna wait on what gets said and proven in the trial instead of trusting random claims. Because so far, I have doubts if Karen even went to Fairview because of Jen's and Karrie's testimonies not lining up about what Jen was doing and saying (because Jen testified to a LOT to implicate Karen that she didn't before, and that Karrie doesn't corroborate in the slightest. And from Karrie's testimony we know that Jen told Karen she went there instead of Karen remembering). Yet John obviously went there, and the most logical and so far uncontested way was for Karen to bring him. So it's extremely muddy for me at this moment without the physical evidence or data that'd corroborate things.

[@MommaSmith]

💯%! This is the shadiest ‘investigation’ I have ever heard of. The witness stories/lies are so ridiculous… can’t wait for Proctor’s turn to squirm. 😂 Now that the reports and call records are available from the feds… should be entertaining!

[@cmarchibald]

The punctures on the sleeve seems more consistent with a dog bite than getting supposedly dragged by a car. Am I the only one?

[@tinykitsune0387]

No thats what i think too. Road damage generally looks like someone took a cheese grater to the clothes.

[@LovetheLed]

I made the EXACT same comment 💜💜🤷🏻‍♀️👍🏼

[@nicolepsy]

Also, the CC reading "Misty and Eddie" when the judge said Mr. Yanetti just made me laugh a little too hard

[@AmyRuby]

Ugh I just got a black van and yeah it’s like you breathe on it wrong and there are scratches. It’s the WORST!!!!

[@jeanwinders9556]

Black cars end up a mess in the winter with salt,sand and grey slush. A car wash monthly membership is a must.

[@helenequeenie]

Imagine the position he would need to be in - in order for there to be a hair where they supposedly found it and then also the glass on the bumper. Also, the marks on the corner below the light - 100% looks like she bumped against another car - I'm sure we've all seen that type of damage before. So much of this DOES.NOT.MAKE.SENSE!

[@heyandy.]

The court reporter does everything 😮 Judge is there just listening and rocking her chair 😅

[@MuzerlinaV]

The hair stayed on the car… in a blizzard? 🤨

[@Julzartnerd]

how do they know it’s not from a different car. Karen’s truck had a tiny red crack and a tiny crack that’s a whole different them a huge big plastic clear piece i need to see them physically

[@SweetStephee]

My heart breaks 💔 for JO's family & KR & her family

[@jenniferguisinger7034]

I honest to god feel like the prosecutor shows us evidence and testimony of the case like it’s show and tell ….like we’re in a museum ( and with the the passion of a librarian ATBEST) then the defense finally shows us what we need to “know” about the exhibits on cross. Thank god for cross …or I would have zero clue what the testimony and exhibits mean.

[@Amontillado72]

shoe was not seen by all ppl leaving house.. although snow was not a lot..so how can other ppl find the shoe surprisingly covered with snow? It was plantes afterwards as the taillight were. This case is a mess but very clear.