Misrepresentations of Islam by John of Damascus and Thomas Aquinas: with Dr. Osman Latiff

Dr. Osman’s books can be purchased here www.amazon.co.uk/s?k=osman+la...
Some of his free published work can be accessed here sapienceinstitute.org/author/...
Chapters:
Introduction: 00:00-13:39
Relational Dynamics: 13:40-22:56
The Iberian Peninsula and the Genesis of Crusading: 22:57-39:26
John of Damascus: 39:27-52:51
Thomas Aquinas: 52:52-1:24:11
The Prophetic Response + Q&A: 1:24:12-1:49:46
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My Paypal Link:
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[@aishax01]

This channel is undefeated, the way academics give us free knowledge that's digestible for us the laymen

[@miscgar9663]

Muhammad copied books of Bible and made Quran. He married many to help them. He killed many as they were bad. So he added polygamy and jihad and made Quran. You will get many women on earth and in heaven. Beware in the last days many logical men will make many to fall. Pray nonstop till you know God Jesus is the only way truth and life.

[@terrorbellidecuspacis]

I will just quote this word here “academics”.

[@Thomas_de_Regt]

@@terrorbellidecuspacis and why would you do that?

[@enlightenedvagabond3556]

Lol echo chamber arguments yes "undefeated." A educated muslim is a oxymoron

[@Im_Sanenough]

​@@enlightenedvagabond3556educated muslim here, want me to stomp your bubble?

[@a.m.t.s.]

I was raised as Catholic, right now I just consider myself bible believer and on religious journey to know God on my own.... i don't like even labeling myself Christian. Islam attracts me long time but because i know that I'm emotional, I can't convert quickly so I rather try to stay objective and critical, especially when it comes to theology. I listen both Christian (also Jewish) and Islamic side/teachings/views on the other side from their perspective.. It's mentally hard 🤕 but I feel like it's right thing. And that's why I'm here. I wish interfaith discussions were based on mutual respect and understanding instead of arguing what i often see 😢

[@miscgar9663]

Muhammad copied books of Bible and made Quran. He married many to help them. He killed many as they were bad. So he added polygamy and jihad and made Quran. You will get many women on earth and in heaven. Beware in the last days many logical men will make many to fall. Pray nonstop till you know God Jesus is the only way ,truth and life.

[@m7mdyahia]

As long as you are seeking the truth and doing what you can, God will guide you. Never Stop asking God the real creator, the compassionate, to guide you, every day multiple times Ask him with all your trust that the creator the all powerfull can and will guide you

[@chicagosveryown7979]

I echo @Mohammad’s statement 👍🏼 it’ll hopefully become clear to you if you approach with true sincerity.

[@TexasCoffeeBeans]

Sincerely ask the Most High to guide you to the truth. You will not be disappointed.

[@TexasCoffeeBeans]

@Sacred Warrior you’re a perfect example of why sincere people leave christianity. Many amongst you are hateful, ignorant and vile.

[@HumanbyGod]

May Allah bless you with best rewards in this world and The hereafter.

[@fidelcatsro6948]

ameen

[@snakejuce]

Wow what an underrated brother, topic, and session. Absolutely a MUST WATCH! Not to forget the amazing books this brother wrote, mA.

[@ummshams8954]

JazakAllāhu khayr for this excellent exposition. It helps me understand the background/the footsteps of the rather unpalatable ways that some Christian missionaries & polemicists are following. May God increase us in knowledge & forbearance.

[@zak992]

Beautiful lecture, resonates with ones God given reason and logic, alhamdullilah we do not have to suspend these faculties in order to understand Islam and what it teaches us about our relationship to our Creator, our accountability to Him, and our responsibility to seek Him in this world before we meet Him in the hereafter. Keep it up guys.

[@fire.smok3]

Really great presentation, may Allah reward you all, I didn't expect much from John of Damascus but it's shocking how he got basic things wrong and straight-up made things up.

[@teenaakhir9105]

Very enlightening discussions..JZK to both brothers...Ameen to rise of the modern age Mozarab .. ❄️🙏

[@mohdnorzaihar2632]

IQ + EQ + GUIDANCE = TRUTH

[@odeebob7826]

May Allah grant you brothers amongst the highest levels of Jannah

[@fidelcatsro6948]

ameen

[@nadermusa4562]

John's low level polemic came about a 100 years after the prophet's death. The short passage of this esteemed "church father" is by no means representative of the Quran's contents, form or extent as it was in his time. It surely is not, considering the heavy bias and intent of the author, representative of Islamic beliefs of the time. The author doesnt claim to have gone through the book from cover to cover. He did not even have a manuscript while penning his work and was obviously relying on hearsay. He paraphrases very few verses as he heard them, amplifying certain aspects so as to serve the purpose of his polemic. And because he has no Quran from which he is quoting, he jumbles clear Quranic chapters, calling them "books" since the scripture of his Christian audience is composed of books, and extra Quranic material, oral and written, as well as 2nd hand reports from non-Muslims about Muslims, like Herodotus's statement about Muslims worshiping Aphrodite. This concise polemic is meant to resonate to the average Christian of his time, ignorant of the teachings of their own bible on similar issues that undermine his very contentions against Muslims; Arianism, sexual depravity and parallelisms with the antichrist. Jesus' portrayal in the Quran is thus presented as partly in line with Arianism and gnosticism, Muhammad's prophethood is rejected, certain Islamic laws are amplified and misrepresented, sometimes completely distorted so as to render them offensive to flesh-hating Christians, including monastics like himself. As a side note, it was common for polemicists to purposefully misrepresent Islam and its prophet so as to deride Muslims and instil hatred for them in their Christian audiences. For example Muhammad is depicted as claiming he would be married to the emaculate mother of Jesus Christ in heaven. This latter polemic was invented in the 800s by Eulogius of Cordova, making its way even among some Muslim Quran commentaries. Ibn Kathir cites it while disputing its authenticity. Among other lies of this untalented Christian hate-monger, there is Muhammad's failure to rise on the 3rd day following his death, as he supposedly claimed, contrary to the "risen" Jesus. Robert Hoyland observes about this writer, after sketching a portrait of the prophet's early life, most likely plagiarized from John of Damascus "follows a lampoon of the Qur'an, mocking the chapter titles involving animals and twisting the words of the verse on the divorce of Zayd and Zaynab (Qur'an xxxiii.37). The final section recounts Muhammad's failed attempt at resurrection, as told in John of Seville's note, adding that an annual slaughter of dogs was instituted to avenge him. This is pure invention, presumably meant to compare Muhammad unfavourably with Christ, and a similar fiction is found in the Bahira legend. "It was appropriate that a prophet of this kind fill the stomachs of dogs," concludes the author, "a prophet who committed not only his own soul, but those of many, to hell."" Continuing with John' polemic; Islam is presented as a "heresy", but clearly not in the sense that it grew out of Christianity, rather in the sense of "false doctrine". John discusses in that polemic many other belief systems which he labels heresies, including pre-Christian religions. The irony is that this caricature of Islam, read through a Christian lens and aimed at a Christian audience even more ignorant than him of what Islam is, would undermine similar later criticisms of Islam, more particularly modern, by his Christ-loving peers. He for instance although is unfamiliar with the Quranic text, speaks multiple times of descendents of Abraham and Ishmael, venerating a single Book whose messenger, a "seemingly" pious man named Muhammad, received from heaven. The book was thus already present in his time, compiled as a single unit. His Muslim contemporaries whom he repeatedly "embarrasses", affirmed the oral and textual corruption of his Bible. Regardless of the sharpness of their arguments or whether these Muslim interlocutors are real or fictitious, putting aside their supposed legends surrounding the Kaaba and the black stone, which are conveniently embarrassing and self-serving for his polemic, these Muslims still affirmed the Abrahamic legacy with the Kaaba whose stone he says Muslims rub their face upon "but they still assert that the stone is Abraham's". In his "refutation" of that Muslim claim, he appeals to his Bible which he seems as unfamiliar with as he is with the Quran and Muslim tradition. Abraham had to travel, according to Genesis for a few days from Beersheba where he gathered wood to the location of the near sacrifice in Moriah. The wood was obviously not freshly cut from a forest as it would not burn, and neither is Beersheba an area that has wooded mountains. Abraham took wood from what he had already gathered, which he simply split, traveling with what he needed and leaving the rest behind. This makes John's argument for the supposed lack of wood at the Kaaba's location irrelevant to his contention. He further deceptively states or is simply ignorant of the text he appeals to, that the wood was gathered on the spot of the sacrifice itself. The blunder is so gross, coming from an esteemed church father, that one can only conclude that it is a purposeful deception so as to win an argument. What is clear is that some zealous Muslim contemporaries hit a nerve for John, accusing him of idolatrous worship of the cross, while John himself was having a hard time defending the veneration of icons against many fellow Christians. Instead of justifying his position, as he does against the Muslim rejection of Jesus' divinity, he engages in an untenable polemical invention. The black stone supposedly is, up to his day a carving with the features of the head of Aphrodite. The Muslim historians do not shy away from naming, describing every main idol and statue introduced into the Kaaba and the surrounding sites. None has ever mentioned anything close to that claim. Not a single idol was left standing in the precincts of Mecca after its conquest, including the main idol Hubal. Why would an obscure female deity be left up to a 100 years later?

[@samboy90]

John of Damascus was a clown of the highest order. Where did you get this excerpt? Is it from a book? Can you send the link?

[@nadermusa4562]

@@samboy90 robert hoyland "Seeing Islam as Others Saw It"

[@FOOTSHOTS1]

Great job , that was very informative

[@intannera30]

This discussion is 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

[@urfbiagent7501]

I loved this so much, may Allah bless you all.

[@fidelcatsro6948]

ameen

[@safyafarooq2878]

Interesting to know how others see at Islam. My Christian grandparents read the Quran. My grandfather claimed that Muhammad copied some stories wrong from Bible. My grandmother praised the dedication of Muslims in their worship. She said it's a pity, Muslims would be such good practicing Christians... Mashallah how do you find so many topics in so short time? One get the impression that there is so much to know, so much to learn! Islam is like a "Fass ohne Boden". Subhanallah.

[@myth6142]

To say that muhammed(saw) copied the bible is funny,since islam also claims to be an abrahamic faith,of course you will find similar stories because both have similar origins.

[@safyafarooq2878]

@@myth6142 yes, that's true. That's how I tried to explain it to my grandfather. He loved to missionarize me. Aspecialy since I converted to Islam. But he was so stubborn. He did not listen, what I said. Now he died one week ago and I am so sad for him, that he did not accept Islam before his death.

[@myth6142]

@@safyafarooq2878 watch manyprophetsonemessage videos,they are the best when it comes to rebuttal of such claims.

[@safyafarooq2878]

@@myth6142 thanks sister/brother Salamualeikum

[@myth6142]

@@nadaiduit imam murrah wanted me to send his salams to him😂

[@A.Majeed_]

Fantastic episode. Jazakum Allah Khaira.

[@-Ahmed8592]

Aquinas's logic: Heaven (the place of eternal reward and pleasure) has pleasure in it therefore Islam is false - 🤡

[@TravelBandit]

Mans had double digit IQ probably 😂

[@-Ahmed8592]

@Johan S I think that's the case for many religions beside Islam, Christian Jews and Hindu discard their scripture all the time

[@CatholicThoughts]

One could amend that argument and say having tons of sex doesn't make people on earth fully happy, therefore why would that make anyone fully satisfied in heaven? That the Messenger of Allah (ﷺ) said: "There are six things with Allah for the martyr. He is forgiven with the first flow of blood (he suffers), he is shown his place in Paradise, he is protected from punishment in the grave, secured from the greatest terror, the crown of dignity is placed upon his head - and its gems are better than the world and what is in it - he is married to seventy two wives along Al-Huril-'Ayn of Paradise, and he may intercede for seventy of his close relatives." [Abu 'Eisa said:] This Hadith is Hasan Sahih.

[@enlightenedvagabond3556]

You don't understand his arguments. He is talking about EARTLY pleasures, not celestial which are by definition ineffable. Muslims love to embarrass themselves with their entry level theology.

[@enlightenedvagabond3556]

@@-Ahmed8592 please stop betraying your own immense ignorance

[@20dumpling]

To constantly give us great content like this almost makes us feel like spoiled kids. Nevertheless, thank you as always!

[@abdoessam8634]

may allah bless you and your work

[@fidelcatsro6948]

ameen

[@jehdmahdi5959]

At 50:40 translation should be: "Never did I say to them aught except what You (Allaah) did command me to say: 'Worship Allaah, my Lord and your Lord.' And I was a witness over them while I dwelt amongst them, but when YOU TOOK ME UP (فلما توفيتني) (not Took my Soul), You were the Watcher over them, and You are a Witness to all things. (This is a great admonition and warning to the Christians of the whole world). [Muhsin Khan & Hilali]

[@zealousideal]

Ohhhhh can’t wait to watch this one. We use to study and follow St John of Damascus as Orthodox to refute Islam. He was a early catholic/orthodox saint that was an apologist to Islam. Now as a Muslim, I’m curious to hear the Muslim side on refuting John. Allahu Akbar!

[@awake3083]

What made you convert?

[@timeread3099]

May Allah keep you steadfast. Unfortunately Juhal of Damascus was lying to Christians this whole time...

[@RD-sq3kw]

Absolutely loved this topic, i just read about it a few days ago, may Allah curse the people in the pitts of jahannam

[@khoyrulislam]

I see Bassam and I click 'like'

[@BloggingTheology]

👏

[@fidelcatsro6948]

Takbeer!

[@stevenv6463]

Wow, I knew about John of Damascus and what he wrote but I had never heard of Thomas Aquinas' writings on Islam.

[@detectiveandspynovels7140]

Absolutely Beautiful Video , 🌹🏏✅🌈🥀☄️🔦

[@Solemn_G]

Excellent presentation. Hopefully Christians will be honest in their study of Islam instead of regurgitating the strawman arguments of ignorant men.

[@abdallahelhilo4638]

Al-Salamu Alaykum brother Paul, firstly, I truly appreciate the work that you do! Secondly, given that there is so much chaos and distractions going on in today's climate whether it be in the US, the Uk, or anywhere else in the world, how does one remain optimistic and not worry about the prospects of the future? There are so many videos of people whether religious or not attacking theological doctrines and ways of life and I personally do not see any humility or respect in the way in which such actions are conducted. What is your advice and or way of going about living in an atmosphere in which such hurtful and disheartening things are taking place?

[@BloggingTheology]

Wa alaykumu s-salam Abdallah. That's a huge question!

[@saranpatel1114]

Be patient, be a good muslim and hold on to the rope of Allah swt (Holy Quran) if you don't have the ability to influence the world. It doesn't make much difference if u or if u dont worry abt these things on which u don't have a control over

[@aysseralwan]

30:00 so the Christian dawah was always trying to insult Islam and not preach their own theology like today🤣

[@dilut222]

Thanks!

[@BloggingTheology]

Many thanks Lavon!

[@AdithiaKusno]

What's the name of KZbin channel referred here that using John of Damascus and Thomas of Aquinas?

[@hoopoe9629]

How Islam transcends the Othering process is interesting…. You mentioned Rwanda and I’m also wondering how that worked in South Africa under apartheid ?

[@_f_]

As Salamu aleikum!

[@MrSongib]

Just some suggestion, put the Host on the left and the guesses on the right.

[@Noraiz2822]

Wa Alaikum As-Salam Wa Rahmatullahi Wa Barakatu

[@lubna.candid]

❤️❤️❤️

[@SALAM-rj8dk]

Nice

[@alberxenos]

Assalamu’alaikum warahmatullahi wabarakatuh السَّلاَمُ عَلَيْكُمْ وَرَحْمَةُ اللهِ وَبَرَكَاتُهُ

[@fidelcatsro6948]

Wasalam amigo!

[@temporarybackup5077]

1:05:21 ✔️

[@jamessheffield4173]

Glad you admit the earliest writer on Islam, describes it as different than later Islam.

[@timeread3099]

He was liar not a writer of islam lol

[@jamessheffield4173]

@@timeread3099 He is a saint.

[@timeread3099]

​@@jamessheffield4173 I saint that loves to lie, says alot about christianity.

[@respectthemanthatchangesfo760]

Wow

[@bobjohnyy8700]

Can you debate about this?

[@abuakmal9618]

9:38 the kings in nusantara became muslim and the subjects followed.

[@RayOfHope8]

❤️❤️❤️🌹🌹🌹

[@fidelcatsro6948]

my cat loves u too!!

[@laylaali5977]

I am not surprised many Christians both in the past and present misrepresent the Quran

[@badrudduza4756]

All of mankind unable to create any single seed or any single mosquito Including scientists and jins?

[@aslamhawa1]

Please Dr Osman. Can you slow down as you speak too fast and in the process losing what is being said.

[@eszeezee6967]

You can slow down the playback speed to your preference.

[@aticqhalim3949]

🕋🏁🏁🏁

[@hassanmirza2392]

John of Damascus was probably the last Church Father, and Thomas Aquinas was Doctor of Church.

[@sultanbin2170]

Quran Chp 3 Verse 36: But when she [woman of Imran] delivered her, she said, "My Lord, I have delivered a female." And Allah was most knowing of what she delivered, "And the male is not like the female. And I have named her Mary, and I seek refuge for her in You and [for] her descendants from Satan, the expelled [from the mercy of Allah]." Quran Chp 3 Verse 37: So [considering these pleas] her Lord accepted her [Mary] with good acceptance and caused her [Mary] to grow in a good manner [from female-to-male-to-female, in response to the first plea] and put her [Mary] in the care of Zechariah [in response to the second plea]. Every time Zechariah entered upon her in the prayer chamber, he found with her provision [heavenly food causing her gender to alter and settle]. He said, "O Mary, from where is this [coming] to you?" She said, "It is from Allah. Indeed, Allah provides for whom He wills without account." You should start from here, Mary was both the biological father and mother of jesus.

[@JamesRichardWiley]

Islam is a man made belief system which began with a 40 year old merchant in a cave who dreamed an angel visited him with a message from a god. He and his followers spread the faith through a series of conquests throughout Arabia.

[@fidelcatsro6948]

naaaaahh Islam is the restoration sent to correct the Christians who had strayed into worshipping the Prophet instead of the Creator!

[@user-lj9zq4dr5t]

@@fidelcatsro6948 no

[@samdavid7272]

HOPE FOR THE NATIONS Genesis 1:21,26 Everything God created on this earth was good. No death, No killings, No Sickness, No Diseases, No Rape Genesis 2:16 God Commanded the First man not to eat a particular fruit Genesis 3:6 Man disobeyed God.... Sickness, disease, and death entered into this world, and Man began to suffer. Isaiah 53:4-12 God promised to send his WORD to deliver us from, Sin, Sickness, and Disease. Matthew 8:17 The promise was fulfilled in Christ Jesus. All you have to do to be healed from your depression, sickness, diseases, fears is to call upon the name of the Messiah Christ Jesus and you will be saved from all your depression, sickness, and disease. PEACE OF GOD UPON YOU. Acts 4:10-12, Matthew 7:7-10 (Ask and God shall give you) GOD LOVES ALL MANKIND

[@vawor4471]

Why then do christians commit suicide? Anyway, Islam teaches that Adam asked for Allah's forgiveness and Allah forgave him.

[@AbbaJifarTube]

God and Jesus Christ commanded their prophet to do the following things: 1samuel 15:3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy[a] all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys

[@AbbaJifarTube]

How Jesus is commanding killing of children Revelation 2.22 (KJV) 22Behold, I will cast her into a bed, andm them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. Revelation 2.23 (KJV) 23And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

[@nasserfirelordarts6574]

Do you have the Holy Spirit?

[@allo5170]

​@@vawor4471 Adam was forgiven?? Yet according to Muhammed he was thrown down to Earth to Come and suffer?? Even Muhammed said his Allah was the one that made Adam sin, go study the Hadith

[@B-Mike]

This is my favorite channel but today I had to stop listening to the guest by his rapid fire presentation. Very hard to follow his very rapid speech.

[@stephenconnolly1830]

Haven't you heard of CC - closed captions?! Easily engaged via the appropriate toggle.

[@Kimeikus]

Meanwhile I’m watching at 2x speed 😂

[@MotuBiral]

@@Kimeikus get off of the adderall bruh 😅

[@ranro7371]

Why didn't Paul conduct this? He has more background

[@ranro7371]

Paul should have done this

[@terrorbellidecuspacis]

If I give these two dudes any of St. Thomas Aquinas books for them to read they will drop dead at the page three. Very very incompetent “analysis”, truly laughable! Plus this power point presentation level makes me remember of my high school days when I was trying to tackle some serious subjects without really caring about knowing them but just to fool the audience. But this is the general “method” around here isn’t? You need to create a caricature of some subject and punch the caricature and pretend that you’re refuting the subject. Very nice! 👏

[@esponka]

these guys never got to their point lol

[@jordantsak7683]

Dear islamic, Islam is a religion of the Law, based on human logic and forgetting that human logic is sinful, fallen, man-centered (I believe, I fulfil the law, I save my self corresponding to divine will). Christianity is a religion of the law/gospel distinction, a religion of the gospel, of grace, of Jesus, the incarnated God, the second person of the divine trinity, the savior, the liberator. Faith to Jesus as Lord is a work of the Holy Spirit, third person of the divine trinity. No one can come to Jesus if God does not cover him/her with His blood. So, it is futile to attack christianity with videos like this, off theology. Damascenus and Aquinas were humans, with errors and mistakes. So what? If we want to conclude what the christian message is (by grace salvation, in Jesus, without works, assurance of salvation) and what the islamic message is (we are alone in front of the divine majesty and perfection, respond to it with you faith and deeds and prove you are able and willing to be saved, NON assurance of salvation ever) we have to do ONLY theological discussions, not things like this video. Islamic people also have a mistaken view of christianity's message, a manipulated view of christians and a self-rightousness that is over the limit, pride and hypocrisy.

[@AbbaJifarTube]

Revelation 2.23 (KJV) 23And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

[@zak992]

We dont have mistaken view of christian theology as you claim, the central thesis of christianity goes against what ALL the prophets of God have taught. To us muslims as well as jews claiming God came down as a man to be crucified in order to redeem a fallen mankind is something illogical and contrary to what the old testament as well as the Quran teaches. Christian thelogy is very convoluted and not easy to understand once you really examine it, it was given its current shape by the early church fathers and it is this aspect of christianity that is so off putting to your average muslim as well as your average jew.

[@HypostaticFridge]

"Islam is a religion of law based on human logic" That is enough to tell me to not bother with your low IQ comment. Islam is a religion with law yes, unlike Christianity's secularism. Islam's law is divine law revealed by God directly and through the last Prophet. It is not arbitrarily made by humans, as in the case of Christians for most of their history simply just modifying already existing Roman pagan law into a Christian context after Constantine. The Israelites had Torah, Islam has Sharia.

[@fadiljelin7297]

You grossly misrepresent both Christian and Islamic views of salvation. Not all Christians believe in salvation by grace only (Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, etc.). And in the Hadith and Quran there one can find the concept of“salvation by grace”. There is a famous hadith where Muhammad smiles and his followers ask him why are you smiling? Then Muhammed said that Angel Gabriel just told him that anyone who believes in Allah and his prophet, they will be forgiven and enter the heaven. Muhammed said I would announce this loudly and publicly but I am afraid that Muslims might decrease their striving to do good works. And there are other hadiths about salvation by grace only. So Christianity (protestant - because other churches do not teach this) does not have monopoly on salvation by grace or faith. That is false. In fact that concept was present in Islam before it was developed by the protestants in Christianity, they might have in fact been influenced by Muslim theology as they were influenced by islamic philosophers which is well attested..

[@stephenconnolly1830]

WRONG - most of the Qur'an is concerned with morals and ethics NOT law.