Missing 411: Bobby Bizup | The Camp St. Malo Mystery

[@VerilyViscous]

So a deaf boy, that was difficult to understand through verbal communication, was around several child abusers and then disappeared. I can't prove that it was foul play, but it certainly looks like that to me.

[@FootbaFan-pr8sl]

Exactly my thought like a bunch of wanna be priests around little boys just sounds like a bad idea. Also Catholic specifically. Like I can’t prove shit but it’s just mad fucking sus considering everything

[@cx2900]

@@FootbaFan-pr8sl priests can only be catholic lol. kids left around a bunch of public school teachers would be in just as much danger, positions of trust and authority over children always attract these subhumans

[@grimtheghastly8878]

So a part of my training for the summer camp and afterschool program I work for has us do mandated reporter training and the fact that Bobby was specifically described as seeming hurt and embarrassed sounds like the poor boy had just been abused by someone at the camp. As other commenters have described, feelings of shame and guilt are common signs that a child is being sexually abused

[@WardahTheBlaqQ]

Kinda does, for sure.

[@CristyB66]

Stop this bullshit. Only a few were/are child abusers in there. LIke in every other church, especially in the US.

[@larryvonkrukenfeld2075]

I got such a feeling of dread when you said that all the witnesses agreed Bobby seemed upset, angry and embarrassed. Clearly one of the counsellors did something terrible to him. It seems that maybe he deliberately hid in the mountains and evaded the search teams because dying from exposure seemed like a better option than being abused again or having to face telling somebody what happened. Poor little kid

[@vict4451]

The truly sad part is that if the little one had made it out of there alive and told his story, there is a damn good possibility that no one would have believed him. Hear about it all the time, from that era all the way through today. Too make it worse is his disabilities would have been used against him in a heartbeat as a "well, he's not ALL there so he is making it up" excuse.

[@Lizzyjaeger]

Agreed

[@darth_kal-el]

He was murdered. He didn’t just run off.

[@maryellenblount6376]

​@@vict4451 My thoughts exactly! No one would have believed him. Back then people always believed a priest or authority figure in the church cause the opinion was they could do no wrong. Sickening!

[@vict4451]

@@maryellenblount6376 back then? Try today. A man of the cloth always gets the benefit of the doubt.

[@foxxmulder3564]

Sometimes, as Robert E Keller said, “The real monsters are humans without conscience...”

[@learning2live78]

💯👍🏻

[@bethwasserman2882]

Thats the definition of a pychopath or sociopath.

[@donh101]

You are correct sir!

[@samp4184]

Just commenting to say that I appreciate the X Files reference

[@Johnny2Bag]

Yuuuuup

[@olivialeal6031]

It sounds like he was molested or was almost molested and they chased after him and silenced him. It’s so heartbreaking to know you trust your child with adults and to find out you trusted them with monsters. Poor Bobby. I hope his little soul is at rest.

[@dannykimzey39]

Did you really say " they chased after him and SILENCED him"? I mean...hmmmm... am I the only one who caught that? 😉🤭 But ya no, good theory.... I think you are on to something for sure. 👍

[@markp4967]

Yeah, yeah THAT'S what happened🙄 Natives killed him

[@agencymenace1090]

​@@markp4967 Why would natives kill a child????

[@Trashcan27]

@@markp4967 racist much? Where are these “natives”? No. An admitted pedophile killed him

[@deborahklein6774]

It is an interesting theory and possible, but I didn't get any part of the story where they might have chased after him and killed him. They may have, but I just didn't see that in the story.

[@joshuapatrick682]

Honestly aliens or Bigfoot would have been less depressing than institutional abuse of children….

[@Luka-vw5hp]

@frankfkling304 honey you’re a victim?? And yeah, there’s more than one case of institutional abuse. It’s kinda why people don’t trust the church. Maybe go to therapy before you go off about social media about the abuse you’ve been through and how it wasn’t a big deal because it was and you’re in denial. That’s not healthy.

[@Graceclaw]

@Frank F Kling sounds like you have a lot of therapy to go through

[@vampsarecool]

Bruh the priest literally gave away Bobby's skull 💀 he was definitely killed or covered up by the church

[@houstonbigfooter]

A Bigfoot took him.this is a old story in the bf community.

[@brotherkhrayn3525]

@Frank F Kling bruh, one of the priests IN THIS CASE ALONE had 70 VICTIMS. 70. INDIVIDUAL. CASES. OF. CHILD ABUSE.

[@mollymolly8882]

As a veteran camp counselor (10+ summers, many camps) I totally understand you get weird trinkets and things from your summers like friendship bracelets, buttons, a poorly made dream catcher, or just a random craft project a camper gives you but HELLO A GOD DAMN SKULL OF A CHILD as a camp keep sake?! There’s something suuuper messed up here- I think the abuse and coverup is the most logical event to Bobby’s disappearance. I feel so bad for Bobby’s family.

[@judibiggerstaff8054]

I would think they have died if they were adults on the fifties.

[@petrmaly9087]

I assume several of the camp employees murdered him so he couldn't tell the parent about sexual abuse and hid his remains in the building. Next year the leader carried the bones up the mountain, but kept the skull so in case this is investigated as a murder, he can plant it in or near a home of some of the people who were there and shift the blame for a murder to that person and away from him.

[@letsdothis9063]

Yeah, that's crazy. It's weird that you hear about all of these religious camps being associated with abuse. (Just weird to me) I don't have a ton of experience, but I did go to Episcopal summer camp for two years, and nothing like that ever happened. I feel like an abusive councilor would have been called out pretty quickly. IDK, it obviously happens. That's pretty sad.

[@Victoria-mg5bt]

And him being their only child with hearing challenges, his death was so final for them, no-one else to be strong for. I believe what goes around comes around and that the man responsible for bobbies murder and horror bestowed on bobbies loved ones has or is having his comeback😢

[@davidmende4438]

So the Dr. never heard of the camp boy? He held on to a child's skull w/o calling police? The camp director has a child's skull? WTF??!?! Was it Bobby's skull? Very busy vid. Mostly heresay. Wtf do the Indians have to do with it? D-. Try harder next vid.

[@angieemm]

I think all 3 seminarians were involved in the coverup of abuse, specifically of Bobby, and that's how his body got where it was: because they all helped. They took his skull and I'm betting when accusations began flying, they knew they couldn't keep it and they didn't trust each other, so it was given to the doctor. A doctor with a skull wouldn't raise too many eyebrows, and the priest would still know his trophy was out there. So incredibly sick.

[@mirandagoldstine8548]

Agreed.

[@goosegirl941]

If I had to guess I’d say they kept the skull for occult purposes. That poor boy :(

[@emilywalker3352]

The entire camp organization and the Catholic church are covering it up *allegedly*

[@archangel5627]

@@goosegirl941 I completely agree with you. I wouldn’t be surprised that in addition to the physical sexual abuse, that some of these priests, camp officials, and workers, were in fact practicing occultic rituals which of course involves young boys. Whatever the case might’ve been, one thing is for sure that the camp officials were doing Terrible things to some of the children there and were covering up their tracks. Let’s be real, this isn’t the first time we’ve heard this type of thing from the Catholic Church/ community.

[@mikemurphy5898]

Idk if it was all 3 or one at this particular time, or what, but my guess would be Bobby ended up in the trunk of one of their cars, then they probably took him back to where they lived knowing it would be the last place someone would ever look until the heat died down and then moved him over the winter. I, obviously, could be wrong, but the part about the skull is extremely disturbing to me. I pray in wrong.

[@lexinicole4317]

Damn, this is just a depressing one. A deaf child who was clearly abused who died as a result whose abusers never helped his family find peace and none of which were held responsible for their crime.

[@rafaelcineasta]

The years where people did whatever they want and nothing happens, those years were full of innocence but sadly a lot of damned wolves out there.

[@kingvinoda3896]

Never trust a camp that doesn't let parents or guardians be around their kids.

[@totower9597]

10:40 No amount of water is too little to drown in. Where I live 100% of child drownings are unsupervised and many happen in under a foot of water and as little as an inch. 75% are in lakes and rivers. Also drowning incidents across all ages are still majority male at about 80%

[@Matt-xc6sp]

Never trust a camp for young boys run by Catholic priests

[@brandyparks7531]

​@@totower9597 Yes, but if a 10 year old drowns in a foot of water, the body will be easy to find. Also, if a 10 year old, not a baby or toddler, drowns in a very shallow body of water, something else happened. Either they slipped and hit their head, someone held them under the water, or some very unusual accident.

[@lilyw.719]

​@@brandyparks7531 The kid probably either slipped or just had a seizure. Neither of those seems unlikely to me.

[@totower9597]

@@brandyparks7531 I'm not claiming this is how he died, I don't believe he drowned but I'm skeptical of anyone who would easily write off any source of water. I know first hand how difficult it is to find someone even if you knew they were in the water and the area.

[@SxTxferlife]

One of the few videos I had to stop. Abuse hits too close to home for me at the moment, I'm barely getting sober for the first time as a 30 year old man and all the numbed feelings are coming back waaaaay too hard Edit:thank you all for the kind words, I can't tell you how seriously helpful they were to me. I don't have any friends, the ones I did have either OD'd or are still using and anytime I had a seriously down day, like magic I'd get a notification from YT of one of you guys saying kind words. I feel like I've finally cleared the hump of pain and now I can be a true father to my son and be a good son for my mother. Seriously, I don't know any of you guys but you've helped me in ways that words truly can't describe. Thank you.

[@Hoppy828]

You're not alone. Hang in there.

[@CraftyVegan]

That you’re able to recognise your limits shows that you’re healing. Be safe.

[@liadown9052]

One day at a time. I hope you have a good group of people to help guide and support you. You're worth the effort ❤

[@lexinicole4317]

Congrats on your sobriety. It isn’t easy, but it does get easier.

[@douggaudiosi14]

You'll do fine buddy. Keep your head up. Sobriety is a journey not a race

[@TAKAT0NIC]

The theory of Bobby not wanting to be found certainly has different implications if he was assaulted before running away. It makes sense to me if that was the case why he’d try to avoid capture, imagine being attacked, escaping and then a bunch of the attacker’s friends start searching for you. I know there is no way in hell I’d would want to hand myself over to a bunch of monsters or want to go back to the camp! I personally don’t think it was murder because why go to that trouble? The sad reality is sexual assault survivors have a hard time getting people to believe them now let alone in the 50s even if he did try to tell someone, nothing would likely come of it and that’s assuming he would even tell someone at all. It’s also an awful reality that lots of victims don’t tell anyone because of the embarrassment and stigma surrounding assault. My guess is the poor kid succumbed to exposure while hiding in the mountains. In regards to the skull being kept, I believe it was a poor attempt by Richard to keep the remains the seminaries found from being identified without really understanding how remains were identified. It’s possible he thought that the dental records were the only way and also, if you recall, Bobby had lost several baby teeth on the trip and had sent a letter to his parents about it so he may have thought that would be the biggest give away. Rest easy Bobby, you deserved better.

[@touchstoneaf]

100% Especially as a boy raised to revere people who are or training to become priests, the feeling of betrayal and the sheer terror that would engender, the feeling of not being safe with people who are supposed to be the safest people on Earth would really mess up his head. No doubt he would have been terrified and horrified and wouldn't have been able to bring himself to return, and the fact that he might rather have expired on that mountainside of starvation and exposure than go back to place where he had been so betrayed is very depressing to think of. Especially if he could see the camp the entire time and was just too scared to come back.

[@ashleyelizabeth2738]

i honestly feel like he might've been assaulted and tried to find help? and they just ended up doing it all together possibly? where as he ran on and they probably went out to find him this how everything was messed up and in weird places

[@carmenortiz5294]

Not murder and how did the guy end up with the skull, to give it to someone else many years later? I can't even imagine what that poor child went through during the last hours of his life.

[@suze-323]

Bobby was a perfect victim. Until it was time to go back to hid parents there was no way for anyone to even understand his accusations. Maybe he did not even die until much later, if his abusers kept him and they just moved his body to the location much later. Maybe the removed skull was a poor attempt to conceal the identity or a trophy kept by the abuser. Since known sexual abusers are involved it is probably clear what happened to that poor boy. In a way Bobby got his wish. He would never leave the camp.

[@elaineproffitt1032]

That poor kid. I can't say what I would do here. Only solace is that they will answer to God!

[@upwards11]

I was living in Texas when the sexual abuse was uncovered. We were Catholic at the time and the catholic schools in town had children pulled from them. The saddest thing about all this was that the Catholic Church KNEW it was happening and the priests were just sent to a different church or different dioceses out of the area. So many parents were mad and wanted justice but it was years later that something (tho not much) was done. We knew a young priest that was transferred, and I had friends that left the catholic boys high school and they knew what was happening. I feel for this boys parents and family members. To know your child was possibly killed by a monster is horrible.

[@AbsurdScandal]

Are you talking about the 2018 abuse-of-seminarians revelations, or the 2019 local Colorado school revelations? Was the school-pulling a reaction to the 2019 Colorado stuff or the wider 2018 scandal?

[@upwards11]

@@AbsurdScandal things started happening about this and a lot of stuff came out locally in 1968. At that time the catholic high-schools lost students over it. Things didn't become known nationally about what happened in the schools until much later. Boys came out out and told what had happened to them. I don't remember the year it all came to a head but that was when the cc was made to acknowledge what happened. There has always been some kind of scandal in the church. If you research it you will find that complaints started a long time ago. But it only became public later.

[@bobalky3638]

More frightening is the fact that statistical research has shown that the Catholic Church has no greater rates of molestation than any other religion or denomination in the U.S. The public school system's abuse rate is supposed to be 100X worse than the Catholic problem. That doesn't even count how many kids are abused by their own family members. The numbers must be horrendous.

[@jos1062]

Abuse of children is still happening all around us. Lots of sick and strange folks out there who get away with this kind of stuff. Sad story.

[@capitalisa]

And yet people continue to give billions of dollars in tithes to the church. Literally financing pedophiles. And people have the nerve to ask why I'm not a Christian. Guess it's because I have morals, ethics and a conscience.

[@shiwarlock]

Bobby ran out of the lodge after possibly being assaulted, is possibly chased or confronted later, maybe Bobby states he is going to turn perp in or something, is murdered to cover up the assault(Or fight happens and Bobby was unintentionally killed, is pushed, falls and hits head... unknown really). You said a few counselors stayed after the camp closed to "wait to see if Bobby showed back up" correct? That would be a perfect time to dispose of the body.

[@Balrog-tf3bg]

Sounds like a solid Catholic response

[@brandonciotti6014]

@Balrog 1999 I don't understand. Could you explain what you are implying?

[@XDrZaneX]

@@brandonciotti6014 The Catholic church covers for their monsters. Hiding the murder of an assaulted little boy tracks as something they would do.

[@mirandagoldstine8548]

@@brandonciotti6014 The Catholic Church has a bit of a history covering up child sex scandals so that’s what Balrog 1999 is implying.

[@thurayya8905]

​@@mirandagoldstine8548 Let balrog speak for himself.

[@gnostic268]

Appreciate that you talked about the background of the Native tribes who originally lived on the Colorado area. Poor Bobby. May he rest in peace. I have a hearing impaired grandson and this is one of my deepest fears because these kids (honestly all kids ) are so vulnerable if adults don't understand how to communicate with them or the adults around them aren't trustworthy.

[@steveescher1554]

But his story explains how they aren't really "natives". They were changing locations and conquering land from each other.

[@penispensar9071]

@@steveescher1554shut up, dude.

[@joseph8468]

This viewer concurs. The information you presented about the Native tribes was quite interesting. Thank you.

[@honeycrispsnail4032]

@@steveescher1554 still natives of america, goofy.

[@nervosadustbolt9642]

It's not really all that pertinent to the case. It just seems like virtual signaling & pandering to me.

[@KerylRaist]

As soon as you said his parents were trying to make it clear that Bobby wouldn't be in trouble if he came home, I started to wonder if this was an abuse case. Back in the day, a lot of kids in that sort of situation would think it was their fault, or they had done something wrong.

[@nicwelch]

Abuse is still rampant to this day! Most states allow for children to be punished by hitting them! What child wouldn’t run away from that?

[@FootbaFan-pr8sl]

Never trust a camp ran by Catholic priests in the 60s

[@rossington1680]

I don’t think they mean that type of abuse.😬 The catholic church has a history….

[@hitmandahl]

Uhm.. This is still the reality.. If not even worse these days..

[@_HimToo]

I'm thinking they probably meant that he wouldn't be in trouble for 'running away'.

[@fotty96]

I have no doubt in my mind that someone who was supposed to be caring for him is responsible for his death. No kid walks into the mountains cause they're upset. Poor sweet boy didn't deserve to die in a place he was supposed to be safe. RIP Bobby.

[@camimons470]

I worked as a therapist with sexually abused children for years. My staff and I began to wonder how common it was for predators to murder their victims to prevent the children from telling about the abuse. These perpetrators have very little regard for children . They are only thinking about their own desires.

[@lindboknifeandtool]

Thanks for doing that. It’d destroy me.

[@stephaniesanderson6190]

And I bet they come in all flavors,colors,and Religion!!!

[@garmmermibe5397]

It's generally not very common except in certain scenarios. (Like this one where there's more reason for someone to die inexplicably.) Killing the kid generally causes way more problems than just telling them to be quiet, even if they don't stay quiet. They might've been able to do this here because they're out in the forest with wild animals outside camp and for the most part, the only immediate power they'd answer to is themselves, not parents, police, or just people walking down the street to get to work. But doing this in a city, where the majority of child abuse takes place just based of raw population density, it's much more difficult to pull off killing them and coming up with a believable cover story and making sure no one sees you. It can be done, but it's much harder. Killing the kid is almost a guarantee that parents and students at school are going to notice someone missing whereas telling them to be quiet means the kids goes home and if they don't tell anyone, for the most part, no one is any wiser. Or, if they are, they may not pry. They may notice a change in someone's behavior, but if the kid doesn't tell anyone, not much can be done. Also important to remember that, despite the priest stereotype, public school teachers are actually the number one non-familial abusers of children by a country mile. Another situation where it's less punishing to tell them to shut up (even if they dont) than it is to kill them. Even if you get caught, you'll likely get a lighter prison sentence, though I've even seen some get deferred sentences so they don't even end up with any time. They just get probation and move to another school district. But that's not the case when you're going around killing people. "PDFs" are also usually among the least violent demographic of major criminals outside of the actual seggs crime. They're less likely to shoot people, get in bar fights, steal, and are many times not aggressive compared to someone like a non "PDF" wife beater or someone who regularly gets into bar fights and such. Granted, there are plenty of PDFs who do engage in these things. But there's also a lot who don't, which is why the numbers even out. So while it's ture they may not have much regard for children, that doesn't mean they're just going to kill them because it brings a lot more attention to the kid and consequently, the person who did the thing to the kid.

[@emmabesleeping]

I was in Civil Air Patrol my freshman year of high school. It’s wild hearing that name again, I feel like so few people know it exists. This is such a sad case and I hope Bobby is at peace. Excellent video as always.

[@brysonsfolly]

I am here because of Pop Culture Crisis. You were a wonderful guest! I am going to try and watch as many videos as I can tonight. Much love brother and keep doing what you are doing!

[@TheLoreLodge]

Thank you!

[@stauker.1960]

​@@TheLoreLodge no, thank you. These are great, and some videos really challenge preconceived notions

[@Hecker9974]

@@TheLoreLodge I love your videos Mr Mattis, keep it up! do what you like and screw the algorithm, if I ever get the chance I'd 100% subscribe to your patreon, you'll see me there one day!

[@pablowentscobar]

"Son, I'd like to give you something. A F*CKING HUMAN SKULL." "Thanks dad."

[@nikelaloca8037]

Right? And a CHILDS skull at that!

[@johnellisonarmadilloconstr7966]

Yeah thanks dad and I can’t remember exactly what he said about it. I think you would remember every single word for the rest of your life

[@beastshawnee]

I would have been thinking it was an ancient skull- because being raised on archeology and anthropology I was used to seeing skulls. Even now I’f probably pick one up and introduce myself before going “aw sh;#! I gotta call cops!”

[@CowboyCountry]

Ok so this one is pretty close to home for me, both figuratively and literally. My parents both used to work at the Lane Guest Ranch, literally down the road from St Malo. They got married at the St. Catherine's Chapel, which is (I believe) on the same property. This is an incredibly remote part of the state, where the only things you'll likely see are deer, elk, and maybe a bear (save for the weird mountain folk, it's a long story). This area is not at all a place I would explore alone, even as an experienced outdoorsman. Thanks for telling another Colorado story, people don't talk about our history much!

[@TheLoreLodge]

Hang on...I wanna know the weird mountain folk story...

[@CowboyCountry]

@@TheLoreLodge I can't confirm any of this information because it happened back in the 60s, but here goes. So I worked on a ranch owned by some old guy who had been in the area for ages. One place he worked went all the way up to the continental divide. He was riding his horse up there, just checking fence, and came across a large unoccupied campsite. He thought it was weird, but kept going. A few weeks later he's riding through again and this time there's signs of people around. This is private property, very far from the road, so he goes and tells the boss. They gather up a few people to get these people out of there, and when they arrive theres like 25 "dirty f***ing hippies." Many are high out of their minds, but the ones that aren't are incredibly confrontational Here's the part I'm most suspicious of. He claimed that they were wearing necklaces with human bones and teeth. The cowboys had guns, so they ran the hippies out, some by force. So that's that story. Also there are some people who just want to live in the mountains, no big deal. But some of them are really weird. A friend of mine has a neighbor who comes out of his trailer every night to just scream. All in all, weird stuff.

[@TheLoreLodge]

@@CowboyCountry very weird. This was in the same general area as St. Mail?

[@CowboyCountry]

@@TheLoreLodge Yes it is, within around 50 miles to the south in the same (Boulder) county

[@TheLoreLodge]

@@CowboyCountry very interesting, I’ll have to look into any other sightings of the group. Could be just some drugged out people in the woods, could be a cult. Either way, interesting to say the least.

[@dillonyother7733]

So this case is hands down the most at home for me. I was a camper at a nearby camp, Cheley Colorado Camps( which is less than 10 miles away, and owns land almost across the street, and has since the 20's) in 2019 and 2021, going back to be a counselor the past two years, and i'll be working this summer as well. I've passed St. Malo's many times and never knew any of this. my camp has a ton of connections around Estes Park, including our owner being a big seat on the Commerce board for the town, so I'll be asking around this summer if the investigation you mentioned is still going on. Its not easy to just wind up on the side of Meeker, especially for a young boy such as Bobby. If he ran up to where he was found intentionally, he had to be running from something. nights at that time of year are usually around 50-60 at the camp, dipping closer to 40 up near that altitude. I agree that there are many weird things about his story and his death. if he was on the creek when he went missing, he'd basically have to cross camp property and a Highway 7. Amazing work as always, if i can find evidence that the investigation is still going on, I'll try to reach out to you the best I can. EDIT: it appears that Tahosa/ Fawn Creek, Cabin Creek, and a unnamed small waterway combine into Cow Creek, meaning that if they were on the Cow Creek, it would place them around a mile from camp. Source for this info is Gaia GPS, its a source that both my camp and many hikers trust due to its accuracy. hope youre able to see this.

[@jlo7770]

I just randomly searched missing 411 and your videos popped up. While I like and respect what David does I like that you're diving deeper into some of these cases. Keep doing what you're doing

[@hughjunit2503]

This channel wouldn't even know about this case if Dave Paulides hadn't brought them all to light

[@mikemurphy5898]

​@Hugh Junit David paulides doesn't strike me as the type of person who's worried about who gets the credit. I say the more people working on these cases to give these families closure and to make these parks safer, the better. Paulides has done enough work with all of this to make his name synonymous with these stories, but he can't do all the work himself. He'll get the credit he's due, and for him, I don't think it's about the money. Sure, he writes books and makes documentaries, but that's A) to get the word out, and B) he has to fund all this stuff and sustain himself somehow. Let's solve the cases first and worry about the glory for later. Be well my friends.

[@jlo7770]

@@hughjunit2503 I guess you missed the whole bit about news station looking into that camp as they were a bunch of peedos... or does that reporter owe that to David too? Idk why you replied to my message anyway? It was so pointless I didn't address it till another message showed up.

[@carnuatus]

​@@jlo7770 there are a bunch of these people that crop up on these videos. They get very offended when someone talks "411" cases, sometimes even if it's with David's blessing.

[@jlo7770]

@@carnuatus makes sense. And someone debunking his research could offend them. Well all I can say to them types is if David is omitting important facts to make his stories fit a narrative then it makes him seriously questionable as a whole.

[@ajaks7636]

Sick people are everywhere. Those poor kids. RIP Bobby Bizup. Great video!

[@Otis-Tank]

Dear sir. I wanted to thank you for your time and dedication in presenting us these amazing stories.

[@ellalella1]

As to not drowning in the creek, you can drown in extremely shallow water even though it is rare for older children like Bobby but it has happened even with adults sometimes. However, it is true that he should have been found. I think it is high risk he was a victim of something really bad.

[@oof313]

Wouldn't surprise me if the reason he never returned to camp, despite having it in full view, was that he didn't want to go back because he felt unsafe... or _knew_ he was unsafe at camp. Poor kid.

[@dutch1087]

I really appreciated your choice to open the video with a discussion on the history of the tribes whose land the story takes place on! Not just a nod either, but a wonderful look at the context of the larger story. Great work.

[@Natasha___.]

Dude, you are so good at what you do. You managed to untangle all the threads of that event and put them back together in such a concise and organised way. There's so much going on in this story, so that was no easy feat. I highly enjoyed it, can't wait to see what's next!

[@lizperrella666]

I love your examination of these cases. This disappearance eats at me. Its absolutely heart-wrenching that the Bizup family was denied the right to bury their son's complete reamins because of the hubris of 2 men. I was raised catholic and the lies and secrecy of the church is undeniable. Such a sad case

[@blukhat]

This causes more questions than answers. So strange. I am glad you retold this story for all of us to know. I hope his family is at peace, Bobby, too. 🕊️

[@smilingiscontagious5722]

This poor baby. I can’t imagine how his parents felt from him disappearing to all this coming out about the priests. God be with this baby and his family. ❤

[@Balrog-tf3bg]

I really wouldn’t be surprised if one of the priests or seminary’s molested Bobby or tried to and he ran away. Probably scared to go back for that reason, and possibly covered up by the church

[@meg2249]

Especially a disabled one. Disabled children tend to be targeted and more vulnerable.

[@anon2427]

Creepy fan fiction

[@leoross5777]

strangle the kid or spend a decade in prison? easy choice for these monsters. how did the one guy know where to find the body to get the skull? i think he gave it to the killer to remind him of what he'd done. after the killer confessed to him, they were both part of a satanistic coven

[@leoross5777]

there is NO doubt that they were banging the kids. this kid may have been hurt physically by it, and ran for help. which couldnt be allowed. (rectal bleeding, etc) and the seminary guy just squeezed his neck to stop him from screaming . a little too hard. ..its ridiculously easy to kill even when you dont intend to

[@HereticWarlord]

Typical of religious people. Most of them are perverts.

[@eonianomega]

Yea, gonna disagree with you here: The fact that no one was ever even accused of murder is NOT a reason to think murder is unlikely. In fact, it's the explanation that makes the MOST sense. Carrying a recently dead 80lb boy or the remains of a 80lb boy to the site is a small task compared to being discovered as a child-molesting murderer.

[@StarlightCatGaming]

They found his skull in a dead priest basement in 2021. Yeah that screams murder

[@jlo7770]

Not to mention that area was checked multiple times, so he probably wasn't there. Body or remains could have been ditched later on, catholics are all about that repenting and telling your preacher or whatever your sins.... you think the guy killed the kid then "repented" for his sins, then they helped make sure evidence was missing... like the kids skull? I mean if the guy "went fishing" with the kid and did something to him, he could have hid the body easily enough. And lugging a dead 80lb kid up a mountain ain't that hard especially if you're afraid of going to prison for the rest of your life lmfao

[@J.H.Moncrieff-sf4qb]

I hate to say it, but when I saw the 411 documentary that featured this case, the first thing I thought when I heard about the camp was sexual abuse. I was surprised David Paulides didn't even mention the possibility, and now to find that several of the councillors were later accused! Thanks for giving us the background that is conveniently left out of those docs in order to make each case seem more "mysterious."

[@jenhodges92]

The Lore Lodge mentioned in another video that the info about the priests came out after the 411 documentary, so Paulides didn’t have that info, which of course changes everything.

[@mustardsquatchdog]

Well done y'all. Nice it's not all opinion but rather valid, thought out research. Kudos. Keep it up and looking forward to more.

[@virginiaspinelli-buser4420]

I was a girl scout and attended this church services while I attended camp at Allenspark. The chapel has been the same. I was married in 1990 at the chapel as well, and it has been a very special chapel to me most of my life (60 years). I am saddened about this boy's death.

[@dj-kq4fz]

Kudos on the level of research you guys put in to these stories!

[@lydgate3419]

this narrator (Aiden Mattis?) is obviously one of the most intelligent, logical and thorough researchers I have heard. His logic is both incisive and faultless. Glad I found this site. Thanks for your obvious tireless research.

[@Emy53]

Parents cared back in the 50's. My siblings that were born in the mid 50's, were not let out of my parents site, but we were all born in Brooklyn, a different type of wilderness, and children went missing there too.

[@darrelswife]

This case hurts. I have 2 sons, 9 and 12 respectively. I would move heaven and earth to protect them. I'm so saddened for Bobby. 😢

[@jacobault2264]

Amen I couldn't imagine what the family goes through it would be hell on earth

[@the2wheelsnowman]

As a new father, if something ever happened to my daughter like that, I have zero problems goin to jail

[@lcarole3131]

I have no idea how I got here But you present so well that I attentively watched and listened closely to the story. All I can say is that for what it's worth_ there is 1 more person on the planet who is deeply saddened and angered by this boy's tragic end. ☹️😢

[@whitebeardskydaddy6756]

Very well told, Aiden. Poor Bobby. My heart cries out for him.

[@skyekeating349]

I think the most likely scenario is that Neil's candy story is closer to the truth than the fishing story but still leaving some major pieces out. So Neil tells Bobby that he won't sell Bobby candy, but then offers Bobby a different way to get candy. Bobby runs off either when Neil proposes sexual favors for candy or after Neil molests him. It explains why he seemed hurt and embarrassed and why the counselors made up the fishing story. He ran from the camp and didn't go back even though he could see it because he wanted to be as far from the camp as he could be. I think he then probably succumbed to the elements. It is also possible he killed himself after being molested and the camp was covering that up. The stuff with the skull does seem to point to some sort of cover up, because why wouldn't he give it to a friend and not the police, but I think the cover up was about the sex abuse and not murder. The dude took the skull because he was a sick piece of shit and he thought it was cool. He took it as a sort of memento to the time when he covered up the sexual abuse and eventual death of a child because he was into horrible shit.

[@wrangelinhabitant161]

If it really happened so, i wish those f-ng bunch of candies stuck in Neils f-ng ass deep enough to make those beast yelling out loud...

[@mirandagoldstine8548]

I have to agree. It was likely an attempt to not smear the “good name” of the priests. Hrumph. Well it failed in the end because now the stories are coming out and there will be a ton of pressure on those sickos.

[@maryjoyspohrer256]

This is the main reason that the Boy Scouts has a 2 deep leadership rule at all times. Also a Buddy System for campers. You don't go alone and you are not alone at any time. Plus no campers sleep with councilors. Unless they are also the parents. Even then, my boys had a separate tent from mine at camp. At least until they were grown.

[@karanfield4229]

It's absolutely heartbreaking the way this world hurts kids. 💔 new sub from New Zealand.

[@capellamorel]

Bobby would have 100% known the camp well enough to not get lost. I’m basing this off of the fact that when I was 10 I went to a similar camp for only a week and can still remember it well enough to get around. Of course we are completely different people but seriously? 5 weeks? That’s enough time to memorize the layout

[@sourcherry8928]

as someone who is deaf and has been since birth (like bobby), we tend to be VERY observant since we have to rely on visuals and add to the fact that he wasnt able to communicate with others well he probably spent a little time exploring on his own/in the vicinity of others. there is no way Bobby got lost.

[@dee6137]

I've only just discovered this channel, love that you have so much detail and include the speculations as well. Makes for a super interesting listen!

[@erictaylor5462]

I don't find it at all implausible that a healthy grown man could not carry an 80 pound dead body up a mountain. I was on a solo hike once when I encountered another solo hiker who had broken her foot. I piggy backed her about 5 miles back to the parking lot where we could get help for he. She wasn't super heavy, but she was way over 80 pounds, closer to 120 I'd say. It hurt but I did it. You should have seen the look on her face when I took my prosthetic leg off to inspect my sore stump. So if I could carry a 120 pound woman 5 miles out of the woods, I see no reason one of these guys would have trouble carrying an 80 pound boy into the woods.

[@Raidar29]

yeah, not to mention the use of makeshift sleds tied to the waist

[@jasperrocks9967]

I was in boy scouts and went to a place called Camp Alexander. It’s about three hours from St Malo. Rain in the Rockies, especially at that camp, is terrifying. I’m talking the trails turned into creeks terrifying. We had to put logs into the dirt to stop it from being swept away, but that didn’t help

[@JohnnyMichigan313]

Your content, delivery and research is top notch. Glad I found your channel

[@thurayya8905]

Rev. Hiester could have been given the skull as part of a confession by someone he knew. He couldn't reveal to the police who he had gotten it from without breaking the seal of confession and he couldn't keep the skull without explanation, so he gave it to a friend who was a doctor. Back then, it was legal for a doctor to have human bones.

[@lyrehlife9277]

As a priest, he would have given it a funeral, private, just himself - but he would’ve thought it to be required by his religion. As the person guilty, he would want to make sure that his trophy was somewhere. Just a thought.

[@thurayya8905]

@Bee This may be prevalent thought today, but certainly not when the boy went missing.

[@thurayya8905]

@@lyrehlife9277 There is no evidence that the priest molested him and certainly not that he killed him; that is prejudicial on your part. Molesters rarely kill, those are two separate crimes. I think my theory is more balanced.

[@javirodriguez604]

​@Bee-ld6do Catholic priests cannot break the seal of the confession under any circumstances. They face the threat of the excommunication

[@agencymenace1090]

This is why religion is a fucking problem, 10000s of murders covered up because "iT wAs CoNfEsSiOn"

[@SmirkInvestigator]

The research and straight talk is fantastic

[@Eadrax432]

I'm a big fan of the show, just love it. Keep up the great work! But just for clarity, Arizona’s population, now estimated at 7,359,197.

[@kensilva2695]

So much info at different times. How the story changed but yet not changed. The worst part is something happened to Bobby that made him run away. He was hurt. Embarrassed. Angry. Then lost. Lost? Taken away? Whatever happened, Bobby suffered and died. Such a tragedy. But thankful for the investigation of a news channel to bring more info in this boys disappearance. I pray Bobby & his parents are together once again in a place where no harm can come to anyone of them.

[@chrisdooley1184]

I hear sleep-away camp and Catholic Church together and I get very bad vibes. Edit: those seminarians and priests were brutal predators. I had my own run-ins with them in the very early 80’s and it has complicated things in my adult life that’s for sure 😪

[@danjohnson887]

I do appreciate the host not saying away from the very obvious most likely scenario.

[@nottachance8554]

Man that’s an upsetting story

[@mirandagoldstine8548]

I have to agree. I hope his killer is sweating bullets now that his skull has been found if the killer is still alive. And if he is convicted of molestation and murder he better pray that he gets solitary confinement because, as I heard, child abusers, molesters and people who kill kids don’t exactly last long in prison if you get my point. Not to mention the fiery punishment that awaits the killer in the afterlife.

[@snailart14]

Thank you for covering this in a respectable way

[@jonesyjonesy724]

Kids back then would easily learned the area they were camping in and at least some survival knowledge. His skull kept basically as a trophy says a lot.

[@EnigmaShadow03]

Honestly, this is scarier to me than anything in those national parks.

[@emilywalker3352]

This case is heartbreaking.

[@Marnarose4433]

100% agree with you as you were telling the story that is what I envisioned happening!

[@TheeccenteictherapistBellaneph]

When you said "white, " I thought snow and he went up and not down. The discrepancy of whether he was alone or not and then the fact that they were priests or studying to be priests, of course my mind goes to sexual abuse. Then the 3 days that they didn't report the bone seemed like there was some covering going on beforehand. The whole thing actually makes sense, unfortunately.

[@M.DavidRodriguez]

As a former counselor at Camp St. Malo, I remember that cabin creek did run through the property. And to get to 11,000 feet elevation is pretty difficult because there is no real trail. It's a lot of bushwhacking and climbing boulders. I believe Bobby was so terrified and embarrassed that he was truly runny away from camp. RIP, Bobby.

[@cheesecube420]

This is such a good, clear video. Subscribed! That poor boy and those poor kids who were abuse victims.

[@HadassahMcKeen-g5u]

My father went to this camp in the 60 and I attended in the 80 . This story was talked about and it was always that he was fishing and went missing. Sad

[@kidcthulhufortney1320]

Wow, there's so much more information here compared to the glossing given in the Missing: 411 movie.

[@morticialechatnoir6884]

I'm so glad I found your channel! I like this style of true crime narrating, reminds me of Mr Ballen, That Chapter, and Coffeehouse Crime. I'm really enjoying it 😊

[@MrSubejio]

I don't think it's so weird that the disgraced priest would explicitly deny involvement in Bobby's death without being asked; even without the question being raised, I don't think it's unreasonable for him to realize where the suspicions would naturally go, and try to head those off at the pass, ESPECIALLY if in the same interview he openly admitted to molesting other children, which would lead to the thought "Well, did he molest Bobby and then kill him to keep him quiet?"

[@kennethlang5480]

Another Great video by Lore Lodge - please keep up the awesome work.

[@Bebecat477]

Great video. This is a very sad story. The child was abused and killed to silence him, I feel. Another tragedy.

[@zacharysnyder2520]

You have to consider first the counsolrs and priests did the search for him before initially reporting it to the park service. More than enough time for him to flee to the top of the mountain, be caught up by an adult or many adults and silenced before he could break a scandal.

[@barnabasschuler9025]

I impressed by you and your channel. So much talent and fun to watch, clear and well done.

[@maryelecta11787]

this is a sick thought what if during the search for him. the person who he was running from him came across him and shut him up for good but the kid led him on a foot chase and that's why he's where he was found kid didn't go down without a fight

[@mikelapine1]

I didn’t get any further than your description of the camp before I instantly became suspicious of the councilors. I think that says a lot about the differences between the 50s and now.

[@LeL-q9e]

I read about Bobby Bizup awhile back, back when other story tellers were reporting it as a "mysterious" missing411 case. In 2019 the Colorado Attorney General released a report stating that hundreds of children were abused by dozens of priests in the Colorado Diocese for approximately 70 years. And what better place to do this than at a mountain retreat away from the parents.The authorities continue to investigate as more victims come forward. The church knew priests were abusing kids and hid that fact! Recently authorities in Illinois released a report stating that 1,900 kids were abused by priests in that state. There is a pattern here. Have pedophiles have been going into the priesthood in order to gain access to children? Pick a city. All together there have been cases of priests related child abuse in cities involving thousands of kids for decades! And the Catholic Church has hidden these cases. The only narrative we have here is what the adult said. Did an adult silence him for fear of being revealed after abusing him? That's a possibility. Did you mention the investigations by authorities, I must've missed that.

[@TheLoreLodge]

We primarily focused on the journalistic efforts to cover this specific case, but we did mention that the whole thing was blown open by the discovery of the abuse in 2019.

[@wisecoconut5]

Wow! I grew up in Estes Park just a few miles away. I have never heard of this case before! It is one of the most beautiful places in Colorado. I never suspected it held such deep secrets. It is a very rugged area.

[@BritLuttrell]

Theory, the father offered him candy after telling him no, for something inappropriate, which made Bobby embarrassed and hurt and ran off. And I think he took the skull as a trophy or similar.

[@outlawandoutdoorstv9901]

Exactly what I think. If a boy goes missing around Catholics you can almost bet the farm one of the priest tried some pedophile BS and wen Bobby said no and I'll tell you can fill in the blanks.

[@helicopterman8544]

I was thinking that.

[@LQOTW]

Let's be clear, though. It was Fr. Hewitt that reported he said no to Bobby for candy. It was Fr. Heister who had the skull.

[@Hawkeye83627]

​@@LQOTW Let's be real, both of them were probably in on it

[@tinataylor3758]

Maybe, but giving the skull away is so strange. I don't know why he didn't hide it. What's even more strange is his friend keeping it and giving it to his son. Can you imagine someone giving you a human skull and not going to the police with it? I can't.

[@WillRoan]

Man. Another great episode. You put in the work. Thanks!

[@goosegirl941]

I was a ranch kid in the 80s and my younger cousins and I would be gone all day climbing the mountains, exploring creeks, playing in the barns… it wasn’t that long ago that kids were allowed to be feral lol

[@sarahoshea9603]

And we gathered in groups much larger than 3! Now if you get 5 of ur buddies to come play the police are obligated to come question everyone; no wonder they sit in basements and grow angrier and angrier till they turn into a mass murderer

[@agencymenace1090]

Nice boomer tangent.

[@gingw7333]

@@agencymenace1090 Not a boomer if a young child in the 80s.

[@larryvonkrukenfeld2075]

The video is about a kid getting molested and dying and you’re just like “I used to DRINK from the HOSE”

[@MarvinHartmann452]

Your video are quite good. You're one of the rare true crimes/mysteries channels that shows theirs face and do the narration on screen.

[@cjcwalker1]

My question is, if all of this happened so close to camp (the stuff with the priests and the boy) where did they hide the body so well that even the blood hounds couldn't find the sent. It was mentioned that they could get a sent to the fishing spot, but not the boy INSIDE the building?

[@blood6hound]

They wouldn't have a second thought about his scent being inside a building he spent a large percentage of his time in already. That would have been normal, and so not considered suspicious I think. Though I do think they should have checked around the edges of the camp to see if his scent branched anywhere else.

[@izzisart]

Honestly, that could be simply due to the rainstorm. Muddys things up.

[@tuchehstone]

Thank you for providing a great deal of context and illumination to the Bobby Bizup disappearance. It's sad to postulate that priests were involved in his dissappear and cover-up, but that's what it seems to be. Most of all, you thoroughly researched what likely transpired. Your attention to details is very much appreciated here.

[@schoolboogycorporation2062]

The person that told the story he was DOWN hill instead of up hill did it to get the search people to look where he would not be. Also, it was reported late to give them a chance to move the body farther away.

[@judeiz2203]

Another great story, keep up the good work 👏🏼

[@cat_spit]

Great video as usual. I just wanted to add that most people don't realize how many non-carnivorous animals like to nibble on bones. Rodents - everything from mice to porcupines - will do it to wear down their teeth and for the mineral content. Deer do it for calcium (and other nutrients). The only animals specifically referenced in the video were coyotes, and it's important to understand that there isn't automatically a link between gnaw marks and predation.

[@Joanne-i7q]

One of my best male friends was abused around age 12, on a Boy scout camping trip. It affected his life so much. He had difficulty with close relationships , anger, anxiety , and addiction. He never told a soul about it , until we were both 42. It explains a lot , sadly. Camp may sound like a fun, learning adventure. Not always .

[@DoctorCheryl]

We are Native Americans (I'm 1/8 Alabama-Coushatta and my daughter and her father are federally registered Eastern Shoshone - he's full blooded & daughter is 55.75%) so I thank you for the in depth look at the natives who inhabited the Colorado area prior to your story. I do want to mention however that to our knowledge, the Kiowa tribe is pronounced as K-EYE-Oh-Wah. Just a little FYI as we attend mltiple pow wows yearly and that is how those people themselves say their tribal name. Thanks again! DocC

[@birdsflowers2289]

I noticed that too. My Mom and Dad taught us how to pronounce the Tribal names during road trips. Our favorite way to pass time on the turnpike was contribute names.

[@whovotedforthat]

From the Uk and find Native American history fascinating so much love and respect

[@daren7889]

Dr. Cheryl: Thank you for your post! Retired Teacher here 37 years, 31 at the Preschool level! I am a big supporter of the American Indian College Fund in Denver Colorado! 🤗🥰🤗🇩🇪🇨🇭🇺🇲🌊♀️🌊♀️🌊♀️

[@daren7889]

Tom Brown the Tracker was trained in the 1960's by Apache Scout and Elder Grandfather Stalking Wolf! I highly recommend reading Tom Brown's books! He learned a lot about Native American Survival techniques! Grandfather was Apache! 🥰🤗🇩🇪🇨🇭🇺🇲🌊♀️

[@ShootingStarNeo]

Eyyy, was surprised when I read this and then realized I didn’t pick up on the Kiowa tribe being mentioned due to already knowing it by the correct pronunciation, because my family lived in Kiowa, CO when I was little!

[@riatsila144]

Just picked one at random. While I wasn't expecting easy listening, this went so much darker than I anticipated.

[@themobseat]

Great narration, knowledgeable and well spoken.

[@TheHaratashi]

As soon as I heard priests were in charge of boys in the camp I knew where this was headed.

[@LostSoulSearching]

Such a sad event. My heart is so sad for little Bobby.

[@kweefypete]

Great content as always. Hair looks fantastic btw

[@susanyoung1600]

You are such a good investigator. I could see you as a police detective.

[@hunterglass1840]

Fantastic coverage. I never had any clue to all this additional information.

[@theprogressivecynic2407]

One unstated thing in this story really concerns me. The man who inherited the skull from the camp director said that he was looking through records to find the possible missing kid it matches. This tends to indicate that there were multiple kids in the area who went missing during that time period, and taking a skull is some real serial killer behavior. Somebody need to look into whether other kids went missing in the vicinity of that camp director over the years. I would bet on one of two scenarios here: 1) Murder, followed by body disposal and scavenger predation. 2) The kid ran away, succumbed to the elements after evading searchers for a while, and then was scavenged. Then, when the bones were found, the camp director went out and looked over the area to ensure that there isn't anything that could incriminate him, and he found the skull, which he took home.

[@mirandagoldstine8548]

Ooh, that’s a good point. You think there were other victims at the camp? Yes, yes I can see the scenario quite clearly. It’s only a matter of looking into other kids who might have gone missing from that camp. There is definitely a bit of a conspiracy in the camp. A lot of things stink in that camp and I’m beginning to think Bobby wasn’t the only victim.

[@theprogressivecynic2407]

@@mirandagoldstine8548 If we're talking generally, organized serial killers tend not to kill people around them unless they get really comfortable and arrogant. This only happens if they have a lot of experience and have remained completely off the radar (and this was before the concept of a serial killer was well known, and before jurisdictions would share info). Conversely, some serial killers start killing by accident (eg. the director tried to molest Bobby, who freaked out, causing him to kill Bobby impulsively), and keep doing it because they enjoy it. Unfortunately, I don't see an investigation here being all that likely, as the priest status provided virtual immunity from suspicion in those days, and the Church has proven complicit in hiding evidence of horrible crimes. Even if some other staff saw him with the body, I have no faith that they would have said anything out of misguided defense of the faith.

[@mirandagoldstine8548]

@@theprogressivecynic2407 True, true. But here’s the thing about the truth: it always comes out in the end.

[@erictaylor5462]

I got lost in the woods when I was around 10. At first I was really scared. but I know a river flowed through camp, and rivers are always at the bottom of hills, nit the top. So I just headed down hill until I got to the river, then I followed the river into camp. I was back in camp in about an hour. No one told my about following streams if you get lost in the woods, it's just something I've always known. When I "learned" this in a survival class it really felt like being instructed in how to use a door. Like someone saying, "First you need to open the door..."

[@harley8047]

10:31 "No one suspected foul play..." *me thinking back to who works at the camp.* *Me remembering the stereotypes of camp counselors and priests.* *Praying it has to do with something else.*

[@DulceAmada]

Just subscribed to your channel, please keep doing more of these stories.