NEWS: Dumb Decisions at Fig and Water is Wet

[@SSand4]

Aside from their practices, there may be another reason things don't succeed on Fig. Everyone and their mother has heard of Kickstarter, Indegogo, and to a lesser extent GoFundMe; but this is literally the first time I've ever heard of "Fig". Now I'll be the first to admit that I'm not an expert, nor do I search every day to find out if new croudfunding sites have come out, but if they're more obscure than the others it certainly can't help the people that use it. That having been said, I agree with you that things don't seem right here. Does Fig get a piece of any of that money? Because if they do, I'd be tempted to say the entire site may just be a massive scam.

[@StopDropRetro]

Thanks for your input! I might get to work on another Fig video, the story just gets stranger and stranger...

[@diamondfailer11]

StopDrop&Retro The people demand a new fig video!

[@MuchWhittering]

Definitely this. I've never heard of Fig outside of these videos.

[@mrsone2000]

The kittens gave me the strength to get through! Thanks for the video (and the kittens)!

[@NyndjaYT]

Kitties! Subbed!

[@StopDropRetro]

lol, I've cornered the kitty market!

[@ongakuwotabeta]

StopDrop&Retro Puns!

[@bandanadee3029]

Origonal Hexatendo, it would appear he's cornered the market on that too.

[@borkor458]

Thanks for the kittens, they helped. :)

[@StopDropRetro]

With my monotone drone I should put the kittens in every video!

[@borkor458]

lol na it was just the paperwork

[@ChristopherSobieniak]

I still dig the time-lapse flower bit!

[@vkbl111]

Great in-depth analysis as always. Thanks!

[@StopDropRetro]

Thanks! I'll keep them coming as we get more news!

[@NolanRyan992]

i honestly cant stop re watching your videos. i love you man

[@mrc6032]

I Love Those old cartoon clips. Especially the one where those fellas go into the SEC court with that judge. And he holds that big paper with OK.LOL

[@hanselmanryanjames]

Kittens make everything better.

[@zackschilling4376]

The CEO of Fig is named Justin Bailey? Like the code ?

[@StopDropRetro]

Yeah! I don't think he's ever explained why that is. His avatar on NeoGAF is Samus from original Metroid.

[@OctaBech]

I came for the kittens and was not disappointed, thanks.

[@StopDropRetro]

I aim to please!

[@mickymacanori1768]

Psychonauts 2 was just aired on the 2018 Video Game Awards ;)

[@jamieg8627]

THANK YOU for the kittens...! :'D

[@MattGallagherComposer]

Thanks for the kittens. Definitely made my somewhat shitty day that much better.

[@ANTHONY-TECHSMITH]

What’s the name of the man in the beginning or were is it from.

[@adamofblastworks1517]

I've never even heard of Fig before, so I guess that's one thing that might lower their funding on that site.

[@pixeltaku]

3:21 Kittens make almost anything better

[@SalimOfShadow]

You totally got the point!

[@FriendofSonic]

Awesome follow up. can't believe they're still waiting on funds for Psychonauts!

[@StopDropRetro]

Thank you! And yes, it's amazing that they don't have the money so long since it ended. I'm sure they'll claim extra investments since have made up for it, nothing to see here!

[@woPLrdAY]

found this video after searching for how Fig works.. you make some good points. I think I'll pass on invesring/pledging now

[@JayXdbX]

I'm one of those people hoping for a train wreck but man consortium is not a game i want as part of that train wreck. I wish them luck but i think this is going to bite them in their ass.

[@StopDropRetro]

Yeah, I hope not! I really do wish them the best and I wish they had succeeded the first time on Kickstarter (and you know I did my part). The game looks awesome, their first Consortium game actually fits the description for a game like Lovers in a Dangerous Spacetime that I was asking about in the last indiebox episode.

[@Valkian24]

Funny to think that Consortium hit it big on Fig but Swery's The Good Life didn't but managed to get success on Kickstarter but just barely.

[@Ipwnstuff]

Hey mate, I know it's been a while but any thoughts on the Wasteland 3 fig campaign? It has $1.7 Million in investor funds but only $514k in backer funds. Feels like an extreme hypothetical but I feel like it's real iffy.

[@StopDropRetro]

I might make a video about Wasteland 3 or an update on Fig, I'm still looking into and doing some research though, no promises. And yeah, the numbers are consistently skewed by "investors" how ever many are real, it's going to be a constant recurring problem with that platform but I feel it was designed to be like that. I hope those developers the best, I never played Wasteland but I'm a big Fallout fan and I hear their team is very skilled at what they do. I wish they hadn't gone to Fig, the platform isn't honest or clear cut and I think it'll bite the devs in the ass later. But I guess it'll work out for regular backers as long as long as they get the game they want out of it. My beef is only with Fig, not with Wasteland.

[@Ipwnstuff]

StopDrop&Retro Well, the CEO of the development team that works on Wasteland 2 and the now funded Wasteland 3 (inXile Entertainment) is in the Fig advisory board. I find that personally a bit fishy as he would take a cut from both his role in Fig and the one in his position in the advisory board. Personally I don't have doubts in that the product that will be delivered will be something of quality, but transparency and true motivations seem to be a nebulous area in fig, when in crowdfunding, it should be the opposite. Anyways, just wanted to hear your two cents as the whole situation is what brought to light your content and got me asking question. Thanks for everything, and have a nice day.

[@zackschilling4376]

For a great video about Fig check out Dangerous Analysts video on Psychonauts 2

[@StopDropRetro]

Yeah, he showed up in the comments here during the Coleco Chameleon thing. He does some good digging, I like his work.

[@swagons529]

looking back to old vids

[@thepoliticalstartrek]

It would of been better to create two companies. One for both type of projects ones under a million and ones over a million.

[@Gfury2000]

Yay! Ol' Timey Kittehs!

[@brucecampbellschin8632]

I'm 50/50 with Kickstarter.

[@larsmarsh7181]

I think your appraisal of title 3 vs title 4 is pretty glib when you consider just how much a game is able to potentially raise via crowdfunding. yeah it's true that most game projects won't hit that million dollar mark or even ask for that much, BUT games as a whole on the crowdfunding platform are really not unheard of breaking the million dollar point. Honestly, I think it's pretty insane not to go for title four when you consider the potential that you could actually hit that million dollar mark. And games, I feel, have a better chance of hitting that mark vs any other medium on crowdfunding platforms.

[@StopDropRetro]

If they're getting over a mil, it's probably no longer an indie game. Get real investors instead of risking it all on your biggest fans and asking for a $500 bet from each and giving them no recourse if you misuse funds.

[@larsmarsh7181]

Apologies in advance for the wall of text. I think the problem with that is that it simply leads to a lot of assumptions about your game. You can't know for a fact you're going to get over a million dollars from your game. Nobody knows their property will make a million dollars via kickstarter. Unless you're Tim Schafer, and even he is beginning to exhaust his good faith supporters. And it's not like legitimately independent projects can't make that much money. I was actually curious about how many games projects have made over a million dollars, and a not insignificant number of projects have actually made 1+ million. I'm not even talking about stuff like Star Citizen. The Homestuck game asked for $150k and raised over 2 million. And even with Hussie's insane fanbase, I don't think he could have expected it. The fact is that all crowdfunding projects are essentially gambles with no recourse for backers. Personally, I've never backed anything via crowdfunding because I don't want to get involved in the nightmare that is backing a shitty project. Even a good project can turn shitty and I've seen plenty of that happen. As of right now, you can create something on kickstarter and disappear with the money, citing nebulous "difficulties". While you've made an excellent point about fig in your other video - and I think that even having the general public as "investors" is in of itself its own nightmare, I actually LIKE the idea of backing something as an investor. I've actually thought this would be a great idea for a while now because most crowdfunding projects that are successful, I don't really give a shit about. Would I back Wasteland 3 on Fig as an investment? Yeah, to be honest with you I think that would be a pretty safe investment. Safe as a relative term in the games industry. That said, there are some companies out there crowdfunding things consistently that I would be more likely to back than others. Even though Tim Schafer is quickly using up all his goodwill, I would probably back Double Fine as an investor. InExile. Roberts Space Industries. Like any other branch of the games industry, it's very quickly shaping up that there are some companies more reliable than others. Reliable as a relative term in the games industry. Fig is, at this time - as best I understand it - really just proof of concept more than anything. If Fig sticks around long enough, you can expect that other platforms will adopt similar methods. If it doesn't, someone will hopefully adapt to Fig's failure and make the necessary changes for success.

[@Triple_R_93]

I just saw this video for the first time and was so confused because I own this game. GoG gave it to me for free quite awhile ago. I didn't even know what it was haha

[@StopDropRetro]

Nah, you own the original, so do I. The campaign was for the sequel. I still hope it comes out but I hope they don't get the short end of the stick with FIG

[@blackhatfreak]

2 years later and psychonauts isn't out.

[@mickymacanori1768]

Psychonauts 2 was just aired on the Video Game Awards ;)

[@GeoExpansionify]

Personally I hope this project does completely fail. Don't get me wrong I love Psychonauts as much as the next person, but after years passing I do lose all respect towards Tim Schafer. The way you go into this topic really shows that this is nothing more of a scam to get more money from people. I mean after reading things like this really does bug me. I think its the simple fact that Tim Schafer is a money grubbing weasel. Besides he launches a campaign for Psychonauts 2 but a month after the announcement there were multiple remaster downloads for his games as well on XBLA and PSN. This is pretty sketchy to me.

[@StopDropRetro]

I respect him as a game designer but that's the problem, I don't see much designing going on anymore he's gone full capitalist. I don't fault him entirely for that, people have to eat, but it's just sad to see them make bad decisions that affect the fans like the whole Space Base 9 debacle. I know a lot of his fans defend him but they're entirely in the wrong there and so was he.

[@SianaGearz]

Do you have reason to believe that Tim pockets the money personally, as opposed to trying to run a studio, trying to pay soandsomany people their salaries, and trying to keep them busy, and struggling with this? A 65-person company takes around 5 Mio a year to run, and i'm not entirely certain whether they're making this money. Discontinuing DF-9 was possibly a mistake, but it was a commercial failure after all. It's possible that they could turn it around into commercial success if they hadn't cancelled it, but what if they couldn't? It's impossible to say from the armchair. Publishing remasters is absolutely par for the course, it's actually the best time filler between projects. People are offended every time someone starts a new campaign before delivering their last campaign's results, but that's what you have to do, because different people are involved to a different amount at various production stages, so they need to secure the funding during pre-production on the new title while other people are finishing production on the last title, because what else are you gonna do, shut down 3/4th of the studio for 3 months? Once game is out, there's still a couple people on bugfixes, the rest need a new project. All of this was hidden to us when game development was publisher driven, also hidden were most games where production ran into issues and had to be cancelled, with publisher swallowing the cost, we used to get the announcement basically when the final product was already at least half way done, so it seemed a lot more sequential and orderly than it actually is, actually has to be. On crowdfunding, backers are necessarily part of publishing business itself (minus the actual ability to audit the developer and assess development risks as they occur), but they don't understand how it works.

[@SteveSmith-rt7wx]

When the Psychonauts Fig campaign came out, the time limit for the goal kept getting longer. The obvious answer is that Schafer cheated the system (being a board member of the Fig company) But the official story is that there was a cock-up setting up the timer. So either they're greedy cheating cunts, or they're so incompetent they can't make a timer, so why trust them to make a videogame? Of course, there's also the question of where Schafer gets the money for his gaming studio's office and the lavish parties he throws for investors. And yet people still trust him and throw money at him for his accomplishments in gaming 15+ years ago

[@terribletimes902]

Guess what, it didn’t fail. The only failure here is YOU. Go Psychonauts 2! 😌

[@AaronALAI]

Why so few views? This youtuber is very lucidity and does his research.

[@StopDropRetro]

Thanks! My channel blew up late last year so that's why the views look so out of proportion. I remember back when I got like 4,000 views on my first Fig video I was so happy because it felt like I went viral! Good times, thanks for the comment!!

[@DanuProductions]

Water? Wet? What next? Globe earth?

[@AnCoolUsername]

I might have backed Psychonauts 2 on Kickstarter. I refused to on FIG though

[@StopDropRetro]

Yeah, I'm not comfortable with a closed area where Tim & Co. get to play by their own rules. At least with KS they don't have control over everyone's money.

[@AnCoolUsername]

StopDrop&Retro Ecaxtly. Especially since I felt ripped off from his last crowded game.

[@TEWESAW]

consortium is such a good game tbh I hope it comes out

[@StopDropRetro]

I have my hopes set out for them too. If Fig makes the game possible, so be it but I don't have to like it. I did my part while it was on KS.

[@SianaGearz]

Thanks for kittens

[@prometheusdarkstar1725]

Nice informative video!

[@StopDropRetro]

Thanks!

[@vladnex1052]

Im sorry dude but everything between 3:20 and 5:00 jus flew past my head. The kittens are too cute

[@ridbensdale]

I've not heard many good things about FIG Your video seems to confirm what I've heard/read. No wonder your magician chap doesn't look happy. (Who is that? It looks familiar) I know it's a cliche but great work. Keep it up good sir 😊

[@raymxslappedyall3660]

Hahahaha!He bragging bout backing ground funding $20!!

[@raymxslappedyall3660]

Y

[@KonEl-BlackZero]

So?

[@raymxslappedyall3660]

@@KonEl-BlackZero uhg,anime avatar

[@savage1267]

This video is my first encounter w the Fig platform. I'm so out of the loop. Also, Polygon is toilet paper.

[@larsmarsh7181]

A FOLLOW UP. I was cruising the internet for profitability with Fig's investment platform and I actually came across this article which I feel like you would be interested in reading. It brings up a few very pertinent questions specifically with regards to what you can expect to make from this endeavour. Turns out, not a whole lot. Apparently for you to break even, Obsidian needs to sell 1 million copies of each individual game ON THE PC. As it turns out, Fig investors are not privy to any of that sweet console lucre. But it gets better, because unlike stocks or real investments, it turns out that you only have a small window of time to actually make money on your investment with Fig. I love this part of the article in particular: "Post investment period sales (at some point, which is usually driven by sales under a certain number, the investors will no longer be entitled to returns - this is not even brought up, but will almost assuredly be in the offering. For Wasteland 3, as an example, once returns to investors fall below $1000 for three consecutive months, the investment returns are cut off)." "Post investment". I love that term. So if Wasteland 3 takes too long to make its money back, I guess you're shit out of luck despite being an "investor". Oh yeah and they tell you nothing about crowdfunded sales - something they'll happily include in their graph but I feel like they will fail to take those sales into account when divvying up ROI. In short, it is not a positive article and I can already hear you rubbing your hands together with glee at how poorly this reflects on the company. www.growly.io/investing-on-fig-insight-from-a-veteran-investor/

[@conit4125]

Justin Bailey? Like the cheat code?

[@StopDropRetro]

yep. I don't know why the names match he is aware of it though I don't think he's ever told if he knows why.

[@roslolian11]

I can't really agree with your definition of crowd funding, sure it is indeed the democratization of production but it is also goodwill production, the backers (or donors) take all the risk in the production process but don't get any reward. What I mean to say is if a normal publisher funds a game, they pay X dollars now but get X dollars later if the project succeeds, if the project fails then thats the risk, at least risk and reward go hand in hand. But as a backer your "reward" is only the product you paid for, there is no actual monetary reward in return for the risk you took and the time value of money you spent on backing the game. So this is why I don't think the current crowdfunding model is sacred at all, it is willfull exploitation of backers by both gaming companies and esp. Kickstarter. Gaming companies love it because they can build a game with no cost and risk, it is essentially 100% profit on their side because somebody else paid for the game and when it makes it money it is all theirs, while KS loves it because they make money no matter what happens. You call Fig greedy but they at least have put some effort into trying to give backers a fair shake. Fig only has a few projects going on at a time so they can at least do some vetting unlike on KS where scammers go in regularly. And while they have been too optimistic trying to get title 4 instead of title 3, the mere fact that investors can make money back from the game isn't ruining crowdfunding, it is saving it. I have stopped backing games ever since I backed C wars, spent 100 bucks, waited 4+ years and ended up with an incomplete pile of shit. KS is a crook, they take my money but offer no protection whatsoever, tos or no tos it is always caveat emptor. At leadt fig is trying to do something different than put all the risk on consumers without any reward at all.

[@MrBenMcLean]

If they're giving out equity then of course they're only giving out equity in that one game, not in the studio, which means that of course that game is going to be handled by a shell corporation. I was assuming that after hearing the basic description of how Fig works.

[@kaihtheloner]

Psychonauts 2 was in development? 😧 I'd have donated as much as i could to play it. I loved the first game.

[@terribletimes902]

It exists

[@anibala.moralessanchez8018]

Oh well, Psychonauts 2 was too good to be true. Go figure.

[@Maniac536]

UPDATE: Company was forced to sell to Microsoft. Game is still not out.

[@Northgical]

It dropped now and was pretty great so there's that, Fig still L tho

[@davidleeashkenazi8992]

Kittens

[@natenbox64]

I'm from the future (well, 2021 that is). I can tell you right now that a lot of the investors who crowdfunded Psychonauts 2 have gotten their money back when Microsoft purchased Double Fine two years ago. Oh, and Psychonauts 2 turned out to kick ass. So there's that.

[@huhulili9021]

Polygon is a bad site

[@_faultee_]

Fig is not crowdfunding

[@lawyitkazuki5768]

Actually only 75 percent of water is wet

[@raytracer5726]

Fun fact: in Russian language, getting a ''fig'' means getting nothing.

[@odriew5014]

What? All I've seen on you channel make me think crowdfunding is a scam most of the time. Now you're telling me it's sacred? Maybe you should do some more positive videos on it occasional if that is what you think.

[@nickjeffrey8050]

Game looks worse than halo 2 graphics