History Hijinks: Greek Wise Guys

[@MarkusAldawn]

"If I were not Alexander, I would want to be Diogenes." "If I was not Diogenes, I would also want to be Diogenes."

[@CDexie]

what an idol

[@sinisterelephant8658]

Just the (likely apocryphal) quote I was looking for!

[@jasondoe2596]

Humanity's first, and most dedicated, shitposter.

[@wofls2713]

@@jasondoe2596 except he was kinda right most the time

[@souffrantdepine3762]

@@wofls2713 Did Jason stutter?

[@F22onblockland]

Death: Gorgias it's time to go Gorgias at 98: Well you see time is a relative construct, it is true that one day my body shall stop functioning but who are you to say that that day, is in fact today? I... Death: Alright alright, i'll give you 10 more years, please just stop.

[@publiusii4246]

I imagine gorgias as greek ben shapiro.

[@tada-kun982]

Ahaha so accurate

[@Prich319]

Dude sounds like the proto-soyboy.

[@Kumimono]

Death: I LIKE YOU, YOU MAY STAY.

[@carlosroo5460]

Gorgias: "And boom, that's how you extend your life, science"

[@hastaman321]

Alexander: "Nice to meet you, I'm famous" Diogenes: "Get bent" Alexander: "He's so cool!"

[@genieglasslamp5028]

Sempai noticed me! UWU!!

[@svarf1752]

Alexander: ,,Bring me a Barrel, I'm living here now!" Makedons: ,,...but my King, the Persian Campaign...." Alexander: ,,Oh fine, but afterwards I'll live here!"

[@alexemy2463]

Alexander and Hephaestion were already pretty bent tbf

[@jiminbang5822]

@@alexemy2463 XD

[@BroganCoovert34]

more like Diogenes "Hi famous I'm Diogenes" Alexander "He's so cool!"

[@Kemot300]

In Hades: Hades (reads the report): So let me get this straight Charon, Diogenes spent years on the coast of the Styx river because he did not care to pay you, and you only took him now because you could not take it anymore, and I quote: "to see him constantly pee into the Styx river"?

[@rolandremzmejorada4641]

Ngl this needs more likes

[@rogueflare4929]

That man would be DOUBLE the LEGEND he already was when he was alive cuz he has the guts AND balls to be soo bold in the Underworld that it even leaves Hades unable to deal with him in an examplary way!?!? DAMN,I THINK I LOVE HIM EVEN MORE NOW WITH THIS NEW HEADCANNON!?!?XD 😂😂

[@atuljha6128]

@@rogueflare4929 why would Hades have to "deal" with him though? The Underworld is a pretty chill place, except for Tartarus of course.

[@theparrot6516]

@@atuljha6128 put him into tartarus. Or if hades is feeling nice. Put him into asphodel

[@thottovonbismarck8756]

There's a series of brief satirical scenes written by Lucian of Samosata called the "Dialogues of the Dead." The main characters are Cynic philosophers (including Diogenes) basically doing exactly this all across the underworld! They're pretty easy to find online if you're interested

[@GhostBear3067]

Diogenes: "I ran out of fucks to give before you were born." Bystander: "I am older than you..." Diogenes: "DID I STUTTER?!"

[@ashofruins761]

"BEHOLD" Holds up a shivering naked chicken "A MAN" is probably the most hilarious powerplay ever

[@patrickcorby1423]

I thought that was a tumblr shitpost not an actual philosopher

[@twoscarabsintheswarm9055]

I'm pretty sure the chicken was dead but oof

[@zoro115-s6b]

@@patrickcorby1423 I think that the whole point of this video is that a lot of philosophy is just the ancient version of tumblr shitposts.

[@marvalice3455]

@@patrickcorby1423 oh it was absolutely a shit post. it was just done by a real greek philosopher

[@marvalice3455]

@@twoscarabsintheswarm9055 that need not be true, though it was certainly not well.

[@anyataylor5333]

Diogenes is the chaotic neutral that everyone likes.

[@ishanafondekar6334]

BEHOLD A MAN

[@Magus_Union]

I honestly think he's the most 'accurate' of moral philosophers with his views if you take the time to dial down his shenanigans by a factor of 50. He's pretty equatable to the context of Fight Club in terms of moral reasoning.

[@kylepessell1350]

He's Bilbo Baggins if Bilbo Baggins took one look at Smaug then told him that his breath stinks and that the jewelry on his chest was obviously compensating for something.

[@nanoblast5748]

Diogenes was the middle finger philosophy needed AND deserved.

[@tuckinatorinator787]

Personally from all that I know of him I admire the guy. Marched to his own drum, wasn't stupid and wasn't concerned about others, was the furthest thing from a conformist, and despite being how he was he was so genuine that people were naturally drawn to him.

[@CDexie]

Diogenes is seriously a legend. After pulling that stunt with the chicken, the academy was forced to expand the definition of man to "featherless biped with broad flat nails". He wandered around the streets of Athens with a lamp in broad daylight, claiming to be searching for "an honest man, but finding nothing but rascals and scoundrels". He threw the only cup he carried to drink water with when he saw a peasant child using its hands to do so out of a puddle, then declared ""Fool that I am, to have been carrying superfluous baggage all this time!". And finally, his words of wisdom: "In a rich man's house, there is no place to spit but his face".

[@DISTurbedwaffle918]

I think good life advice is to be as strong and well-spoken as Plato, but be as brash and bold as Diogenes.

[@caseykendall5506]

My favorite story was the one where he and a bunch of other philosophers were sitting in a room together. The subject of an interesting paradox came up: since they had no concept of the number zero, they argued that TECHNICALLY it was impossible to leave a room, since you could be one to a hundred percent in but never less than that (did I say an interesting paradox? I meant 'incredibly stupid'). Our boy Diogenes stood up, told them he had an easy answer to that, and just fucking walked right out of the room like a boss.

[@zoro115-s6b]

@@caseykendall5506 Those philosophers sound like they were high as fuck.

[@michaelkriston8477]

@@zoro115-s6b Nah fam,Indians and Arabs were the only ones who could even contemplate the existence of a number soley dedicated to nothingness.

[@zoro115-s6b]

@@michaelkriston8477 My point still stands.

[@Obi-Wan_Kenobi]

I actually really like Plato, and not just because he's a bearded wise man who taught youngsters in a school while also being jacked enough to duel any opponent into submission. He reminds me of me in that regard.

[@jaegar2786]

Obi-Wan get a job already.

[@l.o.b.2433]

@@jaegar2786 Pretty sure Jedi don't need payments.

[@johnbones3455]

Why are you everywhere?

[@jaegar2786]

@@johnbones3455 the force is everywhere in everything, it surrounds us and penetrates us. It binds the Galaxy together.

[@caipingcui7594]

GENERAL KENOBI!

[@whatthewhatthe9117]

Diogenes: _Tears open Trojan horse_ BEHOLD, A MAN Children: screaming at the birthday party

[@veryimportantspoon5468]

Have I ever mentioned how much I admire Diogenes' sheer *audacity* ? He marches right up to the biggest hotshots in all of Greece, looks 'em up and down, and says "Move over, you're blocking the sunlight". I aspire to be that bold.

[@deathstar6998]

Well Alexander marched up to him because he was a lazy shit but yeah

[@leyspun]

It's even better. THEY had to march up to HIM.

[@schwarzerritter5724]

Even better, Diogenes made the biggest hotshots march right up to h i m .

[@blazeswordpaladin9357]

All that's holding you back is social constraints, my friend. That was the lesson Diogenes was trying to teach

[@veryimportantspoon5468]

@@blazeswordpaladin9357 What's holding me back is I'm stuck at home and don't have twitter.

[@silvergiovanni2658]

Plato: jacked wrestling philosopher A sound soul dwells within a sound mind and a sound body

[@nunyobidniz]

_Read 'Apology' or I'll eat your soul._ 😆

[@olotocolo]

I might be wrong but greeks had general love for beauty and thus also love for beauty of the body. There was this idea that not seeing your body at it's peak at least once is a horrible waste. So I would say they would totally agree with sound mind dwells in sound body. Althought that exact slogan was created much later if i recall correctly.

[@katsala918]

And then Aristotle transforms into a scythe

[@apokos8871]

@@olotocolo yes and no. Plato started wrestling and sports as a teen, as was the norm with young boys, before he met Socrates and started studying philosophy. Socrates didnt really care about his looks, he had a beer belly and wasnt attractive in any physical way

[@destinytroll1374]

I see what you did there You're cool m8 😁

[@Red-mg4ro]

Plato: And that's my view on the subject. Other philosopher: But what about-? Plato: *Flexes so hard his tunic tears* OP: Sound reasoning, I retract my argument.

[@necronsouls404]

I love how the 2 big theories of Diogenes's death are A) he fought with a rabid dog over a piece of meat, got bit, and the bite wound got infected and he died from that, or B) he wanted to prove a point (of which I do not remember the subject) and forced himself to not breath, killing himself what a chad that man was

[@stekra3159]

Well know the underworld will have to deal with him and Carion is going to be so allowed.

[@juniperblackenstine2156]

Not to be a hater because I sure as hell couldn't be as cool as the big guy, but wouldn't holding your breath just make you faint because your body is like 'What the hell man?' or was the man just built differently?

[@roelant8069]

The funniest story surrounding his death is in my opinion when people asked him how he wanted to be buried. He asked to be thrown outside the city walls. When people brought up that his corpse would be eaten by animals he asked them to give him a stick to fend them off. When people questioned why he'd ask for the stick when he'd be unconscious and unable to defend himself he replied by asking why he'd need to concern himself with those animals eating him is he wasn't gonna be conscious anyways

[@firstnext5482]

@@juniperblackenstine2156 No one answered you, which is a bummer. Yeah, in theory you can't hold your breath to death because you'd just pass out and your body automatically begins breathing again so you're good to go. The thing there though is Diogenes was hella old when he died. If you're old, your body ain't that good. Him holding his breath could've been enough to start a heart attack so zip zap zop, Diogenes died because he went "nah fuck life" held his breath and fuckin' died.. This has been my shitty Ted Talk.

[@chaosreaver3597]

My two favourite things about Diogenes not mentioned in the video, it was reported he was always surround pack of stray dogs, he loved dogs especially strays because he thought that they were the ultimate expression of a care-free life. And he was once asked (this might be apocryphal, as there is only one source I could find) what he wanted done with his body after he died, he told the man asking the question, "dump my body outside the city walls and let the wolves have me". The man was horrified by this and asked his why he would want let his body be desecrated like that. Diogenes' reply "Well give my body a stick, I'll do my best to fight the wolves off". It might be the earliest record of someone saying, I'll be too dead to care about what happens to my corpse.

[@wyrmofvt]

Gorgias: "...and that's why I don't owe you rent." Landlord: "Well, if everything is transient and aetherial, then your apartment is as well, and it just ceased to exist. And that's why you don't have an apartment. Get out."

[@yoyo51010]

since thereis no out or in i wont move

[@vullord666]

"If the apartment no longer exists, you aren't losing money letting me sleep in an empty space".

[@wyrmofvt]

@@vullord666 "If all you need is empty space, why are you so insistent on staying in this particular empty space? Do us both a favor and get out. That way you can have your empty space, and I can have mine."

[@Johnhasa1]

@@wyrmofvt "I am here. Why should I move?"

[@wyrmofvt]

@@Johnhasa1 "Because I'm about to store some rather heavy stone here and you'll find breathing rather difficult with it on top of you. Or not. I'll just have your remains cleared away."

[@ButterflyScarlet]

I love that Plato's name is basically just his wrestling moniker. It's if The Rock was a philosopher. Imagine casually discussing metaphysics with your lecturer and then you go home and see them chokeslam someone on national TV.

[@yourpalbryan1442]

As Blue says: "Its all fun and games poking holes in your opponents' logic until they suplex you in the middle of the symposium"

[@janwitkowsky8787]

Ever tried playing Dungeons and Dragons with Dwayne Johnson? Yup.

[@poppypollen4362]

God, this world needs this.

[@solaris9426]

Thousands of years in our future, The Rock could very well be considered a philosopher to those who uncover his stuff.

[@GSBarlev]

The physics department at my _alma mater_ had a surprisingly large amount of overlap with our sports teams. One legend did his senior thesis on the hydraulic model of metabolism with regards to competitive swimmers. Of which he was one.

[@GeneralOlde]

Plato: Socrates is right, and everyone else hates wisdom. Also, he's faster than Sonic and stronger than Knuckles wait where are you going

[@willowarkan2263]

Soooo, plato's oc, don't steal?

[@kabob0077]

The most Jacked Philosopher.

[@bastiangalaz4580]

Socrates is the first sonichu

[@thisisasupersayin376]

Stronger than all his classmates in the Philosopher Fighting Acadamy.

[@Armendicus]

@@thisisasupersayin376 that actually sounds like a good anime

[@IeshiAke]

Blue: allegedly getting the nickname Platus, meaning broad, because of his- Me: broad knowledge, how original Blue: wrestling coach. Me: excuse me, what?

[@starfishhugger6232]

*Plato rips off shirt.* "LETS DEBATE, LITTLE MAN!"

[@zoro115-s6b]

Plato knew how to deal with people who were talking shit.

[@cubesgames6213]

@@zoro115-s6b with the exception of Diogenes

[@zoro115-s6b]

@@cubesgames6213 Plato: "I could kick your ass." Diogenes: "So?" Plato: "............."

[@kacperdrabikowski5074]

Yea, one of his extremely short biographies I've read said that his nickname derives from Greek for, moreless "broad-shoulered". In essence, ripped.

[@juliaspaghetti7466]

When asked what motivates him Diogenes responded with “spite.”

[@VivaLaDnDLogs]

It's a powerful motivator.

[@DaBezzzz]

"Beyond being a bibliophile and a tank, Plato was also a nerd." I love this channel.

[@beccag2758]

“He was so convinced he was right everyone just went along with it” Gosh dang it’s high school all over again

[@sarahconder9609]

Gosh darn it, its my day off!

[@PrinceNikkoTethlar]

Dude, Highschool never ends. They've made a song about it after all.

[@DeathnoteBB]

High school? More like modern American politics

[@MusicoftheDamned]

The world would be *so* much better if that behavior was exclusive to high school. Sadly, it's just basic human nature, sort of like how it's easier to infiltrate into places you shouldn't be if you just act confident about being there.* *Effectiveness is dependent upon context and persons interacted with. Infiltration not guaranteed. No refunds.

[@TheOverArchiver]

That hit me in the, well, everything.

[@anyataylor5333]

“Aristotle is Usually Wrong” .... That’s just a major understatement but you do you.

[@HimitsuHunter]

Indeed. We like Aristotle because he's the foundation of the scientific methodology... but boy oh boy... he's definitely one to point to when pointing out that a house is more than just it's foundations...

[@stilltmg]

"I mean after all, you are the Aristotle of figuring out which convoluted ideas to throttle."

[@scottbruckner4653]

"BEHOLD. A MAN."

[@DeathnoteBB]

@@HimitsuHunter Wait I thought that was Socrates who founded the scientific method. Hence it also being called “the Socratic method”

[@MortimerZabi]

His metaphysics were fun. His physics were crap.

[@TheHorseOutside]

“You’ll have to forgive Democritus for not having access to the Large Hadron Collider” I most certainly WILL NOT good sir. NEVER!

[@Freekymoho]

really, it's an unforgivable oversight.

[@TheBatmobeale]

Damn him! Damn his britches!!

[@TheHorseOutside]

@@TheBatmobeale cut up his britches, what do we get? MORE GOTDAMN BRITCHES!

[@whatthewhatthe9117]

I mean toddlers are just small hadron colliders

[@Midsomnyx]

I now know the first thing I'm doing if I get a time machine.

[@Tobbs96]

You're surprised the Athenians liked having Diogenes around? If that kind of LEGEND lived near my house I'd be absolutely thrilled.

[@galfinsp7216]

It’d certainly be fun to live with someone who didn’t give a funky fresh

[@kusaisama]

@@galfinsp7216 and peed on you.

[@solaris9426]

@@kusaisama even more so if you're into that kind of thing.

[@nowhereman6019]

Everyone loves that one crazy homeless guy

[@Voitan]

He'd be peeing on it.

[@MxCAT7]

Diogenes story: When some folks (idk, those pirates you mentioned?? memory ish wonky) invaded Athens, he Did Not Care (tm). At some point, though, he climbed out of his barrel, stood up and started rolling the barrel to the other side of the forum. Once he reached the other side he turned around and started rolling it back. Back where he started he turned around again, and he continued like that. When someone asked him what in Zeus' name he was doing he replied: "Everyone is running about all busy and panicky, it felt weird just sitting here, so I got up to look busy as well." And that, ladies, gents and gentlethems, is why he is my Favourite.

[@Sirhc_B8207]

I read something similar, but it was simply something like "I'm making myself as useful/productive as everybody else"

[@herohades2230]

"Greek Wise Guys, or How Long Can We Talk About This Before We Inevitably Talk About Diogenes"

[@adastial2104]

Tru

[@SomeAHole]

Diogenes wins on account of being so cool that he is the most well known homeless person to ever exist

[@BookWyrmOnAString]

Holes counterexample: Adam and eve

[@copper803]

@@BookWyrmOnAString but they arent cool

[@BookWyrmOnAString]

@@copper803 u right. U very right

[@almostirrelevant9181]

“Uncomfortably influential Aristotle” lol. As a philosophy major who’s minoring in history, this is too real.

[@moribell1083]

It’s funny, I’m thinking of minoring in philosophy as I major in history. I’ve came to the same conclusion.

[@sobitasadullah4517]

Oh you poor soul. You majored in philosophy.

[@bificommander7472]

I studied physics, and IIRC in a history-of-science course there was a bit gushing about how Aristotle's views on physics stood until the 16th century and his views on biology lasted until the 18th or something. Of course, one could also say it took that long for people to stop admiring the great wise master long enough to find out he was wrong. And while theories being wrong and getting replaced by better ones is a natural part of science, his mistakes included some real whoppers. I believe he's the one who had reasoned that women must have fewer teeth than men. And that remained the scientific consensus for centuries until someone just counted the things.

[@SomeDude2441]

@@moribell1083 8g 8i8

[@SomeDude2441]

@@moribell1083 8

[@starfishhugger6232]

When people try to argue politics at me I reflexively turn into a Gorgias. I once had my family open up a sudden debate at the dinner table about why murder rates were so high in certain states. One side insisted it was because of guns while the other side argued it was because of drugs. When everyone unanimously insisted I take a side, I insisted it could be because murder is fun, because they didn't have consistent evidence one way or the other, and none of them knew enough about murdering a person to disprove this hypothesis. And they all let me eat my spaghetti in peace. The End. lol

[@TheOverArchiver]

Nice.

[@Fanimati0n]

@@GreenKnight343 *ancient solutions in this case

[@ms_scribbles]

Unfortunately for them, they don't understand that without guns, drugs have a harder time of leading to a lot of murder. Especially since a lot of other weapons are much harder to handle while high as a kite than guns are. That's just objective fact that doesn't even have to go into morality or any sort of philosophy. Just, "guns are too OP, must nerf."

[@zoro115-s6b]

@@ms_scribbles I'm down for all guns in the world being thanos-snapped out of existence because then more people would sword fight me.

[@LawkzBro]

I also wouldn't bother the meal of someone who just non-ironically suggested that "murder is fun".

[@lol101lol101lol10199]

Kings in the Middle Ages: We hire court jesters to roast us and say rude sh-t at our expense that serious people wouldn't dare. Alexander: Have I ever told you about my favorite philosopher?

[@cheezeguyLOZ]

"Everyone is competing for the most galaxy-brains take on the world" So ancient Greek philosophy is just late night tumblr?

[@sunshadowkitten8487]

But with like big words and stuff right? I don't think these ancient dudes would be saying "yeet" or "OwO".

[@ohadgoldhagen1095]

@@sunshadowkitten8487 I have a new idea for a history anime.

[@Punaparta]

@@sunshadowkitten8487 Are you sure that's not just due to translator bias?

[@torcaace]

@@sunshadowkitten8487 they would definetly say owo. They were furries (there are pots depicting men fucking sphinxes)

[@ratticusthewinion]

@@torcaace have you seen that one Tumblr post about how Thoth (Egyptian god of learning) is written in Greek? it would not be wrong for an ancient man to ask "Θωθ, what's this?"

[@michaelscott6022]

"Polyphemus, who hurt you?" "Nobody! Nobody hurt me!!" "Nobody hurt you? Did you trip and fall down the hill?" "Maybe he just wants attention by pretending to be in pain?" "But how can we be sure? Does pain even exist? Or is it a concept only in our heads-- _OW!_ What was that for?!"

[@leohex8767]

"Well its official, Pain Exists!!!!"

[@ulisesdimopulos4376]

My real name isn’t nobody it’s ^^^

[@Valery0p5]

"For f- sake: ULISSES STABBED ME IN THE EYE, OK?"

[@ulisesdimopulos4376]

**10 years of suffering intensifies*

[@leohex8767]

@@Valery0p5 "What is but a single eye in exchange for certain philosophical truth, Polyphemus?"

[@burnin8able]

Personally, I like the other account of Alexander meeting Diogenes, where they meet while Diogenes is sifting through a massive pile of skeletons and bones. Alexander asks him what he's doing, and Diogenes just replies with "Looking for the bones of your father, but I cannot distinguish them from the bones of slaves." Diogenes was the OG comrade.

[@caramelwinged2536]

That is on par with the plucked chicken and I also like that account

[@sramtae5820]

Did Alexander visit Diogenes once in a while just to get roasted ?

[@someonerandom8552]

@@sramtae5820 That’s my headcanon

[@keithcarson7638]

@@sramtae5820 In before we had the Wendy's twitter account. He was the original shitposter.

[@unlucky_2nd897]

@@sramtae5820 Alexander the M

[@Emily-tv1iz]

Aristotle thought women had less teeth than men and nobody thought to check that. I can't even wrap my head around that. I can kinda let slide some of his bad hot takes but like women aren't exactly a rare commodity. Just ask one to open her mouth and voila! Theory disproven.

[@custodeon]

That's certainly an interesting way to spell "voila"

[@Emily-tv1iz]

@@custodeon my brain broke trying to spell words today

[@randombencounter263]

Didn't he also claim that flies have 4 legs, or was that Pliny? I know one of the old dead dudes said it

[@DISTurbedwaffle918]

If I recall, women are more prone to needing their wisdom teeth removed than men are. So sometimes this is accurate.

[@tomfillot5453]

He also, you know, wrote the entire rest of the Animalia, which compiles most of the earliest description of anything living, way more.often than not accurate (and reporting folk's legends as such). The Animalia being the first attempt ever in systematic classification of life, an effort than would culminate, after a long hiatus, in Darwin's work. It's easy to poke fun at the teeth thing, when we don't really know about what could have led to that. Maybe the one girl he counted the teeth of had some removed, who knows.

[@345635356]

Besides Diogenes, my favorite ancient greek philosophy story is that Aristotle got so sick and tired of bad arguments that he put together a list of logical fallacies, which is kinda like getting so tired of someone you write an essay on it and then proceed to bludgeon them on the head with the hardcover of said essay... the man may have been wrong on matters of science but I have to admire the commitment to logical methodology

[@jasperdracona]

We should do this again honestly Like all those turns of phrase that everyone misuses Example: “a couple bad apples” - ‘spoils the barrel’

[@TheNeonParadox]

"While Athens and Sparta were busy having their little spear fight, Democritus was over here figuring out atomic theory." Possibly the greatest line in the history of KZbin.

[@MonkeyWhoWouldBeKing]

"For every Plato's Republic there is an equal and opposite Diogenes peeing at a banquet." is gonna be the intro i use with my students next time we cover athens XD

[@tynorstrom2761]

wanna entertain your class? Seriously go talk about Diogenes all lecture, people will be HOWLING

[@blazeswordpaladin9357]

Diogenes is a philosopher that despite his crudity had some really interesting things to say about conformity. Also the memes are just golden. Plus, when people made fun of him for living in the streets like a dog and tossed him some bones (note: "cynic" comes from the greek word "κύνας" which means "dog"), he peed on them so...

[@Fanimati0n]

He also bit them

[@blazeswordpaladin9357]

@@Fanimati0n Absolute Mad Lad

[@blazeswordpaladin9357]

@@Fanimati0n Absolute Mad Lad

[@blazeswordpaladin9357]

@Frost E Bear We need to revive Diogenes, teach him English, and introduce him to 4chan

[@Punishthefalse]

@@blazeswordpaladin9357 But he would then consider 4chan to be superfluous, unsubscribe from the internet, throw the computer into a thrash bin, and proceed to just go find the posters to troll personally. On foot.

[@artemiswolf4508]

“Aristotles was wrong about almost everything” Me, after taking one ethics class: well I could’ve told you that

[@GabrielLopez-mo2xo]

Well rhbe fair virtue ethics have merit its a decent system even if his end point is wrong

[@The_Murder_Party]

Or physics. Edit: embarrassingly, I spelled „or“ wrong.

[@marsh4833]

But you didn't 👀

[@KarlKristofferJohnsson]

@@The_Murder_Party Well, now I'm really curious about how you spelled it before the edit?

[@RichardLightburn]

Aristotle is wrong about much more than ethics (his defense of slavery is criminal) and physics. Also, consider his theory of poetry: of the roughly one dozen dramatists active in the classical era, and the several hundred plays that they wrote, only three writers left plays more or less intact fewer than fifty plays. Of this sliver, Aristotle's theory explains three or maybe four. Now it's a nice theory. Much can be said in favor of his theory of tragedy; but explanatory power it hasn't got.

[@thefakeslimshady8881]

You missed the best part of the Diogenes meeting Alexander story. Reportedly after asking him to move to the side and stop blocking his sun Alexander turned to his guards and said “if I was not Alexander I would want to be Diogenes” and Diogenes replied “if I was not Diogenes I would also want to be Diogenes”

[@AishathFauzaaIbrahim]

Lol

[@jacobschneider1455]

My favorite story of Diogenes is when he walked through Athens in broad daylight with a lit lantern with the goal of “looking for an honest man”

[@jamesphillips531]

Diogenes: "If there is a reason, then there is a hole to poke. That's why I pee in the streets."

[@plate_fox]

All Florida men share him as an ancestor

[@jamesphillips531]

@@plate_fox as a florida man I can confirm this

[@Center-For-I.E.D.Mismanagement]

If all Floridian men share ancestry with Diogenes, then I'd say they only inherited the trait of 'peeing in the streets.' Having a reason for doing it is likely not included. Lol

[@Armendicus]

@@Center-For-I.E.D.Mismanagement yeah but scientists don't know why. Also they inherited mastery over reptiles as they manage to not get bit during their antics.

[@DatBoi-gi3vq]

@@Armendicus this is a byproduct of the inherent animalfriend genes in the Diogenes the original had an army of street dogs whom he was bros with

[@i_am_Emmet]

Imagine you’re just chilling and some random dude runs in with a featherless chicken screaming “BEHOLD A MAN!” That would be hilarious

[@Hoobastomp]

You should read up on the other Cynics (because Cynicism was an entire school of philosophy, although one with no "teachers" - you would just roll up one day and follow the example of some homeless guy), like Crates of Thebes. He was known as the Door Opener, because he would just randomly walk into people's houses and yell at them for having possessions and not being homeless and virtuous like him. And it worked! Apparently the Cynics were surprisingly successful in convincing people to abandon material possessions and live in the streets. I've read an ancient Stoic essay that basically said, "For the love of god stop listening to the Cynics, they're all assholes and you'll make your parents sad."

[@thebowiththemost119]

@@Hoobastomp now I am just imagining a homeless man high on crack breaking into a house and yelling “you should be like me! Give up your possessions! Live a truly free life!” While the parents either call 911 or get the shotgun and the kids are in a corner crying in terror.

[@alecchristiaen4856]

Just see a hobo with a chicken running for the nearest university.

[@jose-qp4yz]

​@@Hoobastomp do you remember the title of the Stoic essay? quite interested in reading it

[@nano65114]

@@Hoobastomp Shitposting. A practice as old as time.

[@kaithos392]

Students: "So Plato, what do you think of that Diogenes guy?" Plato (probably facepalming): "He is a Socrates...gone mad."

[@josephperez2004]

The whole thing with Socrates and his eventually execution by Athens was nuts because he basically double dared them to kill him by suggesting that they should punish him with and insultingly small fine instead, which got the few people that were sort of on the fence about passing a death sentence on an old man who just talked too much easily over it. Then his death sentence got dragged out much longer than it should have because it was illegal to execute anyone during a certain event that ended up lasting much longer than normal. All the while Socrates stubbornly refused to either apologize and seek mercy or even to attempt to escape Athens. He basically died on principle.

[@jachinnelson5786]

@@josephperez2004 Socrates found his hill, and nobody could convince him to not die on it

[@daviddaugherty2816]

He was so contrary, he hamstrung his own legal defense. That is commitment to a bit.

[@Obi-Wan_Kenobi]

Socrates was twitch steamer to pulled off amazing players but could never be bothered to record them. Plato was his dedicated viewers who could not let those 360 no-scopes go unseen so he clips them and uploads compilations on KZbin. I don't have the time for twitch so I thank all the Plato's out there on KZbin. Good job.

[@tiamat9874]

Turns out Plato is also a god but he pretends its Socrates

[@-AirKat-]

“What is a man? A miserable featherless biped”

[@rosenberg2497]

A plucked chicken would not be very happy

[@StarshadowMelody]

You just made me realize "pile of secrets" has the same number of syllables as "featherless biped"

[@Sirhc_B8207]

@@StarshadowMelody every time I hear/read "featherless biped", I hear the splat noise from Sam O'Nella's video on Diogenes

[@danielbeaney4407]

"The best place to spit in a rich mans home, is his face." Yep sounds like something a man who lived in a barrel would say. Also fun fact Diogenes not only pissed in the street or banquet tables. He also pissed on people who disagreed with him

[@Fanimati0n]

& bit them

[@stephenflint3640]

I'd definitely prefer wet sandals over getting mauled.

[@anelbegic2780]

What a legend. If only he wws born in the modern day.

[@edmundthespiffing2920]

What an absolute lad

[@slithra227]

It wasn't just that they disagreed, people also harassed him all the time and kids would follow him around so honestly he's probably in the right here

[@supremeleaderaiden1211]

Philosophy today: nothing is real philosophy in ancient times: HOW TO BEAT EVERYONE IN AN ARGUMENT, TALK DOWN TO CONQUERORS, AND PEE IN THE STREET!

[@omnitroph1501]

ALSO NOTHING IS REAL!

[@carso1500]

@@omnitroph1501 and sometimes "EVERYTHING IS MADE OF FIRE"

[@omnitroph1501]

@@carso1500 NO, IT'S ALL MADE OF WATER YOU NUMBSKULL!

[@firstnext5482]

@@omnitroph1501 YOU'RE BOTH WRONG, EVERYTHING IS NUMBERS AND EQUATIONS

[@omnitroph1501]

@@firstnext5482 SHUT UP NEWTON, MATH HASN'T BEEN INVENTED YET

[@deathstar6998]

One of my favorite things I heard Diogenes do was when Aristotle was busy saying that every object had a perfect ethereal form. Diogenes then argued: But that would mean there is a perfect void. Aristotle said: yes there would be Diogenes then said: Where Aristotle paused for a moment before Diogenes walked up to him and poked his head and said: There

[@eaglehood224]

If I remember correctly, Diogenes pulled the same trick on Plato so I guess he learned form this experience

[@deathstar6998]

@@eaglehood224 I think with Plato it was a chicken but yeah

[@eaglehood224]

@@deathstar6998 "BEHOLD! PLATO'S MAN"

[@deathstar6998]

@@eaglehood224 Yes, total troll man XD

[@ragingphoenix6196]

EMOTIONAL DAMAGE

[@WilyGryphon]

Diogenes the Cynic was just awesome. Another great exchange between him and Alexander the Waking Parasol: When Alexander noticed Diogenes looking attentively at a pile of human bones and asked what he was doing, Diogenes replied with, "I am searching for the bones of your father but cannot distinguish them from those of a slave."

[@miller_niki1982]

“By some definitions a coconut could be classified as a mammal. What?!” Thank you, Blue, I needed that today!

[@jmurray1110]

There’s a reason we use a fuel nested hierarchy

[@Xalerdane]

It’s covered in hair and produces milk.

[@MsPageMistress]

...this Gorgias sounds fascinating for the Helen thing alone. And just imagine Plato wrestling some dude and thinking super deep things. Diogenes: a bit of a philosophical troll, but not exactly wrong. Democritius: Not only was right about the atom, but honestly his tree chopping explanation still works for actually explaining atoms. Now, Fs and sad emojis for the lost classical literature! F😭

[@nunyobidniz]

F

[@carbonmonteroy]

F

[@nonya1366]

Sometimes troll logic works.

[@stephenflint3640]

Is it really being a troll if the hot takes being spat are actually fundamentally sound? Yes, especially after the guy bit the shit out of you for commentating on his ideas

[@Kuwagumo]

F

[@ploppman7524]

I love the illustration of Diogenes. It radiates pure "I'm done with this"-energy.

[@HoneydewBeach]

Let’s be real here, everyone couldn’t stop laughing when they first heard about Diogenes

[@urielantoniobarcelosavenda780]

Nah, I firts heard of him when my cousin told me about him and Alexander (not the funny part, only the badass part), the second time, however, I laugh

[@Tianna616]

That man is goals

[@elcorpus2000]

Is funnier if you're hispanic because you eventually will hear that he lived in a barrel like a very famous character called Chavo

[@Soy_boi]

My philosophy teacher was like a holy mix of Socrates and Diogenes. So just 100% done with people

[@thehalfnegativeoptimist4578]

I love how red and blue always use terms like “ Alexander the pretty all right” or “ Alexander the not especially studious”

[@isabelheiner631]

It really is amazing and painful the one time Blue says "Great" in that one Alexander video. XD

[@LordDeathwing17]

My favorites are “Alexander the Thoroughly Miffed” and “Alex-SAND-er the Is-Coarse-And-Rough-And-Irritating-And-It-Gets-Everywhere”

[@Phantom-qr1ug]

@@LordDeathwing17 Can't forget the classic "Alexander the Pretty Alright" and "Alexander the Not-Actually-That-Bad-When-You-Get-To-Know-Him"

[@WHATTHEHELL666]

My favorite is "Alexander the Twink" because it's funny./g

[@daviddaugherty2816]

I can't remember what video, but Blue once used "Alexander the Plot Armor".

[@fullmetaltheorist]

So basically Aristotle is like my math teacher. He always gets thing wrong but nobody should question him cause he's the one teaching us, even though he's wrong most of the time.

[@MrSamulai]

So he's also wrong about the fact that he's teaching you.

[@zoro115-s6b]

I had a few times in school where the teacher would say something, and I'd be like: "Well, actually...." And the teacher would actually say: "Yes, I know that's not actually correct, but it's what's in the curriculum and it's the answer that's going to be on the test."

[@gormauslander]

@@zoro115-s6b the fault in our curriculum

[@zoro115-s6b]

@@gormauslander When the schools are still teaching something even though the teachers and students both know it's bullshit, you know your education system is trash.

[@gormauslander]

@@zoro115-s6b agree. Also if they're teaching stuff you won't remember because you won't use it, you're just wasting time

[@jamesknighton4489]

"It time for deep thoughts with Heinlein"

[@Valery0p5]

Heinlein: _Freud_ _was right about everything_ *Mic drop* "That concludes deep thoughts with Heinlein"

[@CDexie]

@@Valery0p5 _Unless its gay, of course._

[@Vfox1983]

So that makes me wonder, who is histories earliest known troll? Because living in a barrel because houses are for losers, plucking a chicken to make a point and metaphorically rubbing it in other philosophers faces and telling the clepto-king to move out of his sunlight is pretty epic. Haha.

[@zoro115-s6b]

I'm fairly certain Diogenes was just Oscar The Grouch.

[@lith_verhen5553]

i think the "behold, a man" was the top

[@Vfox1983]

@@zoro115-s6b I mean... Barrel... Trash can... Spouting helpful yet cynical advice. Yep. I agree. Hahah!

[@Vfox1983]

@@lith_verhen5553 Google how he taught others to deal with the urges of the flesh for a good chuckle. Lol

[@zoro115-s6b]

@@Vfox1983 And he told Alexander The Adjective to scram.

[@generalvictorironraven.1347]

"Alexander the big deal King guy who was on his way to conquer the everything" One of the best sentences I've heard said out loud!

[@jmd9402]

I just wanna see gorgias and diogenes just randomly encounter each other and start having a debate that becomes the philosophy equivalent of a prank war.

[@kitsunefirefox1986]

Athenian student: Master the hour is late may we go home? Plato (throws off robe) Until you pin me class is not over! Random student: Please be reasonable Plato: Stop crying & fight your tutor!

[@anelbegic2780]

Ill be honest i read that the wrong way and sexy sax man started playing in my head until the second half of your comment.

[@blarg2429]

@@anelbegic2780 Many Greek philosophers were _like that_ too actually. Plato considered boning your students to be unprofessional and that's why we use the word "platonic" to mean "lacking in romantic or sexual elements."

[@anelbegic2780]

@@blarg2429 you would think the greeks if all people would be okay with it, do you know if this was the norm or was plato the exeption for non-philosophers as well?

[@blarg2429]

@@anelbegic2780 Plato was the exception, I believe.

[@gingermcgingin1733]

"What is this, Sparta?"

[@connorthompson66]

"In a rich man's house, there is no place to spit but his face." -Diogenes

[@wanderingursa8184]

I want a movie about Plato. And I want Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson to play him.

[@pactimnoob1131]

This would be one of the best movies

[@benthomason3307]

But Plato was an ancient White European. Wouldn't that be like having a Hispanic actor play Confucius?

[@CD-BVL]

@@benthomason3307 yeah bro but c'mon is the ROCK!

[@benthomason3307]

@@CD-BVL which is another good reason not to do it. I could see him playing Achilles if you put him in whiteface, but don't you think someone like a philosopher would be better suited for Leonard Nimoy?

[@CD-BVL]

@@benthomason3307 this comment is more like a joke bro, cuz if the Rock was gonna play Plato it would be a parody Plato because the rock makes mostly ridiculous movies about Chads who get tons of girls and save the world.

[@hellocentral5551]

New rule: all philosophers should take one fighting class before they get their degree, just so we can have philosophical arguments end via mortal combat!

[@gwest3644]

I love Diogenes. When King Perdiccas of Macedon said he would kill him if he didn’t come to him, Diogenes simply said “That’s nothing special, a beetle or tarantula could do the same thing.”

[@vazak11]

"When in a rich man's house the only place to spit is his face."

[@arandomcomment1092]

When in a rich man's house, the only food to eat is him

[@catwithagun902]

@@arandomcomment1092 ah, my friend I see you ascribe to the glorious movement of "eat the rich"

[@nicolebee3283]

Wise guys *Diogenes has entered the chat*

[@TheSpearkan]

BEHOLD A MAN

[@zelktheinvader7874]

@@TheSpearkan BEHOLD AN UNTHINKABLE PRESENT

[@shandaniel2999]

I saw the words “Greek wise guys” and now I’m thinking of a mafia movie in Ancient Greece. “So did Plato guy thinks he’s a wise guy see?” “Keep talking like that and you’ll be sleeping with Poseidon.”

[@stormrunner1177]

I mean, as long it’s not in the temple of Athena I think you’re alright. Edit: In regard to the statement on “sleeping with Poseidon”

[@non-bird-nary2420]

now i want this

[@SMon42]

Better then zeus.

[@shosty575]

It's a Godfather reference y'all

[@marissagalletta4452]

I absolutely love this✨✨✨

[@yanshero42]

"I'm searching for the bones of your father but I cannot distinguish them from those of a slave"

[@apodofseals]

"Philosophy - any deep, analytical thought on a subject" Any subject? So, does that mean that my worldbuilding for my D&D campaign is philosophy? I like this definition of philosophy.

[@callefolin]

Technically although not neccessarily. There is certainly a philosophy about *how* or *why* you should do it, but I wouldn't call worldbuilding itself philosophy unless you're worldbuilding as part of that deeper analytical thought on the subject.

[@pathfindersavant3988]

"We live in a society" - Diogenes, probably.

[@samrevlej9331]

"Don't believe everything you read on the internet" - Plato, probably

[@kusaisama]

@@samrevlej9331 Plato *probably.

[@GilgameshofBabylon]

Vizzini: Let me put it this way. Have you ever heard of Plato, Aristotle, Socrates? Westley: Yes. Vizzini: Morons.

[@SpaceNerd117]

One out of three ain't bad.

[@Mazou-tj4ne]

@@SpaceNerd117 Who exactly?

[@tibfulv]

@@Mazou-tj4ne Plato.

[@BHuang92]

If I were not Alexander, I should wish to be Diogenes. -Alexander the Great

[@acelite3482]

if i were not diogenes, I should wish to be diogenes -Diogenes

[@danieljames1868]

There is something to be said for having the sheer chutzpah to look at the labyrinthine mess that is society and then just openly scoff at it.

[@arandomcomment1092]

Ah. The only time he showed humility

[@owenfrank3337]

God, I love this channel. You sir single-handedly made me the cool kid in my philosophy class. As a history dork in my grade 12 intro to philosophy class, I already had some prior knowledge, unfortunately, my peers did not, with a dry textbook and grouchy teacher people were confused and angry. Enter This video. Now I am hailed as a hero. So thanks?

[@TheDiplomancer]

My favorite Diogenes vs Alexander the Something goes like this: One day, Alexander saw Diogenes in front of a pile of bones, and because he either didn't know he was about to get verbally smacked or simply because he enjoyed the cynic's masterful trolling, asked, "What are you doing?" Diogenes responded, "I am looking for the bones of your father, but I cannot distinguish them from the bones of a slave."

[@valentinarunko67]

Worse burn than a 'yo momma' joke 😂

[@ladyzapzap9514]

@@valentinarunko67and FAR more classy. Masterclass vs 7 yr old with a fart joke.

[@Hinatazuki]

Part of me wants Diogenes to tar and feather himself, walk in, and start frantically squawking: “BOK BOK I’M BIRD NOW, BOK Can I have free corn? 🥺”

[@JessWLStuart]

"The Philosophers Song" - Monty Pythons attempt at Blue's "History Hijinks: Greek Wise Guys"

[@nigeldepledge3790]

Although, to be fair, Python also covered the 18th and 19th centuries. Emmanuel Kant was a real piss-ant who was very rarely stable, / Heidegger, Heidegger was a boozy beggar who could think you under the table. / David Hume could out-consume Schopenhauer and Hegel; / and Wittgenstein was a beery swine who was just as sloshed as Schlegel. There's nothing Nietsche couldn't teach ya 'bout the raising of the wrist : / Socrates himself was permanently pissed. John Stuart Mill, of his own free will, on a half a pint of shandy was particularly ill; / Plato, they say, could stick it away : half a crate of whisky every day. / Aristotle, Aristotle was a bugger for the bottle; / Hobbs was fond of his dram; / And René Decartes was a drunken fart : "I drink, therefore I am!" Yes, Socrates himself is particularly missed : / A lovely little thinker but a bugger when he's pissed!

[@eldorados_lost_searcher]

@@nigeldepledge3790 I just sang this out loud, and my kids are looking at me like I'm crazy. It's good to be the paterfamilias.

[@alisaurus4224]

@@nigeldepledge3790 “just as sloshed as Schlegel” is a real tongue-twister

[@nigeldepledge3790]

@@alisaurus4224 - I might be wrong, but in my recollection they actually sang it as "shloshed"....

[@julianjpantoja4603]

I can just picture diogenese going on a morning walk with a cup of coffee in hand, sees a kid drinking from a river with his bare hands and thinks, “oh shit that’s genius” and impulsively throws out his only material possession

[@urielantoniobarcelosavenda780]

Wait... You know that or you dupossed that

[@AubriGryphon]

Aristotle's writings are a flowing river of gold, not unlike that emanating from the men's room at a football game.

[@coltonwilliams4153]

Now that sounds like a Diogenes! If he was feeling poetic.

[@femoman]

One of my new favourite things is when Blue combines academic jargon with modern slang. For example "Citations in the Archaic period are jank-city"

[@altejoh]

Aristotle and several people after him go a long way to show that the way to getting a theory of the way the world works to be well accepted isn't from being factually correct, but by being well-liked as a person. Which really sucks when it takes hundreds of years for someone else to come along and discover that it really doesn't explain the natural world at all.

[@kylepessell1350]

Unfortunately, people (most people) perceive those different from them to be a possible threat since an instinctual rule of survival even in social animals is that which is unfamiliar also can't be trusted so in order to be accepted by a large number of people it's necessary for even an exceptionally charismatic person to learn how to change the way people perceive you to their own liking. Those who are naive enough to think this isn't necessary often get forgotten by history while those for whom it comes to naturally are inclined to use it for their own benefit. It's only the rare few who can tolerate manipulating others while retaining their own honorable intentions that can get their earnest ideals to last significantly longer than themselves. Now, that isn't to say all honorable intentions are always correct and might even be more damaging since people can more easily forgive those intentions or perhaps believe them because of those intentions when they might have doubted those with more obviously malicious intent.

[@georgethompson1460]

I mean considering these guys where all natural philosophers and mostly just thought about reality and tried to reason it through intuition rather than doing empirical experiments I think I can cut him some slack.

[@shounenbat510]

It reminds me of a line from a song from the musical Wicked: When I see depressing creatures With unprepossessing features I remind them on their own behalf to think of Celebrated heads of state or Especially great communicators Did they have brains or knowledge? Don't make me laugh! They were popular! Please, it's all about popular It's not about aptitude, it's the way you're viewed So it's very shrewd to be Very, very popular like me!

[@teal_m_101]

Dear Athens, You claim to love Democracy, Yet you forced Socrates to drink hemlock because he was speaking his mind. Curious.'

[@DrewLSsix]

Democracy and freedom of speech are two different concepts, you can have a vote and still not be allowed dissenting opinions.

[@daidabus]

i mean if people voted for him to get killed it's still democracy.

[@coreytaylor447]

democracy and free speech may be considered inseparable today, but they can exist as two separate things. especially back when freedom of speech hadn't been invented yer

[@timothymclean]

Ancient Greece kinda sucked. For all that Athens was an imperialist oligarchy (in the modern sense-Ancient Greece had stricter definitions of who counted as a person for political purposes), at least it wasn't Sparta with its helot population outnumbering the freedmen and citizens ~5 to 1 _and_ being treated so badly that other slave-owning Greeks criticized them for it. The other poleis weren't great, either, they just weren't as prominent in their badness. Ancient Greece sucks.

[@jamesgrinsen1085]

I’m sure they voted before killing him.

[@shockingheaven]

Pro tip: talk to Plato, but never say "fight me" when you're arguing

[@jonathankent1517]

Plato: SQUARE UP, THOT.

[@Athena963]

You can really tell that Diogenes and Dionosys would have got along- their names even come from the same root!

[@benthomason3307]

Even as a kid, I was amazed at how Aristotle kept both a)turning up in nearly _every single textbook the school gave me,_ and B) being wrong. "You can see the logic he was working with, but he was still wrong." Is honestly a great summary of his entire worldview. In college I took a class on logic and fallacies, which shocked me, because to my knowledge that's the only field where Aristotle's ideas _actually stuck._

[@dreyri2736]

Not really. His metaphysics is still talked abou. And you really cannot get anywhere without metaphysics. Science has always been just a branch of philosophy. Also, how do you know that most of what you've read in school now won't be considered wrong in the future? Do you think there is no such thing as development in science? Do you really need to give a shit about the fact that Newton believed in luminiferrous aether like everyone else at the time or that objects do not have any color outside of our senses whenever you read about gravity? You realize that even newtonian physics has been considered outdated since einstein? Yet nobody is saying that Newton was wrong like when they say Aristotle was wrong for thinking that the reason things fell to the ground was because it is in their nature to seek the ground (which, when understood a certain way, may as well just be about gravity).

[@benthomason3307]

@@dreyri2736 science is _not_ a branch of philosophy. science is documentation of observations and inferences, while philosophy is speculation and logical arguments.

[@dreyri2736]

@@benthomason3307 philosophy can also be observation and documentation. That's what philosophers have always done. They, however, also try to make sense of these things and create logical systems from it which can become their own new thing. Philosophy used to be called natural philosophy back when universities only had two courses availabke, the other one being theology. Everything you call science and the scientific method is the product of philosophical reasoning by men like Francis Bacon, Descartes, and even Empericus, whose name became empericism (he, unlike hippocrates, did not bother with trying to make a theory as to how the body worked and said it would be sufficient to only go by experience and observation as to what worked in healing people). In fact, everything except theology in universities today is just another branch of philosophy but made more specialized/dogmatic. Even stuff like literature. You know who pioneered literary criticism? Aristotle! Also, you don't document inferences. You derive them from something via reasoning. Also also, a lot of what we call "string theory" is also just speculation.

[@volfi123]

The traditional sciences are all part of philosophy. You might get a degree that says Biology, Physics , Mathematics etc but its still a degree in philosophy.

[@NateJensen1991]

"That becomes especially true after Descartes." Decartes? Decartes is easy. Try Hegel.

[@shadowofdimentio4618]

Descartes literally stated 'I think therefore I am'. Very simple to get your head around. Unless your a philosopher who decides to question what 'am', 'I', and 'Think' means... Fucking Phenomenology

[@ulisesdimopulos4376]

@@shadowofdimentio4618 the question is what type of philosopher doesn’t question the definitions of “I”, “think” and “am”. Especially “am”

[@Halberddent]

I haven't studied philosophy much, but I read some Derrida in a criticism class and that guy is bonkers.

[@phastinemoon]

@@shadowofdimentio4618 I mean, it’s a pretty circular argument, which is EXCEPTIONALLY intellectually lazy.

[@GabrielLopez-mo2xo]

I mean Descartes did start the divide that ended us up with a philosophy of mind and one of body so I think he bares a good bit of blame

[@abthedragon4921]

"Greek Philosophical Pantheon." Wow, if there was a shirt for every awesome OSP quote, there'd be one for each day of the year.

[@ZekeGraal]

We'd probably have enough for a different one for each day of our life at this point lol

[@marcelostalker]

I agree with the points on Aristotle here but, in his defence, he never made anyone take his ideas as absolute truth, people just did it, and I'm pretty sure he'd prefer if said people proved him wrong, for Aristotle had a love of learning and improving the overall knowledge humanity has of itself and the world us and stuff.

[@melchid8448]

Also its kinda funny how people take democritus word for true when we kinda like cut atoms and has been playing with sub atomic particles for a long time. If anything I would say Aristotle is still closer to truth considering he was pretty close to understanding that anything and any matter was made out of fundamental features of universe,he just didnt had any observation of quantum particles so he went with the five element thing.

[@marconarvaez9871]

This is totally unrelated to anything but we both have the same name and profile picture...

[@callefolin]

@@melchid8448 what we call "fundamental particles" is what he meant by atoms. It's just that when we discovered what we now call atoms, we thought they couldn't be divided but Democritus reffered to the smallest non-divisible building blocks ie our fundamental particles.

[@ragtimegalcatty]

9:02 I keep hearing "Sinnoh" instead of Sinope and I can't help but imagine Pokemon trainer Diogenes

[@kusaisama]

Trainer Diogenes sent out rabid dog!

[@josephperez2004]

Honestly, a Pokemon Region based on Ancient Greece where Trainers are also philosophers would be hilarious, but I doubt Nintendo would Sanction it.

[@alexsch2514]

@@josephperez2004 but they could probably get away with a gym leader that's philosophy-themed.

[@thekenyonsquad5672]

diogenes would be the pokemon professor

[@doofinpuss23]

Anyone else picture Cyan walking into the room and just giving Blue back pats as he cries?

[@YiannissB.]

Imagine if history remembered you only by the name your palls gave you in the gym. "Aight kids, today will discuss the Jacked man's take on Athenian democracy." Not so glorious thy name now, ain't it Plato?

[@GreMnMlin]

No no no, that makes it even more glorious. Imagine saying I'm reading The Jacked Man's "Republic"

[@UpSky2]

Actually his nickname just amounts to .... HUGE JACKEDMAN !

[@GreMnMlin]

@@UpSky2 that makes it even more awesome

[@zoro115-s6b]

TBH I'd be down for being remembered all through history not only for my philosophical takes, but also for exceptional physical strength and martial prowess. Like... Where's the downside?

[@fruitygarlic3601]

"Professor, what does Caked Glute Stevie have to say about the ethics of telling lies?"

[@argoroco]

"Ever since I can remember, I've always wanted to be a philosopher."

[@ozzymetalface7363]

Exurb1a.exe

[@FirstnameLastname-kn5sw]

You think I'm funny? I amuse you?

[@tomfillot5453]

Blue: "His biology is mostly busted" Aristotle: "Sorry I counted the teeth wrong, okay ? I was too busy inventing modern biology during ancient greece." For real tho, he wrote 6 books, named and described more than 500 species by himself, probably dissected more than 30 and described their organs. It's the first attempt at systematic classification, compiling many accurate first description of animals, including marine animals, a lot of which (octopus camouflage ability) were considered wrong until proven right millenia later. Also, he possibly didn't count the teeth wrong, and relates unknowingly that women had a poorer diet than men in Athens, and there very well might have been a lot of women in Athens with a few teeth missing. Turns out Democritus was more on the money, but Aristotle's method was way closer to what we would call the scientific method. He didn't figure out control experiments, though.

[@ButterflyScarlet]

Fair enough but like at what point during his scientific method did he conclude that the uterus was some separate parasitic being that could migrate around the body?

[@tomfillot5453]

@@ButterflyScarlet Let's say that at least, he based most of his theories on observations (either reported or first hand), while most of the rest just winged it. The reasoning leading to atoms was pretty, but not much more, and also there's no water or wood atoms. Aristotle "experiment" for the 5 elements seems completely busted to us, but at least there's one. I'm not an expert, I can't say on what he based this parasitic thing, although the root cause is probably misogyny. But for example, he correctly classified cetaceans as mammals, which is something. Overall, in biology, his work as been quite rehabilitated for what it is, an impressive early first attempt. It's quite expected that it would contain errors. Interestingly, while the west conserved only the philosophical work, the egyptians, later romans and then Arabs work with the rest, with some scholar incrementally correcting it with their own observations.

[@blarg2429]

@@ButterflyScarlet TBF, an unborn child is essentially a harmful parasite from a medical perspective. The uterus itself is blameless in this and misogynists both ancient and contemporary can get bent, but the human reproductive process really is rough.

[@deiansalazar140]

@@blarg2429 Calling a human being a parasite is disgusting behavior. You should be ashamed. Abortion or not that dehumanizing talk is NOT okay.

[@solalflechelles1216]

@@deiansalazar140 ... Calm down. Like it or not, an unborn child is a parasite, ie an organism that lives in a host and feeds at the expense of the host. That's just objective reality and there's nothing dehumanizing about it.

[@georgeedgeworth3853]

"Loss of literature" He then proceeds to laugh and cry. Now I don't know why but I relate with Blue here

[@Osric24]

Lost knowledge is a travesty. We all relate with Blue here.

[@SarcasticSloth69]

I never get tired of hearing the story of Diogenes from different history videos on KZbin, especially the featherless biped part

[@legateelizabeth]

"Philosophy is needlessly confusing and pretentious" is an understatement. I can speak academic *fairly* well and having to translate philosophical ramblings of several paragraphs into one paragraph that gets to the point and keep a glossary on-hand of what each philosopher redefines any given Word Made Capital to mean instead of it's actual meaning makes me want to blow my own brains out. And I literally have "pretentious" in my user name. Philosophers feel like they're deliberately trying to be needlessly obtuse most of the time.

[@nunyobidniz]

_this_

[@Tomeroche]

It's sort of needed. Ignoring Rhetoric and trying to get your ideas to spread the fact is that communication between humans is inherently limited. You can't directly beam knowledge and context into your audience's brain so you run into a lot of issues when it comes to communicating complex ideas. This isn't a problem in laymans conversations where broad strokes understanding is acceptable but when you want to communicate new information that you subject doesn't have a frame of reference for it becomes much more important to be descriptive. It's very easy to take for granted how much knowledge is available to the average person nowadays that you can forget that people at one point in history didn't know the vast majority of what we take as common knowledge. It'd be sort of like trying to file share an MP3 to the first MacIntosh computers. Yeah, every computer now can read MP3s by default but there was a point where that shit was revolutionary and trying to share that data with another computer was a crapshoot since you couldn't be sure if they had the software to play it.

[@jemolk8945]

Speaking as a philosopher, I feel a certain need to speak up for people in my discipline. We're always working with concepts that can't be directly investigated, and trying to use indirect investigation to get at the true nature of reality. We don't use truckloads of technical jargon just for the fun of it. We do it because we need, desperately, to be precise where normal speech is imprecise. We define terms narrowly for the sake of a single paper, sometimes in ways different from other people and other papers, because we're trying to talk about things that have no normal words to talk about them. Usually that's because one way of looking at them has simply been assumed for so long that it's seen as "normal" and any alternative is unthinkable. I suppose you could say that we use as much obscure and technical language as we do because, ironically, we're trying really hard to _not_ be like Aristotle or his followers, and trying to question assumptions like the ones they made.

[@legateelizabeth]

@@jemolk8945 And while I appreciate that communicating ideas is hard, I still feel you could absolutely take it down a notch and not be SO wordy, it feels like it's academia for academia's sake sometimes (or possibly just because reading all that stuff for so long results in writing the same way without realising it). At the very least borrow from Germans and invent new words rather than capitalising old ones - even laymen know what "zeitgeist" means, but having to find which specific example of "Meaning" or "Nature" any given philosopher is using and then jumping between philosophers and so changing the meaning of the word *again* is going to drive me mad and causes more confusion than it solves. It's just so outsider unfriendly that it strikes me as not even _attempting_ to communicate the ideas with anyone outside the academic --circlejerk-- field. And if you can't communicate ideas to the layity... why even write them down except as a kind of self-indulgence? Science has "science communicators" to condense those very complicated ideas of advanced science down into something people can understand; if natural philosophy can do it, maybe the other philosophy should give it a try too.

[@jemolk8945]

@@legateelizabeth I mostly agree, for the record. Some specific late 19th and early 20th century philosophers are especially bad about this. Looking at you, Hegel. But, well, most of the papers I've been reading recently are sincerely trying to get across the ideas as clearly and concisely as possible, and it just turns out that the answer to how clear and concise is possible is "not very, by normal standards." Unfortunately.

[@mythosandlogos]

Alexander: “If I were any other man, I would choose to be Diogenes.” Diogenes: “If I were any other man, I would also wish to be Diogenes.” Well done, a fun introduction that should lower the intimidation factor to anyone looking to study Philosophy! PS, The value in Aristotle wasn’t whether his conclusions were correct (how much of our common knowledge will be found to be incorrect in millennia?) but the processes of thought he developed to come to them. Aquinas applied Aristotle to Theology, Dante applied Aristotle to Cosmology, heck, even Ayn Rand is essentially a radically Capitalist reading of Aristotle.

[@michaeljones8495]

Hey blue, could I interest you in nonchalantly saying "I'm blue, da ba dee da ba die" in the next podcast episode?

[@caipingcui7594]

..fuck

[@williamking6787]

Love your cover for "Republic" at 5:11

[@DAsrada]

Ben Shapiro: Who...are you? Gorgias: I am you, but even more insufferable.

[@DAsrada]

@@grzegorzbrzeczyszczykiewic563 Gorgias: Gorgias COMPLETELY DESTROYS Benjamin from Shapiro with dedicated rationale, study and comprehensive elucidation!

[@jonathankent1517]

SELL THEIR TEMPLES TO WHO, GORGIAS?!!! FUCKING AQUAMAN?!!!