Part 3 of the Dating of the Mahabharata with Dr. Manish Pandit

[@piatweets]

Thank ful to manishji and the anchor for bringing all of this together for the benefit of jigyasoos . Hoping to see this in our school curriculum now with the NEP 2020. Pranam.

[@SaraswatiFilms]

Pranaam and Dhanyawaad.

[@MilindJoshiPune]

Very intuitive session.

[@kanchanavasudevan4509]

RV: 1. Can we request Manish Ji to give us the date of birth of Shri Krishna. We understand that HE was 89 (125-36) years old at the time of the war. His avathara took place at the time of Jayanti ( Krishna Paksha Ashtami & Rohini Nakshatra are present) at late evening on a wednesday, in the month of Shraavan. If we can locate such a date , it would be additional confirmation for the MB war date of 3067 BCE. Various Astronomical observations are available in Bhagawatha Purana also, which could be used for cross verification. 2. Karna wanted to be better than Arjuna at any cost and goes to Parashu Rama, who is the Guru of Dronacharya also, for getting Divyaastras. At that time he was already the crown prince of Anga Desha. ( A kshatriya Function ). But Karna hides this information from ParashuRama before becoming HIS Shishyaa. Cheating of ones Guru is not a mild misdeed. This is the reason why Parashu Rama gets angry with Karna when HE comes to know that Karna is not a Brahmin ,who is dedicated for the common Good. 3. Karna's ambition was to defeat Arjuna in a Duel or kill him in the MB war. To achieve this he had undertaken 2 vratas/ .vows. (a) He will not say "NO" to any thing as Daana/ charity to any Brahmin or any deserving candidate. (b) He will not wash his feet till he is able to defeat / kill Arjuna ( inconveniencing himself, akin to Tapas). He fulfils his vratas. So he ought to have been given the privilege of defeating/ killing Arjuna. But Krishna had different plans. He had vowed to ensure Pandavas win. As a consolation he is given a small victory over Arjuna on 16th day War, Arjuna is pushed to a corner in a difficult situation, but Karna is not able to capitalize on the same, due to Sun setting , after which he loses part of his capabilities. Krishna praises Karna's powerful shots , being manifold more powerful than Arjuna's. The next day, Karna is no match to Arjuna like the 3 earlier occasions of Drowpadi Swayamwar, Ghosha Yatra & Gow grahana episodes. When Karna is pulling out the wheel of his Chariot ,Arjuna is against hitting him but Krishna asks Arjuna to hit him and kill him. Krishna would have asked Arjuna to do like this only due to a curse on Karna, not otherwise. Now the issue before Krishna is like this: Karna has fulfilled his Vratas and hence deserved to get his ambition fulfilled, ie. Getting Arjuna killed. However this does not fit in the overall plan of Krishna. And as per his own plan ,Krishna gets Karna killed by Arjuna . This leaves a whole lot of Punya/ karma in the hands of Karna , which cannot be technically carried forward to next/ future lives / Swargaloka etc. because Arjuna will not be there. In order to mete out justice to him/ for his Vrata, , Krishna offers him Moksha directly. One of the conditions, for attaining Moksha is that the person extinguishes all his Punya and Papa . Papas are cancelled out due to his death/ nature of his death. Hence Krishna himself takes the form of a Brahmin and takes away all his Punya Karma as Daana and grants him Moksha. 4.

[@MrSirAussie]

Fascinating and Surreal dating technics. Thanks. Brilliant prediction of the Air-crash. Please let us know of key future key events and how you have figured it out Astrologically. Jai Shri Ram. JAI HIND

[@SaraswatiFilms]

Pranaam. Dhanyawaad. Avashya:)

[@beyoufirst1110]

Very informative session sir THANK YOU 👏

[@suhasinidasi3126]

Hare Krishna. Prabhuji you have truly "cracked the Mahabharat" in this one video. Prabhu please teach ISKCON devotees in this manner too so that they may also benefit from the nectar of your knowledge. Hare Krishna

[@prasadpopuri9019]

PGurus may interview prominent personalities in areas like science. India badly needs invention and innovation in science.

[@mayarajeev3487]

Such a wonderful session. Eagerly waiting for the next .

[@sasankt7068]

I liked the discussion between you and nilesh oak Guruji... I did not get to understand or keep in time for the discussion but I feel like the date of MB is around 5000 BC as he talks ... I might be wrong... and you both accepted to have more talks like that... please plan.. as we need more discussion for the world to accept Sanathna Dharma

[@vijaynarsapur147]

What shocks me is the recording of all events using astronomical markers... thousands of years ago

[@souviksaha856]

Vow ! Amazing 🙏

[@vijaykoundinyatheki]

(long) Sir, I think karna's character has been exaggerated more than required in recent times, mainly by movies in telugu. Karna is definitely not an evil character, he knows that if he comes out with his true identity, he can get the whole kingdom and Yudhishtir will not even stand in front of him even for a second, but he gave that up, without a doubt that is a great act of sacrifice, but his character I think should be examined much more closely. He did Dana but expected returns, after Ghosha yatra, he says to Duryodhan that he'll take a dana vrata, he'll give what ever a bramhana asks from him but will seek blssings of victory, he gave up his armor when Indra comes to him disguised (he knows Indra is coming) but asks for Shakti in return, people say Indra gave on his own, but as far as I know Karna asks for it in return, so that he can kill Arjuna. His friendship: He was the one who gave the idea to Duryodhan to de-robe Draupadi mata in front of a whole sabha, an act of worst kind. He was the one who gave idea to Duryodhan to marry her, that's when Duryodhan hits his thigh and Bheema takes an oath to kill Duryodhan by breaking his thighs, indirectly Karna caused Duryodhan's death. He always pushes Duryodhan for war (Ghosha yatra, Dakshina goo grahanam, etc, he never won against Arjuna anywhere, yet people say he's equal to Arjuna) He lied to Duryodhan about his skill and astras, he didn't tell Duryodhan about the shraps he got. He is a major war monger, only because he wants to fight against Arjuna and prove he's better. His Valor: Karna is no doubt a warrior of super human class, but he's not greater than Arjuna. he lost to Arjuna twice in Goo grahana, he was saved by Arjuna in Ghosha Yatra and all this is when he had the divine armor. In Kurukshetra, Karna did put his soul and blood and gave Arjuna one of the toughest times in his life, yet Arjuna also showed him stars. Yes, things were set to be in favor of Arjuna but that's not because Krishna was scared of Karna, but due to dharma followed by Arjuna. So, I think all these (and many others) should be considered before we judge. After the war, Yudhishtir performed a yaga and gave the whole kingdom to the bramhanas who performed the yaga and got ready to leave to forest again, this time without returning, that according to me is dana, give without any expectations. Karna's dana has expectations (it is rajasa dana), Karna's friendship has selfish goals and glory expectations (rajasa), Karna's valor even though divine, it is not greater that Arjuna. Many such myths surround the character of Karna, but I think we need to see the whole story not just the war episode and decide who's what. There is no greater dana than the dana performed by Yudhisthir, there is no great philosopher than Bheema, there is no great warrior than Arjuna and Krishna.

[@thrinethran2885]

Bhishma was the greatest warrior of the Mahabharata, and he was not felled cleanly.

[@MsRkshukla]

Karna n for that matter friendship is never selfishnessless. He was a frnd of duryodhan. He at times opposed his cunning ways n wanted to take on pandvas in war. Remember he opposed lakshagraha.

[@vijaykoundinyatheki]

@@MsRkshukla Yes sir, he was a great friend , no doubt about it but all I'm saying is he has his flaws. He lied to Duryodhan about his astra shaktis, did not mention about his shraps, may be if he mentioned about them, may be Duryodhan might have considered peace, Duryodhan's main strength was Karna. Karna wanted war, only to prove his valor and gain glory, this is what I feel is his selfishness and for that he crossed all lines of respects. I feel we are exaggerating Karna's character and in the process, knowingly or unknowingly, we downplay Pandavas. The episode which Mr. Sree Iyer mentioned that Dharma devata trying to protect Karna and Krishna coming and asking his punya, I don't think that's there in moola bharatam, I need to verify, but as far as my knowledge goes it's not there. I might be wrong.

[@neeraj8278]

@@MsRkshukla he never opposed lakshagraha.He planned it with duryodhan

[@pushkarkelkar5971]

Yes phatak Guruji was a legend.

[@SaraswatiFilms]

Pranaam. Did you know him too?

[@pushkarkelkar5971]

SaraswatiFilms yes. Very less number of people will be there in Pune who don’t know phatak Guruji.

[@yavagalsomu]

Iyer sir. You need to get Mr. Nilesh Neelkanth Oak on your show. The debate has been raging between Pundit ji and Nilesh with regards to the date of Mahabharatha. Nilesh puts the date at about 5660 BC.

[@suhasinidasi3126]

Hare Krishna. Prabhuji Dr Pandit ji is correct on most of his points and Prabhu Nilesh ji is wrong on most of his points. In terms of how many points are wrong, Prabhuji Nilesh ji simply cannot escape the fact that he mistakes a late waning phase Moon for a waxing phase, does not prove Balarama's pilgrimage which Prabhuji Dr pandit ji does and Prabhuji Nilesh Oak ji misses the most important data which proves that the AV observation is also wrong in his hypothesis. Prabhuji Nilesh ji has had a long time on social media as an astronomer and is hence a known quantity whereas Prabhuji Dr pandit ji was only known as a great film maker before the debate. Even then, the very fact that people like me who used to implicitly back Prabhuji Nileshji so much for years and his date of 5561bc have now come to back Prabhuji Dr Pandit ji in a space of 3 months. (Thanks to Prabhuji Dr pandit ji making his book available for free web share and social media for this). Here is a taster of why people like me have changed sides and back Prabhuji Dr Pandit now. Hare Krishna datingthemahabharata.blogspot.com

[@satyanandaagyani3151]

Brilliant and mind blowing. Thats the only words for this presentation. Could Dr Pandit show any examples of what happens when the Kartik full moon is taken to be within the war? Would I be correct in presuming that this huge error must be in Mr Oak's idea of 5561bc?

[@dhananjaymansabdar9649]

🙏

[@pushkarkelkar5971]

Nice hangout. Still would like to know what other corroborative evidences can be used to set the timeline. Also the age of Shri Krishn and Arjun was going to be discussed in this hangout but wasn’t explored. Hopefully it will be taken up in next one.

[@SaraswatiFilms]

Pranaam. Yes, kindly remind me in the next QandA. I had the sky maps ready in this 3rd discussion but forgot to put it out.

[@pushkarkelkar5971]

SaraswatiFilms sure sir. Pranaam

[@AJ-gz9ip]

just watched all the episodes straight

[@naveen508001]

Imagine a dream wherein someone is chasing and trying to hurt you, and you wake up all of a sudden. Your heartbeat is at its peak. In the above scenario, is the dream real, unreal or has it happened? On the physical plane (body) if we measure, only the heartbeat increase is seen. Some better measuring tools can show some brain activity. The question remains as to what has happened and has it happened. Mahabharata is known to have all the knowledge of the Vedas (Universe). So if you take any concept it has to be there is the epic. Let us see if Quantum mechanics is there in the epic. The dating of Mahabharata is an ongoing thing with each researcher coming up with a different date and having some points which support their observation. We see the Quantum mechanics principle of the act of observation affecting the outcome. So has Mahabharata happened? As you keep analysing this, it will make you question "the happening" itself. What does it mean to say that something has happened. This might sound crazy but as said Mahabharata should help us in understanding all the knowledge of the universe and this is a fundamental thing being questioned here. Our understanding of happening is limited and that needs to be corrected so that the question is answered itself. First, we have to be clear that not everything is happening in the physical plane and is visible. A celestial vision is needed to see things. Vyasa had given the vision briefly to Drupada (father of Draupadi) during the discussion if having five husbands is dharma, explaining the story behind it. Let us see an analogy for better understanding. If someone asks Is God there. The answer would depend on their existing understanding of God. That is the reason we have varied descriptions of God and as your understanding grows things become clear. The same has to be extended to happening. As is the case with the dream (happening inside a body) everything is happening within the entity called the Universe.

[@beyoufirst1110]

👍

[@dhananjaymansabdar9649]

beautiful secret of 0

[@enjoyparents]

Bring NILESH NILKANTH OAK DATING OF MAHABHARAT AND RAMAYAN AND RIGVEDIC DATING .HE IS MUCH MUCH BETTER THAN PANDITJI . MORE ORGANISED - LOGICAL- SCIENTIFIC - MULTIPLE SCIENTIFIC PERSPECTIVES AS EVIDENCES .

[@thrinethran2885]

Don't agree at all that Mr Oak is more logical. Dr Pandit focuses on astronomy/ astrology with a deeper focus. He does not claim to be infallible like Mr Oak. But the latter's chronology is the most outlying, and farther removed from the traditional dating, which has always relied on astronomy. Multidisciplinary does not add to authenticity without greater logic.

[@choudhurysaheb8326]

@@thrinethran2885 Exactly. Oak actually avoided all Geological and Archaeological evidence.

[@prasvasu4217]

Logical, mor like quackery

[@prasvasu4217]

For all the comments in this section asking to bring Neelesh Oak; I'll put the dates for your reference 1. Marxist historians/journalists: Mahabharata was fantasy fiction that never happened 2. Quack modern historians (affected by post-modern thoughts and sometimes religious motivations): 500BC 3. Scientific historian scholars with a lot of reading: Dr. Elst, Dr. Miano: 1500 - 1900BC 4. Astrology scholars like Dr. Pandit and a few others: 3100BC 5. Dr. Neelesh Woke: 22000BC Y'all think and decide, what the truth is yourself. When one uses scriptural evidence, challenge is to understand what parts are to be taken literally and what parts figuritively!

[@sureshparikhful]

Re: your association of Mars and the plane crash You have ruled out causation. You did not make a prediction. We all know that you can associate anything with anything. This has no real explanatory force. If you start your talk thus, what confidence can we have on the rest of your thesis? If we are not astronomers and have forgotten our childhood knowledge of Sanskrit, we would rather accept Nilesh Oak’s date until it is overthrown. It would have been better if you had debated once again with Nilesh Oak. He states his theory and adduced the multi-disciplinary evidence for his theory. Until his view is conclusively overthrown, your efforts are wasted. Sorry.