S3#29. 6mm from SINKING!!! BAD versus GOOD Welding - Portofino 52 New Build.

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Join Barefoot Doctors Sailing FOR VERY RECENT UPDATE as we answer some of the important questions our subscribers have asked us about the process of welding Aluminium, is it stronger or weaker where it is welded, what about different thicknesses welded together and certification for official approval internationally... We are in Dubai to discuss these issues with Raffaele, the founder of Portofino Marine Service and builder of the new Portofino 52, the shallow draft, beachable, aluminium catamaran that we are having built to our specs! Very exciting stuff....
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[@CraigOverend]

If the hair getting in your eyes gets annoying you can always go a mullet. 😄 I've seen multiple aluminium boats fail at the welds on the hull joints and I/T-stringers because they weren't welded correctly like he describes. Also if I/T-shaped stringers are long between frames or bulkheads then adding an extra frame in the middle of the stringer or boxing the stringer is a good idea to reduce the chance of them buckling after an impact that can tear I/T-beam welds. I did notice some box section at about the waterline after the first frame station in the previous video which is good to see, but it's difficult to gauge frame spacing and welds with fisheye cameras when everything is upside down! 🙃 Looking forward to seeing the boat upright.

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Thanks for the comments Craig and the design has been put through engineering stress test and the results are excellent - only 4cm of flex from one end to the other with 20 tonnes of pressure on the stern.... Or something like that (in our previous video Season 3 #10) !

[@latitudeash]

Loving the outtakes…. More please…😂

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Good to hear!Thanks for letting us know...

[@latitudeash]

Everything e I see the interior pictures, I am excited for you both

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Thanks again!

[@latitudeash]

Ya…loving the surfer dude look. Use hairspray or tell to control the look 👍🏼😎

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Thanks for the tip Ash! Thanks for all the comments!!!

[@bobbiejay2085]

Design, engineering and manufacturing are fascinating. No matter the product. It brings about more understanding and respect. Especially the workers working hard in those hot and exacting conditions. Thanks for your behind the scenes. What you are growing is a yachties 'top knot' 😂 Keep up with the fun!

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Thanks Bobbie Jay!

[@barryholiday8998]

Can’t believe how much engineering/math/technique goes into this.

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Yes that’s right Barry! Very reassuring though as it looks and feels really tough…

[@arthurboulton4511]

Fantastic content "STAY SAFE"

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Thanks very much Arthur!

[@clivestainlesssteelwomble7665]

Top Knot ..surely 🤔😂 Nice to see how they are handeling the construction details.

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Hi Clive! Yes I would have thought it would be called a top Knot too but such is the vagaries of the English / American language.... And yes we are very impressed with the attention to detail in he build process.

[@SailingSeahorse2026]

Thanks for the episode. I love how Raffa can explain technical details in an easy to understand plain English way. OMG you can’t explain the heat in summer in Dubai adequately can you! So lovely of you guys to recognise the welders and tradesmen 😊

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Yes Raffa and his team are top quality. Thanks for watching, your support and comments!

[@rickcreel3657]

let it grow Dude

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Will do Rick!

[@user-ci4en8vv1y]

Hi, It seems to be a great boat, but it will be interesting to get an info about: 1. Clearance (it seems very low) and 2. thickness of isolation material and a typr of it.

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Hi P, The clearance (underwing I presume you are fearing to) is 90cm which is reasonable and above average.I do not know about which insulation material is going to be used and how thick but will share that later in the episodes. We do not plan to go to the Artic so will only have moderate thickness of insulation but my specification desire is for non flammable insulation and closed cell so it does not hold or absorb water...

[@RWMLTD]

At Cannes, met with Raffa to discuss building a 60 power cat. They asked how I heard of them, I said saw your KZbin videos on your quest after your last boat was damaged. Would like to know how the build process is going with portofino and maybe pick your brain.

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Happy to chat! Send us an email on [e-mail] and we can chat on WhatsApp. We are in Turkey right now so time zone one hour ahead of France...

[@IamKnowbodie]

Thank you for your amazing content. The universe have you both on a wonderful path, filled with sadness and topped off with incredible joy. I was convinced on owning a Leapord 50, now I am convinced to get a Portofino, however i am stuck between the 47 and the 52 which you had a massive part in. For me the question is the flybridge, you let go of the flybridge for performance increase, which is a worthy sacrifice. Seeing the performance of the 52 succeeding your expectations, would it be considered that a 52 with a flybridge design of the 47, would still give amazing performance around 15-20 knots with a raised mainsail? It will help tremendous to make up my mind in which one to get, since I love your 52 design and I love the flybridge of the 47. And my dream is to sail the Siberian strait above Russia, will the Portofino be adequate enough or should I look at the Exploracat options? Thank you again for your content and your amazingness. You are a wonderful incarnation of Angels. Ps: not sure if you reply on old videos and comments so I am copying and pasting this in all your videos. Apologies in advance for this, and also thank you for the answer I know you will think clearly of, and will help both buyers and sellers. ❤

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Dear Somebody (and everyone is someone - not nobody!) Thank you so much for your very kind and generous compliments ad we are VERY GLAD that our content can have positive effects for you personally and everyone else that gets those benefits! As for the "reincarnation of angels" that is certainly the domain of Eli but I am happy to just be dragged along on her wing feathers! We are certainly working to make our path a beautiful one while dealing with high level issues, ironically right now as we are in the middle of legal processes to try and get some outcome from the fire damage - so you kind words are like words of support, helping us on the rocky road!!! As of the incredible joy, Eli and I always ensure we create the joy and love around us so that any negativity no matter how intense does not prevent our daily love and happiness... It is sometimes hard work to rise above it but we focus on what we have and not what we don't have and remember Eli's mother's wise words "Honey, everything's gonna be ALLLRIIIGHT!" So to your important questions - the flybridge will probably lose a knot to the speeds up to 12 knots and perhaps 2 knots from 12-20 - these are my estimates only. So really if you are still getting easy 12s - 15 knots in the right conditions and sailing almost wind speed in light winds, the 52 with a flybridge will be spectacular too. We are going to have loungers on the flybridge that have backs that can fix in sitting position as a compromise but no structure up there and we sacrificed the flybridge cause we wanted the boat to perform as well as it can with all it's other features as well. If you want to have a boat that is also bale to survive ice collisions then Portofino can easily make it to suit - slightly more aluminium supports, thicker aluminium in the bow and probably an extra ton or two by the end but that is "easily" done. I specified to them that we would not sail into iceberg areas so the heavy construction requirements were avoided. By the way, the 47 would probably be strong enough for icebergs as it is but it is much slower and there are many features that we got added to the 52 that makes it an amazing boat! So if you are serious, ask Raffaele about your specs and I'm sure it can be done!!! Yes we do watch for comments on old videos and get to answer almost every one. Fortunately KZbin has a filter that allows us to see comments that we have not responded to so this catches the comments on old videos - but feel free to drop the comments in every other video as it would probably be good for others to see and improve our KZbin ratings!!! LOL.

[@juergenzenner4219]

Fantastic video. Love the planing and execution from the work. Thanks.

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Glad you enjoyed it, Juergen and thanks for the regular support!

[@latitudeash]

Wow, the care taken to make the two pieces one is exceptional. But how do they stop the aluminium warping and distorting? Warping and distorting is a huge problem with aluminium welding, a lot more than iron.

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

If you see when we are looking at the outside of the hulls, there are a whole lot of strip of aluminium welded lengthwise to the hull. These are temporary strips to stop distortions from the heat of the welding process and they are taken off at the end. If you saw the 47 last week, all the strips were off but ours, the 52 still has lots of strips welded to it...

[@gbsailing9436]

Gosh has a week gone already! I'm so sorry guys I haven't contacted you to get your address to send the amazing hair product I use occasionally! I get to it this week. Hold onto the hair John and it'll look great in place all the time with this stuff. Boat is looking great and, like you I can't wait to see it in the water. RR2 just splashed and they are really happy, so you can expect similar results soon too! I have to say though, your build looks even more exciting!

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Thanks Garth! Glad you’re enjoying the details! This was a very technical video….

[@firstlast1047]

Rafa mentioned free standing liquids in the various tanks. Perhaps it is possible to add/weld baffles, particularly, in the fuel and water tanks. The baffles can be partially suspended from the top and sides, allowing the free flow of liquids under the baffles.

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Hi, thanks for the comment. Yes that is what he was talking about to stop the fluids from slipping around…

[@mikecasista]

I'm seeing other boats (typically from the big three) that are having more and more fuel tank problems. Either pinhole leaks, abbrasion leaks (which this design would eliminate). But even in the new Seawind 1370, they have provisions for removing the diesel, black water and clean water tanks in the future (for WHEN you have to not IF you have to...) How does this design allow for tank repairs or potential replacements?

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Hi Mike and thanks for watching and your interesting comments. Portofino is making the tanks (diesel, black and grey water) integral in the hull so they are actually the hull shell and then internal sheets welded to the structure. Repairs to them would imply a significant problem as AL should not corrode (as long as we keep the anodes and protections in place) and if there was an issue, the boat would have to be dried out for repair to be done. Like any AL repair it can be done anywhere in the world but the tanks would have to be emptied of fuel and welded out of the water.... However, if that was occurring, I think we would have corrosion through the whole boat and the specific protections that Raffaele is putting in place to prevent AL corrosion should (we expect) prevent this problem... Fingers crossed and time will tell!!! Great question - thanks for raising the issue!

[@angusmcbraith]

Very interesting thanks

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Glad you enjoyed it, Martin!

[@vladimirsapogov1994]

Great plot. very informative. I look forward to the next releases. Thank you

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Our pleasure, Vladimir, glad there’s useful info there!

[@mehmetatik9003]

we will be good to see you in Gocek Turkey, particularly med mooring is interesting experience. There are good jetties will serve you. Adaia, Yazz collection and My marina (close to gocek) are well known places. I am sure you will enjoy Gocek

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Hi Mehmet, glad to hear from you. We are heading south to Gocek to scope the place out and would love to get the insider info from a local if possible! It would be nice to meet up with you if you are close - our email is [e-mail] for private chat…

[@lincolnlincoln27]

Hi kids: check this out for your portofino biminy top design(HH 40)..... be safe!

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Will do! Thanks Lincoln.

[@nutsandbolts432]

I notice that most of the welding process is done using MIG welding. I know it’s much faster than TIG welding, but less precise. I haven’t seen anyone use laser welders, which gives you precision and speed, but equipment costs 10x more. Unless the issue with laser welders is lack of RINA certification, it seems like the equipment cost would be negated by it taking only 1/3 of the time to weld the boat. Would you mind asking about this?

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

I'll ask Raffa about it but I do know that they have about 4 welding machines or more for productivity so covering to lasers sounds expensive... I will ask.

[@nutsandbolts432]

@@barefootdoctorssailing8567 if I had to guess, somewhere between $5,000 and $8,000 per machine, not including gas and regulators. Handheld laser machine $36,000, using the same gas and accessories. I wouldn’t throw away my old equipment for one, but if I had to add new equipment or was replacing the old, I’d be interested in seeing a demo, testing to see if it would save time, if I were Raffa.

[@drankenkorps]

Well it does look gorgeous.. still wondering about the weight of the shell....my will be mmm let say different:).

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Hi Jean Luc, the hull weight of the Aluminium is about 8000kg (8T) and the completed boat before loading is 16,500kg and the performance data wa calculated at 18,000kg. It will be very interesting to see exactly what the weights are at these three stages and then even more exciting will be to see how the performance actually compares to the computer calculations! WE WILL SEE!!!!

[@drankenkorps]

@@barefootdoctorssailing8567 takk,danke,hvala,džankujem,spasiba,tack merci,gracie/s I will observe you 2.. oh and about welding from last episode- i recommend to study tig and mig welding.. because he said no grainding away.. which is not actually correct. Regards

[@meshedgears2794]

Wow very cool stuff, I love to see the behind the curtain build process. I did have a question, for the center board the cad showed a cover I think, does a center board actually have a door? Do the doors have a brush to wipe the center board as it moves into and out of the pocket? Well I guess how do you clean the pocket, do you have to haul out or do you just pump fresh water into the pocket to make it inhospitable to marine life? -MG

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Thanks for the question, Meshed Gears! At the most it might be a rubber strip but may be open. There will certainly not be any door type mechanism…

[@2Moza]

Its one thing having good welders but are samples of there Welds tested and x-rayed and stored for any kind of reference and there Names on file for who did what ship????, Also why are they not using Robot welders to speed up there production of there hulls it would be cheaper as machines don't stop for toilet times or coffee times.

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Thanks for the creative thinking Moza! The current process for checking weld validity is a penetrant test that we will share in upcoming videos and that test is done, photographed and stored. X-rays are only done on small boats like this if there is any concern about joins but they are done on all very large ships. I have no idea about robot welders which would be good for a production line of identical boats but Portofino is a custom build boat yard so unlikely to go down that path, I would have thought... They would probably have to sell large numbers of boats to get the money back for the set up too - maybe in a few years when the brand is so popular!!!

[@DvHedensted]

It's going to be an amazing boat, what's the price on similar build ?

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Yes it will be spectacular (we think!) base price is around $1.5M base price with options, Drax.

[@gabrielefanetti3775]

Very interesting video guys, great explanations. I just have a question, you said is not possible to grind the weld after is completed, why exactly is that???

[@raffaelerognoni8861]

in order not to be altered and weakened, the weld must maintain its shape and cannot be filed or flattened, also for this reason the plates are worked with a V shape in order to limit the protrusions which should be rectified with a large amount of filler

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Good question Gariele and hopefully Raffaele has explained it about grinding or flattening it weakens the join...

[@gabrielefanetti3775]

@@raffaelerognoni8861 thank you for the answer. im very curious about aluminium construction,but am not very familiar with it. i work a lot arround steel and am very use to see a weld grinded up to the surface of the base material (untill it disappear) so it was new for me, i use to be told that you just lose the strength of the material you remove (the excess) but you still have strength of the full width, isn't that so with aluminium? sorry if it is a stupid question but again im very curious. by the way the boat looks gorgeus... incredible design, amazing work.

[@raffaelerognoni8861]

@@gabrielefanetti3775 Hi Gabriele, in the marine business as per certification authority (RiNa) any structural welding on steel or aluminium ship/boat cannot be touch, this is in respect of the ISO rules, best, Raffaele

[@gabrielefanetti3775]

@raffaelerognoni8861 this is way i like to ask to people that knows stuff. I was sure i was missing something, thank you very much!

[@MrCoyote928]

Will you be getting a lot of wave slapping noise against the aluminum hulls while you're at anchor and sleeping?

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Hi Coyote. There is insulation in the hulls for noise and temperature changes that should make the sound less. It will certainly be less than fibreglass as there is no insulation on them at all....

[@MrCoyote928]

@@barefootdoctorssailing8567 We really loved the upper lounge like you had on the Leopard.. BTW this is Danny and Judy's Adventures.... 😊

[@billydaniel900]

👍

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

:) Billy, you must win the prize for consistency of support and minimalism! Love having you with us in spirit!👣🙏 PS Found the KZbin emojis! But it looks like they are only on the phone and not my computer….

[@tonyacerra2329]

Are the welds required to be x-rayed?

[@raffaelerognoni8861]

Hi I'm Raffaele, the x ray is not required, the welding will be checked by penetrant liquids, we will explane in another episode

[@tonyacerra2329]

@@raffaelerognoni8861 Thanks Raffaele. If I decide to break open my piggy bank, this would be the boat for me.

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

Thanks Raffa for answering this! The penetrant liquid video will be out within a few weeks, I hope...

[@latitudeash]

Mmmmmm…yummy cake

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

It was really nice actually!!!

[@tinytoons2517]

aussie aussie aussie oi oi oi . . .

[@barefootdoctorssailing8567]

:)))