My biggest problem with “gritty” adult shows

[@namtellectjoonal7230]

"It made me stronger" I fucking HATE that line. No trauma did not make me stronger, it stole precious years of happiness from me, made me (often unnecessarily) careful and jumpy and made me put hundreds of hours and euros into healing from it, all of which I could have poured into actually developing skills and strength. The fuck you mean "It makes you stronger"?

[@molasorrosalom4846]

Yeah, Sansa seems well adjusted with what happened to her....

[@Ashbrash1998]

I HATED it in the show, because the show added a lot of stuff the books didn't. And at least the books took trauma seriously and didn't try to portray it like a power-up moment that never effected them.

[@johnjordan211]

Ita a work of fiction

[@johnjordan211]

​@@Ashbrash1998shut the hell up

[@poptarts8278]

​@@johnjordan211 fiction is meant to portray REALITY. Properly.

[@randomspider725]

It’s disturbing that some people think “realism” when it comes to women means “objectification and exploitation”. Not a woman’s strength or creativity or friendships… just pain being inflicted onto her. Apparently THAT is the only realistic thing about women. Wonderful.

[@SofiaPalas]

THIS 💀

[@NobodyImporttant]

Unfortunately, lots of men don’t see women as people.

[@mousequest7592]

It all perpetuates the idea that “being a woman is to suffer” and I hate it so fucking much. I’m tired of the female trauma narratives that are everywhere now

[@RedNymph234]

I really liked the first season or two of Game of Thrones, but fell off once it just became misery porn. I realized that...there really was never any scene of any of the characters laughing sincerely, or just vibing over a drink with good company, or enjoying something. This is especially true for the women characters. Like...even in the Dark Ages, people still enjoyed things. It doesn't have to be suffering 100% of the time for 8 whole seasons....The only satisfaction a character ever felt was when they killed their foe. It wasn't happiness.

[@K.C-2049]

@@RedNymph234 right and also even in the Dark Ages there would have been men out there being like "hey don't r word that woman", there would have been half decent dudes around, never mind that the entire pantheon of "women's narratives" seems to always be about being r worded from those times. apparently the Dark Ages wasn't actually nearly as anti woman as Victorian historians (lol that rhymed) thought, they were just projecting Victorian era misogyny onto the past.

[@Epiphanystone]

Adding rape scenes into stories that didn't have them is the worst.

[@KariTalks]

“We want complex characters that are morally gray!” “Ok” *shows character becoming anger, bitter, an addict, lashing out at their loved ones because of trauma* “No not like that”

[@skulliebythesea]

lmao literally this

[@darlalathan6143]

My idea of "morally gray" is "rock star in the Playboy mansion" behavior, not mob bosses and drug dealers with kids murdering child-free gangsters!

[@ithseem]

The characters that come to mind for me would be Saix/Isa from the Kingdom Hearts franchise, Jin Kamurai from Tokyo Debunker, Alan Mido also from Tokyo Debunker, Amity Blight from the Owl House, Chloe Bourgeois from Miraculous, Aphrodite from the House of Night, as well as Guy, Toa, Lance, Roy, and Fenn from Court of Darkness. For most of the lineup most of the characters didn't have their backstory fully shown (some of them show snippets, though) but in all the characters you can make inferences about why they are the way they are.

[@KariTalks]

@@calebh373 yeah but the great thing about fiction is that we can explore relationships and dynamics we would never want in real life

[@marmalade8915]

Damn you just described one of my characters 😭

[@thecheck968]

If writers want dark and gritty, there's nothing that holds a candle to a person recovering from a traumatic experience and the bad habits they picked up along the way. But all regards for realism suddenly flies out the window when someone mentions how trauma affects a person. Almost like writing about these subjects is difficult and should rely on something more substantial than shock value.

[@skulliebythesea]

TEAAAAA

[@SingingSealRiana]

Really depends, GrrM does psychological realism really well as in the brutality is never just there to shock, but he pretty much always folloes up with the logical consequences, explaining but not excusing how people came to inact those atrocities in the first place and such. Even why Dany snaps while Jon snow retires damaged but with most of his reputation intact is deeply logical even if the shows execution was horrendously bad. The show makets lack GrrMs empathy and understanding. He was an outsider, but still extreamly privileged as in he always had peoole who loved him and taught him around himself. Especially later on he earns the loyality he inspires, but it is still a privilage he aleays has a mentor around and then another teaching him all the valuable lessons he needs. How he is treated by those close makes very clear, that ge is just some gut, even when things become weird which keeps him grounded and he always has pwoole he can trust to balance out those he cant trust. Dany on the other side starts out all alone in the world with a malicious and delusional older brother and the notion she should be superhuman. She always either gets treated as below people or with reverance after garnering power, put upon a pedestral that makes relationships on equal footing utterly impossible. No matter how many followers she garners, she stays deeply alone. The event that gave her power also isolated her deeply and feed into a messiah complex that makes her somewhat unreachable to critique, she is the chosen one afterall. She has never a mentor just for her sake, everyone around her is either a (former) slavewith impossible expectations of her, aomeone who wants to manipulate ir use her, or someone seeing her as a threat. Shenever grows out of her naivity cause she is no one to teach her better, the goal she is after is actually the opposite of what she truely wants and deeply messed up and concerning things she does are missed over her good intentions. She is utterly set up for faliure and that works cause the author really payed attention to the psychological consequences. I also would not object to sexuall voilance being previlent cause news flash that a part of reality and he never frames it as anything else as the horrific and wrong violation it is. It is not sensationalised, it is present cause just like being drafted to a war you had no idea what it was about and no own stakes in was part of the male experience, sexual voilence is an ever present threat for women through all ages. It is not something overrepresented, it just really is that common, even if we dont want that to be real. I object to rape porn, to framing it as eroticbut that never happens in Asoiaf

[@YoltzinisaCaos]

I actually have characters(male and female)who gave suffered from various traumatic situations, SA, child abuse, etc. At first i just put it as character development, or, shock(even i eroticized it ifthe victim was male, thanks badly written BL and my stupid 12/11 year old arse) but, now i actually had to comprehend how horrible those things were, how traumatic it was, and howmy characters were affected for their life. By the way, tangent. Also, since I used to draw my stories, and, I still do, I can confirm that you cannot show SA explicilty. Even if the audience knew that that was SA, many people would not care and will fetishize it.

[@aishambengue3024]

CLOCK IT!!!!! Trauma is layered and nuanced but it seems like some people ( sadly the people thag get the recognition) don't take the time to delve into that or the intersections of that ( with telling stories with the perspective of WOC, LGBTQA+ l, POC, The Disabled with compassion that is not trauma porn)

[@crazycookie4645]

It kinda reminds me of how Moral Orel was canceled after after the "Alone" episode, which is about sexual abuse. People are fine using SA for shock value and dark comedy, but once you acknowledge how much it messes a person up suddenly it's "too dark".

[@beck-nightengale]

Hearing how badly SA scenes affect not just the actor playing the victim but also the attacker - like James Marsters and Jason Momoa - is really upsetting as well. Especially in the case of the former who was totally blindsided by it and tried to fight it, it makes sense that he was just as traumatized playing the role. It's all the more reason why filmmakers need to stop throwing in gratuitous SA unless they fully understand the gravity of that experience and write about it WELL, because I can only imagine what it must be like for the actors who have to get into the headspace and play it out. As an SA survivor as well, I just really wish society would stop normalizing this contrived narrative by making it feel like it's something that "needs" to happen in order for a story to be dark/realistic.

[@greek_geekgirl1326]

It really hits hearing James Marsters talk about not being able to say no himself, like that’s a violation for him as well even beyond how horrible having to do the scene is, he’s stuck

[@cybersearcher1041]

it fucking blows on all fronts

[@Hal-fx9xx]

momoa joked about sa,I think he was fine with scenes "affecting" him

[@skylerricketts7392]

@@Hal-fx9xxmaking an sa joke and having to act out sa and grasping someone are two very different things. It’s possible that experience changed his entire perspective of sa jokes afterwards anyway. I’m certainly not a fan of his but I also understand a lot of men don’t take sa seriously until it effects them personally

[@Hal-fx9xx]

@skylerricketts7392 yeah,one requires being an actor,and the other requires being a douche bag "changed his perspective" more like he got a lot of flag for that and pretended to apologise men that don't take sa seriously are the same as the ones who sa others, period

[@paulacameron5920]

sometimes I feel it's used to communicate to the audience that the female character is 'desirable' which perpetuates harmful myths about SA - that only the most beautiful women experience it because the 'lust' they inspire in men is simply too overpowering

[@paulacameron5920]

My own experience of SA and my own research has led me to believe it's vulnerable women who are far more at risk where an opportunity exists where the offender has a good chance of getting away with it. There are still some troubling myths out there about rape being a 'complement' to women or there being a direct connection between desirablity and assault, when the reality of SA is usually humiliating and degrading to the women and more to do with power and domination than lust

[@darlalathan6143]

@@paulacameron5920 I noticed that same rape myth, watching "Rashomon" with my roommate, last night!

[@Ri57490]

​@@paulacameron5920true. There was a case when an elderly woman was SA'd by her son. Men working with vulnerable women are also likely to SA them, which is why male carers are not usually hired in elderly homes.

[@thatoneocmaker]

​@@Ri57490 The fact that a man SA'd his OWN MOTHER makes me sick to my stomach

[@molasorrosalom4846]

Brianne of Tarth was gonna be SA'd though.

[@randomthoughts6680]

Recently I got into a creative writing group (all women) and one thing that stood out is how many just write grape and call it "rough love making" because the receiver ends up liking it and then blossoms into a woman. I myself was assaulted and the only thing it did to me was to make me have an irrational fear of bathrooms, pools and crowds, along the fact that I started to walk with a knife in my bag. There's no strength, there's just fear and disgust. Well, the women in the group thinks I'm "too vanilla" for suggesting that consent is a must for me even in fiction.

[@callmecharlie4250]

"too vanilla," I've seen consensual temporary removal of limbs in a story; how tf would consent make that vanilla? the liking grape thing just seems shallow at best.

[@randomthoughts6680]

@@callmecharlie4250 IDK, they also thought not having the fMC to be a "empowered woman" (as in obnoxious, rude and stoic, basically a token male character with tits) was also bad. Like, my MC was simply a normal person who didn't had to shove her personality down everyone's throats.

[@skylerricketts7392]

I’m not sure this is the writing group for you

[@randomthoughts6680]

@@skylerricketts7392 It stopped being when they pulled the "you can't be white, you are latina" card on me.

[@zoebarnes7746]

Saying you’re “Too vanilla” for needing consent in books is INSANE to me. That must have been so appalling and a slap in the face to hear. Those kind of women live in their own twisted heads and have no regards for others. I hope you got out of that group fast, because that does not sound like a safe place.

[@Goomzz]

I’m an actor myself. I once got a script which originally only included my character dealing with sexual harassment when I agreed to it. The scene was later turned into a full on assault in a later revision. Both I and the man playing the assaulter refused to do the scene as we had not agreed to it. They ended up revising it again so it was only an attempt but my character escapes before it goes too far and that’s the version we shot. But he and I were both ready to walk.

[@akamered4483]

Kudos for standing your ground! ❤

[@Attribute-X]

What show or movie was it? I want to avoid looking at things the writers or directors make if that's the kind of people they are. Also, I am terribly sorry you and your co-worker had to go through that.

[@wolfidessdragondol]

That's so shady, thank god y'all didn't have to go through with it

[@Goomzz]

@@Attribute-Xit was a small independent film that didn’t end up getting released. I didn’t even get footage for my acting real from it, which sucks because there was some really strong scenes in it. I doubt It will get released at this point, it was 5 years ago. And even if it did, I wouldn’t hold the director for it as he was very understanding once we both explained why we would not do this version and why it was so much worse for us then the original harassment scene and he had no issues changing the script to accommodate us.

[@Attribute-X]

@ What was the plot even about?

[@martymcflown3707]

Other people have spoken on my thought, but I really think Game of Thrones has sort of ruined historical shows as a general concept because after its popularity every historical/fantasy drama decided it needed to be "gritty" (aka include casual SA). Like I'm a fan of historical trash tv, but gratuitous assault (or attempted assault) became the norm even for cable historical shows. I really like the point that one commenter made about the excuse of "realism" being such BS when apparently it doesn't apply to like...having women shave their armpits and making them up like contemporary models. Ultimately realism comes to a screeching halt if it means these women cannot be sexualized.

[@skulliebythesea]

THIS

[@jodieg6318]

I am a huge history nerd; reenactor and educator for the Early Middle Ages, and I can tell you that what most people are trying to say was "normal" for the time period most certainly was not. There are plenty of judicial records that prove that it wasn't a free for all when it came to violence and SA, and things like 'prima nocte' were a trope in the contemporary literature of the time, basically showing the reader who the bad guy was suppose to be.

[@martymcflown3707]

@@jodieg6318 You're so right! And another thing that bothers me about the implication that casual SA was such a risk in the past is a similar feeling I have about topics like systemic racism or homophobia being treated as something that happened "in the past." As if our society isn't currently struggling with rampant misogyny, racism and queerphobia. I think the extremity to which these historical shows utilize SA as a plot point only feeds into the idea that we can be comfortable/complacent with the way vulnerable people are treated in present day.

[@i.b.640]

Yeah, I feel all the Ken Follett movies already did it. Characterisation Shortcut: Villain: Show him r*pe somebody. Good Guy: Show him espouse modern sensibilites.

[@RedNymph234]

Also GoT is not historical. It's not Rome, it's a made up world with dragons. What "realistic" stuff are we talking about?

[@aliasfakename3159]

Sansa Stark was not raped in the books. She's traumatized in other ways (seeing her father's rotting head, getting beaten & humiliated in public, having to denounce her own family or risk being killed). This makes her clever and tactful in ways that Arya is not & it's fun to read her chapters

[@ChemkintheArtist]

Silent Hill 2 and its remake have a character named Angela who was SA'd by her brother and father. Her mother blamed Angela for the assault happening. Its never shown in detail, but the monsters are effected by Angela's psyche in one particular section and its both sorrowful and horrifying. And... respectful, believe it or not. Sadly, Angela cannot be saved but her symptoms and reactions are so real and so sad.

[@raincandy1653]

It's such a good portrayal but sadly you have bozos complaining she's not hot enough

[@raincandy1653]

It's such a good portrayal but sadly you have bozos complaining she's not hot enough

[@cosmok-1367]

This is why SH2 is probably the best depiction of SA to this day, even though it's not the main focus of the story. What makes it better is that the game relies on the visuals and clues to tell us what happened, rather than showing it in a graphic scene. Though it really makes me sad when you think about the fact that a horror game from the early 2000's (recently remade as well) was more nuanced in such a topic and handled it with care, compared to recent gritty and dark series that are supposed to be aimed towards people to empower them.

[@alexielshadowangel]

I was gonna mention Angela in SH2. It's also the only example I know of where it focuses on the VICTIM'S TRAUMA, and how it affected her.

[@satanyanko]

„You see it too? For me, it’s always like this.“ The flaming staircase scene. This line broke me because I could relate so much.

[@Serocco]

Unironically, One Piece has one of the best portrayals of SA, without ever actually showing it. Basically two characters (Ginny and Kuma) were born enslaved, and they attached themselves to one another for emotional relief. Eventually they freed themselves, joined an army of revolutionaries, fell in love, and planned to marry after basically dating for years. But because they were both revolutionaries, the corrupt World Government wanted them dead. They captured and re-enslaved Ginny. The next time we see her, shes pregnant with a daughter, and the father is not Kuma, and he still loves both Ginny and her daughter regardless. He never once thinks of rejecting Bonney, who was named not by the assaulter but by Ginny who still had agency and freed herself again. Nothing was shown. Nothing needed to be shown. Just the context of the scene and the realization of what happened, that was enough, and you can see just how much it deeply affected reaction channels who read that chapter. There's so much more, but I think I made my point.

[@vivvy_0]

and yet post-time skip every female character has the same unrealistic body and face unless they are ugly villains or 'old hags'

[@SingingSealRiana]

My favorite media portrayal of the whole SA topic is "promising young woman" it is never showing anything graphic, the word rape is never even said an it firmly places the blame on those responsible, enablers, bystanders, nice guys that think what they are doing is different, cause they are a nice guy..... It is tackled as the deeply systhemic issue it is and in no way just a thing of "a few obvioulsy bad brutal rapists" how it can be literally every ever so personable man, what excuses people bring, how everyone is in denial to not have to deal with the issue and how women are absolutly part of the problem as enablers even if the rapist in that case is a man. Media loves the idea of stranger danger, of an obvioulsy bad gut that is easely avoided, of we wpuld act different.... Promising young woman is brutaly honest as in most of us are part of the problem!!!

[@amethystimagination3332]

One Piece handles heavy shit in shockingly tactful ways. I can’t believe I almost missed out because I didn’t like the way the women are drawn

[@hbsupreme1499]

​@@amethystimagination3332execpt racism they blame the Fishman for wanting to kill slave owners when they queen tried to stop them

[@natalimoina]

Uhhh, one of the main characters, who's supposed to be a hero, does SA and is praised for it. OP does NOT have one of the best portrayals, it doesn't even have a good one.

[@amethystimagination3332]

Listening to what it’s like for the actors being made to do these scenes is horrifying, I would argue both the male and female actors are being SAed in these instances. The male actors don’t wanna assault their coworkers and the female actors don’t want to be assaulted. But they’re both being forced to perform sexual acts to the point of breaking down for the sick pleasures of the perverts in charge, tell me that’s not assault.

[@tonichan89]

I genuinely hadn't realised how bad it could be for the actors performing it, esp how it feels for the one playing the assaulter. Such a good point to include.

[@Thufferinthuckotash]

Excellent point

[@tuesday3947]

The same thing happens in anime and as a girl it really sucks. And it’s so fucked up because it’s almost NEVER taken seriously as it actually is

[@user-pi3hd2bt3f]

Man I HAAAATE when im watching an anime and all of a sudden there are men going all giggly and perverted over female characters. It just feels like its normalized somehow. Even when the woman fights back it feels like they are just adding that to show how "feisty" she is.

[@normalgamergal]

I've spoken to so many guys who can't understand why so many women don't watch anime and why I don't really do so anymore, either. I stick to the few anime I loved as a teen that I still enjoy and don't watch many new ones unless I know exactly what I'm getting into. Doesn't help that it was getting worse when I stopped watching instead of better. Don't know for sure where it's at now, but I haven't heard a lot to convince me it's improved. I stopped around the Goblin Slayer era (or a little after) so I'm guessing you can understand why I stopped. Almost more than the material itself was me hearing all the men defending it like it's high art. I don't give a damn if the rest of the show's amazing, the first episode is what it is and showed me the women characters will never be treated as people in it. (This is also why I'm wary dating a guy that's super into anime.)

[@wooogie672]

**coughs loudly** sword art online

[@grimroten3299]

​@@wooogie672 that whole show is a mess I wish I had avoided

[@grimroten3299]

​@@normalgamergal all I can think is that scena in the sismpsons when Lisa and Bart are in the comic book shop and she says "can we hurry up as a girl I don't feel comfortable here" and Bart says "why not?" then the camera zooms out and there's a figurine of a woman chained to a bolder

[@FishareFriendsNotFood972]

Also, another plot aspect that so often happens around this is the SA victim immediately or soon after has enthusiastic intimacy with the 'male protector' who rescued them/supported them after the event. This is so massively unrealistic, most of the time SA victims will have problems with enjoying intimacy with ANYONE for a long period, if not the rest of their life, after such a bad event.

[@_CreamyMari_]

Yes!!! This is was so confusing to me in Dexter. I watched that scene thinking “She’s not ready for this. Where are the writers going with this?” I had hope the writers would ATLEAST choose to show that, although maybe she wanted to, she just couldn’t. Welp… that didn’t happen. In one hand, it is a fact that victims of SA (especially childhood ones) cope through promiscuity, but the writers aren’t trying to show that either. There’s nothing deep or intentional about what they’re writing. It’s simply lazy writing to bait perverts into increasing their TV ratings. Hollywood, HollyWEIRD.

[@Kirsten4260]

That’s exactly how I felt when I was watching the girl with dragon tattoo. The consensual sex scenes always rubbed me wrong way cause hello she just went through a horrific and traumatic situation

[@MortMe0430]

And there's plenty of other (non sexualized, non fetishized, etc) kinds of trauma that a character can be changed by and work to overcome. Drowning, fire, heights, endless other understandable fears that might be derived from traumatic experiences that a person could have to push through to do something plot relevant.

[@totaltotal8481]

True, the thing is most times those experiences aren't even seen as traumatic by most but just part of the action to show how strong a character is and are never brought up again. Even being stabbed or in an actual fight is traumatic to a person, but I guess it would get 'too real' if we show people after 'epic fights' lose their shit, sleep and get into panic attacks at others being aggressive towards them and don't be brave and strong afterwards. Violence in general is so so normalized.

[@SamuraiXGeisha]

THANK YOU!!!! I avoid "adult" shows because many default to assualting women and framing it as torture p0rn

[@l.n.3372]

My male best friend told me that GoT show constantly added rape scenes and that the show runners don't understand consent. So I decided to never watch the show.

[@em01455]

Same

[@l.n.3372]

@em01455 Smart choice. It apparently ends so badly. We didn't miss much

[@Attribute-X]

A lot of the rapey stuff, GOT showed, wasn't even in the books at all, mind you, a lot of them were inventions of David & Dan.

[@dianesaccomano2671]

Same reason I've never watched it.

[@yukikanegawa7470]

The books are good tho. The ending was bad cause they ran out of books and made things up.

[@after_dark7]

Thank you so much for this video. I stopped watching Game of Thrones around 2014 because of the r*pe scenes. They just made me extremely uncomfortable and ruined the whole thing for me. Something clicked in me and I started to realise how r*pe was used as a plot device in media. At the time, no one around me shared my views and I had to hear more than once that GoT is "supposed to be historically accurate" (roll eyes). In later seasons, when the plot quality started declining, people assumed I stopped watching because the overall story was bad, and when I told them it was because of the unnecessary r*pe scenes, I can't describe the look on their faces, most of them took it as a personal attack or pretended to not know what I was talking about, as if I was crazy. I'm so happy this is being talked about more in the open in recent years.

[@mayafey7595]

I hate GoT. I find it shows a lot of stupid and bad people doing stupid things. No, it's not realistic, it's stupid and agressive and disgusting. I am with you. But it's not only the rape scenes, it's de violence for no reason... Same happened with Black Sails. Stupid people doing horrible things.

[@crazycookie4645]

The "historically accurate" argument kinda falls apart when you remember that the show has dragons, zombies, and straight-up magic in it. Also, it takes place in a completely fictional world.

[@SingingSealRiana]

Sooo you want realistic media showing the common horrors of humanity and their consequences but somehow the one that was prevent and feared though all ages, that one is somehow magically is not a thing?! War, treason, torture and starving all good, but rape, thats nit allowed to traumatise anyone

[@SingingSealRiana]

​... News flash .. Voilance, treason and sadly rape too are all part of reality and way more common then you apparently think. You are of cause free to only consume feel good media, but claiming something that depicts the hows and whys of human cruelty is unrelistic for not make out homans as paragons of virtues is plain immature. Look at history the borgias, the incest insanity of the ptolomeic dynasty, how henry the 8th estamlished a new religion to justify his hunder for a new woman, and the need of a male heir. Look at the utter senselessnes of the vietnam war. Look at people like hitler and trump get elected, at the numbers of just how damned common rape is and how a woman gets punished with a lifesentens for killing her trafficker and rapist in selfdefense, while rapists get a few years if anything. Look at how women get declared criminals for thrying to decide over their own bodies and get denied lifesaving surgery to prioritise a clump of cells with zero sentences!!! The funniest thing about your complaint over GoT as voilant as in glorifying it is, that it is quite the opposite. The author is deeply pacifistic anf feministic and you read his wirk instead of just complaining about him daring to call out wrongdooing in humans, you would realise his message is, war is never good or glorious, voilance will always harm both sides and every cruelty will have consequences. There is a great piece of one of the books to find read here on youtube septon(priest/preacher) meribalds broken man speach, in which he talks about how the war into which the common men, farmers and such are drafted breaks them, how the voilance they are forced to inact steals their identity, errodes their morals and turns then into very dangerous but also pityable beings. They lost all they valued, all sense of identity fighting for who knows what under who knows who and some of them wake up, suddenly realising what they are doing and utterly horrified..... It is a very terifying and sympathetic speach about hoe our circumstances can turn us into monsters. It is kinda similar to the song hero of war. Listen to that speach, and then tell me, that the author writes sensless voilance without any depth just for the heck of it. That he glorifies voilance .....

[@mercyfulfate666]

​@@SingingSealRianathat's not the point. The point is - got is almost porn. It uses the rape fetish in gruesome ways. It's made for men mostly - see the amount of naked girls and no naked men ever- and sadly rape is used to make men feel aroused since long ago, and most girls feel unconfortable watching for this reason. So no, the point was never to be 'realistic' (come on, DRAGONS AND ZOMBIES), but to guarantee it would sell to a male audience. So yeah, it's disgusting.

[@billiealexander7484]

As an ASOIAF fan the fact that the writers felt the need to rewrite scenes from consensual sex scenes into rape scenes in Game of Thrones will always be a bizarre sticking point. Same with REALLY graphic scenes added into The Handmaids Tale that weren't in the books. I know some won't agree. Like everything it's a part of life and could be a part of storytelling so I can see the place in a story where it's integral to the plot in some way. But also feel like...I wonder if maybe it's oversaturated in American media the way all violence is. I'd be curious to see the data compared to films and TV overseas if sexual assault is depicted as frequently.

[@molasorrosalom4846]

Yeah, Jaimie doesn't SA Cersai in the book. Also, Daenerys wants SA'd by Khal Drogo in the book. But the book DOES have a ton of SA.

[@burnedoutgraduatestudent4482]

@@molasorrosalom4846Arguably, what happened between Daenerys and Khal Drogo was still SA, considering Daenerys was only 13 and Khal Drogo was 30 and the book even said Danerys wanted to end her life rather than go on.

[@molasorrosalom4846]

​@@burnedoutgraduatestudent4482She wanted to end her life, because he just kept pounding away her at day after day, and she was tired of the constant traveling.

[@natalimoina]

Just depends where overseas

[@SkooMer-h6i]

Thank you! It was always SA in the books! A thirteen year old sold as a slave bride cannot consent to sex with an adult warlord! I hated the unnecessary descriptions of explicit sex scenes involving minors in the books.

[@crazycookie4645]

On a meta-level, I've noticed that whenever women complain about this there is always, without fail, that one guy who goes, "well men get sexually assaulted too!" And yes, men absolutely do get sexually assaulted too, but using that to talk over women who've been assaulted is a special kind of sleazy. Using one victim's trauma to talk over another victim is one of the worst things you can do to someone who has gone through one of the most degrading things a person can experience. It just comes across as playing oppression olympics. Another thing that bothers me is that while hypersexuality is a common and valid trauma response, I'm worried it's becoming the only kind of trauma response media is willing to depict nowadays. I had the opposite reaction when I was assaulted. I became extremely averse to physical contact altogether, but that's rarely shown in media. Media either ignores the fallout almost entirely or they go the hypersexual route. I guess trauma responses like mine aren't "exciting" enough to really be explored. That's my problem with characters like Angel Dust becoming more common. They only depict the hypersexual response to assault when that is not the only response people can have. The "sex worker who was assaulted in the past" is practically it's own cliche at this point because of how over-used it is. I think this comes down to voyeurism. Aversion to physical contact isn't as easy for writers to present in a fetishized way, so they usually ignore it. Responses like mine are usually written off as just being "prudish".

[@michace]

Thank you for mentioning Angel Dust, cause I think he’s a good example of this problem but with a male character. Doesn’t help that he’s not very well written, constantly sexually harasses other characters, embodies many gay stereotypes, and his only complexity stems from the SA he faces.

[@badbitterworst]

Can you provide examples of those kind of characters, please? I've never encountered something like this

[@CaptainPikeachu]

Also the people who bring up men being assaulted too, often don’t care when men do get assaulted in real life and will make jokes about it

[@poptarts8278]

You might like Leigh Bardugo's Six of Crows if you want to see more, respectful, depictions of SA survivors. Long story short, Inej was sold to a place called the Menagerie when she was a child, by the time that the story starts, she is already out of there and what happened to her there is never explicitly described but it's clear what happened. She shows no want to touch people unless completely necessary. There is also Kaz, he isn't a survivor but his own trauma has left him so adverse to touch that it is often referred to by fans as straight up haphephobia. Both characters are strong, have agency and aren't pitied or sexualised by the narrative for their traumas or coping mechanisms. They also have an overtly romantic relationship with each other that I don't think ever even amounts in a kiss, they love eachother and are secure enough in eachother without the physical aspect. And both characters get their own POV chapters, so it isn't someone else telling their stories, it's them. It is truly some of the best depictions of asexuality and touch aversion due to trauma that I have found.

[@mieshocked1450]

I knew where this comment was going. Angel Dust is a valid and good representation. His hypersexuality is not a unvalid response. Honestly I'm so tired of this. I dont know how you can seriously look at him and think he's a bad representation. He is much more than a "thirsty sw".a And the fact that it's not even graphic or explicit 😒 you just dont want to validate Angel's victimhood, despite it being well written.

[@4thcutiemarkcrusader]

I agree with this video, all I'd add into it is adding more observation of how male rape victims are just used for laughs. Like Hughie from The Boys. I appreciate videos talking about rape in medis. You talking about your experience made me realize that what I'm a victim of is not a joke. I was SA'd by a friend then the whole friend group sided with her. They made me feel like I was wrong. Saying "She didn't mean to make you feel uncomfortable" when I literally said to her to stop. Keep creating content, even if it's hard to talk about.

[@BatAmerica]

Good point. If only the writers treated Hughie's suffering with the same empathy as Annie.

[@FrancisR420]

To be clear we're talking about when he was raped by the shapeshifter and literally laughs It off? not the other scene with tech night when then they make a point to have a serious male victim moment at the end of the episode.

[@Attribute-X]

Another thing I would like to add is that it's revealed in one season 4 episode that Firecracker raped a 15 year old boy and no one discusses it or really treats it as something truly abominable in the story, it's just used to make her seem more horrible, and while it works in that regard it feels poorly written for some reason. Also, it sometimes portrays her as being horrified at some thing's that the Seven do, and in the ending scene where I think she shed's a tear and looks like she might not be fully on board with Homelander's regime, but it's hard to feel sympathy for her, given she's a pedophilic rapist.

[@rejectionisprotection4448]

There are ways to do it differently. In the Scottish drama "Shetland", the female detective is g*raped. You don't see it happening AT ALL, the focus is on the effect on her and those around her. Not surprisingly those episodes were written and directed by women. Another show I'm currently watching is Dutch drama "Ferry: The Series". It's about a drug dealer. One of his colleagues gets tortured and you see how it affects him and ruins their "deals" (as he's the "cook"). You also get flashbacks into his childhood as well. It dawned on me that you rarely see ANYONE dealing with the trauma of being tortured or hurt in drama People just get up out of hospital to catch the criminal or to get back in action.

[@vbrown6445]

Shetland is one of my favorite shows. Many seasons later, and now with a partner and child, we still see Tosh dealing with the after effects of that SA. It's very well done.

[@darlalathan6143]

I'm an SA survivor myself! Thanks for raising my consciousness on this issue! As a cartoonist, I'm working on a "darker-and-edgier" superhero comic, set in a high-crime city, and never even thought of including rape scenes! So far, I've drawn an arson scene, police brutality and rioting in the '60s in my webcomic. I always thought Game of Thrones had way too much rape and sex work going on!

[@user-pi3hd2bt3f]

Police brutality and corruption are the best way to make a story dark imo. Way better than needless SA because to me, nothing is more horrifying than the people who are supposed to protect people, turning on the people and getting no repercussions for it. Like, what is there even to do in that scenario except just take it?

[@FishareFriendsNotFood972]

"The only unforgivable historical 'inaccuracy' is giving women agency." 100%!!!

[@artistna]

Hearing how Steven Harrington’s character was supposed to go is wild, I never would have thought something like that would happen in stranger things. Clearly it wouldn’t have added anything, and would have made the characters worse. What we got was leagues better.

[@lisamurdock6679]

If they had stuck with it, they also were going to kill his character off in the first season as well, but they ended up liking the actor and decided to change things for the better

[@burnedoutgraduatestudent4482]

This isn’t really related but when I was in high school nearly every book we had to read had some form of SA in it (Speak, House on Mango Street, The Kite Runner, Catch 22) and it was highly triggering for me. So maybe this isn’t just a problem with gritty tv shows. Idk maybe I’m grasping at straws.

[@Joesgamesntech]

No, no, youre totally right. I had the same feeling when i was at school. Most of the texts are about really heavy shit and youre really forced to engage with it or fail the class, so if it happens to be something thats really triggering for u that class is gonna be hell and your exams r gonna be hell. It sucks.

[@cannolishowtime7055]

Duuuude in Health class we had to read The Lovely Bones 😮😢 was NOT ready for how that book begins (brutal grape + murder of a 13 yr old and murderer never gets caught) just broke my heart forever

[@Ashenhooks]

I had this same experience. It led to a huge fight in class where nearly all the students told off our teacher for assigning so much of that content WITHOUT A HEADS UP AT ALL. She insisted we should all be "mature enough" to handle it.

[@Falkflip]

This. In 10th grade (so we all were aged 14-16) we read The Perks of Being a Wallflower in English class. The book contains detailed descriptions of PTSD, s*icidal ideation, s*xual coercion, violence against queer folks, aftermath of drugs and mentions s*icide and r*pe. Did we get a warning about any of this beforehand? No. How did we discuss the book? We wrote a character analysis or plot summaries. Not once did we talk about the topics of s*xualized violence or trauma and having to read it really messed with me back then, partly because I didn't even really understand the gravity of a lot of the situations in there, they just left a really bad feeling of stuff being very wrong.

[@JustEmeraldStar55]

I often dread watching a show knowing that it includes any kind of SA. If anything, that’s one of the few things that stops me from watching a series altogether. I’m glad you spoke about this. It was needed❤️

[@milamila1123]

Raping Sansa isn't even the worst thing they showed Ramsey do in the show. He tortured and mutilated Theon earlier, reducing him to a quivering, barely-person mess. I don't know why they even added the scene. It was so unnecessary. Edit: Then again, they showed Theon getting tortured and raped by those two women, so...

[@noagaselga3345]

In the book Theon has it much worse than in the show, but none of it is shown, it completely happens off screen and you just see the effect of it. Meanwhile in the show he gets like, 7 episodes of torture porn, while they cut other actually important/interesting stuff, and let's not mention how much they focus on the fact that he was castrated while in the books it's just hinted and it's not even sure

[@Attribute-X]

In the books, Ramsay rapes a 13-14 year old child named Jeyne Poole who was Sansa's friend(they included her in episode 1, I think, but they basically adapted her out), and because the novels lack the scenes where Ramsay broke Theon into becoming Reek, Ramsay's most disturbing shown moment is when he violates Jeyne...there were also hints that he was gonna force her to do stuff with his dogs, the ones he uses on his "hunts"... Oh and did I mention that Ramsay's "hunts" are WORSE in the books, the reason why is because instead of having his dogs maul a girl to death once, he does it as a HOBBY and instead of making his dogs maul the girls, Ramsay instead rapes the girl, kills her, then flays her corpse and takes the flayed skin back to the Dreadfort as a Bolton souvenir...but that's only if they give him a good hunt, if not then he flays them while they are alive and rapes them, you remember that close-up of Adrack Humble? The overweight Ironborn guy who betrays his commander and surrenders Moat Cailin to Theon & the Boltons, but is then(offscreen) flayed alive by Ramsay, who gouges one of his eyes out and puts his corpse on a pike? Well imagine all that(except maybe the eye gouging and putting the corpse on a pike)...but happening to young girls! Then there's what he did to his first "wife", Lady Donella Hornwood...

[@theflashgordon193]

​@@Attribute-XOh my god ...

[@nont18411]

@@Attribute-X the worst part is that whenever someone criticized George RR Martin about this, his fans will chastise that person as “snowflake who can’t handle realistic and mature stories”.

[@CesarALlanos]

@@nont18411I’m not really sure what there is to genuinely criticize in the above. Everything is implied or discussed in the book, but never shown explicitly to us. The chapter ends before Ramsay rapes Jeyne. The chapter is about both Theon and Jeyne’s trauma subjected to them by Ramsay. And once again, it is not pornographically lingered on in excess. GRRM understands that the implication is horrible enough, not the act itself. I truly don’t see what the problem is with this depiction of the darkest parts of humanity.

[@kendallthompson2027]

I blame GOT for starting the "trend" that everyone else picked up on. I'm surprised Outlander wasn't mentioned as a culprit as well. As for Mary's SA in Reign, I'm glad at least that they did show her trauma (whether realistic or not) in the show and it does change her as a character even if it's used as a plot point to further Francis' character. They show her not wanting to be touched, averse to the sound of breathing, and the way it affects her relationships with both Francis and Conde. That's just my two cents, though.

[@namiakatsuki970]

Could you specify which outlander are you talking about? outlander 2014 ( drama) or outlander 2008 (movie)? And if you be so kind, could you write few other movies/series that you know of, where there's r####? I will add them to my list of NEVER SEE THIS. Even if its a movie about healing from sa. Thank you in advance.

[@katb1440]

@@namiakatsuki970 It's definitely Outlander the show. The graphic r*pe scenes are the reason I stopped watching.

[@namiakatsuki970]

@@katb1440 Thank you! Now I will never watch this show. Dodged a bullet! 😇

[@katb1440]

@@namiakatsuki970 Happy to help.

[@Tenshii_Artii]

I thought I was crazy when I was beginning to notice and hear about intended in shows, they more of these scenes were trending after game of thrones. I only first heard of GOT ironically, because of how notorious it was for the over the top sexual content it sometimes had. As much as I love fantasy, I’m glad I didn’t show much interest in the show not really my thing.

[@lluviasanchez3793]

I wish more people talked about this! I'm kinda aro/ace and I always thought that I was just adverse to SA scenes because I don't generally like sex scenes, but I've noticed that so many SA scenes either feel so unnecessary or worse, sexualized. Sometimes they're blatantly used as fanservice which is so gross. Then of course, they never show a great example of trauma and healing. :(

[@jif635]

THANK YOU, I accidentally started screaming about this to my bf because I told him I liked the show he was watching but the bs traumatic storylines for the women are always exploitative and SA related and I was sick and tired of it.

[@skulliebythesea]

You're so welcome!! Show him this video 🙏

[@mercyfulfate666]

Happened to me as well, and the fact my ex just never even thought about it, since it's not something that affected the male audience (untill it's happening to a man), made me reconsider the relationship.

[@imari9997]

@@mercyfulfate666 Low EQ sort of man.

[@blackmanwithcomputer]

​@@mercyfulfate666tbf, many women and many don't take male SA victims seriously at all.

[@dickottel]

I could never be with a guy who likes shows with violence on women

[@Detolsoap]

Growing up, my parents loved Law and order: SVU. I kinda enjoyed it at first, but consuming that much grape content on a daily basis, really does something for your psyche, especially as a young girl growing up in a dangerous world. It didn't help that i have a hyperactive imagination. I soon began distrusting everyone, especially men, even family members and friends in fear. Eventually i stopped watching it with them and would go into my room once it was on. This is from someone who is seeing this type of stuff on TV. I cannot imagine how it must feel for an SA victim to see the amout of glorifyed SA in every adult show. Its probably why i sitck to shows geared at a younger audience . Adult shows are way too oversexualized. Its gross.

[@myrkflinn4331]

The fact that these actors even have to act out a grape scene realistically... like, how is it fun? Being pretend forced on or forcing on in front of a camera?

[@EmeraldcityVA]

When you talk about how uncomfortable it is for actors and actresses to act out rape scenes I think about the acted out rape scene in perfect blue. The main charecter is a beginning actress who does the scene even though it makes her uncomfortable because she doesn’t want to let anybody down. Her co star acting out the scene with her even apologizes because he’s just as uncomfortable with the scene as she is.

[@LukiaChan08]

As someone who grew up with Bollywood movies from the 80/90s - I *really* needed this video essay, majority of them had a seen of grape and just used it for almost normalisation (in my opinion) and entertainment value. I saw another video essay who talked about not only it doesn't add anything but also these scenes are often from the grapist point of view by hyper seggualising the female character about to be graped. So it matters, not only why, how it effects the character and how it's shown..

[@lexa_power]

I’ve had this complaint about GOT for YEARS AND YEARS. I’ve literally been rambling about this exact topic to everyone who will listen to me whether i know them or not for at least 15 years now. My real life friends and family don’t agree with me and couldn’t care less about my thoughts. Seeing this video kinda inspires me to make some content about it. I had no idea youtube / tik tok had an appetite for this type of feminist media opinion. Thanks! And completely agree, and so glad someone else has been saying what I’ve been saying since freshman year in film school (and being told I’m wrong by people IN HOLLYWOOD my entire freaking career. Exhausting!) my take home point has always been: if you can imagine a world with dragons, you can imagine a world without rape. No more misogynistic imaginary universes please…. Women get enough SA in real life! We don’t need it on TV and in movies, too.

[@karolshayan5421]

Louder! 👏👏👏

[@moody2893]

THISSS OMGGG. I’m glad I stumbled across all of this, I feel so seen. 🥲

[@EmpressJusticeTarot]

I have two theories with regards to this: 1) The writers actually want to write in LOTS of consensual sex, but they're afraid that critics will complain about it being NOTHING but soft core. So - and I'm almost dry-heaving as I type this - they turn the sex into SA to legitimise the scene as "drama". Ugh. 2) The last reason you mentioned - there could be a level of fetishism to the SA, which for me, is even worse to think about. I honestly don't think it has anything to do with drama, emotion or edge, I just think it's sexual frustration, then framing it as a ticket to self-realisation for the often attractive female characters as a get-out clause.

[@HASQ779]

Oh my god. I am fully shocked about the Steve SA reveal. I actually loved the fact that they were having a fully consensual sex scene while Barb got taken because it added a layer to Nancy's guilt that played in interesting ways later.

[@Timmywhimmy]

Finally! I hate these so-called gritty shows. Its BS imo. For ppl who had experienced SA its retruamatising. For those who love this kind of thing its sickening how they can 'dream' about this if they havent done it to another human being OR if they did, they get enjoyment out of it and can replay it to gross little heart's delight. Also, imo some of the writers or whoever wants it in a show/movie, i think thats their way of fantasising what they really want to do to ppl. I'm glad some writers, actors, etc are pushing back. I also feel this is used to normalise SA to younger generations to continue the this disgusting cycle

[@Allystargirl]

I was unlucky enough to watch the first original season of 13 reasons why when it first came out, my mom wasn’t very interested in watching, but I was a bit young so she wanted to watch it with me, just make sure it was ok ya know and I didn’t have to look away for anything, and the r word scene in the hot tub, and the sewer slide scene in the bathtub kind of horribly re traumatized my mom :(( we stopped watching it was just a little too much. I felt so bad after that. I didn’t actually know that stuff was gonna happen and be shown so graphically. My mom has experienced similar things… so it was like a gut punch to see how that affected her, and to realize why :((

[@channel45853]

If it is retraumatizing, then that is a problem of the film not having a warning for survivors of SA, not a problem of the film itself. Also, dreams or fantasies don't count against a person's morals. Those are kinks. This is a fictional piece of media. If it was actually SA, you would have a point. But a pattern I am seeing with people like yourself, is that because something disgusts you, even if it doesn't hurt anyone, you have to find some way to make it immoral. Like how conservatives can be with homosexuality.

[@channel45853]

What you think doesn't matter. You can think someone is a pedo, but without proof, you are not only making potential victims look less legitimate by watering down the definition, but you're also writing libel which is illegal. Again, how you feel doesn't matter. Conspiracy with no real proof is something most people disregard.

[@rejectionisprotection4448]

Except it DOES hurt people, whether you watch it or not. Media is VERY powerful in shaping people's perceptions and beliefs.

[@hbsupreme1499]

​@@rejectionisprotection4448 and the people have spoken

[@FallenChocoCookie]

This stuff is why intimacy coordinators are so important. I’m always reminded of the Baldur‘s Gate 3 cast praising them for the work they did with them on the game. People who shoot difficult scenes must have proper support available and those scenes obviously should never be in a story just to be dark or grim or „realistic“. Edit: I wrote this before seeing you included a screenshot of Astarion 😂 called it. His story was so well written and presented ❤ still, a good point that there is nothing similar that comes to mind regarding a female survivor.

[@paulacameron5920]

absolutely about recovery - often it's way too quick and tidy which does women who have experienced this a huge injustice - essentially it minimises the experience of real survivors

[@williamr.c.4168]

Game of Thrones was the story that proved once and for all that there is such a thing as Too Edgy. I literally couldn’t take it seriously because pretty much every two minutes I was flabbergasted at how meaninglessly screwed up it was. Like I’m all for edgy fiction but Game of Thrones was just…entirely too damn much.

[@SOL_NEKROS]

tbh i've been exposed to so many "free SA" scenes in tv shows and movies since a very young age, this most happening to women and it's mostly in horror/action movies that i've grown absolutely reluctant of those genres. I am very picky before watching anything new specially if it's a "heavy" show because I fear i'll find more SA's and sexual violence and it genuinely get's me sick and feeling deeply sad afterwards.

[@akamered4483]

This isn't talked about enough. I grew up with this bs. Watched GoT with my dad when I was 14. You see these scenes as a child and think you are cool for watching it and taking it. "Yeah, I'm so grown up already, this horror doesn't effect me". Guess what?

[@nitzeart]

Even in media that's supposedly having a conversation on the topic of SA and body autonomy, like the Last Duel (2021), they make a spectacle out of the SA. Like they just HAVE to show the scene from the 2 different PoVs. Like... Why?? Did we really needed the scene from the r*pist pov? I understand the rest of the scenes being juxtaposed, but the actual moment didn't need to be shown TWICE to make your point. Did a male audience really wouldn't be able to sympathize with the story if it wasn't shown through the lens of the men characters?? That seems insulting to men and what the writers and directors think of how much empathy men actually have. I truly hate this trend of gritty that's just vouyeristic SA/basically 🌽 The only movie about the topic that has good portrayal of it imo is Women Talking. None of it is shown explicitly, but the consequences are lasting and the trauma literally impacts a whole community of women and girls to the point they decide to upheave their entire lives. It is such a good movie, very heavy, but I highly encourage people watching it.

[@etcetera1995]

Were they trying to go for some sort of Rashomon-style of story about unreliable narration...? That's the only explanation I can think of aside from it just being a fixation with victimized women.

[@nitzeart]

@etcetera1995 Sort of?? Yes but it did it so badly 😭 Ok some spoilers ahead, nothing detailed but still. It does have an unreliable narrator thing, or a "different people remeber it differently". It was a movie trying to give us 3 perspectives of the whole situation and following trial; from the woman, her husband, and the r*pist. But it shows you the situation twice and is unnecessary to understand what happens and how the two perspectives remember it. Because from the rest of the scene surrounding the r*pe, we understand that he saw it as her teasing him, while she was terrified and then traumatized and v*olated. It wasn't necessary to see the thing happen TWICE, and one fromt he perpetrator. It was perfectly understandable without it. It was trying to contrast the way the men look at the events of the story, puffing themselves out, thinking themselves great, when the woman remembers everything VERY differently. It tries to be a feminist film while still s3xually exploiting the woman in it, and then not actually focusing on her; we don't even get her point of view until 1/3 way of the movie. There are no other important female characters, she doesn't have friends, maids or family. Which COULD have been a good point to tell us how isolated women ware more easily preyed upon, how community is vital to women, but the movie didn't say that either. Interesting idea, horrible execution.

[@Sandcat]

I remember it performing terribly and Ridley Scott ranted about movie-goers not wanting to see his movie because they only care about their phones. No, dude, no one wants that. He said/she said multiple perspective SA movie? Give me a break.

[@nitzeart]

@Sandcat Omg, I didn't even realize at the time it was directed by Ridley Scott!! No wonder 🙄 He's on my sh*tlist of directors now and I won't watch another movie by him, not after the last duel AND gladiator 2. (I have similar issues regarding how the women are portrayed in the blade runner 2049 movie and how Scott excused it 😅 He doesn't get the criticisms people make of his bad "feminist" takes)

[@emmablack1230]

As someone who has trauma, I like things that depict SA but it has to be done well

[@skulliebythesea]

This

[@bella-bond]

Have you seen Teeth (2007) by any chance? I liked it but I’m curious to hear other people’s takes on it

[@emmablack1230]

@@bella-bond I haev not

[@camillewilliams1819]

Thank you for sharing your recovery experience! Im not q survivor of SA but I want to make sure i stay educated and compassionate! And i also want to continue educating those in my life about rape culture! Our society has way too high of a tolerance for sexual assault, and we need to learn to take care of each other! Even though I'm not sexually active, i sometimes worry about what i would do or others around me would respond if i was in a situation of nonconsenual sex. Thank you for using your platform to empower others and have important conversations!

[@skulliebythesea]

Thank you for listening ❤️

[@IrisBobiris3]

I remember when it happened to me in my teenage years, I developed such a fear of people and the world that I scarcely left my room for a long time. I did not go outside for anything, but to stand on the porch and look at the stars for about three months. My entire life fell apart.

[@moody2893]

I’m so sorry that happened to you. I wish you all the best in your journey to heal. 💖

[@sobekmania]

I was kind of surprised at how the portrayal of sexual assault in The Boys is... actually not that bad? It's a very gratuitous show, so on first watch I was surprised at how, when portraying an instance of sexual assault, they *never* show the violence but rather depict the damage it causes to both the victims and the world around them. It doesn't feel voyeuristic or unnecessary, especially when the assaults of Starlight and Becca Butcher are used as relevant plot points and not as excessive fan service.

[@billiealexander7484]

Curious how you feel about the most recent season and how they depict Hughie being assaulted compared to the women in the show?

[@sweetlevi4061]

Dont watch the most recent season. They spat in the fact of male sa/rape victims. hughie is assaulted several times in the show. The director thought it was funny.

[@jameer7565]

I thought you were talking about the new season with Hughie and was so confused.

[@LilacSreya]

@other comments in this thread Hughie's dummy was just laying at the corner of the screen for like 3 seconds (full scenes are long, but his shots are not). We don't see anyone barely touching him. He doesn't graphically scream and cry or is beaten around like the most of the female characters (the violence part is stopped, and in the rest he pretends to enjoy it. He doesn't enjoy, but the point is we aren't shown his pain). Even majority of the focus was on Ashley. People whining and bitching everywhere about this 1 instance of a male character; compared to the silencing of the complaints about insurmountable number of female characters just shows how hypocritical and biased society is.

[@Twink6629-lg3te]

The way the deep literally raped starlight yet despite that he is still also a main character with lots of screen time and jokes and sort of a redemption a bit lately to me kinda rubs me weird 🤷‍♂️

[@crouchingidiot]

There is really no reason I can think of to graphically depict an assault. The audience is smart, we can conclude what happened. We will be just as sad and horrified without pages and pages or minutes of seeing graphic assault.

[@UltraViolet666]

Thank you for including the Stranger Things example. Perfect example of why it's not necessary. I'm actually appalled that they wanted to do that to begin with.

[@projecttnzxelsiz]

its almost ironic because the way stranger things handles the implications of what Brenner did to the lab children really well. its never on screen, its not even mentioned, its just implied that El may be a daughter that 001 was forced to have. like... 001 saying Brenner started a "program" and then that El was born.... its clear that the lab is a breeding program and its never over the top

[@theprettypurplepony]

This is such a good video, I really appreciated you including the perspectives of the actors who had to participate in those scenes. It's so frustrating to see that Game of Thrones episode came out nearly a decade ago and we're still dealing with a lot of the same issues.

[@johannageisel5390]

The moment that Khal Drogo grape s Daenerys "Game of Thrones" lost me as a viewer. In general: If I want to see "realism" in the form of SA, I can read an Amnesty International report. I don't also need it in the media I consume for entertainment.

[@Attribute-X]

Unfortunately it happens in the books too, but it's not depicted as violent but it's still awful since Dany is like 13 in the first book, not 18 like in the show.

[@Shades781]

Adult media always feels the need to be extreme to be "mature". They want to be taken seriously and seen as mature despite never earning that. It gets gross very quickly. Worse is when they show it on screen. It always feels so tangible, even if a character isn't being SA'd. It's deeply uncomfortable at best, and incredibly disturbing on average. Media is very hypersexualized and edgy so I avoid certain ratings often because of it. Edit: Honestly it feels like tv wants to upset people in EVERY way.

[@kikikalathiasart9510]

8:40 the game "Mouthwashing" does an amazing job at doing this. The SA is so important to the story, but if you play the game with your mind turned off, you wont even realize that SA happened.

[@taetaesblessedhands1635]

what amazes me about the game is that it still pulled off the thematics of autonomy and bodily violation by making a male character visualise the themes (e.g. curly has stuff shoved down his throat like pills etc. often) instead of objectifying the actual sexual assault victim woman like horror media often do. it feels veeery refreshing.

[@MicahRion]

The part of your story you shared about being more protective about who you let in after a SA was a really important reminder for me. I'm thinking about how I want to apply that to my life right now as I heal.

[@skulliebythesea]

It's helped me form stronger friendships and protect myself. Wishing you the best of luck on your healing journey

[@mercyfulfate666]

I FUCKING HATE GOT. It seems like a Lord of the Rings for horny dudes. And the series is made is SUCH A DISGUSTING WAY it doesn't even seen like a modern show, it seems like made in 70s. It revolts me even more that, when you talk about it to most men, they tend to brush it off, but ALL HELL BREAKS LOOSE if there's male nudity or a male being raped in some scene. THEN it's horrible and unnecessary. Damn I hate this industry.

[@Sarah-rl3tj]

Honestly I found GOT way worse than Caligula from 1979. At leat he was showed as monster and you shouldn’t sympathise with him. I stopped watching GOT after 2-3 episodes, I couldn’t handle how they approached sexual violence in the show

[@Ri57490]

Whenever I find out that someone is a GOT fan, I immediately think less of them.

[@TheMightyAerodrakon]

@@Ri57490 based

[@nont18411]

GoT kinda bred the culture of victim blaming as well. Just look at how many people idolize Tywin Lannister and excuse Ramsay’s behaviors because “he has a bad childhood” while demonizing good guys like Ned and Robb Stark for being “ret@rds”.

[@simmingsammi]

What I found really strange about the Sansa thing is one of the creators of the show (DnD) said Sansa is his favorite character. Why would you add a scene like that for your favorite character???

[@nont18411]

There are different kinds of favorite characters. Sansa seems like their barely disguised fetish. Meanwhile, their “actual” favorite characters that they really loved to push forward about how cool they are are Arya Stark and Tywin Lannister. It’s well known about Arya. Plot armor and stuffs. In case of Tywin, they deliberately made him much more likable than in the books. This guy is a genocidal dictator who ordered his men to gang rape his daughter in law to teach his son (Tyrion) a lesson but the show justifies all his war crimes by saying that him committing the red wedding was noble because it’s better to kill dozens at dinner than thousands in a battlefield. They also added many scenes that make him look like a wise old man like his scenes with Arya and Tommen (both show only). And the best (or worst) part is that they deliberately removed the aforementioned plotline of Tywin gangraping Tyrion’s wife to make Tywin and Tyrion more likable.

[@CaptainPikeachu]

I realized recently that part of the reason I really enjoy watching Rings of Power is that here’s finally a fantasy show that isn’t gonna try to sell me that SA is necessary for dark and grittiness in “good adult stories”. I can just enjoy the story and even characters in peril without all the unnecessary violence that female characters so often get. Makes me really appreciate Tolkien’s world and the showrunners sticking to that no unnecessary gratuitous sexual violence mentality. More shows should be like this.

[@into_a_fantasy_]

Growing up watching many movies and TV shows and it being so normalised made me feel so physically sick and angry and scared I had a negative relationship with sex before even starting that journey And I know many others who feel the same How that can be so normalised is just crazy to me

[@skulliebythesea]

this.

[@KingDeadMan]

Words from my wise, past 12y.o self: "What doesn't kill you won't make you stronger, but will break you down into what feels like debilitating agony." I was speaking to my mother at the time, spouting her boxed-in "sayings". After I said those words to her, she had told me that I was being "too negative", when I had only been stating the truth. If getting stronger after being torn down so badly were actually true, you would not see people go into mental psychosis, self-loathing, phantom pain, PTSD, OCD, hypo/hyper-sexual disorders, etc... I'm not even able to watch generic anime anymore because it's full of mysogyny & the sexualization of children. It makes me physically ill to watch any of that nasty crap, as if it were remotely healthy. I've had several breakdowns this past week, after accummilating so much negativity. I had been so desperate that I actively began searching for positive things to watch; even though it did help my spiraling, I cried even more to see such positive things taking place. This morning, I had watched the latest episode of Dandadan (ep.7). Without spoiling it, the scene was done very well, but that had made me go into another apathetic panic attack. I don't appreciate my 180 emotions, the clarity & insensitivity (on my part) makes my emotions feel small & unnecessary, but I want to feel my emotions. I can't even cry, without apathy interrupting me & making my sadness feel disingenuine. I really hope this comment doesn't get shadow deleted. 😣

[@saffxo6988]

The indie game Mouthwashing has the best example of rape in media that I’ve ever seen. Focuses on the horror that is the aftermath for the victim, and not the act itself. It actually heavily impacts the entire story, too, let alone the victim.

[@phoenixashlynn]

People for years have been telling me to watch GoT, that it's exactly up my alley, that I'd love it. About a year ago I said fuck it, I'll give it a try. There was so much goddamn sexual assault that I was appalled people thought I'd just be okay with it because "its fantasy, you love D&D!". I never finished it. I couldn't. I wasn't interested much in it anyway, and all the assault just made it feel too uncomfortable to keep watching for whatever meager payoff there was going to be.

[@hannahg5407]

You’ve put it into words perfectly I’m so tired of seeing sa in shows for cheap drama

[@savvy76]

I think an amazing example of grape being used for a characters development is seen in Castlevania. Alucard gets SA'd and it is an entire arc of his, he was isolated, allowed two people in who mirrored the friends he longed for, their betrayal and the physical scars they left on him, the anguish for himself and who he was before when he kills his grapists. Then when he further falls into isolation and fear, battling with his human need for community and companionship at war with his trauma and vampiric nature. UGH it was beautiful, I feel like it is the only good SA I've ever seen depicted, like it actually served a purpose.

[@JordanSullivanadventures]

One piece of media that I've been struggling with lately is the Calliope episode of Neil Gaiman's Sandman Netflix show. It depicts a struggling author who kidnaps and repeatedly rapes a woman who he keeps trapped in his house in order to take inspiration from her as a muse. In public, the man proclaims to be a feminist, that he reads bell hooks and is inspired by Octavia Butler and Shirley Jackson. But privately he is actively perpetrating abusive sexual control over a woman living in his house. The sexual assault is not shown directly; it is respectful to the survivor and is implied with unmistakable details. I would have said this is one of the better episodes of television tackling this topic that I've ever seen. But then, earlier this year, the creator of the graphic novel and the showrunner of Sandman, the man who wrote this whole thing, Neil Gaiman was accused by multiple women of sexual assault, including a woman who was the nanny to his children, living in his house, and whom he admitted to "cuddling with in the bathtub." As soon as I read that I felt sick and stopped reading. Several other women accused him of SA in other circumstances, like a female family friend and her daughter who we're also living in his house and whom he had a sexual relationship with while being their only source of housing, and whom he'd later kick out of that housing. This is after years of being a critical darling, beloved by fans for being an active defender of queer and trans people, refugees, and a capable writer of complex and varied female characters. The dramatic irony couldn't be any greater unless he took to calling the women whose housing and employment he controlled his "muses." I've been more shaken up about these revelations than with any other creator I've seen in the public eye. I really thought he would remain the one unproblematic old white guy fav in my fan life. How can you invoke "death of the author," when the author is so blatantly depicting his own life?! I don't know how to approach his work, work I have deeply loved for years, in light of this.

[@ValerieEastwood]

He also had s3x with two 17 year old fans I’m pretty sure (or Neil atleast asked to have s3x with them not quite sure but it’s one of the two)

[@Doctor4077]

Sansa telling the Hound “without Little Finger and the rest, I would have stayed a little girl” will never not make me want to throw up.

[@wreathedriver2856]

God, that Buffy scene. I hadn't seen the interview before, but it's already a scene I have to pretend isn't canon. And yeah, GoT has so much already, but spoilers about Sansa's made me stop watching immediately

[@shoob6298]

I tried really hard to get into GoT because everyone around me was telling me how good it was. I love fantasy, and I gave it a good attempt, but couldn't make it very far. It screamed "we cater to the male viewer" in disgusting ways. The female characters were all treated so poorly it made me sick to watch. Every. Single. One. I quit after Brienne (she was a warrior with respecable prowess, I was happy to see a woman not fit the male gaze) was almost sa'ed but was "saved" because the man she was with convinced the men to stop. I was horrified, and felt violated myself in a way, because I let myself relate to her as a character. And I noticed that that happened to show that the man she was travelling with was a "good guy". Then, later, they have a bathing scene together where Brienne is shot fully nude. She was always fully covered in armor, and none of the male characters I saw were given this treatment, that we had to see their body at some point. I was so tired. Another thing that I noticed was that the show obviously takes advantage of what it can do in order to have fan service using women. I mean the female sex workers, they show up incredibly often. They show up to give insight on a man's character, they show up as a joke, and they show up as a show for the men in the scene (including the actual viewer watching). If they were background context my feelings may have been different, but too often did I find myself watching a whole 5 minutes scene just of two girls having sex with full close-ups and changing camera shots. And the over-sexualization of women was *not* the tone for including sa and abuse. Plus, that sort of sex work is also commonly abuse. Which was not at all delved into. Thanks for the video, I've been wanting to get this off my chest

[@demoniccherry5246]

As a survivor myself I’m finding myself struggling with how to depict it in my own work, so far I’ve personally adopted the implication or fade to black form of representation for my stories which require it. I don’t see why others can’t do the same

[@Chameleon_Cat]

16:26 noooo the original story is so gooooooood why'd they have to be so greedy (i know dont "erm actually" me) two "unnatractive" old women and a realistic presentation of how mentally ill people are hidden and shunned for existing? Impossible.

[@lewa3910]

Berserk fans still in denial

[@Mapomboogirl]

The way women can be broken through SA for “realism” but still be a romantically available and sexually active companion for the male lead shortly after in popular media is bonkers. Not only did it make them stronger, it made them more desirable to the male lead. Now she is pretty AND tough! 🤮

[@potatoboy8340]

One popular show that seems to avoid much criticism despite its content is Peaky Blinders. The series includes multiple scenes depicting sexual assault against women, all of which are portrayed in ways that feel so disrespectful and gratuitous. For instance, in the first incomplete rape scene, it’s clear that the assault is included purely for shock value. What’s worse is that it’s played off as a dark joke, and rather than centering on the woman’s experience or her trauma, the focus shifts to Thomas Shelby, the male protagonist. Shelby, who essentially coerces her and places her in this awful situation, ends up framed as the “hero” because he intervenes to "save" her. This approach downplays the woman's suffering and reinforces the male character’s power, all while expecting viewers to respect him. It really says something when a male survivor is depicted later in the series, with far more dignity than any of the female characters who endure assault. Shows like Game of Thrones highlight a trend among male writers who seem unable to create complex female characters without resorting to sexual assault as a shortcut for drama or "character development." Yet, these assaults rarely lead to believable behavioural changes in the characters; instead, they serve as tools to advance the plot. If these writers had experienced anything like this, they wouldn't be presenting it so casually or exploitatively. As a writer myself, I believe the representation of sexual assault should not require graphic scenes. Instead, effective storytelling can show the psychological aftermath, perhaps the steps leading up to the assault, and allow the audience to understand the character’s trauma without explicit visuals. This approach respects the character's dignity, fosters genuine empathy from the audience, and avoids people getting off on it. I really hope to see more conversations about this topic to encourage healthier portrayals especially when these mistakes are still repeated in shows like Hazbin Hotel.

[@Mephisarisa]

I escaped attempted assault by a stranger as a child, which makes me one of the luckier ones. Still, popular media often retraumatised me as an adult. The opening scenes of The Bad Luitenant made me break down and hyperventilate. I read the first Song of Ice and Fire book, and watched the first episode of the show, and both elicited unbearable nausea down to my soul. So when friends and family recommended these stories to me, I'd react harshly and feel unseen. Eventually, I said I'd read them or watch them if the other person read the entirety of Homestuck first. Sadly for them, none of them took the deal.

[@kelswells]

Ok sorry to comment double but this reminded me of 2 examples that have upset me for years. 1. I was so upset at the r*pe scene near the end of the otherwise camp cult classic Showgirls. I was loving the film until that scene and it really ruined it for me bc it felt so cruel. 2. (Sopranos spoilers) Another that comes to mind is the r*pe scene against Dr. Melfi. It felt so unnecessary and they took it nowhere imo. Anyways thanks for verbalizing something that’s bothered me for so long!! Great video:)

[@skulliebythesea]

I love reading comments! Never apologize for double commenting! These two examples were very popular in my discussions on this. Thank you for being here ❤️

[@zoebarnes7746]

The most powerful SA scenes, are always the ones that aren’t said or showed. But implied by the actor/actresses facial expressions and body language. They can say a sentence or two or even not have said they were raped, you just KNOW. And if there is a flashback it’s the minor details: a hand on the leg, a lingering shadow of figure following them into a room, the back of a man putting something into a drink. That is what can be impactful to so many women AND men. It doesn’t need to be shocking or triggering to make the point come across, the POINT will already be made. These are the performances that always get to me on an emotional level because it makes me think there ARE people out there that care for survivors and mental health.

[@imjumokay]

I see this happen so often in comics and it angers me so much. Using assault as a plot tool then never talking about it again. It grosses me out so much.

[@belleferrington-crammond4186]

I still remembering wanting to write a storyline where one of my characters was SA’d due to my own trauma as a way to half explore my own trauma, so when I looked up examples in the media of these scenes it was so disgusting to me. Not only with how they depicted the characters but how they always seem to glamorise it and make it look sexy and appealing and they seem to romanticise the idea of rape. I kinda wanna re visit that story now just to finish it off but I remember wanting to throw up while writing about the after affects it had on the character cause every time it made me remember what it was like and I simply just don’t get how anyone could ever write about something like that so casually. It’s just absolutely disgusting. Also when I showed it to an old friend they asked why I didn’t include more details about the rape itself, or write the rape scene as it happened because quote “no one’s going to sympathise with her if they don’t know how graphic it was”. I dunno it’s just awful really.

[@skylerricketts7392]

I watched a show called “unbelievable” on Netflix which showed all the ways the system fails women of sa, and it was actually really cathartic to watch and know they put sa in, not as a plot device or ‘character development’ but because they were holding a mirror to the real problems in society and showing people how tea and aweful it was. In the Elizabeth smart documentary there is a scene the night of her kidnapping and they show her screaming and trying to get away while her grasp her, the scene goes on to make the point t that this is what she had to deal with for years, and then she breaks the scene by saying “bet you wish it would stop, huh? So did I” which perfectly encapsulates how these scenes should be shot.

[@Dendaliion]

Amen. I'm so damn tired of beeing blindsided by scenes like this. I stop watching in that instant but the picture is already in my head by that point.

[@peblezQ]

Steve Harrington is one of my favourite characters. If he assulted Nancy, I wouldn't have liked the show at all.

[@khaleesi_cosima]

Outlander is definitely guilty of the overwhelming use of r*pe as a plot device and shock value, but what that show does somewhat well is how the victims feel afterwards. Claire, Jaime, Brianna, and others all experience trauma and face social stigma towards their experiences. However, that doesn’t excuse how often it shows up on screen. Like, how many times do we have to watch Claire get abused?

[@XsweetstarliteX]

Honestly, the fact that it’s mostly men writing in these creepy scenes, just continue to heighten the fear, distrust and underlying disdain people have towards men (other men included). Men will always have terrible PR because they keep doing terrible things…like writing in SA of women and children for entertainment (GOT).

[@LunaGirl196]

Bertie and Tuca has a good depiction since it never goes into what exactly happened (the writers didn't want to show it and they didn't want people to try and brush off what happened to her as "not too bad"), and it focuses on the victim. She even goes to therapy

[@realdavestrider]

tuca and bertie's sa rep was so good until they fumbled so hard when the second therapist bertie sees said "its ok for people without sexual trauma to be into rape fantasies cause our brains are just weird 😜😜" literally dropped the show after that how did the writers not think about how harmful that is

[@raumarsene9910]

​@realdavestrider I feel that's at least a good thing to bring up. It is a complicated thing that occurs in some people folk that are assualted and is not often talked about in a non-fetishistic way in media so I don't think it's a bad thing to bring it up. Granted I haven't seen that part of the show as of yet, so idk if they just managed to fumble the writing or not if so then you could have more of a point.

[@kanirekt-exe5050]

Before I say anything, I want to clarify that I DO NOT think that the amount of SA in modern media is justified. I just wanted to respond to one specific point. In this case, I think that when people talk about “realism” in the media they consume, they’re talking about it less from a literal perspective and more from a character one. For any fictional series, to an extent you can tweak literal realism to an extent to serve your story (Game of Thrones and The Boys are prime examples of this). You can have fantastical elements and still have it make sense. However, for any fictional media to work from a character and thematic standpoint, you CANNOT sacrifice the realism of character (i.e. the way someone would realistically behave in a certain situation, the personality a character would have, motivations, internal struggles, etc.), otherwise it creates plot holes and character inconsistencies, and makes the media less thematically sound and resonates less with the audience. Game of Thrones, for example, is set in an incredibly violent world in pseudo-medieval times and currently engaged in a bloody power struggle. From a character perspective, you’d realistically observe a higher-than-normal number men who engage in or do not mind the sexual assault of women. From a character perspective, if you’re writing a gritty story, it be weird from a character perspective if men in a society in which men frequently have power over women *didn’t* think that they had the right to women’s bodies. The Boys, similarly, is set in a modern world in which corrupt superheroes are basically allowed to do whatever the fuck they want with no consequences. I mean, one of the characters literally is known for sexually harassing women. From a character perspective, it’s realistic that individuals with unchecked levels of power from both a physical and social standpoint would engage in terrible violations and crimes against people, including sexual assault, especially if in a society that still has exploitable systems and culture that allow or even encourages women to be treated like objects. So, yeah. People are moreso talking about character realism when they say that stuff, not literal realism. Again, I want to reiterate, this does not negate ANY of your points about how gratuitous it is or how it’s often mishandled in writing female characters. I just wanted to respond to the realism point, but to be fair I probably got something wrong here. Toodles!

[@mercyfulfate666]

Realism? Got is about zombies and dragons and people with dragon's blood. NOTHING is realistic, so no, it's not an excuse.

[@guardianofmyroom8423]

I’m starting to realize why I prefer watching cartoons now. I use to love live action shows, but find myself dreading or dragging my feet watching gritty tv shows. There will always be a scene with SA. Hell, I love anime but have curated my taste to only watch more wholesome ones. I’ve stopped watching anime that has a lot of fan service, huge age gaps, this is a 1000 year old dragon but looks 8 (looking at you Dragon Maid). Like I loved My Hero for a while and just can’t back into it because of the gross fan service. I really only like the story lines that revolve around the adults (Hawks, I just love Hawks). But I’ve absolutely love Owl House, Lego Monkey Kid, etc because they are able to tackle to deeper and more depressing topics without being triggering to their audience.

[@abirivera4606]

I hate that when people say "adult show" somehow it mostly involves sex, r-word, full nudes, chaos and bloodsh**t and some sort of weird politics no one understands but people pretend they do. Like, bro, there are topics that are not related to those I just mentioned and could not be portrayed that explicitely on teen drama because a teen wouldn't understand the issues yet. But no, the writers go by "haha boobs, haha blood, haha sexual assault" because that is for adults 😎 "I'm so clever and original✨️"

[@iburito3]

Thank you for saying everything I could express! I have zero tolerance for media that uses grape as a plot device. I thinks it’s unnecessary and it taints my view of the given show or movie. It also drives me crazy the lack of trigger warnings we see for such content. Sometimes the warning will say “s*xual content” and that simply doesn’t NOT convey SA will be present.

[@_sarah.honey-]

I just watched Rivals on Hulu/disney. They had rape and abuse, it worked with a narrative but I was tired of seeing the women in the show disrespected. It all worked narratively, but it rubbed me the wrong way

[@paulacameron5920]

agreed, I felt Cameron's situation where her whole employment arrangement depended on being her boss's mistress on demand wasn't really explored in terms of how unfair and abusive this was and how she felt she had to accept this to succeed as a black woman in her industry during the 1980's... It was sort of framed as 'she sleeps with who she needs to to get ahead' Also Rupert's 'redemption' arc - bleugh!

[@foreversurfergirl]

THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!!! I have been waiting for someone to take on this topic for so long!!! I have been sa'd and i literally have to skip so many scenes and pass on so many books/shows i cannot stand it!!!

[@CommanderLexaa]

I actually realized I have PTSD because of the rape scenes in 13 reasons why, I thought I was fine, like... the continuous sexual assault i had been going through hadnt affect me, im strong, and then the scenes came up and I was so affected by it and by the suicide scene...but it was to ''BRING AWARENESS'' for sure....

[@Robloxian2106]

“Game of thrones is just Harry Potter with rape” - PrettyMuchIt

[@kjohnston167]

Thanks for making this video, and sharing what happened to you, I'm sorry you had to go through that. I could relate to what you were talking about someone with complex PTSD. I am just over eleven years of recovery from it, but what happened to me will never be forgotten, the wounds just become more dulled over time. I was hospitalised, put on heavy sleeping meds, became agoraphobic and could barely go outside for almost a year. I began to work before I was recovered and regularly went in on one hour of sleep, leading me to get multiple health issues. All of this is complex, messy, and definitely not sexy, and doesn't sound like too much fun, and not something writers would want to sensationalise for TV, and that's part of the problem. SA is never sexy, but somehow, creepy male writers want to make it so. As soon as I heard of GOT had tons of rape scenes, I refused to watch it, even though I loved fantasy. If you want to see the most accurate and devastating portrayal of PTSD from a real victim and incredible writer I have ever seen, I would watch "I May Destroy You" by Michaela Coel. But major trigger warning: do not watch unless you are in a good place and suggest having a person nearby if watching for support after. This did re-trigger me in some ways, but I had some kind of catharsis by watching it. Michaela Coel should have received many more awards for that work, but it was probably too real for people to stomach at the time.

[@Mariathinking]

I hated that they did this to my favourite character in Downtown Abbey and then made the plot all about her husband. This is a comfy show about up stairs down stairs classism, silly relationship drama, and drinking tea - why did they greenlight such a plot?! Remembering it is making mad lol.

[@l.n.3372]

I watched Downton Abbey much later than most people but I 100% agree. That storyline was awful! It felt like the classic "women gets assaulted so her male lover can have a storyline instead"

[@donnietello]

from one survivor to another, THANK YOU FOR MAKING THIS!!! i also want to add that it’s JUST as concerning in asian media when it comes to BL as it’s WAY TOO normalized and for anime. japan specifically also has a LOT of old disturbing movies that includes such themes like this (and a genre of it called pinkeu eiga) and there’s a literal superhero called “🍇 man”. VERY VERY disturbing.

[@weebyumieyu452]

One show that i think did a really good job with the topic of SA was season 3 of Broadchurch. It was handled very delicately and it felt like a very realistic depiction of that type of situation. It deals with the aftermath of SA, the process of investigating from a police perspective as well as how it effects those within the small town as they attempt to find the characters attacker. It was a hard watch and very emotional but I felt it was one of the best and realistic depictions of the aftermath of SA.

[@nessie4215]

That’s how I feel about Outlander. I tried to watch it and had to stop which is a shame because I love the premise.

[@catscradle9331]

Same. It’s like the writers went, let’s make things equal by having the bad guy brutally r*pe the male protagonist as well as the female protagonist, and, heck, why not a little boy too (who has no issues or ptsd as an adult). When they had the second generation’s drama revolve around r*pe as well, I cut my losses. It’s gross and it’s lazy writing.

[@AmbyJeans]

@@catscradle9331it came from the book, so Diana Gabaldon would be to blame 😬

[@AmbyJeans]

That scene was so hard to watch. And it’s far from the only r*p* scene in the show. I love the show, but there’s way too much SA

[@jenniferrussellstudio]

It's frustrating because there were a huge group of women science fiction and fantasy writers all throughout the 1970s and 1980s who worked REALLY hard to get fiction that was not racist or misogynist out into the public. And then what does HBO do... They do the Game of Thrones. Set us back by DECADES!