Surviving The Shiny Happy People Cult (Part 1) - IBLP Beginnings | Friends With Davey

"Shiny Happy People" is the #1 documentary on Prime Video, taking an in-depth look at the dark history of one of the most mysterious cults in America--and it just so happens that Davey Jackson grew up in this cult!
Davey discusses what life like in the IBLP cult with other former members, and explain how thousands of people were robbed by it's charismatic leader, Bill Gothard.
Listen to Davey Jackson and Producer Josh, livestreaming with a new friend every Wednesday at 8:00PM CST.
Podcast audio available on Spotify, iTunes, and all streaming platforms.

[@stillmagic714]

Oh man, I grew up IBLP-adjacent. Actually the fact that IBLP people existed made us think that we were totally liberal and "not a cult." Meanwhile, they're saying stuff to us like "you shouldn't date because if you kiss someone and then end up not marrying them, you've committed adultery because you kissed someone else's husband." Vomit. I loved the documentary but boy howdy did I need to talk to my therapist about it.

[@daveyjaxx]

First of all the “boy howdy” is sending me 😂 but also the courtship stuff was basically just arranged marriage for fundamental christians disguised as God’s plan for biblical dating.

[@stillmagic714]

@@daveyjaxx it's so true, my dad used to "joke" about it, that I didn't have to find someone because he already had someone picked out. Turns out he kinda did but I went rogue and started dating a...*gasp* Lutheran! I'm such a rebel.

[@biancacox8630]

@@stillmagic714 …I’m looked down upon because I now attend a Methodist church😂…I try to exemplify in my life it’s not about denominations …those were never created by Jesus but by man…it’s the personal relationship with God and trying to do God’s best with the best intentions…so many people can’t get over the guilt and shame they feel they have done …I tell them ask forgiveness once and once only and move on God cares more about if your neighbor has enough food to eat than He does you asking for forgiveness 50 million times! Guilt does not come from God after forgiveness has been granted …geez forgive yourself and move on…❤

[@lizhoward9754]

“IBLP-adjacent”….LOL!!!🤣🤣

[@celestelawler587]

​@@biancacox8630 I just don't get this hang up with God. Don't you & others know how to live without everything being about God?

[@MouthyMiriam]

I am a 50 yr old and I was in the early version of the IBLP in 1974 called the Word of God Community. I was beaten half to death by my parents trying to break my indomitable will…. It didn’t work but the training from that still impacts me. This doc was so freaking triggering…. Especially corporal punishment. The worst part was you stop crying and I will stop beating you…. Doesn’t really work…

[@daveyjaxx]

Omg I’m so sorry. Fortunately I had predominantly happy home life aside from some extremely strict rules. But I know that wasn’t the experience for a lot of people and it’s truly heartbreaking.

[@celestelawler587]

​@@daveyjaxx Were you in the IBLP cult?

[@MouthyMiriam]

@@celestelawler587 the 1970's iteration yes... The Pearls stole their book from that era... The strong willed child... Advocating corporal punishment on 2 year olds... Oh yes .. lovely childhood (not)

[@celestelawler587]

@@MouthyMiriam My question was to daveviaxx. I saw your initial comment where you were quite clear that you have been involved in the cult. I presume by default due to your parents being members. But thanks for responding & providing that additional information about the Pearls.

[@MyMerryMessyGermanLife]

So horrible, I’m so sorry that was your experience. Such child abuse! I’ll stop beating you once you stop crying - such a nightmare. 😵‍💫

[@hagelslag9312]

A lot had to be cut especially due to legal reasons and because Amazon limited their time. So their prime focus was to get the point across. I'm so glad people are sharing their story to add to what they had to leave out.

[@daveyjaxx]

I’m hoping they do a follow up that’s focused more on the cult itself which is what we’re trying to do in this series.

[@hagelslag9312]

@@daveyjaxx In a Q&A in the Fundiesnark subreddit they mentioned to ask Amazon for a follow up to hopefully convince them on it. They said there's plenty of content for a second series! So if they could, they would!

[@reinasherman8009]

Yeah from what I hear, I love fundie Fridays, they have enough footage to easily do more.

[@mikescrazycomedy7362]

What are the current Iblp members trying to keep quiet about and did they lose their tax free extemts status

[@NewWorldDAO]

Since when is patting someone’s thumb while you’re kneeling and praying for them sexual assault? This is what these ladies are, accusing Bill Gothard of doing.

[@nathanieldabney225]

Bro not only was I involved, I was in alert. Worst year of my life. My family eventually left. I have stories that would bring you to tears again.

[@daveyjaxx]

Dude I’m so sorry. People that still try to defend these programs absolutely blow me away. Glad you made it! 🙏🏻❤️

[@kristiw.1823]

I finally had the courage to come watch these episodes you've done. Wasn't familiar with your KZbin channel, but the algorithms kept recommending you. So glad it did! I was part of the generation whose parents got sucked into Basic Youth Conflicts, so it drove me a bit nuts that the documentary doesn't fully explain that Gothard was helping parents destroy their kids, all the way back in the 70's. This was the perfect program for two narcissists who brought kids into this world when they hadn't really wanted them, but desperately needed us all to behave perfectly, so we didn't sully their ministry aspirations. The only way to explain my upbringing to outsiders is to say I was raised in a tiny, one-family cult. It has taken me until my 50's to finally get therapy for it, and I'm so grateful for this documentary, because it is giving therapists (mine included) a way to understand programming that most of us have a hard time finding actual language to describe. The most heartbreaking thing, to me, is to realize that the scandal from '79-80 could have ended his program entirely, if someone had gotten law enforcement involved back then. The second most heartbreaking is that a lack of TLC putting the Duggars on display for the world might have allowed this fundamentalism to stay in a quiet corner somewhere.

[@daveyjaxx]

Thank you so much for sharing your experience and for the support 🙏🏻❤️ we’re trying to make this series more about the ideologies that exploited families and ruined lives as opposed to the abuse and trauma.

[@kristiw.1823]

@@daveyjaxx Sorry if my comment took things in the wrong direction!

[@crissagram]

After growing up in IBLP and doing the whole "training center" thing I am so glad that Gothards bullshit is fully coming to light. That teaching ate so much of my childhood and early adulthood, and it still has such a disturbing amount of reach and after-effects in the US.

[@daveyjaxx]

IBLP is still out there hosting seminars and programs from their headquarters in Big Sandy, TX and that’s why all this information is so important to share. People are going to continue to fall for their BS but maybe we can help a few people recognize the manipulation and exploitation before it’s too late 🙏🏻❤️

[@tinyordinarydays]

Thank you for this. I think you guys did an excellent job. I was Gothard's secretary (the one from New Zealand) and part of the lawsuit. I really enjoyed listening to this and hearing about your experiences and you made me laugh more than once.

[@MyMerryMessyGermanLife]

Wow you were Gothard’s secretary?! I can only imagine the stories you can tell.

[@daveyjaxx]

Thank you so much 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻 Would love to connect with you and hear more about your experience

[@destaniehugs67]

Wow so city officials gave a big ass hotel to IBLP in Flint, yet allowed citizens to still be without Clean water? Sad all round. This runs deep

[@shortybarnesyanik]

I was at the Flint Training Center for a time.

[@tals8224]

Thank you so much for sharing your stories. For years I never knew how to describe how I grew up.. the long skirts, the homeschooling, obeying parents well into your 20s or until youre married (and even then you still have to obey them and listen to their feedback!). I remember getting facebook, and at 22 my mom demanded my fb password and would keep tabs on me. As a child i was taught that education did not matter. To this day I am still trying to catch up and upgrade myself :(

[@daveyjaxx]

Thank you and I’m so happy you made it through. It’s a process learning how to operate in the “real world” but I promise it’s worth it! 🙏🏻❤️

[@celestelawler587]

Yeah. They don't want you to be educated because then they might not be able to control you. And they certainly don't want you to be smarter than they are or discover the truth. It's like the Wizard of Oz. The Great Oz. The man behind the curtain. Is a fraud.

[@ChristyeLynn]

The first two episodes, I cried because it was so relatable. Then, I was like this wasn’t normal? Like Blanket Training isn’t something most people do? I remember seeing the wisdom booklets everywhere. The way my brother was treated v how I was treated and the way it was okay for him to hit us because that’s what boys do and what brothers do. Mom breaking wooden spoons on me and making me pay for them after an attitude adjustment because I questioned her or disagreed with her.

[@craftykittydesigns]

Same experience here. I can totally relate. (((Hugs)))

[@merricat3025]

Thats awful.

[@lindseybrindel5497]

Great Podcast! I was a Student Conference Coordinator for UT the summer of 2000 and worked as a resident assistant for campus housing. I remember the ATI conference very well. One funny story: the dorm I worked was directly across the court from the student housing dorm for summer school. I’ll never forget the look on the ATI families faces when they heard “Highway to Hell” by AC/DC blasting from a kid’s window. I thought it was strange that they group would want to hold a conference at a secular university! *Gasp! Educated women WEARING SHORTS AND SUNDRESSES!?! It was an interesting experience. I so badly wanted to tell the young ladies as they walked through our lobby to run and free yourself! There is opportunities for you beyond being a breeding mare for your husband!

[@daveyjaxx]

Lol that’s great. We were taught that any rock music had the ability to summon demons 😂 I think I vaguely remember protesters at the Knoxville conference I went to with my family but I can’t specifically remember why they were there. My most vivid memory was one of the speakers collapsed and died on stage which was obviously terrifying to witness but also a really strange omen.

[@butterbeanqueen8148]

Jim Holt and his wife were together when the documentary was filmed. It was filmed approximately two years ago. The restraining order was a recent development.

[@daveyjaxx]

Yes your exactly right. We’re getting into that more in episode 3

[@mienafriggstad3360]

Yes SHP was filmed before Jim Holt's restraining order BUT it was still being edited after. Katie Joy from Without a Chrystal Ball; who refused to be in SHP after learning that Jim Holt would be involved; let producers know about the restraining order and asked for a disclaimer to be added to the credits; but producers didn't take her advice.

[@atha9056]

Interesting to listen to you guys breakdown my teens and early adult life. It's been a weird week with the documentary coming our. So validating and now when I mention i grew up in a cult. I can mention IBLP and people will get the gest of what I'm talking about.

[@daveyjaxx]

It feels really validating doesn’t it?

[@coco-pouf]

Gothard’s use of language fascinates me. Dude crafted a whole realm of jargon.

[@daveyjaxx]

He just bastardized a bunch of biblical/religious terms to fit his narrative. And dude absolutely LOVED acronyms 😂😂

[@calebmcintosh1991]

Cults do this to isolate members - in-group vs out-group language basically limits communication with people outside the cult because words mean entirely different things.

[@The3Storms]

@@daveyjaxx I find the same is true of Mormons and Scientologists, y’all have as many acronyms as the military.

[@mcsmaria28]

It really gives me 1984 vibes… with Christians…😳

[@MutterallerDrachen2087]

Most cult leaders redefine and adjust language to insulate the members against the “others”, whether that’s the world, the “enemies” (hi L Ron Hubbard), the gentiles (hi Joseph Smith), etc etc. I can’t remember what Children of God called them. It’s real interesting in these high demand groups

[@5p674]

I can't imagine how you guys got so funny being raised in the seriousness of a cult. Fascinating video. Thank you.

[@daveyjaxx]

Trauma makes us funny 😂🙏🏻❤️

[@SweetiePieTweety]

All comedians were abused it’s a coping mechanism no doubt

[@meemurthelemur4811]

​@@daveyjaxxtruth!

[@MutterallerDrachen2087]

Unfortunately humor, especially dark humor, is a way to cope in traumatic situations. Not everyone will get it but it’s common

[@shawngalloway8940]

I am 50 years old and was in IBLP/ATIA I spent time at Northwoods, was even working at the seminars all over. Could not get away fast enough.

[@rochelle2000]

In Moscow in the very early days, the group stayed in a hotel. I heard about safety issues and strangers going into people's rooms. From about 92 to 94, we lived in ships docked on the Moscow River. I loved those, they were German built, fully staffed, and very efficient. In late 94, renovation began on the orphanage compound (3 buildings) and from then on we lived there. Some of us fell in love with the Russian people, culture, & language, & continued in that afterwards.

[@daveyjaxx]

There’s another guy that I’ve talked to that had a very similar experience working my for the IBLP in Taiwan! Fell in love the culture and he’s been there ever since

[@Jaebee2626]

So many cults!!! Thanks for covering this topic. Right now Scientology rocked my world. I just went to a dentist in FL and ended up in Clearwater in hands of doctor of Scientology. So scary! Justice for Lisa McPherson and Whitney Mills ❤ Trying to figure this out!

[@daveyjaxx]

Wow that’s terrifying 😳

[@asdlkfjlkdjalskjfsldskljdf2593]

Yo! IBLP cult represent! I'm nervous to watch it.. Every time I'm reminded of that part of my childhood it makes me angry.

[@daveyjaxx]

The documentary is pretty intense tbh. It brought back a lot of memories I had mostly blocked out-but we’re trying to keep the podcast series more about the actual cult and less about the trauma. Dropping a new episode every Wednesday and the next one was pretty tough to record.

[@silviareed5206]

I grew up in a cult and was homeschooled as well. Then was sent to a school for my highschool where I was abused by my Bible teacher. This is doc coming out is so triggering and I appreciated your vlog and your shared experiences

[@daveyjaxx]

I’m so sorry but thank you for speaking out and supporting 🙏🏻❤️

[@delilahhart4398]

I worked at a health food store in Little Rock during the 2000s, and the Duggars occasionally shopped there. I remember being impressed by how polite and well-mannered the kids were and complimenting Jim Bob and Michelle on their kids' behavior. Little did I know that the kids were being abused! 🙁

[@daveyjaxx]

Usually if something looks that shiny and pretty and perfect on the outside, there’s something wrong on the inside.

[@kate4biglittlevoices]

Billions watched on tv and internet and never knew - don’t beat yourself up about it

[@WhiteRabbit89]

​@@daveyjaxxTHIS!!! 🥺

[@veritaslux644]

This video is not true! The Duggars were, and are, absolutely wonderful loving Christlike parents (and friends, and Church members). The Duggars, did the best job in raising their children to love and follow the Lord, better then any parent or couple that we know! And we know hundreds through being a member of several homeschool groups. The Duggars are being slandered and persecuted because they were following the Lord! The only two big mistakes the Duggar parents made and admitted to, and corrected/resolved appropriately (mistakes most all parents are making now), was in not realizing (until Josh was ~14 and he briefly touched his younger sisters over the clothes), was that they needed to become much more biblically stricter! This is where they “tightened ship” (ex: wouldn’t let any boys hang out in girls room or play games that could lead to boys taking advantage of any girls) and other restrictions. When media saw that the Duggars has an amazingly well organized loving family, and that this is so strange to see in this day (even when family has only 1-2 children), they invited Duggars on TV. Also the Duggars had realized they needed to put an end to all children having unmonitored access to tv/internet/cell and eliminate shows that can lead to wrong thoughts. But this is more difficult to do as they get older, especially after 18 in our liberal American culture. And the parents second huge mistake was in allowing Derek and Jeremy to marry their daughters! These two arent truly Christian , they are wolves in sheep’s clothing and deceived many! They are in cults (Ex:John MacArthur cult and Bar association cult), and have indoctrinated the young women, Jinger and Jill, to dishonor their own loving Christlike parent!! Praying that all slanderous evildoers repent before it is too late🥺🙏!

[@delilahhart4398]

@@veritaslux644 Okay, so when Josh was caught abusing his sisters, why didn't they get him help from a real professional? Also, why didn't they get professional help for his sisters, so they could better cope with the trauma? Why do Jim Bob and Michelle do "blanket training" and take advice from people like Michael and Debi Pearl, who teach their followers to beat their kids? Why were Jim Bob and Michelle so quick to shun Jill, yet were so quick to defend her molester and keep him in the family fold, even after he was caught looking at sexual images of children online? Why do Jim Bob and Michelle have to use notes to keep track of their kids' birthdays and likes and dislikes? Wouldn't a truly loving parent know their kids inside and out? And why do Jim Bob and Michelle have their older daughters raising their younger siblings? They're depriving their children of a normal childhood by making them do their job for them.

[@MyMerryMessyGermanLife]

Yes the Jim Holt stuff is very bad! He was paid off for years by Jim Bob to keep his mouth shut about Josh. The entire time he’s been married he’s been severely beating his wife and kids. Like we are talking regular hospital visits where friends would notice that another kid “had a fall” and would go missing for a few weeks. He was apparently extremely violent - body slamming, so many bearings, throwing them up against walls. The worst kind. Many of the survivors who spoke out in the documentary are so upset that they painted Jim Holt in a good light when he’s even worse than Jim Bob. His son issued a restraining order against Jim Holt after a horrific beating and apparently, the only way to keep other kids in the house safe was for the wife to also issue a restraining order against him. Their home life was a living hell, then gets on TV acting like the good guy when he’s the devil himself. 😵 Men like him thrive in these kinds of cults.

[@daveyjaxx]

This is exactly the problem with this cult…shiny happy exteriors but absolute hell behind the facade. And it’s all enabled by Gothard’s teachings. Absolutely sickening.

[@MyMerryMessyGermanLife]

@@daveyjaxx good for you for making this series to bring more exposure to their darkness. Every survivor’s story chips away at the pain and the power!

[@colette6984]

I just watched the documentary, and I can't believe it's worse than shown. I'm glad I watched your podcast before watching the doc. It's so heartbreaking and tragic! I hate when Scripture is twisted and used as a weapon for control and abuse! I'm glad this doc is blowing the lid off this cult because people can be naive and not understand that this teaching creates destruction.

[@daveyjaxx]

It’s unbelievably sad and simultaneously infuriating 😤

[@colette6984]

@@daveyjaxx yes! That's exactly it..

[@tanyasutton5044]

Was there any consequences or shunning from your family after enlightening the public via this video? I married into a cult family who is currently under investigation. We have chosen to stand with victims of this cult.The family has rallied around the Cult leader and now treats us as if we are some type of guilty party in order to protect the family name/reputation and sweep the abuse under a rug. What has been the hardest consequence of speaking the truth ?

[@clairefisher3132]

I remember the pooka shell necklace era. Late 90s-early 2000’s. I definitely had one myself!

[@daveyjaxx]

Someone gets it 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

[@colette6984]

It's so important for people to know what scripture says so that they don't get swept up in these waves of false teaching! Correct interpretation: Hermeneutics. So so important.

[@daveyjaxx]

Agreed 🙏🏻

[@mienafriggstad3360]

👏🙏

[@stacywilliams1624]

I'm enjoying listening to you guys talk about your IBLP experience, so relatable! So grateful for the documentary coming out, I think it'll help people see where we're coming from. Still recovering from this upbringing and watching the doc brought up emotions I didn't expect.

[@daveyjaxx]

It’s such a validating experience watching the documentary and then talking about it with fellow survivors. I’m not a guy that cries at all but I definitely broke down the first time I watched the documentary.

[@candace9243]

Found you through Cults to Consciousness. LOVE LOVE LOVE this podcast! More informative about the organization and FAR more entertaining than the documentary. ♡♡♡

[@alkittie8]

I am fascinated by the IBLP, and I'm so sorry y'all had these experiences. I'm a traditional Catholic, homeschooling mom of four, and sometimes I feel like I'm very conservative, but last night my husband and I had gin martinis and this afternoon my kids watched Paw Patrol for like 3 hours. And none of this is sinful. I have a great relationship with the Lord, and it really confuses me how those in the IBLP believe that God wants them to behave in such stringent and abusive practices.

[@daveyjaxx]

Listen if you’re kids are allowed to watch “secular” tv you’re not cult level conservative 😂😂

[@celestelawler587]

I'm fascinated by people who claim to "have a great relationship with the Lord." 🙄 WTH kind of nonsense is that?

[@maillemacanaugh1841]

Fellow catholic here, conservative but raised in a secular urban environment. Reading through the comment section like I’m visiting a foreign country. This is totally foreign to my life experience, it’s fascinating and heartbreaking.

[@SolaGratia.]

I was in it, too. I worked in Indy and HQ, circa 1995-1998. I was one of Bill's collection of underage girls until I started telling people what was happening and someone confronted him. He called me with her on speaker phone and denied everything, then sent me home in disgrace, forbidding the staff to contact me and intercepting my letters to my old house mates, lest I should tell on him and be believed. For the most part, no one but the one person who'd confronted Bill on my behalf seemed to believe me at all, although I now know there other girls being molested at the same time who would have believed me. The rest just blew me off or accused me of lying to hurt a godly man.. and eventually I moved on with life until some 20 years later when I began receiving Facebook messages from people apologizing to me for not believing and supporting me through all of that when I'd attempted to tell them. They had heard the news of the lawsuit against Bill for SA with more women than I ever expected, and now that this documentary is out, I have to see his disgusting face every time I open KZbin. But at least it seems like people are finally ready to listen.

[@daveyjaxx]

Thank you so much for speaking out 🙏🏻❤️ would love to talk to you more about your experience so please feel free to DM me.

[@delilahhart4398]

I don't understand why anyone would take advice from Bill Gothard on marriage or parenting, since he's never married or had children. He doesn't even have a background in psychology or mental health!

[@daveyjaxx]

This is one of the things that ALWAYS confused me. Like what authority or expertise does he have as someone who hasn’t experienced ANY of the stuff he’s talking about 😂😂

[@GaderineInsomniac]

@Delilah Hart....because A) he used a hypnotic speaking style B) He offered black and white answers to the chaos of the 60s/70s C) He tied every principle to God. D) adults indoctrinated in fundamentalism were primed to swallow his claims. E) He promised health/wealth for meditating on the Bible F) he appealed to audiences more inclined to learn from lectures with charts than highly emotional meetings (concerts, pentecostal services, faith healings, etc). G) He cherry=picked stories to shape the narrative (Confirmation bias) H) young adults (like me) who started attending seminars in 1973 were addled by drugs and lacked critical thinking skills. --Ex-Xn, Ex-ATI Dad

[@ninaschultz6922]

​@@GaderineInsomniac exactly right, good predators offer what their victims crave, they lure them in and bind them in place. It's easy to believe in lies and hypocracy if someone gets told exactly what they need to hear. A predator/snake oil's salesman will sell to those who want to buy, sadly it can be a very easy game to get fooled.

[@beckysmith6375]

The point you may have missed is that the Bible has answers to life's problems. All teachings are tied to the Bible passages. Bible teachers and ministers have always given advice from the Bible.

[@delilahhart4398]

@@beckysmith6375 Anyone who follows the IBLP is just following Bill Gothard's interpretation of the scriptures. People need to learn to think for themselves and not expect others to do their thinking for them.

[@brynbailey7132]

I went to a church for years that was IBLP-adjacent and had friends in the group itself. I have spent time in the ATI center in Indianapolis. It definitely didn't "feel right" there. Something wasn't right. I didn't find out until years later what truly went on....the documentary got it spot on.

[@daveyjaxx]

Indianapolis is where I went for their “rehab” program 😂😂 but yeah it definitely has bad vibes

[@brynbailey7132]

@@daveyjaxx I bet we knew some of the same people....glad you got out. And that the almighty algorithm helped me find this podcast! 😄

[@biancacox8630]

@@daveyjaxx Rehab for what?? Were kids sent there who questioned authority??

[@SwedeProof]

Your podcast just popped up and I'm a new subscriber. You have one of the coolest voices ever to grace a podcast, and you cover this disturbing topic with raw, gritty truth, grace, and dignity. Each story is gut-wrenching and deeply disturbing, but you're all so brave. Thank you for sharing your experiences.

[@cruzianfibergeek]

I watched a lot of the episodes of 19 kids and counting. I admired the family. Learning now what was going on when the cameras were not looking is quite surprising. I have to wonder what the production crew saw that didn't air on TV.

[@frankiesayspanic]

thank you for sharing your experiences, i look forward to hearing more. i didn’t grow up in iblp but very adjacent to it, as in being homeschooled and following a lot of the same rules about media and purity culture and such so i have a LOOOT of similar religious trauma. take care of yourselves while you’re peeling back open these wounds ♡

[@daveyjaxx]

Thank you so much 🙏🏻❤️

[@theyrblu]

Seriously just learned that IBLP is a cult. I had to go to the IBLC in 84 when I was 14 to be able to “date” among a bunch of other rules. Thanks for the frank talk and looking forward to part 2.

[@andrewc.2952]

Man oh man, you guys are fantastic. You are my people. My parents sucked us kids into homeschooling, we had Abecca stuff. Fortunately my younger siblings didn't have it as bad as me, my sister, and my cousins. Man it was such a farce. I remember my dad signing the papers for the county to "evaluate" us and confirm that we were being "educated". I wound up being primarily self taught and read libraries worth of books throughout that time.

[@emilyjensenius4289]

I found my old homeschool Abeka "biology" book awhile back when visiting my childhood home. It was appallingly bad, especially the section that discusses evolution. Like not just false or misleading info but amateurishly written.

[@grammichal6759]

The reading part is excellent actually. Don’t sell yourself short in spite of it all. ❤

[@kathrynmarie412]

SUCH amazing insight!!! Thank you so much for sharing these memories!

[@daveyjaxx]

🙏🏻❤️

[@carolpray9816]

I am so glad that I found your channel. I had no idea that the Duggars were part of a cult. I thought they were a bit strange, but hey, I grew up in the Catholic Church we have our own issues. I didn't know the extent of the abuse that all of you suffered. I am shocked but not surprised.

[@daveyjaxx]

🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

[@lizhoward9754]

Congratulations on getting out of this cult. That is very, very impressive. Does IBLP do anything other than home school, write “wisdom books”, pop out babies right and left, etc? I have often wondered what these mission trips were. Did they just go overseas to put up IBLP buildings and recruit people and tell people how sinful they were? Did they do ANYTHING to make the world a better place or help people with no strings attached?

[@daveyjaxx]

I think there was actually a lot of good done by some of the people in IBLP who genuinely wanted to help others. But overall the net effect was negative in my opinion.

[@Mushroompanda648]

It is so refreshing to hear stories from Men who were in a Fundamentalist Christian Cult. We rarely hear from Men because the Cult gives "Godly" power to Men. Usually we hear from Women because of the abusive nature of the cult. So thank you both for your stories and I'm here for the next! 😁

[@daveyjaxx]

Thank you so much! Episode 3 we’ll actually have a female ex-cult member to compare her experience as well 🙏🏻🙏🏻

[@Mushroompanda648]

@daveyjaxx I'm looking forward to it. 🙂

[@health_is_wealth333]

This was very interesting, sad, and healing all at the same time. Thank you for sharing fellas! ❤

[@daveyjaxx]

🙏🏻🙏🏻❤️

[@mavibarrena3751]

I love how they said the wisdom booklets would give you equivalent of a college degree 😂

[@daveyjaxx]

Ikr 😂 absolute joke!

[@eejacks6594]

yeah same..and then they started VERITY "College" to rake in more $$ using child labor to run the departments.. good times.

[@nikkio.9990]

Cannot wait for part 2. this is so interesting, thank you for discussing this.

[@daveyjaxx]

🙏🏻❤️ thank you so much! The next couple episodes are going to be pretty intense and we’re have a woman that’s also an ex-member as a guest for episode 3 so it’s gonna get weird 😂

[@nikkio.9990]

I'm a former evangelical (not fundamentalist but conservative enough for time) I slowly realized any parenting ideas that came from a place of need for control or viewing children as inherently wicked was a great formula for- how to end up alone in the nursing home, so I never really got on board with any of it. I'm so sad the damage can never really be reversed for fundamentalist kids, but grateful for the platforms we have today to give so many a voice. Oh and I'm ready for the weird.

[@merricat3025]

​@Nikki O. I really don't get the difference between Evangelical and Fundamentalist. The Evangelicals i have met take the Bible literally...or maybe they are fundamentalist that share their beliefs

[@nikkio.9990]

@@merricat3025 kzbin.info/www/bejne/hJrMg6GFbLqHis0 I agree. The line between fundamentalist and evangelical was blurred awhile ago.and there isnt much difference anymore. I highly recommend the video I linked above. It's a to the point professional video essay on the history of the difference between fundy, evangelical and Mainline in America and how it got mixed up. This is stuff I wish I understood a long time ago.

[@merricat3025]

@@nikkio.9990 ty I will watch it

[@debrastrayer8600]

Congratulations to both of you for your recovery! Thank you for posting. You are how to bring this abuse to light.

[@daveyjaxx]

🥹🙏🏻❤️

[@gracefelty5361]

thank you both for sharing your stories!

[@daveyjaxx]

🙏🏻❤️

[@hannahdudzinski4396]

This should have more views! Great discussion!

[@daveyjaxx]

🙏🏻❤️

[@jorazz16]

Great discussion. The Shiny Happy people doc was great, but it did leave me wanting to know more.This discussion is fulfilling that. 4 more episodes they should do.;)

[@daveyjaxx]

Thank you so much 🙏🏻❤️ We’re going to get into detail on the training centers (compounds) next episode and then get a woman’s perspective on being in the cult in episode 3 🔥

[@merricat3025]

Agree

[@PrudenceBudgets]

Great content. I love to hear everyone’s perspective

[@serenaburden1606]

Love the content! Thanks for sharing.

[@daveyjaxx]

🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

[@RonKelmell]

Even my faltering efforts to align with Biblical principle of living have protected me from many a heart ache. I can thank IBYC/IBLP seminars for the affirmation of Scripture and guidance toward Biblical relationships and lifestyle. Our adult children are productive, positive citizens. But then from the beginning, I knew Christ in me was my salvation and not any single teacher or denominational club.

[@beckysmith6375]

Ron, I agree with you. We were Christians before being in IBLP, and we found IBLP to be very helpful in numerous ways. The first seminar really turned me away from an unhealthy rebellious path I was on. Some parts we didn't jive with we just ignored. It's possible to take the helpful and leave the rest. I'm very thankful for IBLP and Bill Gothard. It

[@HarvardChickie]

Wow dude I’m sorry for both of you but you guys did some massive work and growth. Bravo!

[@daveyjaxx]

🥹🙏🏻🙏🏻

[@BigWahly23]

Dude, congrats on your recent success! There’s nothing I love as much as comedy then Cult related content. I did not grow up religious or in a cult which is probably why I find it so fascinating. Between learning about IBLP & Scientology recently I can’t get enough! Also, I think your standup is great! Found you on KT. Keep it up man! As Tony would say, “I fuckin love it”.

[@danielleolson2521]

DC Talk and Jars of Clay were my jam :D. thank you for this looking forward to the other episodes. I did not grow up in a cult but this is fasinating to learn about. I do have to say all the homeschool talk makes me sad. I am a homeschool mom and hate having to defend that “No we are not weird sheltered christians. My kids are ‘socialized’ with all types of people and religions. we participate in state testing and are doing great don't worry” haha anyway looking forward to the other episodes thank!

[@daveyjaxx]

You’re a real one 🙏🏻 homeschooling definitely isn’t the problem at all! It’s the motivation behind the homeschooling. And I almost forgot about Jars Of Clay 😂 I wasn’t allowed to listen to them either.

[@jjgems5909]

Agree. I felt like they painted homeschooling as a whole in a bad light. And sadly for some really evil people homeschooling can be a means to abuse and control their children. But I know kids who were abused and controlled, and had drug addict parents who attended my public schools. My mother was heavily abused as a child, in talking black eye in her first grade picture that her mom gave her and dog feces smeared on her face. Abusers will always find a way to abuse. That’s the conclusion I’ve come to.

[@meemurthelemur4811]

I met Jars of Clay when they were just starting out. It was nice to see that they were all really nice, even as they grew in fame and popularity.

[@theoblongbox4909]

Also, I want to say, it's so interesting to see how this has all turned out because I remember very well watching that original Duggar special when it first came out on Discovery Health when I was like 11 or 12. I used to love watching any special that had to do with multiples being born or big families and so I found their family with 14 kids very interesting. And then I also remember watching a couple of their specials and then I remember when they got the regular show. I stopped watching after a while because I got bored and then years later I heard about all of the drama going on. Crazy. Never really expected that.

[@ChristyeLynn]

I think the hardest part and when you miss pop culture references because you’ve never seen Ghost Busters or Fresh Prince or listened to Britney Spears… In a way, it’s like I grew up in another country.

[@johnnybates7580]

Thanks for sharing your experience.

[@Turddles44]

Came here from rumble, rotc. Loved ya on ya first n second visit man, you kick ass ☻️

[@amandahendrix8533]

Bryce is so funny I wish he had a podcast!

[@daveyjaxx]

He’s the best!!

[@ChristyeLynn]

There should be a documentary for Dr. James Dobson and Focus On The Family.

[@sewingintrifocals-alisonde7778]

I second that. Used to listen to him in my car.

[@MutterallerDrachen2087]

Trauma is not a competition. One thing my therapist is always telling me is that diminishing your trauma because “it wasn’t that bad” is often a sign of more severe trauma. All of it ain’t ok. There maybe different long term effects and therapy needed but it’s not a competition. Healing hugs.

[@caseyhendrix6980]

Did not realize IBLP headquarters are in Big Sandy Texas. Right down the road from me. Yikes

[@daveyjaxx]

Yepppp they’re still hanging out!

[@TexasNative70]

Please go into how you and your family got out of this mess. Also...how the hell is Jim Bob Duggard not in jail due to covering up abuse? This was a great episode...now suscriber.

[@daveyjaxx]

Oh we’re definitely going to get into that and thank you 🙏🏻🙏🏻

[@huntersabol8472]

Loved listening to you'lls perceptive. I'm glad you pointed out the difference between being a male vs female in this group. I think Jim holt was left in the docuseries since they had already completed production and release date was set. I would hope they could do a follow up to address this as well

[@daveyjaxx]

Brice has a ton of insider detail on Jim Holt that we’ll be addressing in episode 3

[@brendaechols5929]

" Beautiful bearded daughter." 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@daveyjaxx]

Gotta love courtship 😂😂

[@ninaschultz6922]

Davey & Josh, just found you and liked & subscribed 😊 Great conversation and insights into IBLP scriptures, thank you for sharing. It is a huge field of work by Gothard, that has not been covered sufficiently imo, it seems as if his work has relatively strong influence in US Christian homeschooling circles. To me, it is important to understand, what common sense is up against. I've been getting into Gothard's appaling teachings around children's education and patriarchical family structures a while ago. I am pleased to hear more from males leaving the system - after listening to female witnesses to awful, trauma-inducing upbringings in IBLP 😮 Looking forward a lot to more content on this topic 🎉🎉

[@daveyjaxx]

🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻 thank you so much!

[@biancacox8630]

Don’t you find it strange that Bill Gothard had higher education all the way up to a PHD yet he criticized even higher Christian education?? That should make people pause and think 🤔…he was trying to keep people from thinking for themselves so he could keep the abuse going and keep it quiet….

[@jcc6789]

You guys made me smile while i was cringing inside. I was in the IFB - and tortured and tormented into my fifth decade of life. Believe it or not, mom (primary abuser) would still be abusing me if she had access to me - and she’s in her late 80’s. The trauma never leaves.

[@VictoriaGrace97]

I was raised in the surprisingly insular Texas homeschool community and this shit KILLED me to watch. Traumatizing and triggering as hell, but also just surreal enough to be hilarious in the worst way. 😂 As a grown adult, sometimes I forget that everyone around me has no way to relate to my background at all… until I pull out a picture and they’re like why the hell were you wearing an ankle length khaki skirt?

[@daveyjaxx]

Same! I grew up and was homeschooled primarily in Texas and that’s where my family first got into IBLP. I’m still incredibly grateful for my homeschool education 🙏🏻

[@Aisling464]

Since when is an ankle length khaki skirt code for being in a cult?

[@melissahodgson1958]

Agreed Davey, they needed to dig into the cult. I would love to see what else was involved.

[@middlesismonica]

This is a great discussion. I had several friends who followed Gothard are teachings. I'm glad it's being exposed.

[@daveyjaxx]

🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

[@grammichal6759]

I spoke to Gothard once when Basic Youth came to Seattle in the early 70’s. He was very keen on people knowing the meaning of names. I was named after the first wife of King David, Michal. He gave me pause when he did not recognize the name. I thought he was supposed to be the ultimate Biblical scholar. II Samuel

[@daveyjaxx]

I’ll never forget the story he told during the basic seminar about a woman named “Barfa” 😂😂

[@PinkPosy1]

What is interesting is how similar cults are regardless of their goals. Looking forward to this series as I have mostly only heard women’s stories of their lives in the cult.

[@halgari]

So I'm a graduate of Unit 28 of ALERT and worked on the campus for about 5 years. Yes the abs were real :D. But no we *never* did combat training of any sort. Infact that was a major thing in the leadership, they were so afraid of actually being labeled as a paramilitary, that we were never allowed to train any sort of self defense. There was a law enforcement class on campus, but the training there was very limited and completely constrained to the 12 or so men involved in that class. Doing any sort of martial arts, formal shooting classes, or weapons training was *strictly* prohibited. IBLP is a cult, and ALERT had its own issues (although ALERT had a tendency to get men jaded about IBLP so that most left IBLP after moving on from ALERT), but I thought I should clear up the bit about combat training.

[@Boahemaa]

I'm glad I found this discussion because I have been trying to get the angle of all his terrible teachings being biblical. The point about an abusive parent more likely to warm up to the prescribed abuse at the conferences is a great point.

[@daveyjaxx]

The IBLP validated people’s worst intentions. That’s not to say that all IBLP members had bad intentions but those that did were able to support their evil with “biblical principles” it’s disgusting

[@maryd4003]

My well intentioned Christian school required us to attend a week of IBLP evening seminars. It was an agonizing week. The fact that he was unmarried and childless, yet gave all the advice related to those topics was a big red flag. Then the prayer at the end where he’d say “I see that hand.” We would bust out laughing. These were prerecorded sessions. Dude, you are not omnipresent. He definitely had a God complex.

[@jssheila]

It's ridiculous how proud I am at the fact that I actually talked to Brice at the training center and I even have pictures of him from going off campus together while we were there....Like crazy proud that we had fight in us and knew the stupidity even while surviving it!

[@jssheila]

Aww I just found a good one of us at the piano together....Lol all things considered, we were pretty good friends 🙂

[@deancrist621]

My family was in the cult. Thankfully I was old enough to say “hell no!” And they had to wait until I moved out to join it, but all of this was 100% on point.

[@mikescrazycomedy7362]

I went to missionary Baptist church and a independent baptist church in the 1990's to 2021. I was taught purity culture and 🎵 and movies. Purity culture messed me up to this day. I broke free and now I attend a southern baptist

[@daveyjaxx]

Took me over 10 years to feel comfortable in my own skin so it’s definitely a process

[@marleysankor]

Thank~you gentlemen!,💛

[@daveyjaxx]

🙏🏻❤️

[@The_Brew_Dog]

For me it’s simple, if some other person, group, place, or book claims to receive direct revelations from god on your behalf” - RUN!

[@daveyjaxx]

Absolutely 👏🏻👏🏻

[@herewegokids7]

This is what I've told all my children now

[@herewegokids7]

"gods way to...". NOPE

[@janellward2380]

Thank you for acknowledging that a lot of the parents had good intentions. I feel like a lot of these parents get looked at as evil and mean. Some absolutely are!!!! But I believe a majority actually thought they were doing the right things by their children. NOT anything abusive!!! I was not IBLP but now that I'm old, looking back I made mistakes as a mom but with the best intentions. I was one of those moms that my son couldn't read Harry Potter because I heard it was bad. I didn't even check it out. I just believed what I was told. 😢 As a mom, I made many mistakes, but I didn't know at the time.

[@daveyjaxx]

100% agree

[@celestelawler587]

Sorry, but just how stupid do parents have to be to think blanket training is in the best interest of the child?

[@AuntBee185]

Lots of us used the school curriculum and never heard of blanket training.When I heard of it I could not fathom doing it ever! I think it was very few people .

[@celestelawler587]

@@AuntBee185 You used the subpar ATI curriculum? And NO, it wasn't very few people who used blanket training. It was MANY. Michelle Duggar got it from Michael & Debi Pearl's book, "How To Train Up A Child." The title alone is offensive. You TRAIN animals. You RAISE & nurture children.

[@merricat3025]

​@@celestelawler587 i would never treat my dog like that.

[@UmbrellaRebellion]

43:37 soft curls! He didn't like very curly hair. Love hearing this from the male perspective. I always hear that the girls were sent home and the boys were "counseled". I (Dee) was too wordly since I joined as a barely adult to attract male attention in IBLP, so I never got the chance to challenge that theory. 46:30 Thank you for saying that! Oppresive to us women. Did you know that Gothard has a second brother that also has been convicted of crimes? I have a whole episode on my channel about the crimes of the Gothard brothers.

[@daveyjaxx]

Oh we know all about Steve 🤮 And I’m glad you were out before you were in 😂 you really dodged a bullet there!

[@UmbrellaRebellion]

@Davey Jackson I was in enough to go to HQ for a few months and get really confused about the hypocracy of BG actions vs teachings.

[@anti-theist]

Excellent show. Subscribing. Thx. ❤

[@daveyjaxx]

🙏🏻❤️

[@mienafriggstad3360]

🙋‍♀️ Hi from Saskatchewan 🇨🇦. I'm a new viewer and subscriber. I found you through Calvin; who I found through Amanda Rae. Bryce; you said you went to a tiny christian school with "cubicles" did you go to an "ACE" school ? Did you do the "ABCs of ACE"? FYI the IBLP had members up here in Saskatchewan 🇨🇦 too. We had two sets of neighbors who tried to convince my family to quit our church and ACE school; to joine them.

[@ArvelleWhitaker]

Oh! no! not the DC Talk tape! dayum bro!

[@pollsfriend]

I could relate so much to the end of the video because of working for a Pentecostal rehab called Teen Challenge. We’d get these criminals that’s were court ordered and combine them with church kids that just smoked some weed and needed reprogrammed, no psych meds, mentally ill people…it was quite the show at times. That said some of the Teen Challenge programs are changing to incorporate psychiatry and psych meds and actual therapy instead of just the Bible and prayer and “work therapy.”

[@meghanferrari6501]

I went to one as an adult. It was horrific I wanted to leave they locked me in a room all day waited til night. While I was sitting in that room they were on the phone with my family telling them all the reasons why they should not come get me. They dropped me off in a town I had never been in with no money no phone no nothing! They stole the change out of my wallet!! F teen challenge! I still am traumatized thinking about it. They were so negligent and illegal in what they did to me which is why I can't stand to see anyone support them and their dumb so called christian rehab. I was on drugs but the experience didn't help. They basically held me hostage then when I an adult who had no reason to be held there against my will they did everything possible to make my exit hell. Dropping a woman off at night in a town she has never been in with zero dollars, no cell phone nothing they are lucky I wasn't raped or murdered. I hate them with a passion. They are a cult.

[@pollsfriend]

@@meghanferrari6501 I’m sorry that happened to you. I went through the program myself and worked for them for a few years because I was desperate to be sober, and I was raised Christian so it was sort of easy to just fall in line. That said once I finally left I actually saw a psychiatrist and was diagnosed with Bipolar 2 and got on the right combination of meds plus medical marijuana, my life changed. I’m no longer Christian, and I would never, ever send someone to Teen Challenge.

[@daveyjaxx]

Teen Challenge sounds a lot like the Life Focus program I was a part of and we’re talking more about that in Episode 2 🙏🏻🙏🏻

[@pollsfriend]

@@daveyjaxx exactly. I’d love to come on and talk to you about it…I was on the inside for five years…

[@shortybarnesyanik]

I spent time in Indianapolis, Big Sandy, and Flint, did a time of Children’s conferences, went every year to Knoxville, sang in the choir. 😢

[@satxrated6178]

Thank you for sharing

[@daveyjaxx]

Love y’all 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

[@ElenaRose725]

The documentary was incredibly triggering for me and I grew up in an entirely DIFFERENT religious cult! I do believe that most cults share similar characteristics and agree with you that more could have been said. Still, the important thing is that people are finally talking about it. BTW, the campus in Big Sandy, TX was formerly built by the cult I grew up in. It was one of three. From cult to cult, huh?

[@Nate-sj2ou]

Interesting. I actually attended training at that campus you mentioned in the early 2000's. The were removing themselves from the Gothard stuff then, however, there were still people there that were still 'fans' of the curriculum. I came from the 'outside' along with a few others and we were considered 'trouble makers' since we called it what it was - a cult. The funniest thing was that most of the younger individuals raised in the organization called it that too.

[@daveyjaxx]

Assembly of God originally built the big sandy facility as ambassador college right?

[@ElenaRose725]

@@daveyjaxx While it was called Ambassador College, it was built by Worldwide Church of God in 1964. I had to Google that since I was so young when my mom joined this cult. Two other campuses were in Pasadena, CA and Bricket Wood, UK. All paid for by the excessive tithes of "the people" while those at the top lived lavishly.

[@cmorrison5466]

@@ElenaRose725 My family exited the WCG in 1995 after "The Changes". Shortly afterwards, I ran into a homeschooling family that tried to introduce me to IBLP. That was the first time I heard Gothard's name. They kept lavishing Gothard with praise and admiration, reminding me of the same way we used elevate "MR. Armstrong". I decided I wanted nothing to do with this organization. It was mind-blowing to me when I found out that Gothard purchased the Big Sandy campus. WCG members were told when it was sold but they were never told who purchased it. There would've been a major uproar had members found out that a "Sunday-keeping Messenger of Satan" would be occupying it. It's uncanny how the IBLP and the WCG have in common even though they worship on different days (Sabbath vs Sunday). So glad we didn't step in that doo-doo. Wasting a decade in the WCG was bad enough.

[@brendahautaluoma624]

Joyfully available!!! 😂

[@MyMerryMessyGermanLife]

That part is so sickening 🤮🤮🤮

[@herewegokids7]

My husband always jokes that he is joyfully available to me 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@MyMerryMessyGermanLife]

@@herewegokids7 love it! 😂😂

[@ritasympson5107]

Some of the aspects sound like Scientology Cult. Control, (charismatic leader) Military Aspect (Uniforms) Childhood Labor Renovating Buildings!

[@daveyjaxx]

It’s like weird hybrid of fundamental Christianity, Mormonism and Scientology.

[@dorothyclark8680]

I was bullied at church school as well! popular at regular public school BUT every Sunday, I would be made fun of and bullied. Good times ugh

[@1951kvk]

It's interesting that no mention is made of the Bates Family that appeared on TLC as well. Gil Bates is on the board of IBLP.

[@Nkkdawson]

I am former cult member as well. And no one has any idea what happened in my home. It was a living nightmare to be in and then to turn and recover from. I would love to be able to share my story. Oh, you were always to have 6 inches between the opposite sex!!

[@reaganpratt9001]

I wasn't raised religious but I got sent to reformers unanimous for 6mo and it was HORRIFIC. just 6mo was incredibly traumatic

[@theoblongbox4909]

I knew about the IBLP, but I was interested to hear more specifically about their homeschool curriculum and their little books. I know that it's all obviously anti-science and very misogynistic and victim blaming, but I was truly interested to look more specifically at the curriculum and see exactly what nonsense it teaches. When they went over the part about the "law of crying out" and stuff like that, I found it interesting.

[@daveyjaxx]

They twisted biblical principles so grotesquely to fit their narrative

[@rebeccavega6851]

We went to a seminar in 1988. I had just gotten married and it all seemed very spiritual. I did started eating whole wheat bread right after that . We didn’t go to a church that followed Gothard so we sort of forgot about him. I did start homeschooling eventually . We didn’t know anyone who followed him but eventually Doug Phillips was everywhere circa 2003. When he had his big down fall there were blogs about it . Many of his ideas were quite similar to Gothard. I am so sorry to hear about all the abuse suffered by so many people.

[@daveyjaxx]

Oooo we’re gonna talk about doug phillips and vision forum a little bit in part 3 and then in more detail in a future episode.

[@angela_eric]

I think I might have had a childhood friend back when I was younger, whose family might have been in this cult. Last I heard, she was living in Houston and had a kid outside of marriage, and my grandparents were being super conservative about it. What I remember, the reason she liked being with her grand parents at the park we met up at is because she was allowed to swim with other people and wear a swimsuit, although she would wear a t-shirt over it. I kind of regret how I left things off because I was really weird and going through some super strong puberty feelings.

[@1515cando]

The IBLP influenced many congregations outside of their direction. Much of the anti worldly stuff was\is prevalent in most Baptist, Assembly of God and pentecostal churches. My childhood experiences pretty turned me against religion of any sort.

[@daveyjaxx]

Absolutely agree 👏🏻👏🏻

[@troygoss6400]

my family was briefly involved with the cult. fortunately, my mom was a strong willed woman and there was no resonance with the organization. i found the documentary fascinating.

[@idnwiw]

I have one question: Do you have any idea about the percentage of people who who have grown up there made it out of the "mindset" of that cult, and what percentage is still ultra-conservative? There seem to be a lot of ex-members speaking out, but with families being "as big as possible" there might be even more left in the cult-thinking?

[@daveyjaxx]

I wish I had a way knowing those statistics because I’m sure it would be shocking. If I had to take a guess just based on the people I know I would say it’s about 60% that rejected their upbringing and 40% that are still trapped in that mindset at some level.

[@jettsetfarmhouse]

I shared growing up in a cult (ifbb Iblp ACE) about two years ago on my TikTok and many in the comments said “the Duggars aren’t in a cult”. So glad to see all of this finally being called what it is. This was my ENTIRE life until I turned 20

[@daveyjaxx]

Glad you made it out and would love to talk about your experience 🙏🏻🙏🏻

[@jettsetfarmhouse]

@@daveyjaxx I’d be happy to share. My book “From the Ground Up” delves into it a little bit but there’s so much more to it.