The Dornian Heresy EXPLAINED By An Australian | Warhammer 40k What if?

[@majorkill]

I could have just renamed this video "What if Rogal Dorn went Bald" and it would more or less be the exact same To see an Imperial Fist's Bald Eagle go here : www.patreon.com/majorkill

[@supersaiyandiclonius3056]

Absolutely LOVE these fanfics. Hope to see more.

[@mut-x8k]

My god majorkill why did this video take so long? I have been waiting for this subject forever!

[@darklordmalthric9814]

Cover the badab war

[@rro3540]

Plz make a vid on the imperial guard during the Horus heresy

[@dudeboydudeboy-zj8kd]

eldar exodites and corsairs please

[@zakluck1686]

I like how the Dark Angels went bad because Luther took over, not that The Lion turned. Keeping with Canon and the knowledge that the Lion would never turn traitor

[@tfan2222]

Real funny seeing that the a fair bit of the loyalist art for this video are of the Lionel Hersey

[@Watcher-in-the-Dark]

Damn right!

[@TheWarmachine375]

Roboutian Heresy Lion: "Are you sure about that?"

[@spikethedragon341]

@@TheWarmachine375 Roboutian Heresy has hardcore Fedora-tippin Atheist Lorgar, while Dornian Heresy Lorgar is the same religious nut, Lectitio-Divinatus Thumping Lorgar who has no Kor Phaeron to later corrupt him, all while the Emprah merely told him to stop praying all the time because even Gods need some privacy and quiet from time to time. More in line with canon Lorgar.

[@TheWarmachine375]

@@spikethedragon341 Roboutian Heresy Lorgar is the best variant of Lorgar

[@RichterBelmont2235]

The way Vulkan turns to chaos is the perfect analogue to some African proverbs that said something along the line of "A child that is unable to find warm in his village will burn it down just to feel it"

[@indrickboreale7381]

And he has a lot of fire

[@RichterBelmont2235]

@@indrickboreale7381 Commander Boreale - Enemy forces in our perimeter

[@indrickboreale7381]

@@RichterBelmont2235 Where?

[@RichterBelmont2235]

@@indrickboreale7381 Southern Quadrant, but they were on the move. Current location unknown

[@indrickboreale7381]

@@RichterBelmont2235 There is no time to be lost. Battle Brothers! Space Marines - today the enemy is at our door. We know our duty, and we will do it. We fight for our honor as Blood Ravens, as Space Marines ... and we fight in the name of the Emperor! And if we die this day we die in glory. We die heroes deaths ... but we shall not die. No! It is the enemy who will taste death and defeat. As you know... Most of our Battle Brothers are stationed in space, prepared to deep strike. Our perimeter has been prepared in the event that our enemies should be so bold and so foolish. We have placed numerous beacons, allowing for multiple, simultaneous, and devastating defensive deep strikes. The Codex Astartes names this maneuver Steel Rain. We will descend upon the foe, we will overwhelm them ... we will leave none alive. Meanwhile, our ground forces will ensure the full defense of our headquaters. We are the Space Marines! We are the Emperor's Fury!

[@urranrell2721]

I think it'll be worse since Guilliman's trait of being the most organized among the Primarchs might carry on if ever he would become a traitor. Imagine an organized chaos legion

[@TheWarmachine375]

Hence, the Roboutian Heresy

[@ethanguest3438]

With organised demons

[@N0noy1989]

It'll just take one Organized Black Crusade to destroy Cadia

[@romeobelisario3190]

In the Roboutian Heresy where he WAS the arch traitor, he DID have the warpath to Terra going, but in the transition to Chaos he lost a deal of his charisma, which meant that while he lead a pretty efficient path to Terra, he was only able to convince Ferrus to directly follow him, while everybody else literally scattered to the winds and follow their own paths to Terra to do whatever. Dorn waged a Blood Crusade to cleanse his Legion of Khorne’s Madness Sanguinius and the Khan were leading their Legions in separate paths of wanton destruction, pillaging/eating every civilian world they came across. The Lion was actually away on Guilliman’s orders to recruit Leman to their cause while also going to the Halos Stars to consolidate his power. Vulkan and Corax I believe we’re also taking their own routes, accomplishing personal goals

[@Salted_Fysh]

Guilliman doesn't fall to Chaos in this timeline. He just wants his own piece of the Galaxy and everyone else to fuck off.

[@MiguelSanchezDelVillar]

I love the detail of how each legion changed, is not just they switch places, is an exploration of each primarchs personalities. I love It 10/10 would read It again

[@williamstott1391]

I screamed so loud when angron died Rest In Peace

[@dragonstormx]

I like how these alternate heresy ideas like this and Roboutian Heresy actually seem to put more thought into some of the characters than canon does.

[@williamstott1391]

@@dragonstormx yeah I mean I don’t know why gw doesn’t realize some of their motives are crap for characters

[@dragonstormx]

@@williamstott1391 Some characters were envisioned as being more one note and writers have tried to flesh out, except sometimes they don't notice an obvious fix. One idea I saw suggested for Angron in canon was the Emperor does offer to help him and Angron refuses wanting to die along with his comrades. And Perturabo has the issue of writers giving him opposite characterizations.

[@williamstott1391]

@@dragonstormx * cough* angron *cough *

[@io2900]

So loyalist Angron is basically Sanguinius in canon? And beside the pain glove, another reason why Rogal Dorn turns to Chaos is because big E make the "taco tuesday" real

[@bplup6419]

Taco Tuesday is on Friday. *ALL HAIL THE POWERS OF COHAS!*

[@robberyproductions1363]

Sanguinius wanted the Burger

[@ismaeljimenez6562]

@@robberyproductions1363 HERETIC BUGAR

[@TheWarmachine375]

@@ismaeljimenez6562 Flesh Eaters chapter: "Our true purpose is clear! Eat! EAT! *BURGER!!!"*

[@TheWarmachine375]

@@ismaeljimenez6562 They are high on Ork mushrooms

[@jslrnzrbntn]

I love the concept art of Jaghatai as a Slaaneshi centaur. Fuckin epic. The Ultramarine armor with Tau technology and the Imperial Fist becoming the Black Legion while the Luna Wolves turn to the Black Templars. Lorgar's story was the best when his faith was so strong he literally lit up, purged corruption in a citywide radius then died peacefully.

[@garberasandor9699]

And Kor Phaeron died in the process of becoming a space marine.

[@thespecter6416]

@@garberasandor9699 But what about that dickweed Erebus?

[@memesofwarhemmer7076]

@@thespecter6416 Erebus decided not to kill kid Erebus rather become friends after he died he became a monk who decided to serve lorgar as his most loyal son so humble he was he died sacrificing himself . Erebus is not his true name is just the name a kid he killed in canon and stolen his name here is more like self sacrifice more like calgar lol.

[@lordhamster9452]

Hmm, instead of a pink on pink RapeSnake, we are getting pink and white SpeeeeedFreeekTaur. Sound very cool and horrifying at the same time. Tau-teched Ultramar is also pretty smart and cool.

[@jslrnzrbntn]

@@lordhamster9452 i also saw some art where instead of him wielding his White Tiger Dao, his dominant arm is a demon tentacle blade

[@BrotherCarver]

This version of Angron actually makes the character very compelling and not some edgy little ball of rage.

[@NicPTheMeme]

"Little" Lmao

[@ladonmccabe]

Meh, I like daemon Angron.

[@jacobgallegos8762]

Well yah his dad wasn’t a dumb ass for no reason in this one

[@undercovertakodachi4301]

​@@NicPTheMemecompare to Khorne

[@skillshare385]

angron the character in canon is very non-compelling, i agree but i personally find myself compelled by angron the idea

[@Corsair-Mandrake]

One of my favorite parts of these fanfics is how often Fabius is still evil, like it’s hard to make him seem good without rewriting the whole story to make it fit.

[@Watcher-in-the-Dark]

Well cuz honestly he isn't corrupted or even truly traitor. He is a psychopath that only cares for himself. There was no turning point for him, even if you take away the disease that drives him to worse and worse things I still think at some point he goes renegade.

[@TheWarmachine375]

@@Watcher-in-the-Dark Imperium Ascendant would like to have a word with you

[@cindermoth3421]

@@TheWarmachine375 Imperium Ascendant starts a whole lot earlier than the other horus heresy fanfics. And changes the very foundation of it a lot more so than the others.

[@Stickyrolls123]

Traitor sanguineous would be scary. Recall that in the books the powers of chaos wanted him to be the champion and that Horus was a second choice. I think the heresy would not have even been close had Sanguineous fallen. I get the feeling that we rarely see his full potential as his abilities are tempered by a fear of rage and losing control. He's always so soft spoken and diplomatic. Him joining chaos would remove those barriers and he would be unstoppable.

[@Diyel]

He'd be a great Daemonprince of either Khorne or Slaanesh tbh

[@reecesanderson6696]

Yeah but his soul essence would be hard capped by chaos particularly if he devoted himself to one God. It be like having infinite power through the bottle neck of a daemon. Think of it like magnus even without the noble shard.

[@shotgunsandsmoke]

I always thought about the many what-ifs. One of them is what would happen if Horus and Glorious Hawk Boi swapped places and Hawk-Boi commanded the traitors while Horus commanded the loyalists

[@Archon3960]

So, Tactica Imperialis' Sanguinian Heresy then. 😎

[@dianapennepacker6854]

Wonder why they never wanted Magnus. Maybe they knew he was too loyal. Magnus literally got fucked from all sides though and Tzhneetch was like "Wow. I hardly had to do anything to get his brothers to turn on him". Anyways yes the Blood Angel would be the most powerful over all of them all for sure. The thing is he might become so blood fueled that he loses any semblance of tactics but I doubt that. He would be ruthless and bloodthirsty but would still be sanguine about it all. Think he duels Horus in that vision and kills him quickly by throwing his spear. Totally makes Horus look like a toy in that vision.

[@cosmicwooloo]

Loyalist magnus would be cool for cannon timelines

[@chronosmyass7226]

It would pretty much be the end of the lore cos magnus could sit in the throne instead of the emperor and well.....

[@jackmack4181]

Wait would that mean magnus did everything right or wrong

[@frankdecron1306]

He gets killed super early on by traitor Russ, who becomes a daemon prince of Khorne. Edit: I was thinking of the theoreticus heresy by 40k Theories. Here’s a link to that kzbin.info/www/bejne/m6myfoh5m713ndk. It’s a fan reverse heresy. They both have Dorn as warmaster and going traitor. Russ and the space wolves go traitor and attack prospero. In the Dornian Hersey he escapes, in the other he is beheaded.

[@ChillAssTurtle]

If he was loyal thered be no fight.. he and empy would giga cuck the entire heresy in 17 hours

[@aumlout5816]

@@frankdecron1306 you're thinking of the theoreticus heresy I think.

[@RogueFox2185]

And in the 40K era the major threat in this timeline that brings back the Silent King is the return of the Krorks, the Tyranids have eaten the Tau to the brink of extinction (The Farsight Enclaves are still around and are currently leading the remnants of their race, though the non-Tau allied species have abandoned them to fend for themselves against the Nid’s onslaught) while the Squats are prepared to launch a massive strike against the Craftworld Eldar who are also being mercilessly hunted by the servants of Chaos. As for the state of Chaos itself at this point in time, it turns out that Slannesh is currently the one dominating the Great Game with the most influence on the Imperial Population instead of just twiddling his/her thumbs in our timeline. (much to the ire of Khorne) Which as you can imagine is quite a massive problem for the Ynnari, who only make up a tiny fraction of the Eldar Race in this reality.

[@jaketheberge1970]

How did Krorks return?

[@MacerXGP]

@@jaketheberge1970 violently

[@superfluous9726]

Guess they didn't like the tau? Seems like a waste. Would have been cool if they made them a bit more grimdark and had farsight start a civil war aginst the tau empire.

[@Skeletor_the_Bigg]

By “twiddling his thumbs” you mean ramming them both up his/her/their/it’s ass with claws on?

[@jaketheberge1970]

@@superfluous9726 There is another fanfic called The Shape Of The Nightmare To Come. The Tao get that kind of treatment in it.

[@flamingmuffin666]

Even in a loyalist switch, the lion is loyal. He can’t be turned, only delayed. Although, I’m immensely interested in what Warp shenanigans the Lion would wreck upon the immaterium.

[@TheWarmachine375]

*looks at Roboutian Heresy Lion, Daemon Primarch of Tzeentch* Yeah, about that.

[@aguy3082]

Loyalty is it's own reward.

[@nick_a91]

@@TheWarmachine375 coolest daemon primarch design, imo

[@theonethesequel]

There's also the Lionel Heresy where you'll never believe who is the Warmaster on this one.

[@mitchelrowe6915]

And oh boi can he be delayed... Been like 10000 years now...

[@brae9271]

I could see a loyalist Angron being really nuanced with how he deals with his rage and empathy. I'd love to see it 🥲

[@adventarchivist5789]

Honestly wouldn't mind seeing videos like this and others in the future. It's surprising how much the Warhammer fanfic community gets so overlooked and should get more attention.

[@Jack-0-lantern]

This might be a bit too big for him but it would be awesome if he checked out the fan made audio dramas, "Star wars vs Warhammer 40k" by "AFanWithTooMuchTime". His fan series is absolutely incredible 👏.

[@pleaseenteranamelol711]

And the fanart is so fucking awesome. Loyalist angron and kurze were so cool.

[@julianpourdanesh3339]

I truly believe that if lorgar and perty are handled better that they can truly become great villains. Like if perty never became a deamon primarch and instead a like leader of a renegade space marines faction. I also think if lorgar could actually do something besides praying in his chapel he could unite chaos and be it’s actual herald instead abbadon like imagine him leading chaos undivided.

[@znalniaskas]

You could have Perty him ascend a daemon prince by tapping into his own warp powers, similar to Croax, and/or injecting himself with the Obliterator virus + using more and more augmentations to stop himself from dying after Flugrim's bs. Have him and the Iron Warriors join forces with the dark mechanicum and you have an actually interesting faction that is composed of traitors, but doesn't serve the chaos gods. Lorgar being the one chaos undivided daemon primarch is fine to me, that makes sense.

[@shanejones2344]

@@znalniaskas saw something about pert being a demon prince of the machine god. It was a fan theory but that seemed kinda neat

[@requiemlul3140]

Eh, I think Perty being a Deamon could actually be interesting. It would make for a very good self-hatred aspect.

[@josemontalvomelendez5642]

or heare me out here. he becomes the demon lord of the soul forge. think about it- it'd fully utilitarian, keeps him in chaos undivided cuz the soulforge is neutral in the great game of chaos simultaneously removing him from the chaos game, works to his great builder origins but now he's making new deamon engines aswell as demonic fortresses and crafts, and makes him a unique type of demon

[@DarkApostleNoek]

@@znalniaskas I like the he ascends by The Forge of Souls. Warpsmiths draw on its power, and the Iron Warriors use those greatly. The Dark Mechanicum is also very close to this.

[@epithed-boi4961]

*Time traveler moves a rock* The Dorian heresy occurs instead of the Horus heresy

[@DarkApostleNoek]

That rock was to be broken down and eventually become part of a wall that Dorn was making thus leaving it unfinished.

[@Rogue.Rainbow]

Now I want to see an animated video of Loyalist Angron fighting the traitors to a last stand kind of like how Noble Six fought on Reach but with chain axes and shit tons of more blood.

[@TimeCircleBlue]

Current Objective: Survive

[@synergy8879]

bruh the last thing i want to engage is a loyalist, sane angron. mans gonna smack you so hard you turn into a mist.

[@SapoWeonN300]

@@synergy8879 Imagine a Loyalist Angron and Ferrus Fighting TOGETHER. My god, i am seeing the blood of the idiots that try to break that duo

[@synergy8879]

@@TimeCircleBlue imagine being a traitor charging and suddenly seeing angron turn around with chain axes ready

[@NicPTheMeme]

@@TimeCircleBlue more like 'Current Objective: Pyrrhic Victory'

[@TheWarmachine375]

4:16 That means Rogal Dorn's hand saved his life by detaching itself with the Magic Pain Glove from his arm

[@yaphongjie8551]

your services are no longer required

[@papacheese6431]

@@yaphongjie8551 they were no longer required

[@revedefleurs181]

Yo, I would definitely love if you covered Robutian Heresy. I haven't completed it yet but the chapter on Emperor's Children really made me hooked into the whole thing.

[@thedamnedprimarch4434]

Agreed, I love the way the Word Bearers have changed by just being loyalist and instead of following the imperium in belief of the God Emperor they still hold onto the old Imperial truth and even have a hostile relationship with much of The imperial cult. A complete 180 from what they used to be I’m not that deep into it but can’t wait to see what is done with the dawn of war story line especially with what is done with Eliphas.

[@dianapennepacker6854]

I want to hear the Emperor transcending into God Hood and loses his humanity in the process. Becomes drunk off those who worship him. So he becomes the fifth God of chaos as he loses his love for humans and it takes the combined might of ALL the Primarchs to take him down. Now that would be interesting as it technically would still be a civil war. People would worship him like they currently do and side with him not knowing how he actually is. Malcador and a few others will side against the Primarchs of course. Malcador becoming a daemon prince of the Emperor. This wasn't my idea. Saw an other guy write it in an other of these videos. Fucking genius and word needs to get out so I could see someone write it haha.

[@posathornsirivat5026]

I endorse Roboutian Heresy for the next topic to be covered. I love how it handles the respective primarchs rise and...fall. Some more tragic than others but tragic all the same.

[@jirojhasuo2ndgrandcompany745]

Its much less cookie cutter too. The only thing i liked in the Dornian Heresy was that Ultramarines went secessionist instead of chaos

[@reillycurran8508]

Wait if the webway wasn't ever compromised wouldn't that mean that Dorne just succeeded in failing at his job just more destructively to everything but what chaos was actually worried about?

[@Akabans999]

Not realy with big E a corpse on golden throne ther are 0 people with know how to continue it thus even if it is unbroken it is a dud.

[@Salted_Fysh]

@@Akabans999 ~ Malchadaddy ~ ~ Magnusbaby ~

[@Akabans999]

@@Salted_Fysh wait Machador suvived? .... fuck some time since I read it forgeting stuff. Ehh then maybe they could complete it.

[@Salted_Fysh]

@@Akabans999 i don't know. It wasn't mentioned so I just assumed. I mean, how exactly would they go about killing him off without the throne? He's a perpetual just like the Emperor, he would just reform in a few decades or hundred years.

[@Akabans999]

@@Salted_Fysh its chaos they are bound to pull somthing from nurgles or tzeetchs ass

[@BaphoMettbroetchen]

I really like this "What if?" mostly. Except the Slamanders part. Seems kinda cheap to write them of like that. :X There should be a really good reason for Vulkan to change 180°.

[@thedarkholegammertdhg9255]

Well, they needed one derp reason. And Vulcan's falling fits

[@The42istheanswer]

-im gonna boop it... -no vulcan. Dont boop the frog -...CHAOS IS IT

[@qball331]

How I would have done it is have them leave the Imperium because of its disregard for human life and either have them join G-man or start their own empire. It makes much more sense for Vulkan and the Salamanders character than just no hug = Chaos.

[@rexlumontad5644]

@@thedarkholegammertdhg9255 In Roboutian Heresy, Vulkan was raised by the wild beasts of Nocturne, not humans and he became more of a survival of the fittest than a broest of bros

[@jj_ai382]

Well Majorkill didn't explain it too well in the video but Vulkan crashlanded into a volcano as a baby. The lava scarred his skin and boiled his lungs turning him into a hideously burnt and charred man with a with a terrible voice. He roamed around for a while then he found a village. The village took him in but they were terrified of him and always treated him like an outsider. No matter what he said or did they always treated him like a freak. As he grew older he traveled the world looking for a place to fit in but at every single turn the people rejected him. Its actually kinda depressing when the Bemperor shows up, because Vulkan actually tries to hide from him. He'd been rejected and hurt so much by humanity that he just tried to avoid interacting with anybody. The Imperium didn't really treat him better when he joined so a resentment for humanity festered in Vulkan. So when Majorkill said Vulkan turned evil cuz no one would hug him he was actually right but it's hard to capture an explanation on how Vulkan turned traitor without taking away huge amounts of time from the other legions.

[@Ghhjfhjztd]

I love the idea of Magnus the good and Puertorabo the respected and loved.

[@captainvalourous6668]

Also speaking of Fanfics I saw this one fanfic called Imperium Ascendant. Long story short after a failed attempt of the Chaos Marines who travelled back in time to kill the Loyalist Baby Primarchs by the actions of the Legion of the Damned. The God Emperor of 41st Millenium warned the Emperor of the 30th millenium about what happened because they sucked as a Daddy. As a result with Big E raising the Primarchs as a good dad as well improving his plans on the Great Crusade. The Imperium of Men became a lot of better place than the ones we know today. Now to be honest it was not yet finished and the author had passed his work on another author since he has more responsibilities to do. Yet what I love it in this fanfic is that the author created some stories which I wish it was true to the 40k because it was simply awesome. 1. Cegorach was not an Eldar God but rather an Old One who was tasked to disguise himself as an Eldar God to supervise the Eldar Gods whom the Old Ones have created. 2. The Emperor of Mankind was the reincarnation of an Old One called the Craftsman. This is because it was this Old One Craftsman who approached the ancient Human Shamans and thought them how to perform that suicide ritual with the Craftsmans own assistance. 3. The Chaos Gods was not created from the emotinal fuckery of the War in Heaven but rather it was a creation of the Old Ones who at that time were so desperate to stop the C'tan and the Necrons from fucking everything up. Unfortunately this planned went beyond south and made things even worst for the Milky Way Galaxy. But by a miracle the Necron's Silent King himself approached the Old Ones and offered them an alliance in exchange for Perfect Flesh for his people thus allowing the Old Ones' forces and the Necrons to tag together and stop the Chaos with the Old Ones facing them on the Warp while the Necrons faces the Daemons on the Material Universe while at the same time imprisoning the C'tan into shards.

[@the_man_emperor_of_mankind]

This reads like 40k the good ending, I like it

[@captainvalourous6668]

@@the_man_emperor_of_mankind Sorry for the late reply but yes you should read it man. For a small teaser you will love Big E's confrontation with the Clown God. 😅

[@NicPTheMeme]

I guess i should re-read Ascendant, then

[@Primus_Phallus]

The problem with the Dornian Heresy or any alt history in 40k for that matter is that it fails to take into a count that if Magnus managed to sit on the Golden Throne, the Emperor is free to crush any rebellion. That's why taking out that young dumb Red Cyclips was imperative for Chaos.

[@taylorhuhn9498]

not when leman is laying siege to prospero

[@Primus_Phallus]

@@taylorhuhn9498 Literally what I meant by taking out Magnus

[@taylorhuhn9498]

@@Primus_Phallus 😶

[@KarizenMagi]

Funny thing, the art at 0:59 is actually from a similar fan-fic called the Roboutian Heresy, where the Ultramarines are both the Arch-Traitor and Arch-Heretic. Lion has Kairos in his ear from day one, making him fall to Tzeentch Fulgrim had Librarians to tell him not to touch the Lear blade, and got hekka scarred by the Dark Eldar Perturabo actually gave a shit about people The Khan gets *fucking possessed by the Lord of Hunts* Leman goes of the deep end with his paranoia, to the point he trusts sketchy Xenos more than his Father Dorn loses Inwit, causing him to spiral into totalitarion levels of dicktator Curze is actually loved and trusted by his people Kahbanda didn't interfere with Sanguinius on Signus, so Slannesh got him Ferrus incidentally opened a warp rift the gave him Nurgle's Rot Angron didn't get jumped by the Eldar and enlsaved afterwords Guliman lost everything to a consipracy before Big-E found him, and after that, jumped into the Eye of Terror for not getting to be Warmaster Mortarion killed his adoptive daddy first chance he got Magnus got humbled before his Father even found him The Emperor was more of a father for Horus Lorgar hates religion with the same conviction he loves it in cannon Vulcan got adopted by the Salamander his legion is named after Corvus was found by the Tech Guilds and the Emperor had to put on an act to get him back, but Corax thinks the act is the real him Alpharius and Omegon get a backstory.

[@Rammkommando]

and plus i think its omegon but one of them lasts until the current black crusade and activates every counter measure he set up and being the only primarch around at the start of it.

[@angelusumbrae]

I'm glad I saw this comment. When I last looked into the Dornian Heresy, not all the Primarchs and Legions had been fleshed out and I think some of them didn't had ANY info yet. Did you write all this based on the video, or did you find it somewhere else? And if you did find it all yourself, where was it? Cause I wanna read it too.

[@Skorpian657]

My favorite of the alternate heresy stories is the Renegade Saga, which pits a chaos emperor against Horus and other loyalist primarchs. It's not a 1 for 1 swap, as many traitors remain loyal to the emperor and chaos, while some do not.

[@darthjekyll3648]

Suggest and tweet this

[@darth_elsa6681]

If things were reversed....I know The Ultramarines would be Chaos Undivided and Guilliman would be the favored son of Chaos. Which would also mean Lorgar would fit in perfectly with the Imperium as it is now as Lord Commander or whatever fancy title Lorgar would come up with. Imagine Lorgar being able to give a purpose to the faithful of the Imperium because he believes it as much as they do and Chaos being a completey united and organized force under Guilliman with proper logistics.

[@MC-wb7cp]

You should read the The Roboutian Heresy Its pretty much as you said it, ultramarines become chaos undivided and lorgar the bearer of the Imperial way.

[@TheWarmachine375]

@@MC-wb7cp Roboutian Heresy Lorgar is a firm believer of the Imperial Truth alongside his Legions. Despite being in an Imperium that worships the Emperor.

[@romeobelisario3190]

@@TheWarmachine375 Yup. Not only is he an atheist, he becomes an incredible hater of religion. Best of all though is that Erebus was a cool dude

[@TheWarmachine375]

@@romeobelisario3190 Yup, and Kor Phaeron was dealt with far earlier before Lorgar reunite with Emps and got a Legion.

[@donatedorb4094]

No matter what, don't ask about Corvus Corax in Roboutian Heresy. He... he's different.

[@mrtorllin]

"I killed Horus by being good... In pretend" -Rogal Dorn

[@deeperestmeme479]

In all honesty, Lorgar would be the exact thing the guardsmen needed. I mean it’s still 9 of the most powerful legions, so Lorgar’s power of speech would be a significant morale benefit for the loyalists

[@TheWarmachine375]

2:33 Man-Emperor of Mankind: "That's a perfect choice of color and I approve of it!"

[@Pyre]

Honestly just hearing the changeup for Angron yanked my heartstrings a little. Instead of being the buttmonkey, he got to be the Big Guy, if only for a while.

[@iamdiscothedrunkhippo5380]

The Iron Hands being corrupted by the void dragon is way better than I would’ve expected. And it honestly makes sense. Also love that the only reason Vulkan turns is because no one will give him a hug.

[@Kobble03]

I really love the designs and art for the reverse primarchs, they all look really good. And I never thought I'd see the day that Majorkill would say he liked Angron and that he shouldn't be aborted

[@trixus4768]

Not gonna lie... the art of loyal Angron is probably the best looking and the coolest looking 40K picture ever... absolutely magnificent piece of art 👍

[@Type_3_Screamer]

I'd love a video on each legion on how you think they could fall or how you think they'd behave as loyalist

[@agentiq007]

Dang, i had no idea that the taco conflict coused by Rogal Dorn in a TTS podcast had so much lore!

[@UnknownTuber450]

I have just heard of the term, "Femboy Thousand Sons" then googled it, I believe I found the artist who is leading the assault

[@AzraelSoulHunter]

Vezimira is a champion of some new Chaos God.

[@robberyproductions1363]

@@AzraelSoulHunter Nah I just think it's some Tzeentchian Fuckery, or possibly Slaanesh at it again

[@balticbvll2987]

i know right, its completely disgusting

[@pietrynglib177]

Give in

[@amandeepgill5206]

Wank it is

[@chubbyninja89]

I was actually able to enjoy this video quite a bit. Good job Majorkill. Credit where credit is due. But you should totally make a video about the Roboutian Heresy, because while I haven't ready every chapter of it, I did like how it gave us a great view of what several of the traitor primarchs could've been if not turned to chaos and all.

[@lupica9184]

I like seeing Dorn in Horus position Imo Guilliman would be rather nurgle tbh, simply bc he is the cleanest, most correct one trying to hold up status quo, clean perfect homeworld, wrote the rulebook for all astartes (in the "normal" timeline) ....he prefers things not changing and being constant safe Similar to the stagnant safety nurgle promisses. All of Guillimans standarts would prevail in a very twisted way

[@Aurora-313]

Plus, Nurgle seems to have a real hard-on for the Ultramar realm in Dark Imperium. For me, it'd be Khorne. I read somewhere he was Khorne's third choice for corruption and Guilliman has an epic temper to the point where the other primarchs had to force him to calm down and stop being a spazz.

[@bradenhansford467]

Perfect, I was actually curious how it would play out if the Primarchs had their sides switched

[@mattstakeontheancients7594]

Other than Vulkan being evil, this seems to be a better storyline than the original Horus Hersey at least in my opinion

[@sentenal01]

Vulkan traded places with Perty for the unreasonable dismissal and rejection by everyone.

[@mattstakeontheancients7594]

@@sentenal01 Sorry wasn’t saying it was better except for Vulkan being evil. I just like Vulkan personally. Just hate he became evil in this storyline. He’s my favorite primarch cuz he and his men will actually save normal folks.

[@parkwaydrivern5089]

Yeah I couldn’t really see Vulkan going evil here way he did. However maybe if Vulkan saw the Emporer waste the lives of common soldiers and etc with the manipulations of Chaos he could fall/rebel

[@fallout44454]

Except for poor Corvus.

[@mattstakeontheancients7594]

@@parkwaydrivern5089 yeah that’s a possibility. The emperor and other primarchs seem to look at individual people like ants as long as some ants survive then it’s cool where Vulkan sees people just trying to survive in a really fucked up galaxy. Completely unrelated but since the custodes were made individually by the emperor, are the custodes now in 40k been alive since before the herasey. Only characters I know that are still alive from the herasey days are traitor astartes.

[@snip105]

It is definitely a interesting topic to question “what if”. For I have always liked that multiverses idea.

[@TeamOneDay]

Didn't expect Majorkill to cover this, the Dornian heresy was actually brought to my attention not too long ago, so seeing someone cover it now is pretty sweet.

[@TheSecondPrimarch]

Yeah, 6:45 Loyalist Angron is probably one of my favorite "what ifs" in 40k...

[@Keijikrall]

Having read much of the Dornian Heresy, I actually have come to prefer aspects of it to canon. I NEED loyalist night lords, iron warriors and world eaters in my life.

[@MrDorkbot]

I have been thinking about that scenario too ever since I was some fanart of guilleman as the warmaster. Personally I came to the conclusion that if Sanguinius had fallen to Khorne (as he almost did in canon) the imperium would have just lost. I also just really think Loyalist Angron would have been so much better than chaos Angron. Traitor Guilleman would also have just been in a better position than Horus, Horus had his entire legion but Guilleman would have the entirety of Ultramar and all its resources/sacrifices.

[@zeroalpha9713]

I’d definitely watch more of this and would definitely buy a loyal angron mini

[@chaosfriedeggz6014]

I just recently found my old notebook containing my alternate Warhammer 40k universe. Seeing this vid again just makes me want to share it. The Ophiuchus & Angron Universe: A version of Warhammer where The 2nd and 11th primarchs still existed and we're instrumental during the heresy. Angron never got the butcher's nails and still has his glorious hair and the Horus heresy while it did took longer was eventually taken down. Thanks to Sanguineous, Angron and Celestius (the 2nd primarch) working together they were able to subdue Horus, and the Emperor executed Horus for his hubris. However their victory was short lived. Ophiuchus who was tasked to scout out the warp returned with dire news. The warp was much larger than what was thought possible and the realm of chaos was nothing more but a small part of it and worse Ophiuchus has accidentally awakened something or somethings from it. The imperium of man prepared for the incoming threat and became stronger than ever before thanks to the knowledge Ophiuchus brought back but they now have worse enemies to fight with. Old gods from previous iterations of the universe and/or pieces of them are awakening from their celestial graves and invading the universe and their surrounding realms. The gods of Chaos too now faces this ancient enemy older than themselves. Old gods of time, space, entropy, darkness, and destruction now awakened aims to eat everything in their madness in an attempt to rebuild and revive themselves. The first invasion was by the gods of time, space and destruction, their entrance caused another rift between the eye of terror turning it into an X and making it far larger than before separating the galaxy into 4 parts. The battle was hard fought and required the reluctant cooperation between the Loyalist and Traitor parties resulting in the sealing of the fragments of destruction, and the escape of time and time devouring space when it was incapacitated by the Emperor but this victory did not came without a heavy cost, The battle left the Emperor, Magnus and Ophiuchus gravely injured. Now the Emperor was placed upon the golden throne, becoming the beacon of humanity or at least in his corner of the galaxy, Magnus was treated much the same but with a smaller throne and Ophiuchus was left frozen in a genuflecting position while gripping on his sword stabbed to the ground on a dead planet chanting the same chant over and over again as well as begging his father and humanity for forgiveness, serving as a shield generator for his corner of the galaxy. The remaining primarchs either went missing or were also gravely injured and had to be put in stasis to be kept alive. Some even reluctantly joined chaos to protect whichever corner of the galaxy they ended up in, like Sanguinius joining Khorne and Celestius joining Slaanesh. Angron was the only one to be largely fine after the entire debacle and continued to guide humanity on his and Kyven's corner of the galaxy. I made this when I was new to Warhammer 40k and I'm still pretty proud of it. I can't believe I actually forgot about this for 3 years. My favorite part of it is that Angron and Kyven too were worshipped as gods by the people of their corner of the galaxy but unlike the Emperor, Angron just accepted their devotion but mostly ignored it not aware that it has slowly been strengthen him and Ophiuchus Kyven.

[@gwilym1991]

This is a cool concept, really surprised the Sanguinius ended up falling to Nurgle, my money would have always been on Russ as according to TTS Magnus Nurgle is technically nature incarnate and come on Blood Angels falling to the Blood God isn't exactly subtle.

[@Falcon2501]

Same here, canon Khorne also wanted Sangui to be his champion if I recalled correctly.

[@FoxHound-ut1hu]

Honestly Slannesh is more likely for Russ.

[@Salted_Fysh]

Besides, Russ and his legion are dirty mongrels so wallowing in disease and muck fits them.

[@FoxHound-ut1hu]

@@Salted_Fysh haha salty as fuck 😂

[@gwilym1991]

@@FoxHound-ut1hu he's just speaking the truth #Magnusdidnothingwrong! 🤣

[@patrickgarrett6475]

I’d love to see a video about the incident where the creation of the Codex Astartes nearly led to another civil war among the remaining loyalists after the Horus Heresy.

[@anlize3422]

Wait a second, real question: If the webway project was completed, wasn't there a way for the Emperor to get help from the stranded Death Guard via said web way? Same thing with the Thousand Sons, considering that Magnus knew shit was up, he would not leave stuff to chance and would move towards Terra in time for it's defense. It is a awesome story, but I think we have some rough edges do tie here.

[@Salted_Fysh]

I don't think it was completed, it just wasn't breached. But yeah, without the Custodians and the Sisters of Silence having to fight of the Demons and without Malcador and the Big E being preoccupied with keeping the gate closed, I don't think the traitors would have much of a chance to breach the palace.

[@TheWarmachine375]

I hope you will talk about the Roboutian Heresy, Majorkill

[@FenrirKyuubi]

Ya know, honestly never read the PDF, I have however, MANY times, listened to the Theoreticus Heresy done by Remleiz of 40k theory which for the longest time I thought WAS just him doing an audio version of the Dornian Heresy(given Dorn becomes the Arch Traitor in that one too) and I absolutely loved it(as evidenced by the multiple times I've listened to it.) Give it a listen you ever get the chance Major, that aside now I'ma' have to give the original Dornian Heresy a read when I've the time. But yeah give Theoreticus a listen, just as detailed and amazingly played off well. That aside thanks Major now I have ANOTHER reading project for when I finally have time off >.

[@nicolasgodines1129]

Majorkill has bad blood with 40k Theories and tries his best to ignore their existence, so he probably won't read it. But If you like it, no shame in that.

[@TheWarmachine375]

@@nicolasgodines1129 What happened between them?

[@mishimamaster1845]

@@TheWarmachine375 they were both partners irl and 40k theories guy cheated on him basically

[@FenrirKyuubi]

I was unaware of this now I feel bad for the mentioning >.< apologies

[@jirojhasuo2ndgrandcompany745]

@@mishimamaster1845 cheated with who

[@camiloquinones7113]

Thank you for asking what your fans wanted to see and following through. You're a legend!

[@simonfuchs558]

I personally love the Word Bearers Arc of the Dornian Heresy. I would also love a Fanfic in which canon lore and Dornian Heresy overlap with 18 loyalist Primarchs vs. 18 heretical Primarchs such that each loyalist primarch had to face his evil version. I think this Gould result in some awesome stories…

[@D1str1ct]

The Lion, honestly, always the bridesmaid, never the bride. Maybe one day in someones canon he will be war master and conquer the galaxy. I would be really interested in Cyphers role though, since he always seems to have the Lions back as well as saving a certain Primarch.

[@reikowallach2465]

One fan theory that's kinda lame but interesting is that Big E is Groundhog Day-ing. He's pressed for time on how to squeeze The Great Crusade, The Webway, and avoiding rebellion in within the timeframe of The Eye of Terror opening and it getting too powerful, but he runs through all the scenarios, knowing he'll have to sacrifice many of the primarchs when push comes to shove, the question is which ones. In that theory, The Dornian and the Roboutian heresies both actually happen. It adds a dimension to why he's acting so distant and uneager to share his long term plans with anyone. Also, the canon where he's kept on life support on the throne might be the one timeline he can't reset, he didn't see himself getting incapacitated like that. The Chaos Gods love that.

[@starhammer5247]

This is one I've seen around. I like how this went. Especially how the Lion was always loyal, he was just blindsided by Luther as he was previously. All of this is cool, and I'm curious to see it.

[@argeltalthecustodiankiller6552]

Ahah spartan are still weak af

[@starhammer5247]

@@argeltalthecustodiankiller6552 I'm sorry, what? The hell are you talking about?

[@Its_Cannon]

Don’t forget, in this scenario, Horus had beautiful and majestic hair. Horus and Fulgrim would go to the Custodes beauty salon on Terra.

[@octaviolarronda6200]

i definitely would love to see the this primarchs interact with their counterparts, and se how many insults they can throw to themself, or the incredible Lion-Lion interaction "mmh..." "mmh..."

[@shandaniel2999]

It seems not even Dorn is immune to the corruption of baldness

[@saipranavpalla1467]

The imperium better exterminatus planets with bald shaved people

[@TheWarmachine375]

I think Dorn rebelled because Emperor refused to acknowledge Taco Tuesday

[@arpiedra5100]

This feels so refreshing! I had not realised how bored i was listening to the same story with small diferences. This actually feels like something new in 40k, which is rare

[@davidennis9623]

Siggi as Chaos’ champion? Takes place of cannon Abbadon? Would be absolutely *legend* and give a whole new meaning to black crusades.

[@saberpendragon271]

There won't be 13 black crusades

[@ssc4649]

Dude i JUST saw you answer that comment on the other video about the dornian heresy and here it is. Bloody legend.

[@arcaneswitchblade6976]

I kinda also do a reverse roles fanfiction in my head, I named it the Sanguine Heresy, based off on how there are pairs of loyalist-traitor primarks, and since Horus, the arch-heretic is paired with Sanguinius, it's only fair if he gets the role as the head of the heresy, even if it wouldn't make as much sense than for example, Dorn of G-man.

[@ttv_swincher8004]

I love your channel and you’ve been the biggest reason I’ve got into warhammer 40k

[@GuileastosGui]

Started reading the pdf, must say... I wish Baldermort would do a audio book on this. I am already doing his voice in my head.

[@notnubilous3804]

I still think my favorite is the Lionel Heresy. Mostly for that one piece of art that has Erebus with his arms and legs cut off and chained to the staff of Lorgar, perpetually engulfed in holy fire for his attempted betrayal. Metal as fuck.

[@merlinmeurer5339]

Would sure love to see the Rowboat Guiletteman Heresy next.

[@ef2833]

This was amazing! Im excited to here about different heresies

[@blueeyeswhitemoron4488]

Making the black legion into the black templars is pretty genius imo.

[@Mugthraka]

The Dornian Heresy was a community work done by the Bolter&chainswords forums back in the late 2000's Each entries for each legion was redacted and presented in the style of the Chapter Approved articles about the various Legions and Chapters from the early 2k's and 3rd/4th Ed era. These where also supplemented by Illustrations from the site most talented members(that you can see in the vid and find in the pdf) and even Models and paint schemes.

[@pedrobastos8132]

Pretty cool ideas, especially how the ultramarines and the dark angels were treated, but on the other hand I didn't like Salamanders and Blood Angels ended up, felt kinda weak, really. IMO, the Blood Angels should be the ones to turn to Khorne. See, maybe the Emperor found out about that the Blood Angels had their, ahem, "defects", and Sanguinius, fearing that him and his sons would end up like the lost primarchs, ran away from the crusade, maybe ending up in the eye of terror (almost like Lorgar did) and then fully embracing their rage in Khorne's name. Although I really like Vulkan's deformed appearance making him kinda hated by everyone else, I think that the author reaaaally missed the opportunity to make the Salamanders the Nurgle legion: they are ugly, they are hated, they are resilient, and deep down they just wanted to be hugged, right? So, who else, if not Papa Nurgle, would embrace them? Right???? As a bonus, I would go out of the way and say, fuck it, let the Space Wolves be the Tzeentch legion: say they were tired of being the Emperor's lapdogs and, you know, wanted the *change* (you see what I did there?) things up and become their own bosses and finally, finally get to beat up the Thousand Sons on their own. Dorn wouldn't even try to convert them, he would just look at this slighty different Burning of Prospero and think "well, thanks I guess 👍", that would also explain how Magnus wouldn't get in the Golden Throne too, as a loyal Magnus wouldn't be able to ask for Tzeentch's help when Russ was about to kill him. Later on, as the space wolves become some sort of early Red Corsairs and hide themselves in the Eye of Terror (or the Maelstrom, I don't know), Tzeentch gets to mutate them like crazy, think of something like a chaosy curse of the Wulfen, and then Leman Russ would try something dumb and end up getting lost in Tzeentch's labyrinth for the rest of the timelime while his sons keep becoming weird half bird half werewolf monsters and tearing up anyone that gets on their way. Kinda of a crazy idea I guess, but it would somewhat fit in with the Tzeentch vibe of tricking people into submission. EDIT: I could also see Lorgar involved in the Age of Apostasy a few millennia down the line, and also, what happened to Malcador? Are there Grey Knights in this version of the universe? If the Iron Hands get to mess with the Void Dragon, do they make the Necrons wake up a few millennia earlier?

[@redeye4516]

Something I found interesting with the DH Sanguinius is that he was taken in by the flesh-eating mutants rather than the pure humans, which is something that influenced Sanguinius as he saw himself more clearly as he was: a mutant. I think even in canon he mentions that he was so far removed from the human form because he was a hexapod (two arms, two legs, two wings, six limbs total). Another thing with the Blood Angels is that these mutants on Baal Secundus ended up becoming Astartes instead of the pure humans, who Sanguinius had wiped out. In Magnus's case, he ended up discovering Chaos before the Emperor told him, and realized their nature before they could trick him. At Nikea, rather than openly arguing for the use of sorcery, Magnus was quiet and when called on suggested to the Emperor that he and his legion become soulbound to the Emperor, rendering them immune to Chaos corruption but physically blind. However, they use specialized sensors in their armor as well as psychic powers to see for them, giving them greater visibility overall, and their loyalist appearance features somewhat uncanny eyeless helmets.

[@Zickoly]

If Magnus stays loyal and does not fuck up the Empeirs webway project, then there would be no demon invasion to hold of. So why would the Emperor in this scenario not just leave his throne room and obliterate the traitors during the seige of Terra? Surley he is powerful enough to do so.

[@asd3601]

because... reasons

[@TheWarmachine375]

@@asd3601 Emperor cannot believe Rogal Dorn would rebel all because He refused to acknowledge Taco Tuesday

[@frankdecron1306]

Dorn realizes the threat and sends Russ to destroy the Thousand Sons, who are caught off guard and Mangus is killed saving his sons

[@asd3601]

@@TheWarmachine375 Its Taco Thursdays

[@Izy5981]

@@frankdecron1306 no Magnus doesn't die. However the reason is stupid for why the emporer won't and it's his pride, he doest wanna leave terra when he fought so hard to unify it and let it fall to dorn. Personally I think it would be cool to see him wreck shit up but ya j

[@AdeptKing]

I like that after the heresy, Guilliman tried to mend things with the Imperium since he found out that Dorn tricked him. Of course he and his legion got stabbed in the back so Ultramar decided to just hate both sides.

[@DeadWeightNeroForte]

Idk, somehow that looks like hardcore chaos fans got tired of telling everybody that chaos is the only way and wrote this. Of course it would be nice to fix the story of some primarchs, such as in Angron's case. But still, loyalist were written as dudes who will not fall into chaos. Is it bad, that GW makes that accent on the loyalists? Yes. But Warhammer already taught me to improvise, adapt and overcome.

[@Badchi]

I remember reading a small outtake where Dorn talks to the dark gods through his pain glove, the dark gods wanted and probably could turn Perturabo to their side, but Dorn said: it's either him or me.

[@Butter_Warrior99]

MAJORKILL LIVES! STOMP STOMP!

[@Sackofballs101]

I absoloutely adore this, it's so well worked out

[@captainvalourous6668]

BY THE EMPEROR I'VE BEEN WAITING THIS! 😭

[@kirkdyteo993]

SAME HERE BROTHER!

[@TheWarmachine375]

ME TOO!

[@tomyrody4412]

".......Fuck you father, I won't do what you tell me." - Rogal Dorn, Heresing

[@forpetessake8123]

I feel like the blood angels turning to knorne makes more sense …

[@DarrinSK]

I gotta say I always thought the iron hands were kind of boring. But this xeno traitor origin vs just chaos taint traitor twist version of them is insanely cool and interesting

[@varangiangaming7178]

I love the fact that the alpha legion spends their time here memeing on rowboat.

[@FrozenPyro06]

I feel like a nurgle corrupted sanguinius would be more headstrong and wanting to charge straight into the enemy because he would be super hard to kill, letting Perty set up an elaborate trap to get the upper hand instead of getting dead

[@edpistemic]

The most massive difference would be the completed web way! I can't believe you didn't talk about that more... or does the PDF suggest it wasn't t finished when Emps became a spectral vegetable and no one else was capable of doing it? What about Magnus?

[@jirojhasuo2ndgrandcompany745]

If i remember correctly Magnus entered the webway post heresy, came out less and less from it as time goes on then basically disappeared, never to be seen again.

[@FoxyGrandmeowmmy5598]

The dornian heresy in a nutshell "I was something beyond furious"

[@michaelwilkinson7957]

Can you imagine Sangy and the blood angels with the warp power boost. Wouldn’t like to face down that fight! I’m calling an outright loss, a clean sweep if the loyalist and traitor primarchs were reversed. There again, the sway of the Mechanicum might not have gone as smoothly without Horus and his persuasive voodoo!

[@blueline4857]

I'd like to see a story where the Heresy was entirely averted and the Imperium kept itself stable. Seeing all the Primarchs at least trying to get along, even if they have frequent arguments and feuds, would be super cool.

[@Kareszkoma]

I'm just at the start of the video. But if Sanguinius and Dorn would've been with the traitors, it would've been the end from the beginning. Not just because most would take their side, but because they were very good in combat. If Lion or the Khan would join to that, topped with Leman, it wouldn't be a fair fight. It would be a massacre. But I'm still very interested in the video. It just seems to be very far from fair.

[@dumpanimator]

I love the idea konrad just bassicaly realize he can change future on his favor Make him probably most dangerous loyalist

[@McCool117]

I would love to see what the Dornian Heresy models would look like.

[@Ma6ku6ta6]

I love how the Blood Ravens got the Rubric treatment in this

[@feroexe7965]

Imagine TTS but were going with the Dornian Heresy Like how would that work

[@rustkarl]

Taco Tuesday

[@catfoy8888]

Guilliman would probably be the magnus of the show given he was tricked into helping dorn and he's already there on terra

[@collinmanning8334]

Hearing no one wanted to give Vulcan a hug hurt me more than I thought it would

[@landonmel3070]

Never clicked so fast in my life

[@trentdickerson2149]

Fuckin same

[@TheWarmachine375]

Me too

[@warcat7156]

Same!!

[@zeroalpha9713]

Same

[@ajspin2642]

I enjoyed this very much. It is very interesting to see the "what ifs" of warhammer 40k