The Industry w/

[@theamulas]

Watching JP try to hold this show together, like a man trying to stop the tide with his hands.

[@ElyonDominus]

Just want to echo what others are saying (engagement go brrr) and say that it was so great to Rami back on the show! It's always a pleasure seeing Jesse Cox on as well. Really enjoyed this line up and episode.

[@bagofseat]

Caught this live; It was such a treat to hear Rami talk about the industry and I always love it when Jesse is on.

[@LadCarmichael]

That one was one of the greatest, such a great chemistry between everyone!

[@PostTimeskipSamLive]

What a killer podcast, this was incredible

[@tangentkatz]

This episode was amazing. Gotta love the balance of dread and comedy mixed together

[@WK-gx2zs]

The Rami bump makes you feel fulfilled. The Cox bump makes you feel fully filled

[@jcat96]

Jesse AND Rami! This is gonna be spicy, i'll make the popcorn 🍿

[@arthurchen6464]

Wait, you put spice on your popcorn? Interesting.

[@bigdaddy4240]

@@arthurchen6464 remind me to tell you my habanero-popcorn story, sometime.

[@gzzuss]

Now, I have to watch Jupiter ascending 😅

[@bittiapina]

This was such a treat to watch live. Rami is always such a joy to listen to, brings so much dev knowledge and Jesse is just a hoot. One of the best Dropped Frames I've seen in a while. When Zeke asked to be made small for the icon, I fucking cackled. Classic Zeke shenanigans. All in all a really good way to end the week watching the show. Also, could not finish Rebel Moon part 2, it was just too horrible. Lasted like half an hour and peace'd out. It wasn't even like the kind of bad that was funny like Jupiter Ascending, it was just bad. So definitely agree with Jesse on that.

[@kephalai]

hell yeah always a good time to have Rami, especially when the industry is burning

[@thexorus]

Absolutely love those Rami episodes!

[@gmartins0]

Hope you go again to dodgin'cox podcast. Just the greatest de-railer when you're not hosting.

[@Wirenfeldt1990]

This show was fucking unhinged.. I love it.. More of this please..

[@Equalitro]

this is prolly the best episode of frams and geekends in last few months

[@ausoleil8269]

A lot of thought provoking conversations. Thank you, great podcast.

[@ShioriTora]

Awesome episode! Wouldn't mind having these four combo more often.

[@alimaty]

When I started watching this Podcast today, what I did not expect was an intensive intraction between Jessie and Rami LUL

[@odintdk4489]

Best episode ever? Rami and Jessie are fucking legends as always! And holy fuck Zeke LMFAO!

[@KagedWhizDumb]

2:23:00 Classic Zeke 😂

[@Justin-ee1mv]

Let’s go June events are coming up

[@Deadran]

Definitely the best DF episode this year

[@MrOmarkhaledbadr1]

Really enjoyed the conversations this week! Also my stupid brain, was really entertained by the silly green screen gags. So funny every time.

[@Juhz0r]

Found the AI talk entertaining. The comparison to the Industrial Revolution is interesting, because while it's true that it was a time of technological advancement, it was also a time of restructuring society. Jesse gestured at this by bringing up lack of regulations, child labor and pollution. Broadly it was a shift from artisans and skilled laborers working in workshops on their own or with apprentices, to low skilled workers operating machines in factories. Skilled laborers were muscled out of the business, because the factories had a higher output, even if the quality of the product was overall inferior. Many of them either had to quit or turn their workshops into factories themselves. Because the workers operating machines in these factories were low skilled, they could be replaced easily, and therefore didn't have many rights as workers. It was a miserable state of affairs. The advent of generative AI is obviously different in many ways to the development of cotton-spinning machinery, but I think some similarities can be drawn. It's not just a technological change, it can also restructure society in ways. If it really takes off with media products to the point where companies are downsizing their teams to just few people who run generative AI to create products, it will cause massive waves in how we view and consume media products. What happens when a team of just a few people can produce dozens of AAA-tier games every year and put them up for sale? What happens when content can be generated so effortlessly? Will we care about it? What will that do to gaming as a market? When anyone can input an idea into a generative AI and receive a finished game, won't it just become meaningless noise? I think this would radically change the way we view art.

[@revlarmilion9574]

I think it's the kind of thing that we won't know how it will go until it happens. The personal anecdote I come back to in this particular sphere is Skyrim. There are people out there who really attribute the game to Todd Howard, who watched him hype the game before it came out and associate it very closely with his person. I was not like that. I didn't know anything about Bethesda save for a couple hours of Oblivion I'd played on a friend's computer years earlier. When I play Skyrim, I don't really see human artistry. Sure, I see that it's a videogame, and I see artifacts of it being a videogame like bad physics, bugs, AI that has no clue, etc, but will we really care that much about the provenance of "Skyrim 2.0" if it comes from an AI? I think we'll just play the game and get whatever experience comes out of that. I played Incredible Fishing in my teens, but I had no idea who Rami was nor was I interested to find out. I just thought his game was neat without making any connection to the human who coded it. Videogames, even the simple ones, are too complex and experiential to really attribute to someone. My playthrough of X might be entirely different from someone else's simply because of what moment I chose to get up to get myself a glass of water.

[@SabreRunner]

01:52:06 Ford said, when he started making cars, if you asked people how to improve transportation, they would've said 'faster horses'. I think Jobs said something similar.

[@SabreRunner]

What that list doesn't count are subscription services and free to play games. It's hard to gauge those but Fortnite had 126 mil monthly active players in 2023.

[@travisbruton3356]

Jupiter ascending is the greatest movie and this has been one of the best episodes in a very long time

[@PelleStrandberg]

Rami is always a great guest!

[@SiLeHo]

'Rami' episode is always great episode!

[@gerard7330]

I just watched the Tim Cain video on Horizontal Slices, and now I get to hear Rami talking about it! Hell yeah

[@TheLoneFranger]

What a great podcast. Rami is always a pleasure to have on to pose interesting points and challenge ideas.

[@matthewmacomber6278]

Genuinely a knockout episode this week. Well done. Almost died laughing. 🤣

[@zephron28]

I think it would be interesting to have a dropped frames with Rami and PirateSoftware discussing their takes on the industry. I bet they would not agree on everything and have a good discourse.

[@aimlis]

This episode made me happy - thank you all :)

[@rythiancross]

Im calling it cohh is going to do dawntrail media tour stuff on his vacation.

[@bearstargirl]

My dream cast for the show!

[@a3-radio]

This was a great episode, then Jupiter ascending entered the conversation and it became the best episode

[@Rhaenday]

Jesse and Rami - always great!

[@ZaurTheVikingSlayer]

i love Dropped Frames

[@kaladinstormblessed9626]

I am 2 hours and 11mins in and this is definitely the best ep of a podcast ive ever watched.

[@kurtwells711]

Rami hit the nail on the head with his talk about the industry. If growth was 10% last year and 5% this year, they say it's a 50% decrease, which is technically true but overlooks the fact that they still made 5% more money than the year before. 100% with Rami, absolutely disguting.

[@BlueSapphyre]

But as an investor, you see growth slowing, so you jump ship to another industry or company that's continuing accelerated growth.

[@Barbabonbon]

rami F&?% I LOVE YOU MAN. What a great way to explain things

[@NexusNoxCS]

Caught most of this live and what a good show. It's always a blast when Rami is on, but this one was especially so. Hell, even JP was allowed to host properly. You know, without two hundred random interruptions regurgitating unrelated things from chat or restating things JP already has said five minutes prior. I wonder what was different about this show compared to last twenty... Can't quite put my finger on it. Cough-cough. Excuse me, dry throuat. Need to hydrate and all that. Yup.

[@zepo82]

I never noticed Cohh doing this..tbf I normally just audio it so I might have missed it

[@impotenceaura]

​@@zepo82??? That's literally all he does. "interesting point from chat" is a drinking game at this point

[@ElyonDominus]

@@zepo82 It's basically all the guy does on this. I have no ill will against the dude personally, wish him and everyone involved all the best, the whole nine yards! Cohh would be much better served on his own show. The format would fit much better. Now that it's pointed out you'll probably catch the amount of times JP will say something and then Cohh will interrupt the conversation to state what JP said as if it were new information and then everyone chuckles and moves on. Zeke will try to cut in and Cohh will just interrupt or talk over him a lot, as well. Just to note: I'm not projecting or trying to put emotions, thoughts, words, behavior, anything, onto anyone present nor telling anyone, even fellow YT commenters, the very same. I'm just stating what I observe.

[@Guru316]

@@ElyonDominus Yeah I'm a big fan of Cohh but he does frustrate me a bit on here. He's always playing a game while the show is going on and only sort of half listening. JP has called him out on it a couple of times.

[@ElyonDominus]

@@Guru316 He's definitely not as present as I would hope. The dude has great point sometimes even if they are what someone else just said when he wasn't paying attention. I get wanting to do some deep diving but honestly maybe there's too much chat interaction? I don't know, it's not my show and I am not going to backseat produce. As a viewer I find my experience tends to be inhibited by Cohh far more often than I find that he adds to it.

[@synthiandrakon]

The crazy thing about studio closures is that the biggest complaint about stuff like the ps5 is that there just is no games, imagine if xbox instead of spending their money in the most wasteful way possible, they just invested a fuck tonne into smaller game studios, maybe elevate a couple experienced studios to AAA like sony did. They could have won the generation on that alone "by an xbox we have games, lots of them every year" instead xbox fans are clinging desperatley to exclusives because xbox isn't giving the anything additional. the only thing they have is the fact playstation fans don't get their games

[@chalando6124]

guess I have to watch Jupiter ascending now

[@JediB311]

Jupiter Ascending was great, I just feel like it was supposed to be a trilogy smashed into one film.

[@BaronVonHardcharger]

Rami is right about "not trusting computers". Humans will always be in the loop at an off-switch with AI stuff, if only to have someone other than the manufacturer to sue for liability. Jesse speaks truth as well, it was MANY years in history before we regulated technology to some degree and brought things into a semblence of normalcy... That's why all the AI "experts" seem to be calling for regulation BEFORE progressing the tech, which may spare people some of the pain of the transition....

[@chrismcbrinn]

Rami and Jesse. Hell yes

[@ifym__]

2:02:47 Imagine being the poor guy who the AI is trained on. "Yeah so we trained the AI on Joe here, we set the parameters to 1 kick a minute and let it run for 1h, after that we figured out that we need a metal frame to hold Joe up because Joe couldn't get up fast enough after being kicked. After the installation of the frame we got in a fabulous training session with 1 kick a minute for 1h and that seemed like a good pace so we let that run for a week."

[@BartvG88]

I’m just gonna say that this is a great podcast to build lego rivendell to

[@ericscasny9312]

Everybody bitches about my 4th boat til they want their 4th boat

[@thedude7319]

Regarding the money part. Measuring just money doesn't mean a lot. What is that proxy for

[@elliemj21]

Jupiter ascending was the most painful cinema experience of my life. I had never before wanted to walk out of a film until that movie. And I couldn’t. I was trapped in the middle of a row of a packed out cinema begging for this film to end. I felt like I was having the worst and weirdest trip of all time.

[@nostigm]

Just all around great episode !

[@JediB311]

Is the Geekenders Intro available to DL yet? And of Course, I Love DF

[@Makeshift_Housewife]

What an incredible show, holy shit!

[@jepeman]

This was a really good episode.

[@clawhammr666]

Rami AND Jesse? Yes!

[@wumpmeister]

Does this mean we are going to see Rami n Cox podcast also?

[@TjinDeDjen]

Tbf, Starlight Express is pretty good; don't know how it was done in the US, but here in germany they build a theatre with a special stage custom made for roller skating (aka a skate park but as a stage). They do flips and shit while also having banger music performances. So as dumb as a musical about trains sounds, for some reason it actually comes together pretty great.

[@luuxii]

The concept of growth is what baffles me. How can growth be considered to be infinite?

[@_Snarky]

1:53:20 sounds like helldivers that Rami is describing.

[@Rhaenday]

To respond to Zeke's hypothetical. Precisely as Rami started out - why are we putting so much focus on trying to automate away all the creative jobs! Beyond that, the other thing that needs to be said is: while *we* would like to not have to work and get to spend our time on what we want and personal/creative endeavors - the system as is, and the people that benefits the most from it, are *very* against any form of decent living unless you spend your time and energy on the things it/they deem profitable. Edit: Also, it needs to be added to that "if you could push a button instead of doing the stream bit" and the follow-up response -- in the world we live in, the reality would rather be that someone else would be the benefactor of that button press and Zeke would be thrust out to do something else that's not "that" (streaming). Continuing to stream as a hobby would still be very much possible, but it would have to be in addition to something else that pays the bills...

[@Onxanc]

Jupiter Ascending is currently free on KZbin.

[@BoyKiba]

Amazing episode, but damn was it depressing ^^" Also, would love an ep with rami and piratesoftware

[@LcoolG83]

Pls anyone help me ..what's the second game Rami recommended?Thanks.

[@josephhenryreyes8205]

You mean Balatro?

[@SoulRekka]

Balatro, it's on most systems, a rogue-like Poker game, but saying it's Poker doesn't do it justice, it's incredibly addictive

[@minutmed33]

If you mean the games he mentioned at the very end of the show, the second one was "13 Sentinels: Aegis Rim".

[@ElyonDominus]

@@SoulRekka could it be?! Is it a Poker-lite?!

[@SoulRekka]

@@ElyonDominus Eureka, it MUST be!

[@IAMWILL24]

Gold, Fucking Gold!

[@splendifferent]

1:57:00 Rami lays it out for everyone. This is essential. Please listen up!

[@Disthron]

... have none of you played Stelaris?! XD

[@Nosmaclear]

-Every culture eventually lazies (now a verb) itself to insignificance.

[@slanderpop8771]

Square released 6 games in the month of September last year….. small games but that’s too much. They didn’t get much marketing and they cannabalized each other. They need to rein it in. It suck’s people lost their job.

[@DXStriker]

Tiny Zeke is the best

[@gomez9949]

If it's all automated, as in food & products, then just setup a universal basic income. If money even matters by then. If fusion happens, and we get more energy out than in, we could just automate everything and just do what we want for the love of it.

[@ccgear4367]

Phil Spencer is Don Mattrick.

[@Rikent]

2:25:23 what is rami doing to jesse?!

[@VladTheRad]

2:25:00 you're welcome :)

[@synthiandrakon]

The thing about Yasuke, the whole black samurai thing, the outrage feels so forced because like this is like a pretty decently popular historical figure, ubisoft has hardly gone digging and found the most nieche reference, he showed up and people instantly knew who he was

[@Tolredan]

artist here; making the thing is the entire point and the fun. having a machine skip all the fun and give me the result is dogshit. arriving at a result is tthe fun part

[@anakrad.3966]

Just like when you ride a bike, enjoy the journey, not the destination. Efforts make you appreciate makers, but sadly, people only care about the result, like you only watch the ending of a movie.

[@revick2769]

Honest question, I'm not trying to attack you or defend ai, but if it's all about the fun for you, why not just keep drawing? Just don't use the machine, your ability to draw is still there , ai seems to mainly be a issue for those that want to create to sell.

[@iGMAS]

Funniest shit in a long time.

[@Victorgramatron]

Rami is so based

[@bombon9674]

1:19:11 just to correct rami. biggest game of the year is not balatro. not even close. it's a very good game for sure but no where near biggest game of the year. that would go to helldivers 2, which sold 12m copies within 3months

[@reshypoo9447]

1:17:00 - Only people thinking about buying the game, care about the price-tag. Whereas anyone who views porn wants the characters to look more appealing, because like it or not they're going to show up sooner or later.

[@edwardhulse]

Why is the thumbnail for this episode Eddie Redmayne’s character from Jupiter Acending? Furthermore what does that have to do with an episode about the video game industry?

[@ZaurTheVikingSlayer]

watch the episode

[@enlightendbel]

Humans can have bad day. AI can too. Hardware issues, heck, the current solar storms. Still would pick the human.

[@enightc]

best combo is Human with AI assistance, once you remove 1 or the other, you have subpar experiences, by combining both, you get the best of the best.

[@TheEregos]

Reminder with Overwatch, the internet might not be vibing with it at all but the other month it was the 4th most played game so people still are playing it on mass even if they are moaning about it. People never left, some loud people did and the rest just play it so i am very excited for Valve's game. Especially if it was a pet project by Icefrog because he must be passionate about it, Artifact was them so obviously copying the trend at the time quickly.

[@YueShenDian]

Please forget your honor and dignity and write shit code. that just me every day, on production.

[@enlightendbel]

I think I fitst played GTA5 pc on a HD5870

[@BeAwesome31]

Rami is king. That is all

[@nived3211]

There was a purge of sweet babies

[@Mako2401]

If you are low on cash, why not embrace AI for parts of your game? I still don't understand why Owlcat didn't use voice AI for Rogue Trader. There are people who literally didn't get the game because it didn't have voice acting in it. Not to mention that AI creates the voices immediately, so you can change the text and still have it acted.

[@FlexxibleFree]

Holy FUCK! The "greenscreen antics" MURDERED tummy with laughter. That was awesome, guys!

[@yorkick19]

Such a good flow in this one. Everyone really into the conversations!

[@chrislawrence6701]

This might be the best episode of the podcast ever. 🤣

[@SuperPinch]

Will echo a lot of what the others were saying. Everyone was really into the conversations and it was such a treat! Really like when everyone is fully involve!

[@alfredwinchesterjr]

1:07:43 I want to note that the dog knew that JP putting his headphones down meant that he would interact with them and/or was getting up and was otherwise waiting patiently. Dogs are smart dang.

[@kleberson777]

FF7 Rebirth Dropped Frame with ItmeJp, Cohh, Max Dood, Jesse Cox, Strippin, and Rami is going to be awesome

[@ll1l11ll]

Re: Game price. The numbers would work better if you weren't paying CEOs 30 million dollars a year with a 20 million dollar bonus on top of their equity.

[@slanderpop8771]

I know it’s crazy, but not everyone 100% games. I did about 85% of ff7 rebirth and it was awesome. Loved the last few hours especially. Everybody has their preferences. But majority of mini games were fun with some frustrating ones.

[@ProjektElite]

This just felt like 4 friends hanging out. It was so good lol

[@Luciodamus]

Incredible episode. Very thought provoking conversations here, especially in the age of an insane amount of crap reactions from out of touch, uninformed streamers spewing nonsense, thinking they know the industry by simply playing video games. Not expecting this to happen every weekend but I’m very glad for this. Thank you!

[@mathewlau1733]

Former history teacher Jesse Cox coming through with Industrial Revolution FACTS