The Marathon Is Broken

[@davidpadilla6095]

Still miss Kiptum

[@Swim-Instructor-Blake]

Me too

[@littlecatfeet9064]

Same 🇰🇪

[@tonybowen455]

I wonder if we'll never see another runner like him in my lifetime

[@DOUBLEpenetrtion]

U can die and meet kiptum there

[@crendler9912]

We all do

[@parscompacta9241]

There is one important factor left out. In the past, marathon runners were not specialists... they had a 5 - 10yr career on the track, then ran marathons at the end of their peak. Now... you get 19 & 20 yr olds skipping the track career & focusing on marathons only while still in their peak condition... ie specialists. Improvement in performance is to be expected (super shoes or no super shoes).

[@caseysmith544]

Also seeing more who do the 10,000 meter or 5,000/10,000 meter as fast training for the Marathon who just happen to be good enough at the shorter event to win every now and then in recent years as well as strictly Marathon specialists, people in the USA and Sammy Wanjiru helped reset the Marathon specialist trend that was common in the 1970's with some like Bill Rodgers and a few others while some would go the 10,000 meter and Marathon route like Frank Shorter.

[@cronikvialo5463]

Yet Kipchoge and Bekele are still 2nd and 3rd fastest ever, while starting at 30+ yo Kiplimo and kejelcha who are the best half marathon runners are both elite track athletes And than you have runners like kiptum / kandie who are no names on the track I think that it doesnt really matter, what is more relevant is the event's popularity and the technological improvements ( training / nutrition/ shoes / doping... etc)

[@WeebDealer]

this is mentioned in the paper

[@MarkFrankel-b3v]

For this generation of runners, both men and women are near the peak. Sub 2:02 for men and sub 2:15 for women is still rare. In ten or twenty years those times will be very common.

[@caseysmith544]

@@MarkFrankel-b3v Yes what you see for now 2024 is under 2;10 for men and under 2;20 for women is very common among elite runners when in 2000's under 2;15 for men and under 2;25 for women was to be considered in elite times.

[@TheSlowRunnerGuy]

Sub 2 hour official marathon is coming soon I can feel it

[@thedailystride5407]

Calling by 2030 we’ll see a 1:59

[@PulseHex793]

Maybe if Calvin was still alive

[@dennismorlan1683]

Who ?

[@payrysdoscs4903]

Kiptum was the only one that could do it atm

[@Justin-uc8sc]

@@PulseHex793 everyone know Kelvin Kiptum was better than Calvin

[@stefandepizzol237]

you're forgetting another aspect: consuming over 90 grams of carbs per hour in a running race was unthinkable until a few years ago. Today when runners slam 140+ grams per hour they're much further away from emptying their glycogen stores towards the end of the race, can keep their oxidative (fat) metabolism lower (thus use less oxygen at the same pace), their lactate building rates a bit higher and run the whole race at a lactate concentration that's a little bit higher and take advantage of a little bit more anaerobic contribution without bonking. Better shoes, denser competition, more sugar, more spacialists, it all adds up.

[@Cynyr]

The high carb intake isn't limited to just running. All endurance sports seem to be getting on this train. Its not as simple as just eating more, its eating the correct stuff, and training to be able to do it without distress. There is also some noise about baking soda as well.

[@sabiitigilbert]

Uganda is cooking something unprecedented in long distance running, the next 10 years we shall dominate long distance running. In general there has been improvement in training and understanding of the race and that’s why the performances are insane

[@FinTechTrav]

You mean cooking in the lab?💉

[@bikerdude6119]

​@@FinTechTravpeople like you cant stand others doing better, go be miserable elsewhere

[@sabiitigilbert]

@@FinTechTrav cooking on track

[@mubatsievonne4649]

Indeed! Kenyans and Ethiopian s will be sleeping as you dorminate.

[@A-betterMe]

the 4min mile was considered impossible until Roger Banister did it, then the flood gates opened and everyone was doing it, i dont know the time difference between the rest catching up with Roger, i suppose it doesnt matte, but i believe Eliud Kipchoge's sub 2hr marathon has had the same psychological effect

[@lsantilli]

I cannot fathom running a 2:08 and not even being in the money, let alone a podium. This shit is why people dope. It’s horrible but true.

[@homeloanswithMitch]

its not just the improvement in racing. I have used these shoes & the training is improved as well. Less wear and tear during training

[@goated_messi_ronaldo]

isnt wear and tear good to get your legs stronger?

[@patsyohara5870]

Kiptum looked like he'd have been the one to break 2 hours but it seems inevitable that it will happen at some point. Personally, I'll be happy if I manage sub-2:45

[@joebeersmarttraining]

Love the videos. From sprints to marathon you have amazing passion and analysts. The main reason for increasing speeds in the marathon (aside from the 1-2% from super shoes) is the increase in carbohydrate fuelling which increases fuel to run fast plus it reduces the increase in oxygen drift that happens with >45min efforts. Plus the elites ARE loading on nitrate which further reduces oxygen drift over the marathon. Keep the videos coming.

[@farmerguy8579]

Kipchoge is the GOAT. I don’t think anyone will go under 2 hours like he did. I know technically it didnt count in the record books because of the pacer car, but the point is that the body was capable of it and he did it.

[@anklexpress]

I have also read that given the efficiency of the shoes comes as a function of minimizing energy losses with each footfall, i.e. increasing efficiency, that runners who have higher cadences inherently benefit more, and this also means that the longer you are running for, the more time it would save, its not like all men, running between 2h02, and 5h02 only get the same increase of a minute or so, and all women across all finishing times get the same benefit. The idea would be that given you already have an efficient stride and have maximized gains in all other areas, the shoes add a slight benefit for each stride, so that percentage increase in efficiency means that you have greater gains the longer you run for....3% of 2 hours is around 3.5 minutes, but 3% of 3 hours is around 5.5 minutes. women typically take more steps than men to cover the same distance and they take a bit longer to run that distance so they would benefit more from a super shoe. Given a sub 4 minute mile was thought impossible until it happened and now many break sub 4, I think for the men many will break 2h once it happens in a race and that will happen soon. for the women, I think many will also now break 2h10.

[@kenrickhk]

Agreed

[@bridgerborsheim6275]

new kendrick album

[@RiqMoran]

its mediocre and boring except for one song

[@jollymolly2521]

@@RiqMoran We must have heard different albums. 🤣🤣"Stay on stream."

[@iankarcher7832]

You forgot undetectable PEDs

[@bonelessbeef]

Like UFOs?

[@markrskinner]

Better phone WADA

[@michaelm9871]

Anytime you see the big jumps across the board like that, it's usually breakthroughs in doping.

[@rfjohns4452]

​@@michaelm9871 I agree and Africans have the latest drugs and shoes.

[@saljablo2767]

Lol at Ruth’s male pacer casually following her into the 2:09

[@rickbowker]

DRUGS?

[@5kribbles]

which drugs? where can I get them

[@mikenealon4042]

wait until someone installs this shoe technology components into the very marathon road/course itself 💥

[@stank_it8114]

We're definitely going to see a sub-2 marathon at some point, but it's hard to predict exactly when, especially after Kiptum's unexpected passing. I don’t think there’s an obvious 'next best' runner who can easily break the two-hour barrier. Naturally, Kipchoge comes to mind as a strong candidate, but given his recent performances, I’m starting to doubt whether he still has it in him to make it happen.

[@GPatronymic]

Just imagine how much faster the men’s side average would’ve been if Kiptum was still with us 😢

[@PamelaEgan01]

May he rest in peace

[@christiankeil7845]

1%Shoes, 5%Drugs

[@tankeater]

1:15 "there is actually much more going on to the marathon scene than meets the eye."... yah, drugs...

[@TheIrishny]

Theres nothing new about drugs

[@tankeater]

@TheIrishny thanks for telling me you have zero clue about the world of doping. Everything is getting more advanced over time, yet you think the drugs are the same? 😂🤦‍♂️👍

[@TheIrishny]

@@tankeater Oh, please fill us in with the exact science of current drugs being taken vs drugs being taken 10 years ago.

[@tankeater]

@@TheIrishny not how things work in the real world... You think I'm wrong, with NOTHING to back up what you said. All you can ask is for me to tell you what you should already know by putting yourself into this conversation. 🤦‍♂️😉

[@TheIrishny]

@tankeater Youre the one that made the claim. The onus of proof is on you.

[@cwehden]

Why don't you ever talk about doping.. This channel will lose credibility when the exposure comes.

[@huntrichardson]

More prize money attracts more runners with more motivation. Drugs? And the modern shoes create less fatigue in training and racing

[@caseysmith544]

Training and Racing is the part the average runner forgets about elite runners becuse Max cushion Super Trainers are not the it thing when talking about elites in running unlike the Super Racers. Lighter Super Trainers are however the it thing for recreational runners to save money only needing one model who often buy models that would conform to World Athletics rules on foam height.

[@jeremysites4907]

Great video!…. Love all the data & stats

[@Quidou1]

There’s so much emphasis on the shoes (for a good reason) but I would be interested in a deep dive on the development of both sports nutrition and training with more data through better technology, I could see how they also have had impact on this improved performance 🙂

[@peterthanasse1321]

Super Shoes might give a 1min 30s edge to the fastest racers, but it doesn't account for the drops of massive times for both men and women racers. This is where probably the biggest technological factors comes into account: FOAM and CUSHIONING. The new foams permit racers to train longer and more aggressively. How? It lets them RECOVER far faster than they used to and saves their legs when they train. This means that runners can do much higher mileage more often, resulting in better endurance and speed. With less fatigue also comes more time for Strength training. Couple that with nutrition (on and off course) and all those factors create an environment for speed and progression.

[@hectorhector737]

its the super shoes, kool aid and pacers(drafting) giving them the edge.

[@emenem6131]

It’s hard for me to comprehend running that fast for 2 hours ❤ It’s all about what we humans believe can be done. I remember being so excited about a pair of Jordan’s when I was 17 that I actually pushed down a two handed dunk after months of trying I was convinced it was the shoes but once I knew I could do it I could have bought a pair of shoes from Walmart by the time I was 19 and it made no difference. 🤣 but I was never a high flyer. I’m just saying the shoes help but once you believe you can hit your goals you start hitting your goals more often.

[@sergiogomes8035]

Revolutionary shoes = Revolutionary running times.

[@Thoth19]

SUPER SHOES ERA!!!!😊

[@kabby29]

Kiptum's death is one of the biggest losses to the sport of running ever. Truly a legend.

[@KevinLynch1717]

I can think of another reason times are getting so fast

[@miguelalonsoperez5609]

Linear regression show statistical correlation but not causality. Only a longitudinal randomized experiment can, not necessary on elite athletes but recommend.

[@eduardomorenovidorreta1314]

Fueling leading to wider glycogen availability across 120-125 minutes is key, 30k wall is long forgotten at these levels.

[@franciscojavierbernal6861]

All about cyclic dextrin carbohydrate drinks now. They get absorbed much faster. I can't believe the video doesn't make any reference to the fueling revolution

[@JDP-88]

Cannot discount how shoe technology has enabled more and better training

[@Brenton1000]

I'm curious if there has been any investigation into the new female world record. I don't know shit, however, I was watching a podcast just after it was broken and they were talking about some pretty "unusual" occurrences with that record.. Her splits, her improvements etc. Innocent* until proven otherwise but would be interested to hear if she's been looked into as under 2:10 for a female is borderline superhuman 💪

[@pants1359]

Gulity until proven otherwise is crazy.

[@carterhyde908]

Guilty until proven innocent is a disastrous ideology my guy. Her record is sitting under doubt as to whether its a true human accomplishment for her, but whether its possible at all is an entirely different set of circumstances.

[@Brenton1000]

@@carterhyde908 actually meant to write "innocent* until proven guilty/othwise" 🤣

[@Brenton1000]

@@pants1359 100%!... I meant to write "innocent until proven guilty" 🤣

[@bradleycarson6619]

Maybe someone has said it already but, I predict that the people who will break the barriers you presented both for me and for women are alive now and probably even ran today.

[@paxundpeace9970]

Just to put it in to context sub 2:10 times have been run about 4500 times in the Marathon.

[@andrejensen7837]

Doping ?

[@daveyork0]

The womens record beats ALL the men up to the year of 1967. When it's the 10000m, that's as far back as 1939. For the mile it's 1933. And for the 100m it's 1921

[@caseysmith544]

The average elite top 10 times on both men & women really went down in 2018 when you see the lightweight almost racing weight Super Trainers come into play as well and not just a Super Race Shoe made for racing only/mainly. The Reason besides finding the exact numbers in seeing these times go down even more and not just a genetic lottery from a few who can wear more durable Super Race Shoe models for some training as well as racing is becuse of the shoes for training as well as the racing pairs that are now both saving the legs from wear.

[@realDougSheppard]

The women have the advantage - they can hire male pacers who can run 2:05-2:10 for the WHOLE marathon. Men's pacers struggle after 20K. I'm not saying the men can't break 2 hours, but they will have to figure out a pacing strategy without pacers.

[@K.huang7]

Super shoes and kipchoge made more people start running. More people running leads to more people running faster times.

[@jimmybondy9450]

Up to not long ago marathon was something mostly aged track runners did. Heck, up to about 2003 there wasn't even a official, ratified world record time.

[@edwarding4355]

I think an Olympic year is a drag on times.

[@123linko17]

What a run

[@darrinkinney2268]

extend this to show the splits for the 5k, 10k, half and full marathons. Much better to see whats happening in context to the other distances. Or the context that people crushing the marathon are 5k runners? Or, the much wider context of amateurs - with the BQ times

[@JustRookieRoblox]

didn't kipchoge do a sub-2 hour in the vienna marathon in 2019?

[@crosslink1493]

He did the sub-2 at an almost level auto racetrack in Italy with a rotating group of pacers helping him out, but no other competitors, so it was disallowed. Kind of makes you wonder if the recently set women's record of 2:09 should be allowed since Ruth Chepngetich had male pacers running with her until about the last 400m.

[@paxundpeace9970]

​@crosslink1493 Conditions were legal for her world records. It is just not the womens only because most races are started together. Olympic marathon race was women only.

[@dyvel]

How does the development of performance enhancing drugs look like in the last decade? And how does marathon runners' strength regiments look like in the last decade compared to 20 years ago?

[@jackhargreaves1911]

Plus 10 minutes for the shoes…

[@RonnyC98]

I'd much rather run in super shoes all the time like adios pro 3. Durable and not too aggressive for more relaxed mileage.

[@TheTrailRabbit]

really don't think we'll see either marathon record move again for a long time

[@leonchristensen1765]

Everything he just showed us says it most likely will. The only way it won't is if someone comes out and busts everyone for drug use, or bans super shoes. Like the swimming suits.

[@bharatdahya776]

Drug cheating, or doping maybe?

[@pahtar7189]

The number of under 2:08 (or whatever) performances there were isn't really the issue as one runner could alter the number a lot by participating in more races in a single year. More important is the number of runners who have exceeded the goal.

[@andybjorkelo8496]

Hi, I co-authored one of the relevant papers. Each runner was only allowed one entry in our data set; if the same runner ran sub-2:08 in the same year, we only counted the faster of the two times for the runner. This was to avoid this scenario of bloating the dataset and get a true picture on the number of runners going sub 2:08, not just the total number of instances in a year of the time occurring.

[@pahtar7189]

@@andybjorkelo8496: Excellent! Thanks for the clarification.

[@mikemowett7401]

Excellent statistics

[@alphahellhound]

You mentioned the number of performances, but it wasn't clear whether each performance represented a unique athlete or multiple performances by the same athlete. Given the switch from extremely minimal midsole shoes to the maximalist carbon-plated super-foam shoes, I can imagine athletes take less physical damage from running a marathon now than they used to before the super shoes. This would result in for example, someone like Kipchoge running 3 marathons a year instead of 2, leading to more "performances" that are fast simply because the fast athletes can do more runs with less risk of getting injured. Not saying the shoes don't also boost running economy and lead to improved times because obviously they do, but I think not factoring in the shoes effect on risk of injury would be excluding a critical benefit of these shoes.

[@andybjorkelo8496]

Hi, I co authored one of the papers. Each runner was allowed one entry per year to avoid data bloat; if a runner ran two times under 2:08, we only tracked the faster of the two times. This means were seeing 23.5 new, unique runners run sub-2:08 each year, not just the total number of instances occurring.

[@alphahellhound]

@@andybjorkelo8496 fair enough, and thanks for the explanation.

[@geoffwhite3664]

Maybe you are being disingenuous or maybe just being dumb, but you talk about scientific knowledge and super shoes, yet you ignore the only factor that matters: prize money. The World Marathon Majors (WMM) (known for sponsorship reasons as the Abbott World Marathon Majors) is a championship-style competition for marathon runners that started in 2006. Just map the prize money offered since 2006 onto your graph of the increase of numbers of sub-2:08 runners and forget all these red herrings of shoes and research. The truth is in the incentives.

[@emanuelsantos5585]

Chicago and Nike have 2 WR

[@duncanharvey2209]

Anyone want to guess when super shoes started?😅

[@michaelsamuels5599]

1968, mexico olympics.

[@squashduos1258]

And I posit very few would have broken 2:04 had they run in in non carbon plated shoes….perhaps one or two runners…

[@tomorrowmanable]

Do you every cover any XC running?

[@greg4318]

Doping is a key factor…………

[@Me-lj1rk]

Have you seen an analysis of age group records? Does this coincide with the elite?

[@WoolWhichReds]

What exactly do you mean by “ they broke the marathon again”

[@o_0malik]

Drugs and more drugs.

[@Williamottelucas]

No mention of the elephant in the room?

[@duaneahlquist4061]

Cool!

[@sylviohache3467]

Your title often confuses me. Good video about shoes.

[@garycarter2362]

I say this with love! II no with out a doubt that everything we see is influenced by something Unseen! Over in Africa 🌍 they ether serve Jesus or the Demonic! The devil will give you short term success, power and wealth but the cost is separation from God for eternity! Jesus will give you everlasting life, peace, joy and power to overcome darkness! Alot of these athletes are asking for help from the enemy! I love track and field and have seen the good the bad and the ugly! I pray that these athletes call out to Jesus for everlasting life! God bless ❤

[@Righteous210]

Tell them to do biblical commands also. Need both.

[@joelmacinnes2391]

7:00 listen to what you're saying, Kiptum, Kipchoge, Bekele are all either gone or finished, these guys were freak talents - we won't see a mens world record for at least 20 years and I think I'm being generous

[@josedelnegro46]

The best thing that will happen in track and field, athletics is when a participant in any given event, and I hope all of them, reach the theoretical minimum or maximum of any given event. I refuse to acknowledge any such thing as a world record. But to the majority of you and most tragically to the promoters only what you judge to be a world record is a worthy effort. I do not demand in any other sport or endeavor in life that a living man beat the hell out of a dead man. The NBA has changed her rules so often and the GOAT debate is so loud, rude, and full of ignorance that people have stopped watching the sport. Please do not turn athletics into tribes watching endless reruns of Usaine Bolt. I hope the theoretical minimum and maximum all are reached before I hit enter. The Baskeballafication of all sports has to stop. All of you can help. Anything that is no a theoretical minimum or maximum is only a personal best period. Nostradamus you understand that more than any of us. From here on out unless you note the theoretical minimum or maximum you are not done. Do not leave your work half done.

[@MainUkraine]

Those drugs are getting better 😂

[@sepg5084]

Haters gonna hate

[@MainUkraine]

@sepg5084 I'm not hating I'm a big fan of Kipchoge and Kiptum was the reason why I watched watched marathons to see him try to run under 2 hours. But I am a cyclist first and in cycling there is a huge doping problem still to this day and running is no different.

[@brentcharlton1065]

Bicarb?

[@rashon420]

It’s about drugs

[@littlecatfeet9064]

2:09:57. I am officially gobsmacked by the female marathoners now. 🇰🇪 🇰🇪🇰🇪🇰🇪🇰🇪

[@oscarenriqueromerocabezas5773]

Creo que debieras relatar estos vídeos en Inglés y en Español para quienes no hablamos Inglés.

[@valapalisok3086]

until microdosing is detected, records will be broken in increased frequency. anyone saying its shoes, diet, better training is delusional.

[@carterhyde908]

Perhaps we are, but personally, having faith that it's true human ability sits better on the conscience than doubt does.

[@cronikvialo5463]

Anyone saying it's one thing when they are multiple factors is an idiot

[@michaelsamuels5599]

1968 !!

[@me-lf4wh]

Hi

[@emma.bridgeforth]

epic

[@sfcablecar]

PEDs

[@JL-yl8gd]

Would kiptum have dropped hot if he was still around? He broke through so hard. Not trying to besmirch the character of a dead man it’s just an astonishing entry into the marathon to set a world record on your second attempt. Was a record holder ever so young

[@josephdirnfeld3593]

Shoes means nothing They are super athletes

[@josedelnegro46]

"Today he who waits to conserve himself for the old fashioned kick at the wire will get kicked into the dust early." Jakob Ingebrigtsen "Do it early. Because you will not be around to do it late." kelvin kiptum. Nostradamus thank you. Both the men and the women are currently under the 1:57 theoretically predicted minimum time. I argued in the forum in the past and I do now also argue that a certain distance beyond the half marathon distance that in theory women have a yet to be realized advantage. So, I refuse to predict who will reach 1:57 first. But soon a woman will run a 1:57. For perspective a 9:58 hundred meters is around.o8 seconds above the theoretical minimum. No one is upset about the 100 metters world record being so close to the minimum time. If a 1:57 is the minimum but it is also the expectation we must assume that over the long run hundreds of runners will run 1:57 or near 1:57. If someone runs a 9:48 or a 1:56 I don't care if it is my beloved deceased mother...investigated! Until then keep running under the current testing protocols. Thanks again Nostradamus for putting expectations into the equation. "All runs are no longer strategic. Today all runs are against the clock". 9.76 Frederick Kerly That is how and why he won the bronze and shoved his teammate over the line on the lean. All heats are wars of attrition and no marathon counts until the theoretical minimum is achieved!

[@colmsheahan6991]

The carbon plate should never had been allowed. A line was drawn. You now can't ever compare times over history. Pity.

[@nathanliu15643]

ist

[@HashBrownDoyler]

super epo