The Rise of Skywalker: You can’t fix stupid (but they will try)

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[@epicfail3167]

At this point, the light side of the force is a pathway to many abilities, some considered to be... unnatural Edit: hey Thor, what's your favorite flavor of chips?

[@013wolfwarrior]

And its soo easy and fast

[@ardendragoon]

Nah. Its all darkside. There was only 2 light side users, Finn and Jake. Rey is a palpatine after all.

[@governwoment8491]

Well yeah... Light = white. As of 2023, white people are evil according to Disney and most of the internet.

[@MojoChrisA]

@@ardendragoon thought this was an adventure time reference and then remembered the misadventures of Jake Skywalker…

[@johannesseyfried7933]

​@@MojoChrisA Adventure Time, with Jake the Jedi and Finn the Human!

[@MolotDET]

In the first year of my carpentry apprenticeship I heard a saying which sums up Star Wars at this point. Once a job is messed up, anything done to make it better makes it worse. Tear it down and start over.

[@eyeheartsushi2212]

Facts

[@infinitespace2520]

And to expand to that, after tearing it down, you analyze what went wrong, come up with a way to fix it, and then start over

[@zachcurtis1283]

Ah, now we know what Project Necromancer really is. Disney trying to keep the Sequels alive

[@GreaterGrievobeast55]

Instead they made a shambling husk of what star wars was to use like a thrall.

[@zachcurtis1283]

@@GreaterGrievobeast55 and think they can convince us it's better than the real stuff.

[@joaopedrorosa6198]

As it should be. We need to give the Sequels a burial. So we can finally move on and have something new. So far, none of the series/books even touched Sequel era. It's a pandora box right there that doesnt let anything new happen. So now we are here stuck with Obi Wan, Boba Fett and Ahsoka series, characters that we already know too much. All they achieve is damage even more the legacy characters instead of creating something. So yeah, fans believing a series about Luke Skywalker is better than something new or in sequel/post sequel Era is part of the problem

[@collegeman1988]

Is that the same as fornicating with a dead corpse?

[@COACHWARBLE]

😂👍👌😎🔥

[@cy9884]

This is the biggest problem with the Disney Trilogy. You can't fix something by pulling more bullshit out of your ass, which is basically what they're doing: Undermining the George Lucas story to try and make the Disney crap look good.

[@dereklopez9060]

And the more they try to fix the sequel trilogy, the worst they get. It's really pathetic. It's like trying to repair a broken glass.

[@achaudhari101]

@@dereklopez9060 Glass can be fixed surprisingly.

[@terryrocks2j]

@@achaudhari101 With the right skilled hands. Sadly Disney doesn't have it.

[@MaxRamos8]

My dad and I are going to watch ROTJ at the theaters this weekend, to remember the CANNON ending of GEORGE LUCAS Star Wars. Mr.Gilroy also counts 😊😊

[@Mgauge]

That's a huge problem. They release stories without caring about the implications and expect to just retcon it all into making sands years later. All it usually results in is making the whole setting worse in a desperate attempt to justify one line or scene added with no forethought.

[@ForgottenHonor0]

"The original writer-director has been fired from the Rey movie." Disney Lucasfilm is off to a banging start, again, I see...

[@chasehedges6775]

😂😂😂😂

[@ignaciomoreno9655]

Nah. I think that it is Situation Normal AFU in Lucasfilm.

[@FTChomp9980]

Kathleen Kennedy:"I love firing people who don't fit my narrative."

[@Dani-kq6qq]

Lindelof was never the director, he was the writer only. And by the ideas he had for the film, i am glad he was fired.

[@Thessalin]

​@@ignaciomoreno9655 We're fine. We're all fine. How are you?

[@GreaseBIizzard]

Personally, at this point my ideal way of fixing the sequels would be to have a new film which starts out with Luke jolting awake in bed, saying, "I just had the worst dream..." and then Mara telling him to go back to sleep. But of course that won't happen, and I wouldn't want modern Lucasfilm touching Mara anyway.

[@tubby1833]

The "All The Jedi" bit is such manipulative writing. They take all the power of the previous Jedi and transplant it into Rey in a shallow attempt to put her on a pedestal she didn't earn. These writers seem to see previous characters as nothing more than tools they can use to elevate their own characters.

[@johantolli372]

Well i mean they did turn Chewie in to a glorified dog, that didnt even inherit the ship he had co-piloted for atleast two decades. Instead he was turned in to Reys personal chauffeur without even an incling of self agency or purpose.

[@markaitkenguitar]

FACTS

[@pilouuuu]

Feminism in a nutshell. Try to obtain all the credit from what patriarchy built without the effort.

[@SuperLuis225]

Why make new interesting characters when you can paint your opinions over a better one and demand people like them or they're sexist?

[@daneg]

@@SuperLuis225 yeah. I don't object to Rey or the actress or her iconography. but her character is really shallow (so was Luke's in the first movie). the problem was...she just kept getting fed really shallow character building. in the end, Jyn Orso is the female protagonist Abrams/Kennedy keep telling us Rey is.

[@gnc623]

This cannot be stressed enough. DO NOT GO SEE THE DAMN MOVIES. NOT ONCE. NOT AT ALL. DON'T EVEN GIVE THEM A CHANCE! THAT IS THE ONLY WAY THIS WILL EVER END!

[@dicksoncider5099]

Truth. It's such a simple concept, if you are a true Star Wars fan you won't buy anything from these clowns

[@Nonamearisto]

Not until Kennedy is gone and her replacement indicates that he's dumping her "sequels" from canon.

[@reidmason2551]

@@dicksoncider5099 You could apply that same argument to any fandom that stubbornly insists on supporting and rewarding companies that repeatedly screw them over. Just recently I saw someone openly admit that they'll support any Superman project WB/DC puts out no matter how much they might complain about it or how bad it might be. That's not a fan, that's a mark. That kind of blind, unthinking loyalty is endemic to all fandoms, not just *Star Wars.*

[@FivesNZ]

Man would love for Kathy to fuck off. She ruin not just my childhood but all of you guys as well. Not seeing any shit from them. I'm with you!

[@HandofOmega]

Well, that aint happening. I doubt there's a single person in this comment section that won't go to see whatever they put out next. Even IF you've given up on it, admit it, you still want to KNOW what's going on so that you can talk with other fans about it! The best you can hope for is that people don't go for repeat viewings...

[@dynosor2011]

The worst thing from my point of view is that they will absolutely include Force Ghost Luke in the movie, and he will say things that will worsen all, maybe he will acknowledge the greatness of Rey or say something in the line of "you will build the best version of the Jedi that I never could".

[@mat3714]

That's absolutely the plan.

[@bigorange2082]

You know it.

[@moffjendob6796]

Honestly, I don't even think they'll have Luke do it. He's not good enough to shower compliments on Rey. It'll be CGI Force Ghost Leia.

[@mat3714]

@@moffjendob6796 That WAS the plan but I'm not sure if they'll go for AI Leia after the last movie debacle....

[@saloz9483]

I can so see them making him say that.

[@Alec11_43]

My favorite part of the novelization is when the heroes are celebrating at the end and they question why Palpatine can’t just somehow return once more(since not only did the movie not explain how he came back, it also gave no definitive reason as to why it can’t happen again). Their response to this uncertainty is basically “oh well, I guess we’ll just have to deal with him again if he does come back”

[@Shifft-This]

What? All the way from episodes 1-6 Palpatine never died. When he died at the end of Return of the Jedi there was no prior indication that the Sith could come back from death. If you're talking about EU stuff then that's a bit of a different story. But within the realm of the 6 original films, nothing indicates Sith can come back to life after they die (though Palps does talk to Anakin about stopping death, but not coming back from it). There was no reason for anyone to think that someone can come back to life in the universe at that point after he died. They couldn't forsee Disney buying the IP and shitting on it's lore.

[@adityanegi1604]

@@Shifft-This he's talking about the Novelization of The Rise Of Skywalker

[@GreaterGrievobeast55]

I feel like that's the writer of the novelizations way of saying "This entire book has been a meager effort to plug up one plot hole after the next, but i'm not even gonna try tackling that. They might throw palps into the very next movie for all I know!"

[@thenot-so-smartfox4145]

No fucking way XD

[@QuestionMan]

All the answers to any of these questions comes right back to that original Yoda quote: "Do or do not. There is no try." Lucasfilm didn't try, deciding instead to "do not."

[@antcatthegamer]

An underated idea I really love from the original Thrawn Trilogy was Ben saying goodbye to Luke at the start of the first novel. It feels like Luke is truly on his own as a Jedi after that struggling with the responsibility of restoring the order for his future niece and nephew, and C'baoth ends up tempting Luke with an easy path to handling that problem. It also really lines up with what we learn about the Jedi in the prequels and expanded universe becoming one with the Force after death and not seeking immortality like the Sith. It made it seem like the whole force ghost lingering after death was an extreme thing for the Jedi to do, a small sacrifice delaying becoming one with the force to pass on some knowledge or training before they could rest themselves. The way it's been handled in Disney Canon is just as a plot device to bring back familiar faces (or voices) as cameos even when it doesn't make sense, like Han and "all the jedi"

[@minecrafter3448]

Actually the only thing they’ve gotten right about force ghosts is Han. His appearance in rise of skywalker was just a memory of Ben. In fact, there’s a good chance the reason they didn’t go with Rey solo was because they couldn’t have Han appear as a force ghost.

[@HandofOmega]

Having the force ghosts not appear in the EU novels was one of the smartest moves they made (tho I would have thought Anakin and Yoda would have lasted longer than Ben, but still...). It shows that they really foresaw the narrative problems that having them around would cause an ongoing story, and nipped that in the bud. Too bad the Disney Era didn't learn any lessons from that...

[@jedimasterdraco6950]

Personally, I've had some notion that there should have been some reason for Force Ghosts not appearing in the EU, and even if there was, if someone was to write it in the modern day, I think Anakin at least should stick around, partially because he might have the best perspective on both his own failings and the failings of the Jedi.

[@oDTRAINo]

I like that alot

[@bleedingstar1011]

I love this point, and I loved Ben telling Luke goodbye for all the reasons you said. I even like in the Legacy comics that Luke's force ghost stays around to help Cade, as in that case, it's his great grandchild and it really feels like the will of the force and very George Lucas that Luke would hang around to help Cade before becoming one with the Force himself. The EU was so much better than Disney's garbage, they're no even comparable.

[@mikeblom8897]

I would have like it more if instead of “and I’m all the Jedi” she just said “I’m rubber and you’re glue you’re dark side power bounces off me and sticks to you” would have made just as much sense

[@jkdbuck7670]

Underrated comment

[@Frosenborg]

I've been watching Star Trek: Picard season 3 and it's Star Trek. Weird how, when you hire a showrunner who understands and respects the IP, you actually get the kind of show the fans like...

[@FumiTheKitten]

Season 3 of Picard was better than Mando season 3. I was surprised how good Picard was. The first two seasons sucked.

[@HandofOmega]

I've been telling people who think the SW fandom are manbabies or whatever, ST: Picard is all that the SW fans wanted to see! Their beloved characters, played by favorite actors, coming together to do their heroic things, reference some classic bits, interact in hopefully emotional ways, and pass on the legacy to a new generation of heroes who proved their worth alongside their mentors! Now, imagine if the Enterprise crew had all been miserable people, who had all failed at life and their careers, don't even share screen time together, and all die right before they can really redeem themselves: THAT'S what SW fans got, so you should understand why they are upset!

[@FumiTheKitten]

@@HandofOmega 1000% facts

[@TDS_MikeMartin]

@@HandofOmega Amen

[@MrDsleepyeyes]

It used to be the body disappeared because the Jedi had become one with the force and sometimes, a jedi could become a force ghost. That explained the end of ep 6 ROTJ, then it became that you needed to train to be a force ghost... okay, so Anakin being the chosen one gave him a pass... then... anyone could be a force ghost and they had more power than you thought? Yeah... I don't know what the effin rules are anymore.

[@mallninja9805]

The rules are easy: Disney can (and will) do whatever the mouse committee decides

[@henrikaugustsson4041]

The rules are what’s in the George Lucas canon, no training needed, become one with the force, die at peace or something. Any Jedi can become a ghost, but not all would, and perhaps a strong connection to the person they appear to would be needed. That’s all. No training, no bullshit.

[@MrDsleepyeyes]

@@henrikaugustsson4041 tell that to disney, I threw up my hands and said, "Well... I'm done." a while back.

[@fusionwing4208]

I can see alternative ways of becoming a force ghost, training perhaps if those jedi still had a darkness in them, thats kinda what yoda's training implied to me. Anakin fulfilling the prophecy I would take as his "training". Thats kind of what I always assumed a force ghost did, they had successfully rid themselves of the darkness within them, which in a sense was their training.

[@erics2954]

@@henrikaugustsson4041 well firstly, the George Lucas canon DOES involve training. But the training isn’t really much of a training in order to build up enough strength to become a for e ghost; it’s more of a series of tests that changes one’s perspective, and allows them to become a force ghost upon death. But i assume that if one already has that perspective on their own, they don’t really need the training to become a force ghost (such as, probably Luke and Leia). I just don’t get what you mean by “George Lucas canon, no training needed.” Like, George Lucas was the one who legit made the whole idea of the “training” to become a force ghost.

[@timboslice9905]

The only thing missing from the end of the Rise of Skywalker was for Chaka Khan, Rey and the rest of the cast to come together in a grand musical number singing “Iiiiiii’m every Jedi….. they live in meeeeeeeeeeee!” 🙄

[@maxhocks2006]

Rey: is descended from a Sith Lord. Shoots lighting accidentally, seeks unlimited power, and is usually angry. Wait why isn’t she a sith again? She keeps doing sith stuff?

[@jaredlocke4300]

Ironically Disney makes it hard to practice Jedi-ism in the real world. REALLY hard to let go of my hate for what they've done 😅

[@henrikaugustsson4041]

The path of the Jedi isn’t supposed to be easy. May the Force be with you.

[@HandofOmega]

If it were easy it wouldn't be worth doing! But you hit on a good point, and it always bothers me when the faction of the fandom that thinks they are defending the legacy of SW the most, do so by embracing behavior that their own heroes would NEVER condone...They act like they never even *heard* of "let go of your hate" or Yoda telling us what Anger leads to...

[@zacariasdelalcazar8873]

Forget the way of the Jedi, there is only one Way.

[@Jedishill680]

@@HandofOmega exactly so many channels act like the Sith and hold on to their hate for Disney content. I try my hardest to not let my dislike like of the sequels poison my excitement for Jedi fallen order, Jedi survivor, takes of the Jedi and Star Wars visions. These pieces of media don’t cease to exist and I can always come back to them when I want to experience some Star Wars

[@jaredlocke4300]

@@henrikaugustsson4041 there is no emotion, there is peace. May the Force be with you 😊

[@newt2942]

This just reminded me why I haven’t watched a Star Wars movie since TROS in December 2019. It’s just too depressing, knowing what happens to Luke et al and that Anakin’s prophecy was inadvertently erased. How TF did they manage to pull that off? I even get a little depressed seeing Luke in the Mandalorian shows. It’s awesome at first, and then sadness sets in.

[@dizehjvegnomis]

"she must have got in on the family pass or something" i'm dying thor 😂

[@GeekNewz]

Well, taking what isn't hers, using weird magic, and wanting UNLIMITED POWER runs in her blood. She is Rey Palpatin after all

[@DemonicRemption]

@GeekNewz Dang it, I just typed a similar comment yet you beat me to the punch four weeks ago. >.

[@mpnuorva]

Luke declaring himself a Jedi is him saying he's not going to do what Sidious demands of him, and at the same time a rallying cry to his father to reassume his lost virtue. That he's going to act like a Jedi, and so should his father. A useful shorthand for his moral victory. TROS tries to do something similar with Rey's moral victory enabling her to facilitate Palpatine's self-destruction, but in her case her moral victory is a literal case of ideological possession crowned by her yelling partisan slogans. The visuals launching a thousand memes about double lightsabers deflecting Force Lightning, and established rules making it seem like she did kill Sidious just like he wanted don't help either.

[@rebelalliance77]

Kathleen Kennedy just wants Rey to be the best ever and she’ll retcon EVERYTHING to see it done.

[@RichRollinRonnie]

“What were all the Jedi up to that day?” That line made me laugh out loud!

[@moogiesboy]

I actually read the duel of the fates script tonight. I find it baffling that anyone could tear that script up and make rise of Skywalker instead.

[@mpnuorva]

So you're fine with an even more blatant breach of lore and a middle finger to Luke and the Jedi at the conclusion just because it's wrapped to gratuitous Legends references?

[@Mgauge]

Duel of the Fates wasn't a good story, but at least it was coherent. Unlike what we ended up with.

[@stryletz]

​@@Mgauge to be fair to RoS, JJ tried to jam 8+ hours of plot into one movie. They could have made it work across multiple movies, maybe, but putting all those story beats into one movie was impossible.

[@moogiesboy]

@BK Beatty no, I wasn't aware of that.

[@moogiesboy]

@Roikka It didn't read like fan fiction though, unlike TROS.

[@rlou4386]

There's a way to fix this. One of Rey's students should be called, I dunno, Jerry Anakin, and he has to destroy Palpatron 2000, a droid containing Sheev'a residual consciousness

[@BladeCrossEXE]

No, Yoda wouldn't say that. But Maul would say "Try try again."

[@GreaterGrievobeast55]

He don't quit!

[@reimannsum9077]

Oh, Jesus. I've never seen the Rise of Skywalker, so that was the first time that I'd heard of, let alone actually witnessed, the delivery of that "And I-" Pant, Pant. Pant. "Am all the Jedi" scene. How did that line make it through the writers' room and that delivery make it past a director. God, Ridley's not even a terrible actress.

[@adamburns8338]

She’s channeling the power of bad writing and planning.

[@Herosadvisor]

I hope we all come out of the Sequels era alive and well

[@marknovak6498]

The force as it was conceived of originally was a power channel. in discussion with Joseph Campbell, it was an Eastern religion-type concept. The Jedi were to channel power not be the source of it. That idea was of particular prominence in the Hier to Empire novels in which the dark side Jedi was literally sucking the life out of a whole planet of humans. i think the writers of the Disney trilogy willfully got it wrong.

[@timidwolf]

Every time I hear something new about the "story" or "lore" of the sequels I'm even more baffled by the stupidity and disrespect Disney and all responsible have for the franchise. It's just another nail in the coffin that's already been buried for me.

[@gamesrock3271]

Best solution I can think of that preserves some semblance of continuity and Anakin's legacy is that Rey being "all the Jedi" was only possible 1) in that specific time and place because of the massive presence of the Force and 2) only because Anakin had brought the Force into balance, so the Light through Rey could match the Dark. In the right hands, it could make for a redemptive reveal in the next movie, but not in the hands of anyone at Disney/Lucasfilm today.

[@1001History]

This is the biggest issue with the sequels. We need to come up with all these explanations to cope through the mess that was their story and try to make it make sense. A series of movies should not require post-movie novels and fan cope theories to collectively fill in all the gaps.

[@Bat_Boy]

Lindoff is EXCELLENT at the long format. And if you are looking for a Star Wars plan, perhaps 5 movies deep…you’d want Lindoff.

[@MaxRamos8]

My dad and I are going to watch ROTJ at the theaters this weekend, to remember the CANNON ending of GEORGE LUCAS Star Wars. Mr.Gilroy also counts 😊😊

[@mickeybunts]

He was fired because he was being reasonable and holding the lore in high regard. Both of these things are unforgivable in the eyes of Darth Kathy

[@cheshirekat8273]

I wish there was a way to know how popular Rey (and other SW characters) actually are. I miss the pre-algorythm time where everyone would get the same poll or be directed to the same websites, so everyone participated in the same poll. Right now, there's no way to really know how popular or unpopular Rey really is, not unless you compiled a ton of stuff.

[@Livelongwforce]

Genuinely one of your best Thor. And I am major impressed that after all these years there are still levels of stupid to be found in ROS 😂. I never even thought about that before. If anyone should be able to channel force ghost, it's freakin' Yoda!

[@bengale9977]

The funny thing about the "I am all the Jedi" power up is that it just came out of nowhere. It would be like in Avatar the last airbender if they never mentioned that the avatar state was a thing and then in the last episode just sprung it upon us. They never even implied that the Jedi could power her up or do anything other that talk to her in the force. She also doesn't do anything to gain the ability to hear them it is just as the plot needs.

[@troopcaptain]

"If at first you don't succeed, try, try again." No, try not! Do or do not, there is no try.

[@jonmurphy4889]

I am all the Jedi line is so cringe😂😂😂 I mean it literally sounds like something a gen z fortniter would come up with in their Star Wars fanfiction... I cannot believe they actually put that in the movie.

[@ridensroom6957]

It is such an obvious rip off of I Am Iron Man too.

[@mateuszsotys3912]

It reminded me of a fanfiction SWTOR villain I created when I was 14. Basically an edgy "Grey" Jedi who after giving a cringe monologue about "light and dark being the same" tries to ascend into an avatar of the force and says with full confidence "I am the Force". I cringe even thinking about it. That guy would be right at home in TRoS. The difference is, ofc, that I was 14 at the time and nobody paid me.

[@Ars_RmCf]

Every time I hear that Yoda quote I think my phone is going off. It is my text buzzer lol.

[@Milothemighty10]

“Every day you do something stupider than you did the day before and I think there is no way he can top that but what do you do? You find a way dammit to top it you are a professional idiot!” -Stanley Hudson the office aka me to anything Kathleen kennedys side of lucasfilm does…

[@josephray459]

I think the only way they could kind of fix it, is if Luke didnt run away, but he was actually training to learn a technique that would help him, Anakin, and Rey win once and for all and establish a new jedi order that doesn't repeat the mistakes of the old one. Again, kind of cheesy, but better than what we've got now

[@Oscar-mh7ez]

Palpatine wanted Rey to kill him and she does exactly what he wanted, shouldn’t she technically be all the Jedi and all the sith now? I’m halfway joking but seriously it could’ve been an interesting twist if she actually became evil at the end of Rise of Skywalker. Then Kylo would have had to kill her or somehow turn her back to the light. Either way it shows they didn’t give the force any consideration when making the sequels just using it as a tool/ superpower than having a deeper mythos to the story.

[@HandofOmega]

Now I want a fan edit where, at the very end, she turns around with a big smile and Sith eyes, Thriller-style, with Palpatine's laughter echoing over the musical sting! lol

[@JerryHazard]

Have to say, I feel it "incomplete" and unfair to critique ROS without giving at least, if not more ire to TLJ - which set the stage for this. Everything in ROS happened because RJ refused to play nice in the sandbox with other people's toys. Any movie following TLJ was going to be a hot mess, especially given the timeframe and the fact that nobody wanted to touch it. And I'm in no way standing up for ROS.

[@erod97]

Agree.

[@Dani-kq6qq]

No, the last jedi did not set the stage for palpatine and the sith returning. TLJ was clearly setting up Kylo to be the final villain, none of that "I'm all the sith" or "I'm all the jedi" horseshit. Chris Terrior's story for TROS makes way more sense and follows TLJ's set up and none of the stuff you are all complaining about. But because you guys threw a fit towards TLJ, JJ gave us nonsense instead.

[@HelloNumber5]

@@Dani-kq6qq Last Jedi is hot garbage. Funny enough, I can rewatch RoS and still think it’s trash (because it is) but TLJ, saw it once in theater and I’ll never watch that garbage again. Just imagining Luke drinking blue milk is enough to gag. What joke. Rian ruined the sequels with his awful interpretation of Luke and ridiculous storyline - JJ didn’t start the ruination but finished it with a nice bow lol. Both movies are trash but Rian’s sw movie is unwatchable. Never watching it.

[@Dani-kq6qq]

@@HelloNumber5 I don't give fvck if you like TLJ or hate it, i am just pointing out the facts, Chris Terrios story for TROS doesnt have any of the things Thor is crying about in his video yet it follows TLJ very closely. So TLJ is not the cause for what you got in TROS, just use logic for once.

[@JerryHazard]

@@Dani-kq6qq I mean that the terrible script and writing of TLJ left nowhere to go for whoever was to write and direct it's follow up. It didn't matter if Kylo was the villain or not, if Snoke had another clone, or whatever you might invent that sounds good to you. Nobody could write a satisfactory third chapter to that mess - or, someone would have. This is Star Wars, funded by Disney. It wasn't like they couldn't pay the right person enough money or something. Look how they got Ron Howard to finish the mess they made of Solo. No, nobody wanted to. So they wrestled JJ back in. He stated publicly after TFA that he didn't want to do another one. TLJ screwed Star Wars so bad, that nobody wanted to work on the final saga film. So that's why we go palps back.

[@MarlonBrando414]

Apparently Lindeloff wanted to write a story set further in the future, away from the sequel trilogy, with an elder Rey as a supporting character, at first lucasfilm agreed but then changed their minds, they wanted the story set closer to the sequel trilogy and have a prime Rey as one of the main characters

[@Paid2Kill73]

It’s just nice to know that after all the Skywalkers went through the palpatine bloodline became literally ALL of the Sith and Jedi

[@oDTRAINo]

Never thought about it that way lol. Palpatine really did achieve unlimited power

[@vgoten1]

Haha, and with that a Palpatine, “brought balance to the force”

[@DrakeBarrow]

Impossible, unfortunately. The idea that Palpatine's long game was to push a Force sensitive to tapping into that battery and literally body hopping into them so he could hack the system and access the amassed strength of all his opponents IN ADDITION to his own sizeable Dark Side strength would be a legit interesting story idea. The late Chadwick Boseman said it best: "We don't do that here."

[@carlosaugustodinizgarcia3526]

I really hated Reylo fandom,but if a reformed Ben Solo lived and with Rey rebuild the Jedi Order ,uniting the Skywalker/Palpatine bloodlone would be better than what we got. It would even explain the Rey Skywalker nonsese .

[@tinybee7780]

Honestly, him misquoting Yoda made me a bit relieved that he was let go by Disney. I probably would have rooted for him if he didn't mentioned Yoda in that last quote (assuming he was serious about what he said, the one that contradicts Yoda's). Thor is right - all of these writers and directors coming here putting "their own spin" on what they think SW should be without showing any understanding of what came before is just bad business. Also, what is Pablo Hidalgo actually doing there in Disney? Wasn't he and his team supposed to keep things in line with the canon? He must have one of the easiest jobs there if he's able to keep his job while at the same time give the go-ahead, leaving the state of this franchise in disarray with all the lore inconsistencies.

[@АлексейМомот-щ7о]

They must have different definition of canon than fans 😂

[@sith7183]

The Thrawn Trilogy is the true StarWars sequels.

[@kendershot]

The more you define something, the more you have to define it. That's one of the major issues with "hard magic" systems like the Force. When something happens outside those specific bounds, either through accident or design, you need to explain why it happened this time and not the last time. In this case, it was incompetence, which makes things even harder. The defined bounds weren't even considered when the exception incident occurred. The Last Jedi did the same thing with hyperspace travel. They added a real countdown clock to get things done, which meant the hyperspace travel time was more or less instantaneous, contradicting how it has been in the past. And the Holdo Manuver.....

[@fusionwing4208]

I always figured the holdo maneuver is a possible action, but the chances they gave in the movie itself are also just as much of an explanation as to why nobody does it, the chances of success are virtually zero. With that said, I agree that it shouldve been someone like leia, leia would make sense actually because she has a connection to the force, the force could have assisted with the maneuver. As for instant travel, yes, hyperspace had always been shown to take time, and hyperspace lanes existed for the sole purpose of shortening that necessary time. You could jump to anywhere with the right coordinates, the problem was your ship was not immune to natural forces, if the jump lead straight through a nebula, star, electromagnetic field, etc. Your ship would impact and be thrown out of hyperspace as a result

[@darthtroller]

Someone told me that TLJ's novelization explained that the Raddus had some experimental shields which allowed the ramming to be so devastating and that smaller ships can't accomplish such feats, idk if it's true but it wouldn't have been too bad of an explanation

[@fusionwing4208]

@@darthtroller that's just them attempting to justify the action working, ramming something via hyperspace is going to cause an insane amount of damage no matter the ships size. Also, nobody would design a shield system with the intent to kamikaze, unless it were terrorists, which the resistance is not.

[@darthtroller]

@Fusion Wing if a small ship advanced towards the Supremacy or even a small Star Destroyer like that, it wouldn't be able to reach lightspeed, it would break apart and bump into the Supremacy, dealing extremely minimal damage, meanwhile a massive ship like the Raddus with its shields was able to have a stronger ability to ram, that ship also wouldn't have been able to reach lightspeed, it rammed and broke before entering hyperspace, the shields weren't designed to ram, they just happened to have a convenient secondary purpose but obviously this purpose is rarely used cuz it rarely has to, the ship is too valuable to be wasted on a kamikaze attack, so when things get desperate and all of the ship's functions have been made useless (such as in the situation we see in TLJ where the First Order is about to destroy the Resistance), the ship is ready for a desperate last resort which is the ram Aside from that I remembered a fanfic suggesting that the reaction to the hyperspace tracker allowed the ram to happen as the collision between the tracker and the speeding object was extremely chaotic and caused a hyperspace anomaly, this would be something that Leia and Holdo would have studied in advance as Leia had enough information to correctly deduce they were tracked through hyperspace, this would eliminate both the future use of a hyperspace tracker (or limit it at least) and future attempts to hyperspace ram big ships (can't be done if they don't have a tracker)

[@thereseemstobeenanerror1219]

The force isn't a "hard magic" system.

[@seanmurphy7011]

“Yoda and I cannot interfere” - Obi-Wan, ESB

[@paulsbourne]

Lindelof wasn’t trying to make a play on Yoda’s “Do or do not. There is no try.”, he was just reversing “try, try again” like how Yoda says things backward. But it is ironic he would mention Yoda in conjunction with that quote lol.

[@Super_Ammo]

4:59 I think the writers were bigger fans of the Last Airbender than star wars lol

[@DarkLordArmanus]

Not to mention that in that confontation Palpatine says he wants her to kill her so he can transfer his essence into her, which we know he can do because otherwise he wouldn't be there, and then she promptly kills him. And then nothing happens. To paraphrase Poe, "somehow, Palpatine died." It's all just complete stupidity.

[@AncestorEmpire1]

I see a lot of Naomi Sunrider in Rey. It could have worked. There’s a J R R Tolkien quote that explains why it fails.

[@vetarlittorf1807]

Wdym? Nomi Sunrider was a decent character.

[@mpnuorva]

Kinda? If one wants their new protagonist going to town on some bad guys with a lightsaber, I think that scene in Tales of the Jedi comic is a pretty good way to do it.

[@mistersparkles1842]

​@@vetarlittorf1807 stronk super saiyan girl jedi

[@jamie1224]

The promotion from Mary Sue to Queen Mary Sue.

[@mandalorian5O1]

In the legends novel The Rise and Fall of Darth Vader the force ghost of Obi-Wan teaches Anakin how to become a force ghost in the last few seconds of his life. Just wanted to add that cause there is a reason (at least in legends) why Anakin was able to become one with the force beyond getting the chosen one pass lol

[@peregrine9745]

Then of course there's the robot chicken-palpatine force ghost. Last second conversion to the light side, woo!

[@koji6745]

To this day I still cant believe fucking ANAKIN wasnt a part of the sequels

[@darthrizzen9349]

What? Rey just used the "Everyone, lend me your energy" ability to gather all the Jedi's powers into herself and defeat Friez... I mean Palpatine with a Spirit Bomb. Abrams and Terrio definitely know squat about Star Wars, but they're up to speed on their DBZ. 🤣 I'm excited to see the upcoming Rey movie where she travels the galaxy in search of the seven Dragon Balls and finally summons the Eternal Force Dragon Shenron!!

[@MaxRamos8]

You forgot that she also met the kid from Yu gi oh to harness the power of the Egyptian Gods

[@1001History]

Rey also secretly has the ten-tailed beast dormant inside her waiting to wake up and defeat another Sidious clone.

[@HandofOmega]

Anakin becoming a force ghost was explained by some short story as being because Obi-Wan (invisible to Luke, for some reason) appeared to him while he was dying and quickly told him how it worked, which he was able to quickly master, still being the Chosen One and all. I guess that works? For me, him being the Chosen One, literally conceived by the Force itself, is enough to justify the normal rules not applying to him. As for Luke and all, I don't see that as a problem at all; he learned it from the Force Ghost Mob we saw at the end of RotJ, and passed it on to Leia. Hell, he may well have taught ALL his students this, tho only Ben was advanced enough to master it...

[@bengale9977]

Personally I never had a problem with Vader being a force ghost and the Jedi council not. Vader was crazy powerful with the force and when he saved Luke he had a complete sense of fulfillment and inner peace. So why wouldn't he be able to manifest himself in the force. The jedi council were not as quite powerful and were stabbed in the back so aren't exactly in a state of Zen like Obi and Yoda were.

[@stephencartledge7067]

I’ve never had less emotion than the Rey emperor fight

[@luchoman91]

Thor Skywalker, I must say that I really enjoy your videos! You are always honest about your opinions and are not afraid to point out negative aspects of the franchise you love. Other Star Wars commentators often refuse to acknowledge these bad aspects, presumably out of the fear that if they don't blindly accept everything Star Wars, then Star Wars will be gone forever. You, on the other hand, openly criticize Star Wars in hopes to help make it the best that it can be! This comment may be a little out of place on this video because it is about the sequel trilogy which is almost unanimously disliked, but I really appreciated your grounded honesty during the runtime of The Mandalorian season 3. A lot of "regular" fans were jaded by that season but lots of online commentators refused to acknowledge that the third season was off in many ways (some even tried to defend the series with strawman arguments like "you are hating on this season because there are no lightsaber duels" - which makes no sense considering how much fans loved the first two seasons and they also lacked lightsaber duels). I originally wanted to comment this on yesterday's video where you discussed your thoughts about Luke Skywalker's presence, or lack thereof, in the Disney-era of Star Wars because I felt you were saying what everyone was thinking but perhaps to afraid to say. Love your videos and I hope your hard work helps put Star Wars back on the right path! May the Force be with you!

[@leightoncressman6188]

I keep thinking that it would’ve made more sense for Ray to be the reincarnation of Anakin Skywalker, and have a mansion where Luke says that Anakin‘s fourth ghost has stopped talking to him, and is essentially missing him, and then mentioned that that happened right around the time when Ray was born.

[@geddyflea6645]

I think the idea of Rey absorbing all the powers of all the Jedi is a typical Disney “gotta 1-up on Lucas “ move, and a stupid one. On the other hand, my only interest in watching another Rey adventure is if palpatine did achieve his goal and possesses Rey, turning her into an Abeloth type entity; I’m really bummed about that “Legend” not being adapted

[@ThanksHermione]

I predict more trouble with the new films from a vocal minority of people who wanted Rey and Ben to live happily ever after as a couple. After ROS, they harassed the people involved with the film. Some went after the partners of Daisey Ridley and Adam Driver, hoping the actors would pair-off in real life. Again, not everybody who wanted the couple did this.

[@moffjendob6796]

"When Rey hears the voices of the dead Jedi"... Tut tut tut! Mr. Filoni was VERY clear that Ahsoka is not necessarily dead! :P Let no edge sunder the glorious orange thread that binds the universe together.

[@bryanblackburn6928]

In the expanded universe, they expand on the force ghosts a little. Luke comments in one of the books that Anakin never appeared to him again after that one time at the end of ROTJ. Luke also has a talk with Obi-Wan (may have been the same book, can't remember) where Obi-Wan tells him that this is the last time he will appear implying that even the force ghosts eventually have to become one with the force as other jedi do. Of course, with Disney SW, the force is just a magic system with no rules which is then used as a crutch by lazy, incompetent and/or biased writers.

[@nathank2289]

Rey being impregnated by a force ghost makes her "channeling" ALL the jedi even more disturbing...

[@richardsylvester4518]

I have been very upset about star wars for years now ... and last year it turned to apathy. I just don't care anymore ... But its gone so far now it's turning into actual anger at the people behind the scenes.

[@Shifft-This]

At this point I've lost any confidence in Disney to tell a good Star Wars story. The only thing the sequel trilogy successfully did was defecate on all the lore that was created before it. Good luck to everyone still hoping for a sweet bun in the sea of fecal matter.

[@Lord-Emperor-Vader]

I think that if they included a scene after Rey kills Palpatine’s physical body where Anakin kills his spirit/ essence it would make the Rise of Skywalker a better film.

[@MaxRamos8]

I like how non chalantly you said the pregnant theory 😂😂

[@Kevin_Street]

Forget it, Thor. It's sequeltown. There's enough lore breaking in those movies to drive a good man mad. It sounds like the Timelines book is just quoting the synopsis of the movie. But if we really need to explain it, maybe that was the Living Force itself, speaking through her with the voices of the Jedi that have made an impression on it over the years.

[@VespoLiveGaming]

Palpy won, Rey struck him down, just as he asked her to do- so he now lives on within her and has access to her UNLIMITED POWAHHHH.

[@themikx2939]

You got the writers mixing up Star Wars with ATLA’s Avatar State with Rey’s “I am all of Jedi” crap 😂

[@stephanicrandall7797]

As Yoda once said: Do, or do not, as long as money it makes.

[@eldestdragon5766]

3:59 My condolences Thor…

[@rogerpalsgrove9678]

Making sense of DLF choices pretty much throws _do, do not, and try_ right out the window.

[@vetarlittorf1807]

Rey getting romanced by Ben's ghost? That sounds like a rip-off of that movie "Ghost".

[@CassiusSarcofex]

Highlander called. It wants its Quickening idea back.

[@mat3714]

The more you dig, the stupider it gets...oh she downloaded stuff from the other guy and all the jedi who ever lived was plugged into her lightsaber blablabla. Mareysue needs unbelievable explanations to validate her equally unbelievable character. I really hope that her big comeback will belly flop hard.

[@randomnumberz]

Having recently watched all of Avatar: The Last Airbender it’s clear that they were just ripping that off too with the whole “I am all the Jedi”. I’m surprised they didn’t make her eyes glow white as well…

[@joemcomber4415]

Honestly this new development doesn't matter for me because I basically discount the sequels anyway. They did whatever they want and no amount of explaining will ever make it good or make sense within the Star Wars world.

[@digitalviolence9845]

Should of just made Ray kill the emperor and become evil.

[@ToonamiT0M]

He wrote Star Trek Into Darkness. Losing him from a Star Wars project is only a good thing.

[@-AtomsPhere-]

Exactly

[@jasonmaiden5026]

Next movie should start out with Luke waking up from a bad dream.

[@marsoelflaco5722]

That would be priceless.👏🏽😀

[@kagekun1198]

President of Lucasfilm? I sincerely doubt Kathleen Kennedy can quote Yoda correctly either

[@drtaverner]

My heart broke the moment I realized that The Mandalorian and Bad Batch were being forced into justifying the Sequels. Knowing there was no story to be told that was independant of the fkn Sequels I lost my ability to love Star Wars. I lost decades of emotional investment, as truely painful as grieving a death in the family.

[@Sammael757]

Just when you think it can't get any worse...

[@ALG2691]

“I have been every voice you have ever heard inside your head.” - creamy Sheev Palpatine “Get up bitch, fight!” - “all the Jedi” Rey: kills Palpatine. “Thanks loser.” - creamy Sheev “Rey…Skywalker.” - Rey Palpatine My headcanon, don’t care, still better than Last Jedi.

[@jacksonshatzer6075]

Since they didn’t really explain anything in the movie we are left to speculate, but I feel it wouldn’t be wrong to see it as Rey being used as a vessel for the force to reject Palpatine’s meddling. Or something like that. I didn’t interpret it as the literal conscious spirits of the Jedi aiding her.

[@jamespuso1627]

They don't explain this ultra well obviously, but the impression I got based on Snoke's "darkness rises and the light to meet it" line was in essence that the force gave Rey some sort of unique ability that would allow her to channel all the jedi as a response to Palpatine doing his weird thing channeling the power of the sith. It's kind of dumb either way. The less they explain about force ghosts the better, but since George Lucas has this thing for Buddhism i kind of always thought they were some sort of equivalent of a Bodhisattva. Essentially a person who has attained nirvana and has returned to help others do the same. In that regard I kind of imagine it being something one could do either by mindfully training with that purpose in mind or achieve and arrive at naturally. But basically the idea is all those who became force ghosts died having fulfilled their purpose and had gone gently into the night. Some characters like Obi-Wan for example would probably have to train to be able to do this due to his regret and his sense of duty, others like Qui-Gon for instance might not.

[@HandofOmega]

My headcanon RoS finale was: As Palpatine is killing Rey and Ben with lightning, suddenly they are both shielded...by the materializing forms of Luke and Leia! As they say some encouraging words to the kids, Palps sneers, observing that they can only hold him off at best, not defeat him...When a new voice, that of Anakin, says: "They don't have to...that's MY job!" He appears behind them all, striding forward to take his place at the forefront of the group/family, as all their combined power is channeled right into the Emperor, who dissolves as in the movie; Anakin gets the final word, assuring us (like in Dark Empire) that the evil is TRULY extinguished and can never come back again...

[@mikepatton8691]

Then somehow, Rey and Ben die suddenly. The End.

[@jakedunnegan]

All the stuff in the Sequel Trilogies are nothing but plot holes that can't be explained in any consistent manner. They basically have to make everything EXCEPT the Sequel Trilogy as non-cannon. They were hoping that un-cannonizing the non-movies and non-TV shows they could be semi-consistent, but that wasn't enough. Or, they have to Retcon the Sequels and admit they screwed everything up. It's an alternate universe that needs to go away.

[@HandofOmega]

Speaking of the Sequels still dumping all over the original lore, what do you think about the Rule of Two now canonically being an attempt by the Sith to create a Dyad in the Force? If there's already a video on this, then please point me to it!

[@isauldron4337]

That idea is so facepalm inducing

[@chrisfromsouthaus2735]

4:00 I know of one that instead of force ghost Ben impregnating Rey, it was the act of Ben healing Rey that caused her to become pregnant, based on the fact that he healed her with his hand over her belly.

[@isauldron4337]

That's creepy

[@Super_Ammo]

"I am all the Jedi" is the inverse of being "one with the force." It's the Concept of "let the Force flow through you", perceived by ego, rather than, in the absence of ego. One of Leia's best lines is "The more you tighten your grip, the more systems will slip through your fingers", referring to the empire controlling the galaxy. The Force should be written with the same regard, a dark wielder's greatest power comes through rage and hate precisely because they are out of control. A light wielder is similarly at their peak when they surrender their emotions, like fear and doubt, to trust in the force.

[@АлексейМомот-щ7о]

You think the writers even know what you're talking about?

[@347Jimmy]

Getting the meaning of Yoda's quote completely backwards is about what we should expect from Disney SW writers

[@xtremeemperor]

I don’t consider the timeline book as canon since we have seen how the writers will de canonize anything at this point that is in the books (comic or novel). Lucasfilm needs to stop wrecking Star Wars before it completely collapses