Vaillant Ebus Controls. Repair No Heating No hot water HeatingGeek

[@paulmc3870]

Hi Heatinggeek, another great video, with regards to the ebus signal cable this appears to be part of a 5 core cable, looks like there are 240v cables and ebus cables together, I was always of the understanding that this was very bad practice as the 240v can affect the signals being transmitted by the ebus cables, and that you should always keep ebus separate from 240v, please keep the videos coming

[@HeatingGeek]

Your right. I forgot about that. I will put this comment at the top.

[@HeatingGeek]

I can do it for some reason!!

[@TheDickPuller]

We’d always use CAT 5 mate on Low Volt controls. Learned that about that 15-20 years ago on Renewables Docking etc. Valliant in Scotland are shit, in fact their boiler are generally shit, popular in the South & Laaaandaaaan though. Overpriced German rubbish, just like Whoofter Botch.

[@francoporco9780]

Have a customer complaining about house going cold because of this hotwater getting priority over heating ! Any way round this ? Vialiant haven't been very helpful

[@TheDickPuller]

franco porco mate, they’re not the best boilers or systems & their technical department is useless. Had lots of problems with this Ebus system & they were useless at helping, Well here in Scotland anyway. Far, far better with Open Therm, a better industry standard & more reliable. The Germans are too far up their own arse.

[@ArifPolicewala]

Another great fault finding video. Cool calm n collective approach. ❤top job Ollie

[@HeatingGeek]

Thanks 👍

[@Aj-og9pi]

Mate I have to say you kept it calm and collective 😂 happens to the best of us. Just wish I was that calm when the pressure gauge split on the old Worcester junior which are known for that problem. Keep up the great vids!! Great knowledge and have helped me touch up on my weak areas. 👍😊

[@HeatingGeek]

You should see me when a pump valve lets by:-/ Not calm then. :-)

[@gonzalomartinez1630]

Clever idea crimping the pipe, I would have reached for the PRV in the panic :) 👍 Thanks for sharing.

[@HeatingGeek]

Its was a bit of a surprise but not the worst one I have ever had.

[@johnburns4017]

@@HeatingGeek Pressure gauges on hinged panels are a joke - bad design.

[@kevinbrown6066]

The Heating Geeks stickers look good. Keep the videos coming. 👀

[@HeatingGeek]

:-)

[@eddyreynolds2463]

Yes mate you show all the frustration that we all have, without swearing respect, mind over matter, loves your problem solving ability Regards eddy, you’re never too old to learn, epitomy of perseverance beyond the. Job 👍👍👍

[@HeatingGeek]

Thanks. :-)

[@HeatingGeek]

It can be a massive pain in the ass sometimes. You cant always win.

[@MikesMovies]

Great info, do you know with a Valiant Eco Tec Pro the stated bus voltage is 24v but its showing 21v at best, could this be giving rise to F62 faults, maybe the smoothing caps need replacing. Thanks

[@jimbo-ed3kc]

Great vid again mate, demystifying some (new to me) controls, great work, keep them coming

[@HeatingGeek]

Thanks :-)

[@tomstrutton4351]

In your opinion, is this ebus stuff better than wiring it as normal? Just looks like addition relays and board to go wrong to me without a substantial advantage over the normal way of wiring it

[@HeatingGeek]

I have weather compensation in my house. Outside sensor, indoor sensor and boiler in loft. It needed no extra wiring center and gives me the controls of the front of the boiler in my front room. I can adjust the heating curve and DHW temperature from my front room. The latter of which does get done from time to time. I use it for weather comp and cascade systems but thats generally it.

[@tomstrutton4351]

You are a heating geek. Cheers for replying fella, really do appreciate it

[@claudiushempstead9893]

How many times do filling loops fail/leak. How many times do drain off washers weld themselves to the seating. Good spot on the teeth missing!

[@themadhatter4761]

Great info as usual. Again thanks for taking the time to post. I can tell you how much watching these videos has helped 👍👍👍👍👍

[@HeatingGeek]

Thanks. Ebus is a weird thing but is perfect for some of the installations where the boiler is remote. Turn up hot water temp on your room stat etc. Thanks for watching :-)

[@johnnysingh418]

Excellent again' them pressure gauge pipes split on Baxi duo Tec too much aswell. LOVEING THAT LOGO.

[@HeatingGeek]

Had it a long time but site is taking ages...

[@UTtiger]

Thanks for your vids mate very helpful! Fitted a 624 today and going back tomorrow to fit the vsmart. Had a quick look at at the vr66 and I’m struggling to understand the connection of the 2 ports as only 3 wires LNE. Where do the switch wires connect to? Any help you could point me to would be great 😊

[@HeatingGeek]

They are not needed. The Ebus controller decides boiler requirement.

[@jordan9318]

Great video. Never had to deal with these. Btw if the boiler controls the hot water temperature why did you have to turn the cylinder stat down to satisfy it. Surely it can be done from the boiler?

[@HeatingGeek]

Only if it has the NTC put into the tank. This one didn't. I zoomed in on the NTC connection to show that at the beginning. Im not the best on ebus but know enough to fault find it. :-)

[@jordan9318]

@@HeatingGeek ok mate. Makes sense. Cheers

[@HeatingGeek]

@@jordan9318 No problem. Thanks for watching :-)

[@dzmalekvali1110]

Thanks king, which cable are for low and high speed for the vaillant pump?

[@HeatingGeek]

None of them in this video. The high and low speed is on the boilers.

[@dzmalekvali1110]

@@HeatingGeek is it the d 19 setting you done?

[@HeatingGeek]

@@dzmalekvali1110 yes. But on another video

[@dzmalekvali1110]

King, it would be great having you as tutor...mine was abit try error find out later

[@johnburns4017]

Ebus: It runs over a _bus._ This comes from computer technology. What is a bus? It is one wire which many devices are connected to, sharing the same wire to send data to each other. Think of a road with houses down each side with each having an _address._ The postman goes down the road and posts each letter (data frame) into each house. The street can be extended with more houses on the street. Now think of the road as the _bus,_ with the houses as devices on the bus, like a computer (boiler pcb), temperature sensors, etc. It is possible to send data to each house by the controlling device using the _address,_ And the houses can do the same. A protocol is a frame of bits that can run up and down the bus into each device, like a letter down a street - each device has an _address._ Protocols can be be sent from the controlling device (computer/pcb) or the sensing device. The protocol frame has an _address,_ which posts this frame into the targeted device using the devices _address._ So, data is sent up and down the bus from the controlling device to sensing devices and back. Like say the room temperature sensors sends data saying the room temp is nearing setpoint so the controlling device winds down the burner fan, then data again from room sensor saying setpoint has been reached, then the controlling device cuts out the burner. The controlling device and temperature device know each others addresses, so when the controlling device gets a data frame from the bus, with a certain address, it knows what that device is, say a room temperature device. Then the software acts accordingly. The protocol has acknowledgements, meaning that when a frame is delivered the receiver sends an _ack_ to the sender saying I have it - this ensures quality of service. So a bus in theory can have an infinite amount of devices on it - limited only by the software the controlling device (computer/pcb) is programmed to handle. This in contrast to the open system (anyone can use) OpenTherm protocol which is only *point to point,* not a bus. One device talking to another over a dedicated, not shared, wire. That is fine for the vast majority heating system, especially combis. However a bus protocol is better for obvious reasons and larger more complex installations.

[@Shayflannel]

😴😴😴😴😴

[@aqib2000]

John Burns CAN Bus is more robust

[@johnburns4017]

@@Shayflannel Exactly. It sends plumbers to sleep as it is way above them.

[@johnburns4017]

@@aqib2000 CAN bus was designed for vehicles by Bosch. I believe it is now open, so anyone can use it. Ebus is robust, as is CAN, as they are both on closed systems. CAN bus can equally be used for other applications besides vehicles.

[@Shayflannel]

its not above me if you were that intelligent you wouldn't be fixing boilers and systems for a living you melt

[@dzmalekvali1110]

Thanks king, good job

[@ijazhussain7127]

Well done very knowledgeable.

[@HeatingGeek]

Glad you like it. :-) It's very difficult to stay up to date with it all.

[@derekclark7545]

The main problem engineers have with Vaillant and Glow Worm ebus systems is they expect the boiler to fire as soon as they have set a demand, these ebus systems normally take 2 minutes to engage the motorised valve and we all know that the boiler will not ramp up until it has checked out the flow, another minute. The other problem is when they open the control box there are no Gray or Orange wires used for motorised valves, WHAT THE F--- that's right permanent live and switched live are not used. Last but not least is that most of these systems are set to hot water priority, meaning that the heating won't work unless the hot water stat or internal cylinder probe is satisfied. According to Vaillant/Glow worm, you can run the wires of the ebus and 240v system together for up to 10 meters, but would you !!! The cable size for ebus is 0.75.

[@HeatingGeek]

Because of the lack of orange and grey, the boiler also doesn't know if the Synchron motor has failed and the boiler will still run if the valve doesn't open. I thought this was part of an interlock requirement but I guess it only matters (in par L) for efficiency reasons and not for the longevity of the boiler.

[@derekclark7545]

@@HeatingGeek remember the boiler will check the flow, if the valve is done and closed the boiler will shut down and an F code will come up, if its open the heat or hot water will be noticed as on all the time the opposite is running. I believe that the Glow worm systempro3 can detect the fault and then displays it, my experience with this brilliant peace of kit is that it can detect many system/boiler faults.

[@HeatingGeek]

@@derekclark7545 It doesn't though. I have personally seen several that keep running because of bypasses etc.

[@kb5057]

Best controls on the market

[@HeatingGeek]

Very difficult to use for some customers though.

[@TheDickPuller]

We Brits still have what I call the ‘Fire Place’ mentality KB, if the radiator ain’t jumping hot, the CH is not on, people(particularly woman) can’t grasp the concept of ambient temperatures.

[@gasfitter78]

Great video again very informative 👍🏿

[@HeatingGeek]

I glad it helps. :-)

[@leaturk11]

This is why I always use Honeywell, another great vid...but why I'm I watching this on my day off?

[@HeatingGeek]

I know. Have a day off :-)

[@jamesjulian]

Why would someone use ebus then put cheap 2 port !

[@HeatingGeek]

@@jamesjulian same reason they wouldn't use the cable clamps. Save time and make more money. Normal nowadays isn't it?

[@a-wahhabchaudhry6429]

why there is no resistence in the new 2 port lever pin?

[@HeatingGeek]

because its open,

[@charliesinden8711]

Smart man 👍🏻

[@HeatingGeek]

Not really but took time to learn. :-) Thanks

[@johnburns4017]

Ebus is not priority hot water. The pcb has been programmed to prioritise hot water depending on the data it received. Ebus itself is just a _street._

[@HeatingGeek]

If you didn't write all the other stuff up I would of been like "Street?" WTF. It is set as priority so as not to overheat other zones. Like floors or normal heating zones when used with weather compensation. That bit I do understand. You can also make it not a priority somehow. (I have seen it but not done it) I think it might have been a bodge though.

[@johnburns4017]

@@HeatingGeek Get to understand what a bus is, I did explain it with a simple analogy. The underlying technology appears to be beyond you at the mo', but getting there. However, Vaillant have tried to have a sort of plug and play system, where the installer does not need to know how it works underneath. Just wire it up to the terminals on the boiler. In that they _sort of_ succeeded. As you pointed out, three had been to the boiler before you not understanding it.

[@HeatingGeek]

@@johnburns4017 I will learn. Vaillant cant even explain it to anyone though. I remember bus systems with household electrics in very posh houses from many years ago. I will learn. :-)

[@johnburns4017]

@@HeatingGeek If the heating zone(s) are calling for 50C flow temperature dictated by the weather compensation, of course if it is also heating a DHW cylinder, 50C is too low a temperature given out by the boiler. So, it _has_ to be programmed as a DHW _priority_ system. The _priority_ has nothing whatsoever to do with the Ebus, which is only a _street._ in which data runs along. The pcb, the controller, decides what is priority, via its programmes in its firmware.

[@HeatingGeek]

@@johnburns4017 Yes I understand that now. Thanks :-)

[@calvinperrins3695]

I don't you think you can beat the veissman 4 pipe system with weather comp and hot water priority.. No hw zone valve, control everything from the boiler.

[@HeatingGeek]

Does it have 2 pumps or a built in diverter valve? what about if you have an unvented cylinder? Veissman seem pretty good boilers except that all the wires are black (don't know if thats all of them). Im going to try and get some training from them this year.

[@calvinperrins3695]

@@HeatingGeek it has a built in diverter, priority hot water, as for unvented, their own brand cylinders come with a temp sensor so no stat or valve, all G3 approved. Boiler controls everything. Makes installing much quicker. As clued up as you are I think you'd like veissman, I don't think anyone can touch em on tech and efficiency.

[@HeatingGeek]

@@calvinperrins3695 They seem to be good boilers (I don't see them much) I just don't know enough about them. Thats why I want to do some training on them and Atag. Think both are very good boilers.

[@calvinperrins3695]

@@HeatingGeek I done they're installers course for the 100w models in Telford. They pay for accommodation if far to travel, they did me (Kent).

[@HeatingGeek]

@@calvinperrins3695 I dont install though. I will ring and ask them. I do want to get on the course.

[@discoveryzk]

Is there any way of contacting you I have installed this setup in my own house and have a few questions now?

[@HeatingGeek]

[e-mail]

[@po65231r]

Why did you have to change the valve body ? Could you not just swap heads ? I do love the vids bro 😁

[@captainbob8001]

Agreed. Why change the valve body?

[@HeatingGeek]

Because this was an insurance job that had gone on for 3+ weeks. I needed to fix there and then. Siemens make the replacement head for these now. But couldn't wait. Thanks for watching. :-)

[@TheDickPuller]

Shit quality zone valve, the valve it’s self will fail in a couple of weeks anyway.

[@aqib2000]

Fibre Washer no it won’t

[@TheDickPuller]

aqib2000 why take the risk, shit valve will fail. It’ll jam or fail to close the serrations will strip on the spindle, why risk it?? Replace it while it’s easy to do so. Ollie has his reputation to think about, word of mouth customer recommendations etc. He uses his engineering judgement & the guy is generally 100% on the money👍👍

[@frankbennett8877]

Great video but that wiring centre was a mess.

[@HeatingGeek]

Yep. One day I will show my work. I take great care in wiring up.

[@derekclark7545]

Your never working on my boiler, the last one you touched the fan went while recording and this one the tube failed to the pressure gauge. on a general note i have been fitting Vaillant / Glow worm weather compensation systems for some ten years, i have had one Systempro go down within 8 months, other than that total reliability, and lots of very happy comfortable customers who have used less gas than expected. An EBUS system is so easy to install, you just need to understand how it works with the boilers own proving methods, then you can understand why the orange and gray are not needed on the two port valves and why you need to wait for the system to fire up the boiler.

[@HeatingGeek]

Its just the boiler will fire when a 2 port isn't open because it doesn't know. So the interlock is lost. I fitted a few Ebus systems and all worked very well. Unfortunately the standard of install I often see is very poor and it obvious the installer didn't spend the time to learn the system. I always allow extra time to repair them though.

[@wedthurfri]

top vlogs,

[@HeatingGeek]

Thanks. I will be back yo it soon. :-)

[@johnburns4017]

The wiring is poor as he noticed. Why not just replace the 2 port head? Why the whole valve?

[@ashleyscott6837]

Not got a compatible one on the van?

[@HeatingGeek]

Needed to be done that day and didn't have the correct head.

[@umark6695]

Do dat init. Proper ghetto. Lol

[@HeatingGeek]

When I heard my voice I had to overlay something. Sounded weird. :-)

[@umark6695]

@@HeatingGeek Did you actually say that in the video then overlayed it?!

[@HeatingGeek]

When I said "can your bucket do that" it sounded getto so I added the extra wording over it.

[@k20aa]

God i hate hot water priority

[@HeatingGeek]

Its ok as long as the cylinder is reheating quickly.

[@izzzzzz6]

What a crappy design having the gave also hinging down.