Why you should go for the S version | Porsche 911 991 S depreciation and buying guide

[@mcahill135]

Great analysis. Purchased my 2013 991.1 C2S in 2017. Paid about 65% of the sticker price for a dealership CPO car (warranty still in effect for 2 years from date of purchase). Depreciation curve has really flattened out the last few years as described in the video. No plans to sell it - it’s a keeper for as long as I can drive it! Great car.

[@paull3179]

991s is such an incredible car you will not think about depreciation once you start driving this. Just buy a 2012 to 2014. I sold my 9974s and will pick up my 991s cab. fully loaded with the sport exhaust, sport chrono in 2 days. This will be my 3rd one and one that I will keep possibly forever. I sold the other 2 for the a bit more money than I paid after 2 years for the first one and five years for the last one.

[@michaelgenias8491]

Fantastic channel very accurate and informative I bought a 991 2013 model 5 years old and you are absolutely correct. I'm in the uk

[@Gedalneil]

Overall production value continues to get better and better. Thank you so much. Again, very insightful and greatly appreciated.

[@BeauKnowsMultifamily]

Absolutely love this channel, probably one of the most economically beneficial to an auto buff that I know of

[@fkflqfgj]

Excellent data analysis and review. When I bought my 991 c2s cab couple years ago, I did a similar (not quite exhaustive and methodical as you) quant analysis on all the 12-15 c2s cabs in US market. My conclusion back then was about $5800 depreciation for every year, and about 3800 for every 10k miles. This enabled me to compare two cars with different price/year/mileage. But I also found out, as your analysis similarly show, that most 911s are priced "fairly". Strongly suggest anyone interested in buying a car using this type of tool for comparison shopping.

[@theonlywinner]

Anybody else notice the shortage of 2016 (991.1) as compared to the abundance of 2017 (991.2)? I think people (myself included) like the naturally aspirated 2016 more than the turbo 2017. I predict these will hold their value better.

[@billballeza377]

I purchased a 991.1 2016 C2S at the very end of the model year, just as the 991.2 turbocharged models took over. Interestingly, my Porsche dealer recently mailed me a trade in offer with an imputed value of my car at the high end of book. There may be an interest in late model, naturally aspirated engines, already developing, I have the Sport Plus, chrono pkg, and PSE with that killer exhaust pop when decelerating. I wouldn’t trade that for any comparable twin turbo model, although the bells and whistles are better.

[@theonlywinner]

@@billballeza377 I agree. I love my 2016 Cayman S with the NA Flat 6. I don't think I'll be trading it in either. I test drove a 997.2 911 GTS this past weekend at Porsche of Newport Beach. And compared the performance specs on that to my Cayman S and they were pretty much identical but the Cayman handled better and braked better.

[@scottoconnor3484]

Just bought (2/21) a 2012.5 2S with 57,000 miles for $60k, but this one includes full Fabspeed exhaust, Cobb tune, a high end, built in K40 radar detector, new tires, and an extra audio amp and subwoofer. Pristine condition, too. Would have paid around $50k without these extras. Glad to see the depreciation curve is nearly flat now, costing as little as $200/month. Did a pre-buy inspection with my mechanic, and found only a couple of very minor issues.

[@craig42069]

I feel like this video has more actual advice than just the numbers, compared to some of the others where I'm left feeling a bit lost.

[@QBNTO1]

I’m buying one in 2022. These videos help me a lot.

[@fourwheeltrader]

Happy to hear that

[@17forever64]

Your are correct about this, I have been looking at both cars for the last 6 months. I have been looking at the 991.2 The S has become a better value over that period of time and the prices between the standard 911 and the S cars have been coming closer together. Many of these cars sit on lots for months. The Porsche Certified site shows you the original msrp on the cars. If you factor in the original msrp on the cars the S becomes an even better value. A well loaded 911 cabriolet original msrp was about 120k with the options I would want. The msrp on an S cabriolet was close to 140k. Now a certified base 911 cabriolet is between 75 to 80 k and the S cabriolet is between 85 to 93.

[@walterski8377]

Lightly looking as well over how many model years are you comparing ? Thanks

[@17forever64]

Walter Ski I was looking at the base and the S, both convertibles. I just bought a used Lexus 350gs though so I’m done looking. I have had two Porsche, loved the way they drove, but they were a maintenance nightmare. Just could not do it again !

[@sunnohh]

Trained economist - approves of this channel and methodology

[@sammckenzie2331]

How do you collect your data for these videos? Web scraping?

[@mashsyed9808]

Hi. Can you do an analysis on the depreciation of the 991.2 911 GTS?

[@fourwheeltrader]

Good suggestion, thanks

[@johnespanol1273]

i second this request! :)

[@fourwheeltrader]

*which car would you like to see analysed next? *

[@andapen]

Fourwheel Trader - Car depreciation analysis 991gt3, 997 gt3, and prediction of how prices will be in 6 years?

[@danielzhu7356]

Nissan gtr pls!! I an trying to decide between 911 s & GTR

[@fourwheeltrader]

Gt3's are requested a lot. They will feature soon!

[@fourwheeltrader]

Did you already see this video of the gtr: kzbin.info/www/bejne/j2aypnyHaNpjmLs

[@protectandswerve]

991.1 & 991.2 Turbo S'

[@jsto6703]

Thank you so much! This was very helpful to me.

[@ZilvinasButkevicius]

Osom videos, thank you for your time to do this!

[@fourwheeltrader]

Thanks. Which car would you like to see analysed next?

[@ZilvinasButkevicius]

@@fourwheeltrader I think Honda S2000 is worth analyzing, I use to own one, and sold it with profit.

[@zenjitsuman]

I would like to see analysis for the Audi RS5

[@davidhoughton5893]

How does the 991 targa hold value vs the convertible?

[@raz5584]

Can you please kindly do review on the 991.1 C4S depreciation

[@johnespanol1273]

great videos!! how bout an analysis on the 991.2 GTS models??

[@peterkapusi5882]

991 is my favourite 911 of all time. When do you think it will bottom out in price knowing what happened with the 996 and the 997? When to enter the market?

[@fourwheeltrader]

This video shows in the beginning the full 991 depreciation curve: kzbin.info/www/bejne/gYipo3lqiZqNppo That will give you a pretty good idea about the future 991 values.

[@WheresTheAnyKey1]

oof that first year depreciation almost as much as some decent budget sports cars!!! good lesson to not buy new

[@fourwheeltrader]

I agree. Financially, an used on makes a lot more sense.

[@kringlefanten]

What about 991.1 vs 991.2? Do the 991.1 keep better value?

[@seandenny2412]

Good info little fast on the delivery but I understand you have a lot of info to get out

[@Username17775]

Great video as always. I think there is one more variable you could consider in this analysis in particular which is the difference between the 991.1 and 991.2 because unlike in other mid cycle refreshes, the 991.2 is where Porsche introduced forced induction in the base models of the 911, getting rid of the naturally aspirated engine altogether. Given the Porsche purist mentality I wonder if this has any effect on the future value of the 991.2. Thoughts? Sorry for the long comment!

[@fourwheeltrader]

That's indeed a good point. I should have included that categorisation.

[@davidawassmann]

@@fourwheeltrader Although turbo is a variable, let's not forget that Porsche has been making turbos a long long time and their values are quite robust!

[@Tony240zt]

@@davidawassmann It's not a question of reliability, but rather the raspy NA sound that is covered by a turbine. 991.1 Carrera S w/sport exhaust sounds amazing!

[@ChiefMiskito]

@@Tony240zt Agreed, I've had both. The 997.2 w PSE still sounds great (to me).

[@kringlefanten]

The 4S with PDK should keep its value much better than the other Carrera models.

[@budtaylorus]

yea low mileage s manual is more expensive than automatic (if you can find one), not sure where the data came from

[@paulhelvie972]

Great video, I have a 991.1 gts 2015 can you do a depreciation on its value ? As I’m interested if the fact the naturally aspirated engine will help it’s value in the future or should I sell it.

[@fourwheeltrader]

I will make a seperate video for the GTS cars.

[@findtomdotcom]

Great analysis, thanks. Can you do the 992 911 C4S please.

[@Sams911]

how much do options play into this? I would think a very loaded car vs a stripper would be a big part, no?

[@fourwheeltrader]

Valid point. The data shows that options play a role in the price of a car when it is new or almost new. The older the car, however, the less the importance of the options. Mileage and model year are then the main drivers for the price. On a depreciation curve you can then also see that the premium you pay for the options fades away with the age of a car.

[@ChiefMiskito]

@@fourwheeltrader I do think that options help sell cars faster (e.g. if you have PSE or sport chrono versus a car that doesn't have them). If a potential buyer is well informed, they will prefer cars with the "right" options over a car missing those options, especially if price is similar. I know I would not consider a car without, for example, PSE or sport chrono. And in many cases, having a manual is driving up manual car equipped prices. And that's not even an option (the PDK costs more). Anyway, my $0.02 worth.

[@Andyuk911]

Cool, be great if you looked at the UK market ...

[@Safa-Dinho_09]

I love your videos.

[@fourwheeltrader]

Thanks!

[@mattwhitney10]

Where is this data from? Or what is the source?

[@domlp]

Great video. As noted by another commenter, the 991.2 has a turbo engine for the base and S, and such is not as “pure” as the 991.1 base and S. In that frame of mind, do you feel that the manual vs PDK would have a big impact on future value? I could see some attraction to a 991.1 S with manual gearbox a few years down the road.

[@fourwheeltrader]

Thanks. Manual 991.1's might indeed be more attractive in the future. At this point however, it is not yet visible in the data so it is merely speculation. Also, because the automatic gearboxes with double clutches are so good, i havent seen in any market yet that the manual would go for a premium. Nevertheless, it might be still too early for that.

[@wjohnsonism]

After watching...I feel if I purchase a 991 and drive it, or any 911 for that matter, I’m only adding to its depreciation curve. Personally I want to drive the heck out of it but at the same time realizing years from now I will be that one lone bubble high on the graph with high mileage and low value. Anyone else juggle with this conundrum?

[@fourwheeltrader]

Perhaps somewhere in the middle might be a good solution :) ?

[@combat191145]

Boy oh boy - things have not turned out that way at all. Naturally, all used car prices have gone up, but the Porsche's considerably higher. In addition, the manuals and coupes are more desirable and are more expensive. In March of 2022, a 2013 911 Carrera S manual transmission with 50,000 miles will probably sell for $75 - $80,000 and as much as $85 - $95,000 at a dealer!!

[@fourwheeltrader]

Over here you can find the lastest market update: kzbin.info/www/bejne/iGjMaZWbd5J0a7s

[@BeauKnowsMultifamily]

I own a 991.1S with 44,000 miles. I drive 5000 miles per year. If I want to estimate what my car may be worth in five years then I assume the calculation is 957×5x5 years equals roughly $24,000 less than what it’s worth today. Is that right?

[@fourwheeltrader]

The best benchmark (in my opinion) is to use the depreciation per year graph and adjust the price points from there based on whether the mileage increase is more or less than the average mileage increase within the market. I would say that 24k is an overestimation of the drop because it is only based on the average number and doesn't take the flattening of the curve into account.

[@BeauKnowsMultifamily]

Fourwheel Trader - Car depreciation analysis yep good point and makes sense. Thank you, love your channel

[@porschelife4ever]

Thanks this is great. I purchased a new 2015 911S in jan 2016 with an MSRP of $132k but due to a pricing issue published on the dealer's site I was able to get it for $99k. Figuring it was a one in a life time deal I went for it knowingly most of the depreciation was absorbed by the price error. 4 years later I've probably lost less on the 911 s than an average Audi (which I also own). I'll be interested in the impact of future value given 2016 was the end of the naturally aspirated engine. Id guess in the future we will see these cars climb in value like the air cooled ones. Given I have 3 cars and a short commute the 911s only has 8k miles so on average i only do 2k miles a year and an RS5 next to it in the garage it is hard to decide which one to take. :)

[@iTzDaSponge]

Hi, great videos! I am personally also very interested in the Porsche market. Can I ask you where you get the car data from? Would love to know! Thanks.

[@TheMattprune]

Thank you great video. I'm thinking of selling my 2year old bmw 540i, and buying a 991 S as I think it's depreciation curve has flattened so is a fairly safe purchase depreciating less than my 540i over the next 2 years. Would you agree with this?

[@fourwheeltrader]

Relatively, an old 991 should loose less than a new 540i yes :)

[@primehimselfdeluxe]

LEXUS LC500 please!

[@fourwheeltrader]

Good suggestion

[@primehimselfdeluxe]

@@fourwheeltrader ... and of course don't forget the iconic Audi RS6 after that, if you have some time :) Thank you very much! Good work by the way!

[@NetZao]

Thanks for the video: what is the data source you use for "future depreciation" predictions for your videos? Is there some website that lists predicted future values?

[@fourwheeltrader]

I calculate the predicted values myself

[@273VIPER]

My next P car 👍🏾

[@mariomifsud4650]

Thank you for the video! One clarifying question- the data that you use is advertised sale price not actual sale price, correct?

[@fourwheeltrader]

Correct, they are advertised prices. It would be better to use the selling prices but those are unfortunately not available.

[@mariomifsud4650]

@@fourwheeltrader Thank you!

[@peterhanlon5303]

Porsche 991 GTS depreciation please

[@fourwheeltrader]

Thanks, good suggestion.

[@peterhanlon5303]

👍 it could be a future classic and prices seem to reflect that

[@DriftKr6l]

Please do a 997 GT3 next

[@fourwheeltrader]

Coming soon!

[@bokudou]

Nice video.

[@fourwheeltrader]

Thanks! Which car would you like to see analysed next?

[@bokudou]

@@fourwheeltrader You've done all my favorites already!

[@achristian7015]

Why do people worry about DEPRECIATION? Its a toy, enjoy it and hold onto it in which case depreciation means nothing. If you do not have the money, buy a $2000 wonder.